making benefits easier to get to. go to the heart of the guardon knot of corporations and big government and guys that economically cease from that we get to the heart of the problem. >> this is now the foundation. this is how things are done. >> right. >> very few people seem to be aware of it and that for them becomes wow, we have to really change the system. i think it will take a lot of pain before people wake up. >> i think you are right, sean. remember with the mainstream media at least with several members of the media they are part this of eco system. they live in washington, d.c. they like -- >> sean: they want access. they are out at the business and the parties. the very things we don't go to. you dragged me, you you and bright bart. breitbart. >> and i ran out of town as quick as i could. it has been a very informative hour. important stuff.

good work. we will continue it and follow up in the days, weeks, months to come. >> peter thank you and steve thank you. and that is all the time we have left. i also want to thank all of you for watching. let not your heart be troubled. the news continues here on fox. and hope you have a great captioned by closed captioning services, inc. >> greta: tonight a woman accused of savegely murdering her ex-boyfriend in the shower. if convicted she could face the death penalty. on the record takes you inside the jodi arias trial. an arizona man in the shower stabbed 27 times, shot in the head and his throat slit from ear to ear. his accused killer his former girlfriend and she is now standing trial. she claims at least now that

she was forced to kill. >> i didn't kill travis. i did not take his life. >> this is not a case of whodunnit. the person who done it, the person who committed this killing sits in court today. the defendant jodi arias. >> i can just arrest you and throw you in jail. i want to know why, why did you do this to him? >> jodi arias killed travis alexander. there is no question about it. the million dollars question is what would have forced her to do it? >> it is no doubt about it in my mind this was a rage or a killing. >> here is a woman that gets a gun, gets a knife and puts it to what she suspects is good use against this guy. >> i felt that the gunshot wound may have been last but in any event the gunshot wounds and the wounds to the neck would have had to have come after the defensive wounds of the hands. >> certainly if she is going to

claim self-defense she is going to have to get up on the stand and she is going to have to testify and justify each and every wound and why. >> what really happened in there? >> in a nut shell, two people took travis' life. two monsters. >> you did not shoot travis? >> i have never even shot a real gun. >> you did not stab him 27 times. >> that is heinou is s. >> or lit his throat from ear to ear? >> i can't imagine slitting any one's throat. >> if i was going to ever try to kill obama i would use gloves. i've got plenty of them. >> she listened to his voice mail for 16 minutes after the killing. apparently that is how she knew he was going off to mexico with another woman. >> is it your belief that she would have con fided in you you with certain things? >> yes. >> she con fided about the relationship? >> yes.

>> but never con fided that she killed him, did she? >> no. >> i don't have anything else. >> greta: june 24, 2008, travis alexander murdered in his arizona home and now you more than four years later his ex-girlfriend jodi arias stands trial for his murder. let's take a look at how the case has unfolded in the arizona courtroom. >> this is not a case of whodunnit. the person who done it, who committed the killing sits in court today. the defendant jodi ann arias and the person that she done it do was an individual by the name of travis victor alexander a former boyfriend of hers. an individual that she was in love with. an individual that was a good man. an individual that was one of the greatest blessings in her life. and this love, well, she rewarded that love for travis victor alexander by sticking a knife in his chest.

and he was a good man according to her and with regard to being a good man, well, she slit his throat as a reward for being a good man. and in terms of these blessings, well, she knocked the blessings out of him by putting a bull le bullet in hid during one event that occurred on june 4 of 2008. >> jodi arias killed travis alexander. there is no question about it. the million dollars question he is what would have forced her to do it? and throughout this trial you will hear that jodi was, indeed, forced. in just under two minutes we go from the last picture taken of travis in the shower in just under two minutes to the picture of travis' body. you can see the foot in the

front with his head and his shoulders and blood clearly on his shoulders. in just those two minutes jodi had to make a choice. she would either live or she would die. >> she is a snoop. just couldn't help herself. and when she did it she went and looked into, got ahold of mr. alexander's phone, his cellular telephone and she wanted to see what was in there. couldn't stop herself from it doing that and so she goes and looks at his cell phone in june of 2007 and she is looking for things to see whether or not there is going be any contact with any other women and describes them as being flirtatious and wanted to know what was going on and wanted to see if there was anything in the cell phone that would confirm her suspicions about his flirtations. and she found things there that she didn't like. and but it was her going into

snoopingphone 123-4507 surreptitiously without his knowledge because she wanted to know, just couldn't help herself. so she looks looks in there and finds things that she doesn't like and at that point they break up. that is june 29 of 2007. >> jodi did not always tell the truth about what happened that night. she was scared. scared about what had happened. and scared about what she had done. she had absolutely no experience with police interrogation before and so when they talked to her she wasn't always truthful. her panic about what had happened led her to tell different stories. but you will learn that what she said, those stories were not the truth. >> where are did you go once

you were inside? >> once we went inside we went directly to the stairs, took the stairs up to the top and there is a set of double doors at the stop of the stairs to the left which is the entrance to the master bedroom suite and we went in through the open door in there and the personnel went in to find the body. >> and did you actually see the fire department work on this individual or not? >> they he didn't work on him, no. >> they looked at him and -- >> visually inspected him and were able to dehe clare h him deceased at that point. >> what were you able to see? >> as far as the body? >> yes, sir. >> it appeared to me that he had been deceased in that position for quite some time. >> anything unusual about the body that called your attention to it? >> other than the neck wound, he had appeared to be dried blood on his neck, appeared to be a neck wound from ear to ear. his face was dark purple, almost black, the rest of his

body was a very pale white and he was kind of crammed in the bottom of the shower seattle stall. >> are you familiar with the term defensive wounds? >> yes. >> define that for me, please. >> if you have injuries to the backs of the forearms or palms or backs of the hand you can have gun shot wounds in those locations or in the case of an assault with a knife or edged weapon you can have cuts or injuries to the backs of the palms or backs of the forearm and it is consistent with someone trying to either grab the knife or fend off you wounds or fend off injury. >> and the way you divide it by necessity the person would have to be conscious and alive, correct? >> yes. i felt that the gunshot wound may have been last but in any event the gunshot wounds and wounds to the next would have had to have come after the defensive wounds of the hands. >> the second we woke up we

were kissing. >> anything about her demeanor that indicated to you that she was upset about anything at that point? >> not at all. >> in terms of that date, did you form an opinion based on your contact with her and being around her as to her strength and how fit she was? >> she is very fit. she was in good shape. >> and in terms of her strength, did you form an opinion based on that night? >> we were instant messaging back and forth. at some point i complimented her on being very feisty and was kind of referring to she is a lot stronger than she looks. >> there is no reason for it. there is no reason why. there is no reason i would ever want to hurt him. >> there is no way anybody else snssments. >> he never raped me. never -- >> there is no way any one else

could have left your palm print in blood on that wall. no way. get that through your. >> fy was ever going to try to kill somebody, i would use gloves, i've got plenty of them. i didn't kill travis. i didn't. i did not take his life. >> did you have anything to do with the death of travis? >> not -- i don't think i had anything directly to do with it but i feel responsible some what for it. >> detective. the jurors have some questions for you. there were any sets of knives that appeared to be missing a knife? >> no. we didn't find anything like that. >> was the gun that was used to kill mr. alexander found in ms. arias' possession? >> no, it was not. >> when you personally interviewed mr. alexander's roommates was there ever a mention of their concern for

his extended absence june 4 through june 9? >> no. they believed he was in mexico already. they didn't know his schedule. >> what were the alibis given by those roommates? >> one was working and the other was actually staying at his girlfriend's home and they were house sitting for her parents. >> i actually moved to mesa a few weeks after we broke up. >> really? >> i mean as far as the timeline goes. but i mean if you want to call it our official breakup. shortly thereafter it is like we were still seeing each other. >> seeing each other but it was a long distance type relationship. >> it was always long distance when we were officially dating. we dated from about the beginning of february to about the end of june so february, march, april, may, june, about five months total. >> in june of 2007 you guys broke up and --

>> june 29. >> and you moved to mesa. >> moved to mesa. >> most people when they break up kind of go their own way. >> plans were already in order for me to move there. i was already speaking with a friend who was, you know, i was going to be her roommate and i was a roommate for a short period of time. >> i know all of the details of this case. what i don't know is why? why did you choose to go visit travis that day and why did you do what you did? >> i never hurt travis. >> you did. you hurt him. that is why we are here. that is why we are here because i needed to talk to you about this. i can just arrest you and throw you in jail but i want to know why. why did you do this to him?

>> i wouldn't hurt travis. he has done so much for me. >> there is so much evidence in that house. so much. and it all points to you. we have your blood on the scene. your hair with blood at the scene. your left palm print at the scene in blood. >> greta: after nine days the prosecution resting its case. the defense case begins january 29th. and straight ahead, sex photos, stab wounds a gunshot wound and a slit throat. the jury sees gruesome crime scene photos as the medical examiner describes the brutal murder. dr. michael wade season here to talk about that -- dr. michael baden is here to talk about that next. and jodi arias what did she tell police during the interrogation and what will the tapes tell the jury. you will see the police tapes yourself and then hear fromarch detective mar mark fuhrman.

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>> greta: tonight we are taking you inside the evidence in the jodi arias trial from racy sex photos to gruesome crime scene photos, prosecutors trying to show the i have us innes the vf alexander's murder. the medical examiner telling the jury how he thinks the stabbing, shooting and throat slitting played out. >> i thought that the gunshot wound may have been last but in any event the gunshot wounds and the wounds to the neck would have had to have come after the defensive wounds of the hands. >> and if that was -- s that what you told us today? >> yes. >> greta: dr. michael baden joins us.

good evening, sir. >> good evening, greta. >> greta: in looking at the autopsy report and listening to the medical examiner he said the gun shot wound may have been last. any way to say that with certainty, number one. number two, was the fatal wound, the knife wound to the jugular? >> there is no way to say from the autopsy alone which came first and which came second. the fatal wound was really the cut wound of the carotid artery next to the jugular. that is what spurts blood diffusely because it is so close to the skin and under such high pressure. >> greta: would you expect that his killer would have had wounds himself or herself? >> well, i would think in my experience in a situation like this the perpetrator are want to be grabbed by the victim, he is stronger, he is

bigger and if she comes after him with a knife he could grab her, grab the arm, grab the knife. so in my -- and in my experience usually the shooting comes first. she shoots him in the head from a distance and the autopsy shows that the muzzle of the gun was more than an arm's distance away at the time of discharge. that bullet wound stuns him, makes a concussion of the brain and she could come up close, stab him and he could still try to hold his hands up in defense and he has multiple defense woundsers cuts on the hands which indicates he tried to protect himself unsuccessfully. >> it says that there is no exit wound so and so what was the direction or where did the gunshot wound enter and obviously it didn't exit. >> the gunshot wound entered from above the right eyebrow

and went down to the left cheek. in the autopsy report the description is that it did not hit the brain. it went right next to the brain. could cause a concussion that way. and it went into the cheek and what is interesting, greta, is that even though the gun hasn't been found the bullet that was removed at the autopsy from the cheek could be matched with other bullets previously fired from the suspect weapon, the grandfather's house and if the police are able to get target samples of when that handgun was fired in the past they could match them up and determine the gun that was used even though the gun has been disposed of. >> greta: what do you make of the fact on the front page of the medical examiner's report it says that the gunshot that we were just speaking of is from an indetermineate range? usually it is my experience there has been some estimate or there is an indication around the gunshot wound as to

distance. and so what does that mean that they can't determine it? >> indetermineiate means he couldn't determine it but in fact -- >> greta: what does that tell you is what he should say? >> tells me that the muzzle of the weapon is more than two feet away from the skin at the time of discharge. because if the muzzle of the gun was two feet or closer it would leave particles on the skin and then expanding cone like fashion that could tell you if it is a contact or a few inches away. it means it is more than two feet away. we can't tell if it's two feet or ten feet away. indiindetermineate but it is na defense wound. >> he is about 5'9". >> right. >> greta: and you have two weapons here, a knife and a gun. whoever did this and, of course, the woman arias is on trial for this, you have to

assume you are not ambidextrous. there is a time lag there. >> right. what would happen first is the gunshot wound would be made and then the knife picked up and the victim attacked when is not able to properly defend himself other than just hold his hands up which become our cut because he was much stronger than she was. usually if it is the last gun shot wound, that is a contact wound up against the skull and brain to make sure that that person is not going to get up again. >> greta: in the schemeatic in the autopsy report it shows a series of knife wounds of various dimensions. what i thought was interesting the wounds are are all over the front and you have some in the back, some on the legs and the hands and you you have got, of course, this gun shot. it was like if the single knife to the artery was fatal, the

gunshot wouldn't have been. whoever was there was very busy for a significant amount of time, perhapses a minute. >> yes, at least that. and tells you something that this isn't just a casual strange coming in to rob him or whatever. you get this type of overkill when there is a relationship between e two people. they know each other. around one of them s really ticked off at the other. casual stranges being caught in the middle of a robbery or something will just shoot you you or stab you long enough so that you will be dead. they don't keep stabbing you after you are dead as happened here. >> greta: in terms of trying to determine what came first the chicken report the egg, the gunshot or the knife shot, i thought it interesting in the schemeatic of the wounds on the hands there are not a lot of defensive wounds on the hands. i would have expected more defensive wounds than that which means that i think he died rather quickly rather than

put up a fight. >> i agree with you and it also indicates he wasn't in a position to hold off the knife and that is the reason that he shot first. if he -- that he is shot first. if he isn't shot first he should be able to at arm's length to be able to put up more of a resistance. >> greta: dr. baden as always, thank you, sir. >> thank you, greta. >> greta: coming up, sex, lies and video. jodi arias caught on camera changing her storely about what happened the day her ex-boyfriend was murdered in his shower. you will see her interrogation recordings and detective mark fuhrman will be here. he is is next. and will the defense team put jodi arias on the witness stand? our world famous legal panel is here, coming up. hrimp. [ male announcer ] it's red lobster's 30 shrimp! for $11.99 pair any two shrimp selections on one plate! like mango jalapeño shrimp shrimp.

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>> greta: jodi arias own words blow a hole in the defense. see changed the story about the day of the murder three times. prosecutors now trying to convince the jury she is in addition to being a murderer a serial liar and they are using videotapes of her police interrogation to do it. >> telling me about two people coming in and taking care of him and letting you go is so far fetched i can't believe it. why would they could dog leashes this? do this? what were they arguing about. what did they say? the details. >> they didn't say a lot. they were white americans from what i could tell. they had what do you you call those things like beanies that cover your whole face. a mask over your nyes. one was black.

i think they were both black or even dark are blue or something. >> greta: former lapd detective mark fuhrman joins us. good evening, mark. >> good evening, greta. >> greta: in preparing to interrogate or interview a prospective defendant in a homicide case, what do you do? >> certainry you can't bluff or can't present anything that you can't produce that evidence because then the suspect knows how much you don't know instead of how much you do know. this interrogator detective flores, i believe, he was very good at bringing the suspect along from the phone not committing to anything, letting her commit herself. destroying her story little by little instead of dumping on her and then just like this video of interrogation brought her to a point where she he gave up the ghost. i'm there and i believe you know i'm there.

i believe your evidence and now this would have been the perfect time to say it was self-dehe fence, not after i got an attorney and i know he i'm going to get arrested. >> greta: i guess that is what most people don't realize. often times not so much what you say during an interrogation as a suspect but what you don't say. as you say it would have been a good time to say the self-defense. that apparently is coming later but it is what you don't say that sometimes can be particularly damning. let me ask you about the autopsy report. your thoughts about sort of how to homicide occurred, what went first? >> well, i listened to dr. baden and we have talked about this and, of course, you know i have thought about this, i agree with dr. baden completely. i agree the gunshot came first while the victim was in the shower not paying attention. didn't even see the suspect. gunshot, he was some what

incapacityiated. the stab wounds started. he puts up some kind of defense, maybe just from the pain, that is why we don't see really great dehe fence wounds from him because he is much bigger and much stronger and then obviously at the end he s not dying quick enough so you have the slice of the throat and the carotid artery which now he succumbed to the wounds. >> greta: let's say i shot him first and he didn't die, i probably would have shot him again. i probably wouldn't switch weapons. when you switch weapons you got to put something down and if he is not dead he is going to come at you whether it is a gunshot or are a knife. i'm sort of curious is there more to the story. she told three inconsistent defenses so to me it is highly suspect, i haven't heard the evidence but highly suspect she is the guilty party. i wonder if there was somebody else there.

i just don't see the switch of weapons thing. >> greta, it is really smart that you picked up on that, really sharp. because in her story she says when the two people came in they tried to shoot her but the gun didn't go off. there is the answer to the question. the is second time she tried to fire the gun did not go off and that is where she got the part of the store relationship for the two intruders that came in. she went to the other weapon because the gun didn't go off. >> greta: but she he would have to have it with her. most people that go to a murder go with one weapon. they he don't have a second weapon in their hip pocket. maybe it's possible. >> and dr. baden touched on this. this is a rage killing. this is i'm going to embarrass the victim. my focus on this is to show everybody and show my isself just how mad i am at him.

she brought both weapons and also left with both weapons. is fairly interesting right all into itself. she was going to do this regardless of what the gun did. she was going to hug humiliate. you see this in a lot of relationships where it is homois sexual or not you see it in the relationship where one person is going to kill the other person. it is embarrassment and rage. >> greta: the jury are may get a little more information if she decides to take the witness stand. i'm sure she won't fill in all of the blanks but i'm sure an effective cross examination will. nice to see you. >> thank you. >> greta: what is life like for jodi arias sitting behind bars awaiting her fate? we will take you inside the cell at a maximum security prison and you will see for yourself. that's next. >> and our amazing world reknowned legal panel is here. what do they think of the prosecution case? what is the state's most

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sign up for your free trial today at constantcontact.com/try. >> greta: you have seen jodi arias in the courtroom. now, a rare look at accused killer behind bars. troy hayden getth exclusive access to arias inside a maximum security phoenix prison. >> what does that look like to you? >> like jodi. >> for the past couple of weeks this is how we heard about jodi arias. >> you know who that is? >> that looks like jodi. >> the prosecutors working as hard as they can to send her to death row but tonight we hear about jodi in a different way. and it happens here. her home for now. the maximum security tower in phoenix. i was given exclusive access to the unit and i met jodi. >> how are you feeling? we spoke together for some time. >> going the way you thought it was going to go. >> because of the impending case and advice of attorneys

she he didn't want to appear on camryn agreed and i promised not to reveal some of the things i talked about but i also told her i would show viewers how she is leving. >> this is jodi's room here. her cell. a small cell. a little tiny window up at the top. three bunks. only two of them are occupied. this is jo jodi's in middle anr roommate right here. and lotions and a toilet and a basin. she s lock down in her with her cell mate from 0:00 p.m. at night until 6:00 in the morning. >> something interesting happened. all of the pod mates held up hand written notes and said free jodi. is i soon learned that the troubled women were circling their wagon around a friend. >> she comes in here with a smile on her face but first base who knows her like i would knows that she is hurting

inside but she can't show it to us because if she comes in her hurting we will all be he what is wrong and then she has to talk about it. if i was on trial tore two weeks i wouldn't want to talk about it. i would put on a fake smile and make everybody feel that she is perfectly fine. >> she is beg kept in one of the higher security units here where detention officers can keep a close watch on her. >> she may feel she has nothing to lose so we keep an eye on all of them. >> jodi told me one of the ways she occupies herself in jail is with her art. she showed me some of her drawings and paintings. landscapes, portraits. many some of the mostcy individual were of jody heavy self-and created inside the concrete walls by those who say she they know her best. >> she has the biggest heart in the world and a lot of people don't think it. she has an incredible heart. >> she really needs your guys prayers right now. an amazing person all around and would do anything to help

any of us girls in here and we all love her very much. >> the rollicks be reversed he could be the one on trial tore her you know what i mean. it could be reversed and people don't even think about that and think about the fact that she he is hear here by protecting heavyself. >> and that is an argument that jodi is betting her life on. >> tray hayden joins us. troy, i'm curious, i have been reading stories about possible witnesses for the defense. one is a woman named lisa andrews an ex-girlfriend of the decedent and apparently there is an e-mail involved. do you know he anything as to why she would be called? >> i do know there are a couple of ex-girlfriends on the witness list and i think what they will try to say is he was seeing multiple women at the same time and may back up abuse or emotional abuse. one of the most interesting witnesses is matt mccartney who is jodi's eck boyfriend for some two years and he claims in

a blog that he saw jodi with a broken finger and marks on her neck that she said that she got from travis. we'll see if he takes the stand. >> she better hope the marks weren't the day after the murder they were seen. it would look like she was engaged in a fight. the whole business about calling the ex-girlfriends and lisa anders thinks the defendant sent her an e-mail in which she gets called a shameless whore and seems that the witnesses supply a motive to kill that jodi would be jealous of the ex-girlfriends. >> i talked to a man named dr. hyatt, a plastic is surgeon in mesa, arizona and i asked him, how come we didn't hear from travis' friends because right after the killings they all suspected jodi. the woman lisa you are talking about apparently had her tires

slashed by jodi arias or they all suspected that and that is when the e-mails came out. i don't know what she will say that will help the defense, i will be honest with you. >> looks more like jodi abusess the decedent abuses jodi. >> we will have to see. the prosecution has done a really good job in that case. i sit in there every day and we saw the horrible pictures of travis' body. one of the most violent murders i have covered here this town and there is really no other suspects out there and she is admiting that she did this and they have a big hill to climb, the defense does. >> greta: sometimes you get so much evidence it is almost impossible not to do a good job and sometimes the defendant makes such a mess of things that it makes it quite easy for you. troy, stay with us for a second because we will now bring in the legal panel. in san francisco, former prosecutor michael cardoza and here in washington ted williams and bernie grimm. first troy, he knows this case

better than anybody else. >> troy, i want to get an idea from you when the pictures is are shown is there any reaction from the jury? >> they have been stone faced throughout the entire trial. the only two times i saw you reaction number one when they showed travis before body. i don't want to be too graphic but you know pacman with his open mouth his neck was gaping open like that. they were disturbed by that. and really pornographic photos of jodi. >> everything i see and hear or have looked at in the case this woman is crazy as we say in lake charles laz as a jay bird. my question simply is why didn't they go after the insanity defense this this case or i think they would have had a better chance of proving insanity than anything else in

this case. i don't know about that. but i looked this woman in the face and i didn't know what to expect when i met her. going to be a monster or something that i could say absolutely i could tell this woman murdered somebody. the way she portrayed herself is very, very normal. the bottom line is this, this all starts a week before the murder when she says that a gun was stolen from her grandfather's house, a .25 caliber gun that ended up killing travis is she thought about it for a week. >> greta: i don't know what the the precise standard is in arizona. usually you can't understand the wrongfulness and if she was clever enough to have the three different defenses sounds like she knew better to try tropical storm isaac protect herself. >> but was she crazy at the time she committed the offenses. fatal attraction. >> the acts were so deliberate she is reflecting on what she did and therefore at the time she knew right from wrong.

>> therefore she did premeditate. >> greta: michael want to get in on this? >> i do, try. how many women are sitting on the jury and when they play the tapes how do the women react to what she says on the tape to the detective? >> the tapes i have got to say i look over every couple of minutes and no reaction whatsoever. definitely is a female minority on the jury. there is somele alternates sitting up there we don't know who exactly it going to be. fewer women than men for sure. >> how are the men reacting? >> during the tapes? like i said. >> yes. >> these are are mostly older people. i would say 50, 50 plus and taking their job very he seriously. they don't even look in our direction at all when they he walk in. they sit down and have been stone faced except for the two insurance stances i mentioned. >> greta: troy, we do take exception with the older people that are 50. anyway, besides that, other than that. >> sorry about that.

>> greta: can you think of why the defense would be calling the ex-girlfriend being apparently terrorized by the defendant. >> calling somebody a whore or calling the other girlfriend is not a defense. it is an admission. >> greta: that was supposedly what jodi called her and if anything else if she is so angry at the ex-girlfriend looks like a fatal attraction and looks like a motive and almost looks like the defense is using the ex-girlfriends to supply a motive for their own client. >> i meant to say that she had said it. that is the reason why she killed the person but a motive is not aa defense. you don't get akuwaited if you say these people are sort of trashy. >> greta: much more ahead. the burning question, will and should jodi arias testify in her own defense? that's next. ♪ [ male announcer ] shift the balance of power

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noy is going convict me. >> why not. >> go because i'm innocent. you can mark my words on that one. no jury will convict me. >> greta: will jodi arias take the witness stand? would our legal panel put her on the witness stand. she is on her own witness list. any kind of behind the scenes discussion about whether or not she will take the witness stand on her own behalf. >> my percent aral feeling is as a guy sitting there watching it how else can she say i was abused and who escaped is going to testify to that besides her? if she can portray persel hersn front of the jury the way she portrayed herself in front of me. >> greta: ted? >> i would try to keep her as far from the witness chair as i

could. when you look at the jailhouse interviews i believe she feels that she can manipulate a jury into a not guilty plea. >> greta: doesn't every defendant think that one. michael? >> i have got to tell you the only chance that she has in this trial is to take that witness stand. if she doesn't, i can guarantee you a guilty verdict. and i think the defense attorneys in this case clearly understand they will not get a not guilty verdict. they are hoping for a hung jury or a lesser included. and if she is even half as charismatic as she has been in the television interviews that i have seen and she is charismatic she macon vince one or two of the jurors that she didn't do it or at least raise a reasonable doubt with them. she absolutely has to take the stand. >> greta: as a te defense lawyr even if i was the prosecutor i

would have a field day with her if she took the witness stand. >> you don't have a chance otherwise you may well do it but you may as well give up the ghost if you don't put her on. >> greta: the gun from her grandparents that apparently is missing. the fact that she doesn't have all of the defensive wounds. the fact that she told three stories and now supply the motive that she was jealous of the other girlfriends. >> problem with this type of case, it is a death case. >> the evidence. >> the problem here, it it is a death case. you can't call your chi tonight say i didn't murder him and then want to testify during the penalty phase and say i'm sorry are i said that. >> when a client testifies a thousand things have to go right, only one thing needs to go wrong. >> greta: the decision to testify is going to be hers injuries she gets to make it, not the lawyers. but do the lawyers, i mean are

they sort of hinting that they are at least opposed to it or not? >> you know, i haven't had a ton of contact with them. i think what we will have to do and see how effective a case they can put on without her. i don't know to me is it a hail mary to throw her on the stand. you guys are attorneys. i'm not sure. >> they would have to put her on saying you are damned if you do, you are damned if you don't. you have to put her on the stand as michael said and she has to explain as best she can that she was brutalized. she has got to take the stand. i don't think she should take the stand but she has to take the stand to try tex plain that. she is the only one that can put the case up before the jury. >> and think of the attorneys 30 feet away as she is saying what she is going to say. >> all of the murder cases are emotional. all you have to do is reach one or two of the jurors to hang this and that is is the only thing they can hope for. this little lady is

charismatic. she is. >> greta: you hang a jury it can be retried. >> no question. but then they come back and give you a better offer in the case. they may not retry it as a death case. >> i agree. >> and that is ma what you hope for. >> greta: aito tally agree with you on that one. gentlemen, thank you all. what is next in the jodi arias trial? are we expecting any surprises? a look' head is next. a look ahead s next. [ male announcer ] coughequence™ #8. waking the baby. [ coughs ] [ baby crying ] ♪ [ male announcer ] robitussin® liquid formula soothes your throat on contact and the active ingredient relieves your cough. robitussin®. don't suffer the coughequences™. why do more emergency workers everywhere trust duracell? duralock power preserve. locks in power for up to 10 years in storage. now...guaranteed. duracell with duralock. trusted everywhere.

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