>> that's right. >> brian: that will be great. don't forget to watch the weekend show. eight hours of programming coming your way and the browns who learned to play the piano really good this time, in the after the show show. >> steve: have a great weekend. >> elisabeth: have a great weekend, everybody. bill: good morning. new details emerging on the woman who apparently snapped before plunging the nation's capital into chaos. the 31-year-old miriam carey with a 1-year-old daughter in the car took police on a chase before being shot in front of the nation's capitol. martha: news cameras caught these chaotic the moments as police say they rammed the white

house barrier and then took off. that's her car as it what is wedged in for moments. she spun out. turned it around, and she took off. unbelievable she was able to make it through that group of police officers there. then she spun up around the office building towards the u.s. capitol. a tragic and chaotic story that played out. all of this happened on a beautiful small afternoon in washington. bill: miriam carey was a dental hygienist. she says she struggled with postpartum depression and she

has no idea why she was in washington to begin with. >> reporter: the focus is on the 34-year-old suspect and her motivation. they are running her name against existing data base and it's standard practice to obtain her computers and phone records to identify which site she visited before heading into washington. the suspect approached the white house security perimeter with her vehicle. engaged with a secret service agent, we don't know what was said, then she rammed her car into the secret service agents and threw him up on the windshield. $we are told there was no weapon in the vehicle just the

1-year-old child. we are wondering how the vehicle got from the white house to the capitol and we were told two factors. the crowded nature at scene and the child in the vehicle caused hesitation. authorities say this is unconventional warfare. you have a person who turned the car into a weapon. security is designed to counter troo digital attacks'. in this case the car became a weapon, could have contained a bomb and it could have been a diversion for a secondary attack.

the authorities ema side this is the second time in a month we have had a major incident in the city and it comes at a time when there is no homeland security secretary. janet napolitano left the job a month ago. >> the men and women on front lines are doing a great job. the idea that they don't have any leadership to govern puts the nation sat greater risk. >> reporter: one of the big take-aways is this is a situation where you had a non-traditional attack. the use of a vehicle as an effective weapon that abated security for some time. martha: when all this went down in the heart of our nation's capital. tourists and office workers had a front row seat to the chaos

and panic as it's laid out. >> i heard 7 or 8 successive gunshots back to back to back. i thought it sounds like gunshots. i should have come out to see what was happening. when i walked up the street i could see kind of a chaotic situation. >> we were caught off guard. we questioner scared. every one was mass panic for a while. the security people were good about telling us what to do. >> we just heard a pow and a whole bunch of cop cars. then we heard ought pop and return fire then a boom like an explosion. i thought it was an actual explosion. but then they ushered us into a house. martha: it was scary.

that scene right there is unbelievable. no bystanders were hurt. >> we can show our viewers a bit of a overview from google map. we'll isolate the white house in the upper left hand corner. that's 1.5 miles in total. here is the white house where the gate was rammed at 2:15, 2:20 eastern time yesterday. she sped at speeds up to 80 miles an hour down pennsylvania avenue. this is the area around garfield circle. slammed it into reverse and shots were fired. she went north and east and this is where the fatal moment happened with her chimed age 1 in the back seat. if you went further southeast there about another mile, that's

where the naval yard was and that's where we had the shooting incident two weeks ago. nation's capital on edge. you have two of these incidents in a short period of time. on top of the shutdown. martha: it was real exercise for the capital police who did an amazing job. but they have to be on edge after what happened at the navy yard and war worried something like that of a terrorist nature could happen. they got a standing ovation. members of the house returned to the chamber to continue debating how to end this government shutdown and took to the floor to show their thanks to the capitol police and other first responders. >> i know i join the majority leader in expressing our gratitude to the capitol police.

[applause] martha: the capitol police are a much loved arm of the security force that protects our capitol. they are among the hundreds of thousands of government employees who are being forced to work with no pay thanks to the shutdown. so the gratitude is all they are going get this week. no paycheck. bill: they will get a paycheck eventually once this is figured out. martha: we are now in day four if you are keeping track which we are of the partial government shutdown. americans are showing their frustration. according to the new pox poll numbers 58% say they think it's very serious. 23% say it's somewhat serious.

10% say it's not that serious at all. any signs that the senate democrats and house republicans are moving toward any compromise? >> the gop controlled house is continuing to reopen parts of the government one by one. today they are expected to take up funding head start and wick and furlough and money for the furloughs employees you were talking about. house republicans believe this is a way to move forward while giving both sides a chance to negotiate on bigger issues like funding obama-care. >> the president's refusal to work in a bipartisan * pay as led to this shutdown. we must restore a america's faith in their economy and trust

in their government, especially before we reach a debt ceiling deadline. >> if you ever hope to get out of this mess and hope toned this government shutdown, get rid of the tea party direction. work with us. >> then there is the nation's borrowing limit, the debt ceiling. we'll hit tonight two weeks. obama says congress must raise it and he won't negotiate on that. but republicans are preparing for a battle over that, too. bill: there will not be a trip to southeast asia. secretary of state john kerry will go in his place. that is the case for the president. he will stay home this weekend. martha: the gulf coast is on

alert. as karen takes aim. bill: there are new polls showing how slow congress has sunk and why so many americans no longer believe they have a government for the people by the people. martha: when a routine traffic stop is not. the dash cam shows when a man pulled over opened fire on a state trooper. please get back in your car for me. get back in the car for me now. sir, please get back in the car for me now. brakes, tires, oil, everything.

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martha: the government shutdown is affecting the investigation of the accidents that killed 8

people. the national transportation safety board is in the sending any investigators to look at the crash. 8 people were killed on the bus who were all senior citizens from a church group in north carolina. bill: 81% of you disapprove of the job congress is doing. that's an improvement of the record high of 83%. only 8% of americans feel that people are in charge of the government. 88% believe the government is in charge of the people. gentlemen, good morning to both of you. these are the numbers that give you a look as who how people are feeling. ith that it second number is stung.

-- is stunning. >> it all ideological groups feel this way. it speaks to how remote and unresponsive thresponsive people government is. >> i don't think it requires a lot of explanation. i think most americans know we live in a society that feels larger -- if you think about wall street and the media people feel like they don't have any power. when it comes to the government, i think it's the biggest part of our economy, the single sector. you look at what's going on in washington. people feel like we have to make it work for our families. they just go on their own ways.

bill: you know what it is juan, that's a direct reflection of how big people think the government has gotten. you know, bill, when you ask about simple things like getting the job done, are they meeting my need. helping me, my family, my children, my community. i think people wonder if this is about putting money in the pockets of the politicianser ego and power trips. >> i think that's right. also not to get in the weeds here. but the way government works. congress doesn't pass laws so much as it passes authority for the executive agencies who make it up as they go along. it gives insiders and power

interests special deals. everyone seize that and it drives everyone crazy. and it drives the distrust of government as it is part of a distrust of all institutions. the disapproval number for the path is 49 per. that's actually up five points. apparently the vice was all on the backs of democrats who were giving him higher number now. go back to the disapproval number of congress. in that breakdown, tea partyers disapproved 71 per. republicans 77. democrat 82. that's across the board. >> if you break it down for republicans inside there, they are also at a high point in terms of disapproval. democrats are close to it. compared to the president, the

president looks like he's glowing compared to the attitude toward congress. it's a mess on capitol hill. these numbers persist. it's not just that they are attached to the shutdown. >> i understand what you are saying. but what i'm saying is this is an equal opportunities offender here. whether you are on the left or on the right. you are not happy. >> everyone associates congress with partisan squabbling. the shutdown isn't responsible for a lot of this discontent but it seems to have augmented a little bit and it will probably get worse. bill: gentlemen, have a good friday. martha: a routine traffic stop turns into a gunfight and it was all caught on video. wow. you see the rest of that. we'll show you coming up.

>> the impact of the government shutdown being spheld overseas. an american world war ii memorial so well known and so deeply road in our history is now closed. ♪ [ male announcer ] may your lights always be green. [ tires reech ] ♪ [ beeping ] ♪ may you never be stuck behind a stinky truck. [ beeping ] ♪ may things always go your way. but it's good to be prepared... just in case they don't. toyota. let's go places, safely.

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bill: what looks like a routine traffic stop unfold slps watch what happens. >> sir, get back in the car for me now. sir, please get back in your car

for me now. i told you you were speeding. >> 5326 shots fired. that man apparently shooting at the officer. speed away. he's got three kid in the car with him. the officer was shot in the chest and wound. the shooter in the car was found a half mile down the road. he was found dead at the wheel from gunshot wound from the state trooper. three kids in the car. the state of oregon.

determination that could be kerrs fear and physical exhaustion. martha: what a beautiful description that is of what happened on normandy on the beaches. german troops could not stop the american soldiers from storming d-day beach. but the partial government shutdown is closing down the memorial in normandy, france. disappointing many people who have traveled great distances to go there to pay-their respects. gregg, unbelievable that this could be happening. what's the mood there. >> reporter: i would say disament is an understatement. -- i would say disappointment is an understatement. you can seat sign.

closed to the public. this gate is locked up tight. what you can't see is beyond this gate. 9,500 died this date. we are seeing a partial closing here and other locations like this across europe. we have people who planned for months and years for this visit. they can't change those plans. that's why they are very upset about not being able to get inside. here is what a few had to say to me. >> the spirit was that was shown mere many years ago is shown more these days. these guys died for the freedoms we have got fan now we can't even get in to pay our respects to them. where is that ethic.

>> they lost touch with the basics and what sacrifice really is. >> we came all this way to visit this place of honor and you can't get in. i hope the politicians in washington pull themselves together and get the problem sphostled quickly. bill: the blame was spread around by these people. but the passion straightforward as you heard. martha: i hope everybody in washington is watching this. it just looks ridiculous on the face of it. it's an open area so how are the visitors working around the shutdown to see what they can see there, gregg? >> reporter: you can't see the graves but you can go just about half a mile from where we are and see the broad expanse of beach which was a killing field in 1944 for so many of those

young, brave men. they were planning their own modern day envision. they wanted to go across the beach and up the bluffs and get into the american cemetery to pay their respect. americans can't believe it and locals can't believe it. we talked to one frenchman whose descendants benefited from the invasion. the cemetery for the german soldiers who did -- we talked to one our group who said they were substituting a stop here for that creme terry. maybe they are going do it once again to get into that creme terry at more man difficult. thank you very much. what do you think about this america. we are take your tweets

@marthamaccallum and bill hemmer as to regard to whether it's normandy. yesterday when we are take your questions. martha: we took our kid there. it's a must-see. it's a mustth do. these people went over there to do that and now they can't get in. bill: tropical storm karen will be the first named storm this season to hit the u.s. that could be a wet weekend. martha: how long is this government shutdown going to last? new details on why the white house may want it to keep going on for some time. kathy rogers respond to that next. >> reporter: apparently

civility to them means agree with us. do whatever we demand. if you don't you will call an anarchist and terrorist and any other bad "ist dwhrtion is in the books.

>> here we go.

tropical storm karen. fema recalling some furloughed workers from the shutdown whack to --back to work. >> we do have good news associated with karen. we think the storm system is weakening. it looks rather disorganized. one of the reasons for that is we have strong wind coming out of the west pushing thunderstorm activity away from the center of circulation. most of the rain rolls east of the center of it. another factor helping to weaken this storm system is dry air across the western gulf of mexico. two things helping to weaken the storm system. we still have shirk watches in effect from grand isle, louisiana, mississippi, alabama and parts of florida. so just west of the city of destin, florida, you will have a tropical storm watch.

karen is forecast to strengthen. by early sunday morning we could be looking at winds maximum sustained 70 miles an hour. eventually take a look at monday and tuesday. the storm picks up in speed and it will be producing rain pack parts of the east coast. a lot of rain. and storm surge another concern. martha: how long will this shutdown last? according to the "wall street journal" if the white house gets its way. it could be a while. a senior obama official telling the journal we are wing. it doesn't really matter to us how how long the shutdown lasts. what matters is the end result.

what do you think, congresswoman, about that statement from a senior admin official in the "wall street journal"? >> this should be about getting the government open, listening to the american people. addressing the issues on their mind. i know from the republicans in the house, we are working hard every day to open up this government and get the government working again. but also to address the debt crisis. the sluggish economy we continue to struggle with and a costly healthcare bill on people's mind. we need to have these negotiations. it sounds like the white house is more interested in winning than having the negotiations with the republicans and the democrats in the senate to solve these problems. martha: there are those jose

there is nothing to give in terms of the debt ceiling issue. that's complicated by another story that john boehner has let leak, apparently and they are back pedaling on that. he will not let the country default. so doesn't that in many ways undercut your leverage if you put it out there that you plan on raising the debt ceiling? >> no one wants to default. we have an obligation that we have to meet, but we also need to address the out of control spend. we need those spend reforms so we can change the current trajectory of the debt we have taken on as a country and the impact it has on our economy and our jobs. i also heard the president say he bent over backward to work with republicans and we are holding th the people of the u..

hostage. the only message we are getting from the with it house is one that says they are not willing to negotiate. that doesn't help solved our problem. the people i represent in eastern washington, they want us to address these tough issues. they want to us make these difficult issues. they recognize that the economy is sluggish and this spending is unacceptable. this our moment for the negotiations between the house and the senate and the white house. martha: let's take a look at some of these new poll numbers. these go to the issue of defunding healthcare which was the primary point that got to us this shotdown. the question is republicans in congress trying defund healthcare law, the healthcare law, 4% say yes, that was an important effort on their part. 46 per say the was a waste of

time. in the end you believe that the healthcare law will be repealed or defunded, only 27 per se there will be some change. 64 per say it's the law of the land and it will remain there. was that effort worth it? >> it definitely was worth it. people are hurting because of this healthcare law. there shouldn't be special treatment given to members of congress. as well as eliminating or delaying. truly we need to make this fair for every one. the president has said he will delay it for employers. he picks and choose. that's not the role of the president. this is legislation and it is our role as legislators to decide what the law is going to be. martha: it's going to being a long couple weeks with no

movement in sight. we'll see which side will be willing to budge. bill: every shutdown in 3 days. now in day four, five, and 6. october 7 is monday. that will be day 7. there is just a few things going on around here. martha: a lot of important things happening. bill: forget feeling like a million bucks. we'll tell you how one man became the richest man in the world if only for a short time. martha: he criticized the president at the national prayer breakfast, then the irs came calling shortly after that. he says the irs targeting is still going on. >> do you really believe because you criticized some of the

president of ther's policies at the prayer breakfast that i.r.s. is giving you jazz?

martha: a texas man became the world's richest man if only for a moment in time. he was online checking his bank account. he had $4 trillion plus in his personal bank account. >> i logged in 8 times to see fit was still there and every time it was still there. >> reggie the trillionaire. martha: it turns out it was just

a mistake. he said if he had $4 trillion, he said he would use $3 trillion to get us from $17 trillion to $13 trillion for the national debt. bill: is the irs still going after conservatives and tea party favorites. a doctor says he was audited by the irs for the first time in his life after he challenged the president's leadership at a prayer breakfast. >> whether that was the case or not, the fundamental issuer is the freedom of our citizens is being threatened. i think this is a much more serious thing than iran-contra or watergate or benghazi-gate.

bill: jay sekulow is a friend of dr. ben carson. sir, good morning to you. you were speaking with ben carson just this morning? what did he tell you about this? >> before going on the interview i wanted to confirm the details about what he released in this speech and to bill o'reilly. dr. carson said he gave the prayer breakfast speech in february and a limited audit was begun on property holdings starting in june. it was a limited eight. they found nothing wrong. and the irs decided to do a full audit going a year back. in august he got the tall clear in his own word, the irs quit.

bill: dose think he was a target because there are more questions they asked, or could you chalk this up to a coincidence? >> it's possible it's a coincidence. but based on everything else going on,ed the fact that billy gram evangelical association was audited for the first time in its history. samaritan's purse was eighted. they took out an ad saying "vote your faith." we had business owners audited who were big romney donors. the irs was going after people using their power to intimidate them and try to silence them. unlike the tea party dr. carson did not back down and did not

release this information. bill report other side would say you can't prove it, and honestly it could be difficult thing to prove. how would you argue that? >> dr. carson can choose if he wants to challenge the irs. but the irs when they do these audits and find no change, it raises the suspicion of all lawyers including organizations that are not on the right by any means like crew which looks at responsibility in government. they say they weren't shocked about the irs tea party that didn't raise red flags, but when they heard about dr. carson it did raise flags . this is a liberal group who didn't think the tea party scandal was a scandal. but they did find this a scandal. they had no purpose to do the audit. bill: you represent what, 41

clients? where does that case stand now for your clients? >> you remember that list that came out with 152 groups and why they were delayed. we are filing again a motion to file an amended complaint. we know why 33 of our clients were delayed or targeted. they were hoping to file that by the latest october 18. basically that list changed everything in our lawsuit for 33 of our clients. bill: thank you, appreciate the time. martha: take a look at this. a 3 1/2 inch nail that a man shot into his own heart. there is the nail. that lucky man survived and he's here to tell us what happened. >> when it hit me i my was in

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martha: the father of 7 accidentally shoots himself in the heart with a nail gun and lives to tell the tale. a carpenter was building a deck for a neighbor when he fired a 3 1/2 inch nail into his chest. he called his wife and she drove him to the hospital where the doctors found that nail punctured his heart tweet. eugene joins us now. thank you for being with us today. what an unbelievable story this

is. >> yes, it's something ... martha: you went over to help a friend with his deck. how did it physically happen. >> i was building the deck and it was chest high. i was shooting a nail at an angle. it bounced and i still had my hand on the trirl and it bounced down and hit my chest. i pulled my t-shirt and it was hart to get my breath. i thought i can't believe just did this. i shot myself in the chest. the next thing that went through my mind, this is serious. my cell phone was in my truck right aroun around the corner. as i'm walk you are trying to

diagnose and i could hear it gurgle and crunch. i'd called my wife and said get over sheer as fast as you can i just shot myself with a nail in the chest. i said get me to the hospital. martha: she screams over there and gets you. you get in a car with her. you are not even in an ambulance. what is she saying to you on the way over. how does this happen, honey? we have 7 children? you have got to ... >> she said, are you going to die? i said just drive, step on it. we'll get there as fast as we can, call ahead and let them know we are coming. she got a little panicky for a while. i said showed yourself together. we have got to get there. martha: how long was that drive. >> about 4 miles.

it wasn't very far. martha: i'll bet it felt like it took a long time that day. >> it's not a big hospital. they asked me the questions what happened. and the one gentleman said you mean the nail ricochetted and hit nut chest? i said no i have a nail in my chest. they cut my shirt off and took my muddy shoes off and prepared me and said we'll have to send you down to hcmc in the twin cities. they put me in the ambulance and i went down to hcmc to the emergency room there. martha: i said yesterday when we told this story that it wasn't your time. is that what you think? >> god has got another plan for me. martha: we are so glad for you. what a crazy story. thank you for being with us. have a great weekend.

feel better, have some rest. bill: you are one tough man, eugene. there are new numbers from our fox polling team that will surprise you. next.

mar r mar mash trs the from the clap but-- it's the trillion dollar question, could a deal be in the works? we're now into the fourth day of this as we welcome you to -- there's a live shot, they're moving around, a little bit of activity, and we're starting hour two of "america's newsroom." i'm march -- martha maccallum. bill: growing concerns the shutdown and the debt limit could collide into a super standoff. so far no signs of a budget here. -- budge here. the house republicans plan to push a series of mini spending bills in the coming days, and just two weeks from now, congress will need to come together again and decide the next crisis on the nation's debt

limit. will either side budge then? eric cantor. >> it's time for the president and senate democrats to put partisanship aside and sit down at a table so we can work out our differences. >> right now we need a big deal. we've got $17 trillion of debt. raising the debt doesn't fix the debt. i've always been the first to say that. so i want a long-term solution to this short-term problem that we seem to have every three to six months. >> it appears to me that the cr discussion and the debt ceiling discussion are going to be combined maybe into one effort. bill: mike emanuel's back on the hill. he hasn't left, in fact. [laughter] what are the democratic leaders saying about these two fiscal issues colliding? the days are getting thin. >> reporter: that's right, bill. we're less than two weeks out from hitting the nation's debt ceiling, and so you heard some bipartisan optimism there from senators corker and manchin

thinking this is an opportunity for a big deal, but the top democrats here on capitol hill, well, they don't seem to like these two huge issues colliding. take a listen. >> we will act on a clean debt ceiling, and the president has said he's not going to negotiate on the debt ceiling. he's not going to negotiate, we're not either. it's never happened in the history of country. there's never been a negotiation like this. >> they're stalling for time so that they can jam the, this up against the debt ceiling. i hope they prove me wrong. >> reporter: you heard the senate majority leader, harry reid, talk about a clean debt ceiling vote, but a lot of people i've talked to think he does not have the votes in the united states senate to just raise the debt ceiling without any concessions, and there are certainly not the votes in the house of representatives for just raising the debt ceiling without some kind of dealing. so the question is, when will they finally get to the table, bill? bill: all right. day four, and viewers they wake up in the morning, they turn us on, and they want to know whether or not this thing will

be resolved soon or not. how would you answer that? >> reporter: what's striking is the lack of urgency here in washington in general. you've got that quote from a senior administration official saying we're not in any rush because we feel like we're winning. i've talked to all the various offices of leadership, are there any formal talks going on? no. no formal talks going on at this point. a lot of blame game going on. the house of representatives is going to keep passing bills to try and press the senate to take up some of these spending priorities. so a lot of blame game, and here's a key senator in the middle of the action. >> it is because harry reid is shutting down the government, and he's objecting to allowing us to fund the va. he's effectively saying he wants to hold veterans hostage in order to force obamacare on the american people. >> reporter: so lawmakers are here on a friday, a lot of times they are back in their home districts. they are actually in town, in washington, but with no formal talks, there are no indications this is going to end anytime

soon. bill: thank you, mike, mike emanuel on the hill doing duty for us. martha: you hear a lot about this name calling in washington over the shutdown. the rhetoric gets nastier every day, it feels. here's more from senator ted cruz of texas. >> the more progress we have made, the more energy there has been from the american people behind defunding obama kay, behind -- obamacare, behind stopping the harms from obamacare, the nastier the democrats have gotten. it's gotten more and more personal. they have been using personal invective, they've been calling us anarchists and terrorists. and be listen, greta, i think that's a sign of the fact that they're concerned. martha: maybe so, right? meantime, senate majority leader harry reid putting the blame on the house speaker, john boehner, and he made this remark. watch this. >> some recent stories have even suggested that the speaker's keeping the government shut down because i hurt his feelings. if that's true, i'm sorry that i

hurt your feelings. martha: oh, boy, right? i mean, for now we've got a panel on what all of this means. we'll weigh in on the rhetoric in washington and what's the real impact on your life and this budget battle. bill: in the meantime, republican senator mike lee says he will not back down on the obamacare fight despite the impact of the shutdown. >> what the democrats are doing here is they're saying to us unless you are willing to fund everything, we will not allow you to fund anything. unless you are willing to fund obamacare, we won't let you fund benefits for veterans. now that's pretty twisted. that's wrong. the american people demand better. bill: also in that interview senator lee saying that democrats -- or the senator, rather, says the democrats need to learn how to compromise. martha: so what is the end game here? both sides are taking a lot of heat for this shutdown. a new fox news poll asking who

is the most responsible for the stalemate, take a look at how that came out. speaker boehner and president obama tied at 25% each. bret baier's the anchor, of course, of "special report" every evening, and he joins me now. they sound like a bunch of kids in some ways, hurling these insults at each other. and then you've got approval numbers more congress at practically, you know, 11%, i think. people are just disgusted. where are we going heresome. >> they really are. you talk to people any place outside the beltway, and they'll say this is just ridiculous, you know, the whole back and forth. that said, where are we going? i think that the consensus now is that these two things are going to roll together. you'll see the government shutdown roll into the debt ceiling deal, and that there'll be some kind of effort to have some resolution of both of them. now, can the president negotiate on the shutting down of the government and not negotiate on the debt ceiling and thereby keep his promise not to

negotiate? i don't know. it was one democratic senator talked to politico today and said this: in the past i've been frustrated because i wasn't in the room on negotiations. he said today i'm not sure there is a room. martha: yeah. that caught my eye as well. and we just heard mike emanuel confirm that, bret, because he said he's spoken to leadership in every office on capitol hill, there's no room, there's no dealing, there's no discussing. i think a lot of people hear that, and they say, you know, what do we elect these folks for if everybody's going to stand at the wall and look at each other and say, no way, we are not budging? and how about this quote from the white house this morning? we're winning, it really doesn't matter to us how long this hutdown lasts because what -- shutdown lasts because what matters is the end result. >> that's a tough quote because that quote will come back in the next few days, however long it takes, and at some point the pendulum will swing. i mean, yes, in polls the gop is

taking it on the chin for some of this, you know? people get upset when we say what polls are showing, but it's true. there will be a point though, martha, that the no negotiation and we're not talking about anything will not be as viable perhaps as it is in these early days. martha: so where do we go from here? you know, john boehner has hinted that he will not let the united states default on its debt. how he gets there, i guess, remains the big question. and whether or not it all gets folded into one big package and if they can, you know, get any of this along the way, it feels like the gop has very little leverage at moment anyway. >> yeah, that's right. and this passing of the spending bills one by one, what is the end game there? eventually, what are you going to to back the democrats into what corner? even if they said yes to all of the funding of the to va and nih and all of these individual spending efforts, what then?

the democratic list that they want approved is at the back of the line. that's really not a ton of leverage on the democrats. so it then becomes president obama and whether there is going to be some coming together on this and providing speaker boehner something of a win, a w, an exit ramp, whatever you want to call it. one technical thing though, martha, is that the technical default would never really happen. in that the tax revenues would still be coming in, and the government would have to choose not to pay the interest on the debt first to really default. that wouldn't happen, but it's just a word that we use broad in an umbrella sense. martha: and it's a moment that possibly might get some spending cuts which a lot of folks have been pushing for for a long time. we'll see if they get it. we'll see you tonight. bill: so what do you think? when will there be a deal?

tell us what you think @bill hemmer and @martha maccallum. we'll add them up and let you know how you're coming down. martha: i love that quote, you know? the senator says i used to be upset that i wasn't in the room, you know? how come i'm left out, i want to be in the negotiations. there's no room. no negotiation. bill: i thought mike emanuel said it, very telling how quiet it is on the hill. breaking news now, central egypt getting reported from reuters, get this, military vehicles firing live rounds at muslim brotherhood supporters near tahrir square according to a witness on scene there. there were hundreds of supporters of the deposed leader, mohamed morsi, that took to the streets after friday, day of prayers. we're working for some pictures on this and also some folks on the ground to try and confirm some of the reporting we're getting, but live rounds fired by the egyptian army at muslim brotherhood supporters in central cairo. more on that in a moment. breaking news now in cairo.

martha: well, it is also day four today of the obamacare launch, and there are still problems with the online exchanges. so how many people have actually signed up at this point? we've got some really interesting numbers for you on this. plus this: [gunfire] bill: that is just a remarkable thing to watch and to hear. chaos on the capitol. gun shots fired as a woman leads police on a high-speed chase with a child in her car. we are learning more details about her this morning, we'll have that for you. also, there is this -- martha: this movie's getting incredible reviews. it's going to be packed this weekend. so how real is what happens in gravity? my gosh, you can even see this thing in 3-d. we're going to ask if an astronaut could really survive if that happened.

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bill: say it ain't snow, maccallum. that is snow. martha: it sure is. bill: falling near boulder, colorado. martha: wow. bill: i mean, come on. martha: october 4th. bill: that some coming from the pacific northwest, some areas could get 18 inch obviously the white stuff not just in colorado, but in the dakotas also. it's coming, old man winter. martha: and a fox news alert, our nation's capitol on edge as we learn stunning new details about the mental health of the woman who led police on a high-speed chase through washington yesterday afternoon. [gunfire] [bleep] martha: firing as she takes off x there she goes.

what a tragedy this story is. the suspect behind the wheel was killed by the officers, 34-year-old miriam kerry reportedly suffered postpartum depression. her 1-year-old child was in the backseat during this whole ordeal yesterday, and now a new report claims that the woman believed that president obama was stalking her. clearly, she had mental issues and was disturbed from everything we're hearing. i'm joined now by dr. keith ablow, forensic psychiatrist and a member of the fox news medical a-team, and phil mudd is a counterterrorism analyst and a former intelligence adviser. gentlemen, welcome. good to have both of you here today. let's look at this from the law enforcement and intelligence side of it first, phil, because obviously what starts to go through everybody's mind, is this an attack, is something going on? when you hear that there are police running all over the capitol, and they're locking down the building. what went through your mind as you saw this, phil? >> i tell you, there are two

things that i thought of. the first is i went back to my old life, and 12 years after 9/11, i react the same way everyone does, please don't make in the kind of terrorist tragedy that we're concerned about in the united states. and the second thing, of course, is the tragedy of a child that's going to grow up without a mother. i think the police did the right thing, they potentially safed a lot of lives in washington, but it's still a tragedy. martha: it is. it's so tragic when you learn about this woman, dr. ab low, and once again, another story about a person who obviously has some mental health issues and is now no longer with us. >> absolutely. and listen, you know, here's the lunacy, if you will, of the way we've been approaching this or some people have been approaching this. if this woman had shot at the white house instead of driven her car toward the capitol building, we would be talking or many people would be about gun rights and restricting them.

mental illness turns out to be the problem many almost all of the episodes of terrible violence that we've witnessed other than terrorism itself, and here's another woman, postpartum depression's very common. it can cause psychosis, especially among people who are vulnerable anyhow to depression. and i've seen people suffering with delusions, paranoia. so the story may well hold together and, sadly, people can become violent in those circumstances. martha: yeah a. and as you point out, you know, this little child in the backseat, you know, will be without a mom, and it's such a shame that this -- her issues weren't able to be addressed sooner and the whole thing could have been prevented. but, phil, you know, when you look at it and you think about what happens at the navy yard and how we look at these situations and we learn from them if there's anything that can be taken away from it, how did they do in terms of handling the situation, and what lesson

is there if, indeed can, they find themselves in a, god forbid, terrorist situation in that area? >> i mean, i've worked with the capitol police before, they're pretty good. they practice these scenarios. you have to remember no matter how much you practice, this is one of the most densely populated tourist areas in the country. martha: yep. >> and in that kind of situation, you're not going to avoid chaos. clearly, one of the questions we have to ask here is the use of lethal force when we find the woman didn't have a weapon, and i don't judge, i think they did quite well. that vehicle in that scenario is a lethal weapon. if she had mowed down people at a bus station, we would have said why didn't they act earlier. i look at and say they did fine. martha: i think you're right about that, because it clearly becomes one of the questions, keith. and you look at it -- and she was -- that is a lethal weapon, that car, and she clearly could have plowed into people along the streets, and it appears that the police had no choice, doctor. >> you know, martha, i lost a dear friend of mine who was a

fellow psychiatry resident to a sigh cot kick man who -- psychotic man who killed him with a car going back now 20 years ago. so these are, sadly, not so isolated as events, and what's more here, while i'm glad to hear that the capitol police will probably be seen to have acted properly, i will tell you if we track back in this woman's clip call care, i can't give you the same assurances. why? because our mental health care system, as you and i have talked about before, is shattered, and i guarantee you there were opportunities to prevent this tragedy clinically that can't be actualized because our mental health care system is a wreck. martha: yeah. and we need to point to it again and again and again and get reform to be put in place -- absolutely. martha: -- in some way, shape or form. doctor, thank you very much. phil, great to talk to you again. bill: brand new details on a brutal mob attack that's grabbed national attention.

what authorities are now saying about the key suspect seen right there and what it could mean for the case. that's coming up. martha: and major controversy in one state after a police officer is asked to stop wearing his uniform when he drops off his child at scoop. at school. >> i was a little surprised. i think it's his right to wear that in public. if my kids saw it, i think they would actually feel protected to see a man in uniform at their school. ♪ [ male announcer ] may your lights always be green. [ tires reech ] ♪ [ beeping ] ♪ may you never be stuck behind a stinky truck. [ beeping ] ♪ may things always go your way. but it's good to be prepared... just in case they don't. toyota. let's go places, safely.

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female announcer: on a huge selection of clearance mattresses. get two years interest-free financing on tempur-pedic. sleep train's inventory clearance sale is on now. ♪ your ticket to a better night's sleep ♪ martha: so a police officer picking up his daughter at an elementary school in arizona got a stern message from the principal: don't wear your uniform be here again, because your gun is scaring the other parents. the police officer posted his reaction on facebook saying, quote: nothing like your kid's school calling and asking if i could not come pick up my daughter in uniform because

parents were concerned when their kids came home telling them there was a man at school with a gun. okay, so this is where we are with this, right? the school district ended up apologizing saying that the principal did not intend to offend the police officer. bill: new york city police identified the key suspect in a brutal mob attack on an suv driver last sunday afternoon. the video, it's gone well viral by now. a biker bashing in the driver's window with his helmet after a wild chase on a new york city highway. meanwhile, the wife of a hospitalized biker has retained gloria allred -- that's the celebrity attorney -- for a possible case existence the driver of the suv -- against the driver of the suv. david lee miller's keeping track of all of this. what more do we know, david lee? >> reporter: at this hour apparently there are no charges that have been filed against the driver here. he is not facing any criminal charges as of now, but authorities underscore that a this is an ongoing investigation and that might very well change.

when he fled the scene after his suv was surrounded by the bikers, he ran over edwin causing serious injury including possible paralysis. the victim's wife said that her husband was forced to take the action that he did, and in a realitied development this morning, there is a report that he was driving with a revoked driver's license. he is a massachusetts resident and does not have a montana license. and as for -- massachusetts license. and as for that news conference you mentioned, a few moment ago i got an e-mail from gloria allred's office, she said nothing will be said until that news conference -- bill: so it's a possibility then. >> i think they're paving the way for a civil lawsuit. martha: sounds like it. bill: what do we know about more arrests? >> reporter: it is being widely reported that the man seen taking off his helmet and smashing the window of the suv,

then dragging the driver out of the car is expected to turno co. he is identified in numerous reports as a 38-year-old sandwich worker or originally from guyana. meanwhile, in court this morning was christopher cruz on video, he is the biker who slowed down in the front of the suv allegedly instigating this entire incident. cruz was charged earlier this week with reckless driving and unlawful imprisonment and was released on $1500 bail. a few moments ago we caught up with his attorney outside the courts in lower manhattan. listen. >> my client was rear ended by the suv, and my client never left the scene of the accident, he followed all the procedures in this accident, he waited for the police, he went to the hospital afterward to be attended to for his injuries, and then he went to the police station. >> reporter: and what's crucial here is that according to cruz's attorney, his client has no idea who any of the other bikers were on that video.

some of those other individuals still presumably being sought by cops, facing possible charges. bill: clearly not over. >> reporter: indeed not. bill: thank you, david lee. martha: all right. well, today is day four, october 4th, but also day four of obamacare. so how many people have actually successfully been able to sign up at this point? we've got the kind of surprising numbers for you on that coming up. plus this -- >> grab ahold of anything you can. bill: this is the new film called "gravity," and it's out today, and it look stunning. the story of an astronaut literally lost in space. could this be reality for nasa? >> what do i do?

martha: we're watching on the wires that there are protests erupting across cities in egypt and particularly in cairo, and now we have a report that at least one person has been killed as military vehicles have been firing live rounds at muslim brotherhood supporters near cairo's tahrir square. so we'll continue to keep a close eye on that situation as it develops. ♪ ♪ bill: in the meantime, day four of the shutdown, and day four of

obamacare and the exchanges, and the white house is asking everybody, be patient, problems persist for americans trying to sign up for health insurance online. we sent fox business network's gerri willis online where she's been all week, haven't you, gerri? [laughter] >> that's right. bill: and byron york joined us on day one, fox news contributor, on tuesday morning, and you were doing your own research, too, byron. we'll get to you on that in a moment and also the waiver issue. but, gerri, what have you found out in terms of raw numbers for people who are online or signing up? >> all right, devil's in the details. the government reported they had 4.7 million people sign onto healthcare.gov, but those numbers look suspect. california originally said they had five million people sign on, turns out it was only 645,000 people. also big numbers originally reported in new york state, not true again.

44,000 people signed on. now, when you look at the most important number, right? who actually got coverage, who actually got enrolled in obamacare, the numbers get even smaller. in the state of north carolina, one person was enrolled by blue cross blue shield. the best numbers, the highest numbers come out of kentucky where they had some 3,000 people enrolled. so i think the expectations were extremely high, they are dashed today. this is going very slow. bill: okay, back up just a little bit here. one person in north carolina? that's the information -- >> yeah. blue cross blue shield, that's their number. bill: in kentucky, the president was out yesterday touting kentucky and flocking to the online sign-up. but kentucky's not on the federal plan, are they? didn't they go ahead and set up their own plan statewide? >> no. and that's why they supposedly did so well because they set up their own web site, they really promoted, they got out there and told people about it, so people knew to sign up. therefore, they got 3,000 enrollees, and that is the very

best performance across the country. bill: okay. now, you're saying -- new york had ten million hits, i thought, right? what was it? >> they had ten million people sign on, but they think they had a denial of service attack because, let's face it, there's only 20 million people shivving in the state -- living in the state of new york, so the idea that half the folks got online is hard to believe. and in reality, last night the new york state officials came out and said it was only 44,000 people. bill: okay, got it. byron, on tuesday morning they said there would be sticker shock because -- >> well -- bill: -- enrolling was a lot more expensive than even you had expected. go. what'd you find out? >> two big problems. one is people are having trouble just getting on, and the web sites are not working, and they're telling them to come back later. and the other problem is when it actually works, what the insurance costs. that's a huge issue. and not does it cost more than obama officials had projected a couple of years ago, but does it cost more than they're already paying if they currently have

insurance. so that's the, that's the huge problem here. and the administration, i mean, those numbers that gerri has are really, really troubling for them. they need about seven million people not to visit web sites b i to actually buy insurance -- bill: listen, we're going to lean on both of you in the coming weeks to figure this out. bya now, how can the president legally grant a waiver? byron, how is that possible? >> well, a lot of experts believe he can't. obamacare, the law, contains a lot of discretionary clauses for the secretary of health and human services to use her discretion on this or that, but is this report necessary, when is this report due? the fundamental part of the law, that is the employer mandate, for example, that a's supposed to go into effect on january 1, that's right there in black and white. the problem is when the president does something, he basically dares somebody else to stop him.

and congress has not stepped in. congress would be the obvious -- bill: you're right about that. they had a chance this week to stop the subsidies, remember, congress, and they did not do it. let me just show our viewers, subsidy verification delayed, out of pocket caps delayed, small business online enrollment delayed, congress gets subsidies, i mentioned there. is any of that reversible under the law, byron? >> not unless somebody files a lawsuit and wins or congress actually takes action, and there are enough democrats in congress to stop any republican attempts to change the law. we've seen that this week. and unless there's a lawsuit and the president loses, he can actually do this. bill: we will see if that happens. you holding your breath? [laughter] >> not anytime soon, bill. bill: me neither. i like to breathe. byron, thank you. gerri, we'll check out "the willis report." her special series continues, a user's guide to obamacare. 6:00 eastern time, you will find

her only on the fox business network. to viewers at home, hemmer@foxnews.com is the e-mail or send us a tweet @bill hemmer, because you asked, bya. martha? martha: well, the political blame game is raging on in d.c. >> they've shut down the government over an ideological crusade to deny affordable health insurance to millions of americans. in other words, they demanded ransom just for doing their jobs. martha: ransom and kidnapping and anarchy and all sorts of words flying around in d.c. right now. if the president's doing it, how can you expect lawmakers not to? harry reid with interesting comments moments ago on this. our panel is coming up. bill: check this out, is that a squirrel on tiger woods' neck, and will that make him a better golfer? martha: oh, my gosh. ♪ ♪

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bill: they were just playing golf, and then she -- watch tiger woods' girlfriend, skier lindsey vonn. that was a live squirrel. she tried to put it on tiger's shoulder. he wanted to watch golf. get away from me. his reaction? priceless. is that a squirrel in your pocket, or are you just -- [laughter] bill: so it did not look like he was very pleased. i'm trying to see where that went, hang on. martha: gosh. don't ever put a squirrel on my shoulder. that is so gross. i love animals, but squirrels don't belong on people's shoulders, and clearly he knew he was on camera, and he tried to be cool about it, but i'm sorry. that's weird. weird, weird, weird, weird. ♪ martha: all right, how about this? new questions into president

obama's leadership throughout the government shutdown stalemate. the president says he has gone above and beyond and bent over backwards to work with republicans throughout. watch this. >> during the course of my presidency, i have bent over backwards to work with the republican party and have purposely kept my rhetoric down. martha: but has he? really been keeping the rhetoric down? here are some of the president's recent comments in the last week on the shutdown. you decide. >> if you've talked to somebody who said, i don't know, i was watching fox news, and they said this is horrible -- [laughter] and you, and you can say, you know what? don't take my word for it. go on the web site. you don't get to extract a ransom for doing your job. for doing what you're supposed to be doing anyway. or just because there's a law will that you don't like. they've shut down the government over an ideological crusade to

deny affordable health insurance to millions of americans. in other words, they demanded ransom just for doing their jobs. finish. martha: okay. julie roginsky is a fox news contributor, jason mater rah is an author and radio talk show host. welcome to both of you, good to have you here today. >> good morning. martha: so, julie, he says he's bent over backwards, and yet a lot of people are saying where is the president's leadership in this situation. >> >> well, you know, the reason we're in this situation is because he's bent over backwards a little too much, and i think he's given time and time again has given, given, given. these guys know they can walk all over him. he hasn't shown strong leadership in the past, and i've criticized him for it. i don't think he's used the bully pulpit enough. look, at the end of the day where he is drawing a line is saying if you want to get rid of the affordable health care act, you voted for it 41 times, you appealed it to the supreme

court, all of those issues did not make it go away. now you're essentially holding the economy hostage, and you're holding -- and so i understand where he's coming from. this is not something that we're going to shut down the government over. it's over. these guys have to move on. martha: all right. let's hear what jason has to say about that. times.says he has given in way >> yeah. yeah, way too many times. listen, liberals and president obama, too, need a history lesson. we live in america, and there are checks and balances. oh s and constitutionally the house of representatives has the power of the purse. they get to originate revenue bills. so barack obama needs to be reminded that he is not a dictator. this is not a dictatorship. the house of representatives was elected with a republican majority just like he was elected. therefore, they come together and negotiate. and let's not, you know, let's not play game like, oh, we've never used the debt limit and spending measures in american history as leverage. we've been doing this both republicans and democrats since president eisenhower. s this is not something that is

new. martha: all right. you know -- >> president obama should have a sense of urgency. martha: you know, in looking back to see what he might be referring to when he says he's bent over backwards, julie, there's mention of all the dinners that happened, republican den ors at the white house over the spring and the charm offensive, some called it the diner's club, these dinners were happening so frequently. do you think that there's a chance that he's peeved that that didn't work? it didn't get anywhere? >> no, i'll tell you where he's peeved and i'm beefed, the whole -- peed, the whole continuing resolution, look, we can fund this government at funding levels. and yet already we're having this whole debate over funding something at levels that are way below what he wants to fund them at and way below what the democratic party wants to -- >> but that was a concession -- >> let me finish my point. >> that was a concession. hurry up. >> thank you. i'm not on your show, so you don't have to tell me to hurry up.

the republicans have already won. we're funding at sequester levels. you've got it. congratulations. >> listen, sequester levels was a concession back in 2011, and a negotiation for 2011. we're now in 2013. different matter -- >> not at all. let me -- [inaudible conversations] martha: hold on. it is my show, so i'm going to step in -- hold on. >> president obama -- martha: jason, jason! whoa, hold on. i want to get this in here, and i want to get to it. no way to run a country. you've got thomas jefferson looking at john boehner and president obama wrestling on top of mount rushmore. this is what "the economist" thinks of how we're doing things here, julie. >> you know, they're right. it is the no way to run a country. i would never support holding the debt limit hostage. by the way, revenue that's already been appropriated in the senate and the congress, why would you hold the debt limit hostage over this? >> it's been done. >> why would you hold the

affordable care act which the republicans tried, god knows they tried -- >> because it's unpopular. >> i'm answering your question. over 70% of the american public in a poll today said that they want to decouple discussion of funding of obamacare from opening the government. so you guys are preaching to the choir, jason, of 23, 30% of the voters. >> again. listen, listen -- martha: final thoughts, jason. go ahead. >> democrats are doing nothing. in fact, they've even said, chuck schumer and dick durbin have said, listen, we can scrap the medical device tax. it's the democrats who are being obstinate -- >> and the president has said that he's open to fixing anything that's wrong with the health care -- >> which is a lot. martha: that's a perfect example, because he had a lot of democrats, bipartisan agreement on -- and -- and we could have that discussion just not over the debt limit and not over funding the government. that's where the problem arises.

martha: julie and jason, you guys are talk show panel for a reason. well done. >> thank you, martha. martha: see you next time. whew! bill: get ready for a wild ride, "gravity" in theaters today, but could an astronaut ever survive this?

jon: the shutdown showdown drags on with no deal in sight although there are some reports speaker john boehner says he will not allow the u.s. to default on its debt. live reports and political an sis plus -- analysis. and speaking of media coverage, have the media done a good job covering the rollout of

obamacare exchanges, or has it been overshadowed by the shutdown? and new details today on just what went down yesterday afternoon on constitution avenue, that horrific shooting outside the capitol. join jenna lee and me in seven minutes, "happening now." ♪ ♪ pressure. bill: the heart-stopping new film "gravity" is out today, and you have to see this to believe it. just roll it and watch here. >> astronaut is off structure! off structure! dr. stone -- >> no! >> that arm's going to carry you too far. you need to listen to my voice. focus. in just a few seconds, i won't be able to see you. do it, now! bill: it just goes on from there. discover magazine editor at large corey powell is here to walk us through what could be a potential nightmare. you've seen the movie, you're not going to give anything away. sandra bullock is in the film and so is george clooney.

it looks to be a huge hit this coming weekend. the premise is this, the russians have a dead satellite in space. they blow it up, it causes all this space debris to fly around the area where they are around the hubbel telescope. the space debris is a reality. it happens all the time. >> absolutely. so we sometimes forget because we've been doing this for such a long time now. space is a very dangerous place, and we're actually making it more dangerous by building up the extra debris in earth orbit. there are about 500,000 pieces of everything from old cameras, bits of rocket boosters, just junk flying around in orbit at about 17,000 miles an hour. bill: so that's a problem. >> that's a problem. bill: that's a legitimate reality that has played out in this film. >> it's a real shooting gallery out there, and sometimes the space station or the shuttle actually has to dodge pieces -- bill: they steer it one way or the other. the other issue is the tether.

in the clips the tether snaps. how real is that possibility? >> well, so you can also see in the clips george clooney is sort of flying free, and sandra bullock has a tether. in fact, everybody is tethered, and everybody would stay very, very close to the station. the situation they're describing is where there's not just one piece of space debris, we've never experienced that. the tethers aren't designed to handle that kind of load, so that -- bill bill that's possible, too. we're two for two right now. sandra bullock floats off into space, and the question becomes, does she stay alive? can you survive? >> so the standard space suit on a space station care rays -- carries about eight hours of air with a half hour of reserve. after that, if you you can't fia

way to get back into the space station, you're in a tough situation. bill: you were telling me there was a situation in july where an italian restaurant nearly drowned -- astronaut, nearly drowned in his space suit. >> they're still investigating exactly what happened, it looked like his environmental controls sprang a leak, the water that maintains temperature sprang a leak. he started to fill up like a fish tank. he got about half a gallon of water inside, and in zero g it just sticks to you. bill: he's okay. he survived. >> he's okay. but he went into a tumble while his suit was filling with water. bill: should we see the movie or not? >> you should see the movie. the movie is, it is terrifying and beautiful. it's one of the most beautiful movies i've seen. bill: corey powell, have a great weekend. martha: that's what i'm going to do this weekend. thanks, guys. well, you know the federal government has shut down for business, and the budget standoff drags on. are we any closer to a deal, folks?

martha: so -- bill: so? martha: you going to see "gravity" this weekend? i will bring you my review on monday. "happening now" starts right now. bye-bye. jon: breaking news on the gridlock in washington. but right now some brand new stories you will see here first. jenna: information on the disappearance of madelyn mccan. phone records helping identify new suspects this cold case. the partial government shutdown how it is impacting the governors race in virginia. a minnesota mom is suing her former boss allegely firing her after she posed for "playboy." does she have a case? our legal panel weighs in. it is all "happening now." jenna: here we are at day four. jon: count them,