deeper into the planet surface then nasa has ever gone before. that is cool! >> it is cool. no elon musk this time around. [laughter] 70 percent he says that he will end up on mars at some point. they go. but that is cool. >> i cannot wait to see what it finds. that does it for us. >> thank you for joining us today and every day. "bulls & bears" starts right now. >> hi everybody, this is "bulls & bears" thank you for joining me today. i am david. today on our panel, we are going to get right to it. president trump slamming gm's decision to cut 15 percent of the salary in the workforce in north america also pretended to

and production of so selling vehicles in ohio, michigan and ontario. some of those may shut down. let's listen to what the president said. >> i believe they will be opening up something else . i was very stuff, ispoke with her when i heard they were closing. i said you know this country has done a lot for general motors, you better get in there soon .and you better get back in there soon so we have a lot of pressure you have senators and a lot of other people, a lot of pressure. they say the chevy cruze is not selling well. i say then get a car that is selling well and put it back in.so i think you will see something else happen there. but i'm not happy about it. >> the her is the head of gm. they are up five percent on the initial news but for the presidents micromanagement of gm hurt the company in the long run? what do you think? >> you know, i think that she is getting out in front of some slowdowns economically as well is a shift in the business if you think about millennials, a

lot of them cannot afford to buy cars, a lot of them are using uber and lyft. this tariff talk is giving her the perfect cover to use tariffs as a shield. >> i would agree on one side with what she was saying about the economic side. the stock spoke for itself today but i just got off the phone tim ryan. the overseas, it is the plan. >> that is his baby. >> understatement. he just wrote a letter to the house ways and means and he wants to have a congressional investigation on how they use their taxpayer-funded dollars. with the recent tax cut. he is also very upset with president trump because he thinks that president trump gave corporate america a free ride without any new strings attached. there is going to be a lot of being said to this. >> there's too much interference in corporate america now. i think the president is to

slow his role. there is reality here, demand heading down. reality that easy credit that is fueled a lot of this auto stuff to the last seven or eight years which i believe is up 65 percent, is now over. there is a reality that you have too many people and too many plants. we have a corporation you have to adjust to reality and president trump needs to know that.and if he wants to put gm back in bankruptcy, it is a big mistake. >> i agree. using the president, sherrod brown and as robert just pointed out congressman tim ryan all speaking on the same page. when you're looking at what's going on with gm and the auto sales at large, i don'tactually see a reflection of tariffs here at all. what you're seeing is that consumers are making a preference and a choice and that is that they're not buying

sedans, they not buying cars. they buy and cross overs . while a question the decision the nancy writebol for the holidays i think it was ill-timed but there, any remaining sedans will shift to the plants where there are manufacturing suvs and cross over vehicles that people are buying. we've also seen sustained record high levels of auto sales over the past two years. every economist is predicting the numbers will go down. gm is getting ahead of what they are saying is auto sales that will decline. they're shifting where the market wants which is crossovers and suvs. >> robert was speaking to a democrat because the presence language sounds kind of like a democrat. he says they better damn well open up a new plant there quickly. speaking of ohio. he says i love ohio, i told him you're playing around with the wrong person. it is kind of unusual for an a republican -- >> you are talking about michigan and ohio. [laughter] you have michigan and ohio where you know the president sees this as a talking point

for both sides. it will be interesting. >> addict probably could not win reelection where he not able to carry ohio. >> ian carried the entire -- >> and this is -- >> sorry. >> if you go back to gary's point about government interference, this is a long line of interference per these are jobs that we have paid six figures a piece to save and another coming back around again. we need to let the free market do what they need to do and we need to stop having this interference from the president picking winners and losers in the economy. >> at least to the next question. who's next? what is donald trump want to go after next? was an s corporation they don't like that moves out of one city or state where they put a product that they do not like or they do like. this is crazy. the greatness of this country is the ability of companies and people to create unfettered, we have too much fetter it can be a big mistake.

>> it is something addictive when they begin to micromanage. kennedy did it with the steel industry.president obama did with the auto industry. i think the taxpayer had about a loss of $10 billion. >> go ahead morgan.>> one of the plants at their closing in michigan is a plant thatmakes the chevy volt . which has been a complete flop. no one wants to buy it. think of electric cars, we direct to consumer preference the united states never has gotten about three percent of citizens buying chevy bolt or anything electric. or anything like that. so consumers are just saying, we don't want these hybrid vehicles, we do not want the electric vehicles. we are not interested in that right now. the gas is just too low, an suv and crossovers have become quite efficient. >> of two points. one from a capitalist

perspective, at the end of the day, ford had terrible earnings and they are cutt earnings had sales but higher margin because of the suvs. so we saw the signs coming. on the political side i understand why president trump is asserting himself because think of the romney, obama campaign. when romney said it was against the auto bailout, that was the end of him winning michigan and ohio. so i'm not surprised that president obama is going to be tough on gm right now. >> let me go back to what i said also. a lot of the moving auto sales through the years has been on the easy credit, easy money bandwagon. that has ended. you can get interest rates, what they've done when they took them down to what happened to auto sales. straight up. that is no ending and all of these auto companies are going to have to adjust to reality.

and president trump i understand the politics but he's not dealing with reality. he will end up hurting the company more than helping them. [multiple speakers] >> garrity said the president is not dealing with reality. i should have the show right now. [laughter] >> he is done with politics. that's what this is all about. but could this lead to an ultimate attempted bailout? if he forces gm to do the wrong thing, it would inevitably taxpayers have to come into bail him out again?>> increasing tariffs and say this will be a good thing and this will be a win, turning around and having to do a bailout, i'm think anybody will stand for that. certainly, he would never be reelected under that platform. i just do not see how that happens. >> i don't think we are going near that right now. the only place in the country -- at the moment, california's only place that buys these

electric vehicles. if you want to get government mandate and people involved, i guess you can force everyone to follow california to buy a chevy both. >> gm is taking money you know, this cash flow and putting into electric cars. >> that was in the announcement today not that it was weird, it makes no sense based off with what the market shows people are buying. >> tesla would disagree with you. i think tesla shows that there is an appetite for an electric car. >> a $100,000 car. >> will talk about tesla coming up. thank you. up next, stocks surging back into the green today. was it just a cyber monday boost or did it last until the end of the year? wouldn't that be nice? but some give their clients cookie cutter portfolios. fisher investments tailors portfolios

to your goals and needs. some only call when they have something to sell. fisher calls regularly so you stay informed. and while some advisors are happy to earn commissions whether you do well or not. fisher investments fees are structured so we do better when you do better. maybe that's why most of our clients come from other money managers. fisher investments. clearly better money management.

each day our planet awakens but with opportunity comes risk.

and to manage this risk, the world turns to cme group. we help farmers lock in future prices, banks manage interest rate changes and airlines hedge fuel costs. all so they can manage their risks and move forward. it's simply a matter of following the signs. they all lead here. cme group - how the world advances. comcast business built the nation's largest gig-speed network. then went beyond. beyond chasing down network problems. to knowing when and where there's an issue. beyond network complexity. to a zero-touch, one-box world. optimizing performance and budget. beyond having questions. to getting answers. "activecore, how's my network?" "all sites are green." all of which helps you do more than your customers thought possible. comcast business. beyond fast. >> is the correction over asked

of last week's big sell off some were selling off the whole economy saying that this was just a big landing of a long-term economic contraction but look at what happened today. big action today. does today's bullish action in the recession bears were all wrong? what you think? >> david, you know i've been one of the big bears all the way down. i think price today hates that

we have seen a low for now and i think that we probably will have a decent december. i don't know if we will skyrocket from here but i saw enough people turning very bearish and the end of the world is probably not a hand. i saw enough to tell me i think we will get some upside testing in the weeks ahead.then i will reevaluate. >> you know, i've never really been a bear , always been a baby cub. you hit the be the bearer of bad tidings, no pun intended. i don't think we will get a no santa claus rally. i don't think companies are incentivized to say we will get a boost in earnings. you will not see multiple expansion.we just had the president doubled down on tariffs potentially with iphones. i don't think were getting trade relief. that means you're hanging your

hat on the fed and at the end of the day i think that the potus has been very, sticking her nose in the middle things i think in and i think it incentivizes -- >> there was an interview lesson hour ago that he was talking about possible tariffs on iphones come from china. he said i can make it 10 percent and people could stand that very easily. >> fabulous! [laughter] >> this most make a dead cat -- you have oil conversations between russia and the middle east, the way i view this tax 2.0 is dead. gdp will have a slowdown. we are already expecting third-quarter to be slow and you have the fed hike rates looming. i do not see the bull market continue. i think we also continued volatility. >> i am with robert. i'm really looking to see what happens at the g 20. it doesn't look like the president is ready to take his heel off of the neck of the chinese. at least at this point we will

see what comes out of the meeting because he does like to make a deal. but there are a lot of things to be optimistic about the economy. that's where that consumer optimism numbers and business confidence still coming in at high numbers even though we have seen volatility in the market. people are still overall encouraged by the economy, businesses are encouraged that regulation is not strangling them. i think holistically we are seeing many encouraging signs. people are looking for any reason just aloft. >> i have two points in your favor. one is that there was just a survey of economists of the wall street journal looking at third-quarter growth because they're coming out with another print this week. or least a look back at third-quarter growth. they are steady. they think it will stay at 3 and a half percent which is not a recessionary economy. and the retail sales over the weekend look pretty good. >> i am not a bull, and is not as bearish anymore. and just realize we just dropped 2000 points in one half

days so we are due to balance. my biggest issue is not necessarily here, it is the euro zone. germany contracting and you also have japan contracting and if germany's contract and what about the rest of europe? that is going on while interest rates are still negative and they are still printing money. not to mention what we are seeing in italy, paris and brexit. i think the big issues come from here and i don't think we will be immune as we move forward. >> gary brings up a good point on europe. i was a positive signs on brexit so far with the announcement by theresa may today and the far right and the uk doesn't like it but i'm looking to geopolitically, what happens if this russia and ukraine crisis. germany still clearly wants to buy gas en masse from russia. there's a lot of political instability there. it relates to russia and ukraine that could affect the gas market. >> by the way one thing suggested with that there may be some deal with china at the g 20 meeting on natural gas. maybe manufacture more of these facilities for our liquid natural gas, etc. something like that might happen.

>> it is possible, david. but i want to go back to robert for a second because if you come back to the consumer in the us, even though there is consumer optimism, don't feel like it is already priced into the market? and do you think there's enough optimism to push growth into the double-digit arena where we can see multiple expansion from here. >> i am nervous there's no question. i was going to chime in. thank you for this. we had the.com bubble that came in that was last time we saw this type of consumer confidence level. the answer is that we cannot predict that consumer confidence is going to predict where the markets are going. yes, we probably have some decent christmas sales but as gary pointed out there is still a high ability to use credit cards and i think we'll talk later on the show how people are taking cash out -- >> the investment workers has been

extraordinary. it ain't for nothing that we more jobs than people. looking for jobs. because for every person that company hires, they have to be $10,000, huge investment for companies that made for the long-term expansion, right? >> you're getting at the same time that we are getting information coming out from gm today about the layoff of workers. you're still getting very low weight expansion and if you talk to americans, they are not feeling that level of wealth which i think is one of the reasons why they are going to the credit side of things in order to try to feel a little bit more well-off. i don't think that is translating at the level that perhaps we had hoped it would. >> wages feel good off literally, the worst scenario that we've seen in eight years where there has been no wage increase. it is still actually trending at or below inflation. we've only had one good quarter where we are excited about wages. it hasn't been more than that. >> but hold on, we have had a

real good economy over the last year. very strong gdp, unemployment has been very low. if that can continue i think the market can resolve itself. my worry is the economic cycle, upwards and downwards has not been extinguished and i think we may be in for some reckoning here. because of how much debt, how much deficit and again, a lot of countries around the globe right now are in pretty big trouble because of that. >> bacarri we all applaud where employment is. let's be clear, there's a huge skills gap. a tremendous amount of jobs available but the participation rate is still around 63 percent. so it is not all of a sudden there are these new jobs being filled. they are not being filled. in reaction have a skills gap to fill the jobs. >> will also, there is a reason companies spent $10,000 per employee because a lot of training is going on right now and hopefully the training will play out in terms of our increase in production skills. >> i mean i think to back up what robert just said that's

always the amazon chose where they chose because everywhere else they look they could not find the skilled workers that they need. and if congress doesn't like to get anything done in a bipartisan fashion in the next two years which they probably won't -- >> you just depressed me! if we have to depend on congress for anything i don't think it will work.up next, what 8/10 homeowners are doing with their mortgages that someone could backfire. details coming up.

metastatic breast cancer is relentless, but i'm relentless too. mbc doesn't take a day off, and neither will i. and i treat my mbc with new everyday verzenio- the only one of its kind that can be taken every day. in fact, verzenio is a cdk4 & 6 inhibitor for postmenopausal women with hr+, her2- metastatic breast cancer, approved, with hormonal therapy, as an everyday treatment for a relentless disease. verzenio + an ai is proven to help women have significantly more time without disease progression, and more than half of women saw their tumors shrink vs an ai. diarrhea is common, may be severe, and may cause dehydration or infection. before taking verzenio, tell your doctor if you have fever, chills, or other signs of infection. verzenio may cause low white blood cell counts, which may cause serious infection

that can lead to death. serious liver problems can occur. symptoms may include tiredness, loss of appetite, stomach pain, and bleeding or bruising more easily than normal. blood clots that can lead to death have also occurred. talk to your doctor right away if you notice pain or swelling in your arms or legs, shortness of breath, chest pain or rapid breathing or heart rate. tell your doctor if you are pregnant, breastfeeding, or plan to become pregnant. common side effects include nausea, infections, low red and white blood cells and platelets, decreased appetite, headache, abdominal pain, tiredness, vomiting, and hair thinning or loss. i'm relentless. and my doctor and i choose to treat my metastatic breast cancer with verzenio. be relentless. ask your doctor about everyday verzenio. and all thro' the house. 'twas the night before christmas, not a creature was stirring, but everywhere else... there are chefs, bakers and food order takers. doctors and surgeons and all the life savers. the world is alive as you can see, this time of the year is so much more than a bow and a tree. (morgan vo) those who give their best,

deserve the best. get up to a $1,000 credit on select models now during the season of audi sales event. >> we saw the same thing

happened just before the financial crisis of 2008. homeowners trading in their old mortgage for a new one with a higher interest rate in order to cash in on the houses equity. more than 80 percent of homeowners who refinanced this third-quarter chose this method of cashing out withdrawing about $14.6 billion in equity out of their homes. lenders say homeowners use the

money for home renovations or sometimes a pair of credit card debt. which now is averaging about 18 percent. but is using a home as a source of cash a good idea? or maybe the beginning of another housing crisis. join us to discuss real estate investor, jamison wildwood who cashed on his refinancing. as i understand, he cashed out and you will be paying a little higher interest rate in order to buy more real estate and you know it is the same question that folks asked or failed to ask enough in 2006 and 2007, what happens if prices go down? >> for me it does not actually matter much if prices go down because i look at how much you have to pay per month in a look at how much the other investment is giving me. i'm not planning on selling anytime soon so the actual price of the house doesn't actually matter that much. >> is it me? >> let me ask you something, give any credit card debt? >> me? no.

and you look at this from a pure investment. taking out cash, paying five percent on the new cash. now you are going to roll it into something you think is better than five percent. >> that is exactly right. >> and what you think that this investment will give you? >> well, i looking probably six percent cash on cash and then as the real estate appreciates over long. of time like seven or 10 years, and another four or five percent appreciation annually. >> you can hold onto the property for 7 to 10 years, there a lot of people that may look at this and think, i can cash out, by another property, do the same with that property, etc. that is a tennis team that got us in trouble in 2007 and 2008. you do not think that might happen again?>> it is about risk. like the risk of taking out debt. debt is considered risk and

financial wealth. for me, i don't not have a lot of risk and other payments.i look at the addition had to pay per month for the higher amount of interest and principal rather and i thought it would be a good way to make another investment that i thought was a good deal. >> and so, how do you -- how do you view that in -- in a liquid asset at some point, you have to pay off the principal and then you will not know her rates are we have to roll it or you need to sell the asset if you got a seven year mortgage. >> sure.but that is only considering that it is appreciation is anything that you want to get. i am looking at cash flow, am looking at long-term hold strategy. people have been talking about a recession coming up soon. i am not worried about that because i'm looking at a much longer timescale than what happens in the next two years.

>> i have written about this, i've studied what happened in 07 and 08. it was pretty simple. people were cashing out, taking all kinds of crazy loans. right at the top of the market because of easy money. and now we've had gargantuan easy money for the last 10 years and is repeating itself again. as a real estate investor i'm sure that you've seen this new study that, aren't you worried at all that the house may come down again, no pun intended. >> sure.i mean, i think people use a kind of money for a lot of reasons. sometimes the reasons are not that great. if you're paying off credit card debt with a home equity or putting yourself in a higher risk position. if you are improving your house, with the home equity, maybe it's a little less risky. if you taking a vacation with your home equity is another high-risk activity.you have to look at where the money is

actually going to. i think banks tend to want people to do refinanced because they make money on it. and so they sell the idea that you can do anything you want with it and it is not always a great idea. >> this is carol and i'm glad that you brought that up. i am curious, in terms of looking at all the different investments that you had available to you with the cash he got back, why did you choose to invest in real estate versus investing in stocks or bonds or private equity or crypto or any other class you could have invested in? >> partly that is an understanding issue. and in real estate before but i have no idea about crypto. i have looked into it, it looks crazy to me. i think stocks are pretty high right now. again, we're talking a potentially a recession sometime soon. no one really knows. it could be a big drop in the stock market and to me that sounds like risk. i look at real estate and i think even the people that bought at the very highest level, 06 and 07, they are in

the money right now. for a longer time period -- >> i think we would argue with you on that one. >> the houses that your purchase, are you using it as a rental property or how are you using them? >> i have a couple of rental properties. the house they purchased with this was not actually a house. i went into a partnership at an apartment complex outside of atlanta. that was me making a bet on the city of lansing being you know, low risk type of city for the longer run.and so, a partnership looks like many investors coming together and taking down a really big asset together.and i put into a partnership for that deal. >> we want you to succeed, we are hoping that you succeed. forgive us for being a little cynical because we went to the 2006 crisis but again, best of luck to you. it is a bold move on your part and we wish you all the best. thank you for being here. >> thank you so much. >> paying at the pump has a

friend writing in the streets. so why are liberals fueling a similar effort here at home? it is next when "bulls & bears" returns. an august to remember,

starts with a december to remember at the lexus december to remember sales event. lease the 2019 es 350 for $399 a month for 36 months. experience amazing at your lexus dealer. >> americans thankful enjoying

lower gas prices this season but the trump administration leased the national climate assessment on friday, liberals and some republicans already are clamoring for a carbon tax. take a look at what happened in paris over the weekend. protesters took to the streets to protest a hike andthe already very high gas tax . could the same happen over here? with the carbon tax. what do you think? >> the french love to hate their president. i'm going out on a limb to say that this clearly did not work. what's the difference between what you're seeing france and here? over the election, this was actually california, again a

ballot measure to increase the gas tax in california. california voters voted for it again because they know close infrastructure. so as you pointed out the chamber of commerce, which is not a liberal institution, has also talked about this is that we will need to raise the gas price to pay for restructure. what is the political reality? i do not see the president raising gas taxes anytime soon. but if there is a serious infrastructure package, could something like that be included in order to pay for some of the crumbling and failing infrastructure? potentially. >> anybody wants any more taxes -- let me throw something out. in this year federal, local and state, the great american people spend between 5 to 6 trillion of hard earned tax dollars to them. and they need more. they say they want more.this is crazy!

it is a headwind, the taunting markets in the economy. and the infrastructure thing, i still have to go back to the president obama who said his big spending bill was going to infrastructure and hardly any did. i don't believe a word any of these people say and it is getting tiresome. >> amen!>> amen as well. >> amen! if you look at the two components, you've congress getting something down which we know is not going to happen. then you have a tax and supporting the american consumer. on both sides it is a lose lose. this is a scenario that is not something that could get done, should get done and if it did get done would not be something that worked out. i am with gary on that one. a big amen! >> a couple of things. the cap and trade is being recommended by two republicans. >> fire them! both of them. [laughter]

>> it is funny how democrats -- >> they are already gone. >> in 2008 and 2009 this was recommended by a huge liberal from california. it got shut down then when you had a house of democrats, house of democrats in executive bridge of democrats. it's not happening. that being said is different than a gas taxpayer with respect to the gas tax, if you can charge a penny or two to get it infrastructure, i would respectfully disagree with gary.this could be for another debate. i think it could make -- >> here is how they are similar. i understand gas and carbon taxes will differ from what they have in france but they are the same in that people do not trust politicians to do what they say they're going to do. i think it's that simple. and if emmanuel macron says he's going to use the gas tax to somehow care climate change, the public does not believe it. they say we don't believe you're going to spend that

money and solve that with gas taxpayer chris people are finding that 10 weeks of vacation and 35 hour week's cost something. nothing is free. it has to come from somewhere. so emmanuel macron has to adjust to the situation and of course, they don't like it and that is i think why polling at about 25 percent right now. not too good. but back to this tax. it comes back to one specific question. how much more money are they willing to take out of the economy before the people go nuts? enough is enough at this point in time.>> if you look at with the new york times, they did a story on this end they profiled the people who were coming to protest here. and originally started out as protesting against these higher gas prices. then you see the struggling class of people that can not get work. it is not about not being able to work a 35 hour work week. they do have a living wage, there is not enough were pretty

even hillary clinton the past because criticized the european leaders about dealing with some of the immigration and migrant issues.you have got a lot going on in europe where people feel very frustrated. people that cannot were not saying we only want to work 35 hours, they dislike they do not have a living wage. >> part of the reason they feel that way is that they are paying too much in taxes. one guy interviewed disinherited b,40,000 from his mother had died. 60 percent of that was taxed away. go ahead carol, i'm sorry interrupted. >> i was going right back to your point about not trusting politicians. we've been hearing from the gop forever that they are the fiscally conservative party. and we are waiting for them to be fiscally conservative. there are trillions of dollars, places they can cut spending. trying to add taxes to the equation without addressing the fiscal conservativism is not going over well. >> let me chime in because your give me the best softballs

ever! i mean i am to the right of fiscal conservativism. which with respect to discipline. it's been crazy was going on and now we see we are starting to lose jobs. we need to have a good gop, gdp this week. >> they are not too many but we have them here. thank you gang! pay your taxes with bitcoin? this crypto currency continues to collapse but one state is willing to take the risk. we explained coming up next.

i am a family man. i am a techie dad. i believe the best technology should feel effortless. like magic. at comcast, it's my job to develop, apps and tools that simplify your experience. my name is mike, i'm in product development at comcast. we're working to make things simple, easy and awesome. >>

>> bitcoin dramatic drop in price over the past few trading sessions does not mean the platform it is based is going down as well. overstock.com found is a big supporter. he was on with vernie this morning extolling its potential. take a listen. >> the potential of this revolution is, and has greater potential than anything we've seen in history, 90 percent lower friction cost, complete transparency for the regulators and when they don't have now and immunity from market manipulation. all kinds of mischief that goes on in the current version of wall street cannot even go on in a block chain version of wall street. >> so is this just pie in the

sky? or is he onto somethingand what happens to bitcoin by the way? >> i was am not a fan , it is not backed up and thinks that the agreement of strangers on the internet which is kind of like letting the comments section of the website have their own currency.the funny thing is that now you have these states who are trying to quote - unquote legitimize it by accepting it as payment. i will tell you i think this is a way for them to keep track of anybody who has those assets and make sure they're paying their taxes.i do not think that there is a lot of legitimacy there. i think it is a tax grab. >> i think the states are not taking in bitcoin. last december and the friends you said all of these coins would turn to dust. there is no economic value behind it. even the venezuela came out with them.dennis rodman came out with a pot coin that is now down 97 percent. i expect all of these coins to be gone. it is a central bank induced bubble/mania.

it is absolutely doomed. i cannot believe anybody continues to talk about it or back it. it means they just own it or praying that someone buys it back. >> government is. as you mentioned, ohio has already agreed to allow business taxes. to be paid by some kind of bitcoin currency. >> gary is debbie downer today. as a millennial on the panel -- i think there is a big difference between taking bitcoin in the in the long term benefits of block chain. if you look at the ohio state treasurer, a good friend of mine and also a fellow millennial, who announced this today they are only looking at this is not just taking bitcoin but really the long-term investment that they're making into technology and into block chain in ohio which will totally transform the way we bank and to business. i think robert will definitely be able to speak to the intricacies of block chain -- [multiple speakers]

it is just the future and you arejust old parts . >> the millennial times to because i am double morgan's aid but i will equal be supportive. i truly believe that over time -- >> you have some? >> i have a bunch of different companies and i think over time only part of the asset class. i don't think weather today or tomorrow is the right pricing, we don't know. with respect to -- >> by the way, it is interesting how ohio government could decide to have you pay for something that is moving i mean, your pain with a currency that one day could be $1000 less or more than the next day. i what point does the government freeze it and say this is how much -- >> that may be the at the close of the exchange. there is daily pricing. there is enough liquidity. >> robert, i follow you very carefully.you are one of the most brilliant people i watch on tv. what economic value does

bitcoin and any of these coins have for the future in this economy? i cannot figure it out just yet. >> two things. we said that about amazon when it went down 95 percent. >> no, no, no! >> we did, you would have to go back many years. but we said that about amazon, the whole idea of the you know these have no real intrinsic values . >> those are businesses. you cannot compare a business with a going concern that something that is an asset class supposedly based on the agreement of strangers. let's talk aboutcurrency, this is the ultimate . based on nothing. >> the underlying platform is gas. it all depends on what the underlying platform is. i think bitcoin says just the instrument to future platforms. i would agree with what patrick

i think, -- that protocol, this idea of transparency is the future of business. it can literally intermediate so much of the overhead that we have running a business. and by the way, when equifax went down, okay, look what happened with the idea of crypto. the idea that there was a transparent ledger that everyone could actually think about. we'll thought equifax was all of the end-all. now they have all of our privacy and all of our information in all of these millennials and libertarians are saying my god, we have to do something else. chrysostom knock at the answer and what economic value backs these coins except somebody willing to pay a higher price. >> we have the treasury but i would like to know what you are backing the dollar with other than the treasury? >> we back the dollar -- >> we all -- [multiple speakers] >> the u.s. government requires payment in dollars per the payout in dollars.

>> you have the treasury. >> we are in agreement. >> it is three and half trillion dollars -- [multiple speakers] >> what determines the value worldwide of the u.s. currency is the worldwide market. the u.s. currency, trade in the world market, by the way, so does crypto currency. >> supply and demand! >> i agree, i think it is a similar thing. >> this is down and -- it is now in too few hands and they cannot sell it, they destroy each other this point in time. >> okay, we're not in the market made sense at 20,000. we do not know if it makes sense at 3000. it is just where there are buyers and sellers. it is still early days.

by the way, people bought it when it was under a dollar and you would have been fine. >> okay. >> ohio doing this is a really smart move for the state because ultimately, it was not like they will have 90 percent of ohioans paying in crypto. they're trying to be more forward leaning in technology on block chain and i think it's a smart move. >> if crypto keeps going down you agree to pay when it is 3000 and a close to 1000. >> is a play to get more technology. >> coming up, how elon musk says tesla nearly went bankrupt this year and how he resuscitated it back to life. listen to what he said in a moment. clients cookie cutter portfolios. fisher investments tailors portfolios to your goals and needs. some only call when they have something to sell. fisher calls regularly so you stay informed. and while some advisors are happy to earn commissions whether you do well or not. fisher investments fees are structured so we do better when you do better. maybe that's why most of our clients come from other money managers.

fisher investments. clearly better money management. .. the day after chemo shouldn't mean going back to

the doctor just for a shot. with neulasta onpro patients get their day back... to be with family, or just to sleep in. strong chemo can put you at risk of serious infection. in a key study neulasta reduced the risk of infection from 17% to 1%, a 94% decrease. neulasta onpro is designed to deliver neulasta the day after chemo and is used by most patients today.

neulasta is for certain cancer patients receiving strong chemotherapy. do not take neulasta if you're allergic to it or neupogen (filgrastim). an incomplete dose could increase infection risk. ruptured spleen, sometimes fatal as well as serious lung problems, allergic reactions, kidney injuries and capillary leak syndrome have occurred. report abdominal or shoulder tip pain, trouble breathing or allergic reactions to your doctor right away. in patients with sickle cell disorders, serious, sometimes fatal crises can occur. the most common side effect is bone and muscle ache. ask your doctor about neulasta onpro. pay no more than $5 per dose with copay card.

>> the company is bleeding money like crazy. and if we didn't solve these problems in a short period of time -- >> how close did you come to death? >> a few weeks. david: elon musk, a shocking admission that his cam nip almost died this year. >> he's the identity of the company. a lot of people who hold the stock would probably say they feel he's a volatile presence right now. pot smoking, whatever he's doing. the radio interviews and some of

the erratic tweets. so for me the question is, is there a way from a corporate perspective to keep him as the visionary and as the one coming up with the new ideas. and someone to could run the day to day. >> they thought they could fix that by making him the ceo of the tech company. he likes to talk. he's a thought leader in the country than they like to hear him. >> i think it's too late, i think tesla doesn't have a choice. and i don't think there is

enough appreciate was for these highly disruptive companies that do walk the line over and over again. he's a disruptive founder. i think it would be great for him to have that partner he could depend on. >> more than any other company out there trading right now, he's the face of the company he runs. he walks the fine line. even this interview. it's like it's violation because he didn't give out material information back then. the man is a genius. the man is a visionary. the price of the stock is acting well right here. david: the stock was up 6%. >> the market was buying the baita and the short sellers

temperature the sales growth year over year was phenomenal. if that continues, i think the stock goes higher and the shorts are going to be drinking a lot of booze going forward. i have been down on the company in the past because i worry about him. david: we wishes that very best. thanks, gang. president trump: we don't like it. i believe they will be opening up something else. i spoke with her when i heard they were closing. i said this company has done a lot for general motors. you better get back in ohio and you better get back in there soon. you have a lot of pressure. they say the chesy cruz isn't selling well. i said why can't you get a car that is selling well and put it