i'm bob massi. i'll see you next week. [ woman vocalizing ] that doesn't press. have a great weekend. bulls and bears right now. >> big news on the trade front sending stock soaring today. hello. this is bulls and bears, thanks for joining us. i'm david. joining me as lauren, jonas, rick, and gary. bloomberg is reporting a trillion dollar offer is on the table from the chinese. china will buy up american goods aimed at bringing the trade imbalance to the u.s. 20. market searching on the headlines with the dow ended up 336. this is proof despite negative news all the markets really care about is the trade deal with china. what you think?

>> i don't think that's all we care about. you have to rewind about 30 days and think about all the negatives the market was facing. we had the tariffs, we had while almost the shutdown at that time. twenty-seven days. we had the mueller investigation. we have worries about the feds. i think you'll find that any bit of good news on any one of those five or six barriers that will propel this market forward, we have had sort of good news. but we have had no more bad news. my only worry is that any one of those, another drop it back down we go. for now, fingers crossed. >> when we got the china report yesterday in the afternoon, i think the dow was up 500-point since then. that proves that the market does care and respond to hopes of a

trade deal with china. let's just say we get one and everything starts to look better. stocks go up, the economy is doing better. then the feds will come in and rain on the parade. now or in the same problem all over again. >> hopefully it will not get that good. >> i'm not kidding. to gary's point, there is a lot of bad news brewing including risk your debt that was all of those things have magically repaired themselves to get this good move. it is not enough to really drive to record highs. these are your parts that are missing. as far as record highs, were not seeing growth stories coming out. that's great news. we can get the chinese to buy more stuff but that will not drive stocks radically higher.

we need some stories coming out of tech land that is not good news. an environment not to crash and. >> there's also diversification intact. if you look at the backdrop it might unite the world. chinese technology in u.s. and that is not always good for u.s. tech companies. >> number one, it sounds great that we could sell the trillion dollars worth of goods to the chinese. i haven't heard a word about protecting intellectual property. if were not dealing with that they'll be enormous criticism. can any of you remember the last time the chinese kept a deal with us for much of anything let alone a six-year term to buy this stuff? i don't trust it. when those start i think you'll find that people react to that

in the market. >> we have breaking news. we are joined by white house economic counselor, larry car drove. thank you for coming out in the cold. it is before the storm. let's talk about a storm. >> it's a great day to be a live. >> it seems things are working out well. has china conceded adult points so that were not going to have to raise tariffs on march 1? >> it's impossible to answer that question. we made progress with china and the deputies meeting in beijing last week. nothing has been resolved. nothing on contract. i want to be an optimist about china trade. the president has indicated a certain amount of optimism. he is communicating with chinese president. but some of these news reports are inaccurate and incorrect.

that does not mean in the next several months or so we cannot have very good deals on china trade. i'm not ruling that out. but these reports are suggesting right now that things are done, things are agree to. the technology staff has not been dealt with. the enforcement stuff has not been dealt with. the commodity and tariff rates, were moving on the right track. i want to be optimistic. were being positive. but people are filing news reports as though things are done. it is not so. president trump is a much ruder negotiator than that. please give him credit. let's wait and see. i think the market was strong today because of your fabulous manufacturing spending report. the economy is doing great. >> i don't disagree in terms of the economy.

i do disagree in terms of the market. every time there is news on china it seems to move the markets one way or the other. today is no different. i think the report that there is a deal to increase for china's, that's what was moving the market today. you disagree? >> i think it is a mixed bag. there is a lot of crosscurrents in a day. is the china trade talk important? yes. will it affect the economy. yes. they will have a trade talk of future growth in the united states and it will grow. i do not deny your fundamental point. all i'm saying is other things are going on in the economy. i don't want to get ahead of the story. talk to president trump on this. he wants to make a china deal,

that is a great deal for america. it is workforce, farmers, manufacturers. technology. we cannot let them steal her simple -- some of these news stories, he can't jump him. he has to go through the proce process. he has to make a great deal for america. it will not happen overnight. we are moving in a positive direction. >> but is one of the things we have put on the table that china has to import more u.s. goods to get us to an even trade balance? >> yes. this goes back to win we went to beijing almost a year ago. look, we want china to abolish their tariffs.

we want them to abolish their nontariff barriers in their subsidies. if you open these markets, american farmers make the best produce in the world. american manufacturers make the best industrial supplies and capital goods in the world. the same is true for energy. we have always wanted that. of course, the technology stuff it's all been a package from day one. i can't stand here and say it's done. >> david: is the focus on removing tariffs more on reaching an arbitrary level of trade balance are in balance. >> i think the principal focus for the long run has to be to remove tariffs. our expert sale will soar. we are the most competitive economy in the world.

in every single field. it has got to be a tariff chan change. it has to be non- tariffs and subsidies. it has to be technology. look, this is a large-scale, complicated process that covers the ground. nothing has tried this before. president trump has had the backbone to do it. he has called china on it. he has taken actions with tariffs. he is being tough if he has to be tough. this is the first time with any magnitude and the seriousness has ever been tried. that by itself is a very good thing. we are going to have to see. there is people getting ahead of the game. it's much better can we talk about the increase in the production of business equipment

which means tax is going to soar. i will have 3% growth in the fourth quarter and the two years of the trump administration we have achieved 3% growth which are critic said we cannot do, and we have done it. >> the job numbers continue to come and go. unemployment continues to be down. you have still more jobs than jobseekers. you read the headlines and they're all talking about how it will go to heck because of what's happening with the shutdown. what effect do you think the shutdown will have? >> whatever the quantitative is, nobody knows. it's temporary. his super temporary. everybody knows that. that's why the stock market is looking through it. point number two, you just hate

to see any pain or difficulties, any problems with people week to week and paycheck to paycheck. hardship is bad. i have to say this, the president is 100% rate on the issue of border security on the wall. this is a nation saving in my judgment at least. a nation saving principal that we must fight for. it's a security issue and humanitarian issue. by the way, i will say this, robert once upon a time wrote a poem that said great fences make great neighbors. i would make this argument. we have a catastrophe at the border. if you fix that and follow the guide, it will help the american economy. it will help american workers at the border and elsewhere.

i'm just saying, this is a lifesaving principal worth fighting for. on the other hand, keep your eye on the long-term and private sector. the job numbers will be better than you think. they will be up, not down. we are doing things that people said we cannot do. it goes back three years working on the story. it is panning out. i know some people don't want to give us credit. >> david: revenge of the --dash we've been talking about this for years and here's another example. i have to ask you, they have moderated their policies or at least their rhetoric concerning rate hikes. i'm wondering how much you think is because of what the president said about what the fed was doing. >> the president has expressed his opinion. i am many others thinks he was

right. i'm not going to play that game. he expresses his opinion. the president has acknowledged that a million times. i think the fed is perhaps as we listen to what they are saying, it's not my view, it's their view about having patience and so forth. i think that's a good policy. can i just step back, i know we love to talk about the feds. i started my career as the new york fed in 1973. let me just say, lower marginal tax rates and major deregulatory rollbacks and opening up the energy sector it has had huge,

major gigantic contributions to the animal spirit in the entrepreneurship and the lifeblood of this economy. blue-collar workers, the best since the 80s. the wages of blue-collar workers are aging faster. this is not about money in the feds, it's about incentives. if you tax something less unregulated less, you get more of it. this is what trump talked about. >> do you think they can have this great growth without high inflation and the need to raise rates. >> i always go into deep prayer and meditation. i think some recent statements are encouraging chairman paul gave a good interview, richard

is writing brilliant speeches and people should read what he just did for the money market tears. so, is the fed on the learning curve, i hope so. >> thank you so much for >> thank you so much for stopping by.

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>> david: larry was just speaking with us. i want to get the panel's reaction to the fact that the white house was so anxious to pour cold water on this story that we have reached a deal with china. that led to the market booming today. we do have the sound bite. this play that and get your reaction. >> nothing has been resolved. no contracts. i want to be an optimist about china trade. the president has indicated a certain type of confidence. but i must tell you, some of these news reports are in accurate. >> so, why would the white house want to pour cold water on a story with china?

>> there is a lot of robert frost in there. he also said positive things about the economy. not seen them rally and fall apart. i would say because it's the road not taken. they don't want the stock market to go up another thousand points. and then there setback or negative information. markets are dying to go up right now. they're looking for something good and he's putting a little chill out, don't pop the champagne yet. >> i have to say, i appreciate his comments. you will recall what i said at the top. i was not very impressed with what i was reading from bloomberg. i think it is easy for the chinese to cheat on a deal that

is based on importing american goods. to me, if the president wants a big win he has to do something to solve the intellectual-property problem. i was pleased to hear larry say that that's what it's about. i think he was also right when he said a victory has to include not just a six-year purchase of goods but are changing of the terror structure in china. i give him credit and i hope that is the course he was on. >> he was positive, not optimistic. i'm curious about the 2024 deadline. get the tariffs to zero by that date. that is into an assumed second term, is that a way they can appeal to the president we have confidence in you, i don't know. the issue is the follow through. can we trust the chinese?

is that one of their sweeteners? >> i am a little bit more cynical than everybody else. first of all. >> i agree with what rick said. but all that you laid out quite honestly is pie in the sky. that will never happen. my take away from this, my cynical part says nothing has been done. there is nothing out there. he would have given a shred of fact if there was something out there. it's all fumes. finally, we have not seen the reaction yet. my feeling now is this news in the future is a big uh-oh. that's all we been riding on. we been riding on rumor and kudlow has said there's nothing out there. >> we should mentioned as far as we can tell, right now after market there is not a huge reaction.

we will wait and see. the one thing that bothers me about the report, although he denied the report, was the idea that governments can somehow regulate to a precise million dollar mark how much experts or imports they have. that is the kind of government regulation i don't think is possible. particularly with the chinese who lie about their stats. >> this is where the negotiation gets dangerous. their whole country is organized by the government. there is a lot of questionable debt. even if we are being too shrewd, we can drive them into a deeper session by trying too hard. we could be trying to break china's back. the market was down a lot in the last few years. was spread across a huge economy.

it could be bad to everybody. you don't want to be to successful negotiating with china. there's a big economy and very leveraged. it can always be bogged down. >> i love david's points. it is true. in the real world, the government cannot make $6 trillion worth of goods to be purchased. i don't care how much you lower tariffs. you will in th improve the opportunity to shift more stuff but you cannot make a guarantee. that's what happens when two things are in play. the chinese are willing to tell the president what he wants to hear, and the president wants to look for a victory. >> once again, we thank larry for coming on. of course they are looking for victory. well, they are saying to not get ahead of yourself. pace yourself. more to come. we will be right with my friends to our annual

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>> david: we have debated many times what the consequences should be for facebook's privacy violations. the report says u.s. regulators have meant to impose a record-setting fine. much larger than the 22.5 million google had to pay. it would be the first major punishment against facebook in the u.s. even if the reports were true with this just be a slap on the wrist? >> i think it's useless. at 22.5 million to google's lunch money, i don't care if you triple that amount. it will be snack money to facebook. there's only two issues with facebook. first, can they fix these problems and i think that is the question that has to be discussed. no amount of fine will answer that question. the other, are facebook's problems causing them to lose subscribers? those are the only two things facebook cares about.

you can find them till the cows come home and it will change anything. >> it might. they have been finding wells fargo and is starting to have -- this company is a little dodgy. they're not doing as well now. at the end of the day, their lightly regulated compared to the banks. there's a million ways a bank can get fine. you're talking about an ftc violation. they're basically saying in 2011, you're telling your users you can do it will protect your data but in fact they are lying to the users. they say were not going to do that, were going to tell the people i will hustle out all their private information to third parties. then they did it anyway. i say find them triple digits. it has to go. >> there has not been any punishments really yet for facebook.

if they finally get an actual, real fine no matter what the size, it's about time. do they change their practices? probably not. do you not use facebook anymore? i don't know. if you're not using facebook, you're using instagram, and they own that. >> i think it comes back to rick's point. do they want to change. look, first of all, facebook is sitting on $44 billion of liquidity. even if the fine is $100 million, it is .2% in accounting terms. they say that's a withdrawal from petty cash. you pick the 20s out from under the cash register. that's nothing. by the way, can they do it? this probably takes a programmer ten minutes to change the privacy settings for facebook as an entirety. that's a no-brainer. the question is, do they want to

do that? i don't think 99% of the people care or know. i had to go in the other day and change my privacy settings because i was getting unsolicited friend requests were being sent out. i did not know how. i learned in two seconds. that's it, i didn't care. i think this is a nonissue for facebook, unless they want to spin it in their way. they're saying we are paying 100 million and donated 100 million to a politically correct cause and will be totally private from here. >> even then you would see the stock rally. >> the 2011 consents that they sign with the fcc. they said facebook's innovation does not have to come at the expense of consumer privacy. the action will ensure it. of course it didn't. i'm wondering how much it is if the fcc can enforce anything.

>> they are like a catchall. like the food truck outside has more specific regulators. there is no social media regulator yet. if they keep overstepping the bounds which are pretty broad than they will end up with a specific tech or social media regulator. then it will be hard to operate and grow. you're going to have more trouble. >> david: we have to go. i have not seen jonas as fired up as this ever. >> meanwhile announcing another round of layoffs ♪ (vo) here's a question. was it necessary to create a luxury car more teched out than silicon valley? with a cockpit fit for aspaceship. hang on. radar that senses things the human eye can't. busted. and the ability to make a thousand decisions before you even make one.

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>> shares of tesla's dock was diving today dropping nearly 13% after announcing a 7% cut in the

workforce. the founder and ceo, elon musk is trying to deliver on his cheat model of the electric three. foxnews.com automotive editor is here with us now. with federal tax cuts, is tesla ever going to make a middle-class car? >> they've already lowered prices to offset the tax cut. when it happens again the get another half in a couple months. they are having trouble getting the price down. they haven't gotten a $35000 car yet. they have a long way to go. they frontloaded production last year to make profits. the high end models, clearly they have eaten up the demand. now, they need the midprice models out that they can sell in europe. they are nowhere near that $35000 car. by the time they get there they will be tax credits left. >> isn't the issue getting the

cars out and producing them fast enough and then delivering them fast enough? if you have fewer workers, how do you do that. >> he said were going to hire people to get production up. this is not a surprise if you go back and take a look at his tweets. this is the whole idea behind tesla. let's build this big giant assembly plant and get the cost down. what they're learning now is what they knew, it's hard to get the cost down on the technology. that's why you're not seeing a lot of mainstream electric cars. the automakers that are competing against them, they have other product lines that can generate profits to pay for this. in the meantime, tesla dozen. all it has is electric cars. >> gary smith here in florida. building on what you were just saying, do you think tesla has any competitive advantage?

at the bottom line, they make an electric car with almost no distribution. i cannot see them competing in the long term maybe even the short-term against anybody, ford, volkswagen, subaru that's coming out with electric cars. >> right now their advantages technological. volkswagen, one of the biggest car companies in the world will be spending $84 billion to develop electric cars. you can just see the scale of what's coming ahead. that's just volkswagen, ford, general motors. earlier this week toyotas american ceo says we are going to have too many electric cars in a couple of years. it will be a long time before they take over. that's why toyota is not going all in. >> to anything sometimes are too tough on tesla. i'm going to devil's advocate. they are founded in 2003, have been in business 15 years.

it takes time for any automobile manufacturer to establish itself. gary brought up problems with distribution, but that's an easily solved problem once you have the product to a price point and design place that people want. i think we need to give tesla more time. >> it's a problem they created themselves. they did not have to build a $35000 car. they could have became a profitable company. and then held off until they were making money elon musk wants to change the world into it now. and they are living on the edge. >> we did not give john a lot of time. >> this guy has had a lot of time and money. >> the whole viability. i question if you can make a nice car for that much. is this a fantasy he's going

after? it's cool that people are now buying tesla instead of them fives. but is it a myth? is there market there? is it even solving the world's problem compared to making these electric sleds? >> the cars will go into the tunnels. if you have been in a model three, the cheaper versions are not all that nice. when there's a 35000-dollar model and sure it's going to feel like. >> have you been in the cheapest model three? it's not a super plush car. you have to spend money to get the upgraded interior we haven't seen what a $35,000 model looks like. >> gary, thank you so much for coming in. coming up, netflix has a new take on its way it treats fortnite. just as old rival hbo.

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>> david: the number of netflix. their view on the competition is changing. in a quartered we letter he said, we compete with and loose to fortnite, that's again, more than hbo. our focus is not on disney plus, amazon or others, but how we can improve our experience. is netflix just throwing a little shade at hbo. let's ask dave. divisional founder and ceo. what's going on with that reference to fortnite and hbo? >> the fortnite phenomenon is real. if i were an investor in netflix my concern would not be fortnite. my concern is that my company that i invested in is now in a lowered barrier to entry business and people who are really well-positioned to compete with me and compete rather savagely with me are coming into the business.

i think the shoe that dropped this past week was the announcement that nbc universal, or comcast is coming into the streaming business. they certainly have an arsenal of weapons that make them a lot scarier than anyone playing fortnite, as far as netflix shareholders go. >> dave, do you think that netflix has the apple iphone problem. at least here in the u.s. everybody has an account. my question is, do they go after those plan shares that they'll make each person have their own plan? >> certainly that kind of sealing up the leaks in the boat makes all kinds a sense but, the issue is that when you move into a created business where there

is not direct barriers to entry like, back in the cable era to get that programming, you had to subscribe to the cable system. now that we are in a broadband universe programmers can weigh in and build streaming packages. when you look at these guys come in with 13 - 18% price increases, they don't have that pricing power. so, you can seal up the password sharing, but you cannot seal up the competitive entry. that's the big problem. >> i have to say, i wonder if you agree. i think people are overstating the importance. it's nothing new that passive entertainment competes with interactive entertainment whether by way of doing it online like fortnite or you're just playing a game. that's old news. what's fascinating and why i remain incredibly bullish on the company like netflix, no bars to

entry. with television it was a distribution game. you either had to get enough stations to carrier program and sell advertisers, or if you are cable you had to get on the services. now, streaming. it's a wide-open lamb. what is that mean? it comes down to programming. right now, netflix has shown themselves to be adept at programming. there will be others that can do it to. >> rick, i disagree. i think a lot -- for many years the competitive advantage of netflix was they were the only ones you could get dvds from and then streaming. now everyone is in the streaming game.

from comcast to hulu and amazon prime. now they are in a content game. content is like retail. your hot one day and cold the next. dave, your thoughts on the. >> that's the interesting thing. they are now in a content arms race with a potentially unlimited number of competitors. i have a good friend, who is one of the premier investors. he asked me one time, why do you think netflix is spending so much money on programming? and his answer was, because they have to. his observation which is very interesting is that in a wide-open, creatively fueled business like that, ultimately if you don't control the distribution, all returns go to the creative talent. a bidding war erupts. >> that's not entirely true. i wish it were but it's not entirely true.

look, it is content. i won't go into speech about the economics of content. suffice it to say, anybody who is a player in the game all they need is one hit and they can coast on those profits for 20 years. >> i have to say, in my opinion, you are referring to a world that used to exist. only a limited number of players could line up for that content. when you look at the amount now being spent, it is no longer superpowers, it is now the great big and growing nuclear club. >> very quickly. >> we've all been a little too old here. understand why the company would not want to be valued like hbo. they don't want to be valued like that. but this whole thing about plugging in for 24 hours of

entertainment, they must be worried that someone like google or somebody will come out and make watching anything on a screen seem like a wrecker business. i will wipe it out in a year. you can handle the hbo's of the world. >> competition now can come from any direction. it is no longer who is going to do the same thing as me, it could be fortnite, it could be something completely different, but they cannot expect they will plan the line of scrimmage. >> thank you very much. have a great weekend. we appreciate it. >> elizabeth warring calling out to mnuchin about what he did a month ago. why the outrage now? is she looking out for consumers is she looking out for consumers or maybe a pre to be nobody but yourself in a world which is doing it's best

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david: the president just tweeting this out. i will be making a major announcement concerning our southern borderer humanitarian crisis and the shutdown tomorrow afternoon at 3:00 p.m. live from the white house. elizabeth warren is demanding steve mnuchin provide details of

his calls that spooked the markets. what did you see in financial markets that caused you to be concerned about the liquidity of the 60s largest banks from the nation? what do you think? >> let me and the first part. of course. she is running for president. this is obviously a presidential bid. that said, is this the right question to ask? i don't think people are still hung up on it. but i would like to know the answer. i think this is where the legislative branch should ask the executive branch what the heck was going on. >> this may have been a political ploy on her part but it may show you she may not be a good enough politician to run for president. nobody cares anymore.

we have had 93 breaking news stories since then. it doesn't matter. >> i think she is mad that's core tets * is stealing all the air. she is trying to remind everyone that she is the one who is going to rake the bankers over the coals. i don't think she is wrong. but the public doesn't need to be reminded. mnuchin leaked the trump thing was going on that made the market go up. and they are coming on our show saying there is no deal with the chinese. he slipped out and had an interview with the banks. >> she is putting on a show here. it's a political ploy that will backfire. but i think mnuchin's plan backfired on his.

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