coast, red eye. >> tonight, on huckabee. tonight on "huckabee" -- >> we should be doing everything we can as a country to create more good jobs that pay good wages, period. >> the president talks a good talk but what's the truth about today's job market. >> i have been long-term unemployed for four years. >> this is the first time. >> hundred resumes and one interview. >> i work two pilot jobs. >> it's depressing and it's defeating and it's humiliating. >> tonight the real unemployment numbers and the real stories behind them. and -- >> having the freedom to start your own business because you will know you can get health

care, that's about jobs. >> is it about jobs? small business owners say obama care makes it impossible to hire. >> the more dollars out of the pocket is less money to invest into the company. >> and mike roe says to learn a blue-collar trade. >> if you show up early and stay late, you will run that business. >> tonight on a special "huckabee," where's my job? ladies and gentlemen, governor mike huckabee. [ applause ] >> thank you. thank you very much. and welcome to a special edition of "huckabee." where is my job? from man's beginning as recorded in the book of genesis we were hard-wired for work.

we were told by god we we would earn our bread by the sweat of our brow. it is nature to want to prove our value by producing. we imitate our parents in their work whetherst the little boy who tries to take tools to fix something or the little girl who begs to help her mother in the kitchen. it's just part of our dna to want to be grown up. and one sure way to feel grown up is to work. that's why the loss of a job is far, far more than just an economic setback for a human being. it's dehumanizing to want to be productive and not be able to acquire meaningful labor. there is pride and dignity to be able to sit at the table and eat a meal that your work provided. but in our current economy a record number of americans are either unemployed or underemployed meaning that the job they have is part-time or pays less than what is required

to meet basic necessities. in 2004, the centers for disease control reported on the suicide rate from 1928 all the way to 2007. suicide rates mirrored the economy in the ups and downs with an up tick at the beginning of the great depression and plunged during world war ii and spiked in the recessions in the '70s and '80s, peaking after the post-war peak in 1982. suicides dropped to their lowest levels ever in the year 2000 when technology was on fire. unemployment was at a stunning 4% at the time. but as the dot com bubble burst, america's suicide rate has been steadily climbing. all that is a stark reminder that the job issue is an economic issue and it's a lot more than that. it's an issue that gets to the very soul of our culture and its

people. joblessness results in people either giving up in despair or rising up in defiance. of course both parties claim to be all about jobs. >> you know house republicans have been focussed on economic growth and jobs since day one. >> today our businesses have created 7.2 million new jobs in the last 40 months. this year we're off to our best in private sector jobs growth since 1999. >> but the truth is jobs aren't created so much as when the government does something as they are when the government stops doing things to put an anchor around the necks of entrepreneurs. do we value the work and the people who do it? if so, we ought to pay them as if we value them and their work. the companies should pay as generous as they can because good workers have worth. if the employer keeps too much

for himself, he or she doesn't value worker. the reason high taxes are bad because it's a sign that the government disrespects the workers by believing that what it's going to do with the workers' salary is better than what the person who earneds will do. that's the value of work. i believe you are valuable and therefore what you do has value. [ applause ] american employers added 162,000 jobs in the month of july and the unemployment rate was lowered to 7.4%. my first guest says that the numbers don't add up. joining me is the former head of the bureau of labor statistics. keith hall. great to have you here today. >> great to be here. >> friday we got the new

numbers. 7.6 to 7.4. what's not to love, keith? >> well, first of all, that unemployment rate is the most closely watched economic statistic there is. and unfortunately that is a flawed statistic. and the reason is to be included in the unemployment rate, you need to be completely jobless, no job of any sort, no pay. and, second, you have to be active. you have to be doing certain things as opposed to just jobless. and particularly you have to be conducting interviews and send ending out resumes, things like that. and in reality what happens is when people are unemployed for a long time, at some point, they get tired of looking and they go into a passive mode. they have sent out resumes to everybody they can think of. but when they go into that passive mode, the government stops counting them. they are stopped being counted in the unemployment rate.

a lot of what is happening, is that the unemployment rate since about four years ago has dropped not because people are getting employed but because they are moving from unemployed to just jobless. >> the front page of the "wall street journal' has a headline, low pay clouds job growth. what is the real number we should be look at? >> the number that is most important right now and important in determining income growth and tax revenue and how many people are on welfare it's called the employment rate. it's the share of the working-age population with a job. right now that number is very low. it's about 58.7%. and the problem with that, of course, is that when the recession started that was up to be about 63%. when the recession ended that had falling to 59.4%. but since then, in this four years of recovery, that number

has only gone down. it has declined over time. so for any sort of progress in recovery, that's the number that has to go up. you have to have a bigger share of your population with work. and that's just not happening. >> and how many of those people who are employed are only working part-time and maybe even a fraction of the time they need to be working to make ends meet? >> there are people who are unemployed in a number of ways. 20% of people employed now are part-timers. and that's rather a lot. that number is a lot bigger than when the recession started. and so, they are just considered the unemployment rate is just being employed. and that's a problem. and the second thing is do workers' skills match the jobs they are in. if you have someone with a lot of experience and skills who is in a job inappropriate for them, they are counted as employed and

not in the statistics. >> i appreciate you being here. keith will rejoin us later in the show. coming up, the jobs outlook is bright. she says the president is helping job growth. can't wait to discuss that. we'll hear from americans unemployed or underemployed. they are desperate to find work. >> i'd like to hear from you, go to my website and tell me what you think. or sign up for mys may book page or follow me on twitter. you can find that on my website.

. throughout the show tonight you're going to be hearing from people who have different stories but with one thing in common they're all looking for work. jerry simmons took two pay cuts before she was laid off as her job as a health care insurance agent last summer.

she spent more than a year sending out dozens of resumes. what kind of feedback are you getting from employers you are hoping will hire you? >> hi, governor. i have had kind of an interesting experience with interviewing. i looked at opportunities where i might be going into an entry level positions. and one of the questions is what is your long-term goals and where would you like to be in five years. and i say i like to apply my skills and be able to grow with the company and learn their business and be able to grow with them. and the response that i've had to that has been kind of surprising, that, well, we're a small company. we're not really planning on growing. most people don't get the opportunity to move up or grow

in our company. that's just not in the plans right now. and that goes against pretty much everything i learned about business both in school and out in the real world is you have to adapt to the market and growing. >> i appreciate your being here. thank you for joining us. and joining me is tamera holder. she says that the president is making progress when the president is creating jobs. you will have to convince me. i don't see ethel meraming singing. >> i think that the left and right can agree we have seen slow growth. it's not what president obama hoped and dreamed about. he prevented a huge depression. i'm not going back to, well, bush started it. >> you're not?

we're making progress. there was progress, tamera. >> i can blame bush on other things if you want to get me started but i think everybody's discouraged. the problem is that republicans are obstructionists. and in stead of talking about -- instead of talking about how do we get more americans get back to work we are seeing them how do we cut food stamps. like everybody on food stamps is a lazy recipient. that's not the case. they are hard-working people making minimum wage jobs, underemployed and they need to support their families. >> i think a lot of people are on government assistance out of necessity. >> i can't answer to a lot of people in the party. you are talking about people in d.c. who i think are as out of touch as obama is. >> it is both sides. >> but it's the president's policies that are making it

difficult for business owners to make long term plans. the tax consequences. 16 in effect, the fact that the payroll tax went back up, those are real issues that curb people from hiring. so why is it that the president's policies if they are as good as you say they are why haven't they resulted in something other than this very anemic recovery? >> it's not the president's policies that are the problem. they are part of the problem but it is corporations behaviors. we have seen mcdonald's, dominos, these major corporations paying people lesser wages and seeing profits. we saw in the news this week that mcdonald's posted second quarter profits again. >> would you be happier if they were losing money? >> no. -- no, no, no. but i think if a company makes money they should reward the people making them the money.

the guy standing a it the cash register is selling the burgers. >> and i wish that every company could pay more but what if hay can't because the cost of their doing business and what their business is going to be in the next quarter is such they can't continue to do it. a lot of companies -- i know you may not understand, but they have investors and if they don't return something to the investors the investors don't invest and the company goes out of business. i'm not defending low pay. people should pay good money for the jobs they do. but what i want you to explain to me is how come it is that the obama policies have not resulted than anything other than a massive downturn in full-time employment? >> this is typical republican scare at theics. there is no massive downturn here. we have seen slow growth.

i agree that the numbers aren't necessarily that great. when you see front page of mother jones of all publications saying that the numbers are deceptive, we all seat on both sides of the fence. but the point is, is that we're at a time that there's a lot of instability whether you are talking to economists or people on the left and right and we need to keep going at a pace in investing in our workers. how do we do that? i agree with cutting corporate taxes and small business owners taxes. >> that's a start. >> which is what obama is trying to do. >> i missed that part of his policy. stay with us. we'll bring you back at the end of the show. mike roe will be talking about the value of blue-collar jobs. but first small business owners tell us why be president's policies are keeping them from hiring anybody. we'll be right back.

christina bellows recently lost her job as a manager at a non-profit. she has a bachelor's and master's degrees and 20 years of experience and she needs benefits and can't find a job that offers any. what kind of response are you getting? >> with the first interview, they don't talk about benefits. they say benefits are provided. but they don't necessarily say what kind of benefits. and i don't necessarily bring that up, nor, do they bring that conversation up. >> i hope things get bert for you. your situation is like so many of people in the country.

obviously, you are willing to take cuts from what you had but you have to be able to live. we wish you very well. thank you. >> we're joined by a couple of small business owners who want to grow businesses and hire more employees but they can't. william marsh and gina martin. gina, william, great to have you both back. >> thank you. >> gina let me start with you. when we were talking with you before, the last time you were on the show you were telling us how obama care was very complicated, making it difficult to know if you got to that 50-level of employees that was going to throw you into a new realm. have things simplified? >> they are still confusing for sure. they aren't any better. here we sit again. we know we have that one-year

extension since the last time we spoke. but really, things are not any better. we are still faced with just enormous cost increases for providing the health care that we provide. so we're really having to look at decisions in our business to see if we continue the health care coverage with the employees that we pay it for now because not only is health care insurance going up the regulations are going up. the unemployment taxes are going up. disability is going up. every single aspect of what we do keeps going up and up. >> here's what i find interesting. the affordable care act is supposed to make health care more affordable and accessible. your employees were getting health care, now they're threatened with not getting it at all bauds the cost of the affordable care is unaffordable. did i get that right? >> that's exactly right. >> it goes against what is supposed to be happening.

william when you were here before you talked about the channels you face. you have a smaller company with a handful of employees. how does the current policies of the government keep you from growing? >> well, you hit the nail on the head, governor. you said that the affordable care act was supposed to bend the cost curve down. my health insurance agent said in 2014 when obama care is substituted you should expect your rates to go up 40 to 50%. after we have seen successive increases year on year of 10 to 15%. the affordable care act is totally unaffordable. further more what is going to happen in small businesses like mine tis the rates will be unaffordable. and employers will no longer

offer health benefits. so employees will join into the obama care arrangement and the cost of obama care will balloon. what you are seeing today in the unaffordability is the first wave in a tidal wave. we are keeping our heads down and helmets on. because to try to understand what kind of operational environment we are going to have in several years is impossible. my job is to make sure that my men are employed and their mortgages a mortgages are being paid. >> so i hear you both saying that even though you are providing health care for your employees you may get to a place you can no longer do. that it would be less expensive for you to pay the penalty. but when you do that, your employees still are required by law to find health care which is going to be a lot more expensive

for them. how is this helpful to your business and your employees? >> this isn't helpful at all. not only that i would have to say the timing of this is awful. we are all seeing and william and i were talking about all the increased regulations on top of the health care. the timing couldn't be worse. and i would like to say i hear that corporations are greedy. this is not about greed at all for most businesses. this is about survival. and you only have so much money. and you have to allocate what you want to do with that money. and if you throw it into health care you don't have a business. so these are the choices we are faced with. >> i want you both to just tell me if you anticipate that you will either hire new people over the next 12 to 15 month, let go people because you can't afford them any more or just hoping to hang on to what you got?

>> well, we're not looking to hire in this environment. the market -- >> is it the environment? >> the opportunity for american manufacturing right now is unbelievable. if you look at the natural resources at our disposable. the growth in the global economy, the innovation history, the human capital. american manufacturing has a once in a lifetime opportunity to expand and dominate the world. it breaks my heart that at 40 years old, my outlook on the future is not what it should be. >> and gina? >> you have the fire in the belly if you are an entrepreneur as it is. and i would say that the opportunities with our business in growth, they have certainly been stymied years ago. especially with this administration because there is so much uncertainly out there. we never know what is coming down the pike. and we don't know with the health care increases and everything else what we're going

to do. and what we're looking to do really is increase your -- decrease your costs by turning your full-time workers into part-time workers. that's one of the things we have thought about doing with our business. and we are looking at whether or not certain positions in our company are necessary. it's a fight for survival. >> we'll keep in touch with both of you. appreciate your being back today. if you want a good-paying job, what about getting a job that gets your hands dirty? >> mike rowe will tell us how changing attitudes toward blue-collar trade could be the solution to high unemployment rates. ture card to fly home for the big family reunion. you must be garth's father? hello. mother. mother! traveling is easy with the venture card because you can fly any airline anytime. two words. double miles!

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live from america's news headquarters, president obama is sending a letter to congress seek authorize of use of force against syria and authorize military action gwen the regime in response to a chemical weapons attack near damascus. the senate and house will vote on the matter september 9th. a fire at yosemite national park is blocking many of the views that make the area a

tourist destinations. the wildfire burning nearly 350 square miles and destroying 11 homes. it's 40% contained. now back to "huckabee." for all your latest headlines, log on to foxnews.com. max lieberman graduated from cornell in university and got a masters in 2012. his education makes him an ideal candidate for the green energy jobs that the obama administration is promoting. but five years on he can't find a job that matches his education. you have been five years out there beating the pavement. have you thought about relocating to houston or oklahoma city where the oil and gas jobs are? is that something you have

looked at? >> i have sent my resumes to people in california, texas, canada and overseas too. but the same story. it's always, you know, we respect your education and sounds great on paper. but we're just not hiring for your position right now. and it baffles me. everybody told me for years, family, friends, advisers that i'm on the right track and everything is going well and the government wants to support me. but i can't find the jobs. it's not there for me. >> you have two prestigious degrees from a prestigious university. what are you doing right now? >> right now i'm working for an energy company that helps people save money on their building costs. but it's low-grade and i want to expand and get something better and, frankly, mike, i want to make the salary i can live off of more comfortably and enrich

my own life. that's not something i have been doing right now. i've been looking and it's not happening right now. >> maybe being on this show, max, we want to hire you. >> i'll talk to that guy. >> maybe mike has something for you. >> thank you, mike, great to have you here. maybe an expensive college degree isn't always the best path. a lot of young people ought to consider a career in skilled labor. mike rowe is host of the discovery channel show "dirty jobs" but he has a foundation called mike rowe works. mike, is it a pleasure having you here. >> nice to be here. >> you're talking about something, mike, that is near and dear to my heart and that is a college degree is not always a ticket to a good career. and, yet, we are told that, you

know, if you go to college you're going to be able to get a good job and make a lot of money. >> it's a difficult thing to talk about. the minute you take a position that is contrary to the prevailing narrative you are seen as anti- college. not all knowledge comes from college, right? there's been a thing -- [ applause ] it's so easy to -- i think -- confuse the cause of the thing with the symptom of a thing. and a lot of the things that we talk about today, a lot of the headlines from the skills gap to the unemployment to currency devaluation to the changing face of the modern day proletariat. these are a symptom of our relationship with work. people were continually surprised to see how happy the people were that we met and to see how prosperous they were. there is a chronology in all things.

in college i wouldn't trade my degree. but when i got out of high school i went to a community college and spent two and a half years at 40 bucks a credit. you can afford to fail. trying to figure out -- trying to figure out what it is i wanted to do with the useful part of my career. and it took a while to sort it out. but i feel lucky because i did in the right order. i never took on any debt. and in the end i'm okay. >> well, you know, there is a poster -- there is a poster that you saw in a high school guidance -- we have a shot of it. >> that's what i meant. this is the single worst piece of advice i got. when i was a senior my guidance counsellor called me down and suggested james madison and university of maryland. i did well on my exams. but i told him the story i told you and he pointed to that poster and said which of these

guys do you want to be? work smart, not hard. that's where that old chestnut began. and that poster was part of an early college recruitment campaign. on my website we have redone the poster to see work smart and hard. >> let's see what it looks like. >> but we are challenging people to get those hung in classrooms around the country. the argument is simple. if you are a society that took the advice of work smart not hard, then a lot of the things we are dealing with right now start to make sense. i don't want to sound like somebody's angry uncle screaming at kids to get off the yard. i don't care if you work for mcdonald's or william's company, if you show up early, stay late and volunteer for the hard stuff you are going to run that organization before too long. >> that is such an important

piece of advice. i think we have diminished the importance of people who do work with their hands. when i'm on an airplane and it has a mechanical problem i'm more excited to see an amp certified mechanic than a history major come near that airplane. that job cannot be outsourced. if you need a plumber you can't send your toilet to china. >> you can. but it's very expensive. look, again, it's not about -- this is bad or this is good -- this is a skills gap. it's another inconvenient piece of the narrative that nobody ever talks about. there are 3 million jobs available right now. companies like caterpillar are struggling to find heavy equipment mechanics. >> what do they pay? >> start at mid-40s and with a couple of years of experience,

120, 130 a year. >> you have an application with you? >> but it's simply a question of what do we value and what do we celebrate? it's like manufacturing. if you look at detroit and consider all the things that went wrong, for me it starts with our relationship with that which we make, our relationship with making things. you know, and we're just missing the headline in the conversation over and over. >> if you had a piece of advice to give to the president and congress, what would you tell them? >> look, first of all i'm not an expert but i would say that the reality of the situation right now vis-a-vis alternative education we have to make a case for the trades. we have to start with an wareness campaign, a public relation campaign to challenge perceptions and stigma. 3 million shovel-ready jobs is a great idea. but i had a dirty jobber tell

me, that's going to be a tough sell. you are talking to a country that no longer has relationship with a shovel. you have to start at the beginning. and so i would say, let's maybe step back a little bit and have a broader conversation. i'd say 1 trillion dollars? student loans is no joke and conclude by suggesting we are lending money we don't have to kids who can't pay it back to train them for jobs that no longer exist. that's nuts. >> that's common sense. that's why mike will stay with us. some of our guests will be back to talk more about is america becoming a part-time nation? we'll be right back. what person in this audience, who doesn't want health care from an employer? who doesn't want protection? >> i wouldn't personally -- unless it was a rhetorical question i don't expect the person who hires me to take care

of me in every aspect of my life.

stephanie standers used to make more than $16 an hour plus commissions selling skin care products but it's she lost her job in 2010. and finally took a minimum wage part-time job at a fast food restaurant working 20 hours a

week. she is now on strike and would like to unionize. how would the union in the fast food arena help you? >> everything is power of numbers. you know, if i was to go to my boss or the corporation on my own with a problem i wouldn't get anything done. versus going to a union and having a union behind me, i think i would -- the outcome would be much more successful. >> sometimes the union dues become very expensive. would you lose more than you might gain if you go from $7.25 an hour to $8 an hour but the union dues cost you? >> no. i don't think i would because, you know, it all falls back on if i get $8 an hour that would be a start. that would be more than $7.25 and i would be able to live comfortably. >> well, stephanie, i hope you

do well. it's tough to lose a job that was paying you a lot better than what you do now. thank you for being here to share your story and perspective. joining me again right now is mike rowe. tamera holder is back. keith hall is back. let's address is issue, is unionization of fast food workers is that viable? >> absolutely. >> you think is it? >> absolutely. because this is an industry that has a very high turnover and we're seeing so many workers like stephanie herself who are going to fast food places because that you they have nowhere else to turn and they are taking whatever job they can. but we are also seeing a -- they're paying people just barely above minimum wage. these are people who -- 46% of these people are aged 21-35. they have families. they have kids. they need to pay for more than

$8 an hour can pay for. >> mike, does the unionization help the people or raise the prices so high that the people can't afford to go there? >> it's beyond my pay grade. but what's interesting to me is the union conversation is about the relationship between the worker and the boss. the conversation that i'm personally obsessed with is about the relationship between a few hundred million americans and work. work and labor are different things. and i think it's easy to talk about two things accidentally at the same time when you talk about this story and the topic that we were just talking about, which one informs the other, right? i wish her well too. my liberal and conservative

friends want the same thing. they just disagree on what's the symptom and what's the cause. that's still missing from the conversation. that's long way of saying -- >> they're not talking about protection of workers. i have worked with unions and represented railroad workers who were fired in the name of homeland security and had to go to the unions to get their protection from their employers. and so i understand what personally as working with people, why the unions are important. back in the day the unions were created because of poor workplace conditions. but now we are talking about a different form of protection, health care, whether or not you like obama care, health care these are things that workers need and want. >> but the unions are disenchanted with obama care. a scathing letter he wrote to the president. >> i didn't defend obama care. my statement did not defend

obama care but it's unions protect workers and make sure they have proper health care. who doesn't want health care from an employer? who doesn't want protection? >> i wouldn't -- personally, unless it was a rhetorical question i don't expect the person who hires me to take care of me in every aspect of my life. >> but that's -- that's -- >> as a self employed person i expect that person to take care of that. >> some so am i. i want to bring in keith. help us to understand this is not something that is just about numbers and figures but about real people with real hurt in their lives. but it does get to the point of what is a better answer than asking the government to come in and demand certain things? is there a market solution? do we have to wait for the

government to come in and order people to treat their employees right? >> that's not the railway to get higher wages. you want the higher wages because the businesses are growing and they have to pay more to get more people on board. the story we just heard the problem is not that she doesn't get paid more it's that she lost her job to begin with and had to retreat to a fast food job. right now, we're at an all time low with teenagers. about 25% of teenagers have work right now. that's an all time low. and that's typically where fast food workers come from. and if we have 3/4 of our teenagers not working or have work experience, that's a problem. >> i want to address something. mcdonald's takes a lot of heat for low paying job, my son worked at mcdonald's when he was

in high school. and it was a good place for him to work. he learned when to show up and discipline. there was a very strict order of doing things and the management that oversaw his production frankly, was a very important part of teaching the fundamentals. he's not still working at mcdonald's, but i was not the least bit ashamed and neither was he, that he had that job. >> people don't talk about the skills gap but the thing they really don't talk about because it's awkward and touchy are soft skills. you show up on time and you tuck your shirt in. i mean, it's so fundamental. look -- i've talked -- i've been really lucky in my own life and with the people i get to talk to. every state and employer i have talked to the single hardest thing to do is find people who are hungry and eager and attitude, attitude, attitude.

you can't teach it. you have it or you don't. >> tamera, you are shaking your head. >> i worked at mcdonald's when i was in high school. i wanted something better for myself and i understand what working in fast food does for your and your psyche and skills. but this is the most disgusting argument that you should take a low-wage job -- it's an abusive relationship. where are you going to go? you can stay in this nice house with me and you have no skills and you have a bed and you have food and water. but because you can't leave this abusive relationship where are you going to go? you can't go to a shelter. you're homeless without me so we can pay you nothing. >> but i think you are missing what mike said and that is if you are better at even that low-skill job than anybody around you, you won't stay in that job, you will find a way to move up.

>> 2.2% of the jobs at mcdonald's are managerial. >> we are out of time unfortunately but i will treat you to a big mac after the show. coming up i have some closing thoughts. stay with us.

i've had a i've had a paying job since i was 14. it empowered me to be the first male in my family to go to college. when i was a teenager i had two jobs for a while. my job at kxar radio helped me to learn how to communicate,

think on my feet and develop confidence and overcome my fear of crowds. my job at jcpenney taught me the hard work of unloading trucks, stocking merchandise and made me to this day ticked off when people put their hands on the glass of a door instead of the handle. i was the kid who had to run there with the windex. i lost jobs that i wanted. including one that came with a nice house at 1600 pennsylvania in washington. and by the way i often have been pate paid a lot less than what i thought i was worth and sometimes i was paid more than i deserve bud still less than i would have liked. a couple of times i had jobs that ended and i had no idea what i was going to do to pay my bills and feed my family but i found something to do even when it was not anything like what i

was educated to do or enjoy doing. if i was not unable to find a job i am not sure i could handle it. i would go door to door offering to sweep porches or rake leaves. i have worked so long i don't know how to not work. i think one of the highest urgency of our government is the creating of opportunities so people can work. a job is not just how we put bread on our table, it's how we put life and hope into our soul. that's our show for tonight. hope you enjoyed being here. until next week from new york this is mike huckabee good night anded to and god bless.

this is cielo drive, 40 years ago the summer of evil began. nestled high in benedict canyon in los angeles it's been home to many of hollywood a-list celebrities. hello. it was august, 1956 during a blistering heat wave close to midnight. three women and a man all around 20 years old crept up