will be here, john captainer cash will be here. and a super model, miranda kerr will be here. >> steve: and steve will be in the after the show show. so we'll see you back here tomorrow, everybody. bill: fox news alert, that's where we start, where washington is on a spending spree and according to the latest report from the congressional budget office the feds just wrapped up its biggest spending year ever, wracking up the biggest budget decifit since the second world war. what we could do with that money, huh? hey maccallum! martha: good morning to you, good morning to everybody at home, i'm martha maccallum. so this is the situation, at administration took the reigns of one of the worst financial years in history. here's how the numbers are adding up this morning, government spending, a cool $3.6 trillion.

these numbers are unheard of when you look at it historically. there was so much talk about how much needed to be cut, line by line, we were supposed to be a tightening of belts and here we are. bill: now questions where all that money is spent. stuart varney, first the report, what does it say? >> we spent 3 trillion, $600 billion in the financial year just ended, unfortunately, we only took in $2,300,000,000,000, that means we had a decifit, again, second year running, of 1 trillion, 300 billion-dollars. now, what we do not -- there was no spending cutting, okay? spending cuts overall did not happen. we actually spent more in the year just ended than the year before that. in fact, medicare spending went up, and the big increase was in the payments for interest on our debt. that was up 16 percent. so -- >> bill: so when we ask the question, what you get for all that, what you get is more decifit spending, what

you get is a greater debt. now, look at the decifit as a share of gross domeec product. this is a five year model on the screen. look what happened between '08 and '09. look at that jump. and it stayed up there in 2010 and 2011, stuart. >> it's a danger signal. that's telling you that the decifit, the amount of money that we're borrowing to keep the economy going, borrowing, is way up there by historical standards. in the last three years, we have gotten into territory that we've not been in since the second world war, that is a danger signal for the financial costs that we are -- course that we are on, 8.6% of gdp, that is the share of the decifit in our overall economy, danger signal, not sustainable, period. no economic growth to show for it. bill: to the novice observer, what that shows you is the hole is only getting deeper, we're not digging out, are we? >> the hole is getting deeper because we are

accumulating debt. we now have 14 trillion, $700 billion worth of accumulated debt. okay? that is huge. that is precisely the same size as our overall economy. you are getting pretty close to greek level, european levels. it's a huge danger signal. bill: that it is, hello, good morning alence. this is shaping up not just to be a business story but a major political issue now over the next 13 months. stuart, thank you for that, see you at 9:20, fbn, all right? >> yes. martha: varney, then we've got herman cain, folks, going toe to toe with president obama and winning. according to the rasmussen reports poll for the first time, we are seeing numbers like this, folks, herman cain at 43 percent, president obama at 41 percent. cain will be a prime target, you can bet, tonight at the debate that's going on in las vegas this evening. we're going to have a preview for you on who needs to do what in that debate tonight. look for rick perry to try to get back on the map

tonight. bill: it's always interesting, the day after, based on what happens in those debates. so cain is taking surging numbers on the road, he is, heading to arizona to meet with america's so called toughest sheriff, joe araaio, known for his aggressive position on border security and other issues. cain says the two have a lot in common. >> first of all, sheriff joe has very similar qualities that i have, ce get the job done, neither one of us have been a political correctness tool, and i still don't plan to be a political correctness tool. bill: cain taking heat suggesting the u.s. should build an election rified fence along the border, later he was he was -- he said he was joking, it of sarcasm, and michele bachmann, calling for tougher immigration laws, saying the feds should foot the bill for a border fence. >> this is a burden that needs to be borne by the

federal government. the state of arizona should not be on the hook financially for building the fence. we need to make sure that english is the official language of the united states government, and we also need to have a set of criteria, for those who are found to be in the united states illegally. bill: bachmann vows that if elected president she will have what she calls a superfence along the mexican border. expect to hear a bit more about that later tonight. martha: all right. meanwhile, mitt romney supporters turning a campaign headquarters, opening into a full on rally. tim pawlenty was revving up the crowd in nevada but it was all about mitt romney who says he believes at this point, still got a long fight ahead of him. watch: >> i know you're here not because things are great right now in nevada, but because things are going to be great in nevada after i'm president. what i believe it's going to take to get america working again is someone who's not a life long politician but instead someone who knows how the economy works, who's been in the private sector

and who will get america working again. do you want that? >> martha: romney not saying too much at that appearance about his gop rivals or the fact that herman cain is surpassing him in some of those polls but the man who introduced him said that while there would be refreshments at this particular event, they would not be serving any godfather's pizza, not at that one. bill: got a fox news alert, quickly, a crowded tour bus slam going a tractor trailer, sending five to the hospital that, bus was on its way to new york city on the throughway in floatsberg, you can see the front end -- in slostsberg, they had to cut the driver and numerous passengers out of that wreckage, the crash, snarling early morning traffic for miles and investigators are on the scene hoping to figure out a cause for the wreck, but this repeats something we've seen for the past year in various parts of new york state. martha: so true, bill. these kind of scenes have become all too common, really. last year alone, there were

34 wrecks involving motor coaches. earlier this year, 15 passengers wound up dieing in a similar crash along i95 in new york. remember, that was absolutely horrific. senator schumer of new york has pushed for increased inspections for the buses, which sometimes stay on the road despite serious safety concerns. and also, there are questions about the drivers. all right, we want to get to this story which has captured so much attention across this nation now because there are new developments in the disappearance of 11 month old lisa irwin, her parents have now hired a high profile lawyer, joe tacopina whose name and face may be familiar to you, he represented joran van der sloot and others, he's joined this case, he says that lisa's mother, deborah bradley, has nothing to hide. just two days ago during an interview with "america live" anchor megyn kelly, lisa's mother said she had

-- she had no plans at that point to hire an attorney. >> we don't need a lawyer. we don't need one. >> aren't you worried that they're going to come after you? >> it's a possibility, yeah. it's scary. but we haven't got one up until now because we felt like we didn't need one. martha: a big change of direction since sunday. today is tuesday. and now they have hired one of the highest profile criminal attorneys in this country. arthur idala joins me now, a prosecutor and former criminal defense attorney. why do you think the change of tune? >> i don't know. megyn -- maybe megyn could convince them when she said why don't you have a lawyer, and she said we don't need one. look, the bottom line is these parents have gone out, they have spoken at length to megyn kelly, who is an accomplished attorney, they have spoken to judge jeanine pirro who is the district attorney of westchester

county. i don't know whether they knew that or not. and they've really put their story out there. so if they get charged, martha, and i know this from experience with my clients, those news interviews could be the worst evidence against them because they highlight the inconsistencies, the investigator brought in, bill stanton, by a benefactor, he works closely with joe, and i worked with joe, everyone should know that, he worked in the district attorney's office, joe absolutely knows what he's doing, diswroont gets involved, he makes the decision it's time to bring in a lawyer, he calls his buddy joe, who they've worked together and joe has done the right thing, he pulled the plug on these interviews, he heard what they had to say. martha: he pulled the plug on the interview and you point out, they sat down with several reporters and sat down with megyn over the weekend and with judge jeanine pirro, they've been open about this, who knows if they would have been had

they hired a lawyer on day one, but i want to play another piece of sound from deborah bradley, as we all seek to get a better handle of what's going on here. >> because it's so easy to hear the stories, say oh, she drank, orioo it's so easy to say those things, but i know i didn't do anything, he didn't do anything, there's a bad guy out there with my baby, right now. and there are people that are judging. please, just look for her. martha: what do you think about this arthur? i mean, the bottom line question is did they do it, are they involved. >> i was an judge jeanine pirro's show saturday night and she put me on the spot and i said my insingts, five years as a prosecutor, 15 years as a criminal defense attorney, my instincts from what i see on the television, from the people who work with fox who interviewed her, i find her credible. the husband hasn't given me enough. martha: he says nothing. >> right. i find her credible. before joe tacopina got involved, i find her

credible, i believe her tears are genuine and martha, they're in a no win position. if they don't talk to the media, people think they're hiding things, if they talk too much, why are you talking to the media. martha: at their house and their neighbors' house, they allowed all that to take place and it will see how it changes now that they have a defense attorney hired. arthur, always good to see you. bill: 11 minutes past the hour. a few stories we're working on this morning. also this, a disturbing hit and run, a little girl, run over by a truck, but it's what happened afterwards that will absolutely stun you. martha: plus, will the gloves come off tonight, folks, in the latest republican debate? you know, we've been watching these things very closely. so rick perry is one of the men out there, this man, herman cain, has stolen the limelight from him. can he fight his way back into this race? bill: also president obama taking aim at republicans while pushing a jobs plan. what about this comment? >> we could actually lose jobs with their plan. so i'll let you decide,

which plan is the real american jobs act?

martha: well, this is a dramatic rescue in boston, after a six-year-old boy was dropped from the window of a burning building, at least 14 other people were saved after an explosion ignited a massive fire there. the little boy's grandparents sthai they were forced to toss him out when the flames trapped them in their apartment. thankfully, a firefighter was there to catch him. >> it was like superman. >> you were thinking you were superman flying out of the building? >> yeah. >> everyone got out safe. i do also thank the firefighter that was there beneath, with one of the neighbors that sort of caught him when he fell. >> i got him, and i thank my lucky stars i was in the right place at the right time. martha: that's what it's all about, fantastic

firefighting, and that adorable little boy and his grandmother, also happy they got out of there safely. luckily nobody was injured in this entire situation. they arrested a 28-year-old man, though, who admits that he set the fire in a suicide attempt. bill: president obama, taking aim at the i. q. of republicans who did not support his jobs bill from yesterday: >> maybe they just didn't understand the whole thing all at once! so we're going to break it up into bite-sized pieces. so they can take a thoughtful approach to this legislation. bill: what about that? connecticut senator joe lieberman is with me this morning. senator, good morning to you! how you doing? >> good morning, bill, doing real well, hope you are, too. bill: i am, thank you. do you understand the jobs bill? because the way i understand it from you, you did not like it as much as the president liked it. why not? >> yeah, look, to me, a lot of the stuff in the jobs bill is the kind of thing

we've adopted over the years, and a lot of it has a good feeling to it, but we're not at an ord -- ordinary time anymore, and to me the best thing we can do to get our economy going and create jobs is to adopt aby partisan debt reduction program out of the joint special committee. and quickly, the reason for that is our economy needs a jolt. paying for more state jobs is not going to than jolt. the jolt is to convince business investors that the government is working together to cut the debt, and once we do that, they'll invest and create the jobs. and when you look at the president's jobs act, even if you break it down to bite-sized pieces, it's spending money we don't have, and you got to raise taxes to pay for it, and to me, that just makes the job of the debt reduction

committee, the committee itself, even harder. bill: you mentioned the times in which we're living. listen to some of these numbers for a moment. unemployment has been at 9 percent or higher for 27 of the last 29 months. since september of 2011, underemployment was up to 16 1/2%. that's about 25 million americans, and about one third of all those unemployed have been out of work for more than a year. man, these are tough, tough times. and i appreciate your comment about trying to figure something out. i want to play a little something from a democratic counterpart in the house. debbie wasserman-schultz, about what she says is the real issue. i'll get to you react to this: >> okay. >> we've stopped the economy from dropping like a rock, like it was before president obama took i've. where is the leadership on the republican side? you want to talk about sitting on the sidelines, they're the ones that have just been crossing their arms and hoping for failure. i mean, how could -- it's so

irresponsible for them to allow the economy to just remain stagnant. you know so, that they can -- >> i think they would disagree. bill: senator, is that even true on its face? >> well, to me, i got reelected as an independent, so that's the perspective i have, both parties are equally to blame for the fact that we haven't gotten together to reduce the debt which, again, i say is the most important thing we can do to get our economy going again and create more jobs again. those numbers, the two read before debbie wasserman-schultz's words, tell how serious a position our economy is in. people want jobs, and so the reaction is to put a jobs act forward, but i don't think this jobs act will make the difference for those people that they deserve. only real leadership, bipartisan leadership in washington to reduce the debt will do it. bill: so many need the help, too. and john boehner on the

house side would say they put plan after plan forward and there's been no action on the senate side so, that back and forth continues. and senator, thank you for your time. i want to congrat i -- congratulate you on the new book, it's called "get some rest", it's out now and good luck with that senator. thank you very much. >> we all could use a little rest these days. god bless you, thank you. martha: boy, isn't that the truth. everybody. a gift of rest is a good idea. we've got a big story coming up. there's new fallout today over the toughest immigration law in this nation, the justice department set all hotline to report any, quote, abuses of the law that has been enacted in alabama. we're going to ask the state's attorney general who he -- what he thinks about that. bill: also fallout from vegas, could the death of dan wheldon change the way we race for good?

bill we are learning now that the indy car driver dan wheldon died of blunt force to the head, the 2-time indy champion, killed off the horrific pileup at the las vegas motor speedway, fellow drivers saying this oval track is too short, it's too dangerous, especially for the ind yeah cars that hit speeds of 225 miles per hour. >> we kind of had a deal, once we had kids i needed to look the other way on that, and the rater in me wants to. bill tbhail is the voice of jim gentlemen johnson, a driver, add thank ind yeah cars belong on street circuits or road courses and

that cars in nascar are much safer for the track. martha: this fox news alert. after five years in captivity, an israeli soldier is a free man today. elad shalik releasean unprecedented prisoner swap between israel and palestinians. that was the scene. hundreds of palestinian prisoners were released on those buses, many serving life sentences for terrorist acts in israel. leland vitter is live outside the home of the israeli soldier just released in northern israel. >> reporter: hi martha. we are now one hour away from ilad shalik showing up at home, they say tie a yellow ribbon around the old oak tree and there are lots of yellow ribbons out here today. want to show you video after he was released. many have said this is like their own son coming home. tv anchors teared up when

they saw the first picture, a pail, 25-year-old boy, possibly not in great health, but certainly, okay, and at long last, free. he gave an interview before they turned him over to israeli authorities and you could tell this was a young man, happy to be going home. >> yes, it was long years. i was thinking i'm going to stay for many more years. >> what have you missed most while in captivity? >> i missed my family, i missed my friends, i want to meet people and talk to them, to tell them about my life in captivity. i have a lot to tell. >> reporter: and right now in gaza, there are also huge celebrations going on. this cost israel dearly, more than 1000 palestinian, many of whom have the blood of israelis on their hands. they are the worst of the worst that israel had to release in order to get shalik back. you look here live at the street, waiting for the home coming, you can see they've lined the streets, back to

shalik's parents' home. you can imagine how much the parents have been looking for this. they have held vigil for two years outside the prime minister's residence. martha: we're losing him. it was breaking up a little bit. but what a story. let's take a look at how we got here, shali k's kidnapping was part of an unprovoked attack which involved seven armed terrorists using a tunnel dug under the israel-gaza border, ef the first israeli soldier captured by palestinian militants since 1994 and he is the first captured israeli soldier to be returned home alive in 26 years. bill: thank goodness for his freedom. he did look frail, for a man in his 20s. martha: very thin and underfed, and we're going to hear his story and it will be something. bill: five years later, now back home with his family. wow. president obama says he does not want to scrap a key health care program, despite his own administration saying it won't work, the numbers don't add up. what's up with that? a great panel in a moment to debate.

martha: plus another battle ground state moves its vote on theical tar for 2012. how is this going to impact? because it will have different impact on different candidates, depending upon whom you are. bill: watch the dominoes fall. for the latest -- latest election news, take us with you, we're along for the ride. before you go to the gym or work out today, go to foxnews.com/mobile, to download our app. do that while we go to break, right? we're back in three minutes.

bill: it is getting tight for this primary season, iowa now officially has set its caucus for early in january, which means for the second time in a row, we're going to be bumping up against the holidays. here's what iowa has country, on -- has done, the caucuses will be january 3rd. now, if you remember, florida has already gotten approval from the republican party to hold its primary on january 31st, and now you have three other states trying to sandwich their way into relevancy, and they're pretty effective so far. south carolina will go on the 21st of january and now nevada has selected january january 14th, and you say what's the problem with that? the problem is new hampshire has a state law that says its primary must be held with like a seven-day buffer

zone before any similar votes so, perhaps new hampshire could go on the tenth, perhaps here on the 11th, but what the secretary of state in new hampshire has, he has sole authority to pick whatever dates he wants and they're talking about december now. that's only a month and a half away. new hampshire could hold its primary on either december 6th or december 13th. it has never been held that early before. how will that affect things? let's bring in charlie hurt with us from washington, the washington times. charlie, how you doing, good morning to you. how's this going to work out? >> well, it's going to be a real mess for the next couple of months, anyway, until we get some indication from new hampshire when they're going to have their primary, and i must say, i think we're far from settled, because if they decide to do it in january, that may be contingent upon nevada or somebody else moving around. but you know, what's kind of

interesting to me about all of this is you think, well, all this is going to be over by february. not so. as you remember, four years ago, when everybody moved up to early january. bill: sure do. >> we figured well, it's all going to be over very quickly, but something got in the way of all that, and as we all remember, hillary clinton didn't walk away with it. bill: and that went on for ten months. >> it went on for months! bill: charlie, i just want names. if the calendar is shrunk the way i just laid it out here, who does it help? >> well, you know, people in washington love to sit around and speculate on this, they can speculate on it for days, but i think the bottom line, you can make the thargt somebody like herman cain could be benefitted, if it were to happen now, just because he's on the rise. if there's somebody who is on sort of an asendencey at that moment, it's going to help them, but honestly, i think in the end, who it

really helps is mitt romney because republican voters, unlike democratic voters are a pretty careful bunch. i think that in this sort of chaos like that, republican voters tend to go for the safest port in the storm and that will wind up being mitt romney. i just don't see how anybody else could be guaranteed at this stage out to benefit as much as he probably will. bill: there is intriguing drama in this, charlie, and we'll watch and see how it plays out. thank you. charlie hurt out of washington. good to see you. a bit of background, the iowa caucuses are the first votes for presidential candidates, that state has held that tradition since 1972, the caulk nous iowa is usually held in either january or february, followed by the new hampshire primary vote, is so it goes one, then two. primary season ends in august, so perhaps we're half way there. martha: perhaps we are, and very early. there is confusion going on within the administration, because president obama says he does

not support pulling the plug on a major health care provision, despite his own administration saying that they think that part of the health care bill is just financially unsustainable. not doable. a white house official saying, quote, we do not support repeal. repealing the class act, and we're going to explain what that is, isn't necessary or productive. what's going on here? meanwhile back in 2009, senate majority leader harry reid promised that the class act was all paid for. listen to this: >> for the first time in this country, for disabled people, people who are working, planning ahead, in case they do become disabled, fully paid for, cbo said in the far future, decades and decades into the future, paid for. martha: how about that, fully paid for, decades and decades into the future, a promise from harry reid on the floor of the senate. so it's a voluntary program, known as community living assistant services, and it was designed to -- designed

to offer affordable care to the disabled and elderly, sounds like a wonderful idea but the numbers aren't adding up. andrea tantoras, mary ann marsh, former adviser to senator john kerr yes, ladies, welcome, good to see you both here today. >> good morning. >> good to see you. martha: there's a lot going on, the strange thing, kathleen sebelius came out on friday, she wrote a blog and in the blog, she said this, she said despite our best analytical efforts i do not see a viable path forward for class implementation at this time and she went on to say she doesn't think the program is sustainable, then the white house started backpedaling and said no, no, because they started to get heat from aarp and others who supported the plan, big supporters of the president, and trying to make it sound like they can pull it off. mary ann, what's going on? >> look, i think the bottom line here really has been the effort by republicans,

senator -- senators and others to repeal it. that's the difference here. ignoring a problem doesn't make it go away. unless you're a republican running for clag in 2012 and that's your election strategy. so rather than trying to figure out how to pay for this and implement it when the economy is better, many republicans just want to eliminate it, and that's the fight you're having here, what president obama is saying is look -- >> martha: she hasn't eliminated it. she looked at the numbers and kathleen sebelius, head of hhs, says it's not do believe a, we'd like to but the program is not viable. so is it viable or not viable and if it's not viable, we've got a big problem. >> it is absolutely not viable. look, the program, as you said, martha, is voluntary, so what you're going to have is adverse selection, meaning who's going to sign up? six people, not -- sick people, not healthy people, right? that's the biggest issue. you need those healthy people to join the system to pay for it, so they're going to be collecting all these premiums from all these people for five years, then, at an unsustainable pace, they're going to have to pay for all this care. it would bankrupt the plan and the smart move, judd

gregg who said, in order for this to work, we'll get behind you, you need to prove that this program would be solvent and pay for itself, they couldn't do it, so they pulled the plug. it's a cost containment issue, martha, and now it's political as you said. they're trying to keep these seniors in their camp, but they cannot pay for it. it's a huge polit -- >> martha: as you're saying, politically it's causing a lot of problems for the administration, and here's a quote from the ceo of advance class, which is, obviously, a group that wanted to see this program go through, they're very confused about the mixed signals from the administration and larry minnix said i feel like somebody just called me about how to do really good pet care after they shot my dog. mary ann, i mean, this reflects an issue -- and i guess the underlying issue here is what does it signal about the whole health care plan? >> two things martha. first of all, this has all been in reaction to republicans who consistently have called for the repeal

of national health care reform. here in massachusetts, where we have health care reform, started by mitt romney, we're now, you look on the front page of the "new york times" today, we've got everybody covered and now we're working on controlling cost. what makes sense here, and the difference is here, don't throw the baby out with the bath water, figure out how to pay for it, then implement it when you can and when that makes sense, frankly, is when the economy is better, after we put people back to work, put the economy back on track, then deal with these things, but the fact is we all pay for this, whether we figure out how to pay for this or not right now, just like when people go to the emergency room for health care. martha: good point. >> and the bottom line is that there are a lot of things that need to be fixed in the health care system and everybody is i guess waiting for the gop to come out with a viable plan as some sort of alternative. >> martha, everything you said, your question to mary ann was spot on, everything you said about this -- that they've said about this bill has proven to be a lie. they said premiums wouldn't go up, premiums have gone up 9 percent, they said you

could keep your doctor if you want to, you can't. now the decifit reduction through this class bill would be the biggest cost cutter, and it's not. all lies. martha: andrea, thank you. mary ann -- you know what, i don't think we've heard the real heat of this conversation that we're going to hear in the runup to this election. i think it's just getting started, the supreme court decision and the calls for appeals as well. always good to see you both. bill: she had a stroke two months ago and just got to the hospital now. why did it take so long to get the scientist -- to get this scientist medical treatment? we have an answer in a moment. martha: there's the cain train, rowing full steam ahead. he l. as he has self-admitted, will have a target on his back. >> let me tell you something else before i go through that, about being in the top tier as candidate. can you all see that big bull's eye on my back?

martha: all right, we are back. let's get you caught up on the headlines in "america's newsroom", secretary of state hillary clinton making her first trip to a post qaddafi libya, clinton promising $11 million in aid to help with the wounded there, and making sure that weapons don't fall into the wrong hands. big issue of course in libya. it is one small step for man, one giant leap for commercial space travel, folks, richard bran son unveiling the virgin galactic space port in new mexico, more than 450 people have already bought their ticket necessary advance. bill, what do you think? >> bill: they could use two, right? >> herman cain is gaining momentum from rasmussen for the first time, taking a slight lead over president obama, head to head, 43 percent of voters say they prefer cain over president obama, that's

within the margin of error but it's remarkable it's that close. cain tells "america's newsroom" people like his simple approach: >> a lot of the people that iran to -- that listen to me at various events, they don't care that i haven't had any high level government experience. martha: you know what, that has -- >> they care about my common sense approach. bill: stephen hayes, senior writer, weekly standard, fox news contributor, how you doing? >> hey bill, good morning. bill: what are you watching for tonight? >> certainly herman cain. it will be interesting to see if he can take what has been a virtue for him, which is what we just heard, the fact that he speaks sort of common sense language of every day americans, that he doesn't get into the political speak of the other elected officials that he's on the stage with, he needs to be able to translate that into confidence that he can actually do the job. that's one of the real challenges for him right now is being the outsider, but allowing people to understand that you can actually do the job if you win it. bill: and many would argue he's being watched closer

now than he was before. let me get back to herman cain in a moment. i want to put out a new ad by rick perry's team, watch the age -- the image here and the tone it sets. >> in the overregulation, in the excess litigation, in the bureaucratic intimidation, let's get back to what we know works. that's to get america working again. make what americans buy, buy what americans make, and sell it to the world. god bless you, thank you all for coming out and being with us. >> bill: part of the job of a president is to be a cheerleader and chief. how does that strike you as you listen to it? >> that does it. i watched the whole ad, i that's a very effective ad. it's interesting that rick perry is going into the debate with a positive ad, something that talks about his jobs plan, which he hasn't really laid out. the speech he gave in pennsylvania was really an energy speech, part of it a broader plan for getting the economy back on track, but it was an energy-focused speech, rather than a specific economic plan which he has not yet laid out.

but interesting to me that he went positive, mitt romney has an ad out, another web ad out today, going negative on rick perry. bill: and with romney, the polls numbers, they're consistent. they're not really up or down. they're consistent. which could be good or bad. we saw gingrich get a pop after all these debates. poll this, bya, because you asked, we want view attorneys let us no he what they think and mike wres out of buffalo, we hear about cain's 999 plan but how much revenue will this plan produce. is that the kind of detail that you are referring to in your first answer and do we have an answer for that steve? >> it is. i think he needs to go further beyond that. remember in the earlier debates when he was asked about foreign policy, for instance, he sounded not only like somebody who hasn't spent time dealing with foreign policy issues, which is understandable, but also someone who isn't reading the newspapers every day so he has to demonstrate basic level confidence on those issues, as well as others. to get to the question that

the viewer asked, it depends on who you ask. bloomberg did an anallis that found that the # 99 plan would raise about 2.3 -- bloomberg said 2. o trillion, herman cain's people say $2.3 trillion, other people say less than that. it all depends on what assumptions you build in to the revenues coming in. bill: and others argue, too, it depends on what sort of deductions are included in this plan. >> absolutely. bill: to determine the level of revenue. stephen, thank you, we'll talk to you later in the week. stephen hayes. go to foxnews.com/"america's newsroom", file a question for steve or anybody you'd like today, bya, because you asked, hemmer, foxnews.com, twitter is at bill hemmer and we have questions for that, martha maccallum, also there out of new jersey, and she writes this, i don't know, what's on your mind? by the way! >> martha: so it's being called the toughest immigration law in the nation and it has some illegals in alabama running scared, kids, skipping school, people not showing

up at work, because they're afraid of this legislation. so now the justice department has set up a hotline to try and catch abuses of the law. we're going to talk to the alabama attorney general on this, great guest. bill: a child hit by a car not once but twice. but what happens afterwards is truly shocking. we'll talk about that. martha: and no, that is not a smoke cloud, folks. we're going to tell you about the devastating dust storm that has people running for cover. >> it got pitch black and the teachers kept reminding us to not to look back that it was just wind, but it was black outside, you couldn't see anything.

martha: wait until you see this. there was pan nick texas yesterday as the afternoon sky was just blotted out by a fast moving dust storm.

look at that thing! it's a massive cloud. it went over lubbock city early last night and an emergency operation center was set up after the storm ripped up trees and caused serious damage at a local airport. listen to this: >> people were like yelling and running around in the hallways and going outside, and no one knows what's going on, because no one has ever seen this before. >> first of all, a buddy -- a buddy of mine, called, asked if he had been in a sand storm since he had been in iraq. it was well, you have now. martha: 1500 people lost power in that storm, texas not the only one dealing with serious winds headed their way. maria molina is in the extreme weather center with the latest. >> reporter: pretty wild stuff across texas and we have two reasons for that. the drought that's been ongoing throughout the state has produced that dust across the region and the cold front helps kick up that dust. you can see from the great lakes into louisiana today, that's where we're going to be looking at gusty winds today, otherwise, the reason

why we saw that gust again yesterday that, ongoing drought for about a year across texas, most of it under the worst category, exceptional drought, that's what has produced that dust across the region. today you are going to see additional gusty winds across texas. we won't see any more dust storms but elevated fire danger. we're going to be looking at gusts up to 30 miles per hour. that's nowhere near as strong as what was dumped yesterday across the region, winds produced up to 70 miles an hour across parts of the state of texas, but lubbock actually reported a wind gust just shy of 6:00 p.m. of 61 miles per hour, so that's what really helped to kick up that dust across the region, and martha, that's around rush hour. you can just imagine the panic as you're headed home from work, stuck in traffic. martha: those are some strong winds, maria. thank you very much. bill: how about a check of the markets, huh? >> martha: all righty. bill: maybe not after yesterday! we're off 73 points right now, investors reacting to

moody's ungrading possibly, they say, about a warning about france's credit rating, and a new round of disappointing corporate earnings here and there, the dow closing off 247 points on monday, a lop of trepidation over what's going on in europe and for good reason. they don't know how deep the hole is over there! stay tuned. martha: all right. in the meantime, the solyndra scandal moves to a new level. here's the question now: did the government actually break the law? republicans looking for answers in a new part of this investigation. bill: also a new report on america's money, more and more of you are making late payments on your credit cards. we'll tell you y. and what that means for the economy. [ female announcer ] once you taste

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martha: a fox news alert. seeking justice in the solyndra case. house republicans looking at some new legal action against a money maneuver that may have put the private investors in solyndra ahead of the taxpayers who are on the hook. so the focus here whether the energy department may have broken a law when they restructured that $55 million federal loan to a failing solar panel maker. hot topic. brand new hour of "america's newsroom." glad you're with us. i'm martha maccallum. bill: i'm bill hemmer. good morning to you martha. republican cliff stearns says the white house is violating its own pledge of transparency by refusing to turn over key document. >> what is the white house trying to hide? we intend to pursue this investigation and we fully expect the white house's cooperation which representative fred upton pushing for some time as is

cliff stearns. john fund senior editor of "american spectator" magazine. john, welcome. >> thank you. martha: what is the difference here in what they're pursuing in terms of breaking the law? >> i think the green jobs initiative obama administration was fated to programmatic because the government ising picking winners and losers. governments don't do that very well. taxpayers usually come out the loser. this is different. solyndra was clearly failing in february of this year and the government restuck toured the loan to keep the company alive and restuck urd in such a way that future investors in the company will get their money back before the taxpayers get their money back if the company goes belly-up that is unprecedented. basically the government is saying we'll bail out investors who are trying to save a failing company. martha: it raised a lot of questions. why would they do that, right? >> political pull may be one of them. solyndra was full of obama campaign donors. clearly a company obama had

a lot of investments in politically. he visited the plant despite warnings from leading democrats where it was headquartered. don't go near the plant t will go down and president could be embarrassed by a failing company wasting half billion dollars in taxpayer money. martha: the taxpayer should be the primary investor. when you're the government making the primary investment and there is questions whether that should happen at all anyway. when you're the government that is making the primary investment the first person that should get paid is the taxpayer right? >> that is so unusual. if they broke the law at the department of energy and what did they conceal or not conceal from the treasury department and what did they conceal or not conceal from the white house? i think might go up to the white house why we're seeing the big stall. the white house doesn't want any documents out before the november 2012 election. martha: we heard investigating what is on people's blackberries and we know that can absence tiff issue. >> that may take a long time given blackberry outage.

>> good point. john, thank you very much. that might work to some people's benefit. june fund, thank you. bill: tonight high-stakes tonight in las vegas. presidential candidates will square off exempt for one. we'll tell you about that in a moment. look at nevada on our billboard behind us here. we show you what number one issue in nevada. it is jobs and the economy. on our map the color-coded. deeper red more trouble n lighter green. look at nevada. talk about a state hit so hard over the past three years. number about of jobs lost in nevada, going back to august of 2008, when americans voted, 82,000. unemployment rate in nevada is enormous 13.4%. the national average is the 9.1. nevada clearly number one. a dubious distinction in that category. historically in nevada, 2008, you go back a couple years, president obama had no trouble in the state.

by the way on the map, red is republican victory. blue is democrat n negatived vad today, senator obama against senator mccain had no trouble. won 55% to 43%. what do we expect tonight. carl cameron is live in vegas. i imagine jobs and economy number one. carl, good morning. >> reporter: good morning, bill w foreclosures an unemployment highest in nevada guaranteed it is number one issue. here at the 8th debate. it will be a huge test for herman cain. he now leads national polls. in a cities tis call tie in handful of polls in lead-off states. for the georgia businessman tonight's debate is real test whether or not he can sustain momentum. most of his campaign success has before driven by his debate performance. tonight is very, very big test for him. also this evening, a lot of questions about texas governor rick perry and mitt romney. for rick perry who had some questions about his economic plan he began rolling out

the first pillar of his energy proposal earlier just last week. he will do more of that later this week and have a complete economic plan in the next couple weeks. and then there's mitt romney. the economy is in his wheelhouse. it is his strong suit and today he has released a new web video announcing a new web page which is called, career politician.com. and in it, it's sole purpose to go after governor rick perry. says when he was governor of texas unemployment doubled in texas while perry was governor. and it is highest it's been in last 20 years. the web page and the web ad are all about the going after rick perry's record trying to beat him up on jobs and economy before tonight's debate as well as throughout the rest of the campaign, bill. bill: immigration will come up too as you mention there. nevada 26%. thank you, carl. should be good doinging. see you tomorrow, carl cameron. martha: for months the occupy wall streeters going

after the folks who they believe are the wealthy in this nation and they think they are harming the economy. that movement reached a one-month milestone today. 31 days what evolved into some ways organized chaos basically. disrupting one of the world's biggest, busiest urban centers. demonstrators ignoring critics who say their biggest problem is lack of any concrete goal. >> there is nothing that anybody can do to stop this movement. we understand exactly what they are going to try to do to stop this movement and it will not be stopped. martha: okay. there you have it. "joe the plumber" became a sensation during the 2008 presidential campaign. confronting then candidate obama about the whole redistribution of wealth issue. guess what he is doing now? "joe the plumber" is running for congress. we'll ask him about that live couple minutes from now. "joe the plumber". bill: about taxes, wall street protests. protesters by the way pointing finger at corporations bank and wealthy. a new gallop poll out show most americans disagree

saying the federal government is to blame for our poor economy. 64% say washington is the issue. but they are not letting waulg street off the hook. 30% say the big financial institutions have responsibility as well. martha? martha: and there are some new fears that the economy may be taking a turn for the worse. we're getting reports that five of the nation as top six credit card issuers are reporting a spike in late payments. that is economic indicator of its own. charles payne joins me now, fox business anchor and ceo of wstreet.com. charles, it is just another indication if people are make like on making those payments. >> you're absolutely right. first time since february of 2009. that was the absolute meltdown. that was the pit of when we were melting down and there was fear and panic and blood in the streets. so that tells you that something, something isn't right, certainly doesn't bode well if you look at

these stocks. they're all for the most part down significantly from where they were a year ago and 10 years ago. so yellow if not red flag. martha: you know, what does this tell us? in terms of credit, right, you're constantly hearing people are having a hard time borrowing money to buy a house or get a loan for their business. if their credit tightens up it will make the situation worse in terms of juicing the wheels we hope will get things going again. >> you're right. 30% decline and decrease in amount of credit cards issued last couple years. far fewer people have credit cards. limits are a lot tighter than they were and banks are desperate not to lose any money any way they can. we see backlash against some of the fees they added just recently. without a doubt this is a real negative indicator. it is emblematic what is going on in the overall economy. banks are still teetering in many respects and this is just a sign the overall economy is not on firm footing right now. martha: scary situation. >> yeah. martha: charles, thank you

very much. >> you got it. bill: the white house says it is official business. critics say it is a campaign swing. president obama hitting north carolina and virginia today. larry sabato will tell us why these two states are critical in winning re-election for the white house coming up. martha: what happens when you have a medical emergency at the south pole? not a good situation. even in the middle of the winter. nothing one american researcher found out, not a whole lot in terms of help came her way in an amazing rescue that took three months. bill: also, alabama, it was enforcing one of the nation's toughest immigration laws in the country. that is until now. the state's attorney general is here live next. >> it will hurt my family. it is going to hurt people that live with me. it, the mortgage, car payment, all of these are going to have to go because i will have to look for something else to do. not here. probably move out-of-state. [ male announcer ] in blind taste tests, even ragu uss chose prego.

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bill: a sick american researcher doing work at the south pole, antarctica is now in new zealand awaiting results of medical testing. doctors think renee nicole desour had a stroke in august. for weeks the bad weather preventing any rescuers from reaching her there. >> coming, coming from south pole on under pressurized plain i was worried about there, i was afraid would do more serious damage or a stroke or who knows what else, they kept the plane at very low altitude so the air crew knew what it do if something had happened to me but luckily. nothing. it was a fantastic flight. bill: she is in place where she can get the help she needs, christchurch, new zealand. martha: big story now, alabama's attorney general says he vigorously defends a strict and controversial immigration law in his state after the u.s. justice department put that legislation on hold. then the doj decided they would set up a hotline for

illegal immigrants to send discrimination complaints directly to the doj. the protests have erupted in alabama, and amidst all of this there are reports that many illegal immigrants have been doing things like not showing up at their work, fleeing the state. in some cases children not going to school because they're afraid they might be in violation of the law and get caught. joined by luther strange, who is that attorney general and he joins me now in his first interview on this subject. attorney general, we're very glad to have you with us this morning. welcome. >> well, thank you, martha. i really appreciate this opportunity to be on today. martha: you know, this has gotten a ton of attention. we've seen so much of the voices of the people of alabama, some of them saying this is the way it has to be. we have to crack down on illegal immigration in our state. others saying that they are living in fear, that they're leaving the state. they're not showing up at work, children not going to school. you know, what do you think about that? >> well, this is the first interview i've given on this

subject and i really appreciate this opportunity. alabama is trying this case in the courts and two federal courts that have looked at this issue, enforcement of the immigration law upheld the vast majority of it and i'm very comfortable with that. i do think there is a tremendous amount of misinformation out there. frankly i think a lot is being fostered by the justice department which is very ironic since they're charged working with the states to help enforce our laws. so the laws in alabama has passed, ones that are still upheld today are eli laws intend to help the federal government do their job, which is to enforce the immigration laws. just like indiana, utah, arizona, georgia, south carolina, the states are addressing a serious problem, hoping to get help from the federal government. martha: right. >> it is more than a little discouraging that the federal government is now working against the states trying to help them enforce their own laws. martha: we're living in a new world now in terms of immigration laws. we've seen the states take

this into their own hands as alabama does because they were dissatisfied with the way the federal government was handling things. as you have very clearly pointed out to us here you feel the department of justice is working against the way you're trying to carry out the laws in your own state. here is what they told us. we called us to ask them about the hotline. the purpose of "the hotline" for the public to report potential civil rights concerns related to the impact of alabama immigration law, hb 56 we have no further comment at this time. where does it stand in terms of what your folks are able to done on ground checking identification and papers and documents of people when they pull them over on the street which is one of the most controversial parts of this discussion? >> exactly, martha. let me say this. it seems to me, and a lot of other people that justice department is stuck in a 1960s, early 1960s as it relates to alabama. they overlook past 50 plus years of fantastic progress. in fact there is reason why

international companies from all over the world, mercedes, and many, many others have located in alabama. they come here because it is a wonderful state. it welcomes people from all over the world. we just want them to play by the rules which is what all americans expect. it is our rule of law which all of our freedoms are i have had ba. the hotline really, to me, smacks of politics. it is really an afront to our good men and women in law enforcement who will protect the rights of all of our citizens. there is nothing in this law that allows anyone to profile someone. we would not tolerate that. doesn't prohibit anyone's free exercise of their religion. it does ask people to play by the rules which we all expect. illegal is illegal. and if people have problems with these they need to talk to congress or the justice department about their lack of enforcement or frankly the to change them if they don't like them but alabama is doing something frankly that the federal government should be doing which is enforcing all the laws. martha: you are overseeing what has been called the

toughest immigration law in the nation. we're watching this all play out in the courts. back and forth and a big decision on friday. thank you, sir. hope you come back and talk to us more about this in the future. >> i love to be back. thank you for letting us get out the other side of the story. thank you very much. martha: attorney general lieutenant that are strange. >> watch the way that story goes. lot of people think it may be supreme court where they make ultimate decision. he became a household name after confronting candidate obama back in 2008 over taxes that became a campaign issue. remember this? >> he had encounter with a guy whose name is plum bir. joe wurs sell berger. joe works in the city he has been in all these years. joe was trying to realize the american dream. joe, i want to tell you what you want to do to "joe the plumber". bill: guess what joe the plum biris doing next. you will find outlive when we ask him. martha: chaz bono,

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martha: this is most awful, awful story of the day and there is outrage growing in china. after a little girl is run over by not one, but two different vans. the video you are about to see i have to warn you is disturbing. we have edited out some of it because it is just too hard to look at, but this is what i want to show you right now. this 2-year-old toddler walking along. her mother was doing laundry in nearby building. she was hit by a van, soon

after that, she was hit by a second vehicle, i that is it. this is very difficult to watch. the surveillance video. then shows, look at these people. they just walk, can you imagine? walking by, riding by on your bike. strolling by this child who is laying there bleeding in the street? locals are furious at what they have seen. and, even angrier at the bystanders who continue, look at that guy, sort of looks back and keeps going. this mother with another child doesn't even stop to help. it is mind-boggling. and then this other woman comes out and sort of slides this child, here we go. off to the side and, you know, this unbelievable piece of video. we can tell you that this child is in a coma. and is not expected to survive. you just have to ask yourself what, how does this happen? what kind of society, what kind of world do we live in this is even possible? bill: no words, frankly but

when this happens sometimes it exacts change out of cities and out of countries they did not even see country. martha: that is value in showing it. bill: isn't it? bill: we'll he is what happens. how the chinese people react to that. truly disturbing. 24 minutes past the hour now. protesters targeting large financial institutions demanding wealthy pay higher taxes. the president spoke of spreading the wealth around back in 2008. his encounter with "joe the plumber", a pivotal moment in that election cycle. >> i think when you spread the wealth around it is good for everybody. listen, i respect what you do and i respect your question. and the, you know, even if i don't get your vote i'm still going to be working hard on your behalf i want to small businesses are what create jobs in this country and i want to encourage you. bill: that is joe wurzelbacher, aka, "joe the plumber". he is with me in bowling green, ohio. how are you? good morning to you.

>> good morning. bill: are you going to run for congress? >> i will let everyone know october 25th. bill: good chance though? >> there's a good chance. we'll see what happens. bill: what do you think of your chances of winning? >> i don't plan on losing, brother. bill: yeah? what would you run on, joe? >> kind of cliche --. bill: what is your platform. >> i suppose common sense. three issues i can throw at you real quick. one, i want to show the american people someone can run a race, win the race and serve the american people, not the lobbyists, not the special interest groups but actually serve the american people and maintain their integrity and principles. the second thing, jobs. i mean, we've lost a quarter million people here in the state of ohio. and we need jobs. they're not moving down to florida to sit on the beach. they're moving elsewhere to find jobs. third thing, obviously real passionate about being a military veteran myself veterans. ohio might not be the

biggest place for veterans but they still deserve the benefits promise. those are couple issues i want to push real hard. bill: if you proceed on the 25th of october, we certainly welcome you back here to make that announcement official on "america's newsroom." you will have a tough challenge. marcy kaptur is the longest serving democratic woman in the house. she could be up with a primary challenge from dennis kucinich, also a well-known democrat. how do you beat either one of them, joe? >> let's take this to the occupy wall street. you have some people over there right now are honestly concerned with what's going on you unfortunately they're protesting the wrong people. really what they need is better representation. that is what is comes down to. between marcy kaptur and dennis kucinich, and, representation that we've had, ohio lost a quarter of a million people. obviously something is not being done correctly. so it is not a matter of beating them. it is showing the american people and leading a new way

with honesty and integrity and creating a environment for businesses to move back to ohio and flourish, for small businesses to flourish. that is the job that i'm going for. it is not to pander to my party or anyone else's special interests or lobbyists. it is actually to represent the american people, union, nonunion, democrats, republicans, those would be my constituents. i think they have forgotten that. that is not a dig on those two. that is ultimately nationwide how that has come about. bill: how would your name appear on the ballot? >> samuel j wurzelbacher. >> got it. so it is not "joe the plumber"? it will be a race to watch if indeed you get in. we'll await your announcement on 25th of october. we'll follow up who could be your opponent, joe. thank you for your time. bowling green, ohio. >> thanks. martha: i'm sure his mom will be happy to hear that. that is what she named him and want that on the ballot no doubt. could be key for president obama winning a second term. we'll tell you what this one

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martha: all right, this is a fox news alert. there may have been some serious voter fraud in the democratic primary back in

2008. let's take you back. barack obama was battling hillary clinton for the nomination and their names appeared on virtually every primary ballot in the country but one indiana district is being accused of rubber stamping dozens of faked signatures and there are questions in the president's case whether he even had enough to be on the ballot there. eric shawn joins us live from our new york newsroom and we take a look back at an important topic. we have to make sure all voting is fair in this country and this is a big issue. >> reporter: that it is martha. today there are calls for a federal investigation into this growing voter fraud-related scandal that's happening in indiana. allegations that the petitions to get president obama and hillary clinton on the state's 2008 primary ballot, allegations they had signatures that were forged. the controversy has now prompted the chairman of the st. joseph county democratic party in northern indiana to resign last night. prosecutors are investigating if as many as

150 signatures were faked on the obama and clinton presidential primary petitions. so many, that it raises questions about whether or not the obama campaign had even enough legitimate signatures to get on the primary ballot. among them, the signature of former indiana democratic governor joe kurner, he told me he doesn't remember ever signing a petition and told me his name and signature that were on the petitions were fakes. the state's republican party chairman arab holkum has called for a federal investigation. >> we don't know the extent of the crime. we don't know how many people. we don't know if it was organized. those were some of my questions, is how deep did this go, does it go one county, one district, does it go one state, does it go 49 other states? >> the county's democratic chairman submitted that letter of resignation last night but denies any wrongdoing, and the state's democratic party chairman dan parker released a statement that says in part we continue to fully support the investigation into what he calls this isolated

incident in saint joseph county. we want to know who committed this act and we want that person held accountable. it turns out the alleged fraud was discovered by an intern, ryan neez at the nonpolitical newsletter of holy politics, indiana. sy a yale center, he supports president obama's reelection and guess what, he was a white house intern last year, but he told me that election fraud is too important not to pursue because he says it undermines the integrity of our electoral system and our very democracy. martha: good for him. eric, thank you. thank you very much. bill: all right you -- all right now, on the 201 map -- 2012 mp, president obama wrapping up a stop in greens borough, from there to another critical state, the state of virginia. on the map behind us, we can tell you what happens historically back in 2008. these were two critical states for president obama

to win, on the map here, again, red is republican, and blue is democrat. in north carolina, it does not get much tighter than this in the overall vote, president obama beating senator mccain by about 14,000 votes, separating the two. a dead heat over here, 50 percent to 50 percent from three years ago. in virginia, different story, virginia had not voted for a democrat for the white house going back to 1964, and this was not much of a contest, 53-46 percent, president obama over john mccain. and now you see why this bus tour is so important to hit these two critical states. larry sabato is director of the center for politics at university of virginia. how you doing, sir, and good morning to you. >> good morning, bill. good morning. bill: if president obama doesn't win both of these states, can he win reelection? >> i think if he loses virginia, he's on his way to

defeat, bill. he can afford to lose north carolina. as you point out, it was his closest election win in 2008 of all the states he carried. i think he's well under water in north carolina, as he is in indiana. another state that he carried in 2008. i'll be surprised regardless of the outcome if he carries either of those states. but virginia is another question entirely, because virginia at 53 percent for obama gave a larger percentage to the president than florida, at 51 percent, or ohio, which was also 51 percent. so if he's losing virginia, he may be lose something other key states that he absolutely needs to win reelection. bill: what's the approval rate for him in your state now of virginia, do you know? >> he's close to 40. he's definitely -- >> bill: 40 percent approval in virginia. >> 40 percent approval. some polls have it low 40s. but he's well below that 50 percent threshold that you need to get a second

term anywhere. bill: help me understand your logic. if he's under water in virginia, you believe, states like north carolina and indiana, and you mentioned florida could be a lot worse, how does that thread tie together, larry? >> yes. it's really demographically, bill. you know, virginia, incredibly, has become a microcosm of the country in a lot of ways. in fact, in 20 08, virginia gave obama the closest percentage to his national average of the 50 states, and you know, there are some histor -- there is some historical back background in this. in the last 28 presidential electricals virginia has voted 14 times for the democratic nominee and is four times for the republican nominee, so virginia has gone back and forth a number of times since the civil war. but i think if you look at virginia and you compare it demographically to these other states, you can see that if obama loses virginia, he's probably losing a lot of the other swing states. bill professor, thank you.

by the way, what's your reaction to herman cain being essentially tied with president obama in this latest poll number that came out? this is what ross mus -- rasmussen is reporting. what do you think of that? >> several other polls have had that, too. essentially it says that the republicans at this point have a good chance to defeat president obama. whether it's cain or whether it's some other republican nominee. now, remember, this is before the scrutiny that's going to come for any republican nominee. bill: and more of that later tonight. thank you professor, good to see you. larry sabato, university of virginia, nice to have you, okay? >> thank you bill. bill: you got it. martha: long before he was running for president he was commander in chief of a pizza empire. herman cain says america needs a sense of humor, folks, and apparently he lived by those words as the ceo of the godfather's franchise. watch this: >> ♪ >> ♪ >> ♪ imagine there's no pizza. >> ♪ >> ♪ >> ♪ i couldn't, if i tried. >> ♪ >> ♪ >> ♪ [laughter]

>> eating only tacos. >> ♪ >> ♪ >> ♪ or kentucky fried. >> ♪ >> ♪ >> ♪ [laughter] >> martha: so funny! all right, that was omaha, nebraska in 1991, right before that, cain said one of the wonderful things about america is the freedom to laugh at ourselves and that is one thing that he has certainly brought to the campaign trail. and i can't really imagine a world without pizza myself! so thank you to john lennon. bill: how about two large pepperonis after the show? in a moment here, he was born tommy, the son of two same-sex parents. by the age of 11, he says he feels more like a girl. what his parents are now doing that's causing a firestorm of controversy. we'll have that. martha: that's coming up. also this, caught on camera steal ago car. why this guy may be one of the dumbest crooks out there today. check this guy out.

good grief. >> the vehicle went all the way into my living room and part way into my bedroom, so it was a pretty rude awakening.

martha: well, a same sex couple decides to give their 11-year-old son hormone blockers to stop the onset of his natural beginnings of puberty. this is 11-year-old tommy, screen left, whom his parents now call tammy. they want to give him more time to decide if he wants -- wants to be a boy or if he wants to be a girl. so they are giving him drug that is will allow him to do that in the future. joined now by dr. keith ablow, a psychiatrist and member of the fox news medical a team, drrt mary mccarry is a professor and physician of health at johns hopkins. gentlemen, welcome, good to have you both here. >> thanks martha. martha: this is a lesbian couple, they adopted this child, and they claim that

from the earliest point in his life, you know, down to the fact that he was learning sign language and soon dollars to one of the moms, i am a girl, and she says no, you're not, tommy, you're a boy, and he kept doing it over and over, no, i am a girl, and they claim that since his earliest days, this is what he has wanted. dr. ablow, what do you think? >> here's what i think. first of all, i think we should remind ourselves from the outset, we're not looking to bully anyone. i'm reminded of the words of abraham lincoln, with malice towards none, but now is the time, martha, when we have to understand this issue. what's happening here? we have two women, raising a child, he's adopted, and he's come to believe that he, too, is female. that argues for a complete psychological evaluation, not just of the boy, but of his parents as well. to see whether psychological forces are at play here, to

make him say such things. we need to do away with stigma and look at this as scientists and really understand what's happening, not make it a cultural debate, but a scientific one. martha: yeah, i meerntion dr. mccarry, this child has not started puberty, and to me the idea, when you think about what goes on in a child's body during these years, right, all of these natural things that are supposed to be evolving in your body, and then to make an arbitrary decision, and by arbitrary, i don't mean willy nilly, but a voluntary act, to say let's give this child these hormones and that will prevent puberty, i mean, who knows what you're going to get into and bring on medically by undertaking this. >> yeah, martha, you know, this is a confusing time for many kids. my concern is when we start to medicate children as this child is being medicated with a growth hormone inhibitor and we change their physiology, any time you change the natural

physiology of a kid that's about to undergo puberty, there's going to be some health consequences, and when we give this medication in adults we tell them it's a safe medication, but there's a small risk of blood clots, stroke, even, potentially cancer. so there are concerns, and when we address as a society confusion and behavioral problems by simply medicating it as a reflection, that's a scary trend. martha: you know, there's nothing legally that can prevent this, dr. ablow, as irresponsible to this child when they're 18, 21, you know, they will certainly have the choices open them in today's society but is this any form of irresponsible at the very least parenting that could be legislated in any way? >> well, here's the thing. it's very tough, and i agree with the other guest, it's very tough to reverse course. and this has been written about. there are people who undergo these transformations, they may regret it later, but

when you're a boy who at three is taken at his word, signing to his adoptive female parents, i am a girl, too, and you then are dressed as a girl and then you get hormone injections, it's tough to reverse course, even though they say we'll stop thest again when he's -- the estrogen to he is decide. it's time for the commission on ethical concerns, just as with stem cells, to get involved here, summon the best minds from around the world to look at this issue, because the theory that people are born into the wrong bodies needs to be looked at scientifically. we need guidelines here for how to behave toward those young kids, pakistan he -- particularly who are at risk to be misinterpreted. martha: as you point out, obviously, some of these issues are so complex and people are tormented throughout their lives with feelings, having these feelings of you know, being born in the wrong sex, but this child is so young and that's what's raised all of

these concerns about whether or not he has any choice in this matter. so thank you very much, dr. mark makary, dr. ablow, for weighing in on this sensitive subject this morning. bill: sense tef and serious, too. jenna lee is cooking up a whole lota stuff in the newsroom. what you working on jenna? >> jenna: we have an interesting story to share with you, 1l.a.p.d. detective tweets a murder scene photo and it sets off a huge firestorm. he says he did it to help stop the violence but obviously it's raising privacy concerns. we're going to go in depth on that. also the firefighter who saved alt boy's life by catching him after he was dropped from a third story window, it was 56-year-old, this is a big little kid, we're going to talk to that firefight ef. and a closer look at the race in nevada and the ruckus it's causing. bill, that's a bit of an understatement. bill: that is very true. we'll see you in 11 minutes on "happening now". nice to see you. possible help for homeowners who owe more than

their home is worth. what is in that plan for you? we have details on that also. >> martha: put your paws up, a bear cub caught red handed. what this little guy stole from the grocery store. have you ever seen anything like that, ever? ever? in a grocery store in we'll be right back.

>> it may be one of the dumbest things we've ever seen, folks. watch this, a suspected thief, caught on tape, steals a truck, pops in, off he goes, doesn't know he's part of an undercover sting, police were tracking his journey right up to the moment, watch this, where he just loses control. he goes into one man's home at 3:00 in the morning, the homeowner wakes up to find a truck in his bedroom. this is unbelievable.

luckily he was unharmed. get this, police say they could have stopped the truck because it was an undercover sting and everything but it all happened so quickly they didn't have time to call dispatch and de activate the bait ca. ears where the driver is, he's on the loose! bill: not going to try that again. martha: somebody knows who and where he is. bill: plan b next time, right? they agreed to allow oil companies to drill on their land and some say they were duped into signing leases they now consider unfair, and turning some of those regrets into enormity nous lawsuits. rick leventhal is live in our newsroom in new york. what's going on with this? >> reporter: bill, more than 400 land owners in upstate new york signed lease toss allow deep drilling for natural gas under their property but have now filed or joined lawsuits against the energy companies, many say they were paid far less than they should have been, some say they're worried about the environmental impact. >> it's so quiet at night, you can almost hear the

stars in the milky way. >> marine mccray has been living on this small tarm in upstate new york since 1985. >> come on! that's good. >> now she's worried her way of life may be ruined. >> i signed the lease. i was an idiot. yes. but they were counting on my not knowing. and they were right. >> reporter: a few years ago, marie and many neighbors agreed to allow energy companies to dig deep below the ground to extract natural gas and a process known as franking. >> they want to come in here and -- fracing. >> they want to come in here and rape this lan and they told us whatever story they needed to tell us to get our permission to do that. >> there's no fraud in the inducement,. >> one of the energy companies negotiated deal with land owners that raised a couple hundred dollars an acre and 12 1/2% of royalty, some land owners say they should have gotten thousands per acre and didn't -- arab

and didn't understand the potential to the property. it's good for the operator, of course, it's good for the land owners who stand to make a lot of money on the royalty that is will be paid out over an extended period of time. and it's good for our country. >> reporter: wevment s says it's good because it's a domestic energy source, and could provide thousands of new jobs and the companies hope to begin drilling within a year, bill. bill: we'll watch that. rick, thank you. martha, what's next? martha: this story is terrible, a group of sore losers are accused of ambushing a team of high school football players. find out what happened to their coach when he tried to get in there and help out the situation. >> it seemed like they were waiting there. we saw everything break out and coach ran into the middle of it, where helmets were being used as weapons. úy i'm not a number.

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where do bears go for fresh vegetables? the supermarket of course like everybody else. bear cub on the broccoli there in the middle. come on. tell me this doesn't blow you away. look at this guy. bill: he was shopping for bananas. >> the cops showed up. there they are. i love our great police force but these guys wouldn't touch the bear cub. another guy came over and grabbed it by the back of its neck and put it outside. the experts say this is very unusual. took experts to come up with that. but the mom was nowhere in sight. there he goes. mr. brave. just grab the thing, guys. mom also in the supermarket then you've got a big problem. >> occupy wall street has inspired an i'm getting a arrested app. an app called, i'm getting arrested. this is true. it inspired an i'm getting arrested app that automatically notify legal counsel [laughing] so far the app