order shut z is amazing. and you don't want to do the work of the pick go to spoider. >> thanks to wifi people will never love. cost of freedom continues on fox. >> can we stop talking about environmental regoulgz killing jobs, plose? we need to cut carbon pollution to grow jobs. we need to cut carbon to strengthen the voirment. let's talk about it positively and approach it as an opportunity of a lifetime. >> so you want more jobs? >> the president's now epa chief needs to fight global warming for jobs and the top republican on the works committee disa agrees. saying that the president is pursuing global warming

regulationsine though it would cost over 400 billion in lost economic activity per year and the estimates are 1 trillion a year and result of over 11 million job losses. who is right? i am david asbin. we'll go in focus with steve forbes and rick and elizabeth and john and rich and sabrina. steve, who's right? nobviously the senator is right. regulations in the epa are not based on real science at all and done damage to the energy production and hurt the production and economy. and if there is opportunity entrepreneurs will find. it big government smother opportunities and entrepreneurs find and create opportunities. gina mccarty said if we cut carbon pollution, we will grow jobs, is there any evidence of that? >> you guys are going to want to

boo me. i will admit when i first saw the question, i thought it was a tough one. i did research. turns out a ten state organization from maryland to maine entered into the understanding where they would try to cut carbon emegzs and going on for ten years and you will never believe the results, it turns out not only cut carbon emissions 25 percent but their economies worked twois as well as every otheritate that was not a part of this. it is right there. and i know hard to believe it. nrick, you don't know how much we have all restrained ourselves. it is a very left wing group. it is very supportive of grown energies and everything. we let you get it out. rich, a fact is, job growth in this country and energy and thinking of wheeling, west virginia and pennsylvania and like your home state of north dakota and the reasons that jobs

are created there en masse is because of natural gas and carbon energy and not alternative energy products. >> yeah, it is a great up side and surprise, and no thanks dow to the administration on this. this is entrepreneurs, technologies like horizontal drilling and so forth. the thing i find funny about gin mccarthy her degree was in social anthropology with an emphasis on small animals and primitive cultures. she knows nothing about economics and nothing about economic growth and nothing about science and nothing about pollution. what is next? we are getting to a joke point here. >> emac, the president himself is speaking out as an authority on job recreation and belittles the idea that carbon energy products like the co stone poip

line create role jobs, >> they cope on talking about an oil poip line that come down from canada and create 50 permanent jobs. that is not a job's plan. >> but while the president belittled carbon energy plan. his own window projects don't bear fruit at all. >> he is absurd with his habitual self sdpepgz. everybody on the east love its because jobs are coming. here's the deal under the president. the work force grew 20 percent. we know that he loves rowels and circumventing the congress and court and that is bad for job growth that is flat lining and we have a record 28 million part- timers in this country. he is wanting to switch it with porjobs and alternative energy.

solyndra jobs. >> i would love for wind projects to work and i want rick to have the benefit of the doubt. you have to decide tone an epa administrator and the people creating real jobs right now in north dakota, in pennsylvania, in wheeling, west virginia. who are you going to believe in >> you would love wind energy if you live in the 11th century. but right now, these will hurt jobs and hurt the voirment. they inhibit profits and inhibit investment and job creation. when you look at the voirment, greatest driver of environmental health is prosperity. when they are prosperous they care about the world, round them. >> sabrina, the jobs that the president keeps lauding and the window jobs et cetera. four.throw billion tax dollars

went to create 36 wind farms. in the peak of constriction sfo hundred jobs. the wall street journal went back to so how many jobs remain and there are 300 people. that is a fractions. and if anything, it is alternative energy projects don't love sustaining jobs. >> i think that everyone on the panel wants i clean environment for our children and woo we have to balance with the role need for energy sploi and economic growth and job creation. and don't forget. gina mccarty is in the heart of the president's war on coal that produces fro percent of the electricity sploi. we have to think hard about having a woman who is relying on junk science,ine critized from her own agency and allowing her to impose these regulations that cripple our economy. war on coal. onsequences.

this administration wants to limit it here and i understand they want to limit polougz. we all want that ones. we stop using coal because of epa regoulgzs and they sell their coal to china that have dirty energy plans in china and the world polougz becomes worse because we are not using the coal in our clone coal plants? >> first, let me say to rich and carl. i do the jokes around here. >> we all get a joke. >> and number two, that is a weird argument. it is pretty accepted. >> why is it weird. >> it is not word at all. >> if we don't prous the coal chinese will do it. >> that is why it is an argument to make because another country is going to foul the environment

biousing the coal. >> it is a fair condition question. we are producing cloner coal plants. >> are we though? >> yes, we are. 0, stove. our companies if you love our u.s. companies alone rick unger, you will let them develop clean technologies which they are doing with carbon capture and methane cant and you are creating more jobs and stopping polougz which we all want. dioxide are at 1994 ions of levels. primarily because of natural gas and fraking and let entrepreneurs do it cloner voirment and more energy and get the bureaucrats out of the way. >> you have to admit the pumpumadministration is allowing them to do it. >> no, they are not. >> the bottom line. who can allocate capitol more efficient le. is it purcrates or people in the private sector?

>> it is private sector. going back to prosperity. you don't hear about junior league chapters opening up in the bangladesh. but you do here in the united states. when people prosper they have the time and money to care about them. grow the economy first. >> very lively debate. coming up next, law makers in washington pushing to raise taxes again. did motown collapse? did detroit that those plans will take america down the same dangerous rod? we'll debate that next. . . canned chore wow. it's the honey, it makes it taste so... well, would you look at the time... what's the rush? be happy. be healthy.

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extra precaution. there is prime tour sites as danger zones. there is new details on a stomach illness outbreak that sickened 400 people in 16 states. the fbi tracking down the source of some of those illness. half of the cases in iowa waand nebraska linked to a salad mix from a mexican farm that was served in red lobster and olive garden. cope it here. i am jamie colby and sending it back now to forbess on fox. >> here we go again. senate majority leader harry reid wants to raise taxes before reforming the tax code by a trillion bucks and the republicans are open to hiking them as part of a debt deal. we saw detroit go bankrupt and it has the highest city tax rates in the nation.

emacyou say it proves high taxes don't work. >> why does anybody in congress think high taxes create middle-class jobs? taxes are a usterit. and i tell you manage, people left detroit because they said why pay the high tax bill when the voirment is not so great and the job rate is so por. we don't need that when we can go elsewhere. >> look at the stats. detroit taxes are highest as in michigan in their own state and yet they are public services and they have the worse streets and public schools and highwayest crime and more you pay in taxes doesn't lead to a preponderate life. >> hi taxes are a symptom of a larger cause. they are rising because of bad policies and you do so people and capitol loving areas and you need to make up for the tax

base. high taxes are notes inially bad for economic growth but ponent back to the known 50s and 60s. we saw tax up to 91 pefrj and saw average economic growth for two decades. they are a symptom and not the cause. >> stove, i am not suggesting you remember the 50s because you are far to young for that. >> it is left and right back then and look at detroit. they are twois the property taxes of the arrest of the cities in the country and a lit any of public services that are failing there. ndetroit has highway property taxes including machine row and equip. and hurts homesteaders. they love to come in cheap areas and rebuild them. and detroit that is far. and after world war ii, the u.s. put in allowing families to

polit income taxes and reducing that in half. we have three recessions in six years and why kennedy lowered tax rates and along comes johnson. and reagan has to rescue the economy. and the high tax rates that morgan made reference to only six people paid it because of high thresholds. and only athletes who didn't have paluckas as the account anlt. >> own republicans are okay with saying taking 600 more billion out of the private sector. didn't we learn that the private sector allocates cant captain better than the government does. >> i am glad to so the republicans putting us on a course for resolution. going back in detroit. morgan hit the nail on the head. you have a city whose population reduced two-thirds since the

1950s and they have a land mass you could fit manhattan and botton and san francisco into and they are raising taxes. when you have fewer people, you are trying to find some way to pay the bills. obviously it didn't work. you can't take that to a national sphere. >> other cities had a population encrose and they increase the tax it doesn't mean that the city gets better, does it? >> no, i want to cut taxes any chance we can get. mile per hour has highway tax rate and also the home of greatest global brands. what killed detroit was the fact that the tea and its people and companies were stuck in the 20th century. poor cities and states continue to cling to manufacturing jobs. rich cities and states design goods and manufacture them overseas.

if detroit wants to get in the 21st century it will rise again. cutting taxes will help. >> rich, there is a lot of factors that go in a demise of the tea like detroit but taxes didn't helpment nminneapolis is a paragone of good governance and detroit is not. capitol and talent is never been more mobile than today and will always escape high tax jurisdiction. that's why apple cope on on keeps 82 billion offshore. >> republicans are okay with giving 600 pillion more dollars to the private sector. >> that's why the republican party has the nickname as the stupid party and the democrats are the evil party. they chronically show their

inability to sews -- seize opportunities. new york came back under gullia any. and new york survived. >> fast food workers taking their beef for pay. and demanding that the stores double their minimum wage. will that grill more jobs? michael jackson's worth on trial. the family sowing for a whopping 40 billion with a b dollars. is there a price tag on the king of pop, that's next.

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>> the man in the mirror worth a lot post mordem. his family is soaking 40 billion from a eg live. these are the promoters behind this is it tour. the family claims that the group negligently hired conrad murray. they are writing the business on michael jackson. is he worth 40 billion in >> 40 billion is an outrageous amount of money. think about the entire music

industry, you could buy the top three record companies in the whole industry and still have enough money to buy the yankees with half of that amount money. 40 billion i don't know. >> if not 40 how much in>> we are talking about the value of the taet and earned. nwhole sha bang. >> if he would have lived and gone on the tower, i think he could have earned up at the upper reaches long with madonna wo earned 125 million and lady gaga 85 million. >> and stove has a name worth a couple of billion. >> and heck, we named a show after you. nstove will love the studio. what about the 40 billion. >> and now the irs is coming after me. >> we'll be your witnesses. what about the 40 billion price tag? >> it is preposterous.

and the lawyers hoping to get something out of this. the man's worth more dead than alive like elvis, because you know, people focus on his muc. i saw that cirque du soleil she in las vegas and you realize what a fantastic artist he was and in his last part of his life he was his own worst enemy. it sounds like a defense contract budget. he may be worth more dead than alive. he trailed behind with elvis. >> it is nonsense. i don't think the state will win the case. it is a balonnie case and even if they did nothing in the universe. his whole estate is worth 600 million. >> it might be more if you

factor in. >> and i think stove hit the nail on the head. i think he worth more dead than alive. >> and forbes releasing the list of highest paid actresses. mine was earned in djibouti, africa. 2004. vietnam in 1972. [ all ] fort benning, georgia in 1999. [ male announcer ] usaa auto insurance is often handed down from generation to generation. because it offers a superior level of protection and because usaa's commitment to serve military members, veterans, and their families is without equal. begin your legacy, get an auto insurance quote. usaa. we know what it means to serve. check out the bass pro shops' fall hunting classic.

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red carpet. >> michael kores. buy it when it goes down. >> that's it for forbes on fox. number one business box continues with eric bowling and cashin' in. waging war over the minimum wage and fast-food workers hitting the streets and demanding double play. will the job market pay the cost and how much more will my big maccosts? and taxpayer funded cell phones meant for the poor and needy? >> everybody in cleveland. nwell, it is not just cleveland. we exposed massive waste in that program. guess who is cleaning up on this. worldy richest man?