r and cheaper. thank you creative destruction. thank you free enterprise for allowing it to happen. that is our show. see you next week.ks tomorrowings right? >> we'll be dry. thanks, everyone. did cyberterrorists just find our weak spots? just this week alone, a big technical glitch halts the big board for nearly four hours. a big outage for united causing big trouble in the air. and that big government tax getting even bigger. so could a massive cyberattack short circuit our economy? hi everyone. i'm brenda buttner. this is "bulls & bears." and we've got our bulls and bears this week gary b. smith, jonas max. suzy did your enemies just see how weak we are on the cyber front? >> they didn't need that to know

how weak we are. we don't know if these glitches last week were all coordinated but we don't need to know. these are like tremors before a big earthquake. we know it's coming. think about the loss of life potential, planes losing ground control contact, the dams stopping the hospitals. you can be very end times about this. it's scary but but i have faith in american ingenuity and more than our brainpower i have faith in the mighty power of capitalism because this is a growth industry. i think this is the growth industry of the next ten years, building the kinds of software or hardware and so forth that will stave off these cyberattacks. if i were ruling the government something which would never happen you know, i would stop the insensitives to the industries that do solar energy and electric cars redirect all that money toward doing everything to let that industry rip. that is the only hope. >> i'm going to gary b. because

your daughter is fighting cyberterrorism. she's studying it correct? >> my daughter is getting a master's in cybersecurity at johns hopkins because i identified that and health care along with her as the, as suzy said probably growth industry for maybe, you know, the next 20 50 years. but that aside, i'm not as optimistic as suzy is. you know this latest government hack was thought to be very small. it turned out to affect 20 million americans. the head of the opm had to resign over it. here is the problem with all that. in every war we've fought since i guess the civil war they've always been on foreign soil. so we read about it in the newspaper and it's kind of this image we have of war, it doesn't affect us. i'm betting a couple of people on this panel went to file their tax return and found out my

wife's social security and mine were hacked. it's that kind of thing. this new war is affecting all of us on a day-to-day basis and we're so disjointed in fighting it this could be a tough one. >> emily, gary makes a good point. this is not so much about throwing cash at this. this is a lack of coordination at the government level. >> i think we can agree with anybody who files tax return looks at their smartphone. we know how much information we have out there. it only makes sense this is where we need to be beefing up looking at the lens of national security through cyber. it's all out there. we all agree this is where we should be investing but a divergence between what people want and their private security particularly around something

like their phone, people want security around that and what law enforcement wants because law enforcement wants the back door in. they want to be able to say we want to be able to see what's happening right now as it happens. but you can't really go in both directions at once. >> what direction do you see us going, john? >> i see us going in the direction you're talking about with the coordination. lloyd and cambridge universitys came out with a study saying this would cost us up to $1 trillion with a cyberattack. sorry. having a cyberattack in my ear. >> we'll protect you, john. >> we have a lack of coordination among government entities. we have the department of homeland security has their own cyber unit, the pentagon has their own cyber unit and all the intelligence agencies have their own cyber unit much like pre-9/11. the cia and fbi did not have good communeication back and forth. the coordination we need is some

type of joint coordination. we have $14 billion allocated by president obama, so we have the money in the budget. we don't have good coordination. what gary b. and suzy are talking about is some type of public/private partnership is probably the way to go forward, hire somebody to put this money in the cloud and let some private enterprise like a google protect this because they'll do a better job than our government. >> good point. a lot of corporations in silicon valley do not trust the government. they're afraid of giving encrypted information to them jonas. >> as they should be. i'm a little more confident in gary's daughter's future in protecting us from cyberterrorism than i think gary is. i think the terrorist thing -- everything that was said about cyberattacks about specifically financial information, social securitys, espionage, that's hard to fight and you can prove that because companies like sony can't stop it so forget the government. terrorists are brick-and-mortar. they're just not going to send a

train into another train. they would have done it already. it's hackable. the death and destruction crowd is not the top talent. the russian and chinese trying to get information, trying to make money off hacking, that's where the threat is and that's hard to fight. fortunately, i don't want to underplay our enemies but our terrorist enemies are not the top computer talent of this world. >> suzy talking at the hack into sony. >> you want to have a scary night, stay awake all night, read the "fortune" magazine article on how sony got hacked. scary stuff. eventually we have to change our behaviors. we talk about the government or private enterprise making this problem go away. ultimately individuals will have to change our behaifrs about what we type into our computers and what we do with our information. it will affect us in various ways. we can't throw it into space and say somebody solve this for me.

it won't work. >> gary? >> some of the stuff my daughter is studying is mind-boggling sophisticated to fight the most advanced forefront of cybersecurity and i respect the heck out of that. the problem is it doesn't have to be as jonas implies, you don't have to be very sophisticated. you can download a piece of mal ware off the internet and send it to someone in an e-mail and infect the whole country's security system. it's not super advanced stuff. the simple stuff that can throw a monkey wrench in everyone's daily lives. >> john? >> i don't think that kind of hacking is going to lead to these kind of terror theories like dams blowing up. that kind of stuff is -- what we did to iran with the nuclear stuff, that level of hacking skill doesn't exist. can they send viruses around by e-mail? yeah. that's going to cost money to the economy but it's not your life being harmed. i think the government needs to focus on areas where they were

sloppy. why is the social security number the identification every single company has? there's arias like that they could regulate or get in there to make it less of a honey pot of collecting data where they hoard all this garbage and keep it in a hackable way for sophisticated hackers. that's what the government is focusing on on making it less valuable information everybody has on us. >> think about the people in the government who have been hacked all their information. this is a threat to national security. these people can be blackmailed. so many scenarios difficult to imagine. john? >> yes. i'm sorry. i thought you said jonas. i'm having a -- >> we understand. >> i'm in the bermuda triangle so it's a bit of a problem. >> my money is on you, john okay? >> because of the geographic difference in north america and military might, the one thing terrorists have an opportunity for is cyberterrorism. what is it called?

a billion dollars? a lot of these different entities these organization caliphates have a billion dollar to send to try to get ooh into our system. if you said after 9/11 we would have had this few terror attacks we would have been happy with that and that's because we created the department of homeland security. we need something similar to that right now because terrorism has changed. it's no longer a physical thing except for the lone wovms and they'll probably be around forever bup it's changed as far as going on the web and that's where we need our defenses. >> okay. last word. thanks guys. cavuto on business in about 20 minutes. what have you got? >> hey, brenda. greece china, puerto rico the u.s. what do we all have in common? how about government med snlg a lot of government spending? we connect, you decide. plus homicide surging in cities across america. is it because of new criminal laws all across america?

see you at the bottom of the hour. >> up first, how the wage rage turns into a price rage for you. you pay your auto insurance premium every month on the dot. you're like the poster child for paying on time. and then one day

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agencies asking drug companies to be more explicit about the dangers. is the wage rage turning into a price rage? starbucks and chipotle both hiking prices after hiking wages, and john says this is just the start of it.

>> it is just the start of it. the new york wage board looked at this and said you will see fast food prices increase by 22% if the minimum wage goes to $15. we've seen this in seattle. the foot-long subway has gone from $5 to $6. starbucks has raised prices nationally but three times as fast in seattle. most of these restaurants are franchisees. they're not the big multimillion-dollar corporations. they're mom and pops with small margins. so the minimum wage if it's raised to $15, has to be passed on to somebody. cities like this because it takes away subsidyies that go to lower wage workers. it's passed on to the people buying the food. if you're okay with that you're okay with a $15 minimum wage but expect price s to be significantly higher. >> emily, consumers footing the bill for this. >> there were a lot of assumption in that but i'm going to throw another one in. these cities that the prices are being hiked in these are some of the highest cost of living cities in the country -- seattle, san francisco, chicago.

that was before minimum wage hikes. these are the highest cost of live stigs in the country. it makes sense their wages would go up and their prices would go. this is what happens in large cities. >> gary is that the only reason for this? you force corporations to raise their wait a minutes, it's got to go somewhere. >> absolutely. what emily's talking about is like the divine coincidence. we raise the minimum wage all of a sudden subway says nope not $5 $6. wow. the timing is mind-boggling. we're just moving money from one shell game to another. john points out the foot long from $5 to $6 minimum wage went up to $15. if minimum wage went up $5 an hour if five come through in that one hour and have to pay $6 that's $5 more out of their

pockets. all we've done is take the money out of the consumers and put it over in these minimum wage workers. where is the benefit to society in that? how does it help the economy? it doesn't. >> suzy this is pretty much like economics 101, right? >> it is with a human face. i was walking through downtown manhattan the other day and there was this long line going around the block. i thought, is it the new magic mike movie? no. it was lunchtime at chipotle. i was there and there was a long line down the block in midtown manhattan, where there's roughly 5 billion choices you can eat lunch and people were lining up for chipotle. true costs went up and the companies that raise their prices are the ones that can, the ones with the loyal user base like starbucks and chipotle. we knew the customer would pay with the minimum wage going up. the places this hurts employees, mcdonald's won't be raising their prices anytime soon.

they don't have a loyal customer base right now. the employees will be will get squeezed less money to go arnold hire fewer people pure economics. >> jonas? >> look all costs get passed onto consumer. if the company is successful they'll have a profit margin. there's not some magic pot of money they'll eat the cost of labor doubling. oh we have to cut back on the corporate jet. the dollar men is going to go away. but all these same cities we noted, you're already paying probably 50% more than you should for a lot of goods because their rents are so high because of government regulations on buildings in san francisco and all these other things. my point is the ultimate point is does the consumer a voter prefer a higher price with those rules? do you want the handicap ramp less skyscrapers in san francisco, a higher wage to the workers? if you like those things you won't have a dollar menu for long. if you prefer cheap food there shouldn't be any of these regulations. >> john no free lunch, no free wage hikes?

>> it has to be passed on because of the razor-thin margins. we're talking about 20% of restaurant workers a higher wage. instead of some type of jobs plan in america that creates a middle class. this is simply a redistribution from the consumer directly to the person working behind the counter. if you're okay with that you're also okay with higher fast food prices. >> "cahin' in" just over an hour from now. what do you have coming up? >> we know about the woman in san francisco murdered by an illegal. but wait until you hear how many other crimes in america are committed by illegals. will cutting federal funding help sthoovm problem? plus bad role models for kids? celebs and athletes busted. we'll see you at 11:30. >> you will. but up here first -- after

extending the nuke talk again, this is the response in iran. so why are we still talking to

♪ ♪ ♪ get excited for the 1989 world tour with exclusive behind the scenes footage all of taylor swift's music videos interviews, and more. xfinity is the destination for all things taylor swift. . still working on talks. should we still be dealing with them? gary b. says keep sanctions? >> absolutely brenda. when i was in grade school i learned a lesson quickly -- bullies did not respond to

appeasement, to negotiation. they responded to a punch in the know. you look at the bully of history and of now, nazi germany, russia iran iraq north korea have not responded to negotiations. a punch in the nose is the way to go and that's sanctions. >> emily, do you agree? >> what is happening is horrible. we need stability in the region. it will make the u.s. safer and israel safer. but the key to what we agree to always has and always will be is cutting off their path to building any sort of nuclear capacity not only building it but also we need to be able to make sure we go in and check that. we have to be verifiable. we do need to still be at the table on these deals. >> john? >> this is incredibly dumb. i don't know who's negotiating this. neville chamberlain? we have a pair of aces and a pair of 2s and we're letting them dictate terms.

they are hurting with these sanctions. that's why they're coming to the table. we are coming to them because our president wants a legacy issue in his second term. we're thinking a bad deal is better than no deal. that is wrong. >> suzy, more talk more trouble? >> i agree with gary, a punch in the chose. on top of that we're negotiating alongside china and russia who want to sell arms to iran. it's crazy. go back to sanctions. >> jonas. >> it's been working since 1979. they can't even get a real american flag to burn because you can't buy stuff in the country. it's like cuba. it doesn't lead to anything except black markets. let businesses build, let them do trade, then punish them with a high tariff if things aren't going the way we want. the sanction creates a black economy and makes the people hate america more. they blame their problem and troubles cutting them off from goods and services. a fairer system is what you do with a normal country like china where you have tariffs. >> gary b. 20 seconds?

>> suzy made the best point. sanctions are working or maybe john did, that's why they're at the table. let's keep them up. >> thanks guys. thank you, emily, for join us. we appreciate it. remember this? >> if the science hasn't changed by now it never will. but in democracy it's not them that carries the day. it is normal human beings that haven't put their stake in to politics above science. it's normal human beings that want us to do the right thing, and we will if you help us. >> well what's not normal may be that same epa chief still going ahead with global warming regulations after the supreme court just told her to cool it.

@? predictions, gary b.? >> one hot summer. i love coke in that case up 30% by next summer. >> okay. john, your prediction. >> roger federer is ageless. i think he wins i his eighth wimbledon tight this will weekend. buy swiss, ubs, i think it's up 15% counting dividend in a year. >> suzy. >> what supreme court? if youer ear in a business with anything to do with the environment, the epa is coming after you.

>> jonas? >> the cute minion toys and the happy meal some people think they're cursing. people hike me will buy their first happy meal in years. good for mb d. >> supervise busins block continues. neil is next. what do they have in common with us in the usa? more government meddling in spending. is it me or does all this meddling in spending seem to be hurting more than helping? that's our "opening question." ben stein says help is leaving a lot of folks helpless. joining us jerry willis adam and charlie gasparino. dagen conveniently off the week of multiple financial crises. coincidence? you decide. ben stein, our