history. there is volatility for you. blake: maybe tomorrow we will just take a 100 point move in either direction. think that will happen? susan: very hard. blake: that does it for us. "bulls & bears" starts right now. david: breaking news. take a look at this. the party returning to wall street at least for a day in a major way, with the dow surging more than 1,000 points. the best single day point gain ever. hi, everybody. this is "bulls & bears." i'm david asman. joining me, morgan ortega, john layfield and rick unger. powerful stock rally today breaking a string of losses, obliterating the losses we suffered in the worst christmas eve trading session ever and making today the best day after christmas rally ever. going into today's rally, president trump said this was a terrific buying opportunity and at least today, he seems to have been right. so has the market hit bottom,

gang? >> i'm not going to throw cold water on a 1,000 point day but i have to throw a reminder in there. before today, the dow was down, get this, 4268 points in 14 trading days, so we were way overdue. i also want to mention, i coined the phrase many years ago in bear markets, rallies are sharp, quick, make you feel good, suck you in and then bury you soon after, and during this bearish phase we had a 2100 point rally and a 1700 point rally. so i love it, i'll take it, i need to see a little bit more before i'm ready to say the big low is in. >> i was feeling really good until gary -- david: me, too. >> gary's a smart guy. he's my friend and he's right. the market is trying to find pricing. if it weren't for all these political uncertainties, this market would be a screaming buy. take apple, for example.

apple is down from the low 200s to around $150 now. this stock now is a huge buy except for the fact if the trade war ramps up, the global supply chain gets almost destroyed because of this. if it doesn't ramp up, it's a screaming buy. that's the political uncertainty in the market right now. the market is trading about a 15 multiple which is a very low historic multiple. the problem now is you have brexit, you have trade wars, you have a government shutdown. there's a lot of uncertainty. that's very hard to price. >> gary doesn't want to pour cold water, then proceeds to give you a cold shower. i got to tell you, i'm kind of with him. it's great what happened today. i hope we see a lot more of it. too soon. too soon. there's still so much uncertainty in the market that i don't know how anybody can have any idea what the direction is. >> well i think we have gotten great fundamentals on wages, on consumer confidence, on the labor participation rate. what is not great is what we have seen happen as it relates

to the fed. this has nothing to do with trump, obama. this is the last ten years of quantitative easing and pumping trillions of dollars in the market so we are off of that sugar high, as the fed unwinds that, and the market is clearly signaling that they're not happy not only about the december rate but about the potential rate rises in 2019. the market wants the sugar high. david: on the other hand, does anybody here, after everything the fed has endured over the past couple weeks of stinging criticism not only from the president, but from a lot of economists, lot of serious economists, does anybody really think they will have that many more rate hikes? >> i actually don't but not for that reason. i think maybe the president will figure out, stay out of it, not your place to be jumping all over it. the economy is such, remember -- >> the fed said there's not going to be any more rate hikes. >> let me finish this point, gary. the fed operates on data. data is past and present. data is not future.

they do not predict the future. david: before you go, gary, i just want to say we do have a segment devoted to the fed so hold your fire until then. i want to ask you about trade. we heard john with some kind of depressing talk about the trade. i think that china is dying for some kind of deal. they may give trump just enough for him to claim victory and sign off on a trade deal, which i think would keep the market humming. no? >> well, it's got to have meat to the trade deal, not just something that on the face of it, hey, we're just going to do something to make it look good. you have to put some real importance to it. look, for me, the big thing about today is two words, wealth effect. if we keep going lower, the wealth effect i really think will affect the economy in a big way because i think a decent part of the last few years was central bank intervention, with asset prices going up, health in the economy on top of the economy, so if we can get back

up, i think that goes away. i'm still not so sure just yet. >> to that point, the lack of confidence in global policy makers i think is one of the problems that has a real problem with the market right now, and you look at what happened with general mattis, the first secretary of defense ever resigning. that doesn't have a huge effect on the market but it has an effect on how president trump handles negotiations and handles matters that is seemingly very unpredictable, and if he's that way with the secretary of defense, the worry is that he would be that way with president xi. i don't see an offramp with china here. china thinks they're winning. the u.s. thinks they're winning as well. so both sides have come to the party thinking that the other side is in a weaker position. that doesn't give room for negotiation. david: let me just put in a contrarian notion here, to john, who i usually agree with about 99.9%. this is the .1% when i disagree. i am very optimistic about what is happening. it may turn out bad. god help us if it does.

i think the fact people all over the world are questioning professional politicians and saying we don't trust you to deal with our money, from the local level here in new york city, where the mayor's increased spending 30% and the subways are dirtier and less effective than they have ever been, to on a grand scheme, so i'm a little optimistic about that. is nobody else? >> well, if we go back to the deal with china, we have until march 1st. we have two months to get this together. i spent over an hour last week off the record with a senior administration official who is part of these negotiations, and i think we all know this, they were candid about this, you have a couple different competing philosophies within the administration. not exactly a bad thing, but you do have the mnuchin camp and others who would like to see a deal, would like to see the markets not react so negatively, but then you have the people in the national security realm of things who are real china hawks who see the threat well beyond trade and tariffs, but see the espionage, the national security threats, the defense threats.

so if we have a deal that's meaningful, i want everyone to answer one thing. what will be different when xi, president xi of china stood in the rose garden with president obama in 2015 after that hack and made a list of promises of things he would never do, including building up in the south china sea which he's doing now. what's the difference? >> i'm with morgan. there will be no difference, in my opinion. you are absolutely right. he won't keep any of these promises. david, your point was interesting. i get what you're saying about it's a good thing that we are starting to finally question our leaders and what they're doing. david: what they're doing with our money. >> here's the problem, though. i think there's a difference between questioning, which i agree is healthy, and backing away and being afraid, because we think they don't know what they're doing. and i'm afraid that's what we're experiencing. david: i get you. >> let me put it best about our politicians right now. this coming year, the first $500 billion plus of our precious tax dollars are going to interest on

the debt that they created throughout all these years, and many of the same players, i won't even call them leaders, are still in there running the country and we expect different things to happen. of course, we can talk the big enchilada, $22 billion of debt, that matters. that's a head wind for the economy going forward and there is nobody doing a thing about it and hardly anybody even talking about it. david: i would put it to you one reason the market's doing well right now is because they know that at least as long as the government's shut down, there's going to be nobody doing anything about anything inside the beltway. >> i certainly agree with that. i want to clarify here. i think politicians as a group are absolutely incompetent. i hope that doesn't translate any other way out there. these guys have an approval rating of a pest exterminator. david: i like pest exterminators. >> you're right. i shouldn't bash pest

exterminateors. look, the economy right now, there's a lot of good positive things out there. there's the global uncertainty is a real problem, the head wind going forward, but you have 5.1% retail sales which were huge. you had 26% e-commerce sales were up. you got almost full employment. you have wages that are increasing. there's a lot of great things going up. we're not falling off a cliff here. our earnings, corporate earnings will go from about 23% to about 7% next quarter. that is a slowdown but it's not falling off a cliff. we're not hitting the trough of say 2008 like we hit back then. i don't think that's coming right now. i think it's all about this uncertainty and the fact that we're slowing down. david: great point. now to another big story we are following. president trump and the first lady leaving the white house late last night, making a very surprising trip to iraq, arriving this afternoon. hillary vaughn is standing by at the white house. this is a very closely held secret. what can you tell us about how it unfolded? reporter: well, i can tell you this. they are embarking on the final

leg of what is going to be a two-stop surprise visit. we didn't know about the first stop and we don't know where the second stop is going to be, but we do know that earlier today, the president visited u.s. troops in iraq. the president and first lady melania trump leaving christmas night at the white house to spend the afternoon today with over 5,000 military men and women. this is his first visit to a combat zone as president. president trump has been under criticism for not visiting the troops in the middle east earlier in his presidency, but today, trump says they have been trying to schedule an overseas trip for awhile, but people found out and the trip had to be canceled because of security precautions. >> the other reason i'm here today is to personally thank you and every service member throughout this region for the near elimination of the isis territorial caliphate in iraq and in syria. two years ago, when i became president, they were a very dominant group.

they were very dominant. today, they're not so dominant anymore. reporter: the president says he has no plans to pull out of iraq but gained more insight into his foreign policy strategy to pull out of syria, saying iraq will remain a launching point for attacks against isis when necessary and also pushed back against reports that called the troop drawdown in syria hasty and reckless, saying he gave several six-month extensions to military leadership and finally made the call that the troops got to go. david? david: hillary, thank you very much. morgan, you have a lot of -- you were in the military, but you have a lot of contacts in this administration. how do you think all this is -- came down and was it on the spur of the moment? this is something i guess that has to be planned pretty far in advance for security reasons. >> yeah. when i worked at several embassies at the state department, overseas, you would spend probably four to six weeks working on something like this. it would be classified at the highest levels because it's not

about getting it out to the press, you don't want the enemy to know the movement, weapon esy with the first lady there. i can tell you when a president, any president goes into a war zone to see the troops, especially on a holiday, what a boon it is for them. they actually have a very dear friend deployed right now to iraq, a reservist like me, and he's on active duty at the moment. got a picture with the president, texted it to me. he was so excited. i spent thanksgiving in 2007 at the u.s. embassy in baghdad and any little moment you get, brian crocker came to see us that day, the ambassador in charge, it really lifts your spirits to know that people care. i'm proud of the president for doing this. i think it was the right move. some people have said well, is this reaction to syria. it takes weeks to plan this. david: some people also suggested that in fact, this was to divert attention from the shutdown but in fact, for all of the talk about the shutdown having something to do with this trip, the trip must have been planned before the shutdown actually happened.

>> definitely. whether it's a cabinet official or the president, top levels at the pentagon and people on the ground, again, a trip like this would have been highly classified. that's why no one knew about it. >> who cares what anybody says? lifting the morale of these wonderful brave men and women in uniform that are out there protecting us for the betterment of us, there is nothing better than seeing smiles on their face and seeing how they look and how they feel on a day like today. good on the president. david: john has taken part in a lot of these things. you have done a lot for the troops in a war zone, right? >> yeah, i have been there seven, eight time. spent seven or eight christmases in iraq or afghanistan. i wish every american could see what these men and women that i consider heroes are doing over there. they are serving in really bad circumstances and in a place they don't really want to be, away from their family. they love when civilians of any kind come to visit. then you add entertainers, the president of the united states himself, this is a wonderful event. i think the president did a wonderful thing to do here. i don't think there's anything

negative that should be said about this. >> here's some breaking news. i have absolutely no criticism of the president for doing this. i'm actually very grateful that he did. it was the right thing to do. i will raise a question i just think is interesting. does anybody think that maybe this is why he decided to stay at the white house? keeping this a secret if he were leaving for mar-a-lago might have been much more difficult than doing it from the white house. >> that's a good point. i know the mar-a-lago air space was shut down for at least under the hold it's normally under when the president comes and then it was released. i don't know that it -- i'm just thinking, i don't know if it would have made a difference if he took off from new york versus palm beach. it's more the logistics on the ground. david: it's a great thing to do this christmas. we all agree on that, which is unusual. great stuff. thank you, mr. president. meanwhile, early reports showing record holiday sales for retailers. what does this mean for the strength of the economy? that's next.

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david: shoppers gifting retailers, their strongest holiday sales in six years. today, u.s. retail sales up more than 5%. consumers overall spending more

than $850 billion this holiday season. are these sales figures a better gauge of the strength of the economy than the markets have been? joining us to discuss is former walmart ceo, bill simon. bill, great to see you. happy holidays. there's a lot of talk about recession. i have never seen sales like this right before a recession. have you? >> no. definitely not. the u.s. is still a consumer driven economy and the consumer's very happy right now. you said in your last segment jobs are plentiful, wages are increasing for the first time in awhile and the consumer's very, very happy as witnessed by very strong christmas retail sales. >> terrific to have you on the show. happy holidays to you. retail sales have been very good. consumer confidence, albeit a backward looking indicator, is at an 18-year high. as you mentioned, we have full employment, wages are increasing, gas prices being low. the question is what happens next? what happens next quarter? there's obviously a global slowdown happening and it

appears that the u.s. is headed for a slowdown as well. do you see that same slowdown coming in the u.s., particularly in retail sales, and if you do, how bad do you think it will be? >> yeah. i think it's going to -- the growth rate will slow but it won't slow to anything that is going to be problematic. we were growing at 4% last year gdp, some of the quarters will be 2%, 2.5% and i think that will be plenty. the consumer can pull us through. i think if we can manage to stay out of our own way and not chicken little ourselves, the sky is falling, to death, i think the consumer will pull us through whatever the global slowdown impact might be. >> i wonder if a question more relevant to walmart stores in particular, tariffs. if we actually see the president put that 25% tariff on so many chinese goods, which he tells us he doesn't want to see happen, he's trying to work that out, isn't that a bigger threat to a store like walmart than anything we are seeing in the economy?

>> well, just to be clear, two-thirds of what walmart sells is either manufactured or grown in the u.s. so it will have an impact on about a third of their products that are imported and only a portion of that from china, then only the part of the cost of goods where the tariff is is where the price increases will be. it will have an impact on the consumer but it's not a 25% increase or devastating increase as you might think it would be. but i am probably like david, hopeful that it will get resolved. i think there's enough incentive to both parties to get this thing solved in one form or fashion in the coming months. >> bill, this is morgan. what do you think about the mountain of consumer debt that we're seeing piling up, and it is rather significant. do you think that debt will cause any sort of slowdown in consumer spending in 2019, or are you not yet worried about consumer debt? >> hi, morgan. i think consumer debt's a

problem but not a problem in the midterm. probably more of a problem in the long term. it takes awhile to get, to have the cumulative effect to slow down the economy from a consumer perspective. as long as wages keep going up, the consumer can afford to take a little bit more debt and i think that's what we'll see through 2019. beyond that, it will be hard to say. david: what about the news itself, bill, excepting fox business, of course, we don't do anything that gets consumers nervous, but there is a lot of nerve-rattling news that's been coming out. earlier in the week we had this phone call steve mnuchin made to the banks. some people kind of panicked on that. does all this negative news and of course, the media hate trump and so there's more than our share these days, does that affect consumers? >> i don't think it has yet, but i think it could. the cumulative effect of bad news, it could have an effect on the consumers. look, we sit here on these

programs and struggle to explain why the market was down 600 on monday and up 1,000 on wednesday. it's really, it really baffles us. so the consumer doesn't even sort of process that. but the cumulative effect of tariffs and market dynamics and interest rates and mueller investigation and secretaries coming and going in the administration, i think in time can wear on the consumer and hopefully some of that will stabilize as we get into the new year. >> bill, this is gary kaltbaum. i want to ask you something different. i printed out today, googled the words "defunct retailers of the united states" and it is a who's who of small, medium, big and actually gargantuan size retailers but walmart continues to thrive. i think about $500 billion in yearly sales now. can you tell fledgeling retail entrepreneurs or just entrepreneurs generally what the

difference that walmart, what are the traits and characteristics that they have that made them thrive while others have gone by the wayside? >> yeah, nathat's a great questn and it's so true. people come and go from that list of retailers and it's really difficult to stay there. what walmart is successfully done over their 50 plus year history is reinvent itself time and time and time again. walmart started as 5 & 10 store and reinvented itself as a discount store, first of its kind, then reinvented as a super center, then reinvented as grocery store and now is re-inventing itself again to become digitally capable and effective online. now they are taking it in my view to another place that even amazon can't compete with, and that is having a very, very effective digital platform and still having a huge, enormous physical retail platform. they have just successfully

reinvented themselves. never been content with the status quo, never tried to, you know, turn their business in a cash cow, not afraid to invest and that would be my advice. don't ever be satisfied with where you are, because a competitor will always do something better. you have to be able to react to it. david: we saw that with sears. by the way, it was extraordinary to find there isn't a niche that even amazon can't compete with. that is walmart's niche. it's always great to see you. thank you so much for coming on. we really appreciate it. >> thank you. happy new year. david: happy new year. perfect day for bill. we are five days into the partial government shutdown. the president digging in on his threat to keep it going. as long as it takes to get his border wall funded. with democrats about to take over the house, is there any end in sight? some answers coming next. jardiance asked-

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how long do you think the shutdown will last, mr. president? >> whatever it takes. i mean, we're going to have a wall. we're going to have safety. we need safety for our country. david: the president taking questions while visiting troops in iraq, doubling down on his threat to keep the government shut down for as long as it takes to get a deal to fund the border wall. that as his white house economic adviser's downplaying the shutdown's impact on the economy. roll the tape. >> the kind of things the services the people get out of government aren't really affected very much. if the shutdown expended through the job survey week, about january 10th, then the government workers who are not reporting to work would show up in the unemployment statistics as well but that would be more of a temporary thing. in the end, a few week shutdown is not going to be something that has any kind of significant effect on the outlook. david: so gang, is he right or should we be concerned? >> actually, kevin hassett is probably right in the main. of course, that's the general

economy. go talk to a federal worker who is going to work every day and not getting paid. his or her economy's not going to do so well. look, there's one thing everybody keeps forgetting. this shutdown will get tiresome for the republicans in congress at a point, and when it does, they will pass a budget, they will send it to the president. the president won't sign it and congress will override that veto. that's how this is likely to end up. >> if i may disagree with rick, as a former federal worker and someone who still has many friends there, what most of my friends who are still in were complaining about was if they got designated as being an essential employee which means they still had to work. everyone else is pretty excited because they know they get paid and get the time off. we love our federal workers but they have seen this song and dance before. there's like a shutdown almost every year now. they know it will be fine. but here's what i have seen. hold on one second. here's what i have seen so far. i have seen the president's advisers have gone on national television and said they have given a number in between the

1.7 and 5 plus the president was asking for. what we have seen so far from pelosi and schumer is just blaming the shutdown on trump and no indication that they're coming to the table negotiating. so the president's team are indicating that they are willing to negotiate, they are putting new numbers out there. we have yet to see any response from the democrats they are interested in doing that. >> the longest shutdown has been 21 days. the average has been three to five. it really does not affect economies. i must tell you, i'm just this logical guy with a rusty abacus that says the last two years, federal spending was about $8 trillion, almost $2 trillion of it deficit spending, yet government's telling us they don't have five measly billion dollars for a wall? >> they have it. they don't want to spend it. >> listen, this politics of doing for our own party and screwing over the people, i'm not saying the wall is right or wrong, i'm just saying they are

playing based on their own base, both parties, and it is getting nauseating. this is how you get to $22 trillion of debt when there's absolutely no accountability with these people. i find it amazing out of all the money spent by government, this little $5 billion is being held up and nothing getting done. david: they are just arguing over words, you're right. every president since ronald reagan has said they will secure that southern border. republicans and democrats. they have had mixed success. some have done better than others but all these guys, the republicans and the democrats, believe in border security. they are arguing over the word "wall" and what's being left out of this, like rick said, you have 800,000 americans and if you are christmas time and you have a family of three and you have bills to pay, it hurts you to not have a paycheck. i think it is embarrassing and disgusting that these guys have shut down the government because they can't do their job. it's simply the fact they cannot do their job. all the other argument is over

the wall. david: i agree with you but on the other hand, i have to ask again, what is worse, when the government does nothing or when it does too much? what do you think? >> i think when the government does nothing, you are at a stand-still, the markets tend to do well. look, i understand it's a blip. i understand they are going to get their pay but it's christmas time. you look at 800,000 of our fellow americans out there without a paycheck right now, so there is a casualty in this. is it good the government doesn't do anything? absolutely. i wish the government would do nothing for the next ten years. >> the government always does something and you know what the big sin is? $3 billion was added to our debt today. our debt. tomorrow, $3 billion. and every day thereafter, $3 billion. >> $300 billion the first three months of the fiscal year, it is a trillion and a half dollar run rate. what will be insane if at the next election the democrats are going to run on fiscal responsibility.

david: it is spending, spending, spending. we have more tax revenues now than we ever have had, particularly after the tax cuts, which led to an increase in growth and more people paying income tax, et cetera. but it is spending. no matter who's in charge, republican or democrat. >> i like what john said. gary, we expect you to pick up today's deficit. you've got that $3 billion. today's your day for that. john, you are right. the democrats are going to run on that and it's unbelievable, because nobody seems to want to acknowledge that. you saw it starting to happen in the midterms. democrats are now going to become the party of fiscal responsibility. >> oh, no. >> it's going to happen. it's going to happen. listen to john layfield. david: doesn't pass the smell test. >> not if you're running on medicare for all, free college for all, free this, free that. >> nobody is running on free college for all. >> everybody. there -- the democrat nominee in 2020 will be running on free college for all.

david: the congresswoman-elect from queens is saying that. meanwhile, president trump's public criticism of the fed continues but is it having a positive impact? we will take a closer look, next. hi.i just wanted to tell you that chevy won a j.d.power dependability award for its midsize car-the chevy malibu. i forgot. chevy also won a j.d. power dependability award for its light-duty truck the chevy silverado.

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they're raising interest rates too fast. that's my opinion. but i certainly have confidence. i think it will stay. i mean, the fact is that the economy's doing so well that they raised interest rates and that's as a form of safety. david: president trump once again calling out the federal reserve, this time on christmas day, trying to give a positive spin to the fed's rate hikes. some argue the president's public lam basting of powell and the fed actually forced the fed's hand into a rate hike to prove its independence, but does this controversy actually have any impact on the fed? what do you think? >> look, i wanted the fed abolished ages ago.

david: i know you did. >> their function to me is a joke and i think ben bernanke created asset bubbles i don't know how we will get out of. but as president of the united states, my biggest advice is to hush. you are dealing with now fragile markets. you are no longer dealing with rip-roaring bull markets where anything you say, markets go up. you will affect things and i think a couple of the tweets hit the market pretty hard. i just say leave it be right now, and if you want to talk to the guy, just bring him into the oval office and have a meeting. greenspan used to have meetings in the oval office. there's nothing wrong with it. there is a lot wrong with interference because it just confuses the people, investors and markets. >> i think there is a long history of presidents and their fed chairmen not getting along. we talked about this before. lyndon johnson reportedly physically shoved his fed chairman. they did not get along. david: he did that with everybody. that's how you knew he loved you. >> gary has a good point about

taking these matters in private although i don't think that's the president's style. he genuinely believes in openness and transparency. we will see if he takes our advice here. what's more important going forward is when you look at the -- i think with a lot of hubris by the fed. janet yellen was quoted a few months ago, i'm paraphrasing, she didn't think there would be another financial crisis in her lifetime, the fed had put enough guards into place to where that couldn't happen. i think that's indicative of the larger attitude at the fed, they are the saviors of the economy. >> i got to say that being open and transparent does not mean telling people this is a great buying opportunity. there is a reason -- david: by the way, turned out to be. he said it this morning before we had a 1,000 point gain. >> it could have just as well gone another way. last i checked, the president does not have an investment adviser's certificate. he is not licensed to sell securities. he needs to shut up. because if i listened to his advice every day about buying on the market, i'm going to sue him

when i lose money. >> okay, that's fine, but what about the actions of the fed for the past ten years? instead of beating up on this president, he has been here for two of the ten, what about the irresponsible behavior we have seen by multiple fed chairmen at this point? >> i'm getting waved on. >> like a good fight. david: ronald reagan certainly assuaged markets concerns, saying markets go up, markets go down. he's being a cheerleader for the market. i'm not sure that's bad. i do agree that him interfering with the fed, let the market believe the fed was in trump's back pocket, then all of a sudden the hubris of the fed came out and said we're independent, we will do things as we want and i think it has lent itself to the fed wanting to raise rates to kind of show their independence which may not be the best thing to do because to gary's point, i don't know if they caused the last two financial crises, they certainly missed both of them. >> they sure did. i'm with gary k. we should get rid of the fed. that simple. >> yesterday. david: college football fans are

crying foul as the latest conflict between disney and verizon threatens to black out this season's games. more on that coming next.

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david: a big cause for concern for football fans. verizon fios customers watching espn today saw an ominous message scroll on the bottom of the screen. verizon may force espn to block college football just in time for the semifinals this weekend. verizon denies the claims, saying espn's owner, disney, is just playing hardball in a contract dispute to raise fees but could disney be shooting itself in the foot by ticking off a lot of sports fans who already have a lot of problems with the sports channel? what do you think? >> i got to tell you, i think they are both potentially shooting themselves in the foot. i was one of the people who got that message today. i suspect i am not the only person on this panel who is a big college football fan. that day, new year's day, is the most important day of my year and this year, my ohio state buckeyes will be in the rose bowl. i'm not missing it, which means if those games are gone, verizon, you're gone, espn, you're gone. david: a plague on both your

houses. >> rick, your anger is misguided. it should be at the idiots at the ncaa who didn't have 18 playoffs. >> i vent my anger on a regular basis. >> even with that slipup to purdue they should be in it. for me, it's business as usual. look, verizon was the one wanting to go to a skinny bundle to go after disney here. disney right now is just from a position of strength, they got the four biggest movies of the year and also own college football right now, at least the playoffs. to me, it's just a business that right now, disney has negotiating strength and are using it. >> republicans, democrats, verizon, disney, i don't think anybody can get along anymore. it's kind of depressing to watch. but look, disney has the strength. they are trying to sell high and they are going to start high and then negotiate down, if need be. that's all that's going on here. it's the art of the deal. i suspect something will get done just like government will be open sooner rather than later, and everybody will be

watching their football games with a lot of beer and nachos. >> i guess i'm not sporty spice. i will be the only one not watching the games. i plan on having a nice champagne brunch on new year's day. >> how dare you! >> but i think, as rick pointed out, you want to see these games if you are an avid fan, you will find a way to see the game. i think these companies are shooting themselves in the foot. ultimately if they do this because you are going to continue to see young people who are die-hard fans, they will see it online, whatever it is. you will continue to lose consumers. >> inviting us to the champagne brunch? >> everyone is welcome. david: i was going to have a beer lunch with you and watch the games. >> that works. david: rick and i were talking before the segment about how many people are finally going to make that leap to cut the cable and just stream everything, find -- you know there's got to be some way you are going to be able to stream, eventually stream college football games, right? >> sure. >> you are starting to see it already in europe, starting to see when they have a world cup,

epl games, you can buy certain packages for european soccer. you are starting to see that some. espn came out with espn plus, a million subscribers already. that's where they're headed. they are making so much money, they are making $80 per subscriber for these events. that's an outrageous fee. >> cable subscriber numbers are way down. david: they lost two billion subscribers in the last year. rick is absolutely right. >> but they picked up a million with espn plus. they are mitigating this a lot. you don't count espn red zone which isn't counted. they are losing a lot of cord cutters but are finding ways to get around it. eventually everybody will go around that just as wwe did when they went over the top and cannibalized their own pay per view business. david: gary, do you have streaming or still have cable? >> i'm still in the dark ages with directv right now. but my kids keep yelling and screaming at me. they put netflix and fire sticks all over my tv and i'm learning how to use them right now. look, it is the shape of things to come.

whoever does not move with it is going to be in trouble. it's why disney got away from netflix and is putting their own streaming on also. there's going to be a lot more where that came from. david: i don't know anybody under 30 who has cable anymore. nobody under 30. everybody under 30 that i know is streaming everything and saving a lot of money. >> you and i have discussed this. our generation started television. our generation's going to end television. nobody who's young has any need for it anymore. david: let's hope "bulls & bears" finds a way. thank you, gang. college is now offering to pay students to take a year off. more on this move, coming next. ♪ - [narrator] do you have less energy than you used to?

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david: colleges are looking to pay you to take a year off. estee lauder's grandson and his wife pledging to pay accepted students $5,000 to $15,000 to take a year after before starting their four-year bachelor's program. >> when i was a waitress my senior year of high school and

my senior year, i know we are pressing people to go into too much debt. so the fact is, not everyone needs a four-year university degree. there is something to be said about wonderful technical colleges. let's stop having such an elitist debate about gap years and find what's best for young people to get good skills jobs. >> i think it's elitist. these kids who get to travel the world. >> you can join the military if you want to travel the world. join the navy. >> the exchange program that can take these kids all over the world. our colleges are doing a terrible job of preparing our youth with these stupid liberal

arts degrees to do anything in our so you see it. it he laces bigotry and prejudice. i think it's great for those that can't. >> we are too hard on liberal arts degree. i love the idea of that year between college and or/high school and college. we should all be required to do volunteer service to our country. >> i completely agree with rick. philanthropy, internships, work, whatever it may be, a breath of fresh air, take one year between. that's a lot of school from kindergarten from all the way. get people to understand the best thing you can ever do is for others that you need absolutely nothing from, it's a great lesson.

>> i took a year off between high school and college. i work might butt off to pay for my first year of college. but also to get enough money so i could take two months in the europe. you can't imagine appreciating all of that had i not worked on my own without getting money from anybody. that's what concerns me. the fact that you get money from the outside for just having fun. there is something wrong with that. >> it's kind of weird. >> i think we all agree with you. >> college is about education. if they can fund this where it's not coming out of the government purse, education is the great equalizer. david: this is a private individual endowing a private university with an idea in is no government money involved. god bless them, it's a wonderful

thing about america, we have fillon throw i. great things from this panel. happy holidays to all of you. that does it for "bulls and bears." we hope you join us next time. we'll see you then. [♪] >> from the worst december to the biggest single-day point gain in history, a huge market rally after a bloody december. the dow up 1,000 points five days after the government shutdown. this is "the evening edit." the market sky rocketing as president trump travels to iraq to that troops for their