your advice to paula deen. let us know what you thought about the show. good night from washington, d.c.. that comes our way, in an attractive, entertaining fashion. varney. i am kimberly guilfoyle. it is 5:00 in new york city, this is "the five." president obama is looking very weak as the nsa leaker edward snowden jumps from communist country to communist country. snowden made escape from hong kong to russia and is mia failing to show up for a connecting flight to cuba. it is becoming embarrassing for obama administration. >> the administration was embarrassed when he had a 29-year-old person that

contracted and leaked these documents. is the administration embarrassed that you can't track him down, cat and mouse game for the world to see? >> i think i have been clear about the actions we have taken and our assessment of failure of authorities in hong kong to act appropriately on a provisional arrest. we have known where he is believe we know where he is now and there are on-going conversations about that. beyond that, we'll have to assess as time passes. >> so where is the president in all this? here are his law professorish comments from this afternoon. >> what we know is we are following all of the appropriate legal channels and working with various other countries to make sure that rule of law is observed, and beyond i'll refer to the justice department that has been actively involved in the case. >> all right. so was that a sufficient

explanation? >> let's talk about jay carney a second. the administration is outraged this could be happening, that edward snowden could do something interpreted as illegal, maybe unethical, who knows. and president obama says we have to make sure we abide by the rule of law. the reason snowden did what he did is because you weren't abiding by the law, mr. president, you were violating the fourth amendment, going after americans without proper rule of law behind you, constitution clearly says you have to have probable cause. there's no problemabable cause. did he do something wrong? probably. did the government do something wrong? definitely. >> comes down to probably and definitely, greg. >> i am thoroughly confused by what you just said, but that's okay. >> we have an hour. >> yeah, we do. you know what, putin right now,

you have to be worried when your adversaries are so happy, when you have china laughing at you, you have russia laughing at you. putin didn't just eat our lunch, he ate obama's dog, he is dying over this. we look like fools. i want to tell you what snowden is. he reminds me of the daughter in the movie "cape fear" unhappy with her family, her home life, runs into the arms of an abusive stranger. that's what's happening now. he is in the arms of people who are taking great pleasure in our national security falling apart. what disgusts me more than anything is that although he was once seen as a hero, not so much, he is now a pawn, a pawn used by our adversaries to hurt our country. now even the right wing of america are pawns because they decided to go for that brass ring of going after obama and sacrificing moral authority of national security, just so they can get something on obama, and that is really disgusting to me.

>> what's the moral authority in national security? let me say something. talk about going to a communist country. you know something, they say the chinese probably debriefed him on everything, russia had him debriefed, there's nothing to debrief. >> there are thousands of pages missing, bob. >> there's not an intelligence community in the world doesn't understand what the nsa does. let me finish my comments. okay, go ahead. >> the secret that every country is spying on every country, doesn't mean even the communist countries don't have the details. he travels with a laptop, four hard drives. it goes back to president obama saying he would give the russians flexibility. when that got transferred to vladimir, that didn't come as flexibility, we can work together, it was good, this is an opportunity, they're weak. gives an opportunity for more power in the world and

opportunity to work with people like china and cuba against the united states. >> bob you're usually critical of that situation, china and spying. >> here's the point. first of all, what he has on his hard drive and -- you could get it all out. only question of what he compromises, maybe nsa intercept areas. that's all he's got. what he does have is moral standing on defending the fourth amendment of the constitution. i agree with eric now, i think he probably ought to come back, stand up to the thing, maybe he'll end up going to jail, but the government will be exposed for what it is, invading our privacy to the worst degree. >> and rand paul -- >> we will get to rand in a second. the right wing didn't go after president obama, they went after the nsa for doing what they're doing. it so happens under president obama the nsa expanded their reach. >> under bush. >> it started under bush, when

it became president obama's, they went from going after foreign intelligence surveillance into let's blanket cover a whole area of the country, figure out if we can find something. we don't know what they're doing with all of the information they're sitting on. >> obama said he was going to change, he wasn't going to be the guy that surveilled americans, he was going to shut this program down, wasn't for the warrantless surveillance of anyone. so that's where the hypocrisy comes in. he said he was going to change it. >> we are confusing two programs, one is p.r.i.s.m. anyone that believes p.r.i.s.m. is violation of fourth amendment is an idiot. there's no fourth amendment for foreigners. we can look at their stuff. it is called spying. if you're against spying on foreigners -- >> i am against using p.r.i.s.m. to spy on americans. >> but that hasn't happened. >> i want to get in on rand paul, bob. >> i don't care about rand paul. here is the thing.

used to be we were spying on foreigners. then when they expanded under george bush to get telephone companies to give them trunk lines to tap into, it went to all americans. >> two separate things. we can talk about the phone records thing as a lock box in which no one is able to look in, you're confusing that with p.r.i.s.m. now. >> we're going to take a momentary break on that and listen to a bit of sound here, this is rand paul on snowden. >> i do think that when history looks at this, they're going to contrast the behavior of james clapper, our national intelligence director, with edward snowden. mr. clapper lied in congress in defiance of the law in the name of security. mr. snowden told the truth in the name of privacy. for mr. snowden, if he cozies up to the russian government or any governments pursued as enemies of ours, i think that will be a real problem for him in history. >> great point. he sums it up well. >> sums it up perfectly.

i stayed in contact with ed snowden's father, lon, he pointed it out specifically from day one, talked to him countlessly, tens of times. and the issue was he feels ed was too afraid to go up the chain of command, when the top of the ladder at the nsa, james clapper, was willing to lie to congress saying no, we're not doing any of these things, when it turns out in fact he knew they were doing those things. >> that's why he chose that path. is that a good enough excuse, violating the law? >> if he broke the law, he should serve time, everyone agrees with that, no question about that. >> and i can understand why he would have a fear going up the chain of command when you have people willing to lie in front of congress, considering the obama administration has a long history of retaliating on whistleblowers, good and bad. he ruined his credibility. in the beginning, he came out, said i specifically released documents regarding civil liberties of americans. i don't have an interest in

putting countries against each other. now he's cozying up to communist countries and giving -- don't think the russians are saying you want to get out of the country, show us -- >> we're more worried than what snowden is doing. of course you're going to go to russia and cuba, so what. >> greg is waiting. better get him involved. >> this plays into what i call david and goliath theater. people root for the little guy david against goliath, this goliath, the united states, is the greatest country there ever was, we are not china or venezuela or russia, we do good things. the people that are coming after us now, the bad crowd that this guy is hanging out with, putin, they can't show it, this is happening because it is hurting us. it is not helping us. we are throwing out the idea of

good and evil and replacing it with big and little. the little guy versus the big guy. however, the little guy is scum. ecuador is a socialist pocket of idiocy. >> absolutely. you're 100% right. >> if he wants to take a stand against the government spying on americans and jumping into our privacy, doing god knows what with this information, then come back, face the music, and deal with it that way. >> his father said from the get go, said come on back, face the accusers, do it the right way. greg, no one is saying america is not great, i am saying we don't want to become like a communist china or iran, where your individual rights, first amendment, second, fourth amendment, are protected. >> we have gone over this, eric. >> let me put it this way. i agree, by the way, i don't think he is helping his

credibility going to russia and god knows going to china, nobody ought to go to china, nobody should go there. wait a second. i think he ought to come back, he ought to face the music, but i think you're going to find a ground swell of people that support him, nsa, tell us what you're really doing, then we'll worry about snowden. >> he will be the messiah to many when he comes. >> not if he stays away. let's listen to this sound, glenn greenwald and david gregory. >> to the extent you have aided and abetted snowden, even in his current movements, why shouldn't you, mr. greenwald, be accused of a crime. >> i think publicly musing about whether other journalists should be charged with aiding and abetting. the scandal that arose in washington before our stories began was about the fact that

the obama administration is trying to criminalize investigative journalism. if you want to embrace that, it means every journalist in the united states that works with their sources, receives classified information, is a criminal. >> this guy is exactly right. i don't know where gregory is coming off doing this. fact of the matter, if you want to be -- it was like the pentagon papers. if "the new york times" hadn't published them, wouldn't know what went on in that war. gregory to ask that question is a hypocrite, as far as i'm concerned. >> bolling. >> since yesterday when he said it, it is insane. glenn greenwald, like him or not, he has a right, we need more glenn greenwalds, don't need fewer, people that want to be a glenn greenwald to say hey, i am worried about this, i will get attacked by the president, attacked by the media. mainstream media, bottom line.

>> this is a pot meet kettle moment. remember when he held up that magazine, illegal in the nbc studio in washington, d.c., yet he is trying to tell this guy he's aiding and abetting someone charged with espionage. with everything going on lately, not the position to take. >> this is an example of where being an absolutist is i think a flawed place to come from. i don't think it is wise. obviously david gregory looked incredibly foolish, especially with that hair. it was a bad question. however, greenwald has never done any prak through investigative journalism about our adversaries, he doesn't have to, he can do whatever he wants, shouldn't be prosecuted, but he was published in "the guardian" most hardcore, leftwing, anti-american newspaper you will find on the planet, and i think he is out of his depth now. the more that snowden pals

around with people that hate america, the more foolish he looks. but he is right, he is a source, he is writing articles. that's what he does. i guess what i am saying, being an absolutist on either side, you're going to lose. >> well said. >> did that make sense? >> it is. you can stand on moral principle, ethical ground, he will be in troubled legal waters. more to come, surprise announcement from jim carrey, starring in the new movie kick ass 2. won't promote it, thinks it is too violent. wonder if he will give back his paycheck. producers are baffled. mr. gutfeld isn't. ♪

♪ welcome back, everybody. a huge bill on capitol hill, the senate about to vote on a massive immigration reform bill, and the two sides couldn't be more split, not talking democrats and republicans, talking about establishment gop and conservative right. listen to senator lindsey graham going all old school. >> the bill will pass, i think we're on the verge of getting 70 votes. that is my goal, has always been my goal. we're very, very close to 70 votes. >> your goal, senator, you're in a rush to give amnesty to 11 million future democrats, aren't you. then senator rand paul sums up conservatives in ten seconds. >> it will pass the senate but it is dead on arrival in the

house. the house is much closer to me, and i think they think border security has to come first before you get reform. >> we will bring it around the table. kg, what do you think, the right is split on immigration reform. >> i think it is interesting. one, shows they have to do something on this issue if they want to remain in the game, be relevant, try and win some big elections, starting with the presidential election. they have to be the party that's seen as being, you know, inclusive. but at the same time, can't alienate their base by not focusing on security. people are concerned about the border. what good is immigration bill if people come in and violate border laws. >> you particular with the rand pauls, ted cruz, secure the border. bob, where do you stand in. >> where i am, there will be a republican amendment by those two conservative guys that's going to put more border security in, it will pass, everybody will have the border security, going to the house,

they'll get some bill. obama will sign it, we will have immigration reform. >> katie pavilion lich, says the senate it will pass, house it will go to conference. >> i don't think so, i think the gang of eight has been a royal waste of time for everyone, and a lot of the issues most important haven't been addressed. you had him say vote against the bill, that's the major problem, interior enforcement, not just border security. the latest one waters down the border security and waters down the 2006 amendment. when you have john mccain saying when he was trying to get elected, build the dang fence, now willing to pass it out with less of a fence, it is disappointing. >> i hate big bills, but enough about o'reilly. anything over a certain weight is done to overwhelm you and scam you.

there's no way in hell every senator read that bill. we know that. and we start finding out things about this that are interesting. there's a paragraph in there says they can change their mind on the fence, if they find it is not feasible. >> homeland security can change their mind. >> any time they want. >> unilaterally. >> everyone wants something simple. they want a border and process. you can do that on one page. the bill should be able to be rolled up into your hand like that. it shouldn't be a thousand pages. >> you mean like health care. >> you can't lie, serve me antifreeze and tell me it is gatorade, not tell me -- by telling me it is saving money, it is going to be for every dollar of taxes paid, each immigrant is getting $2.40 in benefits. so we're going to be in the red 54 billion a year. >> bring this up quickly. in the bill, mind you, they're going to get probably 70 senators to vote for this, in the bill, 100 million to promote things like vegas baby.

1.5 billion stimulus for kids. and competitive chess player visas. loaded with crap. greg is right, read the bill. >> when you get down to it, should be one pager, it is obvious, transparent, doesn't have hidden things that are pay backs for constituents. >> establish a border on bills. a border this big and has to fit in there. >> you nonwashington people, nobody reads complete bills. all these bills, one amendment -- >> they should. >> they should. over a thousand pages. >> the amendment is 119 pages triple spaced. >> but has to have more than one page, it is going to be a lot. people don't read it, go along with what the motions are, this thing will get passed. >> why it is a waste of time, people don't read it, pass stuff they don't know about, and then try to sift back through the

bureaucracy. >> like obama care. >> americans didn't want to read a 12 page mortgage contract. even mccain said we could have solved so many problems if a mortgage was one page. >> you didn't want to read yours. you asked me and bolling. >> exactly. we have to learn to read, people. >> we have to go. anti-gun jim carrey playing a vigilante in kick ass 2. now he is moon walking the film, "the five" reacts. later, a stunt man's prayers were answered in a tense tight rope walk over the grand canyon. in case you missed it last night, we will show you his death defying walk next. ♪

♪ katie actually wrote this cover story. >> no, i didn't. i think elizabeth mine key wrote it, the managing editor. >> doesn't matter. jim carrey announced he cannot support his new flick kick ass 2 due to violent content. cites change in heart since sandy hook and others involved with the film. good for him, lucky for him, too, a genius like jim can make conscious based decisions long after such movie violence brought him great fame and wealth. it is like a star in his 40s denouncing vaccines after getting polio as a kid.

how odd his conscience bothers him when it is time to promote the picture. i think it has more to do with avoiding publicity than principles. maybe he learned the benefits of restraint. remember his anti-gun video that danced on the grave of charlton heston. it was hardly worse than kick ass 2, and soiled carrey for tens of millions forever. maybe he got it. i doubted it. to him, politics is fashion. what to wear this month. he apologized to the movie crew for his decision effects everyone, from the co-stars that make far less than he does to writers and gophers. i doubt it alleviates anger over him dissing their work, his soothed conscience pays no mortgage. >> what is going on? >> what is going on while you're doing that, look over, bob is

like beauty school dropout, looking at my compact. >> he was trying to ruin my vibe. >> exactly what i was doing. >> kg, since you're already talking. is it unfair to rag on a movie as it is coming out, a five star, then all of a sudden i hate that show. >> or you go i hate that segment. >> yeah. >> gotcha. i worked on movies in a variety of different roles. one of those roles -- anyway, i know what it is like, i have done everything from having a speaking role to being what you call a gopher or to being an extra. it is not fair. what he does has direct economic impact on the film, people that rely on this for their well-being, financial livelihood. but this is just more of him trying to get attention on

twitter, being ridiculous and reckless. the guy has no center, he is all over the place. >> bob, what do you think, product of a guy that moves in and out of political issues because he has nothing else to do? >> i think it is probably going to be a dog of a movie, he is trying to lower expectations. listen, fact of the matter, if he is impacting other people's welfare, as long as there's not a lot of violent movies out all the time, you kidding yourselves, just because he did a violent movie, there will be another one. i think the problem is he knows it is a dog of a movie, wants to get out from under it. >> there's no buzz, no buzz about that movie before he decided to do this. now all of a sudden people put him on tv, saying what's that movie going to be about. i agree. i think he is helping the people that worked on the film, maybe he made the film a little relevant. >> i think he should take the money he pays armed body guards at his home, pay the people that don't make as much, pay the

people he is ruining this movie for. on the hypocrisy, aurora happened before the movie, columbine before the movie, chicago, every day, where was he then, why is it now. >> never about the handgun crime, is it. >> never about the handgun crime in cities with gun control. >> he is very worried about greg gutfeld. >> he has body guards for what? >> he apparently thinks -- he pays armed body guards to sit outside his house. >> can we talk about madonna? she was on good morning america, talked to her about guns. check it out. >> that choreography drew criticism with the actress who relied heavily on guns. >> did you ever think about not using that. >> that's like asking people not to have guns in action movies,

guns don't kill people, people kill people. >> several movies delayed releases because of shooting at sandy hook. >> that's not going to change the situation. it all comes from fear and ignorance and people not really raising their children and paying attention to what's going on. >> eric, she echoed the nra like slogan. guns don't kill, channeling her inner conservative. >> good stuff, madonna. >> in the tank, madonna. you have to cozy up to the right wingers. >> i don't know if that's what she meant. it is like out of fear and ignorance. i think she was throwing words together. >> she made perfect sense to me. amen, madonna, your career is so much better than lady gaga. >> i don't know who lady gaga is, but apparently she's somebody big. who cares. >> you met her.

>> you met her in the green room, bob. >> never heard this story before, have you? >> justin beiber, lady gaga, rihanna. >> this is falling apart before our eyes. coming up, the high-wire act i could have easily done myself if i had the right shoes, but it was sunday and i rest. where is nik wallenda, will he continue to wear tacky jeans to work? ♪ 

♪ well, he's done it again.

dare devil nik wallenda walked the tight rope without a harness and with a lot of prayer. >> thank you, lord. wow. that's a long way down. >> yeah, it is. take your time, man. >> i am. >> so what did his family think about the stunt? >> it's amazing watching him do this because no one else ever even thinks of doing this. >> that's for sure. nik is already planning his next one, he is hoping to walk between the chrysler and empire state building here in new york city.

what do you think? i get nervous just watching him. >> not sure what i think. i have an idea. instead of chrysler and empire state, walk between the new freedom tower and statue of liberty, figure it out engineering wise, let him do that, it would be great. >> great idea. >> yeah, the wind, i am scared of the wind, too. terrible on the hair. >> are you scared when you go outside and the wind comes? >> can i be the only person that says i don't like this? >> why? >> because everybody loves this. i find it to be a weird way to deliver a pole to somebody who lives on a cliff. there are easier ways to do it. i hate dare devils. >> look at bob's face. >> can i say something grim. that saturday, a woman died in a stunt airplane crash in ohio. two people died. nobody focused on that. what you do is focus on this. dare devils are tempting fate and we applaud that, and he's

praying. meanwhile, there are plenty of people that aren't tempting fate that are dying every day. i find dare devilling -- but i did love watching it. i loved watching it. >> discovery channel probably had amazing ratings. all the way across, he is like praise god, thank you, jesus, praise god, thank you jesus. no atheists in fox holes 50 feet above the grand canyon. maybe he was trying to deliver the message, i hope he was, did a great job doing it. by the way, i said that, the haters came out. greg, i can't tell you how many people hated me for tweeting what i just said. >> bigger and better things now, like people dying here, and starvation. you're a dare devil, tempting fate, i think you can handle that. >> i love it. i love that this is a family affair. his mom made his shoes. look at that. >> what if he fell in front of

them. no family affair. >> they have had family die before. >> you guys been to the grand canyon, that indian tribe put a complete plastic thing over the canyon. all glass, whatever it is. you walk out there, looking straight down. the walls are glass, too. i got out about one foot and i threw up. >> that's amazing. >> that would have been great. >> not good for the glass. >> get your money back. >> i would never do something like this. dana tweeted andrea and i could walk this tight rope in our heels. not on a windy day. i am too respectful about life and seeing too many people die. >> i think your chance is just as high as getting in the car, driving to work. >> walking across the grand canyon? >> yeah, he's a trained professional. >> anyway, did you see what was on after this? naked and afraid, a new survival show where people went out in

the woods completely naked. strangers! >> strangers! not wearing clothes. >> you're the cameraman, they have to keep what do you call it. digitize everything. thank god for that. >> shouldn't you have been doing something else instead of watching that. >> did they all get survived? >> it was only two people for 21 days. >> right here on "the five," the supreme court issues an important ruling on affirmative action, but are race based admission programs necessary in 2013? that's next on "the five." ♪

we all remember the great martin luther king i have a dream speech in august of 1963. what a lot of people don't know, he delivered the first dream speech two months prior in front of a huge crowd in detroit at the great march to freedom, my dad was there.

marked 50 years since that day. here is dr. king. >> i have a dream that one day right down in georgia and mississippi and alabama the sons of former slaves and the sons of former slave owners will be able to live together as brothers. i have a dream this afternoon. >> god, it makes me -- the greatest man i think walked the face of the earth, next to jesus christ. greg, do you think 50 years later now there's the need for some affirmative action? >> it is interesting. i was looking at that. you think about detroit, and what has happened in the last 40, 50 years with detroit. the civil rights movement for 2013, president obama has an obligation to preach that determination beats dependency. he has the bully pulpit and he is not using it as efficiently as he could. should talk about achievement and success the best ladder to

climb, not dependency. i wish he could do more, that's all. >> katie, do you think there's any place where affirmative action is necessary any more? >> the supreme court bumped it back to the lower court, so they clearly think the lower court has more explaining to do and has to be hashed out more. i think we have seen it has been used a little against whites now. i know a bunch of people getting into college were discriminated against, despite their character, despite good grades, despite sat scores, didn't get into skols that colleagues got in with lesser scores. i think whether it is being used properly as intended is what needs to be looked at. >> for 400 people kept these people enslaved in chains. making up for it a few white people not getting into school. >> making up for it by their skin color. >> making sure they have equal opportunity. >> at what point, bob, is it okay to hurt other kids that worked really hard and deserve

to get into good schools, too. and i qualified for affirmative action. i didn't need it. >> that's under the hot clause. >> do i think should whites be allowed into college to make room for a black kid, that's unfair. on the other hand, you have institutions that for hundreds of years denied blacks entrance, at some point you have to make decisions, that decision ought to weigh somewhat on their admittance. >> the president is asking the americans, attorney general asking americans, former secretary of state is african-american, we all achieved as human beings in the united states the highest levels of office. i don't think it is fair or just to judge people on the admission table and say we need a black kid to certify, we need a hispanic girl to certify we're diverse, instead of looking at their character. >> do you believe a baby born to

a crack mother in harlem has equal chance as baby born to a white couple? >> you asked me this in the past, i said it in the past, yes. you have the equal opportunity to succeed. that's what america is, providing everyone with an equal opportunity. >> quality opportunity. >> not skewing or biassing the opportunity towards people who have certain skin color. >> if i was sure that crack baby, you don't like to hear about, that baby should be provided clothing, housing, health care until they're 18 years old. >> bob, judging by what? >> and by the way, because they're black or because they're born to crack? i'm not sure where you're going. >> white crack babies? >> we all have responsibility to care for that child until they're 18. >> what about the rest of the babies? >> take care of that, too. >> you're making my point.

if we take care of black crack babies. >> somebody pull out. >> somebody has to get the science on the crack babies. >> let's not make fun of crack babies. one more thing is up next. ♪

♪ that special time. time for one more thing. katie. >> during a routine traffic stop in south texas, we saw some monkey business. this is why people shouldn't have monkeys as pets. >> i told you. >> can you sign here? >> whoa! >> hand that to me. >> rabies shots for him. >> i told you! i had a monkey as a pet, they're the worst things in the world.

>> that's another story. greg. >> okay, saturday san diego, california, this is amazing, roll the video. spca, there were 20,000 surfing dogs, small, medium, large group dogs, 20 grand for the aspca. got to love that. president obama ordered a cdc report on gun use, came out. slate has a good piece on it, summary on it. one of the more important points, almost all national surveys indicate defensive gun use by victims are at least as common as offensive use by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from a half million to 3 million a year. that's amazing. this is incredible stuff. we should talk about it tomorrow. >> okay. >> july 1st, a new law goes into

effect, to carry firearms openly without need for a gun permit to go into effect. this is getting ridiculous, cops don't there don't like it. the idea that you don't have to have any license, nothing, carry a gun around, walking around mississippi, get drunk in the bar. >> what about that voice. >> that's not nice, bob, that was offensive. >> the hell with it. that's crazy. brought to you by the national rifle association. >> bob is a little crazy. maybe he needs something sweet now. >> the idea of doing this is just nuts. >> bob! >> bob, my one more thing, it is dedicated to you. you ruined our moment. twinkies are making a come back. >> you stole that from me. >> july 15th. bob loved these so much, he was shoving them in his mouth. >> he threw up! >> a twinkie shake. >> they're the greatest things in the world. bob! nice having you here, katie. that's it. so for some serious news, "special report" is up next.

>> what do you mean for some serious news? ♪ >> plus why did jim carrey -- and when is a wire walk over the grand canyon not a wire when it is not a wire and when it is not the grand canyon.