i can't watch it. liz: forgive me. i shouldn't use suck it up. that was inappropriate. stuart: i'm shocked. liz: i'm shocked too. stuart: thank you for that admission there. i think our time is truly up. in the last three seconds, i will say this, neil, it's yours. neil: apparently i have a lot of company this year not going to the white house christmas party. richard nixon in his worst moments never stopped white house christmas party. part of tradition. that is that. we're following that. what is happening with the president meeting with secretary of state mike pompeo. looking at a china deal that seems to be inching along here but peter navarro was maybe pouring semicold water on some of the rumors you're hearing when he chatted with maria bartiromo this morning. take a look. >> what we're trying for are two objectives that we have to hit. one of course is the market access, which is to buy more stuff, let us get into their

markets without the forced technology transfer and all the other kinds of things they do. the much more importantly, are the structural issues that is, the cyber intrusions, that is the state-directed investment. that is the intellectual property theft. neil: all right. so, you know the drill here. the better things look for potential grade agreement, better stocks look. i think i've been fairly consistent. markets bore me out. things could change. the more likely it looks that we're going to have some sort of a deal cobbled together with the chinese that will ease tariffs, call for the chinese to open their markets more the better stocks look. they could go in reverse if the opposite happens. get a read from mike murphy. mike, it is uncanny and remarkably consistent that pattern. what do you make of it? >> what we're seeing here, a lot of program trade something causing big swings in the

markets, reading headlines whether or not we're going to get a deal done with china. we see big selloffs when they feel we're not going to get a deal done with china. i think ultimately we get a deal done, done quickly and right now that is causing the volatility out there. neil: i think we amped up the pressure a little bit. people say score any deal better than no deal but i think this is dragging on for a while the markets might not be too pleased if it is any ol' deal, right? up the ante what we get out of the chinese? >> yes and no. i think yes, in so much it can't be any deal for sense of having it. the real thing you heard peter navarro mention to maria, something has to be done with i.p. theft. something affects not only u.s. businesses but could potentially affect all u.s. stocks. neil: intellectual property, the fact over the years, under republican and democratic presidents the like they steal stuff? >> they steal stuff.

we're aware stealing stuff. it is such a big market we're willing to accept that in order to get into the market. what has to be part of this deal, the fact, i think it makes common sense, if you and i are going to do business together i will agree to not steal from you. i think that should be a good starting point. neil: imagine they wrote that into a contract, don't steal. >> that wouldn't shock me, neil. neil: no, you might be right. there is this other issue about the escalating friction between the chinese and canadians. they accepted bail and release of that cfo over at huawei, but, but, she can't leave the country. the chinese meanwhile seem to be rounding up canadian officials or former officials there. it is getting kind of tense. does this spill over into the whole trade talks? >> i think it has to. it is tense already i think. when you have governments picking civilians up off the

street the sooner that ends the better for all of us. this posturing in the overall trade package we're trying to get but i think the sooner this ends the better. neil: to harken back to ronald reagan, trust by verify we have to see the chinese follow up on these commitments. they have already made good on a commitment to buy soybeans right now for delivery in china sometime next month, again another wave in february and another wave in march but the other stuff is more loosey-goosey, right? how do we, how do we verify that? >> it, the honest answer, neil, i'm not certain but we have to have something in place where it is more of a open market. again you're talking about a communist country but there has to be more open business. in the u.s. you don't enter into a deal with another company, say, hey by the way, let's write in here that we'll not steal from each other. the one thing will be getting the deal. step one-a how do we enforce the

deal, make sure because they agree to it what's the recourse if they continue to act as they have in the past? neil: mike always a pleasure, my friend. thank you very much. >> great seeing you. neil: all right, the guy who is uncannily prescient over many years i have known him, talking about china, whether we can trust them or deliver the goods or make good on the words that they are giving seem all the write words. gordon chang, being, author of many other classics the coming collapse of china. he endeared himself to the government but i am glad he is here to give us some insight. gordon what do you think is happening? we hear whispering something happen. what do you think we'll get? >> i think there wasn't good deal close to the end of the 90-day truce. i don't think that is good thing though, neil. we've seen this story some times before, the chinese promise but don't deliver. i think the trump administration need to keep the pressure on

until the chinese perform. we haven't gone that route before. everything we tried absolutely failed, negotiations, agreements, wto cases, we've done everything. over the course of decades it hasn't worked. we need to try a new approach, basically say to the chinese, you get your benefits only after you comply first. neil: we always forget, seems like a capitalist juggernaut china has become, that at their core, they're not exactly a free society and they round up people on the streets and they disappear. in the case of having a tiff with canada, they round up a couple key canadian officials, former officials, and we don't know why. so i only say that in the context of whatever we get out of the chinese, are we very aware of what we're dealing with and who we're dealing with? >> i think that most americans fundamentally misunderstand the chinese. you know, basically beijing has been rounding up hostages over

various issues for more than a decade, even before huawei started we had this american, two children, their mother, were, american citizens being detained for no reason other than the fact that their father and dad is accused of fraud. the chinese do this all the time. so the canadians shouldn't be really surprised about this. which really means by the way, neil, that americans and canadians in china should consider leaving because this is going to get a lot worse before it gets better. neil: there are a lot of u.s. businesses as you reminded me, gordon, will want proof that the chinese will make good on the commitment to open markets to them. financial institutions waited for that in the past, they're still waiting. auto manufacturers waited for that in the past, they're still waiting. so we obviously have to have a measure we see progress. it is way too early to tell how we will get that. say hypothetically, maybe not hypothetically we don't?

in other words, the chinese very early on cheating, then what do we do? >> i think we have to go back to the pressure campaign if we let the foot off the accelerator. you know, as you said, neil, we just don't the way chinese think about this. xi xinping believes in a state-dominated economy. he is going back on reform. he is closing the country up and for him it is very important that china dominate, for instance, those 10 sectors mentioned in made in china 2025. now 11 sectors. that 11th sector by the way is 5g. 5g in china means huawei. this will be very difficult for us. xi xinping is dropping hints that china is the world's only sovereign state, if he deals with president trump, in xi xinping's eyes he is granting concession graduation schussly. he is not dealing with trump on one-on-one, equal basis. i think president trump needs to understand the mentality of some

one who thinks he is the world's only sovereign. neil: you mentioned the 5g thing, "barron's," maybe "the economist," talking about all the firms getting jump on this trying to define the technology to make money behind this. i think the figure, more than half had some source back to china. >> yeah, of course and our number one 5g competitor is qualcomm and qualcomm of course has relations with china. neil: right. >> earns a substantial amount of revenue in china. also had substantial difficulties in china and those difficulties are not just the present spat it has with apple. these go back -- neil: by the way they had the complete blessing of the chinese government to support its getting iphones out of china. >> that is certainly beijing took advantage of that too. neil: sure. >> we have to remember beijing has gone after qualcomm to take its technology. this is an ip issue for us. neil: very well-said. gordon, thank you very, very much. >> thanks, neil.

neil: gordon chang. again, we always want to look at these details here. you know the drill. we'll be following the dribs and drabs we get an flashes are worth reporting and we will but again it is trust but verify. remember when the chinese were making commitment to president george w. bush about, you know, calming their intellectual property invasions. they made similar types of promises to barack obama and they quickly cheated on them. in the case of barack obama, within 30 days of an agreement that was signed, in the case of george bush, within 60 days. so think about that before you celebrate a deal. progress is going to be heralded and properly so by markets that take the chinese at their word but increasingly we're getting signs it will take a lot more than their word. we have more after this.

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neil: well deadline, smedline. nine days the government could look at a partial shutdown. those in the house taking a long weekend. enjoy while the getting is good even though we could all be in a good mess because they can't resolve seven bills that keep the government open. they resolved five others that

is exactly what we're looking at. to kaitlin owens, "axios" reporter. the president embraces such a move if it means $5 billion for the wall but there doesn't appear to be middle ground. chuck schumer saying that ain't happening. the president indicate it better happen. a lot of republicans at loggerheads wondering how to bridge the gap. what do you think? >> i think you outlined it exactly how it is. the deadline is next friday, december 21st. after that, about a quarter of the government stops being funded, shuts down. there is not a obvious day out of this one with. you could do a temporary funding bill. the president seems pretty dug in, he wants the border wall money and he wants it now. neil: you think impact of shut down in the government, even partial one is what it used to be? i remember the big one in the gingrich era with bill clinton. now the shell shock response is gone. i'm not saying that's a good thing. it is kind of used to this kind

of happening again and again kind of thing? >> i don't know. there was a mini one earlier this year. neil: you're right. >> but again, it got resolved really quickly. neil: very quickly. that was the shortest government shutdown, right. >> it was also over immigration. but you know, i just, i don't know. we happy hearing this every time the government funding deadline is coming up. we keep hearing speculation is there a government shutdown. i don't know, are people numb to this idea, congress literally can't fund the government or president can't agree how to do it? i don't know. the guess more this happens. more normal it becomes. neil: you're being very diplomatic in your response, kaitlin, i admire that. is it your sense, whatever doesn't happen, ahead of this deadline, with, still technically republican controlled house, that the democrats do something to end it all in january, when they're running the show? >> i mean democrats have no incentive right now to cave to president trump. you know pelosi is about to come

in be speaker of the house. she clinched votes for that now. they just won the majority. they have veto power in the senate. they can block a vote to pass. they feel like they're in a position of strength, especially when president trump has gone on tv he will own the shutdown. honestly i don't see how this ends. it's a giant game of political chicken right now. neil: each side feels they have the advantage which generally worries you. someone won't or maybe both this time. kaitlin, great seeing you again thank you very much. >> you too. neil: i focus on weird things, you guys, as you probably know, i worry about this cavalier attitude whether on the part of democrats or republicans, only a few billion here, few billion here, everett dirksen used to say that adds up to serious money. go to former cbo director douglas holtz-eakin. doug, that is my biggest worry. i understand people saying five billion is a drop in a bucket, a

rounding error, on a rounding error when it comes to the trillions this government spends. i get that, i understand that, but humor me but show me how you are going to pay for that. that is all i'm saying. i don't hear that? >> i think it is 100% a fair concern for number of reasons. number one, 5 billion is still five billion dollars. that is a lot of money of the somebody ought to pay for that. they're sew focused on process issues, continuing resolutions, not dealing with the fundamental problems which we have enormous amount of debt and very large deficits projected as far as the eye can see, no one is looking out over longer term. they're looking out literally week 1/2. that is the vision of our federal government, both sides. that is the problem in my view. we have a substantial difficulty task ahead of us that sun avoidable in the end -- is unavoidable. longer they wait for the debt i share your concern, because the

mentality is too long and focus is too short. neil: you were the one of the ones warning about this going back with working with cbo and john mccain. >> right. neil: if we can't come up with agreement how to come up or address $5 billion, how the heck will we deal with multitrillion dollar liabilities with socially related programs that dwarf that by a factor of 100 times and then some?! >> that is a great question. i hope your next guest can answer it. neil: i was kind of counting on you. >> no, but here is my view of this, number one, the american people need to know there is a big problem. no one is telling them that. for eight years barack obama told the american people, there is nothing wrong with federal budget that we can't fix by taxing rich people. this president is not talking about the problem. that is not helping. people know there is something difficult has to happen, they're

prepared to back their representatives. if they don't do it, it will look like gratuitous cutting programs that won't work. i don't think any congress will be brave enough to do this on their own. you need the president of the united states standing up there is a big problem. i get it. a lot of things in here you might not like. they don't like voting for them but it needs to be done. you elected me to deal with big problems. that is what is needed. neil: president is stakingat lon the wall that it is needed here for security. i'm not here to debate on wisdom of that, pro or con but i'm wondering what happens if we get a shutdown? partial though it might it be could last a while, right? >> yeah i think that there are really two-ways to think about the shutdown. number one, this is a relatively small part of the government. as you know, if you are essential personnel, they get to designate who is essential you keep working though the money is not flowing, then you get paid back later. for things like border security

will be essential. a lot of this isn't going to matter for operation of the government. the second level is, what will the public think about it? will they get completely irritated irresponsibility of unable to deal with this little problem, much less the big problem or not? it will have to be that political price that changes the way they behave. neil: someone will have to stake their job on it. i'm probably getting kicked out of office daring to cross this third rail but i don't see that on either party's part. we'll see. thank you, my friend. very good seeing you. >> good to see you, thank you. neil: douglas holtz-eakin. meantime say this whether "brexit" happens or not, theresa may is still prime minister of britain. people say she is no maggie thatcher or winston churchill, she is not pretending to be but she is in her job. she is can any enough, and shrewd enough to out smart her conservative party and did it

again. this pell-mell rush that she is in hot water, did you ever think sometimes maybe they are? after this. your pants struggle to support the heavier you, your roof struggles to support the heavier me. [laughter] whoo. [crash] and your cut-rate insurance might not pay for this. so get allstate, you could save money and be better protected from mayhem like me. mayhem is everywhere. so get an allstate agent. are you in good hands? and all through the house 'twas the night before christmas not a creature was stirring, but everywhere else... there are stores open late for shopping and fun

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neil: now that we like to give you sort of a sector snapshot of the day housing is big on our list here and of course so much bleeds from that if you think about it, and industry is bleeding. mortgage rates at the lowest price we've seen in three months but it is not exactly helping builders. in fact we got a report out of las vegas this morning showing the market continuing to soften you might recall from the meltdown. it started in las vegas and some of the hot markets, palm beach, florida, silicon valley area, new york city, what have you, but that got some attention here. so that gives us a couple different reads what's happening today for homebuilders.

usually talked about as a barometer for the housing industry, not good. meantime theresa may is going on to fight for another day, securing her job for another year. the fate of "brexit," not so much. ashley webster in london with more on that. hey ashly. >> neil, she goes back to brussels, again, still the prime minister of the united kingdom. you know what, more belgium waffle without any syrup. the same thing again and again. all the smiles and handshakes. she does not expect an immediate breakthrough. no kidding because the eu keeps saying we will not deal. we will not renegotiate. so what could happen here? what are the "brexit" outcomes? the one favored by mrs. may would be to renegotiate the current deal she has enough it could be passed in houses of parliament and actually go into law. the option is no deal "brexit." the bookmakers are saying that is more likely at this point.

no one among british lawmakers seem to agree what they want. certainly not the backstop for northern ireland. this is somewhat exotic, the norway plus, deal, kind of a norway arrangement where the uk would be outside of the eu but still have access to single market. but that deal would call for free movement of people. i think that is nonstarter for the uk. a bringing reason "brexit" passed because of immigration. there is the option of second referendum gaining some steam. the people's vote, you could argue they already had their vote, a second referendum could be on the cards sometime in the new year. we could also have a general election, neil. so many options, so little time. we did get this tweet from the u.s. ambassador to the uk, woody johnson, he put this out this afternoon. he says i cannot overemphasize the willingness of president trump and the american people to make a strong free-trade agreement between our two

countries. it will be the standard-bearer for all future trade agreements. good news for uk. it is encouraging. right now mrs. may is still in brussels trying to persuade her counterparts, throw me a few crumbs i can get the "brexit" deal across the line. i don't think too many people are optimistic that can happen, neil. back to you. neil: there is nothing in it to make them want to do that, right? >> no. they want to make an example of the uk. they don't want to make it easy, because they don't want other eu countries, hey, good idea, let's get out of the eu but we'll get a sweet deal. not going to happen. neil: a good way to frame that. thank you very much, ashley, great reporting on this week. >> sure. neil: former u.s. ambassador to the eu under president obama, anthony gardner. thank you for your time. >> good to be here. >> what happens now? seem son, suspect, ambassador, "brexit" might not materialize. what do you think? >> i think your reporter got it

right, there are a lot of options, really not the experts have a clear what is going to happen but i think relatively certain is the fact that in parliament there is no majority for a hard, no-deal "brexit." so i think that option is not unlikely, not impossible but unlikely. a new, no confidence motion of the entire house of commons which is distinct from what we just saw yesterday is also unlikely because it looks labour believes it will not win such a no confidence motion. so then you're left with the options that your reporter mentioned, none of which are probable but, that includes this norway plus option or a existing deal with some tweaks which are not legally binding but they give confidence that the uk won't be stuck forever into this customs arrangement. then there is the people's vote. so who knows. can i get back to the issue of a u.s.-uk free trade deal. look, there has been a lot of loose rhetoric about this. i spent three years negotiating

a deal, trying to get a deal over the line with the eu. these deals are very long and very complicated. it would be the case also for a u.s.-uk deal. it will not be a big, beautiful, bold deal that will change things for the uk or for the united states. all the issues we were negotiating with the eu will be on the table in a u.s.-uk free trade deal. agriculture, government procurement, services including maritime services, it will be complicated and long to achieve. final point here, it will also be a relatively modest compensation for lack of frictionless access to the single market of the eu. neil: ambassador, reading a lot of british press, a lot of coverage, our own included you hear a lot of just average british citizens say, if they were to vote again they would vote the same way they did in june of 2016, no way of knowing if that would be the case but

i'm wondering if they're galvanized reading of all these problems going on in some these countries? germany, slowdown, if not recession pretty soon, italy, budgetary mess. france, their own problems with protests going on. they're saying if that is a club to be in we don't want to be in it, what do you think? >> it is true, continental europe doesn't look so great at the moment but let's remember there are a lot of advantages being part of the eu, top of the list is access to this very large single market. all of the predictions, including from the government, also from think tanks, that are independent, show losing frictionless access to a single market will be very expensive for the united kingdom. a hard, no-deal "brexit" would be the worst. the existing deal is the best of available options. the norway option would be even better for the uk because it would have higher degree of access to the single market but

this is, this is the positive for the uk, being part of a very large market of 500 million people. you know when wilbur ross was here he made a point that i thought was fundamentally mistaken. he said to the british people essentially, ditch all of those pesky eu regulations, and basically adopt u.s. regulations. and you will get a great free trade deal with us. the problem with that is that many, many u.s. businesses that have invested in the united kingdom actually have done so because they want the uk to be aligned with the e.u. regulations. in other words, the uk is a platform for u.s. businesses to access that market. neil: well of course, their argument is, more easier more consistent with one set of rules, if this starts breaking up, you have different countries with different set of rules i can understand where they're coming from, but it sounds to me like march 29th, that is not a firm date here. do you think we get to that, they push it back or what? >> there is always a possibility of it being pushed back.

but i think the eu would push it back if there seems to be a true possibility much getting to a deal within a reasonable time frame. european court of luxembourg uk can unilaterally withdraw so-called article 15 notice to leave the eu there will be increasing pressure to do that. ambassador. neil: ambassador, good talking to you. >> thank you. neil: apple is planning to build a multibillion dollar campus in texas and others we're told, another brokerage firm is saying you know what we're lowering our price target on this thing. it hasn't had a huge effect now. you remember when the stock was 230, $240 a share. what happened? it is still happening.

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>> welcome back to "coast to coast." i'm gerri willis live from the floor of the new york stock exchange. apple says amazon can keep new york city, they're headed down south of the company announcing it will spend a one billion dollars on new campus in austin, texas. that would create 5000 new jobs. that could triple. texas is giving apple 25 million in taxpayer funding as a grant. it will also likely receive tens of millions of property tax abatement. apple declined to comment which details were reported in the austin statesman american. that compares to what long island city compared to amazon to expand in queens. that company is getting 1.5 billion in tax incentives. apple announces three offices in three other cities, seattle,

san diego, culver city, california. with expectations it will ad 1000 employees in each place. president trump criticized company making iphones in china. the company will spend 30 billion in capital spending in the u.s. next five years. noel, back to you. neil: gerri, thank you very much. saudi arabia having a sharp cut back to exports to the united states. a sharp oil cutback. you if you think about that, how the that looks, president saying what you will standing by them, saudi very apparent role in killing of "washington post" journalist, no good deed goes unpunished. the saudis are sticking it back to the united states by extension. no comment from the president by all of this. saudi crude shipments to the u.s. in january, could test a 30-year low. now the timing is interesting, my producer is reminding me this, around the time the senate is taking up measure with draw

support for saudis in on going war in yemen that killed thousands. saudis going tit-for-tat, ironically against very same president who is still trying to work on their side. man, oh, man, this is getting nasty. so too, a trade tiff that might go bad or might not, but depending on what you're watching, when it comes to the chinese, when it comes to soybeans, buying more from our farmers again for the first time in what, half a year, there are positive developments. kristina partsinevelos has more with a farmer to farmer event going on in omaha, nebraska. hey, kristina. reporter: neil, this is not just any farmer to farmer event. you have farmers sharing data how to improve their crops. tracy farming the past six years. wheat, soybeans, corn. start with the tariff, how that affected your crop in the past year or so. what happened? >> the crop sustained, a great

year, growing year, we had this bountiful harvest but no one wants it right now. so we just sit there and hope that something will be resolved. and it hasn't been. so we're looking at a difference of 3 or $4 per bushel from where we were last year. reporter: wow, $10? >> we were 9 and $10 earlier. we have been below 7 because of this whole issue. reporter: that is a huge hit to your bottom line. within the past 24 hours china said they would increase their purchases. they are already done so how do you feel about that? will they follow through, are you skeptical? what are your thoughts? >> there are so many variables and some teasers and so many instigators and tweaks and everything that still has to happen. all you have to have is hope. something will happen. we have to stay the course like farmers always do, keep doing what we're doing, growing great products and things will pan

out. reporter: i love you're optimistic, but you have the president offered $12 billion in subsidies. >> right. reporter: to offset a loss a lot of farmers are facing. is that helping or has that helped? >> no way it can't help. it is income that helps our bottom line. it's a little discerning because you know it is a real issue if they're starting financial help. you have to just hang on. what else can you do but know that the tariff, the package they put together is helping us get through. but we still have that soybeans to sell. if nobody wants it, what will we do with it? reporter: you're still dealing with that we haven't seen the full effect what china can do coming back to the table. >> we're talking about pennies, not dollars. reporter: that is a good point, pennies, not dollars, yeah. >> when it comes to this commodity in particular, it is dollars that need to happen to make sure we remain viable. reporter: because we're standing in front of this massive harvester, i know this guy costs

half a million dollars, steve tariffs and aluminum, how has that affected equipment and costs? >> everything takes it out. when we see our income going down and prices are going up, so how do you make those even? you work closely with your banker. you have to have that relationship that says, hey we'll come through this, we'll come out of it. hopefully the equipment dealers will realize that, you know, you're going to have to get -- reporter: traci, you're optimistic, you have a contingency plan. throw it back to you, neil, unless you have any questions? neil: no, kristina thank you very much very interesting. if the chinese make commitments on soybeans to get them loaded up and ways in february or march, that could do a lot to help those soybean farmers. again i want to bring you up to date what is going on in washington and riyadh, saudi arabia. we got a commitment out of the saudi a rarians they will dramatically cut the production

of oil. but that is amazing development considering the president stuck his neck out for them, even with their given involvement in the death of jamal khashoggi, "the washington post" journalist. the president did not implicate them. did not want to see them punished, even though this is happening on the same day many in the senate are trying to punish the saudis for the role in that killing. in fact coming up with a measure that could be voted on later today, that would withdraw our support, that is american support for the saudis in their ongoing war in yemen that killed thousands. picture what this is. everyone is fixated, michael cohen going to jail, three years, yadi yada, but i'm not minimizing. this is significantly far more bigger economic story for us and potentially the world. the saudis essentially said we don't care. screw you. think about that. after this.

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♪ neil: all right, oil prices are up on the day. to be fair they had been moving up before we got formal word that the saudis indeed will make good on a threat to cut production of oil in their country, the second largest oil producer on the planet behind the united states, by the way. it is indicating that it is going to do that, to lift the price of oil. oil i think tumbled about 30,

31% this year. it is picking up a little bit of ground. think about what they're doing. it is not happening in a vacuum. the senate is taking up this measure to niche them for their role and the crown prince's role killing the jamal khashoggi, the saudi arabian journalist that worked for "the washington post." we criticized their role in that. the president has not. the president took a leap for them, whether you agree or disagree with them, this is the thank he gets for the saudis, all of that he will stick it to him and us by potentially trying to raise oil prices. so, in the political world of no good deed goes unpunished, the president is finding out first-hand, i cannot imagine that would not be a temptation for him to tweet or say something about this, but the saudis said effectively, we don't care. we're going to stick it to you anyway. that to me is just wild. just wild. i'm a nerd. i know everyone indulges on all

this other stuff but wow, that's a biggie. meantime this is a biggie too, with all the crosscurrents, trade friction and trade front and the oil front, look at this, one in four shoppers are looking to face holiday debt. in fact a lot of it. that is not bothering too much. they will be spending some say recklessly. "wall street journal" wealth advisor veronica daguerre on that. for now, i guess they're in that camp, that scarlet o'hara. but think about it tomorrow, right? >> you buy the 10th president, they're so excited but the fact you will deal with the credit card bill in january, and that credit card debt hangover that is one of the worst things. that is a terrible feeling that doesn't help anyone. neil: so why are they so gung-ho on this? i know the economy is doing, you know, bonkers good, but it is

not as if debt levels are invisible. we know we never really quite got over that. we hacked it down to side during the slowdown and post the meltdown, but what is going on here? >> sometime people have short term memories. we forget the bad times. overall we have a really good year in the stock market overall, depending what you're invested in. not to mention wages are higher for many people. also there is a good sense of, you know, just a sense of positivity in the economy because of some of these tax cuts. now that said, there is still overhangs happening in the stock market. volatility, some concerns about global growth. and also just, this uncertainty, uncertainty about trade tensions is going to catch up with us. we've already seen some of that. but i think people spend, they think about today, not so much thinking about tomorrow. by the way, neil, that is very similar to what we see america doing. our national deficit is big. that is not always the best indicator what is happening in the world but if you look at

that we spend and spend. we cut taxes but we don't cut spending. we wonder why the deficit is growing? americans in their household are doing the same thing. we spend and spend, feels good now. but tomorrow when the credit card bill comes in and we have only $400 saved in the emergency accounts, we have a problem. neil: but you know, everyone learns from the other in this country. even when we debated this wall, i always tell people, whether you're for it, against it, president's insistence $5 billion for border wall, something ultimately could cost five times that, that is fine. but we say it is only five billion. and, you know, these billions add up? >> they add up. so you have got maybe the cost of the wall that happens but also the maintenance costs of the wall. i can't even imagine to figure out what that is it going to be. so again, this idea of living for today, forgetting about tomorrow. but you know what, neil? we're reporting so much more on,

in the "wall street journal" about this. we're seeing more and more poor senior citizens, people living hand to mouth in their golden years because they haven't saved enough. and not to mention the cost of health care is going up in many parts of the country. when you're a senior citizen you cannot get a loan for your retirement. you can get a loan for college but not retirement. we're seeing horrible trends, some seniors committing suicide because they don't have enough money. overall this catches up with us in ways that we're not expecting neil: you can't take in, spend more than you're making. no one seems to learn that. veronica, thank you very much. we have a couple trends that she is watching. karen, i'm wondering is it a worry to you, we look the other way when it comes to debt, all that, maybe buoyed by the fact

that tax cut, 19 states having unexpected moneys to play here, what do you think? >> from small business perspective, they love that consumer confidence is high. they have a great 2018 looking at 201019 too. consumer optimism has never been higher. continues to be historically high. from a small business perspective, they love it consumers are spending, grow their businesses, pay their employees more dollars, provide more health care, all those things important to our economy. neil: businesses are in different kind of position, small business in particular, they have been particularly good handling debt, haven't they? >> a lot of lessons learned from the great recession and weak economic recovery. businesses are in term of, had to see traction and sustainable

growth in economy before taking risks. when you look at it, the latest gallup wells fargo small business index survey found 80% of small businesses feel really good about their financial condition right now, their cash flow is really good. they have financial backup plans. so they're in good shape. you know, 2019 should continue to go the same way. but obviously there is concerns on the policy front in terms of what happens, with the divided congress right now, what that means for policy, how that might impact the economy and small business. neil: karen, thank you very, very much. time was tight with the breaking news development but i appreciate it. more on the saudi fallout for oil for you and your shopping after this.

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neil: remember about six weeks ago when president trump urged the saudi's to rethink a production cut because i'm paraphrasing here, hike in oil prices. he got just the opposite. so much so saudi's are revisiting the production cut issue. despite their role, it's pretty clear they did have a role or at least the press did in the death of jamal khashoggi and everyone in washington with seemingly believing that except the president of the united case you didn't think there is any reason to finger them or punish them for anything. the saudi's have responded they are cutting production next

month. a 30 year low headed our way. it is an amazing kind of take that u.s. especially for the president over mounting evidence that they did have a role in the killing of the "washington post" journalist. let's go to market watcher mark avalon. i'm just wondering how this plays out. the president is going to be tempted i would date to respond to this development here he hasn't yet appeared when you think? >> usually does respond. first of all, cuts in that area of the world don't always hold true. so let's see what happens with production. the other aspect is oil prices have come down a lot and that could be a shakeout to our high yield market, our production. there's a silver lining here. it not all bad if oil prices stabilize. we were looking at daily drops repeated every day and that

could cause its own issue. a delicate price stability in the oil market or slight blip up as troubling and enough canonically right now. neil: i know this is outside your area. and looking at the politics around this that the saudi's have given us yet another reason to distrust them. >> while that is true. there's two stories coming out of washington. the one with all the data and the facts and senator speaking out very candidly about how they want to treat saudi arabia and then we have the president. there is a political aspect. from a market standpoint i want to see the saudi scoffers before you take action within a portfolio and also want to look at remember when oil was in the 30s how dangerous that was for a high yield market and not cause the pullback economically. it not all bad to have some stability in the price market. neil: people forget you can go too far. people filling up their tank and seeing $2 something gas and now

i think about it doesn't take that under $2 bet they love it but obviously that his ramifications. what is your sense of what's going on right now in all this multiple trade and international friends with the latest reports on china. we'll get into that a little bit more with my next guest. there is a consequence for action and now the president jawboning the chinese to do more. early indications are that they will, but it could be the saudi thing in reverse. we'll see if we do that. what do you think? >> when the traits that started the u.s. economy was roaring ahead in the global economy was going along at a 3% growth rate. it has been dragging on and now there's global weakness in the u.s. earnings may have peaked u.s. economic cycle may have peaked and i think our leverage to withstand or at least the stock market's ability to withstand the type of back and type of back and forth and the uncertainty is showing to where the stock market is not as resilient as it was in the face of this back-and-forth and

insurgency in with the weaker global economy that is a net negative for stocks. we really need some clarity in the tone of washington to slow down. we need the heated rhetoric to be pullback in some incremental progress. neil: hope springs eternal during the holiday season. we will see. thank you very much. it comes out of this with china. they are making all the right moves. the question then can we also trust them to make good on it? they hoodwink presidents in the past from either party, democrats or republicans, barack obama or bill clinton, actually both bush presidents. ken blackwell, what do you think? >> neil, let me tell you what i'm concerned about and this might sound like a coordination of messaging. i'm concerned about the strategy of rob, replicate and replace.

the first of our brainpower have to stop and if they don't, there's no way way that i trust them on the trade front to actually follow through on what they promise. that is a real concern. before you ask i'm concerned that the president might have made a bad move when he at least gave them the opportunity to say our willingness to intervene on their behalf if they do the right thing in trading is a real threat to the integrity of our embrace of the rule of law. neil: you talked obviously about the apprehension of two canadians, one former prison official, the other a present one. the chinese just took off the streets and we don't know where they are. what we do know is that this appears to be tit-for-tat with

the issue of the huawei cfl, the founder who was momentarily held in a canadian jail and then given bail and can't leave canada. the chinese are none too pleased with that. but it does remind us what we're dealing with, right? >> absolutely. you know, sounds like a duck, walks like a duck, it's probably a duck. the reality is the chinese have a game plan and that is world dominance as an economic power and they will use any means possible to get to that final result. and so, we have to be constantly vigilant and we have to be willing to not reward bad

behavior, but to counter it. neil: this is kind of in that same ballpark and i know we didn't prepare you, but the saudi thing really amazes me because the president whether you think it was a good idea or bad idea stood by the saudi prince to say i'm not going to be new even though much of the civilized world has but this is the thanks he got for the saudi's have to make good on it to cut their production, but they want to cut their production and maybe the 30 year lows with the goal of hike in oil prices in our country and around the world. what do you make of that? >> i would caution the saudi's. this is a president that is transactional and he in fact will deal with a double cross i think in a very harsh and direct way. and they are sending him the wrong signal. if they are basically stating this is the thanks you get for

not piling on in a crisis moment that we are now facing and we are now going to doublecross you on our commitment in terms of these cut, that is the wrong signal to play out with this president. my warning is to them, my caution is to the president, you know, make sure you take a look at who you're jumping in the pool with. but on the other hand, i would tell the saudi's that you don't want to mess with your ally, your most reliable ally in the fight at your end in your neighborhood. neil: all right, sounding awfully like tony soprano. can become a thank you very commit very much. have a merry christmas. >> merry christmas, brother. neil: all right, be well.

the dow down about 15 points here. so if they're panicking about this, i might be the only one obsessing over this. i just find it remarkable that the saudi's are even entertaining doing this. whether that will change the direction of all prices anyway or form is anyone's guess. the fact that they are is amazing. what's amazing is the fact that many in the house have a long weekend beginning today. so that is three days if you argue it's a long weekend. that cuts from nine to six days they would have to avoid a government shutdown. how likely is not? let's just stay with this little break they are taking. more likely. (vo) 'twas the night before christmas

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neil: deadline slip line even though nine days from now we could be facing a partial government shut down that is not stock the house. which would slice that by three days. what is going on there. >> is going to be longer. it's going to be shorter than the three days here. the house of representatives this afternoon and they will not come back until wednesday night at 6:30. that gives them two and a

quarter days to figure this out. sometimes what they do is try to apply pressure by being out and so there is this kind of take it or leave it strategy at the very end. there is no negotiation going on right now according to the house minority leader nancy pelosi. she says she hasn't had any conversations since the meeting in the oval office. i will read you this quote from patrick mchenry, congressman from north carolina yesterday. there's been chatter that the best word for it in the house about republicans trying to move a bill unilaterally to pay for the bill $5 billion they would do it just with republican votes. the question is whether or not to do it is a question of wisdom in strategy and tactics. it is highly debatable as to whether or not it the right move. part of that is because the president already took i'm responsible for the shutdown if

it happens and it's unclear whether republicans would have devoted mrs. by nancy pelosi says wait a minute what does donald trump know about government? does he care about people with paychecks maybe he doesn't need a paycheck at the holidays with the working folks do. >> how many would not be getting paychecks. >> you are looking not nine federal departments of the 15 federal departments. dozens of agencies. i would look at nasa. i would like it had. one of the most obvious things especially at the holidays are when people are off work on vacation our national parks and monuments. you can imagine the washington d.c. sometimes a little bit of theater about what they do. but the reason is because they have the big government shutdowns in the mid-1990s there was a policy to when you had to shut down in 2013 imposed a policy of people criticized for shutting down the monument in things. you could see some of that. again, folks would not be getting their paychecks at that

day. remember, mick mulvaney, budget director and hafez of personnel management make the calls us to what's essential and what's nonessential. there is always essential people, police officers, federal agents come of folks like that going to work but they just don't get their paycheck joe. the something the congress has to approve. they're right up against the holidays and there is a pretty good back-and-forth on the house floor between steny hoyer minority whip in kevin mccarthy that majority leader. arguing about whose fault it would be and why they can't work out something here at the end of this exchange kevin mccarthy reached under the desk and pulled out a bag of candy from a candy shop in his district and gave it to steny hoyer. even though there is a back-and-forth in a lot of arguing there's still the christmas spirit and that's why some people think they might go to work this out just under the deadline on the 21st late next week. neil: the candy bar would certainly buy me off. thank you very much my friend.

we will have updates from washington as they merit. the fox news poll shows about 50% of americans the editor-in-chief chris bradford. what do you make of that? i would've thought the numbers would be higher because whatever you say to the president is irrefutable that this economy is firing on all cylinders. i would've thought even higher numbers. >> i was wondering the same thing. how could you mail 50% approval and without one of the longest bull market to ever had. absolutely incredible. maybe that some of the atmospherics. people who don't like president trump. maybe they don't like his banter. at the end of the day come even wages are going up and that is something that stagnated for years. the stock market is doing well right now. it's not guaranteed to continue this way, but the economy is one of the things to love them or hate them, president trump is seriously delivered on.

>> it's interesting to because fox has just wrapped up an interview with the president in this other issue came up with michael cohen, an issue by the way they're probably bedevils the president and keeps these numbers that his ceiling here. the president talking about the development with harris faulkner moments ago. >> michael cullen says that he lied in order to protect you. what's your response to that? >> i never directed him to do anything. whatever he did, he did on his own. as a lawyer. a lawyer to represent the client is supposed to do the right thing. that's why you pay them a lot of money at that her comments that appeared he's a lawyer. he represents a client. i never directed him to do anything incorrect or wrong. neil: chris, what you think? >> it's interesting. it sounds right. it makes sense, but it's not a good look for the president who's changed the story about what he knew and this kind of

thing does seep out and it may give people that impression but radley would ever talk to people outside of washington d.c. or new york, most are following the story at all. they're not paying attention to what's going on. i don't think it's a household name. the economy is more important. i heard a story from someone i was talking to in florida last week who compared president trump if your kid get straight a's and then comes home and is a brat to you and household come you may be doing very well, but if the rhetoric or some of these things make americans less pleased. neil: i never had that problem, but he understand what you're saying there. very good seeing you again. thanks. the president was also talking about some of these job cut the gm is announcing. after this.

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>> a couple weeks for christmas is going to hurt -- close in ohio and michigan. not acceptable to me. someone else is going to go in the general motors is not going to be treated well. neil: the president not at all happy about general motors also on fox news some interesting developments on the federal reserve, relationship with jerome powell later in the show. in the meantime you ready now to reason may have survived to fight another day. actually another year. a no-confidence though: over this whole brexit brouhaha for at least that long. enter percy who voted in her favor joins us right now. sir, very good to have you. >> pleasure to be here. good evening. neil: you back to the prime minister why? >> she's the best person to get us through this. it's almost as this whoever is

the prime minister at the moment is irrelevant to the process because the problem we have is getting this withdrawal agreement through parliament. the house of commons behind me is packed full of people who looks the referendum. they campaigned and run the wrong side of the public and the public and they're making this as difficult as possible. it barely matters. nothing changes in terms of the arithmetic to jaime. neil: let me ask you, is that, is it your feeling that the march 29th deadline, and something has to happen. the formal break i guess. how hard and fast is that? >> i mean, we leave on the 29th of march. that is written into law here. the prime minister's preferred option in my preferred option is someone that we leave with video. that movie with no deal

situation and that raises a whole set of problems and challenges. also something parliamentary dead set against it and will do everything they can to prevent. unless we get this deal through its anybody's guess as to where we had next on this. >> i got to read on my side of the pond here that many of your colleagues figured we don't flip over to resubmit, but would rather her be at the helm of this disaster than anyone of us try to challenge her at this time, but post the explosion, then will come in. what do you think? >> i think leaving the e.u. is a good thing. but clearly when she came and spoke to the caucus, she said at the start of her speech that she would be leaping into the next election so i think she's recognized i was quite important for getting a few people but there are colleagues who think what, it is no doubt a challenge the country is still quite

divided on the issue. if she gets brexit delivered, then it's probably time to start looking for new leaders or colleagues will be thinking who is perhaps tainted by the challenges over the last two years and that probably didn't help swing a few votes in her favor last night. by announcing she's going, people start -- >> the same in our country as well. go ahead. i'm sorry. >> absolutely. same on both sides of the pond. a vacancy at the top people start jockeying for it. be my choice question the consensus when it says brexit instead was a bad idea. british referendum voters two and half years ago felt otherwise. and then i'm looking at the troubles in france, germany on the brink of a recession. maybe you guys were wise to reconsider being part of that club. >> i think we were.

a lot of people particularly in the city here hated it. a lot of big interest groups have hated it. most members of parliament on the other side of politics hated it, but the public despite all of the threats that were doled out in the referendum about what would happen in all the rest of it in a million people would lose their jobs or the economy would go into immediate recession. despite all of that, the public what do what was happening in europe. looked at the undemocratic nature of the e.u. and so you know what come in the lies outside of the bean in charge of our own borders, our own laws and i'm pleased that we made that decision and what is happening in europe proves why we will be proven right in the long run. it's a shame that a lot of people here in the establishment and house of commons still haven't reconciled themselves to the fact that they lost. neil: the consensus has been routinely overturned or we will see. thank you for taking the time.

>> leisure. he had a lot to say about the federal reserve as well. don't you think harris should be doing more stuff on fox business? you won't believe what he said after this.

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>> hopefully the fed won't be raising interest rates any more because if you compare us as an example to president obama, he has your interest rates. anybody can make money without your interest rate. and yet, our economy is soaring. our businesses are doing tremendously. neil: the president interview with her making it very clear i don't think it would be a good idea to raise interest rates next week, whether that amounts to a threat, the federal reserve is kind of in a no-win situation because if it opts to raise interest rates, how to pay. if it doesn't, even though the

economic conditions might justify slowing down, people will think that they're bowing to the president. the reaffirmed charlie gasparino. what you think of what the president is saying right there? >> interest rates as one of the many hurdles the market is dealing with right now. they don't want to not do it just because he said that. the goal quarter. with the market needs is they need some sense that they won't be three or four next year he can't even than the market still has the china trade wars and ecb and all sorts of problems. interest rates is definitely one hurdle that i think if they can announce if they're going to stop for next year it's going to be bullish for the markets. >> abysses at another time and place he would've gotten michael cohen to hustle jerome powell down for an interest rate hikes.

but that relationship has soured as we know. listen, i agree with joe. the problem is that when you keep interest rates and i know obama had zero which he did, and where the interest rates are right now is not that much above zero. we are not talking about, you know, the fed squeezing inflation peered >> either way, 2.5%? and they have room and come back down. i don't think the market can handle it. he's probably keeping it low because it's still pretty low. companies borrow more and if there's anything -- if you worried about a tsunami that could hurt the economy and lead to something like 2008. i'm not saying that's going to happen, is essentially debt and corporate debt levels. ge a couple years ago when they

found out now the activist investor, he prodded the board in the company and then it was ceo john flannery to buy back stock because dad was really cheap. they bought it back in 17. i mean, when you have interest rate, you make a lot of decisions based on the fact that your cost of capital is low at the time. neil: of their little higher to make fewer. that's an economic fact. >> of the fed is in height, does that say that they're not independent. >> that would panic the markets more. something bigger going on out there. neil: or what your reaction. the president talked about china, trade with harris faulkner. take a look. >> i know what i'm doing. i mean it's business. nobody ever went to china as a person, you're stealing intellectual property.

you're doing all sorts of things that are wrong. you're taking out of our country $500 billion a year. you can't do it. >> you're not worried about that? >> know because would have been to so great. we do $525 billion with them. they do 100 billion with us as they do five times more. it's really more than that. >> he's talking about the amount of surplus, the trade surplus the chinese enjoy with us and is going to keep fighting that. would you think? >> this will drag out longer than people expect. rumors that president xi will drag it on out to 2020. if that happens that's going to be trouble. i do want to be negative. even if they announce in the headlines that come out were making progress, were not. even if they make progress from there it's still going to be another six months or so to finalize those. neil: we do know their past

record. republican, democratic presidents alike. >> i think he's right and wrong. more the president than you. he's right in the fact that china steals stuff from us. he's wrong in the way he's approaching it. but tara stuff just doesn't work. he needed a much more concerted effort or coordinated effort with other trading partners, europeans which he didn't do. that's why the markets are so worried about this. it's not a coherent trade policy of isolating them on the one thing that is really bad. by the way trade deficits are bad. we have a trade deficit with other countries because her prosperous and we buy stuff. it's a bad measure of the economy. neil: you to make a very good point. i feel the longer this drags on, the more the markets are going to want to see some teeth in this thing. not just a promise to buy more from us, not just to open up the

markets more risk about more soybeans from our farmers. every day that goes by the kind words are not going to be enough. >> even when we do get the headlines and we've made progress in almost finalize this, blakey said the market wants details. it's still going to take time to get those concrete deals. >> they will still jump on the prospects of it but they'll also look under the hood. >> again, his trade policy with china somewhat incoherent. think of it this way. trade deficits keep talking about if we have all these companies -- [inaudible] >> that's a problem. that's a different issue. he's complaining both of them embracing a policy on to things that are disparate. >> that would be a big -- >> the biggest headlands right or the interest rates in the china trade were for sure. but we're still going to have a

massive trade deficit. who do you think has the upper hand right now as far as this negotiation? is that china in the u.s. because markets are hurting or is it china. it's hard to say because we don't really -- you know, but the fine print on most of these trade deals he does is pretty weak tea. >> i was go against that. >> idea was pretty weak and this deal looks like it's not. we will still have a trade deficit. neil: gentlemen, i want to thank you both very much. you survived. >> where do i begin. are also going to talk about the saudi's. they pulled a 180 on the president by announcing they will be cutting back oil production could the same president who stood behind on this whole khashoggi killian issue in that event riled republicans and democrats on the hill coming up with legislation to punish the saudi's and our support for them in the ongoing war again then. so think about that.

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you produce, out of 30% this year is less applied, prices should go up. has it worked that way all the time. fox business jeff flock and phil flynn in chicago. jeff, is it your sense that they are out about it there or what? >> well, no. actually some people are questioning why the saudi's would be screened the president over essentially for want of a better term. because they felt he did the same thing to them. he stood by them through this whole assassination of the journalists. >> remember, you know, earlier in the or president trump was telling saudi arabia and the opec producers, hey, guys, you don't like iran. we are going to cut off all their oil exports, but you've got to back me up on this. you've got a raise oil

production. so they did in the russians did. they said were going to grant waivers and not going to do this and prices collapsed. they are very angry at a cost of billions of dollars. >> that's a take down here. what is the impact going to be on price? >> the impact is a better fill up your gasoline tank. prices are a relatively calm because there's a short-term oversupply. that is going to change pretty dramatically in the new year. we are going to see a u.s. refiners scrambling to get that type of saudi oil that they like and that produces a lot of gasoline. >> i know we've had the 64 straight days of decline of gasoline prices at the pump. when does that stop? >> pretty soon. we can see probably right after the holidays were probably going to see them go up 64 days in a row especially the saudis follow through with the cut. you know i wanted to tell you

one more thing. we are over in the soybean tent over here. that is soybean oil. the guys are sitting down but don't let that fool you. they are trading with the screens there. over to the left this is soybean options. we were hoping would come in with more purchases after the earlier purchases but apparently they haven't because prices have collapsed. >> they actually have put in another purchase. they have their eyes bigger than their stomachs. sort of like asking for a president from santa claus. neil: the president kind of getting screwed here again? and they are taking steps in the right direction to make that happen. >> they often feel insulted that we don't give them enough attention. that's all right there is a big fox viewer right here. he is trying to keep a low profile. there you go. neil: i've got to tell you, and

are not exactly cutting the tension with a knife among the soybean crowd. you touched on it, just. this is an amazing thank you on the part of the saudi's and maybe to a lesser extent to a president who went beyond just supporting them to not even thinking of punishing them for the death of the "washington post" columnist khashoggi. right now we have the senate looking with overwhelming support on the part of democrats and republicans and this is the thanks he gets. i cannot imagine this president is going to treat or say something about it. >> haven't seen it yet, but one trader pointed out that is yesterdays news to them. what are you going to do to us? >> that's exactly the point. it is interesting after opec had their meeting and donald trump treated ahead of the meeting. but after they made the decision to cut production, he didn't

know what, he's worried about the u.s. producers. he's been getting a lot of pressure from u.s. producers to say quit reading about oil. i know you're trying to send a message to saudi arabia. fifty dollars i don't care what anybody says that if oil prices fall below $50 a barrel coming u.s. producers will have a very difficult time. >> and now the biggest producer in the world. neil: that's right. and i you've got to get back to the convention, so please do that. thank you, guys. very much. in the meantime, leave it to richard branson to trump jeff bezos and elon musk. now a rocket can get to the edge of space. yes branson. not those other guys.

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and add potential income. bring amlp into the game. before investing, consider the fund's investment objectives, risks, charges, and expenses. read the prospectus carefully at alpsfunds.com/amlp neil: alright, i thought we were going to listen to the sound of that. this is virgin black deck launching a tourism racket to the edge of space. the two top space experts say we should colonize the moon. just say you know, richard branson apparently beating out the likes of jeff dave does anyone musk to keep this going fast and make sure human beings can get out there. pioneer aeronautics president robert goodman joins us. great column this week talking

about the need to do more to colonize. i'm honored to have both of you here. thank you very much. >> thank you for having us come and kneel. neil: if i can begin with you and get your sense first of all about what all of these billionaires are doing because obviously we are not as involved as we used to be during the heyday of the space program and you guys don't get into that but the fact we're hitching rides at the russians to get out of there. that is going to change soon. but these actions by these guys are important, aren't they? >> yeah, musk in particular has accomplished the most and what it has shown it is possible for an actuarial organization to do things that previously was only the major powers could do and do them in one third the time at one 10th the cost and even do things they haven't done such as creating usable launch vehicles and as a result to set off a private space race, which is going to make it much cheaper

and easier for us to go to the moon, to martha not just to visit, but to stay. neil: why is it important and i raise this with you as well, to do this back at the moon. that is so 70s, isn't it? or would you see that maybe we are missing. >> in a way, it's kind of 50s because we built a station on the south pole in the 1950s and we did it for a lot of reasons are the same as building a base on the moon. it's as easy to get to them there now if that was to get to the south pole back in the 1950s. why do we want to do it? science obviously, but technological development and also there are a lot of value -- as a matter of fact, i can give you a business plan for being on the moon in 10 seconds. would you like to see it?

>> sure. finance a week from christmas and i still don't have your president. here's a little piece of the moon. did you know, neil, diamonds are as common in montana that they've got value. i don't want to trivialize it, but the thought the moon itself is of great value. we are going to look back and see the errors and it's not going to be the space station. it is really going to change our mind that about a lot of things. you can definitely make a business plan for being on . technological advancement and you know, let's go up there, i'm a son of a coal miner. i want to go up there and mine the thing, even if we don't under every crater is an asteroid. there are a lot of very interesting materials there, titanium, there is even gold on the moon. we need to find out what is there, not just there, take the

whole world. so when anybody, when any child on the earth, no matter where they're from, what their race is, what their religion is, they look up and go, look, human beings living on our moon cooperating in peace. you know we should do the same thing here on earth. neil: that is a, not a bad idea, if i try that trick you did i didn't get you anything but what do you think of this idea i think that would be a bad christmas morning. i would like your thoughts on this. we're starting another, you know, another unmanned craft left the bounds of our solar system and influence of the sun. we pay much more attention to colonizing like a moon or revisiting the moon or sending more craft to mars. i think, we've got flights planned there backing up like planes on laguardia, what is wrong with unmanned missions and type of achievement we're seeing

even out of the voyages from the 1970s? >> accomplishment of the manned space program, is great. and also the space astronomy program has done great things, kepler, hubble, these are purpose driven programs. when the spaceflight program was purpose driven, human missions to repair and and upgrade the hubble space telescope, they accomplished greater things. if we send humans to marchs we'll find out if mars is local to the earth or general to the universe. we have to have a human spaceflight program. unfortunately we don't. nasa, for instance, talking about going back to the moon, they're not talking about going back to the moon. they're talking about building a lunar orbit tollbooth. it has no purpose at all. it is not purpose driven

program. it is vendor-driven program. they're not doing something except to spend money. homer and i wrote about it in "the new york post." if you want to go to the moon, you need to go to the moon. spending eight years, $20 billion to build a space station in orbit around the moon, will do nothing, increase cost and difficulty of sending people to the moon or mars, makes no sense whatsoever. neil: homer, you have 20 seconds make a compelling case for us to be on the moon. >> like napoleon said, take brussels, take brussels. let's go to the moon. there are a lot of science and technology and i ultimately it will deliver a great deal of positive economic dividends back to the american taxpayer. we're all worried about that. neil: gentlemen, thank you both very much. you make a compelling case. i wouldn't argue with you. you're geniuses, thank you for all you do and represent. thank you, guys.

>> thank you, neil. neil: getting emails from quite a few viewers volunteering me for the first moonshot. that is very nice. turns out they were coming from charles payne who joins us now. >> i couldn't type fast enough, neil. thank you very much. what is not going anywhere now, that is the market. good afternoon, i'm charles payne. this is "making money." coming up we asked, we all did, right, get rid of the crazy gyrations make it stop. today it has. the grind is feeling more ominous for some people. people say no, this is how boards are put to place. if that is the case is this time for bottom fishing buying. we have advice head. are reports of the a recession next year greatly exaggerated? future of farming higher prices industrial con consolidan and what is next for the family farm. that is coming up and a