powell doing his best volcker imitation. culturally we saw barbie and now there's a bunch of movie remakes especially of horror films. bring on the bellbottoms and the afros. the fact is 70s grit, it was baptism by fire. who would think the main selling point for boys pajamas would be they were retarded. that is it. we were taking our little brothers down, and hope we can bring back boom boxes and everyone can have a lot of fun. we need to hear music, take it on a train with you. liz claman knows what i'm talking about. she grew up in the 70s as well. you are reminiscing about gritty days in beverly hills.

liz: you make me feel mighty real. charles, what? charles: happy birthday. liz: thank you so much. go to commercial break. i need to eat this. thank you. fox market alert. t-23 hours before investors get some clarity on the answer to the question of this year. when does the federal reserve think it might cut interest rates? as the feds policy committee mulls that question behind closed doors the bulls are ignoring all of it and charging ahead once again. looking at dow jones industrials up one hundred 40 one points. again about third of 1% as the blue chips close to a two year high and within 1.4% of on all-time record. flip it to the s&p 500, 15

points, 4% away from its record. even the disaster do sure, oracle, isn't dinging the s&p, the cloud and enterprise software giant up $230 market. reported mixed results for its fiscal second quarter. stock is getting clocked down 2%. and increasing competition is really what slamming the shares, and and wiser to crushing the s&p, the s&p is holding up, oracle is waiting on the index, under half of 1%. compare that to apple's 7.4%, it has been a great year for apple, climbing 2 thirds of 1%,

popping back to a $3 trillion market. what would you guess 2,024 would bring? dan ives, one of the most wild on wall street joins me in studio at the bottom of the hour at 3:00 pm eastern. new jaw dropping call on apple, his sales predictions just in the last hour, dan and his team put out a stunning new note on cybersecurity stocks. he is going to unveil it here. to the markets, whatever you see on the screen, the highest intraday level since january 22nd. and the dow transports, a complete state of flux, the federal reserve announcements will include what i told you about, the interest rate

predictions of each voting member and consumer inflation, in line defending on them metric or case over month headline number slightly harder than expected. the fed could keep rates right where they are for longer before they decide to cut them. john taylor of stanford university and scott bauer. that cpi report had the market when it was revealed, scaling back its bets on the rate cut by march. the odds last i checked a couple minutes ago our back to 43.7%, for may. inflation is clearly sticking. investors want to know your prediction when we will see a cut by the fed. professor? can you hear me?

all right. as we try to reestablish with the professor let me get your prediction for the moment, scott, and what investors and what traders are doing ahead of it. >> happy birthday. you are very welcome. we know they won't do anything tomorrow and powell has the outlook, a lot of work to do. the big thing going into the new year will be what of the holiday sales going to be like? what did the consumer do through the holiday sales. numbers down, retail is down across the board, gives more ammo to maybe push up, at lower rates. the market is very comfortable with where we are. we expect that after march we are probably more like 80%, or 90%.

where to go from here, yesterday was the second time in 11 years the nasdaq closed positive with all seven stocks negative. a lot of it could be the nasdaq rebalancing that's coming up at the end of the week. portfolios have to solve those big stocks. i still want to be in a couple stocks through 24. i don't expect them to be up 200% or 50% but these stocks are still cheap. i want to be in meta which last week i was on here and it was around 315. i want to be in a couple of those stocks. additionally, for 2024, i want

to be on cybersecurity space across the board to. if i had to call out two stops. i'm always best in class, clouds strike, palo alto. liz: you better stay tuned. we've got dan ives who just got back from washington dc talking to people in the government, big call on cybersecurity stocks. what he anticipates for 2024, we real established audio with you. thanks for joining us. let me jump to the consumer price index, the read on consumer inflation came in line except for the month over month headline number which was 0.1% harder than expected. what does this mean to you about market traders who think we will get a rate cut by march?

>> doesn't make much difference. the fed has been clear in the last few days they are not about to make big changes. that is what i see, if you look at 4% and even services higher than that, remember we started 25 basis points. it is going the right direction. the question is how long this will last. inflation -- liz: i wish there were a claman rule but you have the taylor rule. you say the fed will make decisions based on inflation. it has come down from the high of 9 plus% but is the market too optimistic, hopeful or delusionary that they believe

there will be a cut in the first 1:45 thousand 24? >> the market has learned a lot about the fed. it was 25 basis points and they will come down is inflation comes down. remember they haven't changed their targets. 2% has been around a long time. i haven't seen changes, it seems to me that is where they have to go and it is a matter of time before they get there. liz: we saw something we need to point out that happened yesterday. it was the second time in 11 years that the nasdaq closed in the green when every single one of the magnificent 7 had been in the red. i want to push you into what are some names that are smaller

or mid-cap that you think are priced to perfection and people are ignoring but they shouldn't. >> price perfection, not sure anything out there. charles was talking, some people were talking the pay stocks, paypal and those have gotten beaten up so badly those are ones to look at for 2024 as a longer-term horizon, not as a trade. i want to take a deeper dive into what i talked about with palo alto, crowd strike, with that sector and there are probably other names, can't think of one i like as much as the two of those, that entire sector is where i would be but i like paypal because this could be a come back year

because those stocks have been beaten up so badly or rebounded but they haven't rebounded as much as others that have been beaten up. rich: liz: technology roaring ahead. as always we thank you. by the way, set the dvr or watch wall-to-wall coverage of fed day tomorrow live. charles payne will have a rate decision and market reaction on making money and big moment 2:30 p.m. jerome powell faces the press conference. reporters will be asking to pepper him with all kinds of questions and the second powell leaves the podium, instant analysis on "the claman countdown". professor emeritus jeremy siegel, how do ceos interpret the fed message.

lpl financial's quincy crosby with investor guidance. we are all over every move. make them right before the closing bell rings tomorrow on fox business. we have spoken to john taylor, the economist, we bring you the billionaire investor, david rubenstein standing by live. how sees the american economy and into the final weeks of the year and as billionaires line up behind her 24 candidates we will ask who he is thinking of supporting and why. we have salesforce taking the lead on the dow heat map right here. when you look at walgreen roots alliance, we are not halfway through december, has jumped 16% month to date. it was higher earlier, down fraction ollie at the moment. "the claman countdown" coming

right back. ♪ the biggest ideas inspire new ones. 30 years ago, state street created an etf that inspired the world to invest differently. it still does. what can you do with spy? ♪

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tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine or plan to or if ibd symptoms develop or worsen. i move so much better because of cosentyx. ask your rheumatologist about cosentyx. liz: with three weeks left to go into thousand 23 the markets are set to close out a tremendous year if you're able, snazzy gains for the nasdaq, up 40% this year. you heard me correctly. 40%. the s&p, the gains are 20. let's call it 21%. huge, huge move. let's bring in billionaire investor, cochairman david rubenstein to see where he thinks markets are headed in 2024. what strikes me about this year before we look forward to next

year is a huge number of smart market participants set of recession was right in front of us or around the corner. the stock market unwind would follow. what through them off the tracks? >> smart people are not always smart. this is the most predicted recession in american history that hasn't happened. i don't know if it will happen or not or if it will not happen but right now the economy seems to be doing pretty well but recession seems very much into the future. we have recessions every seven years so at some point there will be a recession, doesn't seem like one is imminent in the next couple quarters or so. liz: risk assets have been rallying. we came off of six weeks of gains for the major indexes. what do you suppose might be ahead? trees don't go to the sky. what will bring these back a

bit before they continue a march higher if they do? >> the market is doing well among other reasons, recognizing inflation has come down to where the fed wants it so the market is anticipating rate cuts next year. nobody knows when that will be. the fed is data-driven. no one is expecting one this year but sometime next year there will be rate cuts, and trying to project first quarter, second quarter, nobody knows for certain. my own suspicion it will not be in the first quarter. the second quarter is more likely. the fed wants to make sure it has inflation under control. if the fed wait until third or fourth quarter any rate cut will be seen as critical. into the presidential election season and rate cuts and third-quarter it will be seen as something to help the democrats and that criticism is

one the fed would like to avoid. liz: the silly season is coming where everybody is throwing out headlines to get attention. let's talk about the election coming up. obviously 2024 is going to be a huge year not the least of which will be big moves such as the election. last week we had billionaire can landgone on and he is thrown his weight behind nikki haley. so have the koch brothers. we have tim draper, the venture capitalist out of silicon valley likes nikki haley, he loves her, he's putting his money there, who are you supporting in the lead up if we may ask to to the 2024 election? >> i worked at the white house for president carter. since that time as inflation got high nobody asked for my support. i don't give my support to anybody. i don't want to jinx anybody. i don't give money to president of candidates. i've never given a dollar, i'm

not going to start now but i doubt anybody wants my support. liz: i didn't know that. what if whoever wins were to ask you to be treasury secretary, your knowledge having worked in a white house and your knowledge of economy and america and all that comes with the dollar et cetera, would you say yes to something like that? >> i'm not sure private equity investors or old white men are what the countries looking for in that position. i doubt confirmation will be that easy for someone in my position. i will say where i am. i'm too young to be treasury secretary. i'm going to be 74. today you need to be much older to get a serious position in government. liz: you are showing some real humor here. let's bring it back to the federal reserve meeting. this time tomorrow, jay powell goes to 17 after the hour. we are 20 one after the hour

before the press conference. what will you be most closely listening for? >> j powell worked there for a number of years. i have no particular insight to what he's going to say tomorrow but he is very data-driven, not very ideological. he was initially appointed as people may remember by president obama. he was appointed chairman of the fed by donald trump and reappointed by president biden. i think he is as non-ideological as you will get and because he's not an economist, he doesn't speak in fed speaker. he does a very good job explaining what the fed has done. the fed didn't explain what they were going to do and didn't explain what they did. jay powell does give you a hint what they are going to do and he explains it pretty carefully. i suspect tomorrow he will

probably say the fed is pleased with progress and the inflation rate but not the target of 2% so continue to watch the data. liz: how are you position yourself? we don't know what the fed will do. how are you positioning your investments taking into account that the past several months a lot of things have rallied, bond prices have rallied in the 10 year, it was 5%, we've got it at 4.21%, down 3 basis points, risk assets, gold, bond prices, real estate have done really well. anything catching your eye? >> the value of private equity stocks is not high enough. the most important thing i learned when i did my book on investing, the biggest mistake

investors make is markets russian and they are going down, when markets are going up as much as they are, things that are out-of-favor, has gone too high and will come down a bit. people shouldn't rush in right now because prices are pretty high right now. may be they will go up 5% or so. they won't go up 50%. liz: there is one asset that doesn't seem to come down. it seems to go up. that's pro sports teams. there is chatter you might be interested in buying the baltimore orioles. you grow up in their -- he went to high school there, could we ask about that? any chance would you be interested in something like that? >> i played in little league baseball. i thought i was going to be a major league her. i later realized jewish little

uyghurs make the major league, when i was 11 or 12, i peeked as a baseball player but since that time i have been focusing on private equity. liz: i don't know how old he was. he wasn't 11. it is wonderful to see you. thank you. really appreciate it. >> thank you for having me and have a good holiday season. liz: here's a question for you. is the ev revolution shorting out? we may have forgotten a bigger hint from ford edit involves the star of its ev constellation. two of the streaks most respected voices, dan ives and kyle bass join us on "the claman countdown". we are running hot right at the moment. here are some stocks that are running cold, laggards on the nasdaq.

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for an average production volume at its michigan plant of 600 trucks per week. and the production cuts are due to changing market romance. in lucid shares, the luxury ev maker, $4.22, the chief financial officer sherry house, and the company stock is being listed, and the stock has plummeted 10%. and it is 3 of. 4%, and received its agreement to acquire the cancer drugmaker, it includes a plan to create a new oncology division closes this thursday.

flipped to alphabet shares and google stock, it is down 1%, and a federal jury ruled against the company for its apps store fees. and over fees, google charges apps developers to put their gains on the google play store, and the antitrust lawsuit with search engine dominance. the majority shareholder of epic games 12:45%. apple had a similar suit against its apps store, it won that suit against epic games but what is cooking that will help it top $4 trillion in market. top tech analyst dan ives made the market prediction. easier to ask lane where the growth will come from and he's got breaking news. she's got a brand-new call on

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liz: let's fire up tech giant and apple. it's not the gain at the moment of half of 1% but where it's market is, back above the $3 trillion level. it was the first company in the world to reach that kind of record value and our next guest says guess what? and the next year is going to $4 trillion massive growth. in the meantime, dan ives joins us, the director of equity research, before we get to your case of apple, 4 trillion, going to get there by 2024, hot off the press, you have just arrived back from washington dc in the last two years putting out an incredibly. note on cybersecurity stocks is

why, and what is driving this? >> we are seeing a massive increase in spending that will come out of the bellwether. what is really happening is why these agencies, more roots to the cloud giving the threat level the need for cybersecurity. is could be up 30% spending, names like palo alto or crowd strike, this is a different moment. liz: palo alto networks is hitting a record high, all-time record. we have crowd strike hitting a two year high. some of these names are moving higher anyway but what is it that will drive the spending beyond the obvious concerns about hacks and problems here. talk about ai, these bad actors using ai and that brings it to another level.

>> these agencies couldn't spend now, the are going to open up the spigot because when you look at the threats and the amount of data on the cloud that could be exposed, that is why you look at palo alto, or crowd strike and many of these other, you will see a lot of consolidation, the strategic's and financial players, that is the tip of the iceberg. liz: why these particular names? >> when i look at palo alto, the topic for the last 2 or 3 years, they are just the second or third inning of this massive growth story. investors sit there on valuation, they are not out there seeing the threats and

you could on two hands count the players that are relevant. liz: your calling for a golden age of cybersecurity and you put out this note on that. i find it fascinating. like it to apple, you think it will hit another trillion by the end of 2024. it takes two years to hit 1 trillion but another two to hit three. >> is a renaissance, we seen a group of iphone units, it is a fictional netflix story the china growth story is the demise of apple that is the opposite. over the last week, demand is strong in china, is a strong holiday season. we seek services growth, double digits and this is one. liz: here's my question. you are doing channel checks

obviously but huawei has come in with a new phone and people are adopting those phones because they have new powers to the with chips made there and not here. >> in china especially the high end consumer, if you won and iphone 12 which the new while ways are, you have one hundred million iphones in china that have not upgraded in the last three or four years. liz: it is pushing people. >> within china, 20% of demand comes from china. they are number 2 or 3. liz: you mentioned tesla. you cover general motors which came out with this announcement

that they are having the all electric pickup trucks. general motors is forging ahead. gm is coming out with long-awaited equinox tv coming next year, what your call for gm? >> mary and the team despite the uaw debacle have been able to navigate. strength on ev conversion, if you look at the models, gm could be a rating stock compared with farley and ford, they have been half in the pool. you look at gm, you liquidate them across the board, ford, black eye moment we are seeing here. liz: let's ask about channel checks, elon and tesla have just unveiled over the last two weeks, she looked at the floor

show model they had and couldn't get within three feet of it. it's a long wait list but some people are backing up. >> demand and supply are 20-1, 2 million reservations, maybe 50%, that's an incremental matter where they produce just a few thousand over the next month or two. that is a year from now. liz: no, i can't see out the windshield. >> it takes getting used to but i think it is going to be another flex the muscles moment for musk and tesla despite the naysayers. liz: always has been. good to see you, thank you so much. dan ives. coming up, the president of

ukraine, volodymyr zelenskyy, on capitol hill, pushing for more funding with his war with vladimir putin and russia. one of wall street's top voices is here to tell us the wars in ukraine and israel as israel battles the terrorists could disrupt a soft landing for the us economy. kyle bass is here next, closing bell ringing in 15 minutes. we are coming right back. please stay with us. as an independent financial advisor, my promise to you is simple. as a fiduciary, i promise to put your interests first, always. i promise that our relationship will go well beyond just investment decisions. it's the intersection of your money and your life where we can make the biggest difference. [announcer] charles schwab is proud to support the independent financial advisors who are passionately dedicated to helping people achieve their financial goals. visit findyourindependentadvisor.com known for following your dreams.

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1-800-217-3217. that's 1-800-217-3217. ♪. liz: the hedge fund industry is suing wall street's top cop, the securities & exchange commission in an attempt to reverse two new rules aimed at making the practice of short selling more transparent but could it actually lead to a spike in short squeezes of certain stocks? joining us now, charlie gasparino. >> it is the managed funds association. it is interesting it is coming from hedge funds. i've been asking people what do you think? kind of zero chance they will win this. for all the stuff gary gensler does he is on very firm statutory ground on this. they monitor the markets. disclosure is the bedrock of securities laws. he can do this and they voted obviously to do it and this will

survive the courts easily. now the question is what is the up shot of all of this? and you know i'm not saying we'll return to the meme mania of, 200, january 1 of 2020, this sort of disclosure the way you can find out who is taking out loans, much more granular disclosure on who is exactly doing the short selling, like what fund. it is not just a broker-dealer itself. liz: yeah. >> this is going to lead to short squeezes more. again, you know, there is a special circumstance that went down in 2021, the fed printing massive amounts of money. everybody is sitting at home. what was your pastime then? liz: pandemic. they learned how to trade. they were self-taught. >> it was more than that, if you didn't work you were on your computer doing something. a lot of people were trading and gambling. the fed was printing money. markets generally go up when all

that happens. we don't have that dynamic now but what we could have if that dynamic ever comes back and these rules with stand this challenge and i think they will based on the lawyers i spoke to today, we're going to have short squeezes on steroids. liz: can you explain to our viewers who don't know what a short squeeze in a nutshell so we all understand. >> in a short sale, you buy shares. you sell them immediately. right? liz: squeeze, when does the squeeze come? >> you hope for the shares to come down. you replace the borrow with a lower stock price. however, if the stock price suppose up, you're screwed. liz: the person who is trying to short it? >> is screwed. here is how the squeeze happens. everybody gets on social media, this is what happened with gamestop, amc. liz: wall street bets. reddit. >> there is massive amounts of shorting on these five stocks. let's screw with, let's screw with the big guys a little bit.

that is what they did. they all got together, bought the stock, what they are basically took penny stocks. amc is 6-dollar stock, that is after reverse split. it is a 60-cent stock. back then it was a dollar 50 stock pre-split, reverse split. took it from 150 to 2, to 3, to eight. traded eventually at $734 a share. it put one big hedge fund out of business, melvin capital t crush ad lost others but you could sigh that hoop again. liz: when gensler wants to make things more trains parent causing more short squeezes people who short certain stocks have to announce that to the markets? >> it will be announced more grand youly. you have to announce it anyway. you will find it from the fund not just the broker-dealer. make sure i read this right, the person actually doing the borrowing you have to disclose

aspects who you borrowed with, all of that, you can identify this stuff really granularly. he is throwing a bone to the meme stock community. even though the meme stock community got crushed, crushed by their owner rational exuberance but, he is throwing a bone to elizabeth warren, who is essentially his boss, not really biden to be hornet with you. she hates wall street. anything to make wall street less profitable is good for elizabeth warren. anyway that is the story. liz: charlie, thank you. >> i know you're -- what? liz: kyle bass is next. what do you mean what? >> i like kyle. i think he is a nice guy. tell him i said hi. liz: say hi yourself. he is right here. president biden announcing a 200 million-dollar draw down on the department of defense to aid fighters in ukraine. in just a few minutes biden is expected to host a press conference with ukraine's volodymyr zelenskyy in the east room. as we await for that,

zelenskyy's visit comes as biden east request for additional 10-dollar u.s. aid package for ukraine, israel, other national security needs is in serious risk of rejectiongy congress. joining me heyman capital founder, cio, kyle bass. charlie says hello, kyle. >> heliliz, hi, charlie, good too see you both. >> president biden pushing lawmakers to approve the aid package for the year-end holidays, et cetera. there isn't a lot of taste or appetite for adding to the $32 trillion of the national debt. what do you think maps here? israel desperately need it. ukraine needs fiscal aid as well. >> i am a fiscal conservative. i believe in balanced budgets. i'm an austrian school of commerce at heart. the fight happening between russia and ukraine, the fight

happening between hamas and israel, these are all existential battles that we, as the lead western power must help fight. i think it is important to remember the amount of aid we've committed to ukraine is a little over 110 billion as far as we've added it up and for this year it is let's call it 60, 65 billion. that's against a federal spending number this year alone of 6 trillion. so we're talking about yes, 60 billion is a lot of money but in our six trillion of spending i'm pretty sure we can find a way to defend democracy for $60 billion. maybe i'm going to surprise you but we need to send all the money we can to zelenskyy. and remember, when we're spend sending that money, i'm putting money in quotes, it is important to remember that we make all of the advanced weapons that we're sending to ukraine. a lot of that money goes to u.s. defense industry and our technology industry. so we're spending it, we're

spending it with our companies and we're giving those weapons to the ukraines. so again this is money not ending up in a black hole somewhere where it can be paid to politicians or whoever is in the payment chain. it is important to remember that we're making these things. liz: this is interesting because as you say, you are a fiscal conservative. so the headline here is, you would say if you had republicans in congress who were disinclined to add more money into the spending that has already been done for ukraine, president biden has said, today, we should not be giving putin a christmas present by not helping the ukrainians, i would say that is rather significant. let's sort of bring that into the larger picture of how you see the debt of this nation really playing out as it pertains to the stock market or in peoples investments? >> yeah.

you know when was the last time you heard the words tea party? the republicans -- liz: a lot. >> as much as democrats are in for these fiscal imbalances. remember that you know, economists like to talk about the deficit as a percentage of gdp and for those of us who follow economics very closely, anything over you know, 3.7, 4 percent of gdp would be deemed to be reckless. if you don't, if you don't take one-timepieces out of this, we're talking about 7 1/2, 8% of gdp, more importantly though we are bringing in four trillion of tax revenue and we're spending six trillion. we're spend two trillion more than we're bringing in one year's time as full employment. in the history of our country we have never run a deficit like that at full employment. so what i'm telling you is the politicians have given up on any kind of fiscal restraint, i mean all of them. you can't point at either party here. liz: i know.

>> the republicans have thrown their lot in with the democrats here. the inmates are running the asylum. congress is supposed to be the watchdog looking over presidential expenditures right? that's why we have the various levels of government. liz: sure. >> unfortunately you've got the fed that has enabled with a balance sheet expansion has enabled the treasury and congress to spend as much as they want, the president. unfortunately we're in a bad situation now. the good news we are the tallest midget. there is no real other place around the world that reserve managers can put their assets. [closing bell rings] we're going around the world very quickly but i can tell you that the good news is -- liz: kyle, we're up against the bell. listen you make too much sense, kyle. great to have you. big fed decision tomorrow. we will see you then. ♪. larry: hello, folks, welcome to "kudlow," i'm larry kudlow.