catch me on saturday at 11:30 a.m. t. bill welcome back monday. remember, the spin stops here because we are looking out for you. back of the book segment tonight. welcome to the a big night tonight on "the kelly file." charles krauthammer live with an interesting new explanation of what really went wrong with obamacare. plus, a new warning from surgeons tonight. >> we just don't know. >> they don't know what plans will be available, what services will be available. no one knows what will happen january 1st. >> dr. novak is here in a "the kelly file" exclusive. and a special message from mistletoe madison. wait until you see how she's doing two weeks after she was told it's better to beg than to work without the proper paperwork. we start tonight with a

breaking update from a school shooting in centennial, colorado. welcome to "the kelly file." i'm megyn kelly. at this hour, two student victims have been hospitalized. one, a girl, is in serious condition. the gunman is dead, believed to have turned his weapon on himself. earlier students were seen pouring out of the high school with their hands up. video shows them being patted down while nearby schools went on lockdown. the shoot er asked for a teacher by name. when that teacher learned he was targeted he left the school in hopes, we understand, that it would encourage the gunman to leave, too. the shooting comes a day before we mark a year since the newtown school tragedy. earlier, i had a remarkable conversation with six family members who lost loved ones on that sad december day. you will hear from them a little later in the show. also in the news tonight, is santa claus real and what does he look like?

hide the kids, mom and dad. spoiler alert. apparently we ignited a controversy the other night in a segment about an essay that argues santa should no longer be portrayed as a white man. the african-american author of the piece, aisha harris, was upset about the commercial depiction of santa claus as white and argued that a, quote, fat old white man who is, quote, melanin deficient, made her feel ashamed as a child. thus necessitating an image makeover. kicking off the light-hearted segment i offered a tongue in cheek message for any kids watching saying that santa, who i joked is a real person whose race is identifiable, is white just as harris claimed in her piece but that we were debating whether that should somehow change.

they have a piece that santa claus shouldn't be a white man anymore. yet another person saying it's racist to have a white santa. by the way, for the kids at home, santa just is white but this person is arguing that maybe we should also have a black santa. santa is what he is and we are debating this because someone wrote about it. when i read the piece, the author seems to have -- you know, she's african-american. know, she's african-american. she seems to have real pain at having grown up with the image of a white santa. she speaks honestly saying i didn't understand why that had to be. >> i realize that the piece by harris which went on to argue that santa should be a penguin was also tongue in cheek. that's in part why we covered the story in the first place. humor is part of what we try to bring to the show. sometimes that's lost on the humorless. many questioned whether i understand that santa is a mythical figure.

others suggesting i am a racist who is outraged at the idea of a black santa. >> all right. everybody is waiting for this segment. grab your popcorn. turn the volume up in your office. close the door. sit down. here we go. if you thought santa claus or jesus christ were anything other than white, fox news anchor megyn kelly wants you to know you are wrong. kelly says both with were white and that's a fact. >> thank you for trying to err on the side of inclusive ti. penguin santa makes sense. to get outraged at the idea that there are nonwhite santas is ridiculous. i guarantee you right now if you were to walk into the home of an african-american person almost anywhere in the country you would find a black santa, black angels and a black jesus. >> that bothered me the most was the way that kelly and the otheother s kind of said it so angrily.

you're insisting that this not real figure must be white. >> all right. all fictional people are white. in the bible. santa just is white. like christmas. it's a white christmas. by the way, what kids are watching fox news at home? weird kids. >> we're back in a moment. >> outraged? well, this would be funny if it were not so telling about our society. in the particular the knee jerk instinct by so many to race bait and to assume the worst in people, especially people employeed by the very powerful fox news channel. contrary to what my critics posited neither my statement nor harris's, i'm sure was motivated by racial fear or loathing. it was less sinister. a lifetime of exposure to the same, quote, commercials, mall casting calls and movies harris references in her piece from

"miracle on 34th street" to the thanksgiving parade to the national christmas tree lighting we continually see oh st. nick as a white man in maodern day america. should that change? that didn't get acknowledged because i acknowledged that the most common image of santa has white skin. i also did say jesus is white and that's far from settled. for me, the fact that an offhand jest i made about whether santa should be replaced by a penguin has now become a national firestorm says two things. race is still an incredibly volatile issue in this country and fox news and yours truly are big targets for many people. but tonight take my word for it. our panel debates after the break. >> okay, people. tomorrow morning, 8:00 a.m., santa's coming to town --

>> santa! oh, my god! santa here? i know him. i know him.

back now to santa. ms. harris who wrote the original article and went on a rival cable network to describe our segment as angry lamented online she hasn't been asked on the show. we extended the invitation but slate denied the request.

the website would rather sling arrows from the privacy of its offices than allow a debate. happily zirlina maxwell is here. she's also un happy with the segment and bishop harry jackson is here. thank you for being here. where did i go wrong? >> i think you demanded that santa be white when santa is a imagine -- magical man that flied around in a sled, not a real sled. kids should use their imagination and make him whatever they want him to be. if he's white, black, it doesn't matter. the insistence that he must be white simply because advertisers portrayed him this way in america, i think that was the thing that turned people off. i don't think you're a racist. i don't know what's in your heart. i don't call people reyacists.

but the insistence that he must be white is something we should think about. >> how did i demand and insist that he must be white? >> you said he just is white. that is the case. >> okay, but let me stop you there. i was trying to explain this in the talking points. we have already given the spoiler alert at the top of the show. we know there is no santa. he's a mythical character. >> right. >> the only santa i could have been referring to is the commercially driven image of santa. i was arguing that the image is of a white santa. that's the very same thing that aisha harris acknowledged in her piece and was arguing we need to change. she and i were on the same page about the fact that the image that is portrayed is white. we were the same. when she described him as melanin deficient no one cried

racism. when i said it i was accused of racism. >> sometimes we have to the take a step back and wonder why most of the historical figures are portrayed as white. it's important for people of color. i had a black santa in my house. i have a black jesus. i'm the daughter of two pastors. i had a black jesus in my house growing up. it is important that symbols of tradition and culture in our society reflect all of oh us and all of our identities. it was problematic because whiteness is not a default color. it's not the default identity. >> i think everybody agrees on that. the only thing i was trying to say -- first of all, i was trying to make a joke to the kids at home. people are saying, what kids are watching at 9:00 p.m.? we are on at 6:00. i didn't want to get in trouble like gma did when they said bad

things about elf on the shelf. why are they talking about what race san tta is? he must have a race at the north pole. i don't know what happened. people misinterpreted me. people like to hate on fox news and on me started to ascribe unfortunate motives. >> people put unfortunate motives on you and me. i appear on fox news frequently as a democrat. the hate mail i get is ugly as well. we need to expand our imaginations when talking about fictional characters. there was a controversy with "the hunger games" about one of the characters being portrayed as a black actress though in the book she's described as a black person. people didn't feel the same level of sympathy for her because she was black. the root of that is a problem. we should tap into why that is. >> let me ask you this.

we didn't get to debate ms. harris's position which was we need to think about changing the image of santa. >> mm-hmm. >> that, too, has brought a lot of feelings out by viewers saying, look, historically, all the pieces i referenced, all the pieces ms. harris referenced showed a black santa the. people are taking issue with her suggestion that the mere color of his skin in these portrayals as white is somehow alienating to black children or, as she put it, causes shame in them. >> it is alienating. >> why is it alienating and why is that not racist? >> i grew up in an all white town. i was the only black student until high school. my mom prioritized having symbols, traditional, cultural symbolses in the house that looked like me so i could grow up as a young girl and be proud of who i am. that's important as you develop

your identity growing up. it is not about whiteness being problem t mat tick and seeing whiteness makes me feel shame. it's about being proud of who you are, understanding your history and heritage. i had black barbie dolls growing up. just because my mom wanted me to have high self-esteem. >> thanks for coming on. we appreciate your point of view. >> thank you. >> now bishop harry jackson, radio talk show host. your thoughtses? >> i think this is overblown. what you are dealing with is that fox has a certain image. you are being attacked, i think unfairly. somebody who grew up seeing people lynched, things of that nature, especially younger folks should build the bridge and get over it. we are dealing with the fact that st. nick was actually a

real figure. doesn't matter what the skin color is. the idea that aisha harris had was to denigrate the religious value of christmas. we are going to do away with the man's ethnicity and make him into a penguin. it's ridiculous. >> somehow that didn't get attention. let's change san to to a penguin. instead what i said got attention. >> right. they were looking for you. what we are dealing with now is people are explosive. they would rather talk about what you are saying in the ideological format instead of dealing with substance. we are not going to get past the race problem in america until we begin to deal with real issues, instead of all the stereo typical shadow boxing. i think we can. based on our faith. based on the mandela model. based on mlk. i think we can overcome the race

problem in our nation. but we are not trying hard enough, megyn. that's my opinion. >> we played some of the sound bites there. i think people mischaracterized the statement as describing me as outraged over this and angry. if you watch it, i don't know if we have the sound bite. does this say outrage to you? let's play it. >> okay. >> when i read the piece, the author seems to have, you know, she's african-american. she seems to have real pain at having grown up with the image of a white santa and speakses about it honest honestly saying i didn't understand why that had to be. >> your thoughts? >> i don't think that had anger. i think if i'm hurt, if i'm bitter. if i have unresolved issue, any mention of these things causes me to rise up.

we have a 400-year-old problem starting with slavery. that's never fully been settled. many times we talk around these issues. now the problems we are having at the capitol building, democrat versus republican, all have racial implications as well. it should not be, megyn. >> yeah. >> we can do better. we are better than that. >> you would hope particularly at this time of year we can do better and try coming together. as i said in my opening, not to always assume the worst about each other. don't we always just assume the worst and go on twitter and blindly say the meanest things we can say. >> i really appreciate your having this segment. the way you treated your last guest who you could have disagreed with shows you have tolerance. keep up the good work. i think you will make a difference. we are going to change the way we deal with this issue over time. >> thank you. merry christmas to you.

>> merry christmas to you. >> we are taking your thoughts on it. follow me on twitter @megyn kelly. follow us on facebook. friend us, like us. i always mess that up. we'll be right back with new fallout tonight on the big budget deal in d.c. marc thiessen is here after the break. also new warnings from doctors as millions of americans wonder what is to become of their health care coverage under the president's health care law. >> we just don't know. they don't know what plans will be available. they don't know what services will be available. no one knows what will happen january 1.

from the world headquarters of fox news it's "the kelly file" with megyn kelly. new fallout over the bipartisan

budget deal in washington as we hear growing calls for republicans to reject it. marc thiessen is a former speech writer for george bush and a fellow at the american enterprise institute. you have an interesting take suggesting that the republicans on capitol hill have a case of ptsd or post traumatic stress disorder. what do you mean? >> exactly. since barack obama took office the republicans have basically -- he's run the table over the republicans from this stimulus to obamacare to the fiscal cliff tax increases. the one victory republicans had, the one government reducing victory was the budget control act, sequester. they are giving it up. spending was supposed to go down for the next year. instead we are raising it by $63 billion over the next two years. why. they have ptsd. they are scarred by the government shutdown experience and they are afraid of having another fiscal fight with president obama in january. paul ryan said the reason he's doing it is we don't want

another shutdown experience next year. we'll concede the one victory they have had since the obama era began. >> shouldn't they be having ptsd? shouldn't they be worried? >> they should be. look, the government shutdown was a disaster. the reason for that is we had no chance whatsoever of defunding obamacare. the lesson isn't that republicans shouldn't fight. it's that we shouldn't fight stupid. we shouldn't pick fights we can't win. in obamacare what we were trying to do, republicans were trying to do is get the democrats to the undo the current law we didn't like. in the case of the budget control act, the sequester is the law. we don't have to do anything. cuts are automatic. we say let's stick with the spending cuts democrats and republicans agree to that your president signed into law and let's continue the spending cuts. instead we are agreeing to $63

billion in spending increases. >> is this the future now? how long does the ptsd last? this is a significant amount of oh money they are putting back into the pot. >> exactly. >> are we going to see more of that going forward? >> the the interesting phenomenon is the tea party driven house voted for this. in the senate it's in trouble which is where the estab has control. you have people like mitch mcconnell and the republican leadership. mcconnell, cornin, thune. everybody is against it. there is only one republican senator for this. it's possible that tuesday this deal will fail in the senate where the house republicans voted for it almost in unison. >> wouldn't that be ironic. good to see you, marc. >> thanks, megyn. >> coming up, charles krauthammer with his new interesting take on what really went wrong with obamacare. plus, "the kelly file" follow up

on the spirit of christmas. an exclusive update on mistletoe madison. you have to see it. still ahead. >> hello, megyn. this is mistletoe maddy from the factory. we sent thousands of boxes so far and we have thousands more to go.

under obamacare despite the president's promises you may not be able to keep your doctor or your hospital. we are learning why that is. dr. eric novak testifies on these concerns yesterday. he's an orthopedic surgeon and partner at ortho arizona in phoenix. good to see you. >> thank you, megyn. >> in a nutshell explain how it works. the president maintained you will be able to keep owe your doctor. >> there is no evidence that

anybody will be able to keep their doctor to any significant degree. nobody knows the rules. we don't know the rules as providers. come january first it will be hard with the promises and the things that hhs is doing to force ensurers. >> you talk about how access will become the problem. access to your doctor. what do you mean by that? >> well, it isn't enough to give somebody a card. what we want to do with the law or with any health care reform is to lower costs and increase progress. the problem is simply put, people don't know if they are covered. on the provider side, we don't know if the card people are coming in with is actually valid. ultimately what that will do is reduce the access. the second thing is it's looking more like what the restricted

networks and lower payment structures is going to be staying on the network and seeing patients. people won't be aware which doctors they can see. that doesn't talk about higher deductibles, co-pays and insurance. >> if i have a higher deductible or a higher copay, how will that affect care? >> well, obviously people make choices when they go to the doctor and other choices in life. one of the promises the president made was with this health care law we will see lower costs. we would be able to keep our plan and people would be able to keep their doctors. we are seeing the majority of people looking like they are getting higher rates. even the ones getting subsidies,

people may be seeing their deductible double or triple. that may not be an issue where they will go to the doctor more. if the copay goes up from 25 to 40 or 50 dollars, that's more money. if the medications aren't covered or there are no out of network services it means less care for people we needed to try to help. >> you in your testimony talked about -- you responded to a congressman suggesting i'm not going to get between you and your patient and how you do a surgery. this claim that the government will get between the doctor and patient is bogus. you had a response to that. tell the viewers what it was. >> sure. simply put, the issue was this was congressman dingell back from 2009 who said i won't tell you how to do your surgery. don't tell us how to make policy. i made the case that if you don't spend time doing policy carefully, good doctors, good providers and nurs aren't going to do the job of getting people

taken care of. what we have seen over the last three years is it wasn't well thought out policy. the result now is, well, maybe the law doesn't say how we can do the surgery. but it is certainly beginning to tell us who can get the surgery, when they can get the surgery. that really is very disappointing from what we wanted to achieve with meaningful health care reform to keep health care decisions between patients, families and doctors and away from politicians. >> because you are not doing the surgery until you get paid. thank you for being here. >> thank you so much. new tonight, a poll of cfos fin finds it almost cut in half. the reason, the added costs of the health care over haul. charles krauthammer is author of the big number one -- number one -- new york times best seller "things that matter." it's been on the best seller

list for five weeks. good to see you. we have been talking more about this. say all of health care.gov was fixed and people were signing up which isn't the case now. we go to january and everybody has coverage who thought they would have coverage. when they go for care, more and more will be hearing from the doctors they aren't going to get it the way they used to. >> a lot of them aren't going to get it at all. in fact, if they get it the insurers have to pay for it without having any idea whether the person was insured. as we heard from the doctor, the doctor won't know. it wasn't just the promise if you have your plan you keep your plan. or have your doctor, you can

keep it. the impression obama gave, the basic promise was to the 80% of americans who have health insurance had it before obamacare and liked it. what he was saying is he has a plan but it will leave all of you unmolested. it is a way to address people without health insurance. americans are humane and generous. a lot of them said, okay, let's try to do that. but we are now learning that not only was it known but it was intended that obamacare would demolish the way that american medicine was run up until now. peel would be dr people would be driven out of their plans. tens of millions will lose employer plans. if you want to keep a doctor, you can't. if you want to have a catastrophic plan which for a lot of young and healthies a low

premium, you won't get any of the extra goodies. if you're a 26-year-old guy you have to have lactation service which is you don't exactly need. the whole intention was to redo essentially to nationalize the whole health care system to put it under control of the government. that's why we are getting this shocking realization that everything is changed starting on january 1. >> what role do you think the president has played here? some believe he orchestrated the whole thing because he wanted single payer. others think he's clueless and not paying attention. there are theories beyond that. what do you think? >> the conspiracy theory that he intended we were going to have

to end one a canadian system gives them too much credit. i do think the idea that he didn't know. the answer is he knew. he knew you can't get americans to accept a canadian-type system. it is essential washington control of health care through the agency of supposedly independent insurance companies who, as we see today, are not independent at all. we had regulations issued a day ago by hhs which orders health insurance to reimburse patients starting on january 1 even if they don't have insurance. what he's done is to create a system controlled by the feds by the agency of insurers just like

the government controls the utilities and that's the nationalized medicine that we have today. >> charles, great to see you. >> thank you very much. pleasure to be here. >> tomorrow will mark the one-year point stiince the tragy at sandy hook. up next, some of the families who lost loved ones will join me with their powerful message.

chaos and heart break at a school in connecticut when a gunman walks into a building and opens fire, we believe, on a kindergarten class leaving 18 children dead. an entire class is unaccounted for. the principal also killed in this tragedy along with several other adults. it is the worst shooting tragedy ever in the state of connecticut and the second worst in u.s. history. >> what a terrible day that was. tomorrow marks one year since the tragedy at sandy hook elementary school. six adults and 20 children lost their lives. there is breaking news out of colorado where another school shooti ining injured two studen. a student targeting a teacher shot them before turning the gun on himself. a few days ago i had a chance to sit down with family members of the t newtown shooting vips who are launching a nationwide

campaign called sandy hook promise to prevent the kind of tragedy like the one we saw today and the one that took their loved ones' lives. thank you very much for being here. >> thank you. >> let me start with the obvious question and what everybody wants to know looking at you today which is how are you one year later? let me start with you, nicole. >> this has been both the fastest and shortest year of my life. in all honesty, i can't believe it's almost a year since i have last held dylan. every day is tough. the love and support of family and friends in our community and the people here today has meant the wo >> are you surprised at your own strength? just looking at you here on tv, devoting yourself to a cause now, are you surprised you found that in yourself? that's to anybody. >> yes, we are. i'm surprised i have gained so much strength from my daughter's death. the bravery.

i'm surprised at myself. >> i know you in particular talked about how important you felt it was to try to find forgiveness in your heart. and that you said you would much rather be lauren's dad than the father of the killer. did you find that forgiveness? have you gotten there? >> i found it the day after. >> how? >> there was no other way. i didn't want to live in pain. in hate. i didn't want to hate. >> has anybody else determined to do that either successfully or unsuccessfully. >> i haven't gotten there yet. i just try to be as positive as possible with my daughters. joining in with the sandy hook promise and a fund for my wife, just carrying things forward. to be honest i haven't wasted a moment's time on that. >> your wife mary was the school psychologist.

like the heroes on 9/11 she ran toward the danger. >> yeah. that's totefully keeping with her character. >> when you think about her and try to function in this world are you able to focus on the here and now so you can find happiness? having lost somebody in my life if you focus on the loss it's hard to feel happiness. >> the three of us and my son-in-law try to take the positives and move ahead and try to bring something positive out of this tragedy. if that's at all possible it's in keeping with what mary would have wanted us to do instead of sitting around and doing something else. >> let's talk about that, about focusing on what can be done. parents around the world looked at the this tragedy and said, how can i revent it from happening at my school and my community. that's part of what you are trying to do. educate communities of how to come together without washington but how communities can do this.

how? >> if we start this conversation at the community level with our initiative parent together from sandy hook promise that's how the conversation changes. once people are involved at the community level it works uh and legislation follows. >> what does it mean? what specifically? >> driving awareness. getting people thinking about this. getting involved with programs. there are many. i don't know if we have time to talk about how many programs. >> let me ask it this way. when you look back at the days, months, years leading up to sandy hook what could have been done differently, if anything, the to prevent the tragedy? >> we have a personal nexus in our family. our son daniel was the kid that would talk to somebody sitting alone. adam lanza was the kid that sat alone. if there was a community program that addressed and identified kids sitting alone and maybe

this never would have happened. >> that's one of the storieses we have learned a lot about. his isolation. my own preference is not to say his name because i'm determined not to say the name of killers on our show. i think a lot of them, they want notoriety. we have learned a lot about his isolation and his mother's participation or willingness to turn a blind eye to that without throwing the blame on her, what do you think his family could have done differently? that's for any of you. >> i'm sorry. do you want to -- >> go ahead. >> not particularly for his specific family. but in general, in terms of things we need to look at, the whole idea of mental wellness and ensuring that we are intervening in identifying that our children's minds are are developing in a healthy way and in the same way we work to develop a healthy body. mental wellness is critical along with simple gun safety and

good community connectedness and parenting. these are critical skills that are required across the nation. that's what we are doing with parent together and sandy hook promise. we are saying join us and we'll help with tools and programs that will help prevent t not only the next sandy hook but with hundreds of thousands of gun violence incidents that happened in this country every year. >> this is not an anti-gun group. >> not at all. >> it is not against gun ownership, gun rights. you found that alienating to the cause. this is finding ways to prevent this. neil i know you were a gun enthusiast. >> i grew up hunting, shooting. i started skeet shooting when i was 8 years old. a year and a half older than jesse, in fact. i look back and things were different when i was growing up.

you know we were taught to be more responsible. parenting with more awareness. we didn't have the video games either. and everybody growing up, they were outside. i don't ever remember any children that were isolated . but so often you see these problem cases like this with adam lanza after the report came out and it gave you a picture of how he spent hours alone. you know, i hold his mother indirectly responsible for what happened. he clearly had access to the guns. there was no forced entry into the safe. i think it was poor judgment and

a poor choice on her behalf to -- >> provide the access. >> provide the access. >> this is something i have wondered about. do you think the killer in this case was evil or just mentally disturbed? let me ask you that. >> i don't focus on -- >> him. >> him. i think what bill said. you have to focus on the positive and moving ahead and trying to make something good out of this. you know, we all lost, you know, the most important person in our lives. we lost the most. we need to make sure this doesn't happen again. >> this is a testament to all of you and the love you had for your family members that you are

standing, here a year later able to function in the world and talk about it in an intelligent way. thank you very much. we appreciate it. >> thank you. we posted more of my interview with the parents including how they are coping one year later at facebook.com/the kelly file. we're going to end the show with an uplifting note. a special message from little mistletoe madison next. in the nation, sometimes bad things happen.

but add brand new belongings from nationwide insurance and we won't just give you the partial value of items that are stolen or destroyed... ...we'll replace them with brand-new versions. so you won't feel robbed. again. just another way we put members first. because we don't have shareholders. join the nation. ♪ nationwide is on your side ♪ a "the kelly file" follow up for you now. 11-year-old radissmadison root banned from selling mistle toe but officials said she could beg for money. we are happy to announce her

mistletoe business has taken off. watch. >> hello, megyn. this is mistletoe maddy from the factory. we sent thousands of pboxes so far and we have thousands to go. all of the orders should be shipped by saturday. in the box i include this letter. thank you for your order. i hope everything made it in one piece. the outpouring of love and support is more than i ever imagined. grab someone you love and give them a big kiss. may all your dreams come true. love madison. thank you. >> happy holidays! >> happy holidays! >> that's fantastic. well done. she has put 38 people to work at her little mistletoe factory. she pays them $9 an hour. she's made more than enough money to pay for her braces and with the extra money she's even going to pay for a needy friend's braces as well. god bless her. good for her. what an inspiration.

tell us your thoughts on her grit. go to facebook.com/the kelly file or tweet me. "hannity" at the top of the hour. >> christmas is better without religion. year after year -- >> stop. christmas isn't christmas without the religion. >> absolutely it is. >> no, no. >> folks let me -- >> let me answer the question.

so we are getting a lot of

feedback on twitter about the santa thing. zurlina maxwell says people are sending her hate mail. don't do that. she has a point of view and we are glad she offered it. taking your thoughts now. have a great weekend. it's official. the lie of the years has been announced. find out what it is and who told it during tonight's jam-packed edition of "hannity." here is a sneak peek. >> the man responsible for the controversial times square billboard is here to defend his war on christmas. this former math teacher was convicted of sexually abusing a child. that's not stopping his union from fighting for a $10,000 severance package. >> obamacare is off to a great start. fox news hates it. >> exposed. eddie schultz has been