the ceo said it's a breakthrough in modern feminism because everyone's going february functional footwear. [laughter] should i be buying this on the notion that there's a new brand of feminism that will be represented by the birkenstock? >> i'm not a biologist -- [laughter] therefore, i can't tell you what feminism is. but my friend's uncle once said that a farmer in germany stepped in a cow pie and went, birkenstock! he thought it was so k-6r9 bl, he made shoe out of it. [laughter] charles: company's been around 200 years, so that just tells you, doesn't have to be a great product -- >> i grew up in oregon, all the moms wore those. they were as nasty then as they are now. charles: kennedy, thank you. liz claman, over to you. liz: i was wearing those in santa cruz in the '80s, that was the shoe of choice. thank you very much. kennedy, as always. normally ahead of an interest

rate announcement by the federal reserve you would see markets in a holding pattern, but that's not exactly this. as we kick off the final hour of trade, we do have the dow jones industrials, albeit off of their earlier lows, down 1599. the s&p is -- 159. the s&p is losing 16 points. it's not exactly just flat or holding here. and the nasdaq is down 52 points, over a third of a prosecutor. -- percent. we should say as we look at all s&p 11 big sectors, only one is in the green, that would be health care. biggest laggards, energy, the industrials, materials, so the bears have their strongest grip right now on those names, energy pretty much at the top. big announcements are not helping. big announcements that were supposed to juice certain stocks, at least that's the way the ceos probably thought, both disney and amazon pushed out headlines. disney says it's going to commit $60 billion over the next decade to its parks and recreation

division while amazon gave a huge thumb's up by announcing it's going to hire 5 the 0,000 seasonal -- 250,000 seasonal workers for the holidays. disney's down more than 3%, and it is the biggesting laggard on the dow jones industrials' heat map. you can see it right there followed by intel, dow inc., home depot, unitedhealth and 3m. clearly, the entertainment giant is making that move to prioritize projects that promise strong returns, and the theme parks have been a reliable cash cow. but investors are refusing to bite. they are, however, biting let's call it inhaling on the buzziest ipo of the week. instacart knocking the cover off the ball in its online debut. priced at $30 a share, or it opened this morning, it soared -- just after noon if it soared 40% to $42 giving it a valuation of $14.2 billion. right now you can see though it

is pulling back with. it's now up the -- 2 11th, nothing to sneeze at, but it stands at a $36.41 a share. beware the froth. the most recent hot ipos, we're talking about arm, sweet green, oddity, all now have valuations below what they were their first day of trade. here to talk about that and and how the federal reserve and rising interest rates will affect all stocks, not just ipos, so new listings and then the old ones out there, a finance professor whose class at nyu stern's school of business on how to value a company is one of the most popular. professor, welcome. if you were teaching that class this afternoon after the instacart ipo, what would you say about the validity of instacart's valuation on this first day of trade? >> well, first, i'd take out the word valuation. what happens in if -- ipos is you price the company. it's a different game. other people are paying for similar things. it's kind of tough with instacart because you compare it

to doordash and airbnb and try to figure out how much to pay. i've given up trying to explain what happens on an a offering based in valuation, but i can explain it based in pricing. so i think if you look at the arm ipo, you look at the instacart ipo, it respects the -- reflects the fact that there's at least enough demand, -- the. liz: you brought up arm. let's talk about arm. arm had a boffo day buy last thursday, and it skyrocketed. right now it's come down, pretty much three days in a row, and today i believe it is the down another 6%. yep, about 5% at the moment, so it's off the lows of the session. it is still above its initial valuation of $54.5 billion or pricing, i guess. but is this a tale of, i guess,

beware kind of, of these very frothy moments this time, and how long do you wait for something before you decide now it's the real thing, i believe in this company? >> i would separate arm from instacart. instacart is actually priced very conservatively at the $30 per share. it was priced on the assumption that you would have lower take rates going forward for the instacart, and growth would be, you know, 10%, 12%. this wasn't, i mean, this wasn't a frothy moment you saw in 2021 when everything was priced -- [inaudible] arm is benefiting the fact that it's an a.i. company. i mean, you are in the mood of the moment, and i think enough demand is there for people wanting to buy a.i. companies that you could justify the pricing of arm. now, my reaction whenever i see that though is what i call the big market delusion. when you have markets like a.i. where people expect incredible things, you're going to be likely to see overpricing --

liz: did you saudi pollution or -- say die hughes or delusion? >> delusion. basically, the the assumption that if you have a big market, that everything in the big market is going to be worth a lot. which is i think as old as time, but i think you see it over and over again, you saw it in the 1990s with dot.com, you saw it with china stocks in the first part of the century and social media the last decade. but that delusion that somehow if you're in a big market you're always going to benefit is, i believe, deeply held and could get us into trouble. liz: sweet green did go public in november of 2021, and its valuation was $5.5 billion. this was, well, as the journal has it, the $15 salad company. it's still not profitable. it hit a high of $41 right after it ipo'd. it's at $1.86, so -- 111.86 -- 11.86. what is the cautionary tale to

investors right now? >> when companies claim to have changed an entire business, you've got to always be skeptical. the restaurant business with has been in trouble now for a while. what makes us believe that that a new restaurant company whether it's a salad, my raffle or whatever else, is somehow going to change that game? i think the weight of being in a business where it's tough to break even is kind of weighing down on the company. and i'm not surprised that it's happening. liz: all right. nvidia. let me get to a well established name. the valuation of the market cap at the moment of nvidia some would say when compare to the price to earnings ratio is also somewhere in orbit, way too high. how do you see something like that? and do you say to a stock owner who is buying right now -- not necessarily at the top, but pretty close -- do you look in and say, welsh wait a minute? -- well, wait a minute? >> i think we've got to give credit to this company. i call this my opportunistic

chip company. it seems to find big markets ahead of time, get if in ahead of time whether it's the the gaming market, whether it was the crypto market and, again, the a.i. market, they're clearly doing something right. the only problem now is you're valuing nvidia on perfection. everybody thinks that jensen wang is the greatest ceo ever, that this company can do no wrong. and history suggests when you buy a company assuming it can do no wrong, it'll find a way to do something wrong. liz: oh, yes. >> because you can't deliver on perfection. liz: who's doing it right for the long term? >> i think this is where differentiating between good companies and good investments is -- nvidia's a great company, it's just not a great investment. at the right price, i would buy nvidia. the problem is at the prices you're paying today, you're actually expecting nvidia to deliver perfection when, in fact, it's a very good, even a great company. this holding it up to

expectations it cannot meet. liz: can i quickly get your thought on the federal reserve? it started its september meeting today, right at this moment. policy organizers are making their decision, they're deciding. we will know tomorrow, 2 p.m. eastern. jay powell will come out and speak during this hour about, well, he gets to be grilled by all of the reporters there. what do you get the sense of when you decide whether all of the numbers are lining up for a soft or maybe a crash landing? of the economy? >> in fact, if i were the fed, i'd be wondering how i lost control of the entire process. because a year ago the bond rate was 4%, it's 4% still. we're still talking about recession. so smoke and mirrors and how the fed is going to engineer all kinds of stuff, my reaction is where's the beef? what exactly has the fed done that actually has shown up in the economy? it's almost like the fed has lost control of the process, and

it's trying desperately to make itself relevant again. liz: professor, i want to, i want to audit can your class. that's what we used to call it, awed a admitting the classes. [laughter] good luck to you, and thank you very much for talking with us right now. >> thank you for having me. liz: between arm and instacart, it's a september to remember for ipo exchange-traded funds. the renaissance etf is up 30%, and first trust has tacked on about 8.33% as their newly-debuted holdings ma cheer -- mature beyond their first year, that's when their inclusion into other existing etfs add adds to the intrigue. jay jacobs joins us to talk about the impact of ipos on the etf world. how soon after a company goes public can they be included in, say, one of your etfs that are already in existence? >> the short answer is it depends. the longer answer is it kind of depends on the strategy of the

etf and the index that it's tracking. if you have a u.s. large cap index, it's not necessarily trying to pick up an ipo as quickly as possible, it's trying to reflect those broad benchmark indexes which may include an ipo after a period of seasoning. if it's more thematic, trying to capture these nays sent -- nascent themes that are growing quickly -- liz: yeah. when you think of thematic, look, instacart's been around for many years. it is a grocery delivery company. now we've got the doordashes of the world and, of course, part of uber, uber eats, so those names are in some etfs at the moment. when it eventually matures, do you look at that and say now we've got to put that in one of these etfs that we have at the moment that are thematic? >> ultimately, it's up to the index provider. we are tracking indexes with our etfs, her going to create those -- they are going to create those rules. we're hoping to accurately represent the theme that we're tracking. so if we are tracking artificial

intelligence, we want to represent that environment, and that includes kind of those new ipos and companies that are well established in the space. liz: right. so we can talk all we want about market cap, but it's really up to the index. >> uh-huh, absolutely. liz: okay. so when you talk about profitable companies, that a doesn't matter when you're putting a company into an etf, correct? for example, we could look at bitcoin -- i'm not talking about a spot bitcoin etf. we mow that blackrock has applied for the approval. it's not up for discussion at the moment, but there are etfs that have names like marathon digital, coinbase. so when you look at so many opportunities to eventually, you know, where people are really eager to invest in those types of names, how does that worksome. >> so this is one of the things that i think is so great about etfs, and there's thousands on the market. they are providing access to different strategies that people are looking for. some people want to invest in only profitable companies, so

they might look at new of a -- more of a quality etfs. other people are going to be looking for a really nascent exposure to a new theme that has the potential to grow over the next decade. that's where we're not going to focus so much on profitability, but we'll focus on things like what's your exposure to a.i., to cybersecurity, electric vehicles, some of these powerful, or fast-emerging themes. liz: you've got your robotics etf, and in there that tracks -- obviously, when you're looking at those types of things, they track the companies that could benefit from robotics innovation, okay? so that's why when i was really looking into it, i saw you not only have robot names, but you've got farraday future, fubo tv the, amazon, pinterest, because they, in a way with, even if it's a small vise of -- slice of their business, can eventually benefit from a.i. >> absolutely. and this is what the market has kind of missed this year. there's been a focus on a.i., but really only in these mega-cap names.

there's a whole ecosystem of a.i. users that are using it in their products, semiconductor companies that are building the chips, robotics companies are going to benefit from more advanced a. a.i., so we're saying it's not just about four or five names, it's about a hundred names that are really going to benefit from this. liz: yeah. you talk about what people want to invest in, you have a blockchain etf. it has those names, as i mentioned, whether it's marathon, coinbase, etc., or some of these other companies. that, to me, gives an investor an opportunity to get into a basket overall. and then we were just talking with the professor about semiconductors. socks incan dex is an ishares one. that has an incredible year to date run. >> absolutely. and a lot of people focus on maybe one or two names in the semiconductor someplace. there's a lot of depth, and if you look at a.i., it's not just about gpus made by one company, it's about the whole infrastructure ecosystem. liz: absolutely.

so we'll see when arm gets included one day, maybe. jay, it's good to have you. jay jacobs. at this moment the federal reserve is behind closed doors, as we said, attempting to navigate the u.s. economic ship safely into the soft landing dock. but could a black swan set off a tidal wave that drowns captain jay powell's carefully-charted course? nick timiraos, the "wall street journal" fed reporter that wall street most closely follows, is about to give you his view. by the way, the u.s. dollar easing against a basket of currencies for a third day in a row as a traders await tomorrow's federal reserve rate decision. don't go away, we're coming right back. dow is down 154. ♪ ♪

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liz: all right. so as we have told you, the federal reserve's 2-day meeting is currently underway behind this august federal reserve building, and in just over 22 hours, we will know more about the conversations happening right now as the policymakers huddle. is the conversation, though, pivoting from one more interest rate hike or maybe potential rate cuts to the dangers of keeping rates higher for longer? investors are, call it pins and needles here ahead of the fed's economic projections. we've got stocks in the red at the moment. washington, d.c. and the "wall street journal"'s nick timiraos. nick, just about everybody on wall street is pressing the refresh button on the journal's web site to see your latest

article, but you're here first on "the claman countdown." what's your sense that the discussion is shape shifting to this concern that if we do pause ask and leave it at pause for too long, that may somehow turn into a negative? >> well, liz, thanks for having me. i do think that's the question here. it's probably too soon for them to signal a pause because we've been seeing better data on growth, on consumer spending. in that's been firmer than they anticipated at their last meeting and the meeting before that. by the same token, you know, the inflation news has gotten better. there are signs now that a labor market is loosening somewhat, though conditions still seem quite tight. so not enough for them to really firm up plans to raise rates again, but not puff for them to -- enough for them to signal the all clear either. so i think that's why this is going to be a really interesting meeting, press conference tomorrow, a series of deliberations over how do you know when you've done enough.

liz: fed funds futures is the instrument that enables traders and investors to bet on what will happen. we know that 99% chance of a pause tomorrow, however, we look at november. that's actually come down. it was, i don't know, a couple of days ago i looked at it, it was at 41% odds of a 25-point basis hike in november. december is suddenly higher than november. do you think there's one more rate tightening in play before, you know, december 31st? >> well, i don't know. i think the reason why you see the december odds creeping higher now is that you will have more data, of course, if you wait, if you skip another meeting, and the data is still in the driver's seat here, you know? her going to hear, we're going to hear data-dependent probably a lot tomorrow, and that's because if the data tell them they need to go again, you know, you'd probably rather do it now than find out in february or march of next year, oh, shoot, you know, we didn't do enough,

inflation's making less progress, growth is coming back. is so that would be the argument for doing another one with here. you know, at the same time, we're going to get another inflation reading as long as there's not a government shutdown before the meeting in november, and then, you know, two more after that. so by december you should have a clear arer idea of whether -- clearer idea of whether you've done enough. the first thing i'm going to look at tomorrow is where are those 19 interest rate projections for december? the sep, the summary of economic projections, is very calendar-specific at the september meeting because people are writing down, in effect, whether they think they need to raise rates at the november or december meeting. in june there were # 12 of 18 people who wrote down an interest rate that is higher than where we are right now. so i think the question is -- liz: that was for december, just to be clear. >> that was for, yeah, for the end of this year. another interest rate increase before the end of this year. so will we still see 12?

there's been one new fed governor sworn in, so you have 19 officials. will we still see 12, or will it be a majority but a narrower majority than what we saw in june? that's, i think, the first thing i'm going to be looking at. liz: okay. we've got the uaw strike. granted, it's very limited at the moment, but if they do strike a deal that a gives them a big wage increase, how does that play into the wage price -- i'm not going to call it a spiral, but higher wages as they try, as companies try and watch their arms around, you know, high or indiana -- high or inflation and letting workers there have a bit more? >> well, a too soon to say, you know? you wonder, on the other hand, if this strike goes on for a long time, do you begin to see car prices go back up? a big part of the kiss inflatioe seen this summer has come from better behaved, declining or slower growth in car prices. so if you have these strikes that expand, go on for longer,

we saw in 2020 and 2021 what some supply disruptions can do to car prices and how that feeds into the consumer price index. so so you have risks here, i think, on both sides. liz: nick timiraos of the "wall street journal," thank you for telling us what the first thing you will be looking for is, and that is the december projections for end of year rates. >> thank you, liz. liz: you're welcome. fox business, by the way, is going to have full blown coverage of the fed a's decision, 2 p.m. eastern tomorrow, and right during "the claman countdown," the press conference, and then look who is coming for analysis. it is the jeremy siegel, wharton's professor. don't miss it. we'll be right back. ♪ ♪

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liz: well, as the strike i by uaw workers enters its fifth day, union leaders are warning if serious progress is not made by noon on friday, the strike may be expanded. currently, the walkout is hitting one facility of each of the three automakers, gm, ford and stellantis. the strike is starting to have an impact beyond the automakers as u.s. teal said it is temporarily idling -- steel -- a blast fur mace in illinois, and concern furnace, and another facility had to lay off workers at sites including one in michiganment right know we've

got the big three moving higher by 2 apiece. the airline's pilots' association announced its members have voted overwhelmingly to authorize a strike. the union did not set a date for the potential strike, but said it could be late summer or early fall. negotiations for a new contract with southwest have been ongoing for three years now during which time other airlines from delta to united have come to agreements with their respective unions. southwest hairs down just under 1 -- shares down just under 1%. and speaking of unions, there could very well be a business with union on the horizon for the usfl and the xfl are. multiple reports say the two rival football leagues are in talks to merge ahead of their prospective 2024 seasons. folk sports has declined to comment, fox corporation owns the usfl while dwayne "the rock" johnson and red berg capital own the the xfl.

comcast sports owns the broadcast rights to the xfl are. comcast platte to slightly higher. >> see bow global markets a appointing a new ceo following the departure of edward tilley after an investigation revealed he did not disclose personal relationships with colleagues. he had been with the company for a decade during which time the company's stock more than tripled. tilley is the latest ceo forced out, bp's bernard loony just resign last week over his failure to be fully transparent, and steve steve easterbrook was fired in 2019 after a son -- consensual relationship with an employee which is against mcdonalds' rules. interactive brokers is up 31% over the past year. now will a collab to bolster can crypto trading lead to more

games for the electronic trading platform? we ask billionaire ceo thomas petterfy next. plus, we're going to get his take on the presidential race ahead of next week's gop presidential candidate debate. vivek ramaswamy, he's embracing tiktok saying you've just got to be on the platform to energize young people to get out the vote. one of those o.g. young people on tiktok who's captured the world's attention and is now, along with her sister dixie and her parents, morphing her millions of followers into an entire brand, charlie d'amelio danced her way onto the platform in her early years. his business -- her businessman dad and model mom saw an opportunity to the beginnings of a brand empire. mark and heidi d'amelio are front and center in my new everyone talks to liz podcast which just drop today. how are they navigating fame, family and tiktok?

check it out. i'd love for you to download it on amazon, apple, i heart radio, fox news podcasts, wherever you listen to your podcasts. closing bell, 27 the minutes away. the dow losing about 138 points, the s&p down 12, the nasdaq down 41. we're coming right back. ♪ ♪ (vo) while you may not be a pediatric surgeon volunteering your topiary talents at a children's hospital — your life is just as unique. your raymond james financial advisor gets to know you, your passions, and the way you give back. so you can live your life. that's life well planned. my relationship with my credit cards wasn't good. i got into debt in college, and no matter how much i paid, it followed me everywhere. the high interest... i felt trapped. debt! debt! debt! debt! so i broke up with my credit card debt

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liz: take a look at bitcoin, it is back above 27,000 and earlier hit a september high of $27,490. investors are placing bullish bets on the crypto of record ahead of the federal reserve's rate decision tomorrow. interactive brokers, which operates the largest electronic trading platform in the united states, is making a bet of its own on bitcoin, litecoin, bitcoin cash and etherium. it has just announced it's teaming up with zero hash, a cryptocurrency infrastructure company, to continue building out its crypto trading platform. interactive brokers' founder and

chairman thomas petter my is joining me now first on fox business. thomas, i imagine you wouldn't have struck this deal if there wasn't demand from your customers who are on your brokerage platform. >> well, there is demand, but it is the not as strong as one would expect. we are very happy to announce our partnership which has been in the works for a long time. we have crypto trading on the interactive where brokers' platform for well over two years now, and our commission rates are much lower than anyone if else's. up to now, if you trade crypto on our platform, your coins can -- [inaudible] and we are now adding zero cash to our operation, so it's not really an earth-shaking event. liz: you are, although, constantly upgrading your technology on the platform. and you can't be all things to all people.

custody of cryptocurrencies is a very complex endeavor, so but putting it in -- >> [inaudible] liz: yeah, yeah, exactly. again, custodian, trading, holding, all of that very important. you say that the demand isn't totally skyrocketing at the moment, but are you doing this now because you anticipate that it will? >> well, no. we have been on this for, as i said, over two years. so this partnership has been in the works for a long time. they took some time to get their software up-to-date, if we, as i said, we have been in the business for well over two years now. and to tell you frankly, the volume in crypto trading has been declining gradually over the last -- liz: really? do you think some of that has to do with the securities and exchange commission? gary gensler finish.

>> oh, definitely. liz: -- has been very disinclined to approve many any spot bitcoin etf even though it appears many investors want it. in fact, some say he's slow-walking it, some say he's outright blocking it. how do you view what the sec is doing? >> el -- well, you know -- [laughter] it's very difficult to criticize the e -- sec when you're regulated by them. [laughter] you know, it's better for me to say nothing. liz: well, i'm going to take that as a yes, they are. [laughter] let's talk about options. how much volume are you seeing in the options market? because you've got an announcement on that front as well. >> so options, options trading volume has been increasing tremendously. we have introduced options in the united states 50 years ago last may, so it has been a gradual evolution over time. and more and more people are now understanding what options are,

and they appreciate all the niceties that it brings and all the complex tradings taken to pursue with them. and it is, so stock trading has been declining this past year, option trading has been making up for it, more than making up for it. so options trading is really increasing very, very quickly, and i think people should take some time and devote an hour or two two to familiarize themselves with options. liz: yeah. >> interactive brokers have great, easy to understand tutorial options, and they are a wonderful quite. very -- device. very interesting, rewarding. that's the reason for growing, for the growing popularity. liz: well, sure. people have got to be educated before they start throwing their hard-earned money around. i do have to ask you, thomas, you know, you are a donor mostly to republicans in the party.

you had been donating to the gop candidate for president ron desantis. kind of shifting on that. you have now thrown about a million dollars to virginia governor request glenn youngkin. does that mean you're turning your back on desantis? >> well, look, i tell everybody that you should donate to the people who you any are most likely to be able to get elected in the general election. and i'm afraid if trump is the candidate, that he's going to run existence himself. against himself. namely, people will either vote for trump or vote against trump. and there are more people voting against him than for him, so i don't think that is the optimal choice. so i'm very much hoping that glenn will enter the race and, you know, he could be a wonderful president, and he could certainly win the general

elections. liz: will you come back if he does enter the race, thomas? >> of course. liz: we would really like to have you, because i think a million dollars from you may get him a little bit closer. it's wonderful to have you. thank you so much. >> thank you very much. liz: elon musk is certainly familiar with charging up his tesla evs, but now he's considering charging for something else entirely. charlie gasparino on the shocking move the world's richest man may soon make it. harley breaks it next. and here's a look at how tesla and some of the other ev stocks are moving, tesla higher by about a half a percent. fisker, nio and lucent lower. we're coming right back. the biggest ideas inspire new ones. 30 years ago, state street created an etf

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♪. liz: well this was kind of interesting. while hosting israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu yesterday for a live stream on x, x owner elon musk took the moment to drop this bombshell. he is thinking of implementing a pay wall for all x users. he said it's the only way to solve the platform's bot prompt. first of all, charlie, do you believe that is the reason and secondly will that even work? >> yes i believe that is the

reason because of some of the stuff we've been reporting here on the claman countydown. let me put it into cone tex it will make a lot of sense. we do know he is running around talking to ceos, i know the gentleman, don't want to say it publicly, it was given to me in confidence, the future of x, twitter how he will make money on that in the future. one thing he is talking about creating some sort of a paypal like system. he thinks credit card companies are essentially a rip off. liz: they will raise the fees. >> they will raise them, right? he thinks there has to be a technological way to do it cheaper. he might be able to achieve that -- remember he was one of the founding members of paypal. how do you do that on twitter? one way to do it, is to get users essentially involved, twitter users involved in using

twitter a twitter app as their credit card. one thing i heard really freaked out musk when somebody told him, look at the balance sheet or look at the market cap of jpmorgan versus visa they are almost the same. this credit card company is making so much money compared to the largest bank in the world. so essentially you set up twitter as some sort of a paypal thing, right? you have to monetize the users on the other end to cut down the fees, right? so if you are going to offer this thing, only charge very small fees you have to monetize user data, right? you can't monetize bots. that's why this fits in perfectly. if he can weed out the bots then he can better sell the user data to this bigger plan that he has which is to turn twitter/x into paypal. you can't do one without the other. why to me this makes perfect

sense and i believe if he does go this paypal route, this is what he is going to do. we should point out if you monetize, if you just charge five dollars a month to everybody, that is i guess a number, that bounces around, i still don't think that makes a lot of money for twitter or x, right? liz: well -- >> this is part it ha to be part, i've been bouncing it off of bankers today, this has got to be part of a bigger plan. getting the user data down to where it is real, where it is not fake people, bots are fake, getting it down to where it is real, he can go to advertisers and sell it. liz: right now he lost 60% of his advertising. >> absolutely. liz: some skeptics were saying, to get rid of bots, no. to bring advertisers back. not to bring advertisers back but to get money to replace the bots. >> obviously you will get some money back, probably not a lot. it is also to get the advertisers back and to monetize

the user data for something bigger than twitter. remember he keeps dropping hints. what does he call it the twitter of all things? i don't know there was some grand plan he talked around making twitter to be like -- liz: super app. >> super app but the paypal. liz: do you think netanyahu was like, i'm talking about important things? >> netanyahu understands business. i think he probably said i wow, i just broke some news here on the show. but, liz, make no mistake about it, it is one and the same. you can't have, you can't monetize user data for this paypal app thing without getting rid of the bots. so, and by the way he is clearly, is that him on the right? liz: i am looking, yes. >> god he is a -- dude. liz: my twitter feed is stuffed with random things i don't want to see. is a. >> he has got to clean it up. here is the other thing.

suppose nothing, nothing works? does he get rid of it? i could see him getting rid of it if nothing works. no, no. just saying enough. liz: good-bye. >> i tried it. i'm not putting anymore tesla stock into this. liz: thank you, charlie. closing bell, five minutes away, five 1/2 minutes away. dow, s&p, nasdaq off their session lows. they're on pace still for their second down day in the last three sessions. the dow is losing 82 points, s&p down six and nasdaq getting clipped by 26 points. crude oil, this is interesting, it is backing off the 10-month high is set today. it settled during the session, $91 a barrel, down for the first time in four days. yesterday's chevron ceo slapped a 100-dollar price target on oil. a lot of analysts have been doing that but mike worth doesn't usually come out

swinging that way. he did on bloomberg. today's losses will not put a damper on a pretty outrageously robust quarter for the commodity. in the third quarter alone crude oil is up a massive 30% and rbob gasoline that is wholesale gasoline has gained 23 1/3%. today's countdown closer says investors should dive into the liquid gold mine. joining us 30 billion assets under management, market group chief strategist ryan detrick. prices are pretty much under the microscope for this because that is a big component of inflation after all and you think thousand is the time to get in on that? >> thanks, liz for having me back. we've been overweight energy for self weeks now. we don't buy the global resession talk, all the bad the economy is doing we won't buy that, right? we know there is not a tone of supply. we're overweight energy. there is room, it had incredible

run when you look at crude oil maybe a well-deserved pullback. here is the thing investors should know. energy stocks are trading virtually where they were in 2008 a little higher. for 15 years energy stocks have gone nowhere. this group is rallying for a couple years now. it could have several years of outperformance. if you look oaf history, commodities leap over stocks. we think we're in one of those scenarios right now. liz: you look at output, countries like iraq, nigeria, they are all coming back. in fact they're upping their output, i don't know, nigeria oil production today, they said exxonmobil today pledge ad new oil production number of 40,000 additional barrels per day in its nigerian operations. mexico, iran, venezuela, they're all producing more but it is the demand question, right? >> again you're right. no one has the exact answer

there, like i started the first question we think the global economy is stronger specifically the united states. the united states is making almost more barrels per day than anyone else in the world. we didn't have that 20 and 30 years ago. not saying we can control the price of oil but we do have some keys we didn't have before. the truth again the consumer is still strong. we see what the fed has to say. we think the fed has done hiking. some parts of inflation coming back, we look at rents, shelter, core% of cpi coming back down. economy strong, by the way 12 h 12 months estimates on s&p 500 earnings as we sit and talk right now are at an all-time high. earnings continue to think what we see is still a bull market. liz: doesn't that mean if earnings remain strong that means they have customers? you just saw amazon breaking the news today they will hire a quarter of a million holiday seasonal workers because they think, i assume they are doing this because they see that the demand will be there. doesn't that then mean, uh-oh the fed will have to continue to

tighten rates and at some point does it work in the reverse that we do eventually further out a recession? >> sure. i mean we don't think the fed has to continue to hike. we see it in different parts of inflation coming back. we've i will leave it like this we've been in the camp fed will leave it higher for longer link guy we use. one more quick thing on amazon. i know amazon makes up a huge part of consumer discretionary, but it is hard to to be overly bearish when consumer discretionary is breaking out relative to consumer staples a risk on. one hour, high yield is drastically outperforming treasuries. when you see these things happening this is more of risk on scenario. this is typical of august, september, chop volatility frustration. we're still optimistic the fourth quarter will be strong for equities. >> jpmorgan's phil sat here on the set the higher yield is looking better than the treasurys. really quickly, ryan, small cap,

russell 2000, the worst month to date performer. well, actually, it looks pretty bad. it is down 3% for the month, nasdaq down two, s&p down one, you still like small and mid-caps here? >> further, let's say remainder of this year out a couple quarters we do. similar theme we don't see a recession. smaller cap will do better, more alpha to play catchup to their big brothers. something cheap out there? small caps are historically cheap relative to large caps. we're looking for stuff cheap. small cap is an area we like. we think it is a good place. [closing bell rings] liz: buy low, ryan, thanks so much. don't miss our all-star lineup, jeremy siegel and kyle bass. ♪. larry: hello, folks, welcome to "kudlow," i'm larry kudlow. so the federal reserve meeting is, held today and tomorrow and there's an fomc an