>> okay. and gary b., bull or bear on that? >> bear. >> tracy, your prediction? >> there was a study that if parents put their phone down the kids will act better? come on. >> all right. "cavuto on business" that is next and they don't behave. who is that knocking at your door for a surprise visit? unions. hello everyone. in the national labor relations board wants to force companies to hand over their workers' personal phone numbers and home addresses to unions. now, this will make it easier for labor organizers in what critics are calling ambush elections. sounds a little bush league to me. >> it's outrageous, incredible interference of people's privacy, invading their privacy. if i were a worker at a factory somewhere i would not want the union to have my home address and my phone number calling me

up, badgering me, possibly sending people to walk up and down my front lawn and look at me menacingly as i'm pulling up weeds. i want my privacy respected. if they want to contact me, they can e-mail me or just the same as everybody else. and i might add, the republican party has my phone number and i don't think i go ten minutes a day without them calling and asking me for money. i don't want them to have my phone number either. >> okay. everyone is going to be asking you for money. gary k., i don't even like my employer having my personal information let alone the union. this is kind of nuts. >> well, look. this is the outcome of union membership that has dropped in half over the last 30 years. they are desperate. they just lost a vote in tennessee with volkswagen to go with the uaw. desperation run amok this time. and here is the problem. this is going to continue. you have an administration that's actually backing this.

we have no privacy anymore. ben said it best. this is all about pressure and the votes in order to curry favor with the politicians going forward. >> it's very powerful stuff. they can get ahold of these names and phone numbers, addresses, that's amazing information. >> these rules are not just about getting access to the contact information for employees as a company that the union is trying to sign up. it's also about shortening the election period as well. >> yes. >> there's a shorter time frame for an election to happen, from 38 days now ten to 21 days. >> that's good for the union? >> yeah. because it doesn't give the company time to respond. i want to point out, though, this was -- these rules were passed by the national labor relations board a few years ago. and the way the vote was done was shot down by a court. so this is their second shot at it. and it might go -- it will certainly help unionization in this country. >> i got a feeling your father is a union guy. >> he was not -- my dad was such

a sweetheart of a guy. if he ever went to ben stein's house, ben stein would love him, would bring him in, offer him tea. he drank tea, by the way, ben, and, you know, you would love him menacing you. i guarantee that. i'm only kidding. he was actually a rough guy, the last guy you want showing up to your house. i will say this. i agree a hundred percent with ben. here is the real scary thing. a lot of this stuff you can download off the internet. i can get people's names and addresses pretty easy. >> but it is a lot of work. a company with a couple hundred thousand people, somebody handing you the list is a real sweet thing. >> the real issue is shortening the time frame, making these shotgun weddings. remember what happened with shotgun weddings. there is always buyer's remorse not giving people enough time to digest. what the union can give you, what the company is offering. >> it is to limit discussion and debate. >> absolutely. >> but i would suspect maybe you have a different take on this? >> so i'm with ben. i get calls from the democratic party all the time and i'm sick of it. stop calling me for money and leaving voice mail because i'm

not giving it to you. i will say this. i do elections all the time. it is super easy to get the name and address if you're a registered voter. every single person on this panel and in the country. >> we're talking about people who work within a specific company to unionize them. you can get peoples' names and numbers but do you know where they work? >> first of all if you're a union you know where they work. >> you are not a union. that is the point though. they want to get this information to make it easier for them but is it fair? >> charles, by the way somebody calls you and tells you to unionize and you don't want to, don't unionize. somebody called me and told me to vote for mitt romney last year. >> they want this to be a shotgun marriage, ten days. i mean, that sounds so outrageous. >> i agree. >> let people discuss and debate. >> i'm with you. >> you know why they want ten days? when you think about it, add up union dooues and what the compa gives you -- >> under a lot of circumstances, you can't make a blanket

statement. but under a lot of circumstances, listen, part of the reason i believe, i'm a strong, private sector union person and i'll tell you why. under the circumstances, we have a smaller middle class today than we did 50 years ago and that tends to decline the union. >> why not do -- >> i'm with you. >> here's the issue. here's the gist of this. we can go in a lot of different directions when we talk unions. on this particular topic the idea that your personal information is handed to someone, this is a country with a do not call list. you know, that invasion of our privacy is going to be put out there. i think that oefffends a lot of people. it's not about unions. it's about my privacy. >> you make a great point. in my industry the financial district you can't even call people on the do not call list. this is all about short cuts and ethics. to me it is completely unethical for a union that is not part of the company to go and get this information like this.

>> are you saying you can't get people's names and addresses that make more than a hundred grand a year? there is no data base for this? i deal with wall street guys all the time and that's all they do is call. >> i can get any name, any number, any data base, but there are rules in my industry that you cannot call people that are on this no call list. >> right. >> you're not going to go to jail for it. but it's still out there. >> ben, this week we had a lot of union workers saying let's boycott staples because of the deal with the post office. listen, i know the unions are in dire straits but it feels like all of these things back fired. you know, why would you boycott staples? why would you want to knock down something that could actually bolster the post office and make it more relevant? >> because the unions as you say are desperate and not thinking clearly and as to julie's idea that somehow unionization is going to help the middle class, it helps the people in the union but then the people who are not in the union get put into the lower class. the idea unionization can work

for the whole country is nonsense. again, made something out of nothing. unions can only raise wages for the people in them not the people outside them. >> this is certainly a move of desperation, though, to increase unionization in this country by the nlrb because you look at even vw, at the volkswagen vote, and volkswagen cooperated with the union and let them come in the plant during the organization campaign and they still voted it down and the uaw has dropped a challenge to call a new vote in that very -- >> i am for private sector unions, a huge supporter, but i want a level playing field. what scares me the most is the shotgun wedding notion you brought up. the ten days. i mean, you don't have a month to think about whether to give your dues to a union or stay with the company and give the company your benefits. that is outrageous. >> if joining the union is such a good deal for the employees, then let it germinate a little longer period of time. >> over the last few years we've

seen every kind of sort of gimmick with, you know, trying to -- with the voting schemes, with the time duration, it does smack of something illegitimate or being forced upon people. >> first of all, i agree with charlie. i never thought i'd say this. i believe in strong private sector unions but i agree on the election period. i think we should have a longer period. but i also would agree and say to ben stein's point, you know, ben, you i assume are a big believer in triple data economics. >> not at all. >> listen. if you believe in trickle down, you must believe -- >> i don't believe in it. >> not you but if one does believe in trickle down one must believe people who make monday anythe middle class trickles do. even if people aren't in the union. that's real trickle down. >> i don't believe if you're not in the union you earn less. >> now to you.

>> charlie said the three most important words -- "level playing field." this will take the level playing field and tip it big time toward the unions in an act of desperation. >> look, i'm hosting a show and it's the charlie love fest. >> we love charlie. >> hey, america's middle class is no longer the richest on the planet. whose fault is that and what can be done about it? well the forbes gang is all over it. up next, the drug use fraud and tax evasion, think it lands you in jail? itg the most

powerful name in news, the fox news channel. bonuses that are just bone headed. the irs awarding nearly $3 million in bonuses to employees receiving disciplinary action for things like drug use and benefits fraud and, get this, a million bucks going to workers who didn't pay their own taxes. you can't even make this stuff up. >> some of this stuff people would be fired for. you're misusing travel expenses. but you're ex-irs and you get a bonus even though you didn't pay your taxes. that is the richest, dumbest thing i have ever heard in my entire life. my favorite part, when the reporting was being done on this, the irs said the irs generally doesn't can are conduct issues with awards. >> certainly a lot of people were angry they're getting bonuses in the first place. what does this agency do over the last couple years to deserve bonuses? >> right. spy on people. >> yes. >> target conservative groups.

it ought to be audited. >> target conservatives. they did not get awarded. it was the only thing. >> free legal advice. >> i think the irs is a necessary evil but they are evil. what they do is take money from the american people, that they've earned. but it's necessary to pay the bills of this country. to think that they even get bonuses is, you know, for this job, is insane. that is really insane. >> yes. >> they got a government job. they get a pension. >> can't be fired. protected. >> you know, ben, i got to tell you, it really is, we talk all the time and compare the private sector to the public sector and we know there are certain differences but these bonuses to these people, you know, with these sorts of violations on their record is just beyond the pale. >> well, i can tell you, as a long-time government employee before i entered the glorious world of hollywood, it was fun. i mean, we did not consider that money to be taxpayers' money. we considered it to be our money.

we can play games with it. we can give ourselves imaginary sick days. we can take off and not charge it against our sick days. that way it accumulated for when we left. we had an incredible amount of fun with the taxpayers' money. the government employees basically just think it's his money that god gave him to play with. >> that's the point. i think that is the best point. there's a culture in that sector that just doesn't ever think about where that money came from, who worked really hard, who put in the sweat, the sacrifice, and toil. they just do with it whhat they want. >> this is a small microcosm of a huge problem. government is their own place. they don't care. it's not their money. it's an endless amount of bucks coming from the taxpayer. 15 years ago, the government spending was 1.8 trillion. it is going to be near 4 this year. there's so much sloshing around, what do they care? they have nobody to answer to, no accountants, nobody looking over them. so you get what you get. we get to talk about it.

>> julie, you know, we have huge trust issues in this country. stuff like this just doesn't help. >> i think ben just talked about ten felonies on air. forget the irs. i think the fbi is coming for ben. i'm with you. it's a bigger issue than just irs bonuses. when are bonuses ex-pecked? aren't bonuses for jobs well done? there is this culture now that it's part of your t is actually that work for for profit companies that return money to the share holders. >> i'm with you. >> this is a bigger problem. >> i'm with you. there is no merit. it's irs by the way. 2/3 of the employees at the irs got bonuses in fiscal 2012. 2/3 of them. >> whoever heard of working for the government and getting a bonus? >> here's the thing. when the president of the united states goes out and says you didn't build that bridge, we built the bridge. think about the way this country is changing fundamentally. we're in a situation right now

where government controls everything. where the government controls your money. where the people that work for the government think you work for them. >> well, i think that does turn the idea of public servant on its head. julie, back to you. are you actually saying then that people in government shouldn't even be able to earn bonuses? government workers? >> again, i don't even know what's going on today, but i side with charlie on this one. >> yeah. >> i don't even know what's going on. some kool-aid. >> or where we're doing the show from. if this is the real julie, they told me to change the pronunciation of your name on the show, i just found out today i was pronouncing it wrong. maybe it's a different person. >> for like a decade you've been pronouncing it wrong. but let me finish my point. listen, bonuses should be given out -- look, if you're a government employee and you save somebody from a burning building and you did some massive, you know, do gooder act that deserves a bonus, then you get a bonus like everybody else. but degan is right, 2/3 of people getting a bonus is not a

bonus. that's a salary. it's not right. >> gary k.? >> julie, i have the number for the republican national committee if you need it because you are sounding quite republican. >> let me just quickly add -- i just want to get my thought out to say, clearly, the calls you were getting for mitt romney, were working. >> the last word goes to ben. ben, someone is saying here that you are admitting to felonies. i want to give you one quick moment to at least clear up the official record. >> statute of limitations has run. >> that works every time. thanks a lot, guys. hey, everyone. if you got a lot of debt you may want to work for the public sector because big help is on the way. if you work in the private sector you may just have a big problem. >> and so as i look out at your smiling faces filled with hope, all i can think is, you are completely screwed.

if the government is forgiving student loan debt, who wouldn't want to sign up? they do just that. in fact, it surged 40% in the past six months. if you have a job in the public sector, your debt is forgiven after ten years. but if you're in the private sector, you have to wait 20 years. it doesn't sound fair to me. >> well, again, there's rules for washington d.c. and rules

for the rest of us and it's always we're behind the 8 ball once again and all of this forgiveness, all it does is get more people wanting to be forgiven. we used to have contract laws on debt. it seems to not matter anymore. >> you know, ben, the president has talked throughout his administration about luring the st talent to government. you know, maybe this kind of thing does the trick. it really is attractive to think that after ten years your student loan debt would be forgiven. >> well, once again, i'm guilty of a felony because i worked as a teacher for many years after a left school and my student loan debt was forgiven but let me say this, an investment in college education is an investment that benefits you the student. you shouldn't have the taxpayer paying taxes to support you. you should pay that yourself. contract law is vital to a functioning society. we shouldn't throw it overboard. >> i guess, julie, there's the compassion or fair argument in this whole thing, right?

>> i don't think it's compassion or fair but gary is treating this like a bunch of bureaucrats in washington. what about the firefighter? what about the cops? those people are doing a public service. >> you have to go to college to be a cop? >> yeah, some cops do think you have to go to college. i don't know what the police department laws are. >> the bigger issue. >> let me give you my thought which is essentially this. i had student loans, federal student loans. if i hadn't had those federal student loans i don't know how i would have handled college. it benefits a lot of people and helped a lot of people. if i didn't have it -- >> the bigger issue is that the government is encouraging people to go into debt and deep into debt to get an education. and, in fact, you should be encouraging the students to do a cost benefit analysis of like, well, is it going to benefit me to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars to get an undergraduate or graduate degree? they're working against the

student. >> all of this targeted enforcement by the government. enticement to go into debt with student loans reminds me of what happens with the housing crisis. this could be the next housing crisis where we're going to have to bailout the lenders. whoever is the lenders here because this sounds like, you're enticing people to do student things. like take jobs. >> the government is making a lot of money off of student loans but it does seem unfair. >> you bailout the banks. >> my thanks to charlie and julie. thanks to both of you. you were next, history saying sett s sell your stocks in may. but we have the stocks you

i like skechers. they're selling a ton of cool footwear for men and women. earning and sales are sizzling and acting well in a market that's topping out here. >> skechers is an amazing company. they reinvented themselves several times and blew away the numbers. how do you feel about it? >> i think it's a great company. but fashion is extremely fickle and i would not want to bet much machine fashion trends continuing. >> what do you like? >> boeing. i love boeing. this is a company whose magment has shown astonishing flexibility. brilliantly run basic company.

>> real quick, do you like it? >> i just think prices way ahead of their earnings and i think it's going to do nothing for quite awhile. >> love boeing and also love the cost of freedom that continues on the place for business. don't change the channel, fox. america's middle class is no longer the richest in the world. and get this, the same study that says this says that the middle class is shrinking because the u.s. needs more liberal policies like a higher minimum wage, more unions and more government spending on education but some hearsay those are the policies that are actually pulling down the middle class. who is is right? hi, everybody, welcome to "forbes on fox" let's go in focus. well, john, first of all, let's look at what this study's conclusion is which is other countries are are growing their middle class like canada for example but not the