doesn't mean the rest of the market can't do better. taylor: 20 seconds, what's the big biggest risk in 2025? >> okay, the biggest risk is probably -- it has to be with the -- not the economy, but global -- so much stuff and so many hot spots right now in the market. taylor: yeah. >> maybe supply chain interruption from something we can't count on right now. but the market looks fine. and even with those risks -- taylor: yep. well, we got that go. jordan kimmel, we love having you. thank you so much. and it looks like we are squeaking out some gains for the week. well done. again, thank you so much for watching "claman countdown," and "kudlow" is up next. ♪ if. ♪ ♪ david: hello, everyone, and welcome to to a spial edition of "kudlow." i'm david asman in for larry

kudlow. sanctuary states and counties and cities facing funding cuts under the incoming trump administration for refusing to cooperate with i.c.e. and now more than ever we need this immigration crackdown as illegal migrant crime is on the rise all over the united states. fox news' william that la jeunesse is live -- la jeunesse is live from l.a. with the latest there. william. >> reporter: hey, david. yeah, the showdown is definitely on its way, if you will. a lot of people don't live in sanctuary states or counties, and yet they are paying for states like new york and california to incarcerate illegal immigrants and criminal aliens and then let them go. so the program is called scaap. basically, it's federal taxpayer money given to states and counties to cover the cost of incarcerating illegal immigrants convicted of crimes. but when it comes to deporting those same aliens, these jurisdictions refuse to cooperate. the feds hand out more than $230

million a year to sanctuary states like california, new york, new jersey, not the to mention the dozen or so counties within those jurisdictions getting more than a million each. >> it's hypocritical for them to, with one hand, hold out their hand for federal funding to help pay for the costs of criminal aliens and with the other hand block i.c.e. at the jailhouse door to take away those aliens that are costing them money. >> reporter: and that's why the incoming administration may look to cancel or withhold scaap money and other doj grants from jurisdictions that that don't cooperate with i.c.e. or to interfere or obstruct the deportation of criminal aliens. now, despite that threat san diego county recently passed a measure reaffirming their intent to refuse i.c.e. access to their jails and protect undocumented criminals. >> our -- are not responsible

for, nor should they be held accountable for participating in what is essentially a federal job which is deporting members of the community. >> reporter: so immigration is a federal responsibility, and yet these sanctuary cities want to decide who stays and goes. for instance, misdemeanor versus felony, someone who's married the a u.s. citizen or not, those who are here already illegally, many would argue, should leave regardless of those other factors. david,s it is something we see coming down the line several weeks from now, whether or not the administration, you know, clamps down. david: well, i guarantee they will. the question is what the reaction will be to that. william, thank you very much. joining me now is delaware roy deroy murdock, fox news contributor and julian epstein. great to see you, gentlemen. thank you for being here. the president is going to need a lot of the political capital that, i think, he has. by the way, that political

capital has grown since the election. he got just about 50%, maybe even a little bit under the total because there were a lot of independents in there running too. but right now gallup poll came out with a poll showing he has 51% support. that's way above what he had when he started in 2017. that was 44%. now i it's at 5 1%. can he use that political capital that he has right off the bat to get these things done, to give it to those sanctuary cities who are being so hypocritical? >> yeah, i think he can and he should. even president trump's critics, i think, have been rather dazzled at how he's appointed his entire cabinet, the head of multiple agencies and so on in just a matter of a couple of weeks. whether or not you hike it, he's certainly moving quickly and not just kicking back and relaxing until he becomes president. particularly compared to the previous -- the current administration where president

biden's, i think, off in the caribbean at the moment i think that really has bolstered his strength the even since the election, and he ought to use that political capital going after, particularly, criminal illegal alien criminals such as this monster who set the woman on fire in the subway system. david: unbelievable. if that doesn't do it, i don't know what will. julian, we've seen some amazing transformations. some people like yourself, i think, have said we haven't transformedded, we've remained clear to the original ideals of the democratic party. it's the party itself that has changed. but we see john fetterman and a couple of other people, jouster, complaining about -- yourself, complaining about the wokeness in the democratic party right now. do you think that's going to spread? is it just beginning, the germ is just beginning to spreading among democrats who realize that the american people have moved on even if they haven't? >> well, that's the central question that faces the democrats, david. the question is whether the democratic leadership can part

ways with the groups on the left who have enforced the or the to docks she of -- orthodoxy of the impression if olympics which is sort of a bankrupt religion that has governed the democratic party and has made it very unpopular on social issues and economic issues. and the question is whether the democrats can move away from that far-left drift of the last four years and move back towards the center. and, you know, i haven't seen any evidence yet that the democratic leadership has the guts to stand up i to the groups, but that's the central question. one of the reasons trump is so popular right now, and you talk about the gallup polls, this realignment's been going on for two years. and one of the reasons is you can point to under the first trump administration real wages grew under 7%. under biden, they declined by about that much. the economic results stay soft, there's optimism now they can build. if the democrats are smart p they will stop the resistance and the demonization of the other side, and they will try to compete with republicans on building on issues that matter

to the working class, automation, manufacturing, china's about to get 45% of the global manufacturing capacity. david: right. crypto. crypto's another one that trump has jumped in on. >> 100%. david: well, deroy, and yet you still have these people in the media that are singing the same old tune liking nothing ever happened between november 1st and now. the hill just came out with an article, it was an editorial. it wasn't written by the staff, but it was written by two geniuses from yale and chum can ya law school -- columbia law school suggesting that dems try to block donald trump from becoming president based on the suggestion, by the way, that even jack smith didn't make, that trump an insurrectionist. they still haven't learned from the haw i pare if debacle. i -- lawfare if debacle. i think that helped donald trump become president, don't you? >> absolutely. helped him get in. i think people totally he was being treated were un-- very

unfairly, and that very much helped him get reelected. as far as this effort by the part of some democrats including congressman jamie raskin of maryland that somehow they're going to step in and prevent trump from being seated spin august rated january 20th, i thought win told throughout this last campaign democracy matters, president trump is a threat to democracy, election denial is the next, yo, you know, worst crime even beyond treason, and here are these people saying they could use the 14th amendment to to block trump getting sworn in under the concept of insurrection. he actually was, as you recall, impeached on that matter -- david: yeah. that's why jack smith didn't charge him with that. it's as simple -- julian, these are finish. >> exactly, and -- [inaudible] [inaudible conversations] if he's not guilty of this. david: i would use the phrase if this wasn't a family-friendly show, but they are smart-a lawyers. they think they're the smartest in the class. they were head of the law review at yale, i think one of them, the other was at -- i mean, this

is supposedly the future of the legal department of the democratic party. i don't see them turning around. however, there was -- i have to mention something that happened on cnn, and i'm going to roll the tape on this. a cnn analyst are talking about how joe biden's presidency will be remembered. roll that. >> it's a couple weeks before the election i had a conversation with a senior person in the white house, and i said if harris loses, most of the way that bind's going to be remembered at least in the short term is the guy who was just in between the trump terms. david: the guy just in between the trump two terms. do you think that's how bind's going to be remembered -- biden's going to be to remembered? >> i think right now most americans think of bind as a failed presidency, letting the country go way too far left with what i, again, call the victimology of the impression if olympics. to go back to this question on the 14th amendment, i'll give you a phrase that is family-friendly which is george orwell. george orwell said that some ideas are so stupid that only

intellectuals could believe them. david: right. >> and this is exactly an example that the two professors you cited, it's exactly an example of that. i mean, it is one very dubious from a legal point of view. i caught it would survive any serious scrutiny in the courts, but politically it's exactly what the democrats have been doing since 2015. and that strategy the of opposing and demonizing trumps has failed. and democrats immediate to realize it's failed. it's a dead end street. if they want to compete with the republicans, if they want to claw their way back to relevancy, they need to show that they can build. you look at the infrastructure program, for example, the broadband initiatives never even got out of the box. charging stations, they built eight of them. the public confidence in the democrats' ability the actually build something meaningful that relates in any serious way to the middle class to go back to the political center on cultural issues on things like immigration, voters don't have confidence in the democratic party to be able to do that. if the democrats are smart, that's what they would focus on.

david: yeah, but again, i just don't see the smarts coming, particularly from governors, deroy. we just had our own governor here in new york, governor hochul just came out with a new i program in which she's going to charge oil and gas companies $75 million in so-called reparations for climate change. if reparations for climate -- by the way, who's going to pay that $75 billion? do you think it's going to come out of the pockets of the executives at the oil companies? no, no, no, no, no. taxpayers and consumers are going to pay for that $75 billion. and americans get it. they understand that now, right? >> well, you know, if it even gets that far. this sounds like a recipe for instant litigation that's going to go right to court, and the main question will be if you're the head of exxonmobil, all right, how can you blame us for hurricanes or flood damage or whatever? how much of it was the fault, if any, of the oil companies, how much of it was mother nature, how much of it was regular weather parents.

it's not like somebody sets a build building on fire, oh, there's going the arson it, cuff him and throw him in jail. it's going to be hard to determine what percentage, if any, the oil companies are to blame if they are, and that's got to be litigated, and you'll have expert witnesses on both sides, yes, they're guilty, no, they're not guilty, and this is going to go nowhere. kathy hochul should spend her time cleaning up the trash and killing the rats. maybe she should focus on that -- david: yeah. crime is the number one example starting with migrant crime and what happened last sunday in the subway. we're going to be talking more about that coming up later. of gentlemen, we've got to leave it at that. julian epstein and deroy murdoch great to see you. coming up, paul cueing nan suggests -- krugman suggests americans are just too dumb to see biden's strong economy. we're going to be talking about it more when "kudlow" continues. ♪ ♪

with a commercial auto quote online so you can get back to your monster to-do list. super helpful. see if you can save money at progressivecommercial.com. thank you. ♪ oh in a factory, there was a glove ♪ ♪ a tougher kind of glove, ♪ ♪ like you never did see... ♪ ♪ now the cloth is strong ♪ ♪ stronger than the flames ♪ ♪ the flame is in the heart ♪ ♪ and the heart is in the work ♪ ♪ the work builds the life ♪ ♪ where we're safe at home... ♪ jpmorganchase invests in manufacturing to help create stronger communities. ♪ make the green grass grow all around all around ♪ ♪ make the green grass grow all around ♪ ♪

it's our son, he is always up in our business. it's the verizon 5g home internet i got us. oh... he used to be a competitive gamer but with the higher lag, he can't keep up with his squad. so now we're his “squad”. what are kevin's plans for the fall? he's going to college. out of state, yeah. -yeah in the fall. change of plans, i've decided to stay local. oh excellent! oh that's great! why would i ever leave this? -aw! we will do anything to get him gaming again. you and kevin need to fix this internet situation. heard my name! i swear to god, kevin! -we told you to wait in the car. everyone in my old squad has xfinity. less lag, better gaming! i'm gonna need to charge you for three people. david: retiring new york times columnist paul krugman -- yes, the same man who predicted markets would never recover after donald trump's 2016 victory -- now says president biden will be well remembered for economic policies that americans just voted against. listen.

>> here's a deeply unif popular -- unpopular opinion that, i think, will become orthodoxy a few decades from now which is that biden and his team actually managed the economy extremely well. david: for a possibly more enlightened view, we turn to steve moore, host of moore money on wabc radio and co-author of "the trump economic miracle," and judy shelltop, senior fellow at the independent institute and author of "good as gold." great to see you both. judy, the problem -- the real problem with all of this is that the orthodoxy from which paul krugman comes probably agrees with him; that is, the status quo of the economic community basically go along with what he said. or am i being too pessimistic? >> well, but it's delusional. and that doesn't mean he doesn't have adherence, but he has been wrong so, is often, really

through decades. i've been opposed to paul krugman's government knows best approach since the '90s. he wrote a book in 1994 called "peddlings prosperity" which was to to the take a dig at supply-side economics -- david: right. >> which had just delivered fantastic results under president reagan. and i was asked by "the wall street journal" to review that book, which i did with gusto, taking issue with just about every point he made. but what was especially sweet is they allowed me to suggest the title for my review of "peddling prosperity," and i suggested peddling pom passty, because that really encapsulated that whole attitude he brings to the his economic viewpoint. david: well, you see, you never let facts get in the way of the narrative. that's the krugman way of looking at this things. fortunately, the american people weighed the facts in the last election. but, steve, it's the same

shortsighted people who claim that the 2017 tax cuts put in place cost $2 trillion and are now saying it's going to cost $5 trillion just to reup it, to to extend it further. the former labor secretary wrote an x post, i think this was today. he said trump's first round of tax cuts for the rich added $2 trillion to the debt, extending them would add another $5 trillion if we can't afford universal health care or paid family leave or basic social safety nets. again, to judy's point, they totally ignore the fact that we gained $1.5 trillion since 2017 in revenue, and that's a 48% increase in revenue. he's got it exactly wrong. >> yeah, they always do. and, by the way, he said 25 years ago that the internet was

a passing fad, it's going to go away. [laughter] he's made all sorts of crazy predictions. here's why this is important though, our side wins the intellectual arguments thanks to smart people like judy shelton, larry kudlow, art laffer and you. but there's an old saying that the left writes the history books, and they do. and they've written this fairy tale over and over and over again, and this is the start of the fairy tale. oh, joe biden was a great president. he took over a mess from donald trump which wasn't true, the economy was in full recovery when joe biden came in, and they won't talk about the average income of the average american income when biden was president whereas they rose about $6,000 for the average family when trump was prime minister that's why this is -- president. they control the narrative, and it's always been this false -- david: good point. so, and the big question, i'm going to stick with you on this, steve, because i know you've been working the town, but why do some republicans inside the beltway believe this stuff?

i mean, just, it's just extraordinary that some republicans have actually bought into the cost of tax cuts. >> yeah. you're right about that, and there are some problem makers in the republican party. by the way, related to this point, david, there was an excellent piece by peggy noonan in her weekend story about ronald reagan's last press conference before he left the presidency. i took the time to watch that press conference, and reagan said so concisely that, look, we cut taxes in the 1980s, and tax revenues went up. david: yeah. >> highway had -- he had to explain that over and over to a media that just couldn't get the message. and i thought, here we are 40 years later, and hay still don't get it. david: it's not just the party in power that's blind to the facts, judy. the fed seems to be more and more so as well. we put a chart, i wanted to redux the chart, put it up again, of what the fed has been

doing in lowering rates compared to what the market has been doing in raising rates. in other words, the market, the real traders in debt, particularly the 10-year yield, the 10-year treasury bonds, they have been going up exactly at the same time the fed has been going down. that's why our dollar's not as good as gold, to quote a famous book of yours. [laughter] >> well, i think the market is giving a different message because your getting -- you're getting such mixed messages from the federal reserve. at the last meeting, they cut rates. but at the same time it was a very hawkish message. so i think that what might be happening is this practice the fed has of paying commercial banks not to make loans. they pay 4.4% on cash reserve balances. that's a pretty good return for doing nothing. and i think that has very much

distorted that yield curve. so when you get a hawkish message if and if you're now hearing there will just be two more cuts versus four more cuts next year now that president trump is in office, the fed is suddenly worried, i think that banks probably thought why not just let this keep rolling. we'll just collect that money for doing nothing. and so it reduces their demand for the longer term treasury securities. at the same time, the fed is actually allowing some rolling off of their longer treasury security portfolio. so you're seeing decreased demand for those longer term instruments. so it's kind of a mechanic ifal a effect. -- mechanical effect. but the lower demand does increase the yield for the long term. a. david: the bottom line again, it comes back to what our representatives are doing in spending our money. bottom line are, it comes back to spending our money, and even if they don't have enough money, they'll still spend it, steven. and that leads us to the doge brothers.

and what the doge brothers might be doing and how much they can actually do. of course, you know, cutting waste is one thing, you know? the low hanging fruit on the tree, the waves and fraud that you find here -- waste and fraud that you find here and there. it does add up, and there are millions of examples of it. we're going to be talking totora moment. vivek said if you can't reform aning agency, an entire agency, there's only to one right answer left. and he doesn't even have to tell us what that is, it's get rid of it, right? particularly when it's a department like the department of education which has had exactly the opposite effect. the more money we spend on the department of education and the more they dole out, the worse the test scores of our children get. so it has exactly the opposite effect. we'd be better off without it, wouldn't we? >> well, look, that's why having businessmen like elon musk run this thing is so critical,

because, you know, in the private sector if something doesn't work, you get rid of it. david: that's right. or you subsidize it even more, that's the problem. >> exactly! yeah. milton the friedman used to talk about that. if the program is working, we have to to give them more money because it's working. the answer is always more money. look, i think this doge committee is going to change the culture, hopefully, of how we spend money and how we assess this $7 trillion ungodly budget we have right now. david: yeah. good stuff, guys. thank you so much. steve moore, judy shelton, appreciate it. coming up i, another last minute spending spree from the biden administration. just this week the irs sent out $2.4 billion in covid stimulus checks. but why? when covid actually ended nearly two to years ago? we'll ask about it all with north dakota senator kevin cramer. he joins us next. stick with "kudlow." ♪19, ♪ if

lion in our american factories. today, we're nearly 30,000 u.s. employees strong. in more than 60 u.s. based facilities, across 16 states, we couldn't be more proud to play our part in supporting americans who work the land and build a better tomorrow. ♪ nothing runs like a deere™. (vo) weight loss. for so long, i felt stuck. but zepbound means change. zepbound is for adults with obesity, to help lose weight and keep it off. activating 2 naturally occurring hormone receptors in my body, it works differently. it's changing what i believe is possible

when it comes to weight loss. it's changing how much weight i lose. up to 48 pounds. and changing what happens. don't take if allergic to it, or if you or someone in your family had medullary thyroid cancer or multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2. tell your doctor if you get a lump or swelling in your neck. stop zepbound and call your doctor if you have severe stomach pain or a serious allergic reaction. severe side effects may include inflamed pancreas or gallbladder problems. tell your doctor if you are experiencing vision changes, taking a sulfonylurea or insulin, having suicidal thoughts, if you're nursing, pregnant, plan to be, or taking birth control pills. side effects include nausea, diarrhea, and vomiting, which can cause dehydration and worsen kidney problems. zepbound means change. and when it comes to weight loss... change is good. discover the weight loss you could be bound for. talk to your doctor about zepbound.

it's a lot to be a caregiver and a daughter. because you kind of have to take a step back. getting some help would be a great relief. from companions to helpers to caregivers. find all the senior care you need at care.com

david: so as if we needed another example of biden's last minute spending spree, here's another one. the widen irs -- biden ir are s has sent out $2.4 billion in to covid emergency stimulus checks this week, about two years after the covid emergency ended. really? joining me now is north dakota senator kevin kramer. senator, yeah, you're shaking your head, that's all you can do about this stuff. fortunately are, it's not all we can do come january 20th. but air got to say, add -- i've got to say, adding insult to to injury, we get this from the retiring i reasonable cares s -- irs commissioner, he said to get this money to eligible taxpayers, we're making these payments automatic, meaning these people will not be required to to go through i the extensive process of filing an amended return to receive it. bo loom -- so bottom line is they're just throwing money out the window. >> yeah.

i guess they didn't get the whole inflation is a bad thing -- david: right. >> -- memo, david. and we're responsible for it. they seem to have missed that one as well. it's really quite ludicrous to think that one million people who didn't ask for the money, didn't apply if for it when it was, you know, suppose pdly available in 20 2021 tax returns, now somehow they're just going to force it on them. and who knows for sure if it's even true. who -- by true, i mean, who knows if they're the even eligible or if they're really supposed to be getting it, or if this is just some last minute stunt to drive up inflation as donald trump comes into the white house. i don't know, but it's one of the crazier things. this is what 87,000 new irs employees, that the first fuel on the fire of inflation in the american rescue plan created. so they could go after more taxpayers. i mean, it's why we're where we are, and it's why donald trump's

going to be president soon. david: and by the way, those ten it's of thousands, you know they're not just going to be going over a small number of millionaires and billionaires. they're going for the middle class, they're going for the small businesses, the pass-through businesses. they're the ones that are going to to get hit the hardest. even if they're completely innocent, they'll have to take months off of their business schedule the fill all these forms, and concerning covid, i don't want to leave covid completely because does anybody even know how much money is left in some of those covid funds? >> well, and i think that's part of what's at stake, david. i don't know how much there is. i don't think anybody knows exactly how much there is. but a lot of what is left is what heir trying to get rid of quickly so that it doesn't become, oh, say a pay-for for some tax cuts or a pay-for for some regulatory, you know, cuts in various agencies. there are just all kinds of ways, better ways to utilize any leftover covid money than just to simply give it a back -- give it to people and drive up inflation. so, no, i don't know, but with i

would hope that's one of the things that the doge committee gets after and that congress itself gets after. david: then we have this horribly named inflation reduction act which was, essentially -- >> yes. david: biden admitted it was essentially a green energy act. that's what it amounted to, billions and billions, just peppered with all of these sub saysties. i shouldn't say just billions, tens, even hundreds of billions of dollars in these various subsidies. i think even as much as they love to spend money before they leave, even the biden administration if can't spend all that money. should we claw all that money back? >> i believe that we should claw a lot of it back. and what we ought to do is repurpose some of those dollars -- david: yes. >> some of it's not necessary at all. some of it might be better utilized somewhere else. david: like building a wall! like building more of a border wall. >> there you have it. let's do that. and, by the way, that would cost much less than putting up a whole bunch of electric vehicle charging stations where nobody

drives electric vehicles or turning our entire energy grid over to china's supply chain or whatever the case mine. there's a whole lot -- might be. there's a whole lot we could be doing, and i can't wait to get started on it. david: now, we mentioned the doge recommendations that are coming up. we're already seeing some of them drip out, but how is that going to be picked up by congress? how will that be put into action? >> yeah, it's a great question because doge doesn't have authority, the but what they do have is influence. david: yes. >> like you said, they're already dripping some things out. these are big things. i actually think it adds value to the work of the appropriators and the budgeters and the congress by from if sliding both political cover and, by the way, some political exposure a lot of the waves. i love one of the first ideas i read about was the simplification of the tax code. and therein lies one of our first opportunities with the new congress through budget reconciliation. the simplification of the tax code could be the greatest gift to the economy and to the every

taxpayer in this country and certainly to business. david: by the way, that's steve forbes' idea, get rid of all deductions for everybody, just have a simple flat tax. do you think congress is ready for something that the revolutionary? >> well, i don't think that they are. i love the idea of a flat tax, but a flatter tax would even be better because right now we have these seven brackets. i think when the house passed the tax cuts and jobs act in 2017, we were down to tree brackets -- three brackets. the senate brought it back up to seven brackets. and there are ramifications to the transition on all of those things, david can, but there's no question simpler is better. it costs a lot less. it unleashes economic opportunity. the tax code itself is one of the worst regulations on every taxpayer in the country unless, of course, you're a cpa or a tax lawyer. it's pretty good for your economy -- david: but you can't wait on these things, senator cramer, don't you think? you have to -- tax extensions have to be at the front of the line or at least side by side,

some of the border policies that we need, no? >> it's an interesting it's an interesting point. what i worry a little bit about, david, is our -- particularly given what we've been through the last few weeks just trying to get the government funded for a few more months, you see how complex this big machine is. and when you start dealing with something as big as the tax code, it's going to take a little while. we know that. but at the same time, the border crisis is an immediate crisis. the tax cuts and jobs act don't expire until the end of the yea- david: that's not far off, senator. also americans voted for something. s it is a complex deal, i understand putting together a tax plan is a very complex deal. but you have a president who wants it, and you have a president who now has more power than he did after he won the election. 51% approval rating according to gallup, we heard today. >> for sure, yep. david: more americans want him to do changes now because they want money in their pocket. you can't wait that long on these tax extensions.

>> sure. well, the money in their pocket won't change until next year anyway -- david: they a make plans for it. >> congress operates -- you're right. and there's no question it creates momentum. and that's true. we ought to be working on it as we are right now through the end of the year if that's what it takes. but congress generally operates best on deadlines, not starting points. so if we start on january 4th or july 4th or august 4th, it seems like we always end up at the end of september. having said all of that, there are a lot of things to do whether we do them all at once or tranches. i'm for all of it. we need to go big with. but remember, if we get to simplify -- if we put steve moore in charge of the tax cuts and jobs act extensions and he dame up with a flat tax -- came up with a flat tax, that shouldn't be long. david: there's only one person in charge, and that's donald trump. he can kick the entire congress, both the house and the senate, in the rear end and get them moving. nobody's been in power until he

comes in in january -- i mean, nobody's in power right now. >> right. david: we need somebody -- >> not in the white house. david: senator, great to see you. hope you had a great christmas, and happy new year to you. >> happy new year to you and happy hanukkah to our jewish friends. david: thank you very much. switching gears now, the suspect accused of fatally setting a woman on fire in a new york city subway was indicted odd in brook run. fox news' nate foy live with all the details. nate. >> reporter: hey, david. so, yeah are, a brooj lin grand jury indicted sebastian certificate peat da, the illegal migrant from guatemala, on charges of first-degree murder, second-degree murder and second-degree arson. he faces the possibility of life in prison without parole if convicted on the top charge. there's been talk about this possibly becoming a federal case, but outside the courthouse today the d.a. here in brooklyn, eric gonzalez, said he wants it to remain a state case. >> myoffice is very confident

about the evidence in this case, in our ability to hold certificate pet -- certificate pet tata accountable for his dastardly deeds. we believe very strongly that this case belongs in state court because the charges here are more significant in state court than currently in federal court. >> reporter: but mayor eric adams is advocating for a federal arson charge. he directed the nypd to work with i.c.e.'s homeland security investigations team, and that could allow prosecutors to circumvent new york city's sanctuary laws that protect illegal migrants. and according to a new statement. from i.c.e., david, that policy is on full display in this case. i.c.e. confirms that the it launched a new immigration detainer for him but, quote, the corrections department has indicated they will not honor the detainer per their current policy. zepeda waived his right to

appear in court today. he is expected at his arraignment on january 7th when his indictment will be unsealed. here we are five days after this horrific crime, and we heard from the d.a. today that still she has not been identified. the nypd and medical examiner have both made progress in that process, but so far still she remains anonymous, david. david: unbelievable. nate, thank you very much for that. for more, joining me now is former nypd opportunitier, attorney -- inspector, attorney and fox news contributor paul mauro. paul, great to see you. i can't believe it, even -- i was going to ask you if, finally, at least the horrific case that nate just described for us will end the sanctuary city stuff, but it's already in this case. >> yeah. david: the detainer that i.c.e. wants on this guy, they're not honoring that detainer because it's a -- i can't believe that sanctuary city is preventing this guy from being prosecuted as he should be. >> yeah, of course. and, you know, it's not really that significant in this particular case -- >> not.

but just the fact that it enters it into at all. >> they a just won't give in on any front here because they're afraid -- they, being the progressives that run new york city -- they're very afraid of the idea that tom homan and i.c.e. are going to start to come in, grant illegal immigrants who are guilty of things that are not quite at the level of this and deport them. david: although some are. you have child rapists in boston who the police wouldn't help i.c.e. capture. >> of course. once you start to get a few of them, you start to flip people, you can see they're members of organized crime gangs, etc., etc. that's how you begin to recognize the contours of the groups that we're up against, and if it's just one-offs, this is how you send a message that, hey, if you mess around here, at the very least you're going to go back home, or at the worst, life in prison -- a. david: but mayor adams sat down and talked with tom homan already, and he's said he will try to find ways around

sanctuary cities. doesn't he have the power to do that? >> he doesn't in new york city, at least not on his own, not unilaterally. in new york city there are two statutes, one being -- the louder one being more all-encompassing than the first one passed under the de blasio administration which that lunatic city council was fully onboard with, they're the ones that have given us all this criminal justice reform we have right now. that's what adams is up against relative to -- david: well, there are, i don't want to get too depressed because we've got to be happy about the good things that have happened in the past several months, and one of the good things is a lot of these d.a.s have been kicked out. gascon in l.a., in chicago you had that horrific kim fox, the d.a. in chicago, replaced by a woman who's actually changed the prerequisites of what can be a felony conviction in shoplifting as they've done in l.a. we'll talk about l.a. in a

minute. but they have increased felony shoplifting charges, i don't know what period this is, i think it's over a couple of months, by 154%. it just shows how much shoplifting, really serious shoplift aring was going on. they say, oh, it's a couple of kids. no, this is organized crime. these are mobs whether it's the new mobs from overseas, from venezuela or what, getting together 10 or 20 kids, shoplift are, then they bring it to the mop leaders and they fence the stuff -- mob leaders and, again, pay the kids pennies on the dollar, right? >> yeah. and people tell themselves, oh, this is a victimless crime. they say things like, oh, hunger is not a crime. they're -- a profit motive is embedded in this, and that's why you see high-end stores that have these mobs that run in, go and grab everything they can.. -- everything they can. same thing goes in the drugstores and big chains, supermarkets. stealing this stuff to sell it,

and that is not victimless crime. those costs are passed on to you and me, don't kid yourself. david: and i just want to get the comments, remember, l.a. was run -- the d.a.'s office was run by gascon, a far-left, soros-inspired prosecutor. here's what his replacement said recently about what needs to be done. roll that tape. >> i think more generally for what we see in l.a., we've eliminated the ability for a d.a. who came from a far-left, extreme ideology to enact extreme, to-criminal policies. on my -- pro-criminal policy. on my first day, we rescinded the nine special directives that established blanket policies that said certain crimes and criminals would not be prosecuted notwithstanding the facts of the law. david: paul, if it can happen in l.a., can it happen in new york, can it happen in chicago? >> just remember that alvin bragg's day one memo said exactly the opposite of that, and likely if alvin bragg ran in

new york city now in the same role he's in now, he's -- david: even if we have more of these subway horrors. >> i'd like to think something would change, but i've gotten a little bit hopeless about it. i don't know what it's going to take. they seem to continue to gas gaslight the situation and say the subways are not so bad even though we just set a record for subway homicides we haven't seen in decades. david: americans have got to wake up. paul, thank you very much. coming up, more and more companies are starting to ditch woke dei policies. we're going to be talking about that with dr. ben carson when "kudlow" continues. ♪ ♪ ready. the markets, like life, will turn and challenge us. but when emotions run high, we stay grounded. with the hcm buyline, we work to empower investors, in navigating market volatility and complex conditions. we provide a diverse portfolio with proprietary mutual funds and etfs aimed at growth and preservation.

so you can invest with confidence. visit howard c.m. funds dot com. (singing) i'll be home for christmas. you can plan on me. please have snow and mistletoe. and presents on the tree. right now all over the country kids at shriners hospitals for children™ are able to go home and be with their families for the holidays. and that's only possible because of the monthly donations from people like you. thanks to a generous donor every dollar you give will go three times as far to help more kids. with your gift of just $19 a month,

only $0.63 a day. we'll send you this adorable love to the rescue® blanket as a thank you. and a reminder of the care you'll be providing so kids can be with their families. (singing) christmas eve will find me. where the love light gleams. it only takes a moment to call the number on your screen. or you can visit loveshriners.org. your gift of $19 a month will have three times the impact in the lives of kids like me. because every child just wants to be home for the holidays, and your gift makes that possible. your call is the best gift of all. your gift will be my favorite christmas present this year. please call the number on your screen or go to loveshriners.org to give whatever you can. and when you become a monthly donor your first gift will be tripled!

thank you for giving!

>> and i'll end all of the marx ifest diversity, we can -- equity and inclusion policies -- [cheers and applause] and at the same time, we will ban these unlawful policies from the -- we're gonna ban 'em from the private sector as well. in america we believe in the merit system. [applause] the merit system. david: yes, yes, yes. this country, this economy, how many times do we have to say it? it was built on the basis of getting ahead because of your merits and the quality of your work, something that the our next guest has been reminding us of for many years now. joining me is dr. ben carson,

former hud secretary and a world famous brain surgeon, which is the most complicated work you could possibly do. were those words for your soul, dr. ben -- dr. carson? >> david, i was delighted to hear that because, you know, our country accelerate ared -- accelerated from nothingness to the pinnacle of the world not by luck, but because we believe in merit. and we had all kinds of people who were very smart who came from various backgrounds who contributed to making america great. but i will also be quick to point out that in the past this have been problems, there have been major problems with diversity and fairness. but we were already in the process of correcting that without dei. you know? i remember as a kid going to the deep south and seeing whites only and coloreds only signs and

people saying be careful when you see those signs. in the same lifetime, we have black generals and admirals and ceos of fortune 500 companies and heads of foundation and university presidents. we've had a president of the united states. we've made enormous progress on our own. and the old adage a two wrongs don't make a right still applies. so we start discriminating against another group because a group was discriminated against before, that makes no sense. that. david: yeah. >> what we need to do is learn from our mistakes and make progress. teafd dvd well, it makes sense, i would just say, for those people in the dei industry. [laughter] there has been this whole industry created, and you know it very well. it's, it's -- you see it in the government, you see it in the school system. a lot of spending in our education system is not spent on teaching kids the three rs, but teaching them about guesserty with these -- diversity with these special diversity trainers and so forth.

you're seeing this diversity industry, they're not going to let go easily, are they? >> they're not going to. but i'm delighted to see, you know, walmart and ford -- david: yes. >> -- and, you know, a loot of other -- a lot of other companies starting to back off of this. some of the universities are starting to as they're seeing the results. we really have to recognize that a lot of people made a lot of sacrifices to get us to a point where we looked at the character of a person as opposed to the external characteristics of which they have no control. and that's the road we need to continue down. david: yeah. well, and it bears repeating drd be based on the quality of your work, the quality of your character rather than the color of your skin. those old sayings still apply. doctor, it's great to see you again. i'm so happy to see you here doing well, and i hope, i hope we eventually find you in some place in this new administration.

your work would be well appreciated. >> i'm helping from behind the scenes. david: thank you very much, doctor. be right back. ♪ ... kevin, where are you?! kevin?!?!?.... hey, what's going on? i'm right here! i was busy cashbacking for the holidays with chase freedom unlimited. you know i can't believe you lost another kevin. it's a holiday tradition! earn big time with chase freedom unlimited.

how do you cashback? chase. make more of what's yours.

hillsdale was founded in 1844. we're passing on a cultural heritage, the culture of the west. when the federal government started giving money to colleges, we didn't take it. that independence has allowed us to stay with our mission that we established 175 years ago. because we don't accept federal money. we are free to concentrate on the mission of the college. we care about freedom, and that affiliates us

with the free institutions of america. (♪) how easy is it to play the lottery with jackpocket? step one grab your phone. step two download jackpocket and start ordering tickets for your favorite state lottery game. step three let the good times roll. jackpocket is so easy to use from home or on the go, and there have been over $500m in total prizes won. so now the easiest way to enjoy the lottery is right in your pocket. jackpocket. download america's number one lottery app today. david: well thank you, everybody for watching this special edition of kudlow, and by the way, you can catch me co-hosting the bottom line just in one hour, right here on fox business, but first, edward lawrence is in for liz m, he will take you through the next hour, good to see you. we'll see you in an hour. appreciate it. so i'm edward lawrence in for elizabeth macdonald.

welcome