what happens? >> then you have a problem. >> i will thank you very much. >> this is where they come from. >> two iraqi-born refugee s living in the united states arrested in a terror sweep in the u.s. now some here saying what else do we need to see before we decide to put a pause on letting more mideast refugees in this year. are they right or wrong? welcome to "forbes on fox." let's go in focus to find out which steve forbes is in washington today. elizabeth mcdonald, sabrina schafer. steve, what do you think? >> obviously there should be a pause. clearly they are not mechanisms in place to determine who should be here and who shouldn't. the fbi will testify to that. we don't have the means to determine that. what should have been done and should be done is a safe zone in

syria so people don't have to flee syria for their own safety. >> the texas governor which is where one of the ares took place said i once again urge the president to halt the resettlementle of refugees in the u.s. until there is an effective vetting process to en sure refugees don't compromise the safety of americans and texans. do you agree? >> we can always look to improve the program. my job with pausing it sends the message that we are stopping it all together and we are telling people we don't want you. that's not who we are as americans. if you're telling people that you don't want them, i think places like isis can use it as a recruitment tool and i have issues with it. >> the issue is what americans want. i think what's happening in europe, in fact peggy noonan wrote a column over the weekend saying american s don't want americans to become what europe

is becoming. she's referencing what happened in germany during new year's eve when a group of what appeared to be refugees went on a rampage and sexually assaulted women. >> angela merkelle has been an effective head of germany and a conservative. she sort of bowed to the liberal pressures and decided to take in a million refugees. now it's created a big fat mess. the response to that across europe is we are going -- we are getting neo mussolinis popping up. >> we don't want political correctness to dictate what we do that could compromise our safety. >> this is an uncomfortable situation. the fact is it took thousands of years for the west to develop and codify the values of human

dignity. the reality is there are large parts of the globe where they don't treat women with with respect. where violence is tolerateded and encouraged. we have a right to say we are protecting the values that make this country special. we need to make sure the people who come in not only believe in the values but are going to act in a way that perpetuates them. >> that's the problem with what's happening in europe. there isn't a melting pot we have here. there isn't assimilation. the groups stay in their own way and therefore can become a threat to people. >> and 18 arrested in the attacks related to the new year's eve attacks in germany, this is not about attacking or criticizing. this is about common sense over political correctness. and this narcissism on

individuals who think they don't have to scrutinize the refugee program. i think we should. sabrina is right. the men are violent. they come from societies who hate us. any refugee should have to pledgele allegiance to the constitution before they get in. >> so far the re settsettlement program, they are not large numbers the syrians have been resettled here. do we want to stop it. this is a philosophical point that immigration is a privilege not a right. we are not obliged to off it to people coming from country where is terrorism is endemic. not when there are millions of deserving applicants from other places in the world waiting in line for years. >> steve, with the jus coming

from europe, it's different now. >> yes. we knew who were the good guys most of the time, few exceptions and who were the bad guys. this is not the situation today. we don't know who's coming in, their background. we don't have the means to verify the backgrounds until those mechanisms are in place we are asking for trouble. it take as handful to wreak havoc and murder. meanwhile it's not cheap. it costs money to resettle people. that's one thing that makes the germans mad about their refugee program. it costs a lot of money. >> i agree. this is all costing money. our ally is taking in a million of these folks. you saw the math. we are showing like a handfulle in every state. the issue down in texas when they had all of the folks that were here for years. how will you vet people if you are a law abiding immigrant.

>> how long do we put a pause on this. are we talking about eliminating a refugee program or is this a pause until we figure out what's going on or get stuff together or what? >> i have to agree with the common sense express ed by my colleague bill baldwin. if the countries have a record of exporting terrorism or have internal terrorism that's a reason to say no for a long time. it doesn't matter if people are slipping in through the doors to commit violence in the united states or they turn that way because they are unsuccessful and unwilling to assimilate. >> you're going to call up the department of motor vehicles and

check the driving record. i don't think so. >> completely delusional. the refugees lied about their activities. we think we are state of the art in how we conduct this. no. they are coming from societies and countries that openly hate us. they openly attack and savage women and gay people. it has to stop. i say stop the immigration. stop the refugee programs from places like pakistan until they change their way of life and become more like the u.s. in aspirations and ideals. >> go ahead. >> it wasn't just in germany where we saw these attacks on new year's eve. in finland there is a culture clash. i think we have to be comfortable talking about it saying we stand for a serb certain set of values. we cannot enable people to come in here who are conducting premeditated crimes against women and other minorities. >> all right. coming up next, a bad start for stocks in the election year.

some say that could be a bad omen for democrats like hill clipt in this election year. they will explain next. >> to the southern brawl. charleston, south carolina. the republican presidential candidates will be facing off in the first debate of 2016. it's only on the fox business network. visit fox business.com/channel finder where it's all about to go down. january 14th.÷"forbes on

fox." >> the kick off to the 2016 election year starting with stocks getting hammered this week. now the smart money is getting worried after main street has been telling them they are worried despite a relatively decent jobs report. you see a mediocre economy is bad for hillary. why? >> sure. she's going to have to defend the obama administration's record. we have had economic growth

averaging 2%. employment is lousy. this is why almost two-thirds of americans think the economy is headed in the wrong direction. it's probably good for somebody like donald trump even though i don't think he has the best economic policies. he symbolizes something different. >> the stock market has been the one thing the administration could focus on as being spectacular. it's a small group of people benefitting from that. look what happened to the dow this week. >> the market had a bad week. fortunately it's not 1932 or 2001 in the bush years. the market and the economy are two different things. i think if hillary wants to point to obama's job growth we just had a job report on friday where we created almost 300,000 jobs. that's a good record to run on. >> it is true. the jobs report was good. much better than expectations. it created 292,000 jobs. you know,le hillary clinton is different from bill. a lot of people say things were

great under bill clinton. but he said the era of big government is over. hillary clinton wants to grow government more. >> that's right. in terms of the jobs report people are working longer and getting less pay. it's not as rosy as the initial numbers look. this should spell trouble for hillary clinton. she's running and they have a habit of pulling out of defeat from the jaws of victory. they have to get the right candidate, have a reaganesque approach and they can win. otherwise, watch out. >> will republicans point to the economy as a sore spot for hillary clinton? >> i think they can point to it in a way it's going to hurt her as being part of the incumbent party. i'm not buying that the u.s. economy is suddenly super weak. the dollar is stronger. commodities down. grid lock in wash war. this is the stuff of expansion. if the republicans are smart they will do as steve says and talk about the ways they would

further remove the government barriers to prosperity. not go negative. it doesn't work. >> when most americans think of the economy and think of how they are doing it they don't look at the dollar index. they look at household income. their income has not been doing so well. >> actually household income has not increased since 1999. which is why i feel, david, not just hillary but all establishment politicians are in trouble whether it's hillary, marco rubio, jeb bush. people are sick of both parties. people controlling both parties, sucking money out of the private sector and lining the pockets down in d.c. that's why they like trump. that's a reason they like ted cruz. >> it's not a hit against hillary in particular. it could be against all the establishment politicians. >> i do think it's more about hillary and whether she can campaign what obama promised and how he governed. he governs this way, getting what he wanted through the

bureaucracy, not through what the people wanted. when you sit with the democrats they are probably saying, no, we're not campaigning on health re form. that never comes um. or the stimulus or green energy. none of that works. if this is going to be helping change the subject for hillary clinton. >> well, the point is everything the democrats tried, first of all, they controlled not only the presidency but both houses of dock for the first two years of the obama administration. all this spending of money, billions, trillions of dollars didn't work well, did it? >> no. you look at the results and it's a crappy 2% growth economy. i need to correct john about negative being negative. i will forgive john because he's too young. re gan was the one who invented the misery index. remember the misery index in the 1980 election? it worked well. >> john go ahead. >> the economy was weak. reagan had something to campaign

against. commodities were skyrocketing and the dollar was weak. carter was a lousy mt. all these things are reversing in a reagan es ing fashion. talk optimistically. the electorate doesn't buy negativity. talk about what america can be. >> what obama did was come in a terrible economy, tried to turn things around. ke reagan lowered tax rates, lowered the cost of government through regulations. obama has done the opposite. he's grown government, raised taxes and raised the number of regulations making it harder to do business. that's why the economy isn't working. it's simple. >> it is simple. it's the worst recovery from a sharp downturn in american history. the republicans have to show that they can do better. it's not enough to criticize. they have plenty to criticize in 2012 and lost it. they have to have the positive program. by the way, if they get their act together which they will, you will see stocks rising in anticipation of better times to

come. not because of the democrats but because policies will be changed. >> from your lips. all right. steve forbes, thank you very much. coming up next, the forbes report on how more takers versus makers could put several states in an economic death spiral. is your state on the list? today on "cashin' in," turmoil around the world escalating. north korea testing bombs and iran showing off another under ground missile bunker. critics blame it on failed u.s. leadership in the world. are they right or wrong? plus, gone but never

the only way to get better is to challenge yourself,

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is your state about to go into an economic death spiral? a study from the folks at forbes warning it's because they have more takers living off government than makers making a living in the private sector. bill, this is your baby. which states are in trouble. explain why. >> california and new york may not surprise you are near the top of the list. this is a ratio between the number of takers who either have government jobs or are collecting welfare to make maers in the private sector. fl the ratio is high you can go into a downward spiral. that's why puerto rico is in terrible shape. you can't do it. the numbers don't add up. if you have more people taking than putting in you eventuallile go bankrupt. >> i think it depends on your definition of a taker or a maker. bill, it was a good piece. but it shall. >> once again, let me specify, bruce. just for the purpose of

specifics here. welfare we rip cents. government employees or government pensioners. those are the three categories. go ahead. >> okay. if you don't include farmers in the midwest getting huge agriculture subs tis, they are doing well. we don't count them. i'm just saying it depends on your definition. it comes down to whether your economy is diverse. in some way people are. >> it's a fair one, mike. the fact is a lot of people are on the take somehow from the government. these are people that a 100% of their income depends on the government. we have a map of people moving out of these states. when you have states in trouble about to go into a death spiral folks move out. they vote with their feet. >> great point. they talk about the massachusetts miracle which was michael dukakis. all the m.i.t. graduates.

a lot of them went to next to where rich lives now. >> sabrina, what do you think? >> this is a similar argument. that we are all a nation of takers. it is a bad math equation, a bad trajectory. it can be overly pessimistic. we lunch together people getting transfer payments through pension plans which they paid into even if they are unsus tapeable with welfare hand outs not tied to work. public opinion is on the side of reigning in spending and government. we need good political leadership. >> let's hope that's the side the public is in, reigning in government. we have mitt romney in the last aleks trying to make the point of the makers and takers point. he got hammers in the election. i wonder if maybe the nation is full of more takers than makers. >> no. thankfully most americans want to work. most americans want to get ahead. we have a lousy economic

environment that makes it more difficu difficult. you remove the obstacles and you will see the economy come back. states that are lagging, can't get their act together like illinois, people are moving out. that's the wonderful thing about america. we are mobile. we don't find opportunity at home, we go somewhere else. rich is always making the point that we are like a big ex-peer mental ground where people can move to a state that suits their interest. apparently they are moving out of the spiral death states. >> well, as usual, steve's right. most americans want to work. >> you just assured yourself a job for life. >> they want to do something better with their lives. takers hold back economic growth as a rule. we are overstating the case here. california and new york are home to some of the most innovative smart people on earth et who create enormous amounts of wealth. i don't think we are going to see california fall to 50th. we overrate negativity. >> bill, what's your feeling

about how you came up with this freedom ratio . eventually will things change? will people wake up? >> california is a long way from puerto rico. but there is a risk that google will say, you know, we could put employees in salt lake city or austin instead of california. >> or connecticut. a lot of people moving out of there. two of three americans say they don't have enough emergency savings to even pay for a $500 car repair. but our

we are back with your emergency picks. a cancer drug company. >> it's a player and an important cancer drug. they could pay off. >> bill, like it? >> i hope they cure cancer. i wouldn't put them el in my rainy day fund. >> you have a bond fund. >> ultra conservative. it didn't get crushed in the

first week of january. >> maybe we should be conservative now that the markets are going down. >> it's a downward trend and hedge funds are dumping out of it. >> that's it for "forbes on fox." keep it here. we continue with eric bolling. is it me or is the world going mad? north korea now testing a nuclear bomble while iran is showing off the under ground bunker loaded with missiles. are dangerous countries acting up because of weak u.s. leadership around the globe? hi, i'm eric bolling. our crew this week, jonathan, michelle, juan and jessica. welcome, everyone everybody. countries like north korea and iran are rubbing our nose in their defiance. michelle, what's fuelling this? >> that's easy. failed leadership. the reason why north korea is doing this is they feel embol n emboldened by the fact we have struck terrible deals with iran. north korea acted