>> i'm being sarcastic. >> isn't this called a gym? >> they are going to create safe places for men to contemplate -- >> isn't that called a men's locker room? stuart: i'm done. there's five seconds to neil cavuto. i'm counting it down. neil, it's all yours, son. neil: were you criticizing pope francis? stuart: moi? okay. [laughter] neil: can we cue up that exorcist tape? stuart: wait a minute. i'm episcopalian, and i go to church on a regular basis, and i do not want to hear politics from the pulpit. neil: okay, great. obviously, you won't be going to the vatican christmas party. all right, thank you, son. [laughter] i always like it when he calls me son, i feel to young. if you're donald trump, do you feel so targeted, because right now we've got all this hoopla over his losses and how much he was avoiding taxes potentially for many, many years.

but let's step back from this ask see what's going on. he lost about a billion dollars if we're to believe the 1995 tax return. now, if you substituted donald trump for, let's say, apple or ibm or general motors and put in the company name experiencing loss, would it carry the same weight as it does when you can say of the trump organization it's donald trump? that was the case then, these are some losses over the past years, but we don't give them the same type of scrutiny as we're giving donald trump. now, to be fair, it is mr. trump who is running for president of the united states, it is mr. trump who for the first time in a long time is not releasing tax returns, something that was a common procedure on both candidates' part, democrat or republican, over these many, many years. but we felt it good to go over this with a tax expert. he says the tax code itself is the issue, and i had the pleasure of chatting with you a little while ago before the show, and you said that he's not

breaking any laws. but as you surmised very quickly, it's getting the attention it does because of who he is. but if you subbed his name for a company, it happens a hot, right? >> yeah, i think so. let's face it, this is really all about donald trump. it's not about anything else. we could talk about how complex the tax code is. well, the tax code has always been come plex. this is specifically about donald trump. and if you take a look at what "the new york times" is saying specifically, they're leading in to saying donald trump hasn't paid taxes for 18 years. they don't know ifhat's true. they used the term "tax avoidance." i don't think this is about tax avoidance. it seems to me that donald trump had a tax benefit based upon nearly a billion dollar loss. now, if you want to go out and lose a billion dollars in order to get a benefit, a tax benefit, i don't think that's what trump

had in mind. neil: still, there are a lot of folks -- and we're talking about this as well -- who don't have that opportunity to rejigger a bad year and get tax writeoffs, so they say, you know, obviously, the tax code, his friends are saying that's a sign he can navigate his way around the tax code, and who better to police and change it later on as president? but you pointed out something very interesting. we pick and choose who we have a fight over. warren buffett. what did you mean by that? >> well, when we talked about warren buffett what we said is warren buffett was famous for making the comment that he is actually in a lower tax bracket than his secretary. well, there's a reason for that. it's because warren buffett isn't paying taxes based upon be ordinary income. all of warren buffett's income is being taxed as capital gains. now, that's a loophole that he's taking advantage of. and you could make an argument to say, well, listen, that's a huge tax loophole.

he's one of the richest men in the country. why aren't we talking about that as really problem with the u.s. tax code? but we're not. we're talking about donald trump. he's a light thing rod for this stuff -- lightning rod for this stuff. neil: but you were stressing as offensive as some might find this at sort of a gut level, it's all perfectly legal. are there any special exemptions or allowances all the more for the real estate or casino industries that others don't enjoy or what? >> well, on this specific issue, neil, we're talking about net operating losses. and i want to expand on that nor a moment -- for a moment because in our fam office practice at my firm, we deal with a lot of wealthy people. but in this specific case in this specific rule, you could have a situation, let's say, where of a plumber -- where you have a plumber. he's got some tough economic times. construction is slowing down, and be let's say he has a $90,000 loss. the tax code is set up so that

he has the ability to recover. so the next year and the next year and the next year when he starts to inch his way back in with having some income, he doesn't have to pay tax on that. neil: but let me ask you about the 20 years' thing -- i'm sorry, my friend. the 20-year thing that the times wrote about, they're accurate insofar as saying if you had a huge loss and there is this $50 million many loss that you can take or write off or whatever you want to call it every year, then conceivably since that time and maybe just up until now he hasn't paid any federal income taxes. that's a distinct possibility, right? >> that is possible, neil. but let's go with this: donald trump has billions and billions and billions of dollars. how do we know he had a $900 million loss in 1995? and in 1996 he had a billion dollars of income, and it was wiped out at that point. we don't know that. so i believe that people are

really making a lot of assumptions where you don't have the tax returns, so you just don't know. neil: all right. dan, if you can stick around with us, i want to bring you into this next debate. i do want to put this in perspective, and we're flashing these at the bottom of the screen, but again, we're making a big deal about donald trump because he refuses to release his tax returns, and he's running for president. dupont in 1992 had a nearly $4 billion loss, and, again, i mentioned caterpillar earlier on, big losses totaling over the course of about ten years of well north of $1.8 billion. but, again, this gets the attention, not so much when an apple in 1996 reports an $820 million loss and the next fiscal year a better than $1 billion loss. companies headed by visionaries whether many or out at the time,

well, it happens all the time. to charlie gasparino, marjorie clifton. charlie, how big of a deal will this be for donald trump? >> i don't know. it's a talking point, and this is an election that's won or lost at the margins, and it could hurt him. let's be real clear here. i'm not a tax expert. i've covered taxes my entire career. you know, real estate -- if you're in real estate, you can take a lot more deductions than the average person. a lot more than even the plumber that your last guest talked about. neil: unless he dabbles in -- >> yeah. he has to be considered a real estate developer, and then there's all these special exemptions. trump's got a billion dollar tax lost. i don't believe he lost a billion dollars in 1994. his hotels were getting crushed in the early 1990s, so some of that might have bled into '95 -- neil: and renegotiating his debts. >> here's the thing, how'd he come up with a billion? it wasn't just from losing money. like apple lost money in '96.

it was in bad fiscal straits. donald probably came up -- i'm just assuming -- neil: we don't know. >> -- with a lot of paper losses that he threw in that thanks to a very good accountant, who he brags about -- neil: read about it in his book, but misspelled his name. >> right. neil: i do that with you. >> you can misspell my name anytime -- neil: i leave out the o. [laughter] >> you can carry that forward. he's not releasing his tax returns, so we don't know what kind of gimmicks he came up -- neil: that's half the battle. marjorie, now, i know it's very easy the seize on this, and it does ignite a rage from average folks who say i don't have these liberties. and that's, obviously, what hillary clinton and her folks are going on, that's what her supporters are going on. but truth be told, no laws were broken here, right? >> no. i agree. and i think the issue is, actually, not so much about, you know, the logistics of how the

books were moved around and whether he gained -- i mean, he takes pride in the fact that he games the system, and i think that is at the heart of people's concern, the lack of transparency -- neil: that i'm smart, that makes me very smart. >> it's not -- right. it's a transparency thing. and it is how are you going to play by the rules like you're asking every other american to play by? you can debate tax law, the buffett rule which says if you mitt a certain mark in your income, you should be paying -- neil: a million and over, right. but the rules are the rules -- >> but the rules are the rules, right. neil: so, mark, i want to touch on that with you. the rules are the laws that exist, right? and this happens and is allowed. to charlie's point, there are more of these rules encoded in the tax code for real estate, even casino interests. so people will debate that as we are now but still say, yeah, but it's fishy to me. what's the fallout to donald trump? >> i don't think there is a fallout. i think this is going to

backfire on the new york times and the clinton campaign, neil. because if you listen to professor gaspo there and his academic analysis, that's not what voters are going to take away from this. more millions of independent contractors and small business people who i think will look at this and agree with it. they'll say, of course, any person in business is trying to limit -- neil: yeah, but it's the number. it's the number -- [inaudible conversations] that's the issue, a big number, right? >> well, and the other -- [inaudible conversations] neil: i want to go to dan as our resident accountant expert here. it's the big number that catches attention, right? >> yeah, there's no question about it. it's about how large that number is. it's not 90,000, it's $900 million. >> right. >> that's the issue. but, again, we see donald trump being targeted here because if you want to -- >> because he's running for president. neil: well, yeah. [inaudible conversations] >> but let's be -- [inaudible conversations] neil: let him finish. >> hlary clinton for a moment because we talked about hillary clinton had a, i believe it was

a $1 million charitable tax deduction, and it went to the clinton foundation. >> right. >> now, how does that pass the smell test? >> no, but here's the thing, you know about that for a reason, because she released her taxes. [laughter] i mean, here's the problem that i think donald has here, this thing is shrouded in a lot of secrecy. and i'm not saying one story's -- neil: he should have just released his tax records a year ago. >> you're missing the -- >> let me just make this point. he was told a year ago to release it, and he refused to. now here's the other point i want to make. there are, there's a lot of interesting deductions that he took out that he doesn't want publicized. >> right. >> or else he would have released -- >> and that's -- >> but you're missing the comeback story. this is an americanback story. how many people do you know lose a billion dollars -- >> nice try. >> and compare that to -- >> so he didn't -- >> establishment -- >> think about what you're saying. he didn't pay -- >> tax status -- >> sir, he didn't pay any taxes

on all his apprentice winnings. think about that. >> there's only two reasons -- [inaudible conversations] >> it doesn't play well. it doesn't play well. >> they want trump to stand up for america. >> he says he made something like $300 million, i might have the number wrong, on his apprentice -- neil: and he didn't. >> [inaudible conversations] >> you're comparing a entrepreneur -- >> he's probably, and when you see some of these deductions, you can probably surmise that he's not worth $10 billion. [inaudible conversations] >> establishment politician. neil: all right. but we didn't get a lot of details. i think three different pages of three different forms, so that's end of it. marjorie, is there a risk here that be careful what you wish for, democrats, making hay of this because then they could start going through clinton foundation stuff and writeoffs and connections and all bets are off for the next debate? >> there's already been a lot of digging into that, and i think that's why -- you know, and look, smartly, key rule of crisis communication or getting

in front of an issue is to disclose everything -- neil: i agree with that. i do agree with that. >> and that's the issue. the question is why is he concealing them, and i think it could be two things. one, the actual practices of how he was, you know, offloading money that he would have to pay, and then, two, he's not worth as much money as he brags about. >> yeah, that's what i think. neil: "forbes" magazine, no fan of his, says he's still worth close to $4 billion. now, that's a lot less than tr beg an issue that republicans have talked about, well, this guy, to quote rudy giuliani, must be a genius because he was able to leverage the tax code to his advantage. i'm asking you to go into politics here, but does that carry the day? everything is legal, everything is right, what he did, but the stigma still exists that, hey, you lost almost a billion dollars and as a result since then potentially you haven't had to pay a dime in taxes since. >> well, i would leave it with this, i'm not going to make a political statement here -- neil: that's too bad. [laughter]

>> whether you're wealthy, middle class or poor, what everyone has in common is no one likes to pay taxes. >> no, of course not. neil: very good, dan. >> people see that -- >> by the way, the if he's so genius, this is the non sequitur of that argument -- neil: don't use big words. >> okay. kind of a contradiction. [laughter] doesn't make sense. why -- if he's such a genius, why doesn't he just release it? neil: yeah. if he'd done it a year ago -- >> look, that is a very conventional standard, right? just because they've always done it -- >> honesty. neil: honesty and transparency. >> that's not affecting votes. honesty -- >> have you -- neil: you know,, mark, he would have avoided all of this. i generally agree with you, but the president said get it out there, thrash it out, beat the hell out of each other with it. it doesn't last very long because, i'll tell you, journalists are not keen on numbers or going into numbers, and they'd drop it after a

while. >> some are. [laughter] >> and the other -- >> talk about transparency, compare that to hillary clinton and her clear, deliberate methods to avoid any transparency whatsoever while she was secretary of -- neil: marjorie, your take on that. >> and with her nonprofit organizations. >> but the other point is, look, nobody likes to pay taxes, i mean, absolutely. we all want to minimize to our tax burden. but in the end, you also have to look at what they're for. do the irs codes need to be changed? neil: by the way, marjorie, you make a big deal of the 47% of americans who pay no federal income tax at all, a number that's doubled in the last 30 years. >> look, we've got to be smart and efficient about how -- neil: all i know is we have fewer and butter people paying the bills -- fewer and fewer people paying the bills. >> right. and we still need to pay for schools and roads -- >> that's right. this issue is about wealth distribution which is wealth creation. neil: guys, thank you very much.

we wrapped that up. you're welcome, america. [laughter] all right. there's another program out there. remember i gave you that homework assignment, see how aggressively the media covers this hillary clinton audio that just popped up talking about bernie sanders' supporters. apparently, a lot of you did, and you're still waiting to see that media coverage. ♪ don't let dust and allergens get between you and life's beautiful moments. by choosing flonase, you're choosing more complete allergy relief and all the enjoyment that comes along with it.

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♪ ♪ >> they're children to have great recession, and they are living in their parents' basement. the idea that maybe, just maybe you could be part of a political revolution is pretty appealing. it's a false promise from. but i don't think you tell idealistic people, particularly young people, that they've bought into a false promise. neil: all right. remember the homework assignment

i gave you on friday, and you did do it, right? the media cover only -- coverage of that, and i want today compare -- i wanted you to compare it to the coverage mitt romney got. you remember all of that and how mitt romney came on very show to say he was inelegant at best. yeah. all right, so i said if we're going to go to town on mitt romney over that, the media, i'm sure, is going to go to town on this. and apparently it didn't happen. reaction now from bernie backer, a former campaign staffer, desmond, very good to have you. >> thank you. neil: are you surprised this didn't get much media follow-up? i knew where she was coming from, frustration with the passionate supporters of bernie sanders like yourself, but it didn't get a lot of media play. >> well, i mean, i'm not surprised at all. you know, most things that show that same supporters that you're

asking to support you to later say that they're just basement dwellers is not going to get the type of coverage that it should was we just want to sweep it under the rug and move on and go to the next topic. i want to send a real crystal clear message to hillary clinton and those who believe in that comment, even senate sanders who said it's true, i'm right here in oklahoma city where i was born and raised. at 17, 18 i went to the military to serve my country and later on went to texas with no job, no place to stay without a dime in my pocket and became an i ward- award-winning business owner. i've never been in a basement, did not have a parent to send me to an ivy league school, and i made it. the only time i was in a basement was when i was running from a tornado. so i'm very offended by the comments she's made and bernie sanders for once again folding like a napkin for agreeing with it. oklahoma voted for bernie sanders, and it wasn't because

of a false state, it was because of hard work that we know we can put into to change this country around. neil: does it make you less likely the support her in the general election? >> well, i wasn't supporting her in the first place. i am a capitalist, a business owner through and through. i supported bernie sanders not because i'm a -- neil: who are you supporting now? i'm sorry. >> i'm not supporting anybody at this point. my job is to sit here and continue to tell people the question clinton's policies, the same policies that locked my entire generation up here in oklahoma city during the war on drugs. this is just further proof that once again she has no respect for bernie sanders' supporters s and i won't be moving over to the other side. i made my decision in the beginning and, unfortunately, he hasn't committed on his part. neil: do you think what she was saying then, frustration with this passionate group of voters, yourself included, who were not keen on her. and the idea after the party convention when everyone supposedly "kumbaya"'d together that, well, they weren't keen on

hillary clinton, but they syruply weren't going -- certainly weren't going to support donald trump. maybe by extends voters like you, she's taken them for granted? >> well, of course. the african-american vote was her firewall during the primary. you won't see too much pandering going on because now she has to focus on the middle chat and the white man per se, not women, because she feels she has that on lock. trying to reach out to young voters with this fake, pandering attitude. this weekend we heard she didn't believe in free college, so which one is it? we can look at the tapes and look at one what bill clinton said. this is more of the same strategy over and over, saying one thing on the left hand and something different on right. and it's up to the american people to make the decision is she lying or truly going to do better for this country. neil: man, oh, man. remind me not to argue with you in the future. [laughter] you argue your position very well.

former bernie sanders campaign staffer. let's just say for the time being not committed to one hillary clinton. for the time being. all right. obamacare seems to be unraveling now, so much so that on page 1 of no less than "the new york times" signs that they have to fix things fast. ♪ ♪ the pursuit of healthier.

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neil: take a look at wells fargo's stock. this thing is slip-sliding away, a 52-week low today. the state of illinois suspending a $30 billion investment activity with wells fargo citing predatory and illegal banking practices. this as there's talk that charges could be brought against bank in its handling of these thousands of bogus accounts. way too early to tell, but it's safe to say that this company ain't out of the financial woods here. meanwhile, it looks like obamacare is just entering the financial woods amid signs here that despite it being signed

into law and signing up millions who didn't have insurance suddenly with insurance, the cost to almost all other americans has gone up measurably and stands to go up even more. to washington examiner health care reporter paige cunningham on whether this will become an issue in tomorrow's vice presidential debate. what do you think? >> well, if the ground was ever primed for republicans to attack democrats over the affordable care act, it's definitely now. for the first time, you see a lot of the gop predictions about cost, coverage and quality of care, you're really going to see those coming about in 2017. competition is way down, in fact, at the examiner we've confirmed that four states and possibly more will only have one obamacare insurer next year. and if you look just across the nation, possibly as many as 55% of rating areas will have two or fewer insurers. and you see costs going up more as well on average about 25% across the country. and these are things that republicans have been predicting for a really long time, but now that we're finally a few years

into the law and really seeing kind of how it works, this is really -- i think they have more evidence than they've had ever before to attack the law. so you could see this come up as an issue in the debate tomorrow night, although it hasn't been a huge issue on the campaign trail. it's been an issue in some senate races but not something donald trump has taken up. you could see discussion of it between the two. neil: i always wonder given the building attention on donald trump's taxes and everything else, do issues like these get lost. in other words, we're so focused on what he paid and when or didn't pay and when or for how long that all these other legitimate issues sort of get cast aside, and vp debate also gets preoccupied with them. >> well, i definitely think trump's approach has been different than any of the other republicans in the primaries would have been. the be we had had cruz or rubio, they'd have spent a lot of time hammering the aca, and i think you would see a lot more discussion of it on the campaign trail.

donald trump doesn't get in so much to policy, so his discussion of the issue has been only cursory, and i think it's led to a little bit of frustration among strategists at some points because they really see obamacare as this weapon that republicans could really hammer democrats with. that said, mike pence may be a little bit hesitant to bring it up in the debate because he is one of the few republican governors who actually did choose to expand -- neil: that's right. >> -- accept a portion of the law by expanding medicaid, and he received criticism for that. if he brings up the law, tim kaine is likely to throw that back at him and say, hey, you actually did accept one of its key provisions. neil: in other words, more medicaid funding for the state. he will argue as did chris christie and others, yeah, but that gave me more wiggle room and more control in my state. do you think that falls on deaf ears? >> well, i think that's exactly a what his argument's going to be. he and most other republican governors, they did accept the medicaid money, but they found a

way to attach more ricks on it and more -- restrictions on it, so they say it's a really conservative approach to the affordable care act, and they didn't want to leave that money hanging, you're exactly right. but that may not play well with republican voters, so i wouldn't be surprised if pence tried to stay away from the issue. but at the same time, he does have a lot of really good weapons that he can throw at democrats. neil: paige, thank you very much. it's going to be fascinating. normally the vp debate doesn't get this attention. thank you very much. all right, in the meantime karl rove is looking at this entire soap opera going around donald trump right now as to whether it hurts him or helps him. why karl says the next debate will be even more crucial to right a or very problematic ship. ♪ guys, what's happening here? hey nicole, this is my new alert system for whenever anything happens in the market. kid's a natural.

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neil: what if i tell you there's still a lot to do with deutsche bank is still a lot to do with fears about the banking industry that we seem to have put to bed for a while on friday but are revisiting now with reports at the weekend at deutsche is not of the words and even if the justice department for a supported role -- reported role in the melt down eight years ago is down to four or 5 billion. it will still be in the world of hurt and still be potentially undercapitalized if everything

has a fan. you know, the rows in this country to set capital requirements for banks to repair them in a worst-case scenario and the selling of mass ensues. we are in better shape. a lot of concerns led by deutsche bank or not and that is one of the reasons the stock is down to the degree it is to a third of a percent. keeping an eye on these polls as well, donald trumps dropping and the latest fox news poll. the debate lasted and hurt as much as you might think. karl rove picks apart the numbers of how important the next debate will be. carl, good to have you here. >> is for having me, neil. neil: let's talk about this drop in the polls. i was expecting more because they thought he did poorly come actually very poorly in the debate. but he didn't suffer as much as i would have thought.

i don't know how this tax thing shakes out, but what do you make of just that? >> well, i think debates contend tend to confirm people's opinions. even if your guy or gal loses coming as they okay okay they lost that debate but i'm still for them. i think it is less a debate. so much information from the debate that unless you make a gigantic faux pas, it sort of has a minor impact or you're against you. but it's the coverage thursday friday saturday of this week. more than what happens in the debate. it was mostly did because he began to go after the former miss universe, the former miss venezuela who clinton had brought up on monday night. when this is unimportant doesn't prevent a single swing voter before him, choose up incredibly

valuable time and i've been talking about something unflattering. my suspicion is while he made it through the debate alright in the real clear politics average the rates actually didn't change all that much. in fact, it got slightly better because some older polls got dropped out for newer polls just before the debate that was pretty good for them. my suspicion is later this week we will see the margin ahead and i think the margin will lighten up a little bit. neil: not the media is counting on all of this tax stuff. how much do you think this hurts? >> it potentially hurts them a lot. during the debate she raised this issue and he basically confirmed it by saying if you didn't pay taxes and make them smart and on sunday his advocates, mayor giuliani, governor christie both cause a genius for having done this. that's a mistake. it makes him sound like he's giving the code.

more straight or to say of course when i had business losses i'm able to deduct income, keep the counterbalance of those losses at the income. that's where the tax system is for everybody. if we did have it that way we would call an small businesses in all kinds of businesses to pay money when they didn't make any money. if we extend the principle to individuals, and we pay taxes even though they weren't making any money. the tax code is the way that it is. if you have a big loss and that is exactly what i did. they're a genius for gaming the system. that's not what people like. if you abide by the rules, fine. we don't disagree with that, he makes the mistake by saying he took advantage of the system in his smt enough to know how to do it. neil: journalists are not keen on covering the intricacy of the tax code.

but it does make you wonder if he had released all this earlier whether it does stuff would remain. >> if he really said much earlier it depends on what people -- whatever the issue bias, if you can a month ago, year ago is yesterday's news that hillary clinton was trying to make an issue. trade you real quickly, hillary clinton pounces on the in the next presidential debate in st. louis that maybe senator campbell that governor penn and his vice presidential debate tomorrow. how should it be handled if you're advising neither side, by that i mean either republican candidate. >> if our guys in her eyes and make a little of it, not a lot. does spend a lot of time on this because this is not your problem. your problem is people don't think you represent change. they think you represent more of the status quo. if she brings her that he ought to say our tax code has a print will build said what should he lose money you can take those losses in town and against

future income. if you've got losses tough love. if somebody loses their job and are job and aren't making money they've got to pay taxes anyway. small business loses money. that just doesn't make sense. it once again show she's a government liberal to satisfy her big spending programs for liberal special interest buddies. neil: 40% of the folks in this country don't pay any federal income tax. >> let's be careful about that. slippery slope. a lot of those people are seniors who've retired and we shouldn't expect them to pay income taxes. some of them are barely scraping by. we have a progressive tax code. >> that was just two years ago. >> four years ago. congratulations on that degree from rutgers. neil: thank you very much. masters of political communications.

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>> m. nicole petallides with your fox business brief. after four straight quarters of games in the past quarter finished on friday before the year for stocks. today we started down arrows printed out on 81. s&p 500 down 11. nasdaq down 27. we are watching wells fargo trading at the lowest level since late 23rd teen. we now have learned that the illinois treasurer has suspended her day billion dollars in investment committee with wells fargo. one-year moratorium and caused the behavior of the company downright shameful. keeping a keen eye on google as hukill according to sources is tapping into an advisory firm to consider a purchase of twitter that would compete against disney if that were to go forward. the stock is to e downside about or 10% as a key contract with a major police department went to their competitor and that is because of the advantage.

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neil: albright. this hurricane map view as the street right now i'm the first person on this tropical storm and warned us about it before anyone else even knew it was out there. a resident machine, also meteorologists. this thing is a monster. what happened? reporter: neil, this could go on the record books. this is the strongest we've seen in 10 years good look at the

satellite imagery. this is very distracted, could potentially be catastrophic. i once went with a five and we can actually bump it up again in the next advisory at 2:00 p.m. all four quadrants are filling out here and you see the well-defined eye potentially unfortunately could be deadly for our friends in haiti because they are expecting a direct hit from hurricane matthew in the next 24 to 48 hours. the right front quadrant is the most potentially devastating part of the storm is going to move over haiti, potentially bringing over 40 inches of rainfall which is going to be devastating for them. they are certainly going to see flash flooding and mud of course a lot of the population is poor. they are still suffering from the earthquake in 2010. so prayers are needed for her friends in haiti. watching jamaica as well, eastern cuba and the latest

track at a lot of the forecasting model we look at now moving more towards the coastline. i keep saying this. florida to maine, you need to be watching the storm and we are watching missile into the workweek and even into the weekend as it is still offshore, i'm sure cannot outer banks me to watch this in the northeast into next week. back to you. neil: janice, thank you very much. republicans and democrats can agree on this much. when it comes to looking forward to retirement, most of us are not. meet the lady who wants to change all of that for both parties. approve this message.

i'd look her right in that fat ugly face of hers. she's a slob. she ate like a pig. a person who's flat chested is very hard to be a 10. does she have a good body? no. does she have a fat [expletive]? absolutely. do you treat women with respect? i can't say that either.

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go long™. ♪ neil: here sunday night unite us whether republican or democrat, red or blue or green. only about 26% of democrats, 25% of republicans think they are managing wealth for retirement. this young lady says you know what, we could change those numbers. love your life, not theirs are already rocketing to the top of the charts. rachel, good to see you. your argument is you've always got to be setting goals to be looking at this. too many of us don't give a period >> well, you can't lose out. a lot of people when it comes to the money is a hopeless topic.

that is what i do everyday is tried and that the hope that you can take charge of your life. you have to do commonsense approach of not include spending retirement. neil: but if you're older, not as young as you, it's almost too late. >> sure, the older you are the last time you have obviously. if you're still breathing, you still have time to save money. for millennial sweep of a wake-up call as well to say hey, look at the generation out about retirement pay and we don't have enough. lessons to be learned all around. you're never too too old to save money. neil: were talking about it today you can afford to spend more in retirement. >> depends on what you have saved. i was lifestyle is different. everyone's income is different. if you are at a place where you say i feel good, my math is working out, compound interest is your friend is looking ahead this is what we think the market

is going to do and hopefully get to the point where you can enjoy it an injury to to the limit you were expecting. neil: a lot of friends of mine are much, much older. but they don't change their lifestyle markedly and i was look at this and say you're going to run out of time. >> depends on the numbers. add another specific situation. i love to get people to the point of exactly what they want to live on. this went to limits and boundaries in your money and fame when you're not retired. neil: one of the cheapest people on the planet, lovely man. but he taught her to watch and still walks around with a bag of cash. but now, do you do the same thing? not the bag of cash, but watch every little expense? >> i'm very on top of my money. i teach people in my new book to be wise with money it doesn't

mean you have to be cheap. you can enjoy life but the money has to be there. you have to tell it what to do. neil: i don't believe you believe that. >> i enjoyed nice dinners. i splurge on things. but i plan for it. if i don't have the money, we say now and then we save up and do it later. neil: millennial should be saving how much for retirement of their gross income? >> ilec 15%. once you're added to any of a fully funded emergency fund, then look into that. three to six months of expenses. then you have to save for retirement. neil: a lot of young people, old people say forget it. >> it seems difficult at times. especially millennial set has student loan debt, you have to make sacrifices and get out of debt is put as possible, have the emergency fund in place. >> of course they will.

neil: you are not going to be in that position. don't assume that. >> i do. don't depend on the government for your money. you have to take control of your life and say you're in charge of their destiny. don't worry about the white house. where that's going on in your house. you have to take control of your life. neil: when you hear the entitlement spending is still going out of control. what do you tell young people be they democrat or republican, right or left. >> you have to have a plan. it sounds ample but it's going back to the budget. this is how much of her groceries every month. here's what you have her clothes and you have to plan. neil: real quickly, you and your dad -- [inaudible] >> and a daughter would. neil: love your life, not theirs, rachel cruz. a book about how you can avoid similar problems later on. it's too late for me so i'll be anchoring through 110.

neil: now we know that donald trump in 1995 blast $900 million. it sounds like a big deal. substitute donald trump's name with, i don't know, names like apple, names like caterpillar, names like cisco, dupont, companies that had larger losses and all of a sudden you get a different picture. donald trump's company is obviously donald trump's company. but it is a large multinational concern. we know he and i set the head that concerns the donaldrumps loss. but in fact, such losses while staggering are not unprecedented. try telling that to many in the mainstream media. maybe rightly so given the fact he was reluctant to release.

this guy jerry joining us, lawyer research president. glad to see this young man again. why do you make of that? >> i don't know about young man, but i'm glad to see you, too. neil: what do you make of that but it is a big loss, even nothing illegal around toward going on here. he's taking the lead and adjust the tax code, but it does shave some americans who say i don't have that flexibility. i don't have the wherewithal. the politically hurts. >> i say the only thing he did wrong is to not have the same tax lawyers has been your times which broke the story. 2014 is a far more aggressive tax technique, something i've never seen and i was for several years a tax accountant where they made a profit and caught a refund site here. i'm not sure they are in a position to critique anybody. bottom line here is net operating loss carry forwards,

there are limits on them. wealthy people can afford to deal with those because they can hire very complex systems. they can get tax accountants, tax lawyers to be ab to take advantage of these provisions that are hard to take advantage of. people look at that and say it's not fair donald trump should have that. i think perfectly fair. alanis is a lost. this is an income tax. it's not fair we don't have it. instead it being in him like they did ask they did guys, let's treat a solid billionaires. give us all that flexibility and make it affordable for all of us use all of our net operating. >> credit card interest and the like. stepping back from this, i think it's going to become a very big issue. certainly the vice presidential debate tomorrow, next week in the second presidential debate comes at a time in the media wouldn't let go of the man from his worry. nothing illegal going on the way

pays a lower tax rate on gain in dividends that is historically lower than income taxes on which year he paid for that amount. people are keen on this. they don't get into this. they don't trust rich guys come especially rich guys like donald trump who are reluctant to reduce their tax in the first place. what will the fallout be? >> we looked at the probability markets before it came on the program here. he's gone from a 33% probability to a 31. it's not because the story in and of itself hurts them. it's because it gives me the excuse. you saw the sunday shows to do another through or for five days about how he didn't release. he did nothing illegal, nothing unethical. the only thing unethical is the tax code is unethical. the tax code favors in some ways favors the rich in other ways that favors the poor. this week as the days of repentance, the beginning of the hebrew council. happy new year to everyone.

don't favor the rich. don't favor the poor. judge righteous judgment. our tax code plays rich against poor. our politicians play rich against poor. maybe they should be the ones repenting this week what they are doing because resentment is high because the tax code is so complicated. a flat, simple tax would make us all in the same position. neil: to say things that make you smart to pay little or no taxes i think really rub salt in the wound to a lot of people here and now. >> that's right. he should say i want to change the code to what i did was perfectly legal, perfectly ethical but i want to change the code so everyone can do it easily and inexpensively. that's on the offense. neil: great seeing you again. donald trump strongest argument that is a great businessman, real clear politics associate editor, would you think?

>> hello? neil: doesn't help his argument, heard his argument? >> you know what, i think the average person who doesn't deal with sums that large and doesn't know about ways to avoid paying taxes and take advantage of all the loopholes. they could look at this and say this is a bro bummer. the trump supporters will stay with him. people and decided that this boy i'm not really fell in love with hillary clinton if they can't choose between them. they don't like either of them. the reaction that trump has this weekend, you know, making fun of hillary almost falling down in the street and talking about whether she was not loyal to her husband. this is the kind of thing that is much more potent in terms of clinton and stability who won't vote for trump. neil: in other words, distracting from his message.

>> it's all going to come down to his temperament. if they don't vote they could win. even if they don't like either so worried about the temperament she can win. neil: now you have reports that a lot of older voters by and large not a crass the board are disenchanted by some of the temperament issues. so how does the correct that? what does he do? >> there is a lot to come with debate. more revelations about the fbi investigation. we will see. there's always a lot of teasing if we see something in a super

damaging. the state department is releasing e-mails that over seven, two days before the debate and again october 21 and finally november 4th, this is all potentially problematic for hillary clinton. donald trump is not intent on staying on message. he shows up more bad stuff and tries to create more bad news to distract from the other bad news. it makes people worry about whether or not they could hold it together as commander-in-chief. neil: do think there's any possibility that my crazy thoughts don't get them much credence on releasing the latest series of bombshells to maybe bargain for a presidential pardon before barack obama leaves office? >> wow, you should write novels. but that sounds like a good.

he has definitely made it sound like he's going to jp some thing that could disqualify her. if he hold pardon we should wonder about that. neil: you can run without if you want. if you're looking for services beyond you. real clear politics associate editor columnist thank you very much. with all of these back-and-forth, where do we stand right now with connell mcshane here to break it all down. >> we're going to go through an imap right now. the climb for donald trump in the path for donald trump is getting tougher by the day. new data in postdebate. as you say with a solid blue state aid to a one for hillary clinton. 164 solid red in the states on the map with what we call in our

calling battleground states. here's where it gets a little bit dodgy for trump. of those 13 there are five dead leaning towards the democratic side. pennsylvania is blaming in the data shows on the blue side. the same goes for michigan, wisconsin and once we quickly color in the size dave, we already have to work with about 260 electoral votes. in terms of state bleeding rat, there's new data with the battleground states. the data shows its leaning more towards the red to the blue side of the things a donald trump state. this is where we think the race stands today with the precious data we have. 201-264 for clinton. just a 170. the precious data out thought to be a tossup in southwestern colorado. here it is. this is a great number for hillary clinton.

just a mutt a few minutes ago. 49% for clinton, 30% for donald trump in a four-way race and include gary johnson and jill stein. if that is accurate and it is, we should say a fairly big if, you start to take colorado out of the tossup column and make it a blue state. more than 200 votes. donald trump has a pass. we should point out in the real clear politics average of before we started to work through this number was basically dead even. if this poll is right and moves into the blue column and makes it much more difficult for trump. we could reset the map and start working for possibilities and there are some for donald trump and he has to pick a plain blue state or maybe one that isn't looking so hot right now. neil: in the beginning i didn't hear whether the post resolution of the tax return. >> in terms of the overall

polling and the new polling we have come we talked about this over the weekend does include you. post today. the tax return story coming out on friday. neil: i imagine that potentially more. >> we're not going to have great data intel this week. neil: thank you, connell mcshane. the new york attorney general who was adding might be violating without proper certification. not onto the order of the charity to stop the fundraising immediately. according to tax records are subsisted entirely on donations from others since 2008 when presumably donald trump gave his last personal donation. adding to the financial woes here. next to the tax return that

showed nearly $1 billion loss. we will have more after this. you can run an errand. (music playing) ♪ push it real good... (announcer vo) or you can take a joyride. bye bye, errands, we sing out loud here. siriusxm. road happy. across new york state, from long island to buffalo, from rochester to the hudson valley, from albany to utica, creative business incentives, infrastructure investment, university partnerships, and the lowest taxes in decades are creating a stronger economy and the right environment in new york state for business to thrive. let us help grow your company's tomorrow- today at business.ny.gov

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>> a think of terseness been sniffing all night. gina, gina. >> secretary clinton, what do you think about that? >> i think i'm going to be president. neil: luscious a hillary clinton got the better of data in a skit on "saturday night live" or at least those playing the respective characters here. does that go a little too far? act during supporter saying you

know, there is a double standard when it comes to how the media portrays these guys. good to have you back. >> neil, welcome back. neil: thank you very much. you don't like the way the media plays this. they always make a bigger joke. they took some jabs at hillary clinton but by and large they took a lot more jobs and pollock baldwin playing donald trump. >> yeah, i didn't see the whole show. i saw some clips, but it's so one-sided it's incredible. you can make fun of me all you want. it seems to make conservatives have a better sense of humor than liberals. liberals get so offended by every little thing you say about them. the media and television shows and movies is incredibly one-sided. i'm not saying that from a conservative view. neil: you are a conservative factor. i had seen meson between two foreign, the web show hillary

clinton tested on. your name came up. i want you to react to this. >> any regrets over lucinda scott al vote. >> not one. >> it was heartbreaking? >> yeah, but tchotchke. who's going to be next? neil: okay, maybe there's something we miss there, but i have a feeling we didn't. what did you make of that? we dismissed it. >> a couple of things. first of all i think that a-alpha not just for putting me on the show. secondly, i'm a little concerned hillary clinton even knows who i am in it seems time on the clinton radar screen and a place i really don't want to be because people tend to disappear around the clintons that don't agree with them. >> obviously you are not happy with the attention you're getting. you know you've got a convention, a lot of stuff you

said pretty blonde, speak your mind. hasn't hurt you put the stuff you said? people would've known you for years know you're passionate about this sort of stuff. did you lose any deals, any endorsements cannot any social contract as a result? >> not that i'm aware of. i haven't done anything in a couple of years only because i don't want to. i don't feel like doing anything. neil: i admire that. >> hey, whatever. i've been working since i am nine years old. the thing that people tell me is this. well, he can't get a job. my thought, which is true is i've got an 8-year-old daughter to raise. i've got a wife with a brain tumor, okay? there is more things in my life than my career. it is my wife and make it and it's getting donald trump elected president. neil: are you worried on the

latter that might not have been that bween the tax flows and now people are looking into his charitable foundation, that they are not letting up and they're going to keep pounding. he is added to it, talking about a beauty contestants wait, what have you that he's gotten off message and now this is what's being found. >> i tell you what i really believe. i think all of this helps them because they think at a certain point there's a tipping point where good people in this country i guess the deplorable people in this country get a belly full of it and say this is beyond the pale going a little too far. the thing that kills me is donald trump is a $900 million in taxes and sort of getting out of it legally as a scandal that "the new york times" doing something illegal is not a scandal. at some point we wake up for this country goes right down the

toilet. neil: do you think it shows a double standard? how was his namesake. it substituted donald trump for apple or cisco or general motors, companies and giving years. we wouldn't look twice. these are things that happen. >> when she had some losses, they lost $6 billion of our money and nobody seems to give a whit about that. this guy lost his own money and then rebounded because that is what this country is all about. not at the billion dollars level. he lost everything and he didn't ask anything from anybody to pick himself up and he kept

going and raised three quids. neil: did he write off those losses? >> i was three. i don't recall. i don't remember. he kept going. if it was apple would anybody be same bill? no because he's running for president. because he's a a republican college supplanted by a thousand, if this is hillary clinton and she lost $900,000 try to write about for $900 million try to write it off, no big deal. she didn't do anything illegal. neil: do you think we should have released all of this? >> i don't know because i don't know what his lawyer was saying to him. i can answer that question. yes, maybe. no, maybe. i don't know. i'm not him. he's a smarter guy than me.

i think he's going to win this thing. i really do. neil: you've got a good guy. you were with him when no one was. scott liz, best of luck. >> say it again? neil: best of luck at home. >> thank you. good to see you. neil: hillary clinton expected to make a major address on the economy and other such issues in ohio. we suspect some of these issues like donald trump's taxes might come up. stick around. you are watching "cavuto." i've invested a lot in this game and the returns i get out are measured in reps,

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. . neil: all right. we are awaiting a hillary clinton speech on the economy in which she is expected to at least comment on the donald trump tax situation. josh earnest just told reporters at white house, you have you heard the president mention on

number of occasions he wants to talk about tax fairness in our code. obviously going on to say he still believes that is the case. this illustrates with donald trump that it is not the case. that is my quirk surmisal of that. let's get a read oall of this with john tamney, real clear markets editor, dan shaffer, shaffer asset management. first on the political developments, i want to get what is roiling banking issues. dan, to you what is happening now with this race that seems to be getting problematic for donald trump? >> well i -- neil: dan, i don't think he is good. john tamney is. john, what do you make of this? >> well i think trump's got to brag about it. first of all got to remind people that the reason we have this scenario whereby people don't pay taxes is because republicans and democrats have made a mockery of the tax code over the past 100 years.

but i think what he also got to remind voters it is not good when people pay taxes. when we hand over money to the federal government, we get programs like medicare that start out as $3 billion programs but will cost us taxpayers a trillion dollars in just a few years. better if money is kept out of washington than in washington. we want more scenarios like this. not less. neil: nevertheless, when he makes comments as he does, this makes me smart avoiding taxes and that sort of thing, which might be the case, a lot of people chafe at that saying i don't have that opportunity and you sound full of yourself saying that you do. how does that boomerang on him? or do supporters know this but won't be changed by this, independents won't be moved one way or the other, or what? >> he has to come back with a basic question why does the tax codis crime nate against me or others because we're rich? neil: okay.

>> why because we have billions of dollars that we owe more than you? have we somehow taken more from the country than you have? have we given less to the country that you have. i don't think that is good argument. i think jeff bezos has given a lot more to the company than donald trump. i don't think they owe more in taxes than i do. neil: well-put. hillary clinton will mention this in her economic speech in toledo, ohio. there are indications she has gained in a lot of polls since the debate. what do you think as someone who wants to get this back on issues, donald trump has to do, even his running mate has to do to make this right? >> well, this may or may not come off well but i think, to thine own self-be true. what is donald trump good at? he is good insulting opponent. and good at put-down, when it comes to policies, ideas and proposals that are good, he is not good explaining them. he is however good at putting

down his opponents. he has to bring this back what he is good at, pointing out all the flaws in hillary. he also has to point out how hillary got her wealth. she got her wealth because she can move around a $4 trillion on the backs of taxpayers. he got his wealth in the business world in proverbial arena. start talking about that stop talking about the other stuff. neil: what about the deutsche bank other stuff, banking other stuff, fears of a meltdown other stuff? it dramatically affected 2008 race? do you think it could happen in 2016. >> it has the potential but only if government intervenes. 2008 wasn't a problem because banks failed. that is sign of capitalistic health. what made 2008 something globally scary was government intervened and greated a great deal of uncertainty. the same idea he. shameful of the u.s. federal government for going after deutsche bank. let markets fix these things. but a bank failure on its own can never cause a financial crisis.

only governments by intervening can cause crises. neil: john tamney, thank you very much. very good seeing you. my apologies to dan shaffer. we couldn't get that technically going. i apologize for that. mean while we're waiting to hear from hillary clinton. she will outline her plan to get the economy going even stronger. she is expected though to hit donald trump on those taxes. keep in mind that there is nothing illegal or turid mr. trump did if we believe the 1995 tax returns and nearly billion dollar loss, that could have meant and might still mean he paid no taxes since. we'll see what she says. it is now a hot political issue. democrats want to keep it that way. ates software, used by this bank, to protect this customer, who lives here and flies to hong kong, to visit this company that makes smart phones, used by this vice president, this little kid, oops, and this obstetrician, who works across the street from this man,

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neil: all right. she is on time in toledo, ohio, hillary clinton responding to latest developments, no doubt donald trump taxes as well in a planned economic speech in this crucial state. >> i am so greatful to have this chance to talk to you about what we can do together to have the kind of economy that works for everyone, not just those at the top. i want to acknowledge we have an overflow crowd in another room and i know they can hear us. and we're glad they're here. [cheering] i want to thank your congresswoman, marcy captor, for

her leadership, his -- [cheering] want to thank mayor paula hicks hudson. and the mayor told me there is a young man here who just won a boxing championship, robert easter. where isobert easter? there you are, robert easter. congratulations. [applause] i know toledo is proud of you. we all are. i want to thank kenyatta, for that introduction. do we have any other uaw members here? [cheering] it's a great day to be here in ohio for a lot of different reasons. one is i am so thrilled that lebron james endorsed me and joined our campaign. [cheering] i've gotten a lost wonderful --

a lot of wonderful endorsements for the past year-and-a-half and i'm grateful to each and everyone of them but i got to say there is something special about this one. and it is a real lon in in -- honor in part why he chose to endorse me. not everyone knows this. everyone knows he is amazing athlete, mvp, winner of championships but he is also, lebron is also a dedicated advocate for children. [cheering] and this afternoon i will be in akron where he has done so much for the kids in that community. it's a deep personal commitment he has that i share with him. we both believe every single child should have the chance to live up to his or her god-given potential. [cheering] i could not be prouder to have

lebron joining our team as we head into the homestretch. now, one thing i know, i'll just say it, because i know it's for sure. i hope to be elected president but i know, here in ohio lebron will always be the king! [cheers and applause] i was listening to kenyatta introduce me and i appreciate what she said. toledo is the kind of place where people work hard, look after one another. yes, pay their tax, right? [applause] you recognize we all the have to do our part because we are all in this together and it matters. we believe honest work deserves honest pay. we believe everyone has the right to join a strong union that has your back. [applause]

it's personal for me. i'm the granddaughter of a factory worker from scranton, pennsylvania. he went to work in the same lace mill every day for 50 years. he believed, he passed it down to my dad, who passed it down to me, that if he did what he was supposed to do, he would have a good life and his kids would have an even better life. that is the american dream. that is what we believe in. that is what has got to keep going, generation after generation. and because of my grandfather's hard work, my dad made it to college. and then after serving in the navy in world war ii he started his own small business printing fabric for draperies. as a young girl i would sometimes go to the print plant t was a long building. no natural light. no windows. but he had these long tables where he would roll out the fabric and i'd watch him work with silk screens, if you have ever seen that he would take the silk screen. he would put it down.

he would pour the paint in. take the squeegee, go across end of one table then over to the next table, all the way back. if there was a second color to be added he would do that. sometimes let me help with the squeegee. that was my favorite part. [laughter] and i know, he worked really hard. he worked really hard. he believed in hard work. he passed that on to me. he provide ad good middle class life for us. so i am proud to stand with hard-working families all over toledo, ohio, and america who should have the same chance that i did to share in the american dream which should be big enough for everybody. [applause] fighting for kids and families

has been the cause of my life as kenyatta when i went to work for the children's defense fund all those years ago. it will be the mission of my presidency, i want to focus on what are called kitchen table issues, ones that keep you up at night, like cost of child care and college and prescription drugs and so much else. [applause] that means we've got to create more good jobs, with rising incomes. that means we've got to have good schools in every zip code. that means everybody willing to work and i say that very clearly, you got to be willing to work. and if you're willing to work, you should be able to get ahead and stay ahead. that is the basic bargain. [cheering] i don't know about you but you wouldn't think the theme of my campaign, getting an economy to work for everyone, not just

those at the top would be controversial. yet, this is one of the defining debates, not just of this election but of our time. i will say most american companies, most, run by honorable patriotic people who care about their employees and communities but there are still too many powerful interests fighting to protect their own profits and privileges at the expense of everyone else. they are aided and abetted by rules and incentives that encourage people at top to take advantage of consumers, workers, small businesses and taxpayers. that makes it tougher for the well-meaning ceos to take the high road. and it gets even harder when we

don't aggressive enforce the rules. when we don't enforce trade rules with other question countries with lower wages an standards to get a fair leg up. when we don't exert rules on wall street that exert tremendous pressure on publicly-traded companies to boost share price prices in the short term rather than building real value investing in plant and workers and equipment in the long term. let's be honest, the tax code rewards corporations for outsourcing jobs and their profits overseas instead of investing here in the united states. and -- [applause] it is riddled with loopholes that let the rich get even richer and make income inequality even worse. it tilts the playing field further against small businesses

that can't afford lawyers and lobbyists. so with all these pressures pushing in the wrong direction, it is even more important we have an election about these very issues. because what i know will happen, if we have an election where we have an agenda that actually would begin to level that playing field, we will rebuild the middle class, we will make work pay, we will create a greater opportunities for a great percentage of americans! [cheers and applause] i know how hard this is. i think we're on the cusp, if we win this election, to be able to get these things done. right? [shouting] that means pursuing reforms that unleash the enormous positive

potential of the american private sector. we've got unmatched talent, innovation, entrepreneurial spirit. >> that's right. >> so when we work together we can all benefit. now i believe corporations that benefit from everything america has to offer should feel some sense of responsibility, not just, not just to the biggest shareholders, to their workers, to their customers, to their communities, and yes to our country, to the united states of america! [applause] we have been, we have been moving off track for decades. i don't need to tell you that. you've lived it, you have seen it but it is time to get back on track. [cheering] you can ask anybody who has ever

worked for me or worked with me, whoever served with me, when i tell you i'm going to try to do something, i will get up every single day and work my heart out for you. [cheering] let's begin making it clear for most businesses america is the most important asset on their balance sheet, this country of ours. this system of ours, the rule of law. the opportunity to get an education and go as far as your hard work and ambition will take you. we created the biggest engine of economic growth in the world, the american middle class. so when the middle class thrives, the country thrives. and when it doesn't, we don't, right? [applause]

i will use the white house and every tool at my disposal as your president to make the case patriot system profitable. standing up for america, investing in america will pay off. now, we have always had innight straighttores and entrepreneurs who build great companies and create real value but, we should not and we will not respect those who get rich by cheating everybody else. [applause] so today i want to send a clear message to every boardroom, every executive suite across america, if you scam your customers, exploit your employees, pollute our environment or rip off taxpayers, we will find ways to

hold you accountable! [cheers and applause] but on the other side if you do the right thing and you invest in your workers and your communities, and our country's future, we will stand with you. that is the choice. our goal is to make it easier for everyone to do better. now to understand why this is so important, consider the recent examples we've seen of egregious corporate behavior. look at wells fargo. really shocking, isn't it. one of the nation's biggest bank, bullying thousands of employees into committing fraud against unsuspecting customers.

secretly opening up millions of accounts for people without their con sent, even their knowledge. misusing personal information and then sticking customers with hidden fees. it is outrageous that eight years after a cowboy culture on wall street wrecked our economy, we are still seeing powerful bankers playing fast and loose with the law. and then in a category by himself, there is donald trump. [booing] you may have heard he long released to release his tax returns the way every nominee for president has done for decades. you can look at 40 years of my tax return. we need a law, that says if you become a nominee of the major party, you have to release your tax returns. [cheers and applause]

now a a lot of us were wondering what is he lying? it must be terrible. "the new york times""new york tt of the answer. back in 1990s, trump lost a billion dollars in a single year on bad investments and failing casinos. now how anybody can lose a dollar, let alone a billion dollars in the casino industry is kind of beyond me, right? [applause] it is just hard to figure. but as a result, doesn't look like he paid a dime of federal income tax for almost two decades. now while millions of americans families, including mine and yours were working hard, paying our fair share, it seems he was contributing nothing to our

nation. imagine that. not fair, nothing for pell grants to help kids go to college. nothing for veterans. nothing for our military. you know, he has been dissing america in this whole campaign. right? he talks us down. he makes disparaging comments about our country. he calls our military a disaster. well it's not but it might have been if everybody else failed to pay taxes to support our great men and women in uniform. [applause] i, i saw a newspaper article and gentleman named steve crouse who owns the glass city cafe here in toledo. he sums it up pretty well in this article. i would file guilty if i didn't pay anything.

it is flat-out cheating the government. my friend bernie sanders was right yesterday, when he said trump reflects a distorted view of the american people and what this country is all about. [applause] trump represents the same rigged system that he claims he is going to change. the whole story tells us everything we need to know about how trump does business. after he made all those bad bets and lost all that money, he didn't lift a finger to help and protect his employees. or all the small businesses and contractors he had hired. or the people of atlantic city. they all got hammered, while he was busy with his accountants trying to figure out how he could keep living like a billionaire. and all the while he was using his political connections to

collect hundreds of millions of dollars in government subsidies and extra tax breaks for his companies. in other words, trump was taking from america with both hands and leaving the rest of us with the bill. [applause] [booing] now he says that he is the one who can fick things but that is like letting the fox guard the henhouse, right? here is what i am really just stunned by. i get stunned every day in this campaign but, here is one of the many things i am stunned by, that would cut his own taxes even more. that would like paying zero. you expect us to pay you staying business all the rest of us in america? he opened up loopholes even wider.

according to a new independent study, he would actually listen to this, people, because this is a real shocker, his plan would actually raise taxes for millions of middle-class families. [booing] whose lives and challenges he doesn't care about, certainly doesn't understand. >> right. >> now, many have likely already spent years paying more than he did, and he now would make that even worse. what does he say about it? y'all see the debate about it last monday? [cheers and applause] >> hillary, hillary. >> in the debate, in the debate --

[shouting] >> hillary. hillary! >> then you all know in the debate he said it was smart to avoid paying taxes. [booing] yesterday his campaign was bragging it makes him a genius. here's my question. what kind of genius lose as billion lars in a single -- loses a billion dollars in a single year. he abuses power, games the system, puts his own interests ahead of the country's. it is trump first and everyone else last. and there are lots of principled law-abiding business leaders out there who are horrified by all of this. not a single, not a single ceo of a fortune 100 company

supports trump's campaign. [applause] think about it. i've been endorsed by very successful people. warren buffett, mike bloomberg. mark cuban. i love what mark cuban said when he endorsed me. i've been successful. he is actually a real billionaire. [shouting] you know what? he used profit-sharing to help his employees. not bankrupting to fire people. when he sold his first company he shared profits with his employees and 300 of them became millionaires. that is the kind of business practices i want to see more of in our country. [applause]

here's what we got to do, even if trump is one of a kind, we have to reverse the broader trends he wants to continue. we need to rewrite the rules and make the economy bitter for everyone. i want to briefly share my plan for protecting taxpayers, consumers, small businesses. we'll crack down on worst corporate abuses and empower companies willing to take the high road to invest in good jobs in higher wages and in stronger communities. first, let's start with protecting taxpayers. making sure we have more fairness in the system. it is wrong that corporations and super wealthy play by a different set of rules. a wall street money manager should not be able to pay a lower tax rate than a teacher or a nurse. [cheers and applause]

i tell you what. our largest companies should not be able to get away with paying hardly anything at all. it is insulting when they engage if these games, moving their headquarters to a foreign country, on paper, not in reality, just to take advantage of lower tax rates. it is infuriating when they take tax breaks with one hand and give out pink slips in the america with the other hand. here is the what we're going to do. we're going to close those loopholes. i have a list of them we're going after. we'll make wall street and corporations and super-rich and make sure they pay their taxes. we'll have the "buffett rule," that corporate millionaires can not pay lower rates than their secretaries and other people working for them. [applause] we're going to put in place a new exit tax.

if companies try to leave our country, to avoid paying their fair share, if they try to outsource jobs, they're going to have to give back every tax break they ever received in our country. [applause] then we'll put the money to work creating opportunities here in america. second we'll protect consumers. no american should ever be taken of advantage of. this isn't a new fight for me. as a senator i raised alarm about subprime mortgages. i fought to held reckless manufacturers accountable for toxic toys and household products that threaten our kids. i introduced legislation to protect americans personal data and combat identity theft. so as president i will make consumer protection a top priority across the entire government. [applause]

and that starts by defending and empowering the consumer financial protection bureau which was created after the financial crisis. and the principle person who got it created was senator elizabeth warren. [cheers and applause] and under the leadership of ohio's rich cordray. [applause] the agency has already returned more than $11 billion to more than 15 million who were ripped off by predatory lenders, credit card companies and others. it is making sure defrauded wells fargo customers get their money back. i'm so proud of what the new agency has done.

what does the government do? there are a lot of examples but this is the primary one. standing up to make sure consumers get paid back when they are ripped off. because of its success, republicans in congress keep trying to shut it down. and donald trump agrees with them. in fact he wants to scrap all of the tough new rules imposed on wall street after the crisis. while not on my watch, donald. we're never going to let that happen. >> hillary! hillary! hillary! >> instead of gutting consumer protection we should expand it. we should build on the dodd-frank financial reforms and go even further. because wall street can never ever be permitted to threaten main street again. the wells fargo scandal sheds light on another threat to

consumers we have to address. when the scammed victims, people like you and me, who had accounts there, tried to sue, they were shocked to learn there was a provision in the very fine print of their contracts that kept them from going to court to sue the bank for being cheated. instead they are forced into a closed-door, a operation process without the -- arbitration process without the protections you get in a court of law. . . [cheers and applause] this is common practice across a lot of industries from nursing homes, nursing homes that mistreat seniors, defraud students, you know, who reads

all of that fine print? i don't. and you get defrauded or you get mistreated and then all of a sudden they say, you can't sue us. we are going to reign in that abuse. [applause] >> it sets up a dispute resolution system that favors large corporations over everyone el. that's one of the reasons i'm against it. i warned about this for years and i opposed ttp now and i will oppose to it as a president because it's one-sided to american workers. [cheers and applause] >> what about pharmaceutical companies that jack up prices for no reason?