report it. you should be worried about it. had an expert on who said you should be very alarmed abbout it. what happened at the san jose, california utility nearly a year ago should send slivers down your spine to this day. not only because we are just learned about what a group of armed attackers did to take out a utility substation. the fact all of them disappeared to the night before the police got thereill don't know where ty went or how many of them there were. all we do know is they knew what they were doi and did a lot of damage while they were doing it. destroying not only equipment

that served thegeneral san jose area but stationlines that send power mch of to silicon valley and fiberoptic lines that serve well beyond silicon valey. it wasn't about a grid-getting comprise. some fear it was a dry run for for something more catastrophic. i want you to meet a guy who is worried. he's no nut. federal energy regulato commission chairman. and tonight he's here. >> welcome everybody. i'm neil. to say john is concerned is an understatement. not only because of what happened last spring. but what he fears cold happen again. hn, good to have you with us. thank you for taking the time. how did it only come to light now. >> it's good to be here. i appreciate it. it didn't just cme to light now. a number of people have been talking about this. there have been sporadic reports in the pres about i, but it

has been discussed with not only administration officials, but also with number of the key utility officials across the country that have these credible high voltage substation in the inventory. neil: and they are important, john, because they're not necearily manned. sometimes they are just surrounded by locked gate and that's the best of it. >> most automatic of them are not manned. i don't know any one of them that have has 24/7 personnel at the substations. also, i'd say 90% or more are all simply secured by a chain linked fence and perhaps a camera or two and lights. beyond that there's little security for the critical high voltage substations. obviously those who go after the group that went after this, knew what they were doing. >> well, we don't know who they were, but we know definitely

they knew that they were doing. it was a very deliberate attack that was extremely well planned and very well executed. i mean, executed it theoint they knewwhat they wanted to target. they selected the appropriate type of ammunition to target what they did which was the cooling fin of the transformers. and must of had communications as wel to leave 70 seconds before the police arrived. they were shooting for 19 minutes in the field outside the transformer fence. nay never wentnside the fence. they shot through the fence doing so t night and targeting precisely over the 19-minute time their targets. so they were very-well trained and disciplined. neil: who do you think they are? what were they doing? what was the intent? >> frankly, i don't know who they are i don't know their intent. what i know; however, there are at lest one group of individuals capable of doing this.

which concerns me. it concerns me that the est of our high voltage transmission infrastructure and especially the high voltage transformer substations could be at risk. i think we need to have a ordinated plan, ultimaely, to protect them. neil: you think it was a dry run for something? >> well, again, i don't know either. but i don't want to find out. really i don't want to find out if it was a dry run. i want to encourage the industry, which we have been doing, which i did hen i wasat ferk continuing to do now to, in ct, protect these facilities and hopefully ggve sme agency authority to oversee that and ensure those mitigation meaures get nut place. ne: you know, you and some others knew about what happened here. certainly i didn't and the main ream media the way it dripped to light. i'm wondering that was last april; right. do you ow or suspect of any

other incidents since? >> i don't know of any other incidents since that were of this magnitude, of this detailed planning or execution. this is the only one that i know. i hope it will be the only one that we ever see again. again, the way to crtainly ensure and at least reduce the risk of tat is to start putting in some defenses. some very simple defenses like things, for exaple, the chain link fences make them opaque. you can't shoot from outside. you can't target the individual transformer facilitis inside nap -- that one one. >> do you know if brief beefed up security beyond what we have normally done in the ast r what? >> i know some are taking some steps. in fact i know ones right there in new york, con edison, we actually briefed con edison on physical security issues before

april 16th. we took in with a team of people from doe including the 13th substation in lower manhattan. question di it several months before -- looking at prior t the incident. but and so i know there are a mber of utilities that are taking steps. we need to make sure that it is a cordinated effort. we need to make sure we prioritize the most important substationsand ensure those are protected. >> john thank you for taking the time. it makes a big difference when a guy like you is concerned and anyone ese who just raised the test securi hack ls. thank you for doing that. in the meantime, there's a reason why the former chairman is anxious. there's a difference, as we said, bad guys making utility target an target a target. former fbi special ant john clark.

jo, here is a difference; right? hitting a retailer is one thing, presumably, to get money. hitting a utility substion is another. presumably to rattle folks right? >> of course there's a difference. when, you know, somebody hits a utility place or hits a bank or something like that to get money, it is probably just some -- isle use the t term thug tryg to get money and should be work organize whatever the case may be. terrorism goes far beyond that particular perspective. hose are different types f people than the people we're looking at that is looking to do harm to people and to the nation. neil: you use the t-word terrorist. do you equate the people who took out thesubstation are terrorists? >> i a't say that are terrorists, but it is certainly appears to me it's a terrorist act. and iit is a terrorist-type attack. and do weknow fo sure that

someo was nt behind tis particular attack and that attack may be moving on to something else that could even be more vitalto us than the one they just had. neil: we hear a lot about the grid and how, you know, comprisable it is and how you can hit one area and knock off so many other areas and just a few hits certainly take our entire nation's power structure down. something similar happened a few years ago. do you envision something like that happening again? >> i certainly hope not. and i cerrainly hope my grand kids don't ever see it happen again. but having said that, what we have to do is to continue to consider that these type of things can happen. i think it would be very naive to say that, oh, no we can protect it a it will be gone. what we have to do is continue to work and try to go on other type of means to ensure we can

protect that so it ill continue and n a good way. >> you know what is weird? obviously the people who hit the substation knew exactly what ey were hitting. i'm told there were few wasted pull lets. -- bullets. they were out of there before the police arrived. haven't been identified or -- disappeared in to the night map type of an organization assuming it is part of an organization does that or has the capability to do that? >> well, first of all, when you see that type of acivity take place, i don't believe that it is just a group of people who want to make a little money or gate little money or didn't want to work or whatever the case may be and decided they would take these actions to gain some money. i don't think that is the case. i think when we see the type of well-districted activities taking place against citizens and people who are working hard

to ke their livs go on every day. for them to be doing this type of thing. i an'tee anybody farming that. the are people out there who are looking to go far beyond that and help destroy part of our nation as we have seen take place in the past. >> indeed we have seen the past. tom clark, thank you. >> my pleasure. in the meantime, what does this say about where we stand? wee going to be exploring that. in th meantime, whatdoes that say about a good defense team really -- well, a good offense? what the democrats are pushing the irs o do now fter all the targeting mess? ally? this is the quicksilver cash back card from capital one.

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democrats would be hoping the irs mess would go away. this targeting conervatives thing move on to other tings; right? some e democrats are pushing the tax man to push back. they are suing the government on

behalf of a lot of those targeted tea party groups. they're dubling down, jay. >> it sounds to me. >> th are. that's what you said, neil. the best deense sometimes and offense. is in is basically you're a post hock justification for the irs's bad behavir. you know, the irony of all of this, of course, we know thugh the e-mail that come out that in fact these attacks on the conservative grups was planned over a year before it went public before the apology. and already have been in the works at the highest level of chief counsel office of the irs. that's number one. number two, you know, the law has been on the books for over 50 years. there's never been an issue. it's rarely been litigated. now all the sudd people said it was confused and bone-headed decisions of bureaucrats. we know -- neil: it doesn't add up. >> look at the numbers -- 594 conservative groups targeted

versus six so-called liberal gas. t more lopsided han the seattle denver game could be. even in the face of the numbers we have to scrutinize more political groups makes me think they are taking advantage of the opportunity they are in power at least in the senate and the white house going for them s, you know, go while the getting is good. >> well, that's what it is. what they're doing is using the regulatory regime of the irs -- excusee, to basically enforce these changes. it is going to -- it already has created a really chilling effect. 501c4 organizations don't know what theycan and cannot do now. and trying to impact thing like voter registration and get out the vote drive guide which is a hallmark of olitical speech. but this is, look, you're absolutely correct. the democrats have one shot at this at the end of the day. they're not going win this

through a legislative move. they're not going to change the law between a congress. because of the democrats got the senatbut they don't have the house. what do you do? use the regulatory regime. we know it was senator karl levin and senator schumer phing the irs in the first plac the whole matter is nothing but politic. it ally is an attempt to stifle one side of the debate. you mentioned the six gros te liberal groups put in up in the dragnet. all of them received their ta exempt sttatus. it's not the casefor the perspective groups. >> what percentage of the conservative groups did? >> rig now about 40. there is still aoverwhelming majority. i'm only represeng 4 i think there are 283 cases. most still don't have it. we have clients waiting three and a half years. the irs right now constitutional -- institutional incapable of moving forward. we're filing our motion response to the federal governmnt

today. >> theyare handing out bonuses. >> that we are paying for. >> thank you very much. meanwhile did you hear about apple moving headquarter to texas? at the rate things are going not necessarily unlikely. why the lone star state is drying the darnestto make it sill g female announcer ] who are we? we are thinkers. the job jugglers. the up all-nhts. and the ones who turn ideas into action. we've made our passions our life's work. we strive for the moments where we can s, "i did it!" ♪ we are entrepreneurs who started it all... with a signature. legalzoom has helped start over 1 million businesses, turning dreamers into business owners. and we're here to help start yours. you are gonna need a wingman.

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texas. and if yu're a high-tech company, don't assume you won't like moving to a place that gets very hot,like, well, texas. the lone star state ain't feeling too lonely these days. it's beesuccessl to move companies to se up sho there.

lots of places complaining. california saying they ar bribing places. texas governor said ridiculously low taxes and regulatns. if apples moving to amarillo game over. you said yippee! game on! >> oh, yeah. i'm going to texas to buy a dude ranch i thnk it would be great. neil: what is going on. what is texa doing the other states are crying foul particularly california. do they have a case or is texas winning them over with unheard of incentives? >> well, yeah, of course. i mean, texas we have an income tax and business taxes are low in california is broke, neil. rick loves he has the hollywood elitist friends havig the double cappuccino double caramel latte. it's fin but --

[talking over ach other] >> is that true? >> the crowd is getting offensive? >> look, first of all, texas, they are bribing people i might say you shouldn't take it. it' not just about regulatio it's not just about low taxes. it's roughly 400 milion in cash payments they made toward caliornia and other state companies there. neil: they're legal. >> of course. [talking over each other] >> they have cherry picked it. texas exported more tech items than california did by a couple hundred grand. u know where half went? 50% of the export went to mexico. i think it might he sothing to do with proximity and deliver i are? >> and california is not close to mexico, rick? >> texas hasn't done? california tech companies still way outpace them in term of the number of people employed. >> it is changing. neil: 0 obviously texas whatever it is doing.

it wants to keep doing it. whatever it is doing if you're in california you're welcome t stop it. it is draining the tech pool in silicon valley. so many of the companies left. those are companies that keep an eye on the cost; right? >> yes. of course. and, you know, california is just a mess. it's in shambles. it's becoming a socialist ste. xas they get it. [talking over each other] neil: california is turning things around. >> i think you are behind times. >> no. look -- texas they do it right way. they have a republican legislature. they have a republican governor. here is the other thing. the problem in california it's too much government and too much regulation. they have a full-time legislature. texas they meet every oth year. they barely meet. [talking over each other] neil: they have different strategies. i'm wondering if now say what you will about perry. he's stepping down as th longt serving governor. >> i'm going miss him. neil: i'm sure.

you think it is enough of a potent force? what he's done in texas to help the presidential run? >> you have to be -- no. not even close. rick perry is not going president of the united states. i'm comfortable of making that. >> i'm not arguing. >> yes, they have a republic legislature and governor. you know what they do't have? many people that can get health care. nobody in texas has health insurance. [talking over each other] >> companies moving there would be big -- >> yeah. >> t their employees. it's the people who on't -- [talking over each other] >> people are -- [talking ver each other >> every game texas is making. >> i'm not diismissing it. >> people are moving there. [talking over each other] >> i'm going defend my home state texas, they have a friendlier regulation climate. they do have better tax rates

than california. there's just one problem, so you to live in texas. >> oh, rick. have you ever been to austin, texas. [talking over each other] >> you're a snob. you are a snob. you are an elitistsnob. terrible. why don't you go to bell air. i know, you are sit by the pool -- gosh, you're not allowed in texas anymore. that's terrible. >> have you had it with all of this. blame new york city mayor bill de blasio. ever since he dropped that groundhog -- remember that? he's guaranteed six more years of winter. [lughter] [laughter] ♪ [ male announcer ] evenore impressive than the research this man has at his disposal is how he puts it to work for his clients. morning. morning. thanks for meeng so early. co on in. [ male annncer ] it's how edward jones

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neil:. >> because th was so unpredictable whate heard last night by the way it is

absolutely a beautiful day about their right out. neil: at the point she said this, it was not a beautiful day. the blizzard was still blizzard in. that w a new york city schools chancellor saying the weather is fine causing some backlash to president bush for bridge chief of staff sending a message to the middle of a crisis. i am very sorry for going off the handle i have been dealing with a great deal us know and i was alsa tripping in the snow as she said this. >> first of our leaders have to be very, very sympathetic of any naturalisaster. remember it is not a statistic if your impacted by a natural dister your buck to to present impacted.

not only 6%. the victims are routed t impacted but it is important to be a ltle paranoid when it comes to a disaster. you have to almost over prepare to have the response ready in case it is bad. that is a very valuable lesson people have warned. jurisdictional challenges are a problem bird with a beer and a governor friday in the president cannot do anything until the governor requested assistance. neil: i remember that with katrina but this a bear was brought up on corruption in charges and could be on his way to jail. but this is now and the governor of georgia right now wants to extendn emergency a coupleeeks ago he was criticized for not being prepared or warning people of the severity and

said i will be prepared this time getting very high marks but these things to define leadership? >> sla. the governor in georgia did the good thing to learn a lesson to correct the things i did that go well the first time he responded to a disaster. other governors and mayors said look athat. he demonstrated a commitment to beery engaging and fully prepared. not to be unsympathetic to the challenges people face when there are disasters. you don't want your leaders to fail to recognize the reality of a disaster. like bill clinton said, feel their pain. neil: maybe another current example with the health crisis like governor

chriie and hurricane sandy because much is to be dispersed but are there any other crisis governors are politicians who stand ou >> governor haley barbour of mississippi and contrast to the governor in louisiana will -- both had a phenomenal disaster a lot of people in pain and hurting governor barbara did a border will jump to recognize the problem problem, calling for assistance to be part of the solution. governor blanco did not ask for assistance then put the demands on what she got. in addition to jurisdictional problem with the bare of new orleans. >> haley barbour and risky -- chrischristie did a good job. jeb bush did an outstanding

job to respond to the hurricane. neil: edn and the school's chancellor says everything is falling and it will continue with freezing rain event then say this is wonderful, a first all don't try that with the yorkers ever. second cover adult sound smug about it. >> communication one '01 to respond to a disaster this is a school. there will be a lot of case study experiences from a the response to the current disaster making its way up the east coast weekend we learned they have a better track record of responding to these kinds of challenges they and other jurisdictions the as of a textbook look

but governors of made and new hampshire have been doing. neil: always a pleasure. facebook quit looking at your stock may be your customers and wall youadit welcome back. how is everything? there's nothing like being your own boss! and my customers are really liking your flat rate shipping. fedex one rate. really makes my life easier. maybe a promotion is in order. good news. i got a new title. and a raise? management couldn't make that happen. [ male announcer ] introducing fedex one rate. simple, flat rate shipping with the reliability of fedex.

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uer belly pain, dark urine, or yellowing of skin eyes. these could be sig of rare t seris side effects. crestor! yes! [ female announcer ] ask your doctor about crestor. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca y be able toelp. neil: this is what happens when you have mo than 1 billion users you are tempted to leverage of those and marketing of them. that is essentially is the latest charge against facebook. that is promoting the personal information or images of teenage users in its advertising without theirermission or parents' permission either. how true thh of lawyer for the group taking the latest legal action. what is the gist of the complaint? >> we filed an appeal today

or the appellate brief challenging the district court's approval of a settlement between facebook and a class of parents challenging their privacy violations that essentially permits facebook to continue viating the laws of seven states requiring the use of children for advertising purposes be accompanied by parental consent they're not getting it now eliot feld not have to. neil: how does it work? does facebook l the kids know they're using there images? what is facebook tlink? >> under the settlement and whenever a car represents the parenting is never notified has no opportunity

to consent to the use of the child image but the child is used based on what the child behalf like to reapplication in this world where the child has checked in. @%il: the advertising is on facebook? >> within facebook but with the new policy about sharing that can be shown not only to the minor friends but so to the public as well. facebook is harnessing the interaction to package them into a endorsements for their own sponsors with no consent from the parents. neil: i am not an attorney but i remember after the carnival cruise line they were defending itself saying that you sign onto risk when you buy the ticket. i guess th included feces on the floor. food to?

but would you agree to be a facebook subscriber or koesterer this iwhat you sign onto. is that true? >> facebook is purporting to get consent from the kids that has to be gotten fm the parents. seven states california virginia new york florida and threothers have laws that say you cannot use kids images withoot the parents' consent. there are many times wh a company can get consent as a condition to use the product but here the law says you have to get the parents' consent and this sullivan says it does not have too it. neil: baby come back to save the year okay with 43 other states? >> no. it is not appropriate for a federal court to give judicial approval to a settlement that authorizes a party to violate the laws of any state.

no court should plus a supplement authorizes a violation of law and it is significant oneof those lives in california, facebook called stat neil: interesting. thank you very much. from the state to produce a congressman with a lapel to the health exchange from hell.

neil: if this whole health care thing falls on a self-taught because of the employer mandate. not because ofhe delays. nothing that has happened on the federal level. i have said this before but because it all started to unravel at the state and local level. or again were the state's republican congressman found

zero lot of weird hanky-panky and potential criminality. he joins us on the phone. civic ere is a lot of allegations about websites that were created more pages then given to the federal government as example of progress then maybe they were not accurate but the money flowed as a result. that is an allegation by some. we do know the state's spend upwards of one image is 60 millionf the 4.2 billion allocated already and we have a website that still today does not function. there were warnings put up years ago, the red flags flags, but they were ignored by those in charge and oregon. it is outraous and there needs to be accountability. neil: deceives to be if you want to be a part of the

exchange you go into outer space. how does the resident know if they are in exchange or the pavement has be accepted? because intel the pavements are locked the system that you get pavement's throu is down. what is the us kidney? >> once they realize the web site would not function the would allow it to operate you just go down well double tight page fm filled out by he and and mail it or fax it to them and theyailed several hundred to process by he and then thend you something else and then and then then there is cancellation, the uncertainty, a multi hundred billion dollar. they're struggling to figure out what to do next and questions about data

security with the data system in one instance they got information mailed to them. it is a disaster. they've the fix it eventually. would hope after a $300 million they get their rights. but that is half the cost just for one state. neil: i wonder if oregon is a precursoror with enrollment snafued death monday goes missing coverage getting back to work to provide by card to show they are covered. i have always argued if it collapses on itself it will start in states like or did and others that are not up to it. >> i seek your rights period beyond that the funding mechanism to keep it going is working because they relied on $9 per person

charged to fun to the operation but nobody came inside of so they're not geing the pavements now they go upside down with the administrative funds and trying to figure out how to pay for this. it is a train wreck. it is time to pull the covers off to find out what is going on. it is our tax money in every other american plugged into the state system that nobo was in charge to be a responsible and we hav a mass on our hands. neil: thank you very much. if nflix can make this a hit imagine what it can do with "star wars" to make hbo history

friday night, buddy. you are gonna need a wingman. and my cash back keeps the party gog. but my airline miles take it worldwide. [ male announcer ] it shouldn't be this hard. with creditcards.com, it's easy to search hundreds of cards and apply online. creditcards.com.

we are thinkers. the job jugglers. the up all-nhts. and the ones who turn ideas into action. we've made our passions our life's work. we strive for the moments where we can s, "i d it!" ♪ we are entrepreneurs who started it all... with a snature. legalzoom has helped start over 1 million businesses, turning dreamers into business owners. and we're here to help start yours. neil: you will ha to do

better than that my darling. of netflix to infinity and beyond. a different movie but they hold bigger results teaming up with those who brought you "star wars" to bring the next claymores it is huge is fiercely with kids the latest original programming increasingly putting rivals of showtime and hbo to shame a kickoff tonight on brother netflix with the latest launchis a buy or sell? netflix had a it tremendous role to justi the multiple >> what i'd like it is no nger just a video streing company of lot of

companies that search for gold elsewhere they hit gold with their own backyard with content that people wanted and can get anywhere else for coming have done this a couple times they are redefining themselves for content as a stockholder that can be attractiv..3 keep in mind it is fairly high right now depending you they caneinvent themselves to add the other packages with existing technology this could be atop to keep a close eye on. neil: the argument with netflix you could find any serious said any time but now they seem to be preachy out to more original programming for taking baby -- maybe this is the cash cow? >> it won't keep them in cash but the problem is particularly with theal will cost the bow lot. fadeout decidedin the fall the bid made the deal with

pixar innovation and -- animation to cost $300 million per year that is 3.six additionallbillion subscribers they have to pay for that. it is in a cash cow forr disney but for the netflix stock it is hard to bet against it but i would not buy it. i tried to shorts' tip was killed. i am not play in june that sandbox and the more. there is too much of bentham carry you for word. neil: talk about the showtime killer and it is the new king of the sean rush? that can be short-lived? >> technology is only as good as what have you done for me lately just like apple as long as they keep delighting their customer basehey developed a loyal following thmomement the ball is fumed the to look

for the next thing they have to keep that going in have the customers wanting more civic whether second subject is gm has just delayed announcing a hundred thousand compact cars after unexplained shutwns. but they have already caused six deaths is white toyota recalling the toyota pre-is because of the software program that could freeze calling long dash causing the car to stall but do they hold back? cpac in the case with general motors it is a reason to hold back. eyes serve the would want to look at of war to get out. a legacy problems will never go away. gm the worst problem is they

ha known aboutthis since the '60s. popular science did a six for those that were complaining by simply saying takeover a off of your key ring. they have known about this now '06 deaths and how many re will surface? i would not touch the stock is a legacy issue for years to come. neil: we were showing tesla. normally year brodeur recall or the unexplained fire but one photo makes investors freeze one report gives them pause does this news cast a pall on the enti auto indust because people say i will put my money into an area that does n generate as many headlines? seven talk about investors

first but consumers make the decisions th their hard earned dollars. consumers demand excellence and quality of value. if that trust is broken, if the company says we apologize we made a mistake consumers have proven to be very forgiving but if a second occurrence occurs bndon loyalty roads that can affect spending patterns also can drive the stock price know likably that has reliability issues. people want safety if not delivered consistently then people shop there dollars. neil: what if the focus on the weather instead of the nightcap? we're already seeing that retail sales rose last month now with the more indication this is hitting productivity in in the gdp more

significantly than we thought. that is not a predictive kickoff. >>'' we have to look at is the second quarter numbers all the checks will be modeleby know whether. there is no discounting of that. that means talkg about the weather you have to understa from productivity to labor with every single metric that we looked at. how the fed looks at the market through the year the spring. neil: even i you're ouide these burdens areas there is energy related products that goes for those in florida?

>> this does not just touch one side of the economy but to keep the big picture perspective one of my favorite reports comes out the university of miigan consumer sentiment survey calling five or to people across the country how they feel about the economy? they spend money because it could given clearance how people are thinking about how the weather affected their decision but big-ticket items slides or travel the benghazi that and tell the second quarter so keep that imbalance in selling just one blip of bad news. neil: remind ople they can callown becae the sw stopped. although it is still snow vigor that they look at a minimum of another four or 6 inches.

things are incredible. we will see you tomorrow. >> are you a member of the privileged class? you get special breaks in life? politicians say. >> we will all benefit fro it >> allon't benefit. the privileged benefit. >> is there any other large employer that gets the same treatment? >> it doesn't only apply to congress. >> we will be darnedif we are going to lose their health insurance because of unintended consequences. so unions have a special