anti-establishment want to be heard but can't be because they're shouted down all the time. stuart: two themes, free speech a market decline. we're down, what, 285 points. it has been that way for most of the morning. my time is up. neil, it is yours. neil: thank you very much. hopes for a trade deal are getting slimmer and slimmer. maybe we did this or chinese did this we know the chinese stock market taking a drubbing today. a lot has to do with late entry demands that could be torpedoing talks even though they're a couple days off. edward lawrence at white house. hey, edward. reporter: the talks have soured this week. it is a tough environment to try to get a trade deal with all this going on. the chinese very upset that 28 new chinese companies and entities added to the u.s. entity list for national security concerns but also human rights violations. the chinese very concerned about

these folks being added to the blacklist so to speak. spokesman for the chinese foreign ministry says these accusations are nothing more than an excuse for the united states to deliberately interfere with china's internal affairs. china will continue to take firm and resolution measures to protect its sovereign security. on the list, hike vision, the world's largest supplier of surveillance equipment. they released a statement, that they have been engaging with administration officials the last 12 month to clarify misunderstandings about the company and addresses their concern. the company opposes this decision. they are not happy by deleted tweet about it general manager of the houston rockets, that tweet showing support for protests in hong kong. the chinese canceled games being shown, preseason games being shown from the nba in china. you can't find on line in retailers any houston rockets gear anywhere in china. the bottom line it's a tough

environment to go forward with a trade deal or break through later on this week. the chinese deputy level team offered parts of the deal. the part both sides agree upon. the president said they have come this far. he wants a full deal. now one more item, administration says he has no plans to delist chinese companies from u.s. stock markets. however there is a discussion about how to have more transparency for those companies. when they report to the sec and other agencies within the government there. there is also a discussion talking about putting what china can invest, what investment opportunities china could have in the united states, specifically pensions. again this is all discussion phase. there have been no decisions according to white house sources that have been made. a lot of stuff is being thrown out there. they will figure out what works. back to you. neil. neil: edward, there is kerfuffle over the role vice premier liu he will be here, not coming

with title of special envoy. a lot of people read into that, in that capacity he would be getting orders from and reporting back to president xi xinping. in this role -- i was confused by that? >> it does go further than that. this is not the first time that's happened. in fact last may is the last time it happened. he was sort of stripped of that title. he does come here as a representative of china but he is not the special envoy for president xi. neil: got it. reporter: he speaks for president xi. that gives him the ability to make decisions at the table on the spot. what happens he gets the information, but can't make a decision without okaying it with president xi xinping. he is not speaking for the president but representing china at these trade talks. there is a distinction there. last time he was stripped of the title was last may. you know the talks broke down last may. he does not have that title again when he is coming for these talks this week. thursday, friday, there might be a lot of discussions but this

could indicate there won't be any decisions. neil: but they have phones, right? he can call xi xinping, say, hey, these are some of the parameters they agreed to? reporter: that is true. they could go back to the hotels and make phone calls. these meetings are thursday and friday. the vice premier will be here. but he doesn't hold the title. neil: ed lawrence holds the title of premier on all things trade related. how much does the president need a deal. national taxpayers union executive vice president brandon arnold. potomac advisors president, and independent senior women's foreign policy analyst, patrice lee onwuka the fact that president is showing a more pragmatic side, not open to a partial deal but not all together thorough all encompassing deal that would address artificial intelligence

and stuff like that, seems to indicate he is willing to strike for something else. what did you make of that? >> i mean maybe but i've always seen him, tweets that said maybe something will get done, maybe something won't. sounds like he really wants to take a tough stance on china. the fact you have 28 companies which may have been part of china's repression against muslims in their nation, taking a leadership role in the international community nobody else is willing to take says that the president actually wants to hold china's feet to the fire in a greater way. even if that means creating additional pain. we know there is potential for increase in tariffs kicking in next week i think he is still willing to hold china's feet to the fire. neil: you know the president has indicated, mark, if talks were progressing or look promising he might delay imposition of those higher tariffs on i think $250 billion worth of goods from 25 to 30%. on the 15th they take'

effect. how do you think that looks right now? it is way, way early. i'm beginning to wonder with all ad-on and things on both sides, that will not happen. >> we're looking at blacklisting of tech companies today. we heard rumblings of limiting u.s. invests via pension funds. who knows if it includes etf but american direct investment in china but tariffs has always been a tool. china says we want to be treated equally as peer with mutual respect. that is why the markets are reacting. china won't kowtow to this president. they don't want a public beatdown. they don't want a victory lap with tweets. this has gone to real tension point, that is what the market is looking at. they are not optimistic of a short term resolution. neil: looking at nba fuss created here where the nba is trying to have it both ways,

owners are free to speak their mind but it depends. the bottom line this raised a ugly issue a lot of u.s. businesses have had dealing with china for decades. they call the shots, you can be very afraid to challenge them. because your business and opportunities in china disappear. what do you think of that? >> that is right. that is a real problem doing business with china. i don't know if that enters the picture with our trade discussions. obviously providing additional strain on already difficult relationship we're trying to forge. last thing trump wanted as we try to close the deal which seemed pretty up likely. with the human rights blacklisting issue last night, the nba deal, the nba comments, it is moving sides further apart. that is quite unfortunate. neil: patrice, i'm looking at demands we're having. supposedly separate. limiting how much government pensions can buy of chinese

stocks. even down to listing certain stocks here or not. that is sort of like a lightning bolt thrown in the middle of all of this. what do you think of that? >> maybe it's a way to get it on the table now. i think at this point all these smaller issues seemed ancillary are becoming a part of the discussion. maybe if we get at least one or two of these things done, let's try to get something done. i guess from a negotiating tactic you ask for everything and take whatever you can get. neil: i guess what i'm looking at mark, is lowered expectations. that is affecting sentiment here. do you have lowered expectations as a result? i know it is like a geiger counter following this but what do you think? >> i think the genie is out of the bottle with this. if we go after chinese direct investment in tech companies, what is next on their end? limiting construction permits? aggressive health inspections? american restaurants overseas? this is really not limited to terrorist. when the the talks started we

import more than they do we tariff them, they will capitulate. this is proving that is not the case. there are a lot of secondary tools each country can use. the less wall street likes it. it becomes less predictable. there is global slowdown. if china continue there is will be less economic growth and earnings. that is hesitancy for the stock market. neil: say we don't get a deal, brandon, i'm not asking you to be a market soothsayer. since the markets hoped a tentative deal or limited deal is better than know deal, they don't get even that or significantly delayed, do they have a selling tantrum? what do you envision? >> i think there is concern there. what we need to do is get as big of a deal as we possibly can with china. hopefully that will involve removal of tariffs as we possibly can, that will help the economy and stablize the relationship.

that will lock in trade deals elsewhere. we need to put the usmca make that enacted, whether unlate late rally by the trump administration before congress. japanese deal is a step in the right direction. we need to look to the eu, another source of potential greater partnership unfortunately has been strained by the boeing-airbus feud that has come to a head recently. we need to do what we can with china. we need to look globally to stablize our trading relationships wherever we possibly can. neil: thank you very, very much, guys. i appreciate it here. to put this in perspective. they were outlining, 28 out of dow 30 stocks. down having to do with this. resisttors are walmart and retailers. they put out statements, retail federation, they're expecting a good holiday season no matter what happens on the trade front. so they might be resisting this but if you're international

player particularly like boeing, could extend to goldman sachs or verizon, united technologies, even apple, you are in the direct line of fire here. those are stocks feeling it. financial plays as well. the idea this will contribute to a slowdown, interest rates go down, not very good for the big banks. obviously some big names. bank of america, city group. they are feeling the pinch. when we come back in. ba players skipping the white house but okay sucking up with china after this. we go beyond fast with a cloud-based security system that automatically updates, so you always have the latest protection. phishing. malware. risky sites. it can help block all of that.

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>> freed dim of expression and freedom of expression by members of the the nba community. in this case daryl morey as

general manager of the houston rockets enjoys that right as one of our employees. neil: that is called dancing on the head of a pin here. nba commissioner adam silver rejecting criticism that the nba bowed to china. the chinese are putting out a response to silver's statement. right now they're taking this to the next level as well, right? reporter: we'll start with that. quote, we believe any speech that challenges national sovereignty and social stability is not within the scope of freedom of speech. that is coming from the chinese. now the latest in the dispute over the hong kong comments, chinese state tv canceling broadcast of nba preseason games. the announcement will impact two preseason games, brooklyn nets and l.a. lakers. adam silver, the league commissioner, was defending daryl morey's right to freedom of speech. cctv would investigate all cooperation and exchanges with the nba.

so this is not over. remember this is a 30-year-old lucrative relationship. this summer tencent announced a 1 1/2 billion dollar streaming deal. chinese fans love their u.s. basketball. they love the players like lebron. meantime activision suspend ad professional e gamer over his pro-hong kong comments, another example after u.s. company feeling pressure to bow down to go china. interesting coming at this point in time as trade talks continue with the chinese as protests intensify, nba relationship, activision example, all about the scope of u.s. tie-ins with china. neil. neil: thank you very much. nba players don't mind skipping the white house, but okay bowing to china. it is weird. john tatum is here. john, i know you don't want to rattle business. companies are doing it. google is doing it. various high-tech, other firms

doing it to keep their place warm and active there, but man, it's a little weird. >> it's weird, neil. i think the first thing that i'd like to point out though is adam silver may be the best commissioner in all of sports. he is somebody who is constantly put principle over profits. and, i think he is standing up for freedom of expression. neil: you know this guy better than i do. the whole basketball association better than i do. how did this show principle over profits? he kind of, it was like a jump ball, right? >> well, but he stood up for daryl morey's, what he said. the freedom of expression is what he supported and everything. that he has a right to do that. yes, there are consequences and unfortunately adam is at the forefront of dealing with those consequences right now but i think, you know, the thing about the players that you brought up, you know, it is disappointing

that they would support a communist form of government. i mean these people in hong kong clearly are looking down the road to 2047 when they don't have a lot of the freedoms that, they won't have a lot of freedoms in 2047 that they do currently and they're resistant to that. it is no different than what we did, maybe in 1776. yeah, kind of disappointing they haven't spoken out but, you know, they want to sell shoes. they want to be popular. i think, with the chinese government shutting off some of these games and threatening the nba, the nba is a 10 billion-dollar a year enterprise. certainly a big market in china. there is 300 million kids playing basketball in china. but i think if the chinese government wants to shut out the nba, they're cutting off their nose to spite their face because

kids will miss out on lebron james and all of the great nba athletes. neil: the chinese don't seem to care. i know why the nba would care. it's a lucrative market with so many businesses chasing the same lucrative market, they will swallow their pried, even in extreme cases exposing their books, intelligence, the very operating systems they have, if they are high-tech enterprises. so that is not new. i shouldn't finger the nba for something. but having said that though, if you're the chinese, you're kind of impressed with this, right? we've always been on defense. we could say boo, we get these guys running we must be in better shape than we thought? >> well, i think you're right. they're looking to see who is blinking and i go back though to the statement that commissioner silver made. he was 100% supportive of freedom of expression.

he has supported not necessarily the comments or the content but he supported daryl morey's freedom and right to make those comment. and, and so i think, you look at him from a leadership standpoint as shining beacon, trying to balance this issue. it's a complicated issue. i'm sure, you know, everybody wishes that he maybe hadn't commented on it but i think it is bringing to light who is going to back down and who is going to stand up and i think president trump's done a great job trying to renegotiate these, these trade imbalances. he is not weighing in right now. i think -- neil: not yet, not yet. he must know full well, john, these are the same players who told him to get off. that is their right to do that, freedom to do that, not when it comes to china. he might be tempted to draw that comparison. these guys have weird

priorities, right? >> i think you're very, i think you have hit the nail on the head, neil. once again, i mean you have gleaned an insight, it is ironic that, you, they would, i guess boycott the white house and things american, the american flag, but yet, they would support a country that is led by a communist leadership and, does not support full human rights and freedoms. it, there is a lot of irony in that or at least ones that don't speak up against it. hey, neil, not to change the subject, but i know gasparino is coming up later, but yesterday, or two days ago i was at the cowboy game with your boss, mr. murdoch and his son lachlan murdoch, i think you need to get out to the cowboys-jets game on sunday. i hope you come out to the metlife stadium. come out to a sporting event so you can, you know, feel the

power. neil: sure. but that conflicts with a bocci ball tournament. so i don't know, timing is everything. we'll see what we can do. john tatum, always good catching up with you, my friend. thank you very much. >> thank you, neil. neil: john did his own little verse of pressure right there. meanwhile the president's taxes are bound to be released one way or the other. i told you yesterday, i think it is going to happen. president might be not keen on it. they are getting closer and closer to getting reality, what he is having to say in advance to prepare the public for the whatever is in there. after this. at fidelity those zeros really add up. ♪ maybe i'll win ♪ saved by zero

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neil: all right. if you want to know the holy grail for democrats it is the president's taxes and they're pushing for the release of those tax returns and they're very, very close. the president is still pushing back. attorney robert wood is here now with how this battle could play

out. robert, i know the new york attorney is looking to get these cyrus vance, jr., he has novel way to get to answers of payments that they made, see if they showed up on these returns, et cetera, et cetera, but, it was, they appeal a judge's order they be released or released to cyrus vance, jr., i get the sense it is just a matter of time before these are out there. they shouldn't be released to the public. invariably would be though. how do you see this? >> yeah. i think long term, you're right. it is hard not to see somehow these getting out. there have been so many different battlegrounds and as you noted the yesterday, the battle in new york, district court, saying that, mr. trump couldn't, president trump couldn't block them. then the second circuit putting a stay on that. i think long term they're likely to come out i would agree.

then you're the president. we don't know the reason why he was reluctant to release them. i understand, we never had a guy this rich in the oval office, returns would run into thousands of pages over the years. maybe certain points are, you know, questioned, how wealthy he really is. others, might reveal relationships with certain players, whatever. but he has been, you know, headstrong in not releasing them. furthermore people elected him without those forms getting released. so his argument is, it needn't happen but let's say it does. first thing people will look for is, total operating income over the years, right? and then they start digging into the weeds, right? >> i suppose. i mean i think there will be no set of tax returns in american history that will be examined as closely as these. if they do come out. i mean that's possible. i don't think it's a foregone

conclusion. they will be gone through with many fine tooth combs. really pilloried by armyies of advisors. it's a i think a foregone conclusion, if the tax returns will come out, they will be aggressive, take advantage of the tax laws. president trump made no secret of that, even before he was elected, he doesn't like to pay taxes. he pays as little as he can. neil: even bragged about that during the campaign. one "new york times" story came out on one particular return, showing relationships here and there, it is possible he could have had a write off to him not paying taxes for years. all this might be perfectly legal. it will be a tough sell to the public though. i believe even in that case, you can refresh my memory, robert, it was legal at the time, some of these take tactics are not legal now. the critics will pounce on it,

right? >> the used the term, holy grail. the democrats long sought these returns. as you say even long before president trump was elected. neil: right. >> so yeah, there will be gone through and, they're going to be things that are things close tot tax law. tax law is gray and more complicated you get the more gray it gets. i wouldn't be surprised by that. president trump has a bigger fish to fry in a sense but these tax returns issues, they keep coming back for years now. neil: it is unrelenting issue. we might be seeing it being worked out in a matter of days or weeks. we'll follow closely, robert wood, thank you very much. >> thank you. neil: all right tax issue, notwithstanding, you can imagine she is salivating to get her hands on it. house speaker nancy pelosi is trying to prove congress can legislate and litigate at the

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neil: speaker nancy pelosi drug price plan is facing serious pushback from drug-makers. hillary vaughn with latest on that. reporter: house speaker nancy pelosi is talking about lowering prices of prescription drugs, right now at a hospital in seattle, trying to prove that

she can do two things at once. she can push for an investigation of the president. but also prioritize other things like lowering costs of prescription drugs. under her plan, she says consumers here in the u.s. would not pay more than patients in other countries. >> whatever that price is, it says that in the u.s. the company cannot charge more than 1. -- 20% of that. that takes it all the way down and in the legislation there are non-compliance penalties and the rest. reporter: pelosi's bill would make a few major changes that would help drugs become more affordable, let government negotiate for drug companies, 250 drugs applied by medicare. would cap drug costs $2,000 a year for four prescriptions.

the plan will bring financial relief for patients. it could bring catastrophic costs for drug companies. pelosi's plan would target negotiations and drugs supplied by medicare and make the price available to people not receiving medicare. companies that don't reach a deal with the federal government could get slapped with a fee but if they don't negotiate at all, they could face a 65% excise tax on annual gross sales, if they still refuse to negotiate, that 65% tax bill goes up by 10% every quarter. neil? neil: all right. that could explain why all the drugmaker stocks are way down today. that is not helping matters any. hillary vaughn, thank you very much. patrick byrne wants to set the record straight on exit from the company which includes selling all shares in the company.

he spoke with charlie gasparino. >> the stock is moving higher. i will take credit for it. neil: you should. >> we're reporting a series of emails and telephone calls, patrick resigned ceo of overstock to us, the stock has gone up, which is weird given all issues facing the company. neil: is it going up because he is out? >> i think two things. one of the things he did with us provide what he believes, if it's true, it is pretty compelling that he did not commit insider trading when he left the company. remember he left the company, he resigned. he said he had all this, before he resigned he had this big affair with the alleged affair with russian spy and fbi informant for the deep state, i have interesting comments on my foxbusiness.com story when he describes what he was doing, kind of, it is a little stream of consciousness but, but, he does provide a ticktock why he

told the shares. given me letters, resignation letters, which he believes proves beyond a doubt he had no insider information that the company later on was going to revise earnings downward. that is what happened. that is why it became issue. he sold in august. couple weeks later they revises earnings downward. he sold his all his stock, not a little bit, looked like possibly insider trading. two things he did, he gave me the ticktock why he did what he did. had nothing to do with insider trading. had no idea they would give negative earnings guidance. he was basically at war with the board. he hated the board, particularly the chairwoman of the board. neil: this is his company. >> he basically said they took the company away from him more or less. they lied to him. they almosts forced him to resign. tough read the whole ticktock. last night -- neil: on line retailer. >> but he is moving into some sort of a block chain business. this is a company all over the

place and it is controversial, flamboyant, i actually like patrick, known him for years, ceo is out. neil: incredible story. >> he is living in bally. by the way. he is not coming back to the u.s. unless they start arresting people in the deep state. he did say that. that is one of his things. he does support the current ceo, jonathan johnson he told me but he believes that the board is acting as a quote, unquote, shadow executive team. he believes this is the board basically screwing up the company. they ousted him, forced him out what he says is false pretenses. and he has the evidence meaning these resignation letters would show he had no idea they were going to use that -- neil: no chance he is coming back? >> you know, doesn't even own any shares. >> he doesn't own shares. he is in bally. they may have contacted the

company. the company has not commented on this this is something you'll read about for a while. overstock is not massive, ge or apple, but a fairly significant, publicly-traded company. neil: very smart business model. >> something went wrong and ceo is one of more interesting ceos out there. the by the way the corporate drama i lay out in my foxbusiness.com piece is one of the more riveting insane corporate dramas i ever covered. and i covered morgan stanley's implosion, all these boardroom coups, merrill lynch, you name it. this is crazy. i mean involves the deep state and -- neil: you're the guy for crazy. >> i'm crazy town writ large. neil: so you called him in bali or he called you from bali? >> saw me, i think on your show. neil: okay. >> i was raising specter of insider trading given the timing of his sale. he got pissed. he and he started -- neil: that is expensive call. >> it is on --

neil: no, for you. if you made it you would have to pay -- >> i would charge back to the company. patrick has $100 million, right? he sold all his stock. his phone call to me is like a drop in the bucket, right? neil: sure. he never sold his stock, remember he didn't do that. he was pushed out. >> it went down to three. neil: but he didn't sell it that was his weapon. he was smart. >> he was smart. there was a few great ceos. that is one of the great things covering business, you cover brilliant guys. people don't celebrate enough, they provide jobs. jamie dimon is one of them. jeff bezos is one of them. i would say the guy runs our company, but talking our own book, mr. murdoch, definitely one of them. neil: i would agree with that. >> there are a few great ones. people forget they provide jobs, okay? they may be rich but they provide jobs. they shouldn't be demonized. neil: jury out on pat byrne?

>> i personally like patrick. some of the stuff i can't get my hands around, deep state. maria -- he won't come back unless people start thing arrested. i mean -- neil: i feel like that way too. is gaspo in the studio? i'm not coming. >> if i'm arrested, if they ever fire me, security guards throw me out, i will run away from them. what would happen if they circled you? neil: i couldn't do that. >> if you circled you, you went this way? neil: get smart. >> suppose security couldn't catch me? neil: we'll try. we'll look into that. >> then i run out the door, what could they do? neil: what could they do. he is out. >> that is what is going to happen. neil: charlie gasparino, thank you very, very much. we have a lot more coming up including how stressed out are you? one way to handle it is smashing a car.

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neil: dow down 105 point. gm is taking a big old hit. the strike is not certainly helping matters. grady trimble where the stocks stand right now. grady? >> neil, we've been talking about ripple effects of this strike. certainly it is causing disruptions across the automotive industry and now we have some numbers to quantify those disruptions. 100 employees that supply parts to general motors have had to lay off a lot of employees temporarily because of this strike. we're talking about 12,000 temporary layoffs of employees that don't even work for general motors because of this strike. these numbers are from an

industry group that represents suppliers. the group says it might be hard for suppliers to get laid off workers back because the money is tight they might have moved to another job. we could see extended disruptions. more directly we're seeing that general motors may have to delay production of court vet stingry -- corvette stingray. the workers that make corvettes they're still officially on strike. the company says it is too early to speculate on production timing impacts because of this. only thing drags on. gm is losing up to $100 million

a day. general motors stock is it down quite a bit, taking a big hit. there is pressure on both sides to reach a deal. talks soured over the weekend. unclear if they made any progress since then. neil? neil: grady, hope springs ecertain tall. if you're looking for another gm car or can't find it. you can seems a new appeal. gary gastelu, the new trend, it worries me, what is going on, here, gary? reporter: hard to drive this directly. as you can see over here i managed to get the battle tank -- [inaudible]

armored personnel carrier that is a lot of fun. [inaudible] behind me is a -- [inaudible] neil: all right. we're having some audio issues with you. let me rephrase what gary was saying. i've been handed a number of questionable assignments. this has to be the most questionable. just said. i don't know. but we'll keep monitoring that. gary, thank you very much. fury over "fortnite."

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basically saying you don't want your kids to watch it, don't let them watch it, first amendment lets them put out whatever they want. that is why the lawsuit is there. canadian law is different than u.s. law. you don't get a jury. you get a judge or panel of three judges deciding do we really want the law to go there? do we really want parents to say it is the game responsibility, not my responsibility for letting my kids play the game? that is what canadian judges are deciding. neil: it here has been resolved how? the argument there it is addictive, dangerous for kids. kids you're addicting like tobacco? >> to be clear the addiction issue has not been resolved but the first amendment protection has, meaning, you can put anything you want in a video game in the united states, no matter how violent or off the wall it might be. from that i conclude that the same supreme court would find,

it is not their fault that your kids like it. freedom of speech. neil: i heard some liken it to vaping, making you addicted to vaping. >> vaping is a chemical addiction. neil: that would be the case. an addiction is an addiction and this is an addiction. the hours, you're on the game -- >> when you have a novel cause of action like this, it become as swearing match between experts. so the plaintiff's lawyers will hire a psychologist and psychiatrist to explain the dangers of addiction, the defendants will do the same. the better team of experts, by better, more persuasive team, is the one that the judges will probably go with, but the plaintiffs also have the burden this is novel cause of action. and if the canadian judges accept this, they will be opening flood gate for all sorts of other litigations alleging addiction. do they want to do that. should the legislature, should

parliament, in canada, make this decision that we want these lawsuits? rather than life tenured, black robed, unelected judges. like i was once. neil: like you were. i was saying that. let me switch gears to the president and his tax returns. i always think, judge, they're getting closer here. they're going to end up in cyrus vance, jr.'s hands. i think that is inevitable. i could be wrong but it's a matter of team, illegal as it is to -- >> if somebody who legally has them gives them to somebody in the press, that act is a crime but the press publishing it is not a crime. neil: like the pentagon papers. >> classic case. that is the protection. so when cy vance, the district attorney here in manhattan, wins the case, and he will, dispute whether he gets tax returns, they go into 30 or 40 people's hands. it only takes one of them, once the cat is out of the bag,

forget it, only takes one to leak. neil: why those eight years? >> say again? neil: why those eight years? >> according to vance, michael cohen's the president's former lawyer has explain ad series of connected financial shenanigans to use a loose phrase are all connected began eight years ago, the statute of limitations is five, six, or seven, depending what they're looking for. neil: got it. judge, thank you very much. >> pleasure, neil. neil: judge andrew napolitano. we're down 16 points. we halved our worse losses. a few more up issues. ones up, generally rely on you consumer, retailers are benefiting, mcdonald's and home depot, walmart, microsoft to lesser degree. they're a big retailer if you think about it. they're doing okay. pretty much everyone else not so much more after this. ♪

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tech blacklist with china gets, well, kicked on. stocks off their worst levels of the day but still down. trade talks formally begin on thursday, as you know, but already china telling the united states to stay tuned for retaliation, that because a number of china-related stocks were targeted that we feel should be limited among pension funds that have them in their overall assortment of the portfolio. we want to limit that. we haven't spelled out how much. then there's a whole lot of other stuff going on. it's gotten people wondering whether a deal comes to pass. let's bring in our elite panel. former jpmorgan chief economist anthony chan, kingsview wealth management's scott martin and last but not least, brooke rogers. the betting is the talks are happening. no one pulling the rug out from under them. but they have dramatically lowered expectation because of harsh words between the two sides. been there, done that, heard that again and again.

everything goes down, but something could happen still, right? >> yeah. i think they could find middle ground. i think that even though i very much agree with the motivation behind the blacklist, i think it probably couldn't have come at a worse time. neil: why did they do that, whatever the justification? why now? >> with the talk around the nba manager who supported hong kong, then capitulation from the nba in that area, it could be that the u.s. said we need to take a stand on this now. ip n i'm not exactly sure why they chose two days before a trade meeting but it was certainly bad timing. neil: you think about it, the nba was already hoping to see a lot of its early pregames broadcast across china. now none of them are. that could change. but it's just a needless fight at the worst of times. >> goes to show you how complicated this is getting. i don't know why it would have been timed like this. usually china's the one with the bad timing. now we are doing it. neil: who did it first.

>> i think when they walked away from the deal, you know, it was like okay, we got a deal then wait, we changed our minds. yeah, it's totally a personal foul on the united states if i may say. neil: i see what you did there. >> went right to the hoop. here's the thing. i think it goes to show china, we are willing to play your game if you guys want to test us. neil: yeah. you know, i'm looking at this, hopes rise and fall for the market based on the trade deal, whether or not one comes to pass. what's interesting, the trade-related stocks always take it on the chin if there are doubts about that, they rise when there are no doubts about that. but i'm noticing it's spreading to vulnerable issues, financials get hit, technologies always get hit. you see it extended more in groups. i'm wondering when that's telling us. >> that's telling you there is some risk. similar with the ism manufacturing getting weaker and some of them spill over into services. if the economy gets weaker, cyclical sectors like financials, industrials, will all get hit. you are seeing that. as to the strategy, to your

previous point, i think it's guns blazing. it's part of a strategy. initially the chinese said they may not be interested in a grand deal, maybe something of a smaller deal. we know the president doesn't want a smaller deal. neil: although he might have blinked on that. he seemed to intimate -- >> but if you really read in between the lines, his preference is for a bigger deal. he may have to settle for a smaller deal and in fact, all indications suggest that all we can get at best is a smaller deal but i think that's the reason -- neil: what will the markets do with a smaller deal? better small deal than no deal? >> i would sell it. the markets rally, i would sell into it. i think anthony's right. can you imagine the media saying trump took a small deal on china? like if that was in the headlines? neil: he certainly hinted at that yesterday. i'm not putting words in his mouth but he was vehement, i prefer a big deal, now he's hedging a little bit. maybe that's the way he should have gone from the very beginning. if that is the case, he could have scored a deal like that

months ago, maybe a year ago. but play this out. if it is, you know, a limited deal. >> i think this game has gone on for so long that he's probably realizing now that this can't drive on much further. he probably doesn't want it to drag on much further into the election season. neil: you think the impeachment thing is pushing it? >> i think it's certainly weighing on his mind and it should be. he's kind of losing his chips, the chips he was able to play. i think that if he does take a narrow deal, it probably will be played against him in the media, they will probably say oh, he talked a big game, then took this narrow deal. at the same time it's probably what's best for our economy at this point. neil: so in the end we don't change china's behavior. and china rules the roost with its intimidation with this nba thing. guys are quaking in their boots. >> let's not lose sight of the fact even if it's a limited or smaller deal trn, it's not cleae u.s. president will sell it as a small deal. neil: i understand that, but it will be a smaller deal. nothing wrong with that.

>> or does the smaller deal maybe allow china to actually do what they should do in the sense of follow what they agreed to do? maybe that's how you get the deal done. think about it, if we get a big deal done, everything we wanted, everything maybe both sides wanted, both sides lose something but we get something really big and nice, will china even follow through with coming up with, you know -- neil: we are still kiss china's butt. if you think about it, the nba is going through this right now, you dared to speak out on behalf of these protesters in hong kong, we are going to shut you down in china. this is the same reason why google redoes its entire code to satisfy the chinese audience. i'm just thinking man up, people. right? >> it's pathetic. the nba showed that they were weak. the general manager of the houston rockets, he put out a thing in support of hong kong. hong kong protesters are putting their lives on the line to fight for democracy in their region and it's kind of spitting in

their faces to, after someone all he did was say he supported hong kong, and the nba was more than willing to, you know, wheel that back and say oh, no, we love our chinese sponsors. neil: what is the nba commissioner saying? everybody is free to be a suck-up. stop. >> wait a second. are they? because you just did and basically, to your point -- neil: we are still playing these same games, where we don't want to risk their wrath. right? >> the reality of that is if you look at the chinese economy 20 years ago and look at it today, they certainly do command a little bit more respect. so that's the reason, maybe -- neil: that's how the mob keeps people. >> maybe this pendulum has swung too far but it has to swing. the realistic demands suggest that you cannot ignore that they are now a real economic superpower while they were not an economic superpower 20 years ago. neil: all right, but we are still kissing their butt, that's what i'm saying. >> wet kisses, even.

neil: i think that's demeaning for a superpower. >> it is. neil: i know all of a sudden some were saying in the prior hour, 300 million kids play basketball right now, you don't want to lose that audience. well, risk losing it. >> the extent to which china violates human rights, imprisoning hundreds of thousands of muslims, reportedly harvesting organs from their plat political detainees, oppressing democracy in hong kong. the fact we overlook this because of an economic issue, the united states is supposed to stand for human rights. what are we doing? why do we capitulate in this way? neil: part of the reason is through the economic pushes we make, they will change their ways but they generally don't. i had one dissident from tiananmen square on earlier this week who was saying they are going to respond the same way they did there to hong kong if this hong kong thing doesn't calm down. when i mentioned now they are a big economic power, to your point, they won't risk it, at

their core they will because that's who they are. >> i was recently in south korea and they said all the countries around are, in fact, adding a lot of deference to china because of their size. whether that's justified or not, it's the reality. neil: some of them are benefiting, like vietnam. >> absolutely. that's the weird thing. you talked about how if we are going to take -- this was actually almost an opportunity for the nba to kind of step up and say hey, you know what, we agree with what the houston rockets general manager said and just take a chance to say fine, we realize all the kids are playing basketball in china and the games that were coming up, whatnot, but china, you have to do the right thing here. to your point, i agree, hong kong will go off the rails. this, i mean, this isn't like a controversial statement. clearly in hong kong, those protesters, though folks need to be defended as far as they need help. they need to be supported. this wasn't an outlandish statement. neil: what helps us, i guess, is the fact that all their

controversies notwithstanding, they supposedly need to deal more than we do. i'm not so sure of that. >> yeah, i think that the rhetoric's coming from the white house is that they need a deal more than we do, but i don't know, looking at the way that our stock market has moved and their stock market has moved, it seems like they are in a very strong position to negotiate. i think that the reason why the president is hedging his rhetoric around this is because he knows going into it he's not going to get the win he thinks he's going to get. neil: any win would be no win. >> probably not. i think contrary to brooke, if you look at the chinese stock market and economy, the impact has been bigger on their end so far but i do believe that it's slowly kind of starting to even itself out maybe more with the u.s. our stock market can't get to new highs without probably a trade deal done but at least so far, i believe the chinese markets are taking it more on the chin than we are. neil: they are indeed. they are indeed. we will take a quick break. we will also be looking at what's happening in this market, who's benefiting, who's not benefiting. also the impeachment factor. it used to be considered a wild card event.

the odds were very small of it ever coming to pass. increasingly it looks like at least in the house it will come to pass. then what? after this. no, just a sec. what would it look like if we listened more? could the right voice, the right set of words, bring us all just a little closer? get us to open up? even push us further? it could, if we took the time to listen.

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neil: a lot of folks are situating msaying man, the president of the united states is under enormous pressure. the guy who wants to replace him and joe biden, and all the issues he's facing, senator bernie sanders facing his own issues on health, elizabeth warren her own issues stories that seem to change by the day, we have a radio show host on all this. ethan, it's safe to say it's almost a game of musical chairs among prominent democratic candidates. i tend to keep things simple and focus on the money they're raising. elizabeth warren still raising a

lot of money and in small denominations which is gold in politics. i don't know how long that lasts. what are you hearing? >> pretty much the same. this is part of the primary process which is sort through the issues and through the candidates, find where their strengths and weaknesses are and each one has had their interesting bumps in the road in the last couple of weeks, to your point, with biden in like you said the ukraine, bernie, horribly having a heart attack and elizabeth warren, you know, making these unforced errors of changing stories, which actually opens up the campaign to other candidates as well. this is not done. this is not settled. we haven't even cast a vote yet and people want to anoint winners. i like people like beto o'rourke as a dark horse right now. neil: really. all right. i am going to bring in anthony, scott and brooke here. the beto o'rourke thing is interesting. he's not the first guy who said that.

in other words, someone else emerges who is not in the top sort of league of candidates. >> yeah. i don't necessarily see beto as the dark horse that others might. i haven't really seen a lot of him i'm impressed by. i don't see him doing well as much in the polls. dark horses, buttigieg, maybe, although he started disappearing out of the public eye as well. he hasn't gotten as much media attention as he did during the first part of his campaign. kamala potentially. a lot of people who we thought like cory booker who we thought in the beginning were impressive are falling back. it remains to be seen. i'm not sure if it's beto. >> i don't get that. scott martin, by the way. love your tie. i don't know where you shop. nice work. can you explain that, as far as the dark horse with beto? or maybe even buttigieg or kamala or cory? first name basis, i guess. how could they reemerge because it feels like to brooke's point, they are so far behind, they have almost been completely forgotten. we don't see pete buttigieg on any kind of tv like in a couple

months. >> yeah, that's a great question. i appreciate you asking it. the reason i focus on beto as the dark horse candidate, he's an eloquent, inspirational speaker like barack obama. he really fires up a crowd. he takes the time, he takes free pictures with everybody -- neil: do they still do that? i know in the beginning he did. he still does that? >> i just saw him this sunday here in los angeles in a lower income community. he took the time to see every single person that was there. he connects with people. he listens to everybody. that's a rare commodity in politics that he's a genuine human being with everybody he interacts with and people are connecting with that. neil: interesting. anthony, it's still early. we have a long way to go just to even get to iowa. all of these positions and leaders have changed. as soon as one emerges, they get really scrutinized. it's happened with elizabeth warren, things she says. we have tape of things she used to say so they go after her. the same might apply to beto if he's the guy, to ethan's point,

or buttigieg, i don't know. but is it your sense that whoever emerges is in the moderate mold of joe biden type, including joe biden, or a hard left type? >> i think that in order to win the election, you have to move towards the center, you have to become more moderate. i think even warren will become more moderate if she actually gets the nomination. neil: she would have to. >> i don't want to -- [ speaking simultaneously ] >> i don't want to underestimate mayor pete as people call him. he has raised $19 million in the third calendar quarter. that's very impressive. it's not as impressive as bernie sanders, but for the great point that brooke made, because of health reasons that puts him at a little bit of a disadvantage. i think mayor pete has -- it's a good long shot. neil: i do want to talk as well about the emergence of the moderate joe biden. he was sort of kow-towing to the far left fringes of the party,

i'm not dismissing that but that's not where the general appeal would be, even with his student loan plan he's not calling for student loan across the board forgiveness or that it ought to be paid for by uncle sam, down to college education themselves. what do you make of that, that approach? it's going to be a bumpy ride getting past the progressives but in a general election it might sell. >> yeah. i agree with you. he's trying to play both sides right now, to your point, which is the college debt problem is a very serious issue here in the united states. if you are under the age of 40, it is looming over you if you went to college at all, it is something that needs to be addressed. it's going to hold back the economy if we don't do something about it. so he's trying to play both sides which is hey, we are going to do something about it but we're not going to go full warren and bernie about it, and appeal exclusively to the progressive wing. remember, the voters who show up at the polls, while the progressives have a tendency to be younger and louder statistically speaking, and in

the 2018 midterms, they don't show up at the polls as much as the older, whiter voters. so you have to play both sides right now and that's what biden is trying to do. we'll see if he pulls it off. neil: i think he's talking about your generation. >> i think that a lot of millenials, especially younger millenials, tend to be very vocal about their political beliefs. getting out of the house on voting day a little difficult. talking about joe bindden's education plan specifically, i really like it. i went to community college myself. he's very focused on getting people into vocational education trade school, community colleges and helping people who are actually lower income working class. i think even more so than the student debt cancellation of warren and bernie's plans. neil: do young people recoil at hey, we are going to give you all this stuff? >> no. i don't think by and large. personally, i think there's a practical point of okay, you are

going to give me all this, how are we going to pay for it. i think a lot of people, they do tend to lean toward more left wing politics. >> your generation, sadly i'm not in her generation anymore -- neil: very close. >> do you think it's really the same, how are we going to pay for this? that's something like old fogeys if i may say the three of us, do you guys really think -- neil: i have ties older than you. >> but what about that? do you guys actually sit around and talk at the bar, juice bar, about like how it's going to be paid for, all the free stuff that's coming down the line? >> well, there's cereal bars now. >> see that? >> you fill a bowl with cereal. it's like a milkshake. i think a lot of people in my generation, they see it as well,

it will just come out of the military budget. the detail part isn't as important to them as the overall idea of what it could be. i would appeal to people more, i mean, looking at enormous federal deficit, i think that people need to be a little more pragmatic about how we are actually going to pay for these. neil: i think ethan would get scott most upset, they are targeting the very rich and he feels like he's got a bull's eye on him. should he? >> he should. pretty much every single democratic candidate is looking at that, you know. one of the things why elizabeth warren is popular with the progressives right now is she's a populist. that's what got donald trump elected. people are very -- neil: different populist. i see what you're saying. that is an appeal. >> the point is, yeah, we never closed the hedge fund loophole. we actually lowered tax rates on the wealthiest and people see that, younger people and older people who are retirees who are struggling to make it, they see

that and go wait a minute, you're talking about cutting a benefit for me and yet the really rich guys are still getting away with paying very little comparatively in taxes. [ speaking simultaneously ] neil: all right. really great job on all of that, ethan. we will watch very closely. you have me watching beto o'rourke now. i had pushed him aside. we'll watch that. we are also watching the president. he's facing bipartisan backlash over this whole syria thing but he doesn't seem to care. he's fighting back, saying enough. almost two decades there, enough, call it a day. after this.

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neil: cure i don'y curiouser an. the ambassador blocked from testifying on capitol hill.

he wanted to but won't be given the chance. blake burman with the latest. reporter: in this latest standoff between the trump administration and democrats on capitol hill involves gordon sondland, u.s. ambassador to the european union. the state department scrapped his testimony earlier this morning. sondland was supposed to be up on the hill testifying behind closed doors. democratic leaders have since followed up this afternoon, saying that they will be issuing a subpoena. the top democrat on the house intelligence committee is arguing that the state department is stonewalling and that all of this amounts to obstruction. >> the failure to produce this witness, the failure to produce these documents, we consider yet additional strong evidence of obstruction of the constitutional functions of congress, a co-equal branch of government. reporter: text messages involving sondland have been thrust to the forefront regarding the aid that was being

withheld from ukraine. in a series of texts released from house democrats, the top u.s. diplomat in ukraine, bill taylor, said he thought the aid was being delayed for political reasons. however, sondland responded by saying he did not feel that was the case. republicans say that these texts right here prove that democrats are engaging in selective leaks and are running a flawed process. >> look, if it's going to be this kind of process, if you're going to selectively leak text messages, 67 pages of text messages we have, they take a handful and release to all of you and not give the full context, not release the transcript, we understand why they made this decision. reporter: this morning, president trump reacted to the sondland news by describing what is going up on capitol hill. he took to twitter to describe it, as you can see there, as a quote, totally compromised kangaroo court. this afternoon, after the subpoena was issued, he then went to twitter and directed his attention to adam schiff.

some news involving rudy giuliani, the president's personal attorney. giuliani is suggesting that it is possible that he could go up to the senate intelligence committee and testify there. giuliani has talked in the past about what he describes as evidence that he would like to present though of course, there are other issues, complicated legal issues involving the matters, the fact of him being the representative for the president and what that might mean for executive privilege. neil? neil: would that be a public hearing? reporter: potentially. nothing's been announced or agreed to, but you know, the thinking is he could go up there and put forth his charts as he said and his evidence but then you would have to think democrats would ask him a whole lot of questions about ukraine and the like as well, and then there's the whole executive privilege thing. who knows. neil: all right. thank you, buddy. more after this.

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welcome back to "coast to coast." i'm gerri willis. boeing shares flat today on news that the return of the 737 max jet may be delayed yet again. why? big disagreement between european regulations, regulators, that is, and u.s. regulators over software details. meanwhile, the company itself boeing reporting that deliveries came in at nearly half the size in the first nine months of 2019

as it did a year ago. september deliveries, just 26 compared to 87 a year ago. check that out. meanwhile, domino's is saying that it is losing sales to newer delivery rivals like door dash, grub hub. shares are higher, though, after apparently the ceo said that he has doubts about the future of these delivery companies because they're pricing below the cost of what they cost. so problem for those down the road. he sees this as a near-term stumble. they are reducing their long-term sales forecast to growth of 2.5% from 3% to 6%. also, galaxy sales of the s10 are lower. samsung is warning its profits fell second quarter 56%, a 56% profit drop on slower memory chips and smartphone sales. so big struggle there as well. to scott, my friend, are you there? do you own a samsung phone? what's going on with you?

>> i'm in love with this new apple phone, an iphone xs. much like brooke here, i had an iphone 7 for the longest, longest time and eventually got tired of the battery dying every 45 minutes. this one should last about an hour and a half now. double your pleasure. neil: you are satisfied with little things. gerri, thank you very much. on the floor of the new york stock exchange. by the way, the streaming wars are gaining steam. you are not imagining it. apple turning positive. a lot of it has to do with good buzz about how it's doing on the streaming front. it has a $4.99 per month package. netflix, well off its highs because of rivals like that, disney and a host of others. who knows that better than our fox news headlines 24/7 reporter, all things tech, brett larson who joins the panel. >> i want to point out my iphone 11 pro, the battery lasts several days. neil: no you didn't. what do you make of that? obviously streaming is the rage. a lot of people are still

cutting the cord. they're surprised that the replacement cord is pretty pricey, too, if you were to get all these services. >> if you want to get yourself back to the variety of content that you have with the cable package which is going to set you back anywhere from $100 a month upwards to $200 a month, you really have to start adding in all of these different streaming services, and it does add up. if you adjud just the basics of netflix, hbo, hulu, apple plus, it's about $60 a month on top of because you still need the internet connection and that can cost anywhere from $30 a month up to $50 a month, depending on the speed. i know at & t wireless subscribers can use directv now and get it through their phone without eating away at their data plan. [ speaking simultaneously ] >> they contemplated that for awhile because people are cutting the cord. it's kind of, it's funny to watch how everything has shifted towards this, people are cutting

the cord, cable is too expensive, but you want these a la carte options. now we have all these a la carte options and everyone is saying wait a minute, i have to sign up for several of these things to get everything that i want. neil: that's the future, right? doling out money for this, for lots of stuff. >> i have four streaming services and i'm cutting myself off. i'm not going to get any more. neil: you maintain the cord? >> no. since i moved i have not had a cord for five or six years. i feel like my generation, they like the fact they can binge an entire season of a show or see something at night, where you don't have to go by the schedule of the cable company. neil: do you get fox news or fox business? >> i have a log-in for that. neil: that was the politically correct answer. >> it's hurting profits, when you look at netflix stocks since july, it's down almost 24%. not everybody is buying all the

services. in other words, they are being satisfied with less, and satisfied with the bare minimum of what they can use. otherwise, all these companies' stocks would be going higher and they're not. >> that's the weird thing. you mentioned about how many streaming options there are. the content, though, is still so expensive. you mentioned about how much netflix is paying like chris rock, for example, tens of millions of dollars for two specials, $40 million or $50 million, not a bad gig, well done. >> but here's the thing. neil: i've got a bond market movie. >> i want to star in that. n . neil: whatever you want. >> all the content is so expensive it's watering down the value these companies have as far as stocks. >> well, for one thing, it's kind of funny, content wants to be free. it wants to be out there for everybody to watch it. but people don't -- >> because they have to pay for it -- >> no, absolutely. netflix spends literally billions of dollars a year

creating all of this original content. for that, they have over 100 million subscribers worldwide paying anywhere from $9 a month upwards of over $13, $14 a month. neil: they get the rights to "seinfeld." >> jared max is very happy about that. now he can binge-watch. but it's interesting to see how all this stuff shifts around. you still have broadcast television that airs tv shows on a schedule, but -- neil: log in. >> you log in. the irony of course is you can put up an antenna in 90% of the u.s. and get a lot of free content out of the air in hd. [ speaking simultaneously ] neil: we forget that. >> we've got 5g just around the corner which is also promising more, easier way to access all this content because they will have broadband you don't need to have cable for.

we are on the cusp of change right now and we will see. are all these streaming services going to last into the next three to five years, we'll see. maybe there will be more mergers. >> it's a good call. maybe not conglomerate but some sort of bundling service to where they get these companies to agree, hey, get three for the price of whatever. >> like a triple play. >> wow, triple play. neil: very good job. thank you very much, brett. all things tech. he is a geek. but one with personality. i love that. financial stocks are taking it on the chin right now even with the talk of a rate cut, that's actually hurting them more and the fact we have a slowdown in the global economy, if we don't score a trade deal it hurts them more. i know you feel sorry for financial plays here, feeling the heat but banks are feeling the heat. after this. i...decided to take the dna test.

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neil: you know, quietly we have

been clawing back here. right now we are down about 130 some odd points here. what's interesting about this is it's built on nothing but expectations of trade. pretty much, that's what's ruling the roost here. making money host charles payne, he will sit down with peter navarro in the next hour, maybe get a read on what's driving all of this. what have you got, buddy? charles: first of all, the trump administration said from day one, neil, they believe in maximum pressure. i heard you and your panel talking about some of the moves that were made, and i'm surprised that some folks are surprised at what happened yesterday with president trump and levying these additional blacklists against these companies that are using their technology to beat down people based on their religion. i think president trump is going to play hardball throughout all of this. having said this, i will put this to peter navarro. i'm predicting after the trade talks are over they are going to push back the october 15th and december 15th tariffs to next year. neil: but they would need to at

least appear to be making progress, right, so you are obviously confident that something will happen to indicate progress. charles: well, i think anthony just mentioned -- or someone on your show talked about the soybean purchases. a lot of things are going on -- neil: i never believe anthony. he's brilliant, but i mean, come on. charles: the soybean purchases, paypal just made a major acquisition within china. there are things that are happening. i think we put aside the hubris and bluster and look at the things that are happening and there are different parallels. don't discount this rally being based on what jay powell may say in my hour. i think the federal reserve after that ppi number this morning could come to the rescue for the markets and actually cut maybe 50 basis points. neil: no one expected it to be down as much as it was, under 1.5% in the last 12 months. that's pretty weak. that almost got people thinking wait a minute, this is worse than we thought, are we going into a european negative rate cycle here. what do you think of that? charles: that gets back to the debate. you have a few arrows in your

quiver. the way i put it to my team this morning, you know the old monster movies, when the monster is this big, do we use our arrows or wait for it to get this big. the federal reserve has a choice. if they want to stop this deflationary monster that's growing right before our eyes, they better use their arrows now. neil: they use their arrows now for something like this, when you really need them for something bigger, i know you and i part company on this, then they are out of arrows. charles: although i think deflationary death spiral is far worse than anything we can get from inflation. you cannot get out of it once it happens. that's what happened in the great depression. i think jay powell is paying attention. we'll see. but it's going to be a very eventful rest of the session. already has been. neil: i didn't expect you to say you know, neil, truth be told, i expect it to be a very dull hour. you are a good marketer, my friend. charles: i'm learning from the best. neil: wait a minute. you're the best. this is why he's a bestselling author. he can get you so dramatized we

need that. the interview with peter navarro should be very, very interesting. meanwhile, we have this whole brexit deal possibility. the whole idea is if britain and maybe europe agree on a new date, that is probably pushing it but boris johnson is saying one way or the other, we are going to get a deal. unfortunately, he's not the most popular guy to lead the charge. after this. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪

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neil: all right. uk prime minister boris johnson says a brexit deal is essentially impossible if the european union stands by their

trade demands or certainly, the deadline that they have imposed with those demands. back to our panel with more on this. you know, it's interesting, brooke, because one of the things to come up, if it ultimately gets to be the brexit, the formal cutoff, britain leaves without a deal but leaves, there's all hell to pay. anthony during the break saying there's all hell to pay. my own view, i could be very wrong, is nothing. >> just see what happens? neil: right. nothing happens. >> really? neil: people are saying, i mean, the fear games, people are going to go without medicine, they can't move, they're trapped, ireland just implodes, i think europe is more worried about this than britain because europe fears, i suspect, that if the sun comes up the next day in britain and light goes on, portugal's looking around, spain's looking around, italy's looking around. that club ain't so pristine. >> boris johnson said after brexit, there will be milk chocolate and there will be things like that.

i think that even if, you know, the morning after halloween, october 31st, they wake up and there's a hard brexit, i think that there's almost -- we -- people are so afraid of it. even if nothing happens in the market, even if everything goes smoothly -- neil: it's just like y2k. >> to your point, neil, europe starts to realize yeah, uk's fine. mass hysteria, dogs and cats living together type of stuff, like all of a sudden oh, my gosh, everything is okay. that's like where europe goes oh, shoot, maybe it's not that cool to be part of us. then you have all the fringe benefits, the fringe countries over there are beneficiaries starting to be like maybe we can start to move out. and the fact this is like a bad romance. this has been going on for five plus years. >> don't lose sight of the fact there will be milk and cookies but there will also be slower real gdp growth. neil: i prefer the milk and

cookies. i can live with the slower gdp. >> the bank of england said they would prepare for slower economic growth. let's not lose sight of the fact all of a sudden there will be all these tariffs imposed by the uk and other countries. that doesn't generate business confidence. neil: that's the funny part. >> it hasn't generated business confidence in the u.s. neil: does it bother you the fact that everyone agrees with what you said? >> no, not everyone agrees. >> i only disagreed with him in the commercial breaks. here's the thing. neil: that is the consensus view. >> all you have to do is look at history. look at all the countries that imposed all these tariffs. have you seen business confidence go up? have you seen capital spending go up? neil: the consensus around donald trump is he wouldn't be elected and if he was, we would go into market freefall. i know the consensus was barack obama becoming president would be horrific for the market and we were okay. i know sometimes consensus views on big issues, they are off the mark. i'm not saying yours -- you

could be right here. >> i'm not asking you -- neil: you're disagreeing with me. >> i am telling you to look at what's happened already. what's happened to capital spending. neil: talk to the hand because i'm not interested. okay. we've got a federal budget deficit that just hit a seven-year high. >> oh, no. you're teasing. neil: it's getting worse. where is this going? no one seems to care. >> nobody seems to care. neil: poor brooke and her generation have to pay for it. >> to your point, consensus was this was a major problem and people needed to start to care. neil: the consensus now is no one gives a damn. >> now maybe that's actually -- neil: i'm looking out, brooke, i'm looking out for you. i'm looking out for you. >> we will be left with it. we will be left holding the bag. what happened to fiscal conservatism? neil: it's gone.

>> rand paul, the last deficit hawk in congress, said this is the death of the tea party. we shifted from the party being either socially conservative and fiscally conservative to being just why not spend more, you know? neil: both parties are guilty of it but it's more sensitive for republicans because it used to be their schtick. they happily signed on to it. >> there are tax cuts in 2017 and spending went up. that's not sustainable. you can't cut taxes and then increase spending. it's ballooning. the deficit is ballooning. neil: the democratic candidates and their spending plans, they are trying to sock the rich and these two guys. they can't pay for everything. right? >> no, absolutely. it comes down to there is no fiscally conservative option in the 2020 race. there is no option. if you care about this, you don't have a candidate. >> there's little reason why people are caring less and that is because interest rates are lower. if interest rates were 20%, i

assure you we would be worried about this more. neil: you are showing your age. they used to be 20%. >> they were. 1981. neil: don't get me started. california, though, they do have a choice. they got so onerous with higher taxes, particularly of the wealthy, the wealthy are leaving. a lot of businesses headed to texas, florida and all this but it's picking up steam. a lot of california residents are saying the hell with it. what do you make of that? >> same thing is happening in new york. we are seeing it in a lot of -- neil: you're still here. >> i am. >> wyoming, by the way. >> but a lot -- neil: that happened to a lot of these high tax states. >> absolutely. if they can leave, if they have the ability to leave, they do. they pack up and move. that does take away a lot of the higher tax people and once they leave, who else is there to tax? >> look at states like florida and texas which are doing very well, no state tax, tennessee as

well. illinois, we got put into that bucket with california. losing population in chicago because of the liberalist policies, pension problems, high taxes. to your point, i mean, brooke, your millenial group again, that's kind of been the underlying theme today, the fact we can all work thanks to you guys because of technology and things from wherever, you don't need to be in so many locations where you are like next to your corporate office. neil: they are very angry like at my generation. >> they don't even put it in voice mail. >> younger generations, that's the tale of all time. i personally am not. i do see a lot. neil: get off my lawn! all right. final word, brooke. thank you, scott, anthony. they are the best. they know of what they speak. if they don't, we will have them back and bring them a new one. the dow down about 150 points right now. financial issues taking it on the chin. anything exposed to china, taking it on the chin. if you are a retailer, you are confident people will eat or shop their way through this. you love mcdonald's, love what's

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neil: dow down 152 points. time to take it to my buddy charles payne. charles: this is making money. i'm charles payne. deputy level talks underway in washington. the administration blacklisted 28 chinese tech companies over human rights violations. president trump believes in maximum pressure. wall street worried this could mean no deal. we're off the session lows but peter navarro will be our first guest. he will give us greater insight whether this tactic is going to work. while china comes to the trade table. they have nba, other american companies in a vise grip defending human rights. i talk to a former nba player who played in china, why it is so hard to tow the line on this issue. jay powell facing questions moment