different, pollsters are weighting things wrongly, people are hiding their beliefs, i think it is a sign their guy is down. >> jason riley always with great insight and perspective. thanks for being here. thanks for being with us. god night from new york. >> i don't know what i said. i don't remember. >> i don't feel no ways tired. i come too far john: are they our only option packs fortunately not. we have that libertarian candidates. governor terry johnson and people don't even know they are running. >> what has a libertarian stand for? john: they will answer that tonight in our libertarian town hall. >> and now, john stossel. [applause]

john: people act as if there are only two choices in this election, republicans and democrats but that's not true. there is one other party that is on the ballot in all 50 states and that's the libertarians. tonight they are presidential and vice presidential candidate gary johnson and bill weld will take questions from you, for me at home via social media, from you in the studio audience and from the street. that's where the first question comes from. >> what would you do to create jobs? >> government doesn't create jobs. the private sector does. what would you do? >> you can count on certainty when it comes to rules and regulations and when it comes to hiring, when it comes to being in business for yourself. john: certainty will bring jobs. >> that is true. small businesses don't need big tax cuts.

they just need to know that it's a one-way ratchet and taxes are only going in one direction, down in if we internalize that they will build that second factory and employ another 15 people. >> my question is in regard to the disinformation in the u.s. since the financial crisis in 2008. what policies do you guys have that will foster on to premiership and turned the tide around about this problem? >> well the taxes will only go one direction and that is down and the rules and regulations will only be better. that's a certainty of regulation >> i decided when i was governor of massachusetts i wanted to do besides high-wage jobs so i selected telecom, biotech and software which were three high wage industries and this was back in the early 90s. the average wage was on --

$50,000 all in. i met with the top ceos, what can i do come is a great is a great rations as a tax credit and are there determining issues and i made sure that everything they said they needed within reason as long as it wasn't against something else, they got and i got very happy and started opening new offices and in by the end of my first term if you were a biotech company and he won in the united states even if you are in the research triangle in north carolina or illinois or new jersey which is a big competitive states you have to have an office in federalist where in cambridge or you would lose out on the information curve as to what was cutting-edge in biotech and employment exploded. john: to go back, whoa who are u.s. governor to decide telcom is where the intrashould be? it sounds like renee capitalism? >> it's a little bit of analysis, john. i had to go into that to note

that this would be a place to encourage people to expand. if that's industrial policy make the most of it but i thought it was job instead of the station. >> at the end of my first term we have gone from having the highest unemployment rate among the 11 industrial states to the lowest of the proof of the putting was in the heating in that case. >> i am so pro free market but unfortunately wall street and banking i think has cast a shadow over capitalism and making people very afraid of work capitalism. how would you help to support and raise free markets while working to reduce crony capitalism? >> most americans actually have come to associate crony capitalism and free market has one and the same when in fact they are opposites. crony capitalism pay-to-play is when government involves itself in business.

we want government out of business. that's the level playing field. that's equal opportunity. john: how? >> a lot of legislation gave an unfair advantage to business as opposed to legislation that could have treated everyone equally. >> one of the most depressing things i've seen lately both senator elizabeth warren of massachusetts and president obama saying to small business owners, paid you have a company here and you think you have created a lot of jobs. you didn't create those jobs, the government created those jobs. please, gag me with a spoon. john: let's go back to politics for a moment. governor johnson you are polling at around 9% in most polls and the commission on presidential debates insists you must get 15% to be allowed in the debate. you say this is a conspiracy to exclude outsiders? >> we are okay with 15%. we think we will get to the 15%.

the issue for us right now is not appearing on the topline of the polls. if we were to appear on the top one of the polls i believe we'd be at 20% tomorrow. john: they put trump and hillary on top. >> 99% of media reports that top line. john: it's usually 40/40/9. >> if they said tell a city like clinton, johnson or trump, gary would be a 30% right now. they don't say that. they say that would be right now. johnon facebook ian rogers asks how do you propose smantling the department of education and irs? these are huge organizations with hundreds of thousands of employees the will there be transitional programs to ensure their employment in the private sector? >> is important to run out, we are not running for king, we are not running for dictator we are

running for president and vice president that there are constitutional limits to that. we are going to sign off on it anything that abolishes congress. >> you have to have the political will to do it. if you think they're a bunch of sacred cows there you would never get anything done. i came into office and furloughed 8000 state workers out of a workforce of 72,000 my first day in office. i never got a postcard in my two terms about where does this indispensable state worker go to that sunday one. john: that is what the question is getting at. would you just let them go? >> yeah, absolutely. the government is too big. i'm sorry. john: audience? [applause] on twitter a young man recorded this question about regulating uber and lyft. >> hi john i'm 20 when you're sold and i'm voting for libertarian ticket this year. might question for the former governor is this i'm a former

austin texas resident and fingerprinting legislation cause me to leave the city. i relied on the service is daily to get around. what is your stand on the limitation of fingerprinting legislation for ridesharing companies and would you support legislation that removes legislation? >> absolutely legislation that would make it easy for an economy to thrive and i'm talking about uber an air bnb, to bury entrepreneur companies are being excluded. john: this is the federal government. what do you have to do it that? >> may be nothing but if austin wants to do that is on austin's parp account on us as president and vice president to not put any more independence in the way that happening. >> we think willing buyers and willing seller should be able to exchange goods and services that the government telling them they should not do so.

okay? [applause] john: on facebook john posted what do you think of attacks over every wednesday -- pays the same percentage and everyone gets the same government service. why should anyone pay or her less than anyone else? the same amount of meat cost the same whether purchased by rich or poor person. why should government be different? >> if i could way that magic wand i am proposing to replace income tax and corporate tax with a consumption tax which i think fits that bill. john: i do well, shouldn't i pay a little more than someone who is struggling? >> what i'm going to suggest to someone who has more money you are going to buy more things so you will pay more tax. john: last question from times square. >> how would you get anything done with congress to stop the gridlock going on in d.c.?

>> look, we elect clinton or trump it's going to be more polarized than ever. that's a given. nobody believes anything but that so suppose you have a couple of libertarians, former republican governors having served in heavily democratic states, gotten reelected by big margins. in the middle with a bipartisan demonstration, democrats, republicans, everybody libertarian leaning calling out those sites to come to the middle to address the issues that we do have. i think you can make the case that heard scenario might ask the workout. >> it could be a long cool drink of water. i think the members of congress would be delighted not to have someone in the white house screaming at them for being and not understanding what the latest proposal is the perfect solution. you know we have promised no more sanctimonious self-serving speeches out of the white house,

no more buffoonery and bragging and bullying out of the white house. you can guess which is which. john: for the record on the show we support gridlock. we think they do less damage that way. [applause] stick around gary johnson and bill weld a whole hour of town hall with your questions for the libertarian presidential candidates. [applause] ♪ with this level of engineering... it's a performance machine. with this degree of intelligence... it's a supercomputer. with this grade of protection... it's a fortress. and with this standard of luxury... it's an oasis. introducing the completely redesigned e-class.

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[applause] john: where that their libertarian town hall tavenner's gary johnson and bill weld take your questions on social issues. for example. >> how are you going to legalize marijuana in all of its forms, planet gives -- cannabis, the plant. >> it's going to be a state issue but the first day in office we classify it which opens up a vast research and development that can go along with the marijuana industry and also frees up banking in those

states where it is legal. >> let's broaden it to other drugs. how do you plan to end the war on drugs, legalization or decriminalization? and would you do it for other drugs? >> well since 1999, i've advocated only to the legalization of marijuana believing when they do that as a country and i believe we are going to do that as the country, then we will focus on drugs first as a health issue rather than a criminal justice issue. john: unto another newer social issue and facebook, why should a private business owner be forced by government to serve a customer? a server can choose not to serve a customer if no shoes or no shirts but has to bake a cake for someone he disagrees with? similarities to jim crow but there is no similarity.

the customers free to take their business elsewhere. >> i think supporting discrimination is the wrong thing to do and i think the legislation would force the muslim to sell pork by force, that no one would be allowed to discriminate on the basis of religion. >> utah has passed some really significant idea legislation that allows for religious freedom but it has clearly state that the fact that there will be no discrimination against an lgbt community which i think it's been really targeted. >> so the utah statute for examples is that a church can do anything it wants to as a church. it's in the business of being a church. but if the private merchant wants to discriminate on the grounds of race or religion, those are way suspect categories. john: a muslim ontap or newer must sell pork to you?

>> well, you are talking about potentially opening up discrimination in my opinion that maybe businesses in this country discriminate, the owner of the businesses discriminate against muslims because let just be safe. john: that might happen. >> you are talking about a situation, you have to sell the cake to the individual that wants to buy the cake. you don't have to decorate the cake the way the individual wants to. that's first amendment and if that's legislation john that need signing i will be glad to send the legislation. >> we don't want to be any part of that kind of discrimination of any kind. john: this facebook user post this for governor weld you posting on fire is being good justice and future appointments. none of them are consistent --

considered constitutionalist. your selections are least likely to defend the constitution. >> i think they're all good people. they are centrists. i was making a point that i would necessarily go out and find the most wacko liberal or wacko conservative person that i could in order to point them to the supreme court to further specific political advances. john: feingold is a centrist? >> russ feingold is a smart guy. i've known him since he was in law school. he's a smart guy. >> there's a libertarian in this one and i heard about that one and i'm sorry but i know them all well and i think they are fine and intelligent people. >> i am. concerned about how many people are in prison. i visit prisons frequently. i am shocked at how many women are in prison. i'm shocked when i see elderly

women imprisoned. john: your question maam? >> i question is will you encourage governors of all the states to grant more clemency to the elderly that are in prison? >> gas. compassion. giving judges discretion of the profile of the majority category in federal prison today a person has been arrested on numerous times for selling small amounts of drugs and that's the major category of federal prison today. john: aaron brown asked this question and facebook. why why should i i and evangelical christian vote for you? >> hypocrisy is the unforgivable. doing one thing, saying one thing and doing another and neither of us are hypocrites. being honest in telling the truth, if you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything.

that is what you can count on, transparency, the truth, no hypocrisy. [applause] john: coming up next, are you two isolationists, politicians who would give america less safe and other questions for the libertarian presidential presidential and vice president joe candidate. [applause] (announcer vo) who says your desk phone always has to be at your desk? now, with one talk from verizon... hi, pete. i'm glad you called. (announcer vo) all your phones can work together on one number. you can move calls between phones, so conversations can go where you go. take your time. i'm not going anywhere. (announcer vo) and when you're not available, one talk helps find the right person who is.

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[applause] john: we are back with our special town hall with the libertarian presidential vice president joe candidates. with school starting many people have questions about our broken education system. >> where the changes you've made to the educational system? how would you improve the quality of education for all americans? >> we would abolish the federal department of education.

[applause] >> when the state of new york ends up sending money to washington and by the time it comes back from washington with all of the caveats associated with how should you conduct education in new york state, really it's a diminishment of about 6% of those educational resources that could have been in new york stands to begin with. more money for education is eliminating the federal department of education. >> we need our school choice and more charter schools and more opportunity for those kids and their parents to escape from the school systems to put pressure on the school systems to shape up or ship out in after those took effect three years after i left massachusetts ranked number one in reading and math every year since then. so you know was in end to social corrosion where you get to the end of high school and you don't

show confidence in reading and writing you get promoted because otherwise it would be discriminatory not to graduate you from high school. that's not doing the student any favors at all so i think you need to be hardheaded bear. education is a place where we need conservative hardheaded approaches. john: a choice leaving it to the states for the schools to compete? >> as governor new mexico i was more outspoken than any other governor in the country regarding school choice do we needed to open up competition to public education. john: this freedom creates other rovlin's. trey price asked one of your policy ideas involves absolving the department of education putting education control the local local government parents but where i went to school with our to happen the most likely result is that some groups would pressure the schools to stop teaching evolution in favor of creationism and other attacks on science. do you just let them? >> well i guess you are back to the lunch counter now, one side

one way and the other side the other way. government exists to enforce the constitution, the law of the land and leaving choices to individual states i think we are always going to come down on the side of data must the horse does end up to be constitutional violations. john: on face the key and moffitt asked what is your solution to the student debt crisis? i read you think student loans should be todd is libertarian and something financial aid is the reason for higher education. i agree but is that all you will support? any reforms to help students like me pay for the hyperinflated cost of college? >> one thing i think we need is more on line education on the distance education as opposed to the most expensive model which is a four-year bricks and mortar ivy class institution. john: am. john: m-i just unrealistic brexit i keep waiting for libertarian howitzers and answer

a question like that, what we do to help me with my student debt and say nothing. >> students have been sold a bill of goods. the reason for the high cost of college tuition is guaranteed government student loans so government asked that the deck from the very beginning. >> audience, yes sir. >> what would you do to address the ballooning debt that puts the burden on the backs of the taxpayer's? >> i have to take a dig at john for starters and that is looking for the libertarian solutions. look, we have been dealt a hand here that is unfair by government so taking that into account, can we not those interest rates? john: but that cost the taxpayer money. >> school choice and charter school doesn't burden the taxpayers more jobs available through partnerships with the private sector does not earn the

taxpayers. john: yes, go ahead. >> governor weld you mentioned distance-learning as an option for higher ed. would you be in favor of distance-learning or homeschooling on line education is an option for parents for k-12 education as well? >> sure, all for homeschooling and distance-learning on line. >> it doesn't take a village to raise a child, takes parents. [applause] >> if you empower 50 states to do this, 50 laboratories of innovation and best practice those are going to end up being best practices that will get emulated and of course they will be a horrible failure that will be sticking with the status quo and that will be avoided. >> you know even charter schools have to have freedom to fail and then there's freedom to fail the good schools thrive and teach more kids.

>> and people learn things. john: coming up questions from you about war and are you guys soft on defense? >> i'm voting for donald trump because he's going to protect their country and build that wall. what are you guys going to do to build -- to protect their country? john: plus governors you have this problem. so many people don't know who you are. we have shown these pitchers to people. most people said, who? >> do you recognize this man? >> no. >> i don't know. >> i don't know. your dentures seem to fit fine when you first put them on. but, during the day, they can move! in the morning... noon... evening... enough is enough! it's time to use fixodent plus adhesives. with just one application... ...they give you superior hold, even at the end of the day. so you can keep enjoying your evenings. fixodent. strong more like natural teeth.

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[applause] john: we are back with their libertarian town hall with governors gary johnson and bill

weld pick the libertarians want limited government that libertarians agree one thing government should do is provide for the common defense. some american sphere libertarians won't do that. >> i'm voting for donald trump because he's going to protect our country and build that wall. what are you guys going to do to protect our their country? >> so we are the only ticket that is not isolationist and this year's race. the two other tickets -- [applause] they have turned their backs on free trade which has been the cornerstone of american supremacy in the world since the second world war and we as a party and as individuals believe that the cornerstone of u.s. foreign and military policy has to be military supremacy, demonstrated supremacy and naval and airpower. people all over the world pay attention to that. john: you want to cut a 20%. >> that's not to say we are not going to have supremacy in the air and naval power.

we may not want to have 40,000 boots on the ground fighting for wars simultaneously a regime change. when it comes to regime change in american blood on foreign soil and boots on the ground in foreign countries, we would be quite a bit more skeptical and restrained than certain other candidates in the race. john: a questioner said trump is going to keep me safe by building a wall. >> a wall is the craziest thing i've ever heard in my entire life. john: why? people are upset with people crossing the border and some of them are committing crimes. >> statistically they are committing less crime than u.s. citizens and they're not taking jobs the u.s. citizens want. we should make it as easy as possible for somebody that wants to come into this country and work and to be able to get it work face and a work visa should entail a background check and a social security card and taxes are being paid. john: on facebook eric christian says smaller more focused isis

style terrorist attacks are becoming more common. how the proposed to defend the u.s. in these types of violence? >> these are isis inspired attacks and look, we involve ourselves in regime change. in my lifetime i cannot think of one single incidents where our supporting regime change has resulted in things being better and not worse. [applause] john: guardians do have questions? go ahead. government doesn't like the competition. [applause] >> i question is will you cut all foreign aid including aid to israel and treat everyone equally and fairly around the world? [applause] >> i think that yes we

philosophically, why are we building roads, schools bridges and hospitals and other parts of the world when we have those same needs here today? [applause] >> having said that you mentioned israel. i have a long record with israel. they are a vibrant democracy and a politically sensitive area of the world so it would be at cold day in july before i would totally freeze them out. [applause] >> so you guys don't agree on this. >> i think that we have come to believe that foreign aid is about food and medicine when foreign aid really for the most part just crops up more in dictatorships and into anything but. [applause] john: next coming here. >> i believe regime change has worked in germany and it's

worked in japan and it worked in iraq and tell obama pulled out. why not support boots on the ground when the u.s. assets are involved? >> in germany and japan we got attacked so boots on the ground there. >> this was us having been attacked. a big difference here. >> think iraq, think syria, think libya. those were not successful regime change operations. >> that's because obama pulled out and we were attacked. john: you don't believe that because we got involved in iraq but that is why we are now dealing with irannd in essence became isis in syria and libya, that was a consequence of a regime change in iraq and getting involved in a regime change in those two countries have also led to the arming of isis? not eventually but it's what has happened. >> incursions like that can have

unforeseen consequences, and as bad as the situations are our interventions have resulted in something that i best is the same and oftentimes is worse. >> a hello governors. you believe in blowback and what would you do as commander-in-chief. >> absolutely believe in blowback and the fact that we are flying these drone strikes and killing thousands of innocent people that have resulted in the situation being worse and not better. do you rule out drones completely? i don't think you do that. not to discount potential use that to actually address the enemy but for the most part i just think this is blowback. john: next is and voting john: next is and voting you both have ating your vote?

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[applause] john: now more for libertarian town hall. here's something lots of people ask libertarians.

>> and i wasting my vote voting for liberty and candidate by and voting republican or democrat seems like a more sure bet to win? john: it does frankly and donnie would post why are you trying to split the conservative vote knowing it only strengthens hillary? >> let, a wasted vote is voting for someone you don't believe in and that's a wasted vote. [applause] >> if you agree with us we are fiscally responsible, we are socially inclusive and tolerant if you agree with us and you want to waste your vote on trump or clinton, the airgas. we are libertarians. [applause] john: into the clear they say you were going to help elect hillary but in the polls you are pulling roughly equally with the democrats. >> what's going on here's the two parties have a monopoly. they created the commission on debates. they exist for no other personnel than to try to kill

each other and perpetuate their own duopoly in washington washington and they're practically trying to brainwash people into thinking you have to be in r or a d because that's what mommy and daddy always did and it's simply not true. you have two candidates who are going to be running against and are the third ticket and they do not have our set of views for the republican party is not socially inclusive and welcoming quite to the contrary they tried to make a platform unit that was before the convention. the democrats are going to spend money like water so we have a six lane highway right up the middle. we are two term republican governors in blue states and we got stuff done and balance the budget and that's really needed in washington. we are not saying trust us, we are saying we have already done it and that's going to be a winning argument. [applause] john: who is next year?

>> my question is basically all of my friends that are democrats my age are not voting for the nominee and a lot of friends -- friends who are republican or not voting for donald trump eight how do you make young people in america believe in democracy and vote on voting day? >> i think we tell ourselves it's 70% of americans don't even know who we are and i think we are the natural ticket, the natural candidate specifically for young people with the emphasis on freedom and liberty. that doesn't hurt us at all with them but basically know no, you can't go on forever spending money that you don't have and i think this millennial generation is going to turn the country this election cycle. john: tasha moore is his question for you. what can you do to ensure is that you are libertarians because i'm not quite quite believing it's? >> oh tasha, come on. john: you are just another

liberal republican. >> let's not forget that the libertarian party did make us their nominee. it was a contested race. john: pasha seems to believe about you but not your running mate. >> del and i both have self-identified as libertarians iselle going back to 1970. my papers in high school written about friedrich hyatt who is quite well-known. my first press conference as governor i greeted the members of the fourth state by saying fellow libertarians welcome to room 156. there was nervous laughter in the room because they knew i wasn't joking. john: on twitter, stossel wired a parading as progressives? muslim's, pandering to black

lives matter, muslims and so forth. >> the trump folks said all lives matter and the correct answer to the question to black lives matter is not all lives matter, it's yes. [applause] john: what do you say the person who says you are coming out like represses and the republicans who part of my social media fanbase, they are angry at your liberal position. >> there is probably not anything i can say to that reduces him that would change them. >> beating with industry heads if we can be assertive and without spending taxpayer money, trying to improve the lot of citizens and increase the number of good jobs out there, you call that progressive, okay but that's our job and all of this. john: one last one for this block jp finney tweeted this question. stossel, this gary johnson

believe he is able to effectively debate tromping clinton? his stage presence lacks command. >> oh man. [laughter] [applause] john: i think that is what the tweeter means. >> i will take it over bullying and braggadocio and sanctimonious speeches, that's for sure. [applause] john: audience what you think? does the lack command? >> no. john: when we return, glimmers of hope. >> i'm kind of interested in the other candidates for republicans and democrats are kind of roaming me out. ♪ with this level of engineering... it's a performance machine.

with this degree of intelligence... it's a supercomputer. with this grade of protection... it's a fortress. and with this standard of luxury... it's an oasis. introducing the completely redesigned e-class. it's everything you need it to be... and more. lease the e300 for $549 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer. mercedes-benz. the best or nothing. i wodon't know where i'd be without itre so when i heard about con-artists committing medicare fraud... it made me so mad i wanted to give them the old one-two one, never give your medicare number to get a free offer or gift two, always check your medicare statements for errors these crooks think we're clueless, they don't have a clue it's your medicare, protect it see more ways to fight fraud at medicare.gov/fraud

[applause] john: my mind is made of. i'm not neutral. i'm going to vote for these guys. they very much better choice than trump or clinton but what chance do you have when you can't get into the debate and to recent polls found most americans haven't even heard of you.

we had your pictures blown up. the producer showed these things to people around new york. >> do you recognize this man? >> no. >> i don't know. >> no, i've never seen that base. john: a few people have a clue. >> that's gary johnson. >> a few people recognized bill weld. >> is the vice presidential nominee for the libertarian party. john: once we told them what the libertarian stance for they were more interested. >> governors howdy possibly compete when people don't know who you are? >> well the first presidential debate is projected to have more viewership than the super bowl so there is no chance of his winning without being in that name but we believe that we are

going to be in that game. john: why are you so confident? you are five points away. >> 70% of the people the country don't know who gary is. we will be spending money to increase our name recognition. john: 30 days is enough? >> i see it in fund-raising. it has picked up jim matt kuchar kuchar -- geometrically. gary is getting mobbed in airports and he wasn't before. else i read this the day it's announced that we are going to be in the debates were just not going to be until the end of september. it will probably be the first or second week of september on that day we will have saturation of the media coverage for the entire balance of the election season. [applause] >> by the time the debates come around gary is going to have 100% name recognition. the artificial advantage will have disappeared. john: here's your last chance tonight.

what would you say to america to convince people that you are viable competitors, better than the other two? >> i think philosophically we speak for the majority of americans. we are fiscally conservative. we are socially inclusive and we really question these military interventions that have made things worse, not better. we believe in free trade. we believe in diplomacy and if you want to think that anything is going to change with trump or clinton, guess again. how about two former republican governors, not off the street but to republicans former republican governors serving in blue states, reelected. we have been there, we have done that. this is something that we can do and have done. we don't have to prove anything. john: governor weld your last statement tonight?

>> i can improve on that. gary, you are the man. [applause] john: we have more questions. [applause] we had more questions than answers than we had time for tonight. we just posted that on the web site at john stossel.com. you can hear more from the libertarian presidential and vice presidential candidates. thank you governors. gary johnson and sub five i don't agree with everything you say but those of you would make a better president than hillary clinton and donald trump and of course after tonight show more people realize that. you will be allowed in the debates and when america hears your libertarian libertarian ideas and realizes they are much better than repression from hillary and donald you will be elected so president johnson, vice president weld. >> 17% after tonight. thank you john.

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