greta van susteren standing by live to go on the record. see you back here tomorrow night. greta, take it away. >> tonight, congressman paul ryan is here. he says the president's grand bargain is a raw deal. what about the obama administration's big push to paint real problems as phony scandals? >> this administration is the least transparent in history. they're making it very clear that what they said they don't do. they deny, they deceive, they delay. >> whether it's about the attacks in benghazi and the talking points or revelations about conduct at the irs. the attempts to turn this into a scandal have failed. >> this has to stop. this is not a scandal. this is a national security failure where four brave americans died and we're doing nothing to bring the people to justice to understand how it failed. >> all of these scandals, he calls them they're not distraction, they're real.

they detract from the reality of what happened to the country on the policies. >> fireworks over obama care because the price tag is going higher. some leading republicans pushing a new effort to fund the law entirely as we get more bad news on how much it will cost. it's hurting the people, the jobs, the 40-hour workweek. there is bipartisan agreement that this isn't working. if we can't fight it now, i think we never can. >> president obama back at it again making a rare appearance today on the hill to sell his so-called grand bargain. >> it's a further left version of a widely panned plan he already -- >> why do president obama and his administration insist on sticking with the phony scandal script? congressman paul ryan joins us. nice to see you, sir. >> good to be back with you. >> phony scandal. even today press secretary jay

carney sort of downplaying this. is it a phony scandal? >> this is arrogance of power. they're in campaign mode. they're ignoring this. you need to have trust in the government for the government to work effectively. when our government knowingly targets people based upon political beliefs to the tax code, when our government misleads the country about a terrorist attack, that erodes trust. then when our commander in chief said this is phony, there's no reason to be concerned about this, there's nothing to see here, that's just arrogance. and so i think the president's basically trying to change the subject. it's not going well for him. obama care is a train wreck. this is the worst economy since world war ii. stagnant jobs and wages. the real scandals eroding trust in the government, i think he's basically trying to change the subject. >> i don't get it. in early may when it broke about the irs, he said this is very serious and he had empathy, he seemed to understand that the americans get scared when they're targeted. all of a sudden something

happened and the switch was flipped and all of a sudden demeaned these people who had problems, who believed they were wronged. had horrible audits, had all these questions. almost like -- had no idea why they were being targeted. now he dee means them. what's the strategy to change the subject? >> i think to change the subject. there's two political appoint ease, the head judicial official, the legal counsel. these orders came from the legal counsel. we already know that. that's who oversaw this targeting. one of the two political appointees that the president puts at the irs. i could go on and on about this. i'm part of this investigation. but the administration is not being as forthcoming as they need to be with the documents requested. we're going to get to the bottom of this, we'll see it through. we'll be methodical about it. but you can't suggest that this is phony when we already know and have on record that they targeted people based upon their

political beliefs. this is why we're having a vote in two days. the irs get out of obama care because we simply don't trust this agency with not only our tax -- with what they're doing with tax information but with personal health information. so this is an erosion of trust and the president does not serve himself well. if i were advising the president, i would say get to the bottom of things quickly. hold people accountable and then restore trust in your administration and in the government. >> what do you achieve by the votes? you can vote until you're blue in the face and then it goes to the senate. you have two different parties running two different parts of the government. >> we're chipping away at this law. he's already signed seven different bills chipping away at this law. >> he has, president obama has? >> president obama has. these votes matter. we're already getting democrats to vote with us on many of these things. we had 35 democrats on the employer mandate, we're getting democrats to come along and agree with us. we're seeing a crack in the

foundation because we're making people in congress make a decision. you want the irs overseeing health care or do you want the irs out of it? do you want this rationing board on medicare or not? do you want the medical device tax, the individual mandate? we think this is app effective strategy and our ultimate goal in getting rid of obama care. >> what democrats on capitol hill, when they hear the president say that the scandals are phony, do they roll their eyes or are they solidly behind the president on that? >> they're pretty quiet, actually. especially the democrats involved in the investigations that know what's going on. i don't think they're going to call them phony scandals. i think they're walking away from that label. >> congressman, let's talk about obama care. you just mentioned it and the new congressional budget office reports showing the one-year dee leif the employer mandate will cost $12 billion. is that true? >> it's because of fees. it will cost $12 billion according to the congressional office because of fees. here's what they don't quantify that we need more information on. now that we don't know how to

verify -- now that the obama administration is saying we'll let people self-attest to their eligibility for obama care subsidi subsidies. >> is that like the honor system in grade school. that worked real well. >> self-attestation. >> i know exactly what that is. >> you're eligible and you'll get these subsidies. think of the fraud and confusion that follows from this. this is why we think we have a good case for delay. this is why some democrats are starting to agree with us on delay and we'll make a case all year long to pull apart this bill and delay this bill. think of the kind of fraud that will follow when you only delay the employer mandate and not all the -- >> i mean, why delay the employer and not the individual? what's sort of the reasoning behind that? i think that's not fair. >> remember this line. if you like what you have, you can keep it. we're about to witness as many as ten of millions of people

losing health insurance in 2014. >> because of the mandate? >> because of what it would do to employers. it was going to encourage employers to dump them on to the government program. >> how is it going to get better in a year from now? >> it won't. >> the whole point -- you would think they'd get rid of it totally if that's the problem. just putting off for a year raises the sinister question. >> i believe that's the case. i believe this was done for political reasons. >> just because it's midterm elections? >> i believe that's the case. >> we also think we have a better case to make delaying the other law. that's the case we'll prosecute. >> i'm suspicious that it was done on july 2nd before the fourth of july weekend to minimize the impact in the media. more importantly, a lot of decisions are based on that mandate. i'm curious when they made a decision to delay the mandate for employers. because if it was back in february, it affects people's jobs. unless they made it on the first of july, if they did that, fine.

if they made it earlier, it hurts americans. >> we had a hearing in the ways and means committee, they would not answer the question when they made the decision. >> just deny it? >> they just slow walk it. say they don't know. >> could they give you an estimate? >> no. here's the other point. businesses are already making these decisions. you already know the story about the 40-hour workweek shrunk to 20-something hours. so many businesses have been making their decisions. we see a lot of businesses making these decisions. maybe not as many with the delay. but they're all getting ready to say i can't afford this. i'm not going to offer health insurance to employees. unfortunately, that's one of the biggest problems with obama care. it's a terrible disaster of a law but it's going to cause so many people to lose in what they like and have in health insurance even if this delay occurs. if you keep the individual mandate, keep the other parts of obama care, this thing is going to be a train wreck. that is why we want to prosecute the case, to dee fund and delay this law. if we can get it delayed and

point out how bad it is, we can make a stronger case for ultimately replacing it. we're making progress at the votes we're having and going to bring specifics to the country and let democrats in the house of representatives get to choose on these individual provisions whether they stand with the american people or standing with the law that's going to be a train wreck. >> i have a rub with -- the continued resolution of funds of government and the debt ceiling, continuing resolution expires the end of september and the debt ceiling we're pushing up against and in spite of that, members of congress both sides and the president all taking essentially august off instead of dealing with this right now. why not deal with the continued resolution and deal with the debt resolution and take your vacation later? >> people like me, i'll be working on this all august and the people i work with on the budget committee. september 31st is when the continuing resolution expires. we'll be ready to go on september when we come back. >> it sends a bad message. it has an appearance, even

though you're working on it. we know everybody is going. everybody is going to martha's vineyard and playing golf. the american people know the expiration date is the end of september. you do your work first and then you play. instead, we'll have a big huge crazy scene at the end of september trying to solve it. >> i don't see a crazy scene at the end of september. unfortunately, we'll have a continuing resolution. we passed a a lot of appropriation bills in the house already. i think the debt limit is where you're going to see more negotiations occurring. we're not going to give the president a blank credit card. we're going to insist on real debt reduction and economic growth policies getting to the fiscal issues. we're not going to give him a naked debt limit increase that he's asking for. simply, we've got to address the drivers of our debt. >> let me talk to you about the war on poverty. something you mentioned today. we never hear a discussion about war on poverty. i have to congratulate you talking about it. poverty is a major problem in this country for so many americans.

>> this is an issue i care a great deal about. i had a hearing on this today in the budget committee. next year is the 50th anniversary of the war on poverty. we have spent $15 trillion from the federal government fighting poverty and look at where we are. the highest poverty rates in a generation. 15% of americans in poverty. that's 46 million people. the war on poverty has been fought with all this money and time and poverty is winning. so what we're trying to ask ourselves, instead of measuring or poverty fighting efforts on inputs, on how much money we throw at programs oar how many people on programs, why don't we measure with results, outcomes. how many people are getting out of poverty relying on self-sufficiency on the ladder of life to enjoy the upward mobility that we know as the american idea. we're not measuring our efforts based on outcomes of how we improve people's lives. >> i think republicans don't care about poverty. they want to starve people and do horrible things to people. i will say that since our poverty class increased in the

last 50 years, whatever we're doing is wrong. it's not working. are you willing to make a commitment or can you make a commitment to the american people that we'll change this. we're actually going to get people out of poverty? >> why do you think we're doing the committee hearings. >> i was delighted you were. >> what we're saying is this is not working. we've got to do a better job than this. let's figure out the policies. the problem is if you try to measure compassion based on how much government you build in washington and how many programs you spend and how many people put on programs, we'll never compete with that bidding contest. by the way, it's not working. it's actually trapping people in poverty. we need to go at the root cause of poverty to break a cycle of property instead of perpetuating poverty. these are the kinds of answers we republicans in the house are going to go after to come up with better ideas for fighting poverty. this should not be a republican/democrat thing. this should be a what works thing and we'll tackle that. >> prosperity beating poverty. >> every time. the president was speaking at least today or yesterday about reform.

tax reform in tennessee. he talked about things he wants to do for corporate taxes. you call this, i guess, a raw deal. >> it's a raw deal. i think it's more crony capitalism. the president likes to pick winners and losers. he likes some businesses off the hook but won't let families and small businesses off the hook. he won't help us get the oil and gas we have in the country. he's willing to cut taxes on large corporations. i'm all for that. but not on small businesses. >> why not? why does he cut it on small business? >> you have to ask the president. 80% of businesses don't file taxes as corporations, they do it as individuals. the top individual tax rate is effectively 44.6%. a 44.6% tax rate on successful small businesses, that's where most the jobs come from and he's saying a 28% tax rate on large corporations. that's not fair. so we want fairness. when we do tax reform as we are in the house, we want fairness. we want tax rates coming down on

everybody, small businesses, families and corporations. not just corporations. >> what do you think about the way senator orrin hatch in the senate talking about get rid of all the deductions and let every member of the u.s. senate come to him with deductions that should be included in. >> i think it's great. it's exactly the process we're going through in the ways and means committee in the house as well. >> what's your expectations? >> i can speak for the house ways and means committee. we plan to roll out tax reform this fall. what that means, is get the tax rates down, broaden the tax base. the idea being it's your money in the first place, you keep it. instead of having really high tax rates with a bunch of loopholes where you send your money to washington, we switch it around in bureaucracy. if you engage in behavior that we approve of, we'll let you have money back. that's crony capitalism, making it harder for families to get by. lower everybody's tax rates across the board, create more jobs, more take-home pay.

that's what we're all about. we're going to be bringing this out in the fall. >> all right. quick question. estate taxes, what do you predict? >> everything is on the table. >> everything is? >> i'm not going into specks. we're still getting input. we're putting it together. everything is on the table. >> congressman, we want your reaction to a new poll. take a look. your favorability is 65%. senator rand paul is next with 55%. marco rubio with 50% and governor chris christie with 47%. what do you think about the results? >> i'm an irish catholic. i have a lot of relatives. they were probably part of it. i enjoyed going around the country and meeting a lot of people. my family loved it. we got to meet so many people who are passionate here about their country. i had the benefit of spending 90 days crisscrossing america fighting for the american dream. we didn't win the election. we got close. but it was a real honor.

i'm honored to have had this opportunity. >> what are your plans? let me guess. you're going to come back and say we did the tax code, the debt ceiling. seriously, long-term, what's your -- >> to be honest with you greta, i'm not thinking long-term. i'm thinking right now, where the country is today. i'm thinking of the problems we've got. they're serious. i'm thinking what can i do as a leader in the house, chairman of the budget committee to make a difference for the country for the people i represent to get people back to work and get the economyingi going. to try and reduce the arrogance. there's a lot of specific policies i can get into. but the way i see my job is to do it well and not worry about the next thing. i'm not focusing on that right now. we have a lot of work to do in the house. >> you know who i miss is senator proximate march with the golden fleece award. >> he was always at a badgers game. >> waste on fraud as well. >> absolutely. >> congressman, thank you. always nice to see you, sir.

>> you too, greta. hot button issue on greta wire.com. should the house, senate go on vacation before they handle the debt solution. vote in our poll. straight ahead, house republicans send a sizzle letter to the head of the irs. there's no question this is heating up, oversight subcommittee chair jordan is here to tell us what's happening with the irs. that's next. george zimmerman tangling with the law again. this time caught on camera all of it. the video of zimmerman coming up. plus senator rand paul, governor chris christie taking swipes at each other. there's more news about their fight tonight. we'll tell what you it is and ♪

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tonight just got worse for the irs. lawmakers blasting the acting irs chief accusing done wore fell of -- in a scathing letter to the irs, these house oversight committee leaders demanding he stop obstructing the investigation and warn him it's a crime to do that. subcommittee chairman jim jordan joins me. >> good to be with you. >> a measurement of whether there's obstruction or not, you've brought props. show me, these are the documents you've asked for and this is some of what you've gotten. >> some of what we've gotten. this is one section. >> i think the viewers need to see that you asked for these documents and they take out what you shouldn't see. >> normally, redacted is something like this. there's names and maybe key addresses. >> these are full pages all black. >> totally black. >> 13,000 pages. some information is informative. a lot is duplicate. some is redacted. >> this is nothing.

it's black pages. >> how do you get to the truth when this is the kind of information we're getting from the irs. after the president said he wanted to get to the bottom of this, this is important. we have this, we have the fbi director who couldn't tell us who is heading the investigation. how many agents assigned to the investigation. have they talked to victims' groups. on and on it goes. frankly, i always point out, remember how is started. a planted question when lois lerner was giving a speech blaming two rogue agents in cincinnati. we know that's false. it now comes to washing tond and more importantly, we know it goes to the irs chief counsel's office a political appointee. this is what we're doing. it's like, let's get to the truth. give us the information -- >> but it's even more than that. i really want the viewers to see these. these are literally black pages. that's what they're giving new terms of in answer to your request. >> the president said on may 15th. this is serious, we want to -- now he's calling it phony. in the interim, the irs is giving you a bunch of black

pages. >> we forget what's going on here. remember, these were american citizens exercising their first amendment right asking for a resolution to can't we be a tax exempt organization. these are organizations that meet -- groups that meet in the church basement, they meet in elementary schools, at the vfw hall and they're getting this kind of harassment from their government. here's the part that scares me. we think it goes broader than this. we think groups that had tax exempt status were being harassed and audited via that process. we had a group that wasn't -- most recent audit was in 1995. but they were audited in 2011 and 2012. $70,000. all kinds of documents. we think it goes farther and deeper than what we initially suspected. >> you've got in this letter, this letter that you've written the acting commissioner war fell, you said it's a crime to obstruct. you've got the documents that

are clearly basically jerking you around. you've got a president who says it's phony and a new acting director saying he's going to help a lot and get to the bottom of it. there's no indication that they give a damn. i talked to the citizens who talked. they get scared. >> katherinening will brekt. she started a group -- she had five different federal agencies visit here while her anl indication to the irs was pending. batf, epa. irs, the fbi came while she's applying, the fbi visits her true the vote headquarters twice. all this is going on and here's a lady who simply wants to have voter integrity. she wants to make sure people aren't voting from vacant lots. she's trying to make sure the election system is fair. the federal government is on

her. if that's not chilling, i don't know what it is. >> then the president makes fun of her and says it's phony. the white house press secretary says it's phony. it's just nasty. you know, it is so -- >> the fbi, i always make this point. the fbi director couldn't tell me who headed this up. after they started a criminal investigation at the justice department, but that same fbi visited katherine when she's applying for tax exempt status at the irs. if that's not chilling, i don't know what it is. that's why we got to get to the truth. how do you get to the truth when you get the black pages. >> congressman, thank you. good luck reading solid black pages. it's ridiculous. coming up, rush limbaugh is fired up who is he accusing of being president obama's best friend?

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rush limbaugh taking no prisoners in our one-on-one interview. rush taking on president obama and the mainstream media.

>> a slavish media. he can say what he wants and he won't be called on it. he can do pretty much anything he wants. i should have added in my previous answer to your question that he couldn't get away with any of this without a slavish media. the media doesn't question him. in fact, on board with his agenda and trying to help him advance it. the media has a line with obama to defeat republicans and conservatives and obama is all about that. that makes them his best friend and vice versa. >> hose of the dana show. nice to see you, dana. >> nice to be here, greta. thanks for having me back. >> dana, is rush limbaugh right about this or not? is the media slavish to the -- i think that was the term he used -- to president obama? >> absolutely. he's spot-on. that was a fantastic interview, too, last night. i think that goes to why rush is

around in the political sphere and in talk radio as long as he has. he has his finger on the pulse of everything going on in politics and the relationship between the democrats and the media. it amuses me so much because it's like an abusive relationship that this administration has with the media. a couple of months ago, the top headlines were how the department of justice were seizing the phone records of associated press reporters, they were targeting fox news employees. a number of different reporters were coming forward. the department of justice and this administration didn't like a particular story, they were targeting these members of the media. now, all of a sudden we thought for a minute maybe too hopeful that this was going to change things. but we're bag back to the same old game. >> is it that most of the media might align themselves or democratic ideology or principles or is it president obama? >> i think it's kind of both. there's a sucult of personality that the president developed with the media. he loves having the access. he has off the record meetings

with journalists twice a month. he regularly coe luds -- >> i remember my colleagues i read went to them. >> yeah. but this is a little different, though. the daily collar had a piece out showing media matters. i don't think anyone would call media matters a media entity. they would regularly meet with the white house and collude on narratives. when any other press asked about fast and furious, the white house, department of justice would defer to media matters and their pieces on fast and furious as their answer almost like they were the spokespeople. it goes a little beyond that. i know that it's typical for the white house to reach out to members of the press. they want to make themselves accessible. i totally get that. this goes above and beyond. i don't recall bush persecuting journalists, though. >> dana, let me go to another topic. let's see what rush limbaugh told us about the gop, the tea party and a missed opportunity. >> you have a national uprising

in opposition to barack obama and the republicans acted like they didn't want any part of the tea party either. the consultants and the powers that be did everything they could to diminish the tea party. if i were the republican party, i would have embraced those people, brought them into the fold, done what i could to keep them as donors, as voters. but the republican party had no desire. >> dana, your thoughts, republican party not particularly enamored with the tea party element of the party. >> unfortunately, we've been called wacko birds and hobbitho. i don't know all the words. the republicans have a majority in the house of representatives to this day and they're going to need that grassroots energy and those boots on the ground in order to have any sort of victory coming up in mid terms. i wish that we could have that unity. we have different ways of achieving the same goals. ultimately, the majority on the right have the same goals. it would be great if they could see that strategy and work with

the grassroots people. the people who put their money where their mouth is and get out there, roll up their sleeves and work. that's another abusive relationship. >> do you have a sense of the tea party movement is growing or it's just sort of on hold? where is it today as we sort of look forward to the 2014 mid terms? >> i think it kind of evolved. it evolved from people who aren't really regularly active in politics who maybe have never phone banked in their lives. who have never gone out and protested or gone door to door. we saw a lot of people doing that. we saw a lot of people running for office. we have a number of individuals who maybe wouldn't have had a shot at public office before who got there because the grassroots unified. you want to talk about a big ten. there's your big ten in the grassroots. they unified and got together and pushed people like ted cruz and rand paul and mike lee. all of the folks by the way shaking it up in the senate. so, i think it's evolved definitely. i think possibly it's gotten bigger, much to the detriment

and the disgust of the left. >> dana, thank you very much. always nice to see you. >> thanks, greta. more than ten months after terrorists murdered four of our fellow americans at benghazi, no one has been arrested or charged. today there's news that a key witness and possible suspect in the attack showed up for a tv interview. so if the media could track them down, why can't the fbi? former fbi agent jonathan -- is here. >> good evening. >> what do you think about the fact that cnn correspondent caught up with the suspect and so far the fbi has not? >> greta, lts go back to investigations 101 and think about this. first off, why in the world would an open investigation that's active would the investigators go and talk to a suspect? when i was in the fbi, i could have talked to a thousand of the suspects that we were looking at. but we knew where they were and

knew what they were doing. that's what leads an investigation. >> you know what, actually have a different experience. i've worked with the fbi as a criminal defense lawyer. they always want to talk to my client to get a statement and find out where he was, what he was doing, who he knew. they had the exact opposite. they didn't put him under surveillance and hope for the best. they went out to talk to him. >> greta, you're talking about after he's your client. i'm talking about active investigation going on. when you look at things in the criminal world, it's similar to a terrorist world as far as investigations go. they're out there working these active investigations. they have to look at the entire case. they're not lack of report trying to get a good story. they're going to actually go out and develop the leads and each piece of the pie leads to another piece the pie. >> let me tell you two problems why i'm suspicious of that viewpoint. number one, last september a man from tunisia went into custody in tunisia and the fbi supposedly wanted to talk to him

and the report was that the fbi couldn't. the tunisian government wouldn't let that happen. we went through the month of october and finally in early november senator lindsey graham, a u.s. senator, not the administration, sends a letter to the embassy here in the tunisian embassy here in the united states and lo and behold suddenly our fbi has the permission to talk to them. that's unaggressive fbi investigation with four dead murders. secondly, on october 26th, foreign policy magazine, two correspondents go back to benghazi, walking around the consulate, they find sensitive documents at the consulate that the fbi had never picked up even though the fbi had been there revealing that the day on the attack concerns arose over libyan police who were supposed to be guarding the consulate were taking pictures of the grounds from across the street. again, to my view, the fbi should have picked up those documents. i come into this discussion very sour on the fbi investigation. >> well, i understand your -- the way you're coming in on this. i have to tell you, from the

ground pounders' point of view, that's the agents on the ground. the ones doing the investigation. they look at this in a tactical unconventional way. they're trying to collect the information and move and tumly talk to these people. what you're talking about a lot of the times is policy. >> no. actually i'm not. i'm talking about actual physical documents that's evidence left unsecured from the time the fbi was there in september and the foreign policy people got there october 26th. inexcusable. no one would leave evidence behind. i don't care who you are. >> when you're talking about -- >> the second thing is interviewing this tunisian guy caught on videotape and the fbi says they won't let us talk to him and let it go. they don't pursue it? >> what i was getting ready to say, the pol sif the executives. you're not talking about the guys on the ground looking at things. the way the things are normally

pushed back and forth, it's by executives who probably don't have as much investigative experience than the guys on the ground yet they're steering the investigation when it's this large of an investigation. that could possibly be where the mistakes are happening. i think this cnn interview is really much ado about nothing. i'll tell you something that bothers me is congressmen from utah coming on and saying that and questioning what the fbi is doing and saying why can't they talk to them if cnn has? >> with all due respect, i tip my hat to the cnn correspondent who did it and i share the concern with congressman chaffetz. i know who you're speaking about. all the incidents of dropped ball. i understand what it's like to be on the ground with the fbi and deal with executives back here. i would hope the fbi would raise holy hell if the executives are telling them not to pick up evidence and not to talk to people on tape. >> greta, can i say one thing, though? >> yeah. have the last word. >> patience is a virtue when it

comes to investigation. i thank god every day that there's men and women out there doing the investigation that is i know. their hearts are in it. they're going to get to the bottom of these things. what bothers me is that we have people in congress or people in power who are going out there and basically being like conspiracy theorists and throwing this stuff out. they should meet behind closed doors. i don't mind if he has an opinion about something. meet, talk about, get it discussed and fixed. >> sir, thanks for joining us. >> you got it, greta. san diego's mayor accused of sexual harassment. wait until you hear what the mayor wants now. our famous legal panel to talk about that. in two minutes, fasten your seatbelts, george zimmerman in another brush with the law. what is he accused of now? all caught on camera. all caught on camera. yes, a gun is involved.

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stopped and questioned by cops in texas. this time, he's pulled over for speeding. get this, zimmerman telling the officer he has a gun in his glove compartment. it's caught on the dashcam. >> i'm going to go back and check you. the reason for your stop is for your speed. i want you to slow down a little bit for me. as long as you don't have any warrants, you'll get a warning. take it easy. go ahead and shut your glove compartment. the officer let zimmerman go with a warning about speeding. you heard the officer told zimmerman don't play with your firearm. what do you think, should he be carrying a gun? yes or no, go to greta wire.com. go to the poll. we're back in two minutes. when i first felt the diabetic nerve pain, of course i had no idea what it was. i felt like my feet were going to sleep. it progressed from there to burning... to like 1,000 bees

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one is suing him an the mayor battling the city council over who should pay legal bills. joining us our san francisco former prosecutor jim hammer and miami defense lawyer ted williams and bernie grimm. why does he think the legal bills should be paid by the city? >> sure because he worked for the city. he said the city never game him -- ted are you listening? sexual harassment training. gu to class. i went before. not that i was forced to go. but i went. the important thing is i don't need to go to class to know i shouldn't demean someone or grab a woman's rear end. i don't need to go to classes. as crass as i am, you don't disrespect women. >> you know, that's the thing. ted, for god sakes, i know that you've taught some of these courses. this is a perfect example of like, really? do we have to go to class because some dope is a groper? that's what happens in the organizations. one guy gropes and all the rest of us end up in class. >> no. you don't have to go to class.

look, this is a 70-year-old mayor of a city and he's trying to use this as an affirmative defense against the city. now, quite naturally, the city may very well be liable on its own if they knew or should have known of the harassment by this woman in the sex harassment case. but this is a guy that's a sexual predator, greta. >> jim, this is your state. >> well well, well. i'm northern california. southern california is a whole different deal, greta. >> what's with this mayor? really groping? really? >> i go even further. i got to say. prosecutor.ernie nosey live and it's in my dna. at some point, if you keep touching people without their permission, it's a crime. we learn it in law school. it's called battery. if he repeatedly unwantedly touches women on rear behinds and says things to them, you're in the criminal territory. i hope he gets fired, recalled

and goes broke. i think it's disgusting. >> we see instand at this, the insurance companies and big corporations says if somebody does something bad, everybody else has to go. they never sent me to class, i didn't know i wasn't supposed to grope. anything dumber? >> you wonder why they hate lawyers. this is why they hate politicians. i'm glad they said the city isn't paying the money. >> take it out of his own pocket. >> all the women filing complaints were fairly high up in his administration. the problem for women is when this happens, it's very hard to come out and say, one, you're going to lose your job, two, called a liar and you might not be able to get employed. it goes on a lot more than people think. >> i get the whole point of the classes and i shouldn't -- not to sort of stop the gropers. i think they're almost unstoppable. tell the women what the rights are. but the men have to go to classes too. ted, isn't that part it. tell women you don't have to sit and be groped?

>> you know, i think when you look at the supreme court and what the supreme court has said in these cases is that yes, the women have a right to be instructed by the city concerning sexual harassment. but this groping thing, come on, this guy is 70 years old. he's the mayor. he doesn't know and he wants everybody else to know? this is ridiculous, greta. >> i might add while we're talking about this with women, sometimes men are sexually harassed as well. >> absolutely. >> save that one for another day. >> it's happened to me. >> yeah, it happened to poor bernie. >> gentlemen, as always, thank you. straight ahead, could your insurance rates go up 198%? how mu protein does your dog food have? 18 percent? 20? new purina one true instinct has 30. active dogs crave nutrient-dense food. so we made purina one true instinct. learmore at purinaone.com

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198% is obama care force something rates to go up 198%. georgia insurance commissioner joins us. good evening, sir. >> hello, greta. how are you this sneng. >> very well. i understand you wrote a letter are to the secretary asking for more time having to do with insurance rates in your state. can you tell me why? >> well, i filed a request because we got these rates in from the companies and they were dramatic. that 198 was one particular product for a young person coming off a -- a catastrophic plan, high deductible. those are no more. they're going on to a regular pool benefit plan z their premium goesing from $66 a month to $197 a month. 198% increase.

>> all right. is that the only category? in general how are rates, are they going up? down? or the same. >> going up. and in the young folks they're going to go up at least 100%. 100 plus percent towards middle aged 35 to say, 50 they're going to increase from 50% to 100%. for people that are 60 plus, they're going to go up from 20% to 40%. and georgia not operating exchange. it's a federally facilitated exchange in georgia. we have to approve the rate filings. >> so what is a month going to give you? if the secretary gives you a month to do this what is it going to do to rates sfr sn. >> well, what we asked for is two fold we asked for 30 day

delay but we asked, also, that she take her experts and tell us why these rate increases were not justified with mandates and things that obama care has to cover for individuals. so that was a main part we asked for 30 days to get her time to evaluate these. we had outside actuaries evaluate the rates. they came back on six of the seven companies that filed, and said their rates were reasonable saying one was 8% excessive. so that company rolled their rates back 10%. but we had a real instinct -- interesting thing happen. >> greta: okay. >> go ahead. >> you go, sir, sorry. >> i want to tell you an

interesting thing that happened in georgia today. we had two companies call in and we had seven to begin with. two of them called in, and they were aetna and coventry saying we do not want to participate in georgia's exchange that. leaves with us five companies and two of them are small companies and they're very nervous they may get more participation than they want. so they're talking about possibly withdrawing from the exchange. you but if all companies withdraw we don't have an exchange in georgia. i think if this happens all over the united states and collapse obama care. >> greta: commission yes, thank you. we'll be watching to see what happens in georgia. >> you certainly will. >>. >> greta: coming up,

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is this where we do that bundling thing? let's see what you got. rv, covered. -why would you pay for a hotel? -i never do. motorcycles, check. atv. i ride those. -do you? -no. boat. -house? -hello, dear. -hello. -hello. oh! check this -- [ hip hop music playing ] i'm going on break! the more you bundle, the more you save. now that's progressive. rand paul calling for a truce koit turn into a beer summit? >> i think with governor christie it's gotten too personal so we're ready to kiss and makeup we're going to have to patch things up if we can sit down i'm inviting him for a beer any time he'd like to sit down at a pub around the corner from the senate to have a beer. >> have you heard about that invite? >> excuse me? >> have you heard anything

about the invite? >> it hasn't been formalized. i just thought of it. i think we can have a beer and mend things. >> greta: make sure you go to hello, i'm eric bolling with kimberly guilfoyle, bob beckel, dana perino, and greg gutfeld. the gang is back. it is 5:00 in new york city. this is "the five." well, it is coming up on a year since the terror attacks on our consulate in benghazi killed four americans. president obama promised to bring those responsible to justice, remember? >> we will not waiver in our kmisment to see justice is done for this terrible act and make no mistake, justice will be done. their families and colleagues and all americans know this. their sacrifice