if you've had to become your own investment expert, maybe it's time for bny mellon, a different kind of wealth manager ...and black swans are unpredictable. the isis border threat. we may all regret if we don't stop it now. the head of a federal immigration workers union warning that isis terrorists may have already crossed our southern border or will do so sooner. one republican lawmaker saying four people with terrorist ties may have been nabbed crossing that border earlier this month. do we need to lock it down now to protect our lives and livelihood right now? hi, everyone, i'm brenda. this is bulls and bears. here they are, tracy, jonas, john along with emily. welcome to everybody.

john, how many more warnings until washington gets it? >> i hope not anymore. i hope that the warnings are enough. isis said they are coming to the united states. we have a national federation, federal government head saying isis is coming across the border. isis is putting out blueprints on the internet about how to make bombs to blow up places, specifically in the united states. there's been 60,000 drug related murders in mexico. estimates are as high as 120,000. 60,000 is the official number. that is a war zone there. to seek another bad guy through a bad guy is easy to do. this isn't about immigration or amnesty. this is about protecting our country. we have their blueprint. we have their game plan. we know they say they are coming through. we have to do something to stop it. >>." there clearly is more urgy

with all the warnings about terrorists allegedly coming across the border. they can get in this country without doing that. is this worth the cost? >> i don't think so, brenda. i really come full circle on this after looking into it a lot. first of all, estimates are from the immigration patrol, it costs $22 billion to build this fence. that's not including buying all the land, fixing up all the holes every year, then you think, is it going to work? i mean, you know how many hijackers from 9/11 were here illegally? none of them. as an example, we have the berlin wall, you know, back during world war ii, the heavily fortified wall in the history of mankind. you know how many times it was breached? thousands of times per year. we need more intelligence and security. building a $22 billion a year plus a wall. >> tracy, a lot of people think

the people crossing the border are from mexico or guatemala. people from syria, iraq, iran, how serious is this? >> it's really serious. this has been something that has been bothering me for awhile now. we are not taking it serious enough. isis is here. i don't care what anybody says. they are here. they infiltrate the minds of borders. the tears come down, they want to take care of them. so many of these kids are trained to hate us and kill us. we are letting them in, welcoming them with open arms, paying for medical and everything. it's going to come back to bite us. build a wall, not a fence. build anything you have to to protect this country. >> you could build a wall on the southern border, but it doesn't prevent isis from getting into the country. >> as i mentioned a few weeks

ago, the canadian border is a huge, porous border that is just as open. it's a nice idea to have the walls across our borders. to gary's point, the cost benefit, how much are you going to spend to stop the machete attack? it's terrorism. do more in the country, i think, to stop the movement of people. that means us making sacrifices, getting rid of cash, having more cameras in cities. things to prevent people. requiring federal id. you don't need federal identification to mill about. those are things you need to think about. not bigger walls. >> emily, what do you think? what is your take? >> it's not like there's a lack of ideas or proposal that is have come forward. a piece that isn't discussed about the bipartisan bill passed out of the senate is that it had historic protection for the border. that's where it gets dropped.

speaker boehner said, just this week, the faster we can pass immigration, the better it is for the economy, which is better overall. the house has the votes. i think they have the votes to pass the bill, they haven't brought it up. what did they do this week? came in and went home to start campaigning again. the idea the house could make it happen tomorrow, the votes are there. >> look, i can't believe that you are willing to do a cost benefit analysis. this is something that has to be addressed. if you are going to look at signs, look at them through the other stupid stuff we do. this is the one thing the government -- this is their job to protect and defend. money shouldn't be an object. >> there are maybe better ways to spend the money, is that what you are saying? >> i'm not arguing the 22 billion or whatever it would cost is money ill spent on terrorism, i think it's spent in the wrong way. if you went back and said how

could we have prevented 9/11, we needed to beef up the intelligence, beef up the cia and the nsa. that would have been the way. at least have the agencies working together since we have the knowledge. you want to spend billions of dollars, i'm fine with it to protect the country, but don't build a silly wall. itis not going to stop the terrorists. they are recruiting americans into isis here. they are already here legally. you are not going to get them except by listening to phone except by listening to phone calls and thing that is the and what other agency does. >> do you think it's a silly wall? >> i think in parts of the country, yes, it is a silly wall. people get hung up on a wall and lost to the facts. i have a lot of issues with what's been said. this isn't about a machete attack. 9/11 was done with box cutters. you don't have 60,000 official drugs in canada. cut off and people executed on

the canadian u.s. border. there is a difference between that border and the mexican/u.s. border. theg5 berlin wall, thousands across, the last year, you had 157,000 people that the government said they missed that came into the country. we have secured borders that are worse than that before. we secured the pakistan/afghanistan border. i have been there. we secured it. we can secure this border as well. walls don't work in certain areas. take the troops in afghanistan. take the troops in different places, place them along the border and let the troops patrol the border and you will be able to shut down the border. >> there's your wall. jonas, what do you think? >> i'm not disagreeing with mexico, but where is that crime now? spills over. they are drug gangs telling each other. the fact that we have border now this week, they are not killing

like they were. adding security isn't going to help. itis going to raise costs. >> tracy? >> we leave the doors wide open-i think it's ridiculous. we have to do something. to save it, building something, putting up something is not going to work, fine. there has to be something there more than what we have now. everyone can come to an agreement on that. we need something. we cannot let them come into our country. you don't know who they are and where they are coming from. is our isis crisis because we are godless? neils gain on how multiculturalism may be a costly mistake. this time, rupert murdock is joining the discussion. first, talk about a magic carpet ride. ali baa baa surging. some here say it's time to tell some here say it's time to tell china to roll out the red carpe you know, if you play football for a long time like i did,

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welcome mat to u.s. companies. >> for us to try to do business over there, the stories you hear, brenda, people can't get manufacturing orders. there are no rules and regulations to begin with. you don't know what to follow. china makes it up as they go. if anybody believes the number that is come out of china, i have a bridge to sell you. it makes u.s. companies competing over there completely unfair. it's time they level the playing field with us. >> despite the harassment and e restrictions of u.s. companies, there's a benefit. alibaba says it is going to provide a lot of jobs for americans. >> exactly. there's a lot of issues. one, is alibaba to be trusted? she is right. who knows. that's one. two, are companies in china being unfair? >> yeah, chrysler has a.5% of

the market there, microsoft, also. companies like alibaba, are expanding internationally. they are bringing jobs to europe and the u.s. i understand the fairness issue, but i have to shrug my shoulders and say so what. if they don't want the microsofts and qualcomms to compete over there tharks is their loss. i mean, to come back and say alibaba, you can't list here. who gets hurt? i think we do. >> there's a huge trade imbalance. u.s. exports to china 122 billion imports from china, four times that. >> yeah. we are by far the largest trading partner, $520 billion. hong kong 400 billion, japan 300 billion. we have nothing to fear. we undermine their entire

economy. if you owe the bank $100,000, they owe you. if you owe them $10 million, you control them. with china, there is no recourse here. if you have, like tracy mentioned, companies with inventory that didn't exist. balance sheetings that didn't exist. so what, americans lose money. amazon can't go over there, but alibaba can come here. it's time to quit letting them bully us around like they have done for so long. we have much more to control with than they do in this. >> jonas, what do you think? >> not long ago, there was a fear we wouldn't be the financial hub and the listings would be in england. this is a win for america. this is the number one place to list. they didn't want to list there because there's more restrictions on shareholders rights. at the end of the day, these rules that they do in china where china owns parts of the companies, it's going to hold china back. they can't work forever

their own businesses. itis not a good economic model. it's worked well for a couple decades for china, but in the long run, excludeing u.s. companies is going to hold them back. >> it has worked well for a long time. their growth rate has been triple ours. >> i think underlying all this is that we are only moving in a direction of more international trade and more international market as we move forward. once the genie is out of the bottle, you can't put it back in. we are moving more in that direction. something to look for is high international standards across the board. otherwise you get into picking and choosing and moving around. let's look for higher national standards across the board. >> how likely is that in china? >> slim to none, which is why investors need to be careful if they are touching anything with the china flag waving from it. let's be clear, i don't know if it's a win for the united states. we bought a piece of a cayman

islands show company. we are not allowed to buy shares in chinese companies. they are prohibiting us from taking part. yet, it seems jack made a load of money on friday on our dime. >> gary, what do you think of that? >> i agree with everything tracy said. i shrug my shoulders and say so what? are we better off or worse off if alibaba didn't list here. they cannot restrict u.s. companies. as this country becomes more and more capitalistic, man, why do we have to use this crappy spread sheet? why not the microsoft spread sheet. i think it's going to spread and our companies will be allowed to make further inroads. >> that's the last road. just over an hour from now, eric what do you have coming up? >> hi, brenda. profiling to save america from home grown terrorists is this most common sense and cost

effective way to save lives. plus, why we should wave the white flag on poverty. that and more. see you at 11:30. up here, first, verified or lose your coverage. how a new threat from the white house could leave americans without a health care plan by election day. some cash back cards

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talk about bad timing, with just over six weeks to go before the midterms t president's promise to americans that they can keep their health care plans is going to be broken again. obamacare enroll lees who don't confirm their income could lose subsidies and their plans altogether. here we go again. >> oh, my gosh. i am living it. i got a notice from blue cross/blue shield out of maryland because my plan didn't have all the things obamacare requires, i would have to go in and find another plan. i went to their site and tried to find a plan. what i found is basically everything doubled. i said okay, i'll go to the state of maryland website, which was inpenetrable. i don't know if i was at the maryland website or the government website. all these pop-ups were coming up from health insurance brokers.

i went there. prices through the roof. then i started getting phone calls. i think i'm pretty good with computers and the whole internet thing. i'm still on, well, i'm going to push my decision back to hopefully figure this out. you cannot figure it out. when you can, i am positive everyone's rates are going to go way up. >> you are our sympathy. isn't it right to have income verification? what is wrong with that? >> i don't disagree with those criticisms. this situation, they are getting highly subsidized insurance by people paying lot on capital gains taxes. you better verify that your income is low enough for that subsidy. i hope the government isn't just doling out subsidies to anybody claiming to not earn a lot of money. >> john, what do you think about that? >> i think that gary knows what's going on. he's the only one in washington,

d.c., that knows what's going on. >> i don't know what's going on. >> we got sold a bill of goods. this was insurance reform. this was passed in a partisan manner. what about health care? imagine the stupidity of this. if you have a store that is wrought with theft, add more customers, is that going to fix it? that's never going to work. politicians lie and misspeak to get things done. these guys have no idea what they are doing. >> emily, isn't this proof you can't keep your plan as we were promised? >> look, i think what people should be saying is, isn't this the way it's supposed to work. when you signed up saying i have x-income level and the subsidies were available. they have to prove it. that's reasonable. they got numerous notifications and now, unfortunately, they are not going to be able to keep it.

some people were not able to verify it. it's the way the government is going in and getting rid of waste, fraud and abuse. >> so back door. why are we doing this now? !q1ñ ask questions later. this is what we do. 90%, almost 90% of the 8 million people enrolled are getting subsidies. something is wrong with this picture. not all those people should be getting them. we consistently do it because we don't think about things first. now everyone has to deal with the ramifications. >> thanks guys. especially to tracy and emily for joining us. get ready to get bullish on data breaches. plus, gaga for baba. plus, gaga for baba. how you can

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predictions. gary, you are up. >> brenda, here is my stock advice. when a company has a data breach, buy. first it was target, now home depot. >> bear. >> your prediction. >> allibaba is worth more. you get the yahoo! business. i own it. >> bear. not a fan of the yahoo! hedge fund. >> no thanks vote shows the uk may stay together. the u.s. dollar is better than

the pound or euro. bonds up 5% in the year. >> john, what do you think? >> william wallace is rolling over in hisgrave. i like equity. >> neil is next. take it away. is isis a crisis because we are godless? welcome everybody. i'm neil cavuto. look at the uproar i started. it all began with a chap named nigel as in the man who many say this could be britain's next prime minister telling me, on fox, why he thinks isis is knocking on our door. we are all but letting them in because, as nigel sees it, we have all but slammed the door on god. we are into multiculturalism to the extent we have invited