there's not a lot of cap capital. charles: bottom line, it's just starting. >> just like your guest said, we always knew it was going to take us into the ninth month, and now with the $5 billion starting next month of student loan repayments and all of the savings drying up, that's it. ca. charles: all right, or rebecca -- >> it's guest -- depressing, i'm sorry. charles: thanks a lot, really appreciate it. the market was falling apart as the show began. right on cue, by the way, right in these closing selloffs have been worrisome. we're trying to firm up right now. liz claman, you got a lot on your hands because this last hour of trading has been hectic. liz: yeah. and, guess what? we're kind of seeing this turn around due to headlines out of washington d.c. investor s, you guys, they woke up on the risk-on side of the bed, they quickly rolled over to the risk-off side, and now it appears her fighting to get back into the green. the turn around coming after senate leader mitch mcconnell

held a news conference just about an hour ago during which he promised the senate, regardless of the bickering going on in the house ors or would work on keeping the government open. now, let me just pick this apart for you. the vix was waving the fear nag for the second straight day -- flag the -- but you can see it punch back into the red after having been up earlier. we've got it at 18.49. yesterday e the volatility index closed at 18.94, that's the highest in 4 months. notwithstanding the momentary moderation of fear, can you blame investors for being jitteriesome we are now less than 3 days and 9 hours away from a government shutdown, and the house is nowhere near agreement on a plan to fund the government by saturday is' deadline. republican factions in the house holding up a short-term government funding bill, but we are learning a potential compromise involving southern border security and ukraine funding has begun to take shape, one that's getting consideration

from a number of republicans including speaker kevin mccarthy. coming up, republican congressman bill high zynga of michigan does not want to see a shutdown. he's already got thousands of constituents on the uaw picket lines without paychecks. what kind of compromise is he willing to make, and are others following at this hour? we've got representative the huizenga in just a few minutes. in the meantime, take a look at the dow, extending yesterday's 38ing-point -- 388-point loss. earlier mt. session it was down 312 points. yesterday was the worst performance in six months, but if you look at the dow heat map now, fewer names in the red, more poking into the green including visa and honey welk. at the bottom, verizon, procter & gamble and merck are the laggards, all down anywhere from 1 to 1.5 president. -- 1.5%. the nasdaq trying to lift off the lowest close since may, and right now it's doing it. it's back up 38 points, had been

down about 100 points, so really coming back a bit. the nasdaq is above 13,000 at the moment, but earlier -- and i'm talking maybe 38 minutes ag. okay. we're back above it, 13,104. treasury yields showing no mercy. the 10-year yield hitting a fresh 16-year high. we now have it at 4.6 # 3%. earlier when it hit the fresh 61-year high, it was at 4.593, so this is a fresh, fresh high. [laughter] and the 2-year, yo guys, it's holding at a 17-year high, up 6 basis points to 5.13%. the energy sector is gut punching the bears. oil just got $3.34 closer to $100 a barrel oil. west texas intermediate now trading in the aftermarket session at $9 if.72 -- 93.72, and that's a gain of about 3.33%. if you look at the whole energy

complex, it is the hire, but the drillers and refiners are really gushing up, and that includes apache, neighbors industries up 6.5%, hammer lick and pain up. high oil means high gasoline prices which have spiked 67% under president biden. that may have at least some voters on both sides of the aisle ready to consider the alternatives. in less than six hoursing, they're going to hear from seven of them, seven gop contenders mt. second republican debate right here on fox business. so grady trimble live at the ronald reagan library in simi valley, california, where it will all take place. grady, we're on the cusp of a government shutdown. four of the seven on the stage tonight have served as state governors who, as we know unlike the federal government request, must balance their state budgets. do you get the sense tata voters and viewers will be really looking to hear who has a better solution if they were in power? >> reporter: i think so, liz.

and to your point, each of those four candidates, which is more than half of the candidates on the stage, like to tout their experience balancing their state budgets, so we could expect them to do that again and say that they could do it at the federal level with the mismatched spending in the federal government. we are here in the spin room at the ray -- reagan presidential library, but i want to give you a sneak peek of the debate stage because our crews here have been working really hard to transform the iconic air force one pavilion into a debate venue that is ready for prime time. rnc chairwoman ron that if mcdaniel says these seven gop candidates hoping to be the 47th president of the united states could emulate the late 40th. >> the last time a republican beat a democrat incumbent president was ronald reagan in 1980, and it was jimmy carter. and i think there's a lot of similarities right now with the world as it is today with joe

biden failing the american people and bidenomics and inflation. and it's time for are republicans to take back the white house. >> reporter: the biden campaign has also been here in southern california. president biden himself will be many northern california -- in northern california for some fund raising events today. he and his campaign have been trying to paint all of the gop hopefuls as too radical. >> we're going to stay focused on getting that message and our accomplishments out and making sure that voters understand the extreme agenda that a we're going to continue to see tomorrow night coming from that debate stage. >> reporter: all right. so the stage is set. most notably, the podium positions tonight are a little bit different than just one month ago in milwaukee. former u.n. ambassador nikki haley moving up to the third position after a strong performance there in wisconsin, so she could have a target on her back tonight. as you know, liz, at these

debates anything can happen, but the stakes are really high because we've only seen one candidate who didn't make debate stage who was on the last one. but after this one the field really could start to narrow. liz? liz: oh, boy. it's going to be exciting to watch, certainly, but i think american voters want answers to the real problems of this country. i know dana and stuart are going to crush it there. it's going to be terrific along with ilya, and -- ilia, and everybody should tune in for number two gop debate right here on fox business. to the markets where risks are brewing beyond government shutdowns. i mean, if you check the s&p, it is looking at a gain of 10 points. earlier though it was adding to yesterday 's 63-point loss after tuesday's 207-point loss. the nasdaq is now back into the green here punching higher by 66 points. but with september ending this weekend, the nasdaq pretty much the ugliest, lacking to close out the month around 7% lighter

than where it began. now, some of that sparked by concerns the consumer's buying power is starting to wane. credit card stocks, they were pretty messy earlier. let's check them right now. moody's today says it's seeing consumer debt continuing to the expand, and the quality of that debt is actually declining. moody's also notes delinquencies outside of mortgages are now inching up. all of that not good, but brian moynihan, bank of america's ceo, in new york today. one of biggest card issuers telling the economic club of new york this afternoon he still sees consumer spending strength, that commercial credit quality is still very strong and that, quote, we won't have a recession. all right. let's figure out how investors should see the picture. to the floor the show. tom hayes and brent chutety. tom, equities falling and now the russell 2000, actually earlier was the one area of the

grain, i want to check it and, yes, it's up about let's call it 1%, much more than the rest of them. so where are the flows? right now, because when money comes out of the market, it has to go somewhere. >> that's right. what a difference a headline makes. we were just talking, the whole market was red, money's been flowing into energy, industrials, small caps. it's been flowing out of health care all day. it's been flowing a little bit out of tech, but that's starting to come back. so the fear, as soon as mcconnell came out, of the shutdown was serious -- liz: so within the hour you're talking about. >> within the hour mcconnell said we're going to work to keep the government open, and as soon as that happened, the market completely rebounded which shows the amount of fear. are. liz: so the green room is about, what, 50 feet out that way, and tom was there, i'm here, our producer's in the booth and he's like, you have to look. this is what i'm seeing from the all of my traders is and everybody that i'm looking at when it comes to the flows. you say that the semiconductors started to come back. >> and the vix collapsed ors,

which was very interesting as well. you have a number of fears. you have the vacuum going into earnings season, people have low expectations for that. you have the seasonality, the 10 worst days of the year ended yesterday, so we're starting to move into a seasonably favorable period, but that was hindered by the potential threat of a shutdown. liz: brent, do you see that as part of the current bull market, a start of a bull market or maybe just a bear market rally? >> no, i think we're headed towards more difficult times in the sewer mediate term -- intermediate the term. i thinks agree with brian monaghan, i do believe there's a registration likely in the next few months as the liquidity kind of continues to grind that spending to a halt. if you think about it, to me, the most important thing is inflation. that certainly has moved lower, but i think the final frontier for inflation for the fed is wage growth, and right now it's too high. too high or too tight, and unfortunately, the only way that the labor market has loosenedded

in the past is through a recession that drives wage growth lower, and that's what i think you're going to see in the coming months. liz: one other comment that brian moynihan said was the fed has won the near-term battle against inflation. i'm not, i'm not an economist, but i'm not sure that anyone on the fed would say, oh, we've won, let's wave our flags and say we did it, right, brent? let's just say that the truth is somewhere in between. where are you investing? you have something like $265 billion in assets under management. >> yeah. i think where it's important is they won the current battle. the current battle is based upon covid-impacted inflation. so the economy was pushed out of equilibrium, and inflation went from goods to services with in between about based upon ukraine and russia pushing commodity prices higher. that bout is over. the bout that i'm worried about is a wage price spiral, and that's where i think the fed is worried, and that's the final

frontier on inflation. they have to pull that down, and the only way to do so is through a recession. look, i think the good news for investors is that bonds yield 5.35%. i think inflation will falter, and i think that a gives you a real opportunity for real value in the bond market, so we're tilting more towards that direction to prepare for any coming recession and the reality that along with that recession inflation is squashed and at 5.35% versus a 2% inflation target, i think you have a real opportunity to add value in that manner. liz: if you see value as, and i'm not sure you do, brent, but i know tom does, as certain products that people will continue to buy no matter what the economy is doing, tom, you actually like generac. and i think you said this well before the open today, and it's up 6.5% right now. >> yeah. so they came out at their investor day this morning and reaffirmed their guidance. this is one of those stocks that has collapsed, it's down 80% off of its recent highs in 2021. why?

because they overhered like many of the industrial -- overhired like many of the industrial companies. they're trading at 14 times next year's earnings as opposed to the their average multiple of 29 times. they're basically the kleenex of home standby generators, and and as we move towards electrification, we're seeing grids go down, unusual weather events, and that all helps generac. they're preparing for the future with the battery power walls and clean energy, and their industrial business is growing with the 55g rollout. there's a lot of -- 5g rollout. it's exceptionally cheap, and we think this can be an easy double over the next 12-36 months. liz: double. the pe is certainly palatable. >> correct. liz: brent, when you hear names like that, what goes through your mind if i were to ask you how does an a investor remain tactically bullish e even if you believe, which you say you do, that we will dip into recession? >> yeah. i think similar story but in a different context. i think for the intermediate

term, i think there are pockets of the market that offer good value. so if you look at a small and mid cap which typically don't to do well during a recession because they're economically sensitive, i think they've already discounted some of that. small cap stocks, the s&p 600 raids at 12.8 times earnings, and there is a margin of safety for those who want to invest with a longer her term focus -- liz: okay, wait. so just could you buy the index? would you say buy the index? that's what buffett would say. >> certainly you could buy the s&p 600 index, but there are pockets of opportunity in the stock market. the s&p 500 as tom mentioned, there's parts of that market that are cheap also, and i think value stocks in general are cheap on a historical basis. and i think on the opposite side of this which could be fairly sharp, i think there's good news for investors in those parts. liz great to see you both. senate and house leadership, because we just talked about this, it is a moment-by-moment

developing story. they are still struggling to craft a compromise to avert a government shutdown. you're looking at a live picture of capitol hill right now where senator chuck schumer is speaking. republican congressman bill huizenga of michiganen standing by live next with the latest chatter in the back halls of capitol hill and with his state the nerve center of the uaw strike, what are his best ideas to end the strike that's hurting his constituents? well, with the strike still going, we've got a mixed picture for the big three automakers at this hour. ford down slightly, gm up about a third of a percent. stellantis down one-tenth of a percent. "the claman countdown" is coming right back. ♪ in them. at t. rowe price our strategic investing approach can help you build the future you imagine. t. rowe price, invest with confidence. ♪

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liz: we are less than four days away from that government shutdown, and as republicans squabble amongst their factions, it appears hope for maybe a compromise could come down to horse trading with with the democrats over ukraine funding and securing the porous southern border. listen. >> i mean, the way i look at it, especially when you're looking at american soil, 50,000 people in the last 5 days? we've watched this time and again. massachusetts, a state of emergency. new york has become the number one issue, and we're going to ignore that? i think if you want to walk and chew gum at the same time, you've got to deal with the issues before you. i want to deal with disaster, but i want to also deal with the border. >> we should never let 5 or 10 people push us around like this. the problem solvers has what i call a bipartisan bill that has a c.r., what has disaster relief money, ukraine money and border security money. i think it's a better, better fit.

liz: that was congressman don bacon of nebraska. he is a republican. congressman bill huizenga is now in front of our camera as live. he is on the house financial services committee. congressman, what are you hearing in the back halls behind you about that? is the number of house republicans who maybe would agree to a deal like that growing? >> yeah. well, liz, first of all, thanks for having me on. but i like to refer to these as robust conversations, not arguments. maybe a fine definition there. this is, this has been pretty healthy so far, but we're at the point in all seriousness where it's going to become unhealthy very, very quickly. and here's what i'm hearing from folks. there's disagreement more on the tactic, not the, not the destination really. it's really more about that journey. and for some folks, and this is what my colleague don bacon was talking about, for some folks

they believe that no matter what, we cannot have any sort of continuation of government funding or a continuing resolution, and they do want to shut down the government because with they think that that this will bring greater pressure, ultimately, that will create a better deal and get us back on track. i think they're wrong. i think they're absolutely wrong about that. history would show us, and i've lived through a few of these having been elected back in 2010, i've lived through a shutdown with the obama administration and the trump administration, and this has never turned out well for those of us that have lived through it. liz: well, i guess appealing to those, as you say, the small handful of republicans who are standing in the way, appealing to them and saying our military starring, if we passes the saturday night deadline, will not get paid, tsa agents will not get paid, the coast guard members won't get paid, but they have to report to duty. and these are people who are living paycheck to paycheck. what's going on in the minds of

the people who say let's just, let's just cut 'em off in. >> yeah -- liz: as part of a bigger fight, obviously. >> yeah, it is. and, frankly, that's one of the reasons why i supported another bill a colleague of mine from virginia who is a military background herself that we would keep those folks getting paid. now, they do get a paycheck that drops on friday because the 1st of the month is on the weekend, so there is this 2-week buffer. but nonetheless, i used to represent coast guard city, usa, and we literally -- they were doing food drives, the local folks were doing food drives and having meals prepared for the coastties and their families. so this is real. and, you know, one of the other things is i chair the oversight and investigation subcommittee on the financial services committee, so we have oversight of the securities is and exchange commission. just had a robust conversation with gary gensler earlier today to. but those investigations stop in my subcommittee. they stop at jamie comer's

oversight committee. they stop in judiciary and ways and means. so whether it's hunter biden or other investigations that are going on, those grind to a halt. so in my mind, it is much better for all of us that a if we can continue to to fund government arguably at a lower rate than what it had been last year, give request ourselves an additional 30 or maybe a few more days to go through the appropriations process, we're going to be voting on four appropriations bills tonight. in fact, we're going to be voting til probably about midnight tonight, and then work through the remaining appropriations bills, that's a path forward. but we've got some folks who just simply don't want to do that. liz: and quickly because you, obviously, represent many michiganders, the headline coming out this afternoon is that the uaw chief shawn fein says friday they will announce new strike targets if a deal is

not cobbled together with the big three automakers. clearly there's got to be a way to quickly solve that strike. what are we missing here beyond the arguments that, oh, electric vehicles will hurt jobs? i mean, we're building batteries here. they could be restrain for something like that or not. but what about other options like stopping buybacks at certain companies? investors are now weighing in and saying we're okay with that. >> yeah. well, there's a lot of fear, and you have to understand i have a background, my grandfather was part of the first original sit-down strikes in flint, and we have kind of a divided family on this. i've got cousins who are uaw members and retired uaw, but i also have non-union kind of family members over on the west side of the state. but here's what we do know, there is the potential for a real impact across michigan and, by extension, across the country if there is not resolution are. there's a lot of fear that's

driving this, fear about the future. and, yes, evs are part of this as sort of this headlong rush towards evs has caused a lot of uneasiness within the workers e themselves because they're not sure what that future might look like as well as the original equipment manufacturers too. liz: gotcha. congressman, go talk to some of your friends who are holding out here because a lot of americans do not want to see a shutdown. thank you for joining us. >> thank you. we're working on a balance -- i'm sorry, on a budget commission. so hopefully -- liz: all right. thank you so much. we are coming right back. the dow back in negative territory, down 12 points. we're talking more of the barbie effect floating one stock. ♪ so you only pay for what you need. that's my boy. now you get out there, and you make us proud, huh? ♪ bye, uncle limu. ♪

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liz: breaking news, meta shares have just vaulted $12 off their lows in the last couple of minutes here. they have been, as you see, well below where they are right now. right now we're trading at $298 and change. earlier the low of the session for meta, i just want to get you the right, $286 ask and change. so a big move to the upside, still slightly down, but mark zuckerberg, the ceo, just announced that the facebook parent will roll out an update to its rayban smart glasses in mid october. zucker zuckerberg says at the meta connect event that its smart glasses will be able to live stream broadcasts directly from the glasses to facebook and instagram. they will have a meta a.i. voice

assistant built into them that actually will be able, he says, to identify what people are seeing in the real world. it would also be able to perform language translation. the smart glasses will be available on october 17th. they'll be priced at $299 a pair. of course, ray ban, that stock is down about a third of a percent. those are the adrs, it is an italian company. investors are jumping into the playpen with toymaker mattel. shares are powering higher by 3.5% after morgan stanley initiated the stock at a price target of $27. it's at nearly $222 right now -- 22 right now with an overweight rating, and they named it a top pick. mattel stands to benefit from licensing deals relating to the super success of the barbie movie. transport provider xpo logistics, up 3.8%. it started up high, then it nearly kind of fumbled all of

the gains, and now you see it going even higher than earlier. it's getting a boost if an an a list upgrade. evercore moving the stock to outperform and lifting the price target to $79 and 72, as we mentioned, it's at 70 and change, citing an operational turn around. well, we talked about how well the energy complex was doing. everybody but nexterra. the energy giant's being sucked out of the stock, it is down 19.33% at this hour after the renewables company slashed its growth outlook citing tighter monetary policy and higher interest rates. the news adding a tough year -- adding to a tough year for nexterra whose stock has fallen 44%. and data analytics giant palantir getting a boost from a new 3-year, $250 million contract with the u.s. army that involves research into machine learning and a.i. the company also plans to

integrate generative a.i. into its software platforms. shares of palantir are moving higher by nearly 7 percent right now on that a headline. hollywood writers putting down their picket signs and picking back up their pencils. the writers are heading back to work. could the actors soon follow? not right now. we've got actor the, writer, comedian and saturday night live alum rob schneider who's standing by live to talk about both sides of this and what the actors these to hear now from the big studios. and here's a look at how the hollywood studios are trading at this hour. mixed picture here, comcast, pararah mount a bit higher, "claman countdown" is coming right back. ♪

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a deal with hollywood stewed quos that they are calling exceptional. big protections from artificial intelligence, more transparency about ratings from streaming services, pay increases each of the three years of the contract and writers' room staffing requirements. now union members still need to ratify it, but voting begins october 2nd-9th. this stage though of approval lets writers go back to work right now if they want to. the studios, however, must turn their full attention to making a deal with striking actors. reports coming out now indicate that after two months of zero meetings, the studios and actors could actually sit down to talk within days. joining me now live is a man in a unique position. rob schneider, star of movies from the hot chick, 50 first dates and comedy writer is a member of both the wga and sag

sag-aftra. is one half of you happy in. >> i don't know who you could get today who wasn't an expert. i'm not an expert on anything, i'll tell you. this looks like a pretty darn good deal. it's a 5% minimum increase upon ratification and, in other words, if it's a group of writers working on one thing, they don't have to split their health ask and pension benefits, each of them get treated as a single writer. that's a pretty good one. but the big one, liz, was a.i., that's the big one, okay? now, that was something that i think they went to the wall for, to the mat. and if it was 150 days of a strike and it was over this, so a.i. now, according to this agreement, can't write or rewrite literary material. if a book comes in, they can't just put it to a.i -- liz: and write a script from it. >> so the a.i.-generated material can't be used to undermine a writer's credit. that is a big one because a lot of folks are always turning to the movies. a the studios can't require a writer to use a.i. software, but

the writer can, it's up to him. the studio must disclose if any of the materials was a.i.-generated, but the biggie though, studios can't exploit a writer's material. and they can't use that writer's material to, in essence, are replace the writer. so they can't use that to train a.i. you can't put jerry seinfeld script and say, hey, come up with a jerry seinfeld episode, we need it. we need a couple more. that's a big one. liz: i'm guessing you'll vote for it. >> yeah. that's a good one and, hey, i've never seen this, netflix, they've been around a while now. they've never show or agreed to show number of viewership. yeah. actually show it to writer withs. liz: let's explain to our viewers, rob, why that matters. let's just say you were a writer of a show that nobody watched or you were the writer of squid games, perhaps, you know, any of the other big ones, the last of us, i can think of many.

stranger things. you want to know so that you can say, well, now i deserve more because i got, you know, butts in the seats, you know, people watching it on their couches or phones, whatever it may be. >> exactly. well, the thing is before because hollywood, believe it or not, they're in this for the money. [laughter] so whatever makes them the most money, they want to also brag and say how much money -- liz: yeah, exactly. >> it used to be they used to just brag about and sometimes exaggerate the number of viewers and how much money they made on the weekend. like if they were close to making $20 the million on the weekend, they made 19.5, just say 20 and deal with it. so that's what they would do. but at the same time, streamers have been very tight on showing anybody and giving think of hair competition or the writers, letting them know how much, how many viewers -- liz: god forbid they pay for performance, which is what ceos love to see. rob, let's turn to the actors'

strike because you yourself are an actor as well. they are in their 75th day of striking. what is the big holdup here on this one, and do you think that their strike might go longer than the wga's? >> i think that this is going to put pressure on both sides to get the actors back. and there -- i don't know enough about exactly what the writers were striking about, but as far as the a.i. aspect of it, i mean, let's be honest, it's really hard for a new technology to be held back. so when you can save producers money, in other words, when you can have your actor in the foreground and just put other actors in the background and not have to have real actors there, it's hard to go back and say we want you to spend that money. it's basically saying, look, we've got a faster horse and buggy, and we're going to make you use it, but you're like, yeah, we've got this thing called an automobile -- called an automobile. you might not see actors in commercials anymore, and i just

don't know how much power -- are. liz: i'm thinking of actors who do voices, obviously. you are very good at it. i mean, they could somehow, and we've seen this happen with drake, the singer, where a.i. mimicked his voice. and that is outrageous. he was unhappy about it. you know, why should that company or whoever did that make some money? i mean, you do a great leno, you do a great jerry seinfeld. who knows if a.i -- >> you also have to come down here with -- [laughter] i do think, you know, the cat's out of the bag. we just don't know, actually, we don't even know the specialty of what a.i. can really do. can they just make movies and replace all actors? we don't know. i think it's a really tough negotiation for the producers and the actors. but i do think just like the writers, they have to just stand their ground, say this cannot be used to replace and and cannot replace an actor, a writer and a writer's credit. and i do think that we have to have the same protections with

the actors. we have, you can't take an actor and just use his face or use him to, you know, computer generate him and then use him again throughout the show without being compensated. i think that's -- liz: okay. using -- do the impression of leno and say thank you to "the claman countdown" viewers for -- >> you know, you guys are the best. you guys, the countdown -- you again, doing it all. hi, it's a pleasure. [laughter] i hope they don't a.i. me soon. liz: a little mix of seinfeld and leno. great to have you. i'm very pleased that both sides have come to this agreement, and let's hope the sag-aftra a finish. >> let's hope so, because it's the caterers, the people -- liz: the whole ecosystem. >> it's everybody. it's the drivers, it's everybody. i'm glad we're getting people close to back to work. liz: good to see you, my friend. >> thank you, liz are. liz: nonpartisan political group no labels ramping up at this

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♪. liz: we are just over five hours away from the second republican presidential debate hosted by fox business where gop candidates will try to convince voters why they should be picked to run the country. meanwhile non-partisan political group, no labels is at this hour ramping up efforts to convince millenials to vote for an independent candidate. they are targeting millenials. why? >> biggest voting block, potential voting block, more millenials out there in the population according to no labels. they had a very statistical analysis, more millenials than any other group. they're not as politically sort of active as boomers. boomers still vote in greater numbers but they're there for

the picking. here is what no labels is saying doing this in concert with what we are reporting exclusively on the show for their outreach to people, outreach to donors to get on all 50 states this basically saying we can win this. here is how we can win this in a three-way race. if we get millenials engaged and millenials are increasingly independent. so that is the pitch they're making to donors. i got, i got the pitch today. it came via a source that is part of know labels. liz: okay. >> in a couple days we'll see something significant. couple weeks -- liz: don't they need a ticket first? >> they do. here's what i would bet, i don't know if i bet my pinky or anything like that, an appendage, but i bet some money probably. liz: on whom? >> they will be in all 350 states. they will get on the ballot. here is why i think that, because they're convinced that it's biden versus trump.

they're convinced that most people, like there is a huge radical middle of the country that doesn't biden versus trump if they really had their druthers. they are convinced they can get on all 50 states and the fact that biden and trump are so out there in so many ways. joe biden is not mentally equipped as he was maybe 10 years ago. he is not there. trump has got his own issues, particularly legal issues. let's be real clear, donald trump basically incited a riot january 6th. i hate to say it like that but it is what it is. i watched it. you can't sugarcoat that. i'm not saying he should go to jail for it but he did this pretty irresponsible. a lot of people believe that too. they think they have a shot and a lot of money people sitting there saying we think, if you can get somebody legitimate in there, a joe manchin, a glenn youngkin, it could maybe right this ship because we're going down biden and trump in the wrong direction. i'm not saying i agree with

that. i'm telling you that is their pitch. it is increasingly popular with republicans. now here is the weird thing. you brought up yesterday -- liz: larry hogan was a national chair of no labels, joe lieberman, former senator, independent, founding chairman. >> you brought up wouldn't this hurt democrats, hurt the democrats and -- liz: it will hurt joe biden. >> why would it hurt him? if you run someone in the middle, more republicannish, larry hogan, i don't think they will be him. they respect him probably the leader of the party, i don't think they can get up there and go toe-to-toe as sort of a charismatic figure with maybe trump but if you had someone up there like glenn youngkin, joe manchin, someone right of center, joe manchin, face it is right of center, why wouldn't that pull out for republicans? liz: it might.

>> their data shows they get equaled. the ross perot, the last independent serious campaign, not one state. 18% of the vote, not one state. liz: charlie, keep digging i appreciate it. retail is alive and well. at least that's what the "shark tank" stars kevin o'leary, barbara corcoran and daymond john told us yesterday. >> it's back. amazon 40% up year-to-date. the nrf has expected another 4% increase. people are at home now. working on computers at home. they want to see people. my staff probably half the time at a mall during a time they should be working. they have to give people a different experience. going into the world with a different experience. macy's should have a live stream from macy's. everybody hooked up to instagram. they walked down the runway where they can buy everything they're wearing, macy'ses is the

most popular store in the world. they need someplace they're going they can't experience someplace. liz: bring in the experience. valuengine capital management jordan kimmel. the headline, target shuttering nine stores due to shrink, that means employee theft in four different states. not employee theft, i'm sorry. thieves attacking employees. things have gotten too, too dangerous for them. jordan they're somewhat in the middle of a retail area to invest in and do you suppose this shrink issue is a little bit less of an issue as time goes by and people figure out how to fight it? >> it is great to be with you, liz. i tell you this i would not like to own or run a retail shop and i think damon is right, that the consumers are out there. it is a much discussed recession coming and you can't even take all consumers paint them with the same brush. the some are price insensitive.

others are spending too much on gas and food. i think you know me well enough. i like to do the math. there are opportunities but you have to have value growth, and momentum, liz, i would hate to be running a retail operation and dealing with the crime that's out there. liz: super difficult. one thing that damon mentioned he really likes apple because apple stores give you that experience. we have kevin o'leary saying that he loves rolex. not that rolex is your average retailer. he is a big watch collector. talk where else you see opportunity here. at top of the show we said value. tom hayes talking about names like generac. you give me what are your ideas. >> what is in our portfolio, mattel earlier came up, we mentioned also jakks pacific in the toy group. there is something called a earnings yield. how much the price is, what the actual net income is. you look at margins and actually

the earnings yield on jaxx is for times that of mattel. tell damon to give me a call. he is really entertaining but is is right about macy's but the stock is a little bit broken. it trades very cheaply. analysts are actually reducing their estimates where the other analysts are raising their estimates for jack. what i like is this narrow, narrow group of companies called magnet that have value growth and momentum. those are the only things that can get into my portfolio. we were holding some cash but we're actually thinking the market is ready for a little bit after run here, sold off. that is what we're looking at, only one we own in retail now is jakk. liz: you like health care, amgen, in tech you like mmci. i want to say micron is reporting after the bell. we're waiting on that.

we're trying to see the china effect on chip stocks. money is coming in. the dow reversed. it had climbed into the green earlier this hour. it is down 80 points. a lot of that is the looming government shutdown. give me 15 second. >> here is the thing i think you need to look beyond over the hood of your car. i know there will be rough times. i don't think you want to be chasing overvalued companies, and you have to know what you own. liz: good stuff. always good to see you. [closing bell rings] liz: thank you very much, jordan kimmel. markets mixed at this hour. s&p popped into positive territory. we'll call that too close to call. russell green, dow jones industrials red. ♪. larry: hello, folks, welcome to "kudlow," i'm larry kudlow. we're here at the ronald reagan presidential library working with our colleagues for the second republican presidential debate tonight. now as an alumnus of