court system. über has a lot of legal headachings for now business stays as is. >> a huge hit to über bottom line and whether to go to spreads exactly. trouble. neil cavuto it is yours sir. take it away. >> stuart thank you very, very much. all this time you thought going after banks we get word that federal communication commission is planning to fine at&t $100 million. and it all goes back to those data speeds on your phone. connell with more on that. connell. >> breaking story at this hour from fcc and 100 million fine against at&t from the fcc they're planning is related to the speed in which you can use your cell phone saying mislead consumers or for years about unlimited data plans so june limited they violated transparency obligations as

well. it goes back to stock not moving much on this but coming out we're working off the news release and hope to have more reaction from fcc and at&t in just a mommy. but in 2007 they started when iphone came out to promote unlimited data plan. i think existing customers still renew them. but apparently according to fc krrgs allegations neil whaftion really happening is you were receiving slower data speeds. than other customers were receiving, and at&t was not adequately notifying its customers at that. so the speed of your phone maybe not as as your friends you thought you have unlimited and that was apparently not the case and follow it and see how at&t reacts and fcc more to say later this hour. >> we'll keep track of that also something that should go down in next couple of hours that is federal reserve and whether it is going to telegraph that. pass remote to happen at today's meeting a day --

hike and my friend anthony is right, it might not ham -- happen at all this year. behind the revying is proud. so on this anthony betting seems to be that the frat reserve lay out the case and raise rates in the fall. do you buy that? >> i don't. but you put me in a difficult spot because you have chairman going after me so hit with a golfer workers' i don't see thae that is on the employment or wage side they're superworried about europe and situation in greece. >> when they're implored they don't hike rates. >> it doesn't factor in much but back in september when we have that paper tantrum in september of 2013, you saw the emerging market debt just completely erode neil, in materials of where prices were. so that caused massive disruption around the world. so i think that fed realizes

they're interconnected with the rest of the world. i think waiting until march of 2016, i think it is probably -- >> in the middle of the prime. >> so i'll hear what he has to say but here's what geithner has said and bernanke give them more medicine opposed to less medicine to increase livelihood to get off the gurney. >> chat about this before but we're creating bubble here that this is speeding markets that anyone can mac it dance in shooting fish in a barrel and keep this going worse of this. >> that is one way to look at it but if you start raising rates right now and slow down the economy, and you create a further corporate retrenchment in the economy, then you get all of the businesses on the smaller business, incrementally slow down hiring process that is a disaster. you're clipping away at about 200 -- >> quarter point anthony. >> but there's a ceremonial thing 7 years six and a half years. i think they wait.

they wait for more. >> to leave the house. >> now i'm probably wrong because a future's market is saying 65% 25 bases point rated in september. but reason why i'm looking at this, the way i'm looking at it is we're data driven. i believe chairman yellen is data driven. but there's also a gut reaction here that they're going to wait until inflation to see white in the eyes before they move. >> seen improving economy not numbers and you remind me of that but we did see some pickup in job growth and all. but argument is that if feds coop waiting and waiting that they begin to lose their credibility sort of like -- dad warns them to do this, and then you never do. >> that is a big issue so they have to raise rates and they will raise rates. the question is now, are they going to raise them in september or are they going to wait? i think they're waiting -- research they have is think they're going to wait. i think speculation it is a guesstimate but based on data.

if they raise rates it will be because euro situation with greece has quieted down some and they think they can start pushing for more normalization sooner. it is a good sign for the economy. them raising rates right now neil if you look over the forward year, next 12 months u.s. stock market goes up about 10% from the day of the first rate hike, so i don't think that is beginning to be supernegative for the market. i think that -- >> if it were to come to pass. : fed has done a very good job. don't put me on the set with 6 foote'9" but i need sen phone books to look at height parity. >> thank you very much. stay on this right now. dave first on this rate hike not rate hike, how soon later this year, pointing that even if it were to come to pass, the effect would not be immediately damaging. do you buy that in other words

let's say we do have a fall rate hike that it would not be that damaging what do you think? >> i can imagine market getting nervous about it. that is one way to look at it kind of a main street guy here in colorado, and if i look at what it went likely affect going to have on main street economy. i don't think you know, that size interest rate hike is going to crush thing and unless markets are so fragile that they fall apart like a -- a crying, you know, child. a spot of a rate hike. >> be like babies to me. you know, like kids you want to slap around around not that i wd recommend it. but going into a advertisey so it seems like -- what a decision be based on keeping the markets calm? should they be? >> there's a whole economic and stability thing that the fed has. but back to the same analogy we

use every time on this thing like driving on black ice you don't know where black ice starts and entsdz and if you tap brakes you don't know whether it spins or, you know, just dry pavement there because it is dark outs. it is a little bit of a mystery. i don't think any of us can call it very well. >> yeah, well i've got to here. i have donald trumple aside you might have heard running for president. one of the central themes in the one hour long address was china. saying that they have our number, they have our number that all of these countries that we're indebted to have our number and looking like fools particularly when it cools to china and i thought of the debt we play defense. he said certainly we're wooses because we're wusses we're playing like babies. here's exactly what he said. i want to get your reaction to it. >> when was the last time anybody saw us beating let's say china?

in a trade deal. they kill us. i would beat china all the time. >> a lot of people say that is no way to conduct foreign policy but people related to that statement and anger that was reflect in the statement. what do you think he's saying about china? >> i think he's wrong about the idea that we're being dominated by china. but i think, i think that there's he's right to think that there's a perception as you point out that kind of -- you know, that factory worker, that manufacturing worker here in the u.s. feels nothing but, you know, sort of pressure and decline. i think the reality is that we're winning if that is the right word. i don't think trade is a zero some game where if we win they loose and vice versa ridiculous but a beneficial afnght. but i think we continue to dominate high end or 21st century sort of things of technology and important health care and energy innovation, all

of these things are where we win. they're taking lower wage and lower skill stuff so if you're one of the people working out there in a factory in suburban, st. louis yeah it hurts, and it hurts badly. >> thank you is much. fining a at&t on this, and all inclusive data usage plans. connell now what is an jungt i guess from the fcc what do they is a? a short reaction to recap what we told you at top of the hour. fcc planning 100 million fine. they misled unlimited data customers those who thought they were getting unlimited data on cell phones were getting slower download speeds in cases according to the commission. well, the chairman of the fcc tom wheeler this is a quote saying that fcc will not stand

idly by while consumers are misleading marketing materialings and insufficient disclosure for at&t and part in all of this. said and this is always seemed so far to quote vigorously dispute the allegations. so we'll see. >> if company has much more to say to affect the stock all that much. we'll get become to you. >> thank you connell mccain. former chair of the year not to discuss the policy today or whether feds will be doing today. but his concern about what a number of states are doing today. they have all of these bad balanced budgets requirements. but they play fast and loose rules to get to that. that is upsetting him as inflation did when he first took over the fed job. back in the latter-days of the carter administration, more --

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>> on a day waiting to hear what federal do with the former federal reserve chairman paul. now heading up something called voaker alliance trying to flip in what he thought feds should do and to be true and honest it is talking about what a number of states are doing when it cools to budgets and playing loose with that. but i feel obligated chairman nice to have you. not so much whether you're an advocate of the rates to go up or down but whether markets should be a factor in whether rates go up or down in other words, did you when you were chairman of the fed, factor in how the markets would react to what you did. >> we're talking about something more important than whether rates go up by -- an amount next month six months whatever. >> as long as it stays -- rng rng on this you were tell me

while most states have a requirement to balance their budget, they can do it through a number questionable means in other words shading. >> no question, no congress should not -- not only balance a budget but biggest single problem is many states are not taking care of this pngs which you're obligated to do. >> new jersey cools to miengtd. a fine suspect in that particular respect. not alone. but they are certainly important in new jersey. >> folks should do today chris christie argued well things changed, couldn't make good on that payment wants to bring it disabled again. but a judge is effectively saying they can do that. but you argue that it -- it doesn't help. >> the pain, and got to get that at some point because these are

obligations that are undertaking and not to be change. new jersey not just a present government but -- bipartisan neglect in new jersey for some years. >> but he's running on that record if he decides to run for president he's running on fiscal stewardship of new jersey but you're arguing playing these kinds of game democratic governor are dangerous. right? >> that is right. it has not clear as not just new jersey we're doing states under strain. many are under strain pushing back on infrastructure, education, and pushing become on other services but they're hiding in financial problem that they have. so that the voter doesn't realize trouble that their in and they can't make decisions on what they want to spend money on whether you need increase in taxes without having the facts so -- get facts out there.

get them out there clear lie and don't play games with the budget. don't postpone expenditures until next year. >> what about a reality with the governor in new jersey get with governors both partyies that unfunded liabilities peck a number they're huge. they have to get together to say whatever promises were made unrealistic unless we dramatically increase residents. do you think there's something to that? >> i don't know that we have to matter to increase taxes some eve them have to look. california was in a pretty big hole couple of years ago, and they did to a greater extent do taxes and other things and they're looking better at the moment. >> not as bad 34.7 billion in debt. they're down to about 24 billion but not home free. : they're not home free. they know they're not home free. we made a cable in here, score

in three states somewhat arbitrary we want to produce a scorecard of which states are following responsible practice which is are not. voters never know that and this is just an experiment. but -- >> california gets your highest mark. >> no virginia gets our high test marks. virginia has been a prudent state for a long while. they've had pretty steady revenues they get high marks that are responsibility. and i'm soirl sir under republican and democrat. >> yeah. >> what do they do that other states do not or that is engrained in their system? >> that maybe engrained in their political environment somehow they have paid more attention to this. they have pension obligation as well. they have obligations but they preve cut that with them. >> these obligations are now so pressing i come from new jersey. so depressing, so big that it is too late to make good so you

have to redo. what do you say? >> they they have to spread outr a period of time inevitably to catch up. you started out over new jersey was intending to do and then they delayed it. saying they're going to do it and other states. make a program and 10-year 20-year period they have more than they otherwise would do and catch up by the time some of the retired people were retired. >> so just under saying teasers, firefighters those who were retired that over time you might be able to examine their benefits but slowly but surely reestablish accounts. >> re-examine benefits. but many cases they can re-examine that for new employees. upon the state may have a constitution prohibition. >> reason i mention it is because a number of folks, new jersey, and christian tee administration say this report is unrealistic doesn't reflect the real press. >> can't criticize the report

that says it is unrealistic to point to the facts that is all we're doing. people who don't want to rxz facts and deal with the problem that is there. if they -- can't pretend they don't have a pension obligation. they can't prengd they don't have to pay interest on the debt that they're issued. >> this wasn't a political deal to praise terry brown and doing in california. what they don't have with chris christie a republican of new jersey. >> a bipartisan problem. problem or good government. there's been a neglect of administration or good government not involved in great issues of policy but voters ought to decide that and politician will decide that. but they shouldn't be neglecting to efficiently. this is one part of inefficient operation government states. we have reports coming out about

the federal government. and the administrative practicing in federal government. we've got problems with the same tension paid in university it is in colleges, in training for public service for teaching about public service. but paying attention to the problems of public -- >> in the state level center, we have a debt commission repudiated by both parties. >> every week reading in some disaster from the secret service making problems of the irs or what happened in katrina some years ago. what happened to obama care? why wasn't that better prepared? all of these not very glamorous problems needed attention, an the whole focus of our fort is to bring attention to the front runners that need -- need help. my favorite quotation in this whole thing from thomas edison -- democrat or republican or whatever he is. everybody thinks thomas edison is a sensible guy.

he said vision -- without execution is hallucination owl problem is we've got lots it have reason in this country. fallen down on excuse we have a lot of hallucination. >> we do on both sides. everyone talks in -- you know, mr. walker about reigning in title, government access but never getting to how you're going about it and then ripped apart when they offer a to raise age and back off because they don't want to get electrocuted. >> that is right so we're providing some an ittectote to point out what things are not going right and implication of that. ably cases are serious and a pension obligation over a period of time years. they can next year, following year whether you look, and

they're building a hole that they will find it very difficult. >> said yesterday announced for president that at 24 trillion somehow imagining debt number around 18 trillion now. now he said 24 trillion i don't know what he meant by that. but that we're only a few trillion away from regretting all of this overspending. what do you say? >> the federal government budget problem, federal government debt is in a class of its own. this have a flexible that states don't have. they have the federal reserve. >> turning -- do you think we overdid that? does the idea that the federal reserve? >> not getting into pros and cons of federal reserve policy but an fun usual period. >> would you have done that? >> would -- >> know my secrets the secret -- >> here's what i think, i don't think he would have. >> whether i would have not or i was not in the seats at the time of the crisis, as suggest how it

would have been handle it had very easy to look back and criticize. >> now trying to take the punch bowl away and threat of raising rates it is up. do you worry about that? >> at some point rates are going to have to go up. i think that is inevitable. if we have a good operating economy you don't operate a economy, on interest rates, but that's a great cause of speculation in the market. you like to talk about it. others leak to talk about it. like to talk about i think something more important than whether we're going to have a small increase in interest rates this month, next month, next year. >> but i know you press return but immaterialed your thoughts quickly on the judge with a half victim to hank, former aig federal government did maybe overstep bounds by rescuing company but in the end better to do. >> i think in the end he said they were right to do so.

that was in the midst of an enormous crisis they wanted to be compensated for the risk that was involved. i don't think anybody ever looked back and said second guess that particular proposition. >> thank you. we'll have more after this. you wouldn't order szechuan without checking the spice level. it really opens the passages. waiter. water. so why would you invest without checking brokercheck? check your broker with brokercheck.

>> not just new jersey. many states are under strain. pushing back on infrastructure. pushing back on education. they have been pushing back on other services but they're hiding extent of financial problem they have. neil: essentially reason why we had paul volcker here. he wanted to talk about states underwater playing all sorts of shell games to do it. why they're going through elaborate means of slight of hand to avoid what they should be doing. not only balancing budgets every

year but doing so truthfully and honestly. they have obligations they're punting on. he talked about aig. i want to get reaction to both with our own charlie gasparino. first, charlie, what he had to say about states and their obligations and that is a ticking time bomb. >> not exactly new news but what some one stature of paul volcker, a great fed chairmannhighlights that is a real problem. what leaves out, he is speaking his book. face it, paul volcker was a great fed chairman. tamed inflation back in the late 7's, early 8's. he is liberal and believer in big government. what he is not saying states like new jersey and new york, all places with unfunded liabilities are generally big states with big governments. they can't balance their books by taxes and cuts. they're afraid to cut. if they really -- neil: he does mention california. it tried to slow that. i pointed out the debt is still high in the state but down 10 billion in that state. >> but he was trying to say use

california as great example. we should point out, california raises taxes, small businesses are leaving california. if chris christie really bit the bullet as mr. volcker suggested they should he would be forced, the governor of new jersey, guy probably running for president very soon, businesses would leave in droves. so i think that is part of the problem. neil: chris christie did blink. if you think about it, i live in the state. he did make an agreement with the unions have them give concessions, raise retirement age. his part would be all right. i will make pension payment. he argued that he couldn't do that later on the money wasn't there. fine. the unions and to the public workers he broke a sacred trust. >> maybe, but i would say this, neil. i don't know the minutia of new jersey but if i was to follow what paul volcker is suggest he should do, new jersey wouldn't have i in businesses left. they would have to raise taxes so much. neil: not exclusively. there is a balance but i think you're just a hater. >> no, i'm not. i think he is a great american

and public servant. neil: we should stick together and you chose not to do that. you should hear what he says about you. on this ages thing and whether the government overstepped its bounds he seemed to be saying it is a different situation, different time. don't have me go back to what was heat of the moment in the heat of a meltdown. what do you make of what he is saying? >> you made news on this for a couple reasons. having him explain what is going on in the states but also on that issue. he basically full-throated, at least through, paul volcker willful throat any defense, defended actions of bernanke, geithner, and paulson as regulators. it was spur of the moment. he basically said he would do it if he had to do it. the other thing he made news on, he said you can't have good economy, get the tape, play it back with 0% interest rates. neil: very long. there is a point at which you have to recognize reality.

>> too nice headlines there. neil: thank you very much as always. connell did get a statement and got it from at&t on this fine that fcc is looking to do. connell. >> they want to fine them $100 million for essentially misleading customers, neil, where they said they had unlimited data plans. then fcc is saying some of these customers had slower data speeds. here is the key. the fcc is, they didn't adequately notify customers. let me read you the at&t reaction. that is what they're fighting. we will vigorously dispute the fcc assertions. the fcc specifically identified this practice, legitimate, reasonable way to manage network resources for the benefit of all customers. it has known for years all the major carriers use it. so, we, we being at&t, fully transparent with our customers providing notice in multiple ways and going well beyond the disclosure requirements. so they say they did provide notice. that is basically what the fight will be about here, at&t and fcc as i said, last time we talked about it, neil, the stock isn't

moving much. neil: connell mcshane. heard it in the meantime here from the former federal reserve chairman, arguably one of the best this country ever had, paul volcker said you can't keep rates at zero percent forever. that might be a signal it will all end or telegraph it will end a couple hours from now. more after this.

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new york state is reinventing by leading the way on tax cuts. we cut the rates on personal income taxes. we enacted the lowest corporate tax rate since 1968. we eliminated the income tax on manufacturers altogether. with startup-ny, qualified businesses that start, expand or relocate to new york state pay no taxes for 10 years. all to grow our economy and create jobs. see how new york can give your business the opportunity to grow at ny.gov/business neil: all right. we are just getting word of something interesting that went down in the capitol yesterday. call it boehner unhinged. house speaker angry at a number

of republicans for pulling what he says was unad dullter rated nonsense, breaking with party rank over how to handle this trade deal saying, i made it pretty clear to the members that i was not very happy about it. he was talking about closed-door meeting with republicans who were bucking him on how to go about being in sync votes on trade agreement that ultimately ended up embarrassing the president because more democrats voted against him. speaker was not happy about how number of republicans bolted on him. i don't know if that included republican congressman jim jordan from the state ohio. i know, congressman you were not for caa or tpa, the actual trade authority granted by president on variety of other levels but, did you catch the speakers wrath on either or both? >> well, yeah. first, i am for doing trade the right way. so i am for a tpa process that makes sense with the appropriate

checks. i voted for every trade agreement i ever had. neil: but not those two. not those two. >> not those two, right. taa that is welfare adjustment program. if we believe in free trade and create creates opportunities -- neil: just explain, taa, would carve out relief for business, unions, that would be affected. you said not to that. >> exactly. neil: what i want to know did the speaker say, you bolted from us, hurt us? that was bad thing. >> i was one of the 34 who voted against the rule. they had to get democrats to pass the rule which sets up entire -- neil: did he say anything or do anything to you as a result? is your office like a janitor's closet? >> i don't worry about repercussions. we haven't experienced any. he yelledded at folks. instead of yelling at us why doesn't he work with us? he worked with democrats. he saw how they that turned out. left him high and dry. we said don't put in welfare program. put proper checks in place to keep a check on this president as he negotiates biggest trade

deal in history. doesn't have any linkage to corporate welfare better known as export import ban. we want that to go away. neil: we're told congressman, that he booted three defectors, cynthia loomis, steve pearce, trent ranks from republican whip team. that is pretty vin tick different. >> all three of those members are members of the house freedom caucus which is group of us conservatives supposed to be here fighting for things we told voter. bigger thing, did we talk about trade promotion authority with this president? was that key issue in last fall's campaign? it is important. that is not what we told voters we were would do. why 65% of the republican voters think republicans aren't doing what we said we would do? because we're not doing what we said we would do. go back to focus on what we told them when they gave us this huge majority, largest majority in 80 years. go back and focus on those. dealing with the president on executive amnesty. reforming tax code. dealing with all those issues. let's focus on that.

we move heavy enand earth for trade deal. make a deal with democrats. they run away fright, somehow it is our fault? i fail to see that. neil: do you and speaker still talk. >> yeah of course. we'll still talk. i hope he starts working with us. we think our proposals are common sense consistent with republican principles. consistent what we told voters would do. do it that way instead of working a special deal with democrats and they run away at the last minute. >> thank you very much, congressman. appreciate that. all right. as congressman is speaking we're getting more information on major league baseball hack attack, involving two teaming doing very, very well right now. now the fbi is involved. need i say more. now the fbi is involved. we'll have more after this. (vo) me? i don't just wait for a moment. i watch for the perfect moment. the one nobody else sees. and when i find it- i go for it. (announcer) at scottrade, we share your passion for trading. that's why we give you the edge, with innovative charting

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neil: all right. right now they have two of the best records in baseball but they are embroiled? what could be a nasty hacking scandal but i guess it gets peoples mind off performance-enhancing drug issues. talking about the st. louis cardinals and the houston

astros, back and forth as who was spying or hacking on whom. to warner wolf. you know, says that sports themselves aren't corrupt this is at least sounding corrupting. what is this? >> this is big, neil. this is huge. first time, as far as we know, that one team has actually physically hacked into another team. neil: so what happened, warner? >> here was the significance. when jeff luhnow, was head of the scoutses for cardinals, by the way, cardinals won four pennants and two world series while he was doing. he knows what he is doing. the, and then he was named general manager of the astros. neil: right. >> okay. so, he goes to the astros. the astros are in first place. this was one of the worst teams in baseball. and they have the lowest payroll in the american league. that is the significance. this guy luhnow took billy

bean's method. instead of best players money can buy, it's, you get the best farm team, maybe free agency, scouting, for the least amount of money you can buy. neil: build it up. >> yes. and he has. so, the cardinals, still upset perhaps that he left, wait a minute. let's try to get this guy. let's see what he has here. now, you can take things in your head of course, but you can't physically, as the cardinals did, hack into another team. and i'll tell you what. the new commissioner, manfred, i think he is going to come down huge on the cardinals. neil: but hacking into another team, connell was trying to explain this to me, i discovered two things, it involved baseball and secondly involved hacking. but one thing that confused me what do you gain hacking into what he is doing over there? >> it is the scouting. that's, this guy may be the best

scout in baseball. and they knew it. they wanted -- who is he scouting? neil: whatever program or software he was using he didn't change his password. >> i guess not. neil: that, might be very good at cutting but not very good at computer stuff. >> by the way, he hired a physicist who knew nothing about baseball. neil: is that right? >> yeah. so he -- neil: do you think, warner, other teams do this sort of stuff? >> they may have but they haven't been caught but baseball, you know, and the cardinals, i mean you're talking about, wow, the scandal-free st. louis cardinals, stan musial, bob gibson, lou brock, that is the up standing baseball model. this is not like the old cincinnati bengals. neil: a lost teams will say, is this stature of some of these other scandals we've seen, performance-enhancing drugs. it is different but? >> it is different because it is

not the individual players. the team, the team is the felon here. this is, this is going to be huge. neil: what kind of fines would you look at? >> i was thinking of national football league. when the patriots did the "spygate", with physical props, okay? they fined belichick half a million and patriots one quarter of a million. i think manfred will hit them with, at least a million dollars. i would think so. because he has got, hey, if you're doing it, you better -- neil: throw any of them out of their jobs? >> if they find out who the guys did, i'm sure that's a possibility too. neil: what about the physicist, is he safe? [laughter] neil: i don't know. >> astros are safe. neil: we're watching something else very closely as we've been

reporting here. the government, more to the point, fcc fining at&t $100 million for bilking its customers it says. so-called all inclusive data plans that apparently at&t, according to the fcc was playing fast and loose with the data and speed of that data. now looking at 100 million-dollar fine. at&t is protesting it. the fcc commissioner is next.

neil: all right. here's all the proof you need that fox business can move mountains or at least trigger federal investigations. ever since our adam shapiro started looking into the hiring practices of our air traffic controllers the faa has now formerly opened an investigation based on his initial investigation and this fox business report that said that it is at best, sloppy and

irregular. now the faa is opening an investigation thanks to fbn's work and his work, more to the point. in the meantime we're still in the f acronyms here, fcc looking to fine at&t $100 million over these all you can use data, one step, one inclusive plan that at&t has that is the charges that the at&t rigged speeds of this data depending on customer, time of day, all that. at&t says that is not so. fcc commissioner ajit pai is with us now. what is the at heart of this? that at&t played fast with the fast speeds or what? >> fcc is essentially alleging that the at&t viiv lated 2010 northern disclosure rule that discloses how it manages network to consumers that. is what at&t has done for years. all of sudden fcc is changing rules more in search of

headlines, than in search of justice. neil: that is interesting. if at&t was in fact doing this it was violating no law or rules or standard procedures. that it could, would be free to adjust data speeds to customers? >> the fcc explicitly said five years ago that all, any company had to do was disclose its practices on the website and point of sale. neil: does it do that? >> at&t explicitly does that one of the strange things if you look at fcc document, completely ignores seven different categories of disclosures, that at&t. nationwide press release, bill inserts, emails to particular customers, to websites, even to that day at&t maintains. neil: i'm an at&t data customer and i have noticed points of day where my data is downloading a lot more slowly than other times. is that legal? is that fine? is that okay? they can do what they want? is that something like two point a rial type in my

agreement that i never read. >> this program applied to tiny minority of customers private to 2011 who were using disproportionate. neil: i'm talking about me right now. this is all about me. i'm kidding. to get to the point. does this stuff still go on and is it okay if it goes on? >> if it happens an isp has to disclose to you how it is managing its network. is there any allegation along those lines that violates rules i will be first to stand up to enforce them. neil: internet service providing. what you're saying this case fcc is going too far, which i think if i heard at&t's reaction correctly that was essentially their take? >> yeah, exactly. the fcc essentially ignoring the facts in search of a good story. that is exactly what happened here. neil: wow. a jet, thank you very much. the fcc commissioner ajit pai. next hour we have ending link where the federal reserve is

coming down expected hike of rates. paul volcker danced on this issue a few minutes ago on this very broadcast but he did make clear that you can't stay at 0% interest rate forever. we have effectively been there close to seven years. i think what mr. volcker was saying the party has got to earned sometime. we just might find out in the next hour exactly when. stick around.

>> all right. paul making some news on this show just a few minutes ago talking about the party possibly ending maybe as soon as today when the federal reserve telegraph what is many are hops or thinking will be a rate increase later this year. i shouldn't say hope but thinking the better world. saying that it is probably a good thing for that party to end. >> at some point rates have to go up. i think that is inevitable if we have a good operating economy,

and zero interest rates. >> you don't have -- zero percent interest rates. >> i think he's right. by the way, corporate bankruptcies are at record lows, so what is happening is we have a lot of zombie companies and a lot of local governments that have done nothing to restructure their debt and to improve their operations and chewing up a lot of productive assets. and i'll tell you what is interesting even paul is saying also echoed on wall street by economists who talk to us. there's no pricing power. the fed may have created inflation via lower rates. but if fed does raise rates you have possibly europe and japan step in to do money precincting or china stepping in, central banks stepping in to do surplus at well. so it depends on a global basis what other central banks do too. >> so fed governors are very

loved to start criticizing their successes, or their bred seis sores but i guess the feeling for paul, that this was a mistaken trek for fed to talk when it started doing this in the middle of a meltdown. what do you think? >> been an unusual one. i'll tell you neil rates at zero for six plus years. do you realized we have not had a fed rate hike in ten years? so if this is definitely uncharted territory, but let's think about why rates go up. why are interest rates up in history? they're up because the economy is strong. they're up because wages go up and demand goes up and banks have a propensity to loan money. frankly if you ask me and look at the data maybe one of those four things is beginning on in the positive. to me i don't think that fed really sees the need to raise rates. i'm in the camp that they don't hike rates this year and then

2016 being election year is dicey as well. >> only troubling thing about what -- they said and what i hear federal reserve and how much they are cognizant of the market. not nigh naive but to do bidding based on what markets might be doing yeah they're going to rebate. but i just wonder lizzy whether that is -- always a wise strategy if you have a risk ticking off the markets. once in a while. >> yeah, because one of the leading economic theaters is consumer confidence, and certainly if you see a 401(k) balance going down that would hit consumer confidence. but i think you're right because wall street analyst told us they don't want the federal reserve responding to the markets knee jerk reaction especially when federal reserve officials are increasingly being asked to visit capitol hill, and

basically justify their actions. >> you know, scott i'm thinking at the time remember with the first surplus under president bush rejected by the house dow fell close to 800 points they have to scramble to get back together. satisfy markets. they have got back together. they frantically approve stimulus and dow slid another 6,000 points so to tame beast for the moment we saw markets go back basically. to what end? >> we need the a lot of surplus back then you're riewght to poit out that it worked for about three hours next morning market opened up down a couple hundred. but look stimulus around the globe is prevalent you look outside of japan, india now is doing stimulating. those markets have responded very, very well on at least a paper basis to what the feds have done over there. but this fed has look r looked at stock prices saying they're

overvalued and one way to stock down by hiking rates. j talking about the charm from whom we'll be hearing in next 58 minutes or so 2:00 afterwards. thank you very much. another development we're watching closely across the globe greece goes ka put tomorrow or fighting yesterday. thursday is the day. so we're going to know one way or the other if greece gets help or the boot. we shall see. economists mind you is we all seem to fear and wait for that. but what would be the worse case scenario talk about market tampering if greece goes. nobody in state germany anyway. what would be the big deal if greeks go? >> i think end game for greece has been the same since negotiations began years ago that is simply to allow greece to leave the eurozone?

>> what would happen then? >> what is interesting is there's two different scenarios, on the one hand that means that the weakest link has been now pushed out. and so you night people a reallily in the year now that economy is stronger. so again that weakest link is gone. but on the other hand concern would be then who is next? does this create a domino effect. do we see exit from portugal. italy, spain so really market is trying to grapple with these two very opposite potential reactions from the market. >> what do you think happens attention in woodchips to the portugal and spain, dodge the road in france do you agree somebody >> greece is by far weakest link if we see greece leave it is not necessarily trigger for portugal, italy or spain but fact when we compare economies of greece to other three that i just mentioned you're talking about an extreme outlie or. so i think the fact that it would be a positive for euro era

and sustaining entirely if we do see greece exit from the eurozone. >> lindsay thank you very, very much tomorrow is the decline day for that. meanwhile with emergence of one donald trurp say so say now not all republicans are preaching their hum public roots. >> when i was young we didn't have electricity or running water. >> i'm proud of my net worth. >> i flip mcdonald's to pay for my way in college. >> 8 billion -- >> lecturing me. >> apply to the middle class. >> i'm really rich. >> which brings me to forminger rm indiana governor mitch daniels never covering this geen ma have i ever heard him brag ging about how rich he was and period an very, very sferl governor one of the few i might

point out that he was complimenting today. >> thanks for having me, neil. ferlg now all of a sudden it is okay per donald trump to say i'm rich and a prods proud of it. >> 15 or 20 people of it you hear a little bit of everything in it. you can say differentiated himself. but i honestly i don't think question expect to see him around if this too long. >> really? you don't think it is going to make it far? erchtion i don't know. great promoter but not a candidacy standing when it gets serious. >> do you ever wonder in a day and age where we put great stock on the media not talks but media does tend to go for character. those who are extra loud, or make extra controversial statements that could be a quick -- what do you make of that? is that bad? >> it's reality.

i don't -- i honestly don't pay too much attention for a long time. -to the american poem and phil say media too eventually asserts itself and we generally get down to serious people. and having the serious conversation. >> paul was complimenting you and others in the party have complimented you i think one character is this, last remaining adults in politics, before you moved on, that you saw problems for what they were. looked at accounting in government for what it was. and should be -- and kept track of the money. now you're doing the same in education. in purdue. what i'm getting at here is do we reward that kind of confidence or do we just forget it? >> well, i felt rewarded. we set an all time record when we were in for reelection having done things that people said that would be unpopular. that is too much, too much

change too soon. i drived a lot of i took a lot of confidence out of the experience one experience i had in elected office that people will be fair minded. they'll judge results. and what may have seemed -- controversial at the outset in the end can if it works, if it was good judgment, can be rewarded. >> scott walker who seems to be running for president himself leads in a lot of polls said sometimes you have to bang heads in this case up to inyos now pursuing tenure. where do you draw that line? going so far? trnlg i think i always felting a only going to speak for myself. there are national implications to this. there are demographic clearly, political i'll say even the nature of today's media. which you're driving americans

apart or encouraging them to have like minded camps, and we've got big problems to solve i'm sure you've talked to mr. volker about all of those. ignoring them a number of states like india have a balanced budget. >> but they would do it through means commended you for not doing that. but by and large clever ways to get around it. >> just a complete earlier thought. i hope on both sides will produce candidates this time whose tngt city trying to unify people and try to draw them out of the these polarized positions with anyone doing that? >> i think you see some early indications. i don't to pick and choose. >> but democrats coming in? >> so few of them. but there's time. only say something about the state. listening to your report which is interesting when i think about greece. i will be very surprised somewhere down the trail we don't have a greece like situation in the country where

states where you were just discussing who have been used game ukes who have allowed, bought political favors with con sheen -- saying bail us out. we can't afford for you to let us fail. >> already done that in the rear and college loans, there's a president for them. >> i'm saying you see that at te level of our economic union to say that federation of states. so -- >> one strength of our federal system is that we -- >> we print money. >> you can't at the state level here and there are you see success stories which people are free to emulate and sometimes do. >> all right very good thank you very much. the government he's one of the few republicans not running for president so tried to keep track of them for the time being. art --

coming up, you heard about this and on our very show talked about this. saying that irs now is reduced itself up to bunch of liars. irs commissioner, who is running for president of the united states on that, after this. >> deduplicateing them what does that mean? >> it means they're lying. neil they're just lying.

>> deduplicateing them. what does that mean? >> that means they're lying. neil, they're just lying, here's their delay here, they make it a practice to send us endless duplicates they want to give us the maximum number of pages in order to brag about how much they've given us. >> a lot of those pages are

blank. welcome back to coast to coast everybody i'm neil cavuto talking about the revelation that those e-mails they suddenly found them better than 6400 of them. but push to get them doesn't happen any time soon. they're -- they're dedacting decopying, just lying, and that was the fear here that all of a sudden according to to him and trying to get handle on him as they do submit them and asked information to get hands on benghazi documents from the state dpght, 15 or 16 blank pages were included material that was closed out wiped dun and people are freaking out over this to former irs commissioner. 2016 presidential candidate that feeds this we can't trust the irs. they lie, drive us nuts and come up with excuses not to provide stuff. i don't think that is a fair

sweeping indictment of everyone who works there. but that is prevailing view of them many of the towers would be in your party. what do you think? >> this started two years ago when lerner first made statements in may of '13 and dealing with production e-mails it is really hard to stomach. kind of like a bad -- >> never seen -- >> e-mails over if there's 6400 of them should be go ahead -- >> turn them over. i'm with you they have to take out taxpayer information fine. but if it is a duplicate who cares i don't care if there's more out there. let recipient through what is a duplicate or not. i don't buy that argument at all. >> more proof we need to get rid of the irs. you say? >> come on, neil we've had this confers before that is just simplistic jargon from those who don't understand business or government. welcome simplify our tax code.

>> that is last time i'll let mccain give a question to pass on to you. you're saying easier said than done to shut down irs but argue a way around it. by not having many, that many filing taxes the old method, rite? >> exactly. i fiver a hybrid system with a consumption tax to take 150 million americans off the income tax roles altogether. we leave the income tax in for high end and lower rates, and we lower rate for business that will make us more competitive overseas. neil, it also a as you know, it will have an impact on this identity theft it huge problem that we have now where people feel for returns by stealing your id. that would help there too. so or there a lot of reasons to change the tax code. >> all right. in the meantime you're still in that nontop ten category. and donald trump might have pushed you down another peg. are you worried that no one is beginning to be able to hear

you, see you? >> i'm not, neil i'm not. i think we're picking up steam getting arranged iowa. i was in three or four different counties last week and that county share chair told me this thing is wide open. i'm in washington today at the r and c they have 19 candidates listed in their official straw poll. not all of them are going to get in but i was just filming an interview of them that they're putting out for all of the candidates so starting to get out there. frankly i just wish you and your colleagues would reconsider what you're doing. you are intervening in the political process. by saying you have to have hit a certain threshold of name recognition typical americans have not focused on ration. so if i like to see you folkingses put in two or three slates of candidates. follow that 19 at the rnc has got that would be great. >> you're ungrateful because you're here with me right now. >> yeah, but i feel like we're

sorts of friendmys. >> see what i can do on the orr thing, neil again tell them out to lunch. in the meantime more incidents again. you sea terror threats at home but another scared in the go around or terror threats that are real and here something that retired colonel has reminded me about that it is alive and home and one thing about this leats example is that we catch it before anything bad happens but whether the guy who was housing the texas and supporting texas shooters, or incidents we've seen now 6 states keeps happening. only paying attention when it succeeds and something big succeeds. >> yeah, you are right neil first of all thanks for having me on. that is my concern too. i talk to folks every day, everyday americans that is something that they're worried about is, on one hand you've got the threat of a cataclysmic

attack like 9/11 that is a possibility that isis and al qaeda are pushing for but now starting to see a new trend decentralized attacks where, you know, locals basically self-select on the internet. they get trained on the internet and then they go and do an attack. fnght they need to be isis and bad, awful guys who want to kill people? >> understand that isis narrative, this global expansion narrative resonating in all corners of the world. what they really do is they're the same myth entrepreneurs as global from the gnat subsidies they push a narrative with marginalized youth looking for honor and action to do things like this young college student was looking to do. you start adding this up over time and it is really beginning to change landscape here in america, and i hope that we start paying more attention to it. because it really will have a cumulative impact on our country. >> you're right pip hope it

does. at least you're reminding folks about it will help. thank you very, very much. >> my pleasure neil thanks for having me. one thing that any regular viewer and anyone who watches the show we have a problem with people closed door. back with bounceers i don't know i had a problem with it. when they close a door on you and you can't find out what is behind the closed door. you have to ask yourself a question. i paid for that door. i paid for all of you behind that door and you're not sharing that information with me. no -- not right, one congressman behind that door, next.

>> all right it seems, followed up on a discussion with paul worried about states and unfunded liabilities we're just getting word now that the government is -- putting its feet into this idea that a lot of americans could be

seeing their benefits, their private pension benefits compromised in the years ahead that the money has run out of the till that a lot of private companies, for example don't have enough money to cover them. this, of course, has been a big concern for some time. what do you do for those retiree it is and even future retirees looking forward to private pensions but coming to the rescue is kent we're told that the government is already asking and that the obama administration has asked the man who has been behind biggest payouts in american including 9/11 compensation fill and golf oil spill disaster to ride to the rescue here as well to decide how to make good on payments due to those who might be getting moneys or will be getting retirement moneys from plan thactd go belly up. doing the same that gm pulled ignition comp sogs fund to see who qualifies for what and when. but kent will be taking over a monstrous issue.

but talking about 1400 private pensionen plays, affecting some 10 million americans, thiest is something like this. a lot of companies that make promises about paying workers and a lot of them companies under brink. pension funds are vastly underfunded and kent to figure out how to rescue them so here question go again. a theme that is very, very common. another theme that is common hack attacks there was behind closed door meeting among some in congress with like it is of the homeland security and nsa officials trying to describe how big this problem was and is. it was a closed door meeting but out from that closed door republican texas congressman will hear on what he heard. congressman has a meeting bothered a lot of folks myself included because i wonder what are they not telling me? >> this is big or problem than

we were originally told. >> i came out with my questions than when i went in, and so you know, the sayings that we need to be focused on out there in the public. the size of this attack over 400 million records potentially compromised is a big deal. the intelligence services and have an idea of, you know, who was involved in the attack. what is your specific group. but you know, only a country like china russian organized crime are ones that would be able to do something of this size. >> well, confirm that that was china, that china it was behind a lot of these latest hack attacks particularly on federal workers particularly on those in defense establishment. china has you know saying no it is not us at all. by the way you america are hardly ones to lecture people on intrusions and invading people's

privacy but you did and were told it was china. >> it is most likely somebody supported by china. and had is -- this is not new and something they've been doing before. when you look at some of the writings of the chinese general about this topic over the last decade they talk about doing these kinds of attacks and really about espionage collecting information on a number of americans and question is how are they going use that. how did they use this for other attacks and other ways to get in to our system? >> all right congressman thank you for shaish sharing at least something with us. wonder what you're doing behind that door. now we know at least a little bit. thank you. >> all right. we have an update on some issues that the u.s. open including looking up overhead. tunnel. >> yeah absolutely neil. done the show last couple of week when is we start talking about sports sometimes i lose

your interesting. this particular go arranged -- >> this particular go arranged we have a story about the u.s. open about a business story. stock market at the moment but use of drones in broadcasting sporting event at fox sports for the first time broadcasting u.s. open not in washington as it gets underway going to use drone technology companied hello video in shooting the open to some degree and the video that i've seen of it pep and showed a little bit of a few minutes ago pretty cool the way they follow along using drones. look for that company and see if other companies get in the space how much of a lucrative business sports broadcast is. second part of the stocks today they're down. going to ruin my thesis play along with me for a minute. callaway underarmor and nike by the way golfers neil, the garment of the gps company i

need to find where the hole is. other deer maintaining courses. now who knew if but we hear at the fox business next have something that we call the fbn golf index. we should have known this a long time ago. here it is five years. we should have been betting on golf socks so much so that year to date, the fbn golf index made up of golf related countries up like 8 pbt versus two for s&p. so i don't know if we can play golf but we should have been buying golf socks that would have made some money. >> you know when they did that they mixed my botchy ball up. i know that would be another good one. >> yeah ethnic blast is rights. >> another and maybe come from the federal reserve very soon is this notion that the party is beginning to engtd. and then maybe, maybe they're never so exact but expecting them to tell grandfather at the

end of the year might come. even is thinking. by the end of the hour says that no about with it is not in the cards but we heard from fall, right? >> longer than to everybody has to come to an end even if it involves botchy ball. we'll have more after this. here is a simple math problem. two trains leave st. louis for albuquerque at the same time. same cargo, same size, same power. which one arrives first? hint: it's not the one on the left. the speedy guy on the right is part of an intelligent system that creates the optimal trip profile for all trains on the line. and the one on the left? uh, looks like it'll be counting cows for awhile. so maybe the same things aren't quite the same. ge software. get connected. get insights. get optimized.

automotive innoright here.ts... with a control pad that can read your handwriting, a wide-screen multimedia center, and a head-up display for enhanced driver focus. all inside a redesigned cabin of unrivaled style and comfort. the 2015 c-class. at the very touchpoint of performance and innovation. neil: all right. you might have seen these guys once or twice before on tv, right? these guys broke out of the upstate new york prison 10 days

ago, richard matt, david sweat. it has been 10 days. they could change their look. so the new york state police have now advance ad photo or computer-generated image what they think they look like now. take a look at this. i see absolutely no difference. i mean, i guess they got a little bit of beard going. that is before. this is after. yeah. you know. believe they're on the run, you get some gray. you notice that? i'm on the run. but that is the latest from the new york state police. if you see these guys anywhere near you, forget 100,000-dollar award. they're still dangerous. gray beard or not. that is what authorities believe they look like. it has been 10 days. if you pop up in tijuana, just so you know. that's before and then after. all right. this is after now. see from a distance when i look at this i see no difference. wow, really? did our graphics department put

this together for the state police? i'm just curious. meantime we're still focusing a day after the fact on entrance of one donald trump into the presidential race. a lot of people i'm hearing, comedians, mainstream media, doesn't have a chance. he is charlatan, big egoist, i urge you not to glom on to the consensus view he doesn't have a chance. need i remind you, gina lowden, big tea partyer, remind you they said the same about ronald reagan. they said the same? earliest of days about bill clinton. abraham lincoln. i don't mean to put them all in the same pot. i just say the consensus is often wrong. on to donald trump, do you think his message resonates? forget about the messenger, that message, the anger at the system that has failed us? >> you know, neil, i keep having to check myself, wondering if i'm the drunk guy that walks in

the bar, the more i drink the better the ugly girl looks. i have never been attracted to donald trump before now. the worse the economy gets, neil, the more donald trump looks attractive to me as candidate. as our economic problems continue to take places they predictably will under this administration, donald trump will look mower and more attractive for those of us wearing our economy goggles, or whatever you want to call it. neil: forget he is bigger than life personality and money and braggadocio and all that. i understand. the anger that he reflects on deals with china always have us on defense, mexico, that always has us making excuse, he does make you think. what is wrong when conventional politicians have delivered us from both parties these kind of deals, these kind ever situations time and again? i wonder about more than half of american eligible voters who don't vote. and the half of those who do are frustrated and angry at the

system? what do you think? >> yes. i agree with you. i think pundits out there who are underestimating him playing into the psychology of the deal that donald trump knows perhaps better than any other american and that is that you want your opponents to underestimate you and ridicule you. if you look at, you know the psychology of all of this, neil, as we're going forward, more they underestimate him, it gives him, gives him latitude to continue to be sort of bombastic, because that's what they already expect. so, i do think that the more that he is able to speak the truth and given that latitude, oh, that is just donald trump making noise and he is underestimated, the more he will continue it surprise. don't forget, a lot of people in this country gone toe-to-toe with donald trump and he left them empty briefcases in his dust, neil. people better be careful about underestimating. imagine for a moment what donald trump would do to an irs or to isis? those kinds of thoughts can get

people excited. neil: yeah, i picture him doing, to china, you're fired! you know all this time, gina, my trump impression hasn't gotten any better. always good seeing you. thank you very, very much. we're saying you're not pro or antitrump but we're anti-consensus view, sort of gloming on to what everyone else is saying. if he reflects rage palpable and real, don't dismiss that. coming up, don't dismiss how big of an impact this government crackdown on trans fats is going to have. the ceo of bennigan's isn't. next.

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legalzoom has helped start over 1 million businesses, turning dreamers into business owners. and we're here to help start yours. >> fox business brief time. we're back with what may be good news for uber drivers in california. i'm sure many of them are watching, even if they're not there is an interesting story. the california labor commission ruled uber drivers are considered to be employees as opposed to third party contractors. this could be big because the company then could get, put itself into sticky legal situations, to face rising employee costs an benefit issues as these are employees, not contractors. in an attempt to avoid this, uber argued it is a software platform and not a taxi company. didn't win. as it stands right now, one of uber's main costs are employees. means additional drivers could lead to driver cutback as well. something to watch as well. "cavuto: coast to coast," neil will talk about this ban on

trans fats in just a moment. so don't go away. ♪

neil: we told you yesterday we were, on this broadcast that secretary of state kerry had some very strong words for syria president assad. is saying and was convinced the

government is using chemical weapons against its people and that we would be policing that. keep in mind that not only if that is true, the government using it against its people that would include isis since a lot of those rebel fighters it is goings after are indeed isis elements but apparently this issue came up at a white house briefing by josh earnest just a few minutes ago and, josh earnest was asked if the assad regime used something considered to be chemical weapons, if they did that, would that amount to a red line that had been crossed? in other words is that red line exists? quoting now from josh earnest, of course it does. the point is that declared stockpile that assad previously denied exists had not been acknowledged, rounded up, removed, destroyed because of work of this administration and work of russia. then again we should stress if it is also true that he is still doing so, obviously it is not all been rounded up and destroyed. so it is irony of ironies in

attacking some of the rebel elements, fighting the president assad, we are, in a way helping isis. it gets complicated but it is what it is. something else that gets complicated, and for this next guest very problematic, the crackdown on the part of the federal government to ban all trans fats pretty much everywhere. bennigan's ceo. good to see you back. >> good to see you again, hardest working man in tv. neil: tell me about that. let me ask you this. why is now the government pushing this? >> good question because a lot of us in the business have been cutting back on trans fats for many years. we basically eliminated from all our recipes, and as we are a franchise organization, obviously working with the franchisees to adapt, modify recipes you're using so we eliminate 100% but the core of the issue really is the mandate. i think i agree with ronald reagan who said that the, the real purpose of the u.s. government is to protect its

people, not to tell us how to live or tell us what to eat. a lot of people -- neil: people say trans fats are so dangerous, they're killing people. have to do something. >> let's rewind the tape. neil: high costs -- >> rewind the tape. used to be margarine is better than but ir. now butter is better than margarine. one of those debates that continue on -- neil: you've been taking a lot out of the menu. >> the truth of the matter is the oils used whether peanut oil, canola oil, vegetable oil, that we use has better flavor profile for our food. it enhances the flavor profile versus using a trans fat-based oil. so -- neil: a lot of americans are used to it in microwave popcorn. >> mostly in frozen foods, yes. neil: how does that affect you? a lot of your stuff you sell in grocery stores. >> we make from scratch. bennigan's, you remember the monte chris toe, make everything from scratch. neil: no trans fats in that. >> none, none. neil: you have nothing to

complain about. >> i'm not complaining about. i'm complaining we're under assault in this business. it is not just the trans fats, neil -- neil: do little salt count. >> got to do that. now we're looking at sodium count which is fine. we don't need to be mandated. we're big boys and girls. we're pretty smart people and tenacious look out for our guest. then it is minimum wage. obamacare. everything else is going up. commodities continue to rise. neil: overtime issue. >> what is exempt versus nonexempt now? what it happens, keeps pushing limit on margins, the profit margins in the restaurant business. the smaller operators will go out of business. there will be some dark restaurants. restaurants that go out of the business over the next several years because cumulative effect of the mandates is having a deleterious effect on the businesses. we continue to fight the good fight. what it has done, is, they started tugging on superman's cape. now we has a business have

galvanized, in the franchise business, but international franchise association. we have gotten together to really be heard as a voice, to stop these mandates from coming to put good people out of work. neil: paul, thank you very, very much. we asked all the restaurants, all get out. something not going on there. coming up we'll have the fed decision imminent. fox business sill a over it. what we're waiting to hear, i guess no longer if but when federal reserve raises interest rates. later this year? we shall see.

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you didn't hear it from me but there is a fed meeting going on. [laughter] >> sources say. neil: sources say. we should find out shortly from these aforementioned sources who say that the federal reserve will at least telegraph what it will do on interest rates. we are told. charlie gasparino, gerry willis, dagen mcdowell. all right, drawing daigh, the fed is going to announce exactly when it will raise rates or will it tease it? >> it teases it. gradual is the word janet yellen has been using. the bond market is already telegraphing that a rate hike is coming. consumers are getting used to it. you had long term -- neil: i don't think the markets will ever get used to it. >> the fed ran raise interest rates gradually if it is doing that because the economy is getting better around we won't necessarily fall out of bed. you have seen longer term interest rates go up. mortgage rates, gerri can talk about that, 4%. that maybe gets people off the sofa to buy a house.

neil: is the market telegraphing this. >> mortgage rates are higher. they're moving out in front of the fed. always happens that way. only rates tied to prime move to lockstep. everything else the betting is made, rates are going higher. can i tell you who would love to see these rates? savers. >> yeah, babeally claim. you're getting up there. >> people in retirement. >> you need to worry about your retirement income! what? neil: connell, did you hear that? >> don't get me involved with that with her. neil: speaking of grandpa, my fellow boomer, angry at the world -- >> by the way, if you look at markets, markets are basically saying, not going to raise rates until later in the year. neil: dagen is not or janet yellen. >> she. neil: the other she. more cerebral. >> went to school with friend of mine. >> she is from brooklyn. >> fort hamilton high school. >> that is from brooklyn.

neil: good for you. go ahead. >> my point is, doing something crazy like we're doing it tomorrow -- neil: the fed never does that. >> i don't think so. here's the thing -- >> put it on hold forever. >> here is the thing that you have, problem you have with this economy. yes, a lot of people say they should raise rates but economic data is mixed. one quarter we have 0% growth or negative growth and next we have better than expected jobs and next quarter we worries than expected -- neil: market and tantrums factor in. it's a factor but shouldn't be -- but he also said, rates can't be 0% forever. >> people save through the markets too. i will say this. if you have a real problem in the market, if she has to raise rates because of bubbles in the bond market, what is going on in certain aspects of bond market, junk bonds, leveraged loans, if she has to raise rates to pop bubbles, economy doesn't improve that is when --

>> something to watch in terms of the bond market. because you, long term rates have gone up starting in february of this year. you have not seen money come out of bond funds. this week, latest report came out earlier today, 2.9, almost $3 billion came out of bond mutual funds. you have not seen that happen in recent weeks. it happened back in 2013 when the fed was pulling back on the bond buying. and it caused a real kind of shake-up in the bond market. if you start seeing that, longer term rates could start going a lot higher to put the fed on hold because it slows the economy. neil: i didn't hear a word you said. i'm still angry at you. you would retire soon. >> you should pay attention -- we should be excited for savers. they don't have to search for yield. neil: can we shut her mic? >> i don't think there is any excitement for savers and here is why. neil: not growing to raise rates a point. >> when savings rate come off the bottoms already, it is already happening. it is already --

>> like nothing. neil: it will make -- >> it is at least something now. >> it is nothing. it's nothing. here is the problem that you have -- neil: should they do it. >> i don't know. here is why -- neil: i don't don't you know. we pay you a lot of money. >> you asked me if should or will. neil: i said should. >> i don't know should. they will at the end of the year. neil: who is on first. >> they should do it this year, later in the year instead of next year during the presidential race. neil: he is right. we're doing this to pierce a bubble. >> yeah. neil: and has nothing to do with economy going gangbusters because it's not. i worry about that. if you're doing it to pierce a bubble. >> if you're doing it to pierce a bubble you're only watching markets and i don't believe the federal reserve -- neil: i think they're only watching. gerri, are they watching markets? >> they're watching the markets, absolutely. i think that is what is interesting earlier, liz talked about zombie companies, all the companies doing well only because rates are low, it is

time we got off of that. >> look at twitter. >> we need to get off that needle. should go up. neil: in the aggregate without all of this? >> here is the thing, a lot of people talking about twitter. i did a story, bankers are talking about they're open for a he willsa here's why, that valuation of that company which was once a $70 stock, i don't know what is trading today, 34.50, something like that, that valuation was fed-induced. neil: i think whole market. >> particularly companies like twitter, putting $18 billion evaluation on whatsapp? that is where you get ridiculous -- neil: isn't the bubble there? that is what they're addressing. that alone is -- >> my point that is not the only thing that the federal reserve watches. >> of course not. they watch the bond market. >> they're watching wage growth and job growth and watching all inflation indicators. >> they care about bubbles. >> when the fed does raise rates the stock market will actually

go up because why? because the economy will be better? neil: never raise higher than quarter point. follow that through. if it is only quarter point i could see your point. but if the fear is it will be trajectory of rates bring them up 2, three, percentage points -- >> that would be ugly. >> is the economy really getting better which it hasn't. it has benefits and starts, then it is not going to be a problem. here is the problematic scenario is this the good jobs report we recently had was a one-month thing. that happened before. we go back to slow growth again. >> a lot of economists don't -- >> i'm telling you, that is where you raise rates as the economy is still slow where there is not firm consensus where it is going that is where markets go up. neil: i wish i had more but dagen gave me my prune juice. >> i woke you up. we're talking about federal reserve monetary policy, i hate

you, never want to back here again. hate, hate,. >> this is best interview with a guy. neil: shut up. trish: don't go anywhere neil, i want input as we get the announcement. neil: if i haven't fallen asleep. trish: you will not fall asleep. this is exciting stuff. we're seconds away, everyone from the big fed decision. we have peter barnes standing by right now. getting ready to bring you the headlines as soon as they cross. the big question everybody is asking is, is the fed going to move away from its zero interest rate policies and signal a rate hike for some time later this year? there is talk we may get a quarter point in september. we may get another quarter point in december. but on the other hand we were supposed to get a quarter point in june? guess that didn't happen. a lot of concerns whether or not the fed can move. gdp, coming in negative, down 0.7% in the last quarter. you get two quarters of that

we're in recession. how is the fed supposed to act right now? you combine that with a dollar that gets continuously stronger. there are many skeptics whether she can move. janet yellen will take the mic in 30 seconds. peter are barnes has the news. >> no change in rate guidance, trish, no change in interest rate guidance from the fed at this meeting. the fed continues to say that raising rates will depend on incoming economic data. after a bad first quarter the fed says that the economy is now expanding moderately. let's read the economic analysis now. quote, information received since the federal open market committee met in april suggests that economic activity has been expanding moderately after having changed little during the first quarter. the pace of job gains picked up while the unemployment rate remained steady. on balance a range of labor market indicators suggest that underout tilllation of labor resources