tv Cavuto FOX Business April 15, 2015 8:00pm-9:01pm EDT
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everything. as always found at loudobbs.com. take a second to like the fox business network's facebook page. and that wraps up our housekeeping. that's it for us tonight. good night from new york. neil: so you think these four candidates are the only ones in the presidential race right now? in a minute i want you to meet the fifth, who was actually the first. and for my money thus far the only one who will make you think. but before we get to that i hope you remember this. it's tax day. do you know where your money is? welcome everybody. i'm neil cavuto. and i hope by now you're done with your taxes even though if you think about it, we're never done with our taxes. rates going up. fees going up. fines going up. if you have it, uncle sam wants it. an affordable care act that suddenly doesn't look so affordable. and free college for which you will likely get the bill. this tax day, why not a
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good taxpayers revolt. how about accountability from this government that shows no mercy. how about this next hour we explore how we can get our country back by finally demanding our politicians to show some backbone. and how about we start with the guy who made it all possible under ronald reagan gosh, more than three decades ago. art laffer with me now. art, hard to believe it's been that long and then some. >> it really is. neil: since the reagan revolution. everyone thought it was crazy to cut tax rates and expect to be an economic boom. you didn't. ronald reagan didn't. but that was then. a lot of folks say that can never happen now. what do you say? >> i say they're wrong. i mean, it's prime time right now for a major tax revolt. spending revolt as well. this free education person -- college it's amazing how people think that something free doesn't cost twice as much as something you pay for. which it does. neil: but if you don't pay for it, you don't care.
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someone else is treating to dinner, at least in my case i'm ordering a couple of appetizers and a couple of desserts. everybody doesn't mind spending someone else's money. >> they ultimately get a bad economy like what we have right now. employment at its lowest level. sitting there down at the floor for eight or nine years. gdp growth is anemic beyond beneath. just like it was under jimmy carter. it's perfect time to have a fiscal revolt and bring this economy back. and i look at these candidates out there and i think we'll get it. neil: maybe you're right. the one who is lighting up some interests every time we have them on. but before that, i want to talk about the general environment where it takes longer and longer for you to clear the path to be making all your money after you pay the government. >> true. neil: late spring before people clear that hurdle. for many people, after
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june. and each -- each year it gets longer and longer and longer. i mean, we're not that far away, you know, from essentially coughing up our entire paycheck for uncle sam at the rate we're going. what do we do? >> teddy kennedy's simple flat tax on a postcard. how much did you make? send it in. remember that? neil: i remember talking to charlie rangel he will about this. he said neil, am i remind you that the top rate used to be 90%. and he was saying, we have a lot more room to go. so he was -- he was saying 90% would be a good goal. >> oh, i was thinking of it the other way. we have a lot more way to go down. neil: what do you think happens on that front? all the candidates are talking about simplifying the tax code. >> sure. neil: but it's all talk. >> i spend a lot of time with a number of them, neil. i can tell you, i don't think it's all talk. they're testing the waters and doing all
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that. anyone looking at the polls knows that taxes aren't popular. and the income tax is especially not popular. and i think these guys understand that what you need is a low rate broad-based flat tax, and, you know, let the economy start going again. if you did that, the way reagan did with two brackets 15% and 28%. we went back to just reagan you'd get a boom in this economy like you can't believe. a wonderful period of prosperity. neil: well, anything lower than what we have now. if you weren't going to slash it to the degree that reagan did but you slashed them all would it be a step in the right direction and put more pressure on the spending? one thing we did learn from the early '80s, they spent that money coming in. if we can get that part controlled, we could be on the way and off the races. >> i think we will get that happening. to be honest with you i've never seen a better group of candidates than the republicans now. i think hillary as far
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as democrats goes is as good as the democrats can possibly put up. i mean, when i think of some of the other candidates democrats have put up and could put up, hillary is by far than the other ones. neil: i agree with that. >> and republicans are really good as well. so we'll have a very good race where people will compete as to who can get the best formula for prosperity. my guess is you'll get a low rate, broad-based tax rate. sound money. minimum regulations. if you think we had a boom in the '80s or '90s following obama you can't believe the boom we'd get following obama. it would be amazing. neil: did you stop at a bar before you came here? >> no, i did not. even though i'm short i'm naturally high if you know what i mean. neil: you are indeed. great guest. thank you very much. to the tax man, the entire tax system, the fifth candidate in a four-person race thus
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far. actually the first candidate to declare his intentions to run for the white house. irs commissioner mark. our tax return code is so out of control. he's running for president to change it. who better to change it than the guy who -- well the fox running the asylum, if i can mix those metaphors. first, you don't get the respect. you were the first out the gate. it's not as if you were nobody. you had pedigree credentials. budget. irs. ignored. >> well what do you expect? it's a clothes shop neil. i don't think wall street and the big donors are going to buy this election. i've opened an office in iowa. and we're starting to make -- neil: how big is the office? >> just a small office. it's a beer and pizza budget. neil: who is funding it? >> 10% of my net worth is what i'll put into
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this. neil: emily is okay with that? >> i have a son that will be seven. the kids on the t-ball team they think they'll practice on the south lawn. so, you know so you may say the folks in washington, they may say this will go nowhere. i have to tell you in the five short weeks that we've been doing this, i think we've gotten to a place where people are saying, look, this guy has interesting ideas. you know what, he has a lot more experience than most of the -- neil: that's why we had you on a number of times. everyone deserves to hear you out. if they don't think you have a serious chance or don't like what you're saying that's their call. you shouldn't be excluded because you don't fit a certain profile. former elected official. which seems to be the way we go. your ideas aren't crazy. i want the folks at home to hear them. on the tax code, what would you do? >> look, i think what we need to do is take 150 million people off
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the role. people are scrambling to get their paper in or file online tonight. we need to move to a consumption tax and then reduce the income tax rates for the hirers. leave a small number of people on. bring down the business tax rates. neil: still have two different taxes. >> yes. exactly. neil: that's what europe did. remember, it was sold originally, we'll keep the vat tax at a low vefl justlevel. >> everybody talks about europe. but there are 160 countries around the world. australia. new zealand also using a vat. this is the norm. we should be doing things that ease conversations with other countries. pretrade. all the things we have. neil: wouldn't that extra sales tax, whatever you want to call it, consumption tax wouldn't that be just more of a pool of money for spenders to dig into?
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>> i don't think so. i think everyone is acutely aware of the dangers of raising taxes politically. that's why this plan which everyone can go to markforamerica.com and see it. it replaces the revenues we have today. neil: what would the percentage be? >> oh, low-income earners meaning people who are a couple that earn more than 100000, 14, 15%. it would get up into the low 30s. neil: versus 39.6. >> people at the top are paying supplements on the affordable care act. neil: what's the highest? >> the low 30s. neil: okay. the lowest you would be at income taxwise, the lowest you would be what? >> fourteen, 15. neil: how many rates would you have? >> sliding scale. fourteen, fifteens. (?) again, it would only kick in if a couple is
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earning 100,000 or more. anybody below that level, 150 million people, they wouldn't have to deal with the service at all. neil: not with the income part of it. but the consumption tax. >> pay as you go. neil: liberals say that's regressive. >> no. this proposal says you can use as an offset to your social security taxes a calculation. you'd say what your spending would be, you can reduce your payments into your payroll taxes. the nice thing about this plan it's balanced. it leaves the total moneys coming in about the same. and it leaves the distribution of burden about the same. and i just think that's essential. i love the flat tax. i love the fair tax. but the problem is, it -- it really tampers with the progressivivity. there's this construct in this nation that the wealthy, the richer pay relatively more. and what this proposal does, it will generate economic activity, make
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us more competitive. but it doesn't change that construct. neil: what about investment-related taxes? >> you bring down the dividends as well. neil: all right. so dividend taxes go down. cap taxes go down. like marco rubio. >> the rubio proposals are different in many regards. neil: but it's simpler. but it bites in other areas. the consumption. >> absolutely. neil: what about entitlements? >> jeez. this is the other half. you said that in your lead-in. we're right now at this moment and it won't last long where the spending is, again down below 3% of gdp. but it will creep back up rapidly. and when you get to the mid-20s you'll see your debt as a percentage of gdp go way up. so what you need to do is, we need to have a serious conversation. i don't want to increase the burden of taxes anymore. but i would test the benefits program. neil: that sounds a lot like chris christie talking about --
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social security if you're over $80,000. start phasing it out altogether. >> i'm glad he's getting with the program, really. neil: you're for that -- we enter a certain level, you don't get social security? >> neil i mentioned my young son. i signed up for an insurance policy. last 15 years. several thousand dollars a year. i hope i won't need it because i'm alive. if you've done well enough if we don't social security and medicare, we don't fix these programs, they won't be around. neil: we know that in the macro sense. governor christie is right. is it too much to come out the gate and say i'll slash it to smithereens. >> slashing is the wrong word. nobody should think there will be immediate cuts. neil: so grandfather certain things in? >> of course. people drawing benefits now. what did reagan and o'neal do when they cut the deals in the '80s,
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phased things in. neil: could you phase whatever social security -- with that in mind that it starts cognizant of the age i am and don't start that year? >> i'm willing to do that if you'll give me your salary here at fox business. (?) neil: okay. let me take that back. mark, i look forward to hearing a lot more for you. >> i have something for you, neil. if you place this in back of you. and put it up there. that would be great. neil: a lot of people don't know -- we talk to the herman cains, the ben carsons. they may outside the it will petritypical petri dish. when they run for campaign, 60 people running in italy. throwing things at each other. it's lively. we should have that. if you don't like what you're hearing, you don't have to. but he should be heard.
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susan, and you're saying what? >> they created the current situation. how did we get here. we look at what's happening. small businesses are falling off. this year, the tax code is so confusing 40% of small businesses say they'll file an extension. neil: that's not just president obama's creation. >> it has been happening. somebody needs to step up and do something go. it's not obama or hillary clinton or elizabeth warren. they're out of touch of what the real world is about, when they come up with principles to help small businesses, let's take an example, the jobs act that was supposed to be so good for us in small business. three years it took the secc to finally pass reg a plus. uncredited investors like us can invest in small businesses and get them going. neil: don't get going on about reg a plus. >> look at the nrb. neil: i understand. you're annoyed. emily, here's what i
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think. this predisposition on many democrats, if in doubt spend. they're very creative of spending money. not creative when it comes to saving money. >> but what about the tax credits that democrats have been proposing? look, in the tax package, they were debating last fall, the proposals that were coming out of the democratic side child tax credits. then policies impact people in their everyday lives. paid sick-leave. raising minimum wage. these are policies -- neil: who pays for that? >> they lift people into the middle class. they keep them from falling out of the middle class. neil: who pays for that? >> the same tax that republicans are trying to put into swiss cheese tax holes for businesses. it's not for the real people. neil: maybe you'll answer this. who pays for this? >> we pay for it. the small business owner. the average americans. we pay for it. money has to come from somewhere. doesn't fall out of
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trees. what happens with this entitlement programs, the deficit accelerates we're diverting necessary for ourselves the private sector that would get this economy going. all this rah-rah about this recovery, you know what, it's not a recovery. i wouldn't be surprised to see us slip back into a recession because of what's going on. neil: you have to start saying, we will also comprise on the credits we like. and the things we give to oil companies and banks. >> that's how we get the complicated tax code to begin with. look profits are high. people's productivity have never been higher. their prosperity is not gaining. profit is at record highs. neil: are you saying this recovery -- >> the company has paid several federal income tax. neil: you know what's amazing to me all right. emily, i love you to death. but you don't hear me when i'm bringing up a point you find
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offensive. what she said, you heard her. i don't know what's going on, young lady. bottom line, you think this is something that can all work out with tax credits and the like. do you really believe that this constant throwing bones to the american people free college and that, will win the race when we don't have the money to spend? do you think in the end that's being honest with the american people emily, yes or no. >> we need to look at the tax code is complicated. it's this large influence. money in politics. everybody gets a little bit here. a little bit there. we need to be honest about where the influences are coming. neil: yes or no? >> i don't understand that on both sides of the aisle. >> i don't think the current administration the way we're structured right now will get it under control. neil: it's a no. that's it! washington won't fix this spending mess, i will. sixty seconds to a better america if you can wait 120 seconds of rivetting commercials.
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♪ neil: all right. it's time, my friends. time to quit talking. start doing. because this tax day, it is pretty clear to me at least the problem isn't all the money coming into washington. it's all the money being spent in washington. so you think it can't be done? i want you to start the clock. i'm going to solve it in 60 seconds. in six steps. step one, cut all government programs. each and every one by 10%. not off their growth. off their bank accounts now. immediately. step two, cut all foreign aid in half. (?) it's pretty clear to me that we can't buy our friends. so i'll be damned if i'll put a deposit on their hate. step three, government entitlements not some. all. step four, raise the retirement age for collecting social security benefits from 67 to 70 in stages. step five require all
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americans pay federal income taxes. right now 47% do not. now it needed not be a lot, but it better be all. everyone pays something. i don't care what the percentage is. but that everyone has some skin in the game. (?) and step six outlaw this is the important part outlaw all deficit spending any politician who willingly goes overbudget goes to jail. there you go. sweet and neat. daring and done in 60 seconds or less. boom. president cavuto. [laughter] this guy is jealous as all. but, anyway, congressman michael of the fine state of texas. good to have you sir. >> thank you. neil: sixty seconds or less. solve america's problems. go. >> well i think your idea of across-the-board cuts certainly is something i've embraced in the past. the budget control act of august of 2011 did exactly that. now, it wasn't as quite
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as awe steer as you pointed out. 3.2%. the president closed off the white house to visits because he said we couldn't afford it anymore. (?) it turns out we could. neil: i remember. you actually played heroic roles in it. look, we'll go across-the-board on this. even include defense. all have skin in the game. that was like a backup -- the sequester cuts and all the rest. we couldn't even do that. i'm wondering can we ever do this? >> well, the sequester cuts did go through. problem is, the great number of those cuts came from defense. caused people concern. several attempts to undo them. i've resisted those votes to undo of those. neil: i agree. republicans don't want to cut the military. or democrats don't want to cut entitlements. i can understand that. we have to recognize the obvious here. right? >> i don't disagree. a lot of people forget that ten years ago after
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katrina came ashore, we cut discretionary spending by 1%. not a lot but 1% for that fiscal year to pay for katrina. all kinds of people saying, you cut money from cancer research. no we cut money to save the mississippi louisiana gulf. neil: you'll always get somebody saying the starving kids. or grandma falling off a cliff with her wheelchair clutched in her hand. >> the clinch ers was a year later republicans lost the majority not because we spent too little money because we were spending too much money. the deficits exploded after that. neil: exactly. all you guys and i will give credit to you. you make unpopular decisions. you have to be willing to lose. you have to be willing to stand on principle. if it means losing your seat. if more thought that way, they wouldn't lose their seat. the american people would be so surprised they would say whoa, whoa. we're not at that point. >> well, two-thirds of the congress has served less than five years.
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there's actually a lot of turnover that happens in the house. neil: a lot of that -- i've talked. yeah, we have to do this and that. as soon as it gets close to their term, no, no, we won't do that. >> i trust you on the concept of a flat tax. hr1040. everybody ought to pay the same percentage. i didn't understand the 1993, when bill clinton and i earned the same amount of money. he was taxed at 17%. he at 32. it never made any sense to me. let's be fair about this. neil: congressman, took you longer than 60 seconds but i was asking a lot of questions. always good to have you. thank you very much. for those of you wrestling with the middle east and all the problems there, i will have a 60 seconds solution on that tomorrow. in the meantime, i'm leading us out of this mess. grover norquist, doubtful many will follow me. put 3% down get 3% back. really?
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>> neil: if homebuyers could have as little as 3 percent down what you call paying them? with a first-time home buyers get 3% rebate of their purchase price as a way to encourage them to buy a home to is that helps them or create another mill down? are we begging for a new crisis? you don't think that is the case. i do because i remember covering the crisis but why do you say it is not? >> credit is pretty tight any time there is a widening credit is a strong signal we still have fresh wounds but
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it is time to move on and millenials are trying to get into the marketplace and it is tight. neil: did you put 3 percent down you get a back as. >> put it in perspective it is only on fannie mae owned properties the one said fannie mae already owns and the objective is not just to provide financing but a seller motivation to sell the properties. neil: but they may is the stamp of approval and other lenders feel happy with that but we know from the last crisis it was putting its stamp on risky stuff. who is to say they're not creating
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underbite recovery is slower but i am optimistic. this cycle is different we talked about housing prices and the drives the ems spinach few things housing his is strong? to milwaukee and collateral we feel bullish about back. >> we are trying to discern -- this is a standards but if you look at the totality of the mortgage market we are at the cycle lowe's so we need to encourage that. neil: i appreciate your expertise and help i am wrong for garner u.s. time tears digest from grover norquist because people are literally running scared.
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neil: that was a media relapse -- reaction to my plan but information shows that if they are leaving the blue states running to the red states grover norquist says that is approved you need. what do you see happening right now? is to make the states that are not taking the cue like california and new york will keep digging themselves in a whole. what is before then is detroit. people are moving to arizona and nevada, texas, florida there are nine states that have no income-tax.
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another ted that have been hints -- announced that is their goal the governor of arizona once you take a back. louisiana and mississippi the house voted to taken out. the governor of maine says his goal is to phase out over time is a north carolina i think another 10 states and the next 10 years that will take us at zero income-tax with that happens it is difficult to see how your or minnesota california maintain their high income tax states and don't lose their people. >> but they have to get it from property tax or sales tax is ida somebody is calling you right now.
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i am very upset. but what kind of reaction if they take it out of one hand to put it into another? >> that was mr. giuliani calling. there following the model that you don't raise the sales tax or shifted to another if you have normal growth over time if it comes in above 2% anything beyond that goes to permanent the ratchet down the income tax if you have a more serious recovery and economic growth issue higher taxes revenue, that is when you end up with this situation to ratchet down the taxes. neil: what in the diary environment? >> then you cut spending progress some point you have to reduce spending or doesn't work.
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>> they have all kinds of adhered to your timeline some of the dance around and the taxpayer pledge everyone looking for the republican side. >> why has he told you know ? >> he did not take the pledge when he ran for governor. he wouldn't raise taxes but did not put it into writing now he seems to be under the impression his father wanted spending cuts but that is not what happened. the spending went up even more than was planned. it is a disaster on all fronts to increase spending, slowed the economy it was of little much.
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is incorrectly reading and writing history but not to agree to a tax increase. raising taxes is what politicians do instead of governing if you allow a tax increase on the table it drives reform away. not part of reform but instead of reform. neil: that could have spent governor bush himself. marco rubio is getting support but the one thing that voters are goggling that have voters wondering is tonight a "strange inheritance" takes you for a wild ride. when diet and exercise aren't enough, adding crestor lowers bad cholesterol up to 55%. crestor is not for people with liver disease
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neil: age is a state of mind of the voters' mind. google is wanted to find out how old root marco rubio are and also hillary clinton in the top searches physically the age of your boss does not matter as long as they help make money. multiple best selling author says age obsession because i have gotten older it has got to stop by definition ronald reagan never would have gotten out of the gate and winston churchill never would have gotten a chance. >> and marco rubio says that
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is the real message with the real generation in that hillary might be passed. neil: but that was the selling point with barack obama but now people are older toussaint i will not go back. >> he was just elected to terms to the united states. >> i am not say that automatically means you are young or old. stomach lookout reagan handle that. a movie star, a handsome handsome, and he rhiannon ideas that were young. people could not believe them. supply-side economics. but that is perfectly
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legitimate to say there looks like the past generation. another john lindsay came when i was in new york city. he was fresh. and to talk about a new generation and it appealed to the millenials that marco rubio is doing that the baby boomers tried and had their chance. had does not turn of the voters. >> you are wrong. they will not interpret like you did but to say subliminally to take shots at the folks. with the great sense of humor he could joke with people remember what he said to walter mondale? that there is a rare.
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>> ronald reagan was said trouble after the second debate. on the first debates he never finished then they said he is losing so he recovered with southland line but no doubt he had a problem. he still would have one but that tells you that fox will use what they can. >> if you are talking about jeb bush if you are marco rubio that the old guard is nothing new nothing different. >> it is good to be young in heart. the way you conduct yourself. looking to the future that can overcome older age. but there is the in for the
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issue and the brutality issue. with the two oldest elected died in office. sdr. he did not belong there. the party do with that is why they got rid of flawless to put troops in. neil: don't get me going on mollet's. >> take you very much. >> what is said deal in the meantime? >> there is no economy. neil: ways to spend more money. that need to be kept at 41 degrees. while being shipped to a country where it's 90 degrees. in the shade. sound hard? yeah.
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politicians will not give away? it got me going with so woman who says for a college is a great idea. >> free community colleges and free regular colleges. >> what do is wrong with that? you have to invest in generations. >> we don't have money toward fast. >> is a brilliant interview that you hit the nail of the head. you are on fire. dinner reservations got canceled. your back and forth with fat lady should be a wake-up call. you are right we do not have the money to spend. great job keeping your head
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from exploding she is less. please please please get the girl back on her bed. many baby boomers pay for or on the college by working and waiting to have kids she has a lot of growing up to do. >> shuts out. to be deep inside that i.c.h. us at the expense of the equally icy brain of mine. would it be possible for you to think about anything other than your personal greed? we educate the next generation to benefit america not to keep the personal page account that's and happy. >> but we also try to teach about personal responsibility not getting something for free there is
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one reason colleges so expensive because government is paying for it in college jacks up the price because they know that the government will pay whatever they require. >> tavis raise with the generation of workers no handouts broad a by children the same way. so oblivious to what it is like to earn respect not all the american sign to get it. 51 it badly enough you'll pay for it. >> disposable generation is to sensitized because they get bailed out and are not required to work hard. everything is paid with other people's money. committee colleges already freed is called for years of high-school.
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why end of world you insult those taxpayers? requiring your guests have an iq above five. i just find that idea insisting to throw money that we don't have. for get water boarding. >> as soon as she shows up your program is turned off. neil: where are you going to go? >> she is nuts people like her are responsible for our country being in such a mess. what happened to working for what you get? easy you can sit there all dash mighty. finally i thank you are against free college for kids because you are paranoid he will be helping your future replacement.
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clever. into the so snide and cynical i admire you. for those letters so suspicious. goodnight to. >> a menagerie. >> mounted by the master. >> that everyone can take something that is said to make it alive. >> you have someone's lifelong obsession. >> these lines are from nights at the museum. >> can his sons get the legacy to pay off or did they inherit a dying business?
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