gpa, lower levels of depression and teach your kids to say thank you. >> an attitude of gratitude. >> here on "the five," set your dvr so you never miss an episode. we'll tell you about the numbers that are not being celebrated in the year. this is special report. and good evening. i'm ron roberts in for bret bai baier. if you make a list happy to see 2013 in the rearview mirror, president obama is close to the top of the list. almost three months after the disastrous rollout of his nak sake health care plan, new statistics indicate more people are signing up. but there is more to the story behind the numbers. white house correspondent

wendall goaler is traveling with the president in honolulu and begins with another shake-up in the obamacare bureaucracy. >> hello. the agency in charge of medicare and medicaid is retiring. officials say it is for personal reasons and suggest the troubled rollout is not the cause. michelle snyder had put off retirement for a year at the request of her boss but the malfunctioning obamacare website turned it into an unfortunate year and left kathleen sebelius defendering. >> michelle snyder is responsible for this. >> excuse me, michelle snide ser not responsible. hold me accountable. i'm responsible. >> this was almost news for a president ready to wrap up a tough year in his home state of hawaii, with obamacare

functioning more better, more people enrolled this month. but a spokesperson for john boehner said the surge in enrollment didn't meet the goal for december. combined with state exchange enrollments it still left the administration more than a million people short of the goal of more than 3 million sign-ups and experts say most of the people have yet to pay the first premiums. >> to enroll in health insurance you have to pay the first month's premium and the most recent feedback we have from the insurers is that 5% to 15% have actually paid the first month premium. >> and though the december surge suggests the website has been fixed, there is troubling news in who is enrolling. >> if you look at the demographic data of the trends of who is enrolling, it is the less healthy and probably older. >> that could mean the administration isn't having the success it hoped for convincing young healthy people, who don't feel the need for insurance, to pay for it. >> obamacare works by requiring

healthy people to pay more and sicker people could pay less. that is a great deal for sicker people, but not for healthy people. >> and a pool of lesser healthy people will mean higher costs for insurance kpz and more expensive premiums for everyone and those higher premiums would be tacked on in 2015 and could fuel more republican complaints about obamacare and scare young people from signing up. >> wendall goaler doing hardship duty in honolulu. thank you very much. the six states that will develop drone sites, alaska, north dakota, virginia and others will develop facilities. they plan on using commercial use of the doans by the end of 2015. pushback from a new york time report disputing the role of al qaeda on last year's attack in benghazi libya.

adam housley is following the story tonight. >> reporter: 15 monthsar the -- after the september 11 attack in benghazi which killed the bast a -- the ambassador and other americans claim there is no involvement from al qaeda or any other international terror group and a video insighted the attacks. mike rogers said that the times portrayal is not acras. >> the individuals on the ground talked about a planned tactical movement on the compound even before they went to the annex. it tells me they didn't talk to the people on the ground and intelegence. >> democrat member adam schiff said while the time's report adds some value, it is also

deficient. >> i do think it adds valuable -- incite but there are indications al qaeda was involve and there were plenty of militias unaffiliated with al qaeda involved. >> sources that continue to face threats of losing jobs and must remain anonymous challenge the times findings, texing fox news, it was a coordinated attack and false to say anything else. it is completely a lie and, quote, guys were coming into the compound, moving left and right and using imt, individual movement techniques, that is not a spontaneous attack. today the state department seemed to agree with the times but parsed words when stating that quote, core al qaeda was not involved. >> obviously they all -- these groups all had a certain kind of extremist and terrorist ideology and clearly these were violent folks on the ground, there for americans who are no longer with us who i think can -- would speak exactly to that fact, these were clearly terrorists.

>> fox newss that learned there were briefings held one day before the attack by the head of counter intelligence for the region, identifying al qaeda as the largest and most significant element infiltrating libya. john. >> adam housley reporting. thank you so much. a german magazine is reporting on a special hacking unite of the nsa. they said the hackers exploit hardware vulnerabilities and hijack microsoft's internal reporting system to spy on their targets. we'll begin with our special guest tonight, former cia director retiring michael hayden. general, good to see you. so the newspaper talks about the nsa, it is designed to crack the uncrackable. know the unknowable, get the unget sabl and hack into computer systems around the world to get information about what people are doing. this is a system you are family with because it was online when

you were running the nsa. i think a lot of people are surprised about the extent of the capabilities of the nsa and some of what they are doing. >> well i'm surprised they are surprised. i think the article points out that when it comes to electronic surveillance, keith alexander and his people at the nsa are good at this. and that is good news for the american people. john, here is the major muscle movement. signals intelligence used to be passive or midpoint. someone decided to send a message, you get between a and b and hopes that message hits your antenna too. what has happened with the digital age with worldwide web, is we've gone to no longer intersettlementing at the midpoint but go to the end point, where sometimes they have not yet decided to trans mit. that is what is going on here. and it is a good thing for american security and american liberty. >> the person who was in charge of the tao unit and people are

calling it the tao, said in the artic article, some of the most significant intelligence our country has ever seen has been owned by tao and their goal is to achieve pervasive access on the network. how much damage to that capability has been done now that the tao is out there in the public eye. >> no intelligence organization in the world likes their sources and methods or tactics, techniques and procedures published in the open domain. and now we'll see the legitimate foreign intelligence targets will read these articles and begin to take precautions that will plaque it more difficult for the -- that will make it more difficult for the american security servess to defend the united states. >> a lot of companies read this in the morning and said, oh, my god, what is going on up there. because they on linkedin, to

send mal-ware and sending shipments of computers, destined for overseas and hacking into, as we said, microsoft's reporting system, microsoft windows crashes and you get the error bug send message and that could send information and into cisco reuters, prompting them to come out with a statement saying it is very concerned about this and launching an investigation. the implication here is that the nsa is appropriating u.s. technology and exploiting it for intelligence purposes and u.s. companies aren't appreciative of that. >> no. and a careful reading of the article, and believe me, i read it very carefully with my antenna very much up to see if there is anything in there that should concern or outrablg the american -- outrage the american people and i couldn't find it. this is about targeting legit mass foreign intelligence targets. and the fact that they make -- they use american-made equipment is interesting but not

compelling. the fact that a foreign intelligence target uses a cisco router shouldn't be a safe haven for that target. now i'm pleased that these organizations, these american companies are surprised and they should be surprised. they had nothing to do with this. this is american intelligence. >> spying overseas is one thing. can americans be absolutely assured that this is all happening overseas and none of this is happening here at home? >> again, even reading this grand ex pose, they are not suggesting this was done against americans, the microsoft point you make. if you read the article carefully, this is about the warnings and the phone-home mechanism in microsoft software. on already targeted foreign computers. i hope we're following that kind of information. >> let's turn to benghazi because you were talk become this -- talking about this yesterday on a sunday program. we have information from people on the ground in benghazi during the attack on the consulate that

the new york times artigle is -- article is flatout wrong and there were targets there that night targeting the compound. what do you say? >> this is representing a medieval discussions about how manim angels or jihadist you can get. this was a terrorist attack and not a peaceful demonstration that went south. number two, who did it? a few days after the attack i said this is almost certainly -- al qaeda is organized in tlie move -- in three movements. al qaeda kind, affiliated and like-minded. i said this is certainly either high-end like minded or low-end affiliated. >> but that is not what the new york times said -- no al qaeda. >> i agree. >> so are they wrong in saying there was no al qaeda connection? >> it depends on your meaning of the word al qaeda. and if you take that back to my argument about angels on the head of a pin, you can narrow

that theological position. no one has suggested that someone with a motorola pushed to talk in hindu was sending detailed instructions to somebody in benghazi. the final point, john, is really important, and it is about the broader narrative, all right. this pushes against the president's narrative that al qaeda is in retreat, al qaeda is on the run, the tide of war is receding. and no matter how you pars out what happened in benghazi, globally you can see, and this is quoting the economists now, al qaeda controls more territory today than at any other time in history. >> it changes the face of the war on terror. time is growing short. but i want to make one point, that the weekend standard reports, we'll have stephen hayes on this, but this analysis contradicts the times' own reporting in which "the new york times" wrote three congressional investigations and a state

department inquiry examing inning the attack which americans said including participated frommal sheeria and al qaeda and the mohammed group in egypt that is known to have ties to al qaeda. >> i read his piece and very carefully done. but iffer looking for membership cars -- cards before we say they are part of the jihadist group, we are wasting our time. >> thank you for stopping by and happy new year to you. terrorists in it russia just ahead of the winter olympics. but first, fox five here in washington on the firing of of two time super bowl winning mike shanahan but the nfl redskins. he is one of five coaches to get the ax since the end of the regular season yesterday. box five in new york city with precipitations in times square for tomorrow night's big party. the square will host millions of people counting down the last

few seconds of 2013. and this is a live look at philadelphia, wtxf, the big story in philadelphia tonight, setting a bail at $250,000 for a roman catholic priest whose conviction in the clergy sexual abuse scandal was overturned by a pennsylvania appeals acourt. and that is a live look outside of the beltway from special report. we'll be right back. ♪ i wanna spread a little love this year ♪

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74 people we told you about on friday trap add board a russian ship stuck in the antarctica ice are still there tonight. rescue efforts have been hampered by bad weather. the russian foreign industry said a chinese helicopter may be used to evacuate the passengers and crew members. all are said to be in good spirits and supplies, including russian vodka and in no danger

of sinking. and russia had a second deadly bombing. a syrianor foreign affairs correspondent amy kellogg said this is all happening with the so chee olympics a little more than a month away. >> reporter: two terrorist attacks in 24 hours in the southern russian city known as volume go grad. a tolly full of people, killing 14 people and injuring many more. and then hitting the central train station, the blast caught on tv, 17 people were killed. >> because the shrapnel was identical in both explosive devices this confirms the two terrorist acts were connected. in all likelihood, they could have been prepared in the same place. >> reporter: russian authorities expect the work of the caucus's em irrit which include chechan fights. thor trying to derail the winter

olympics in sochi where the radicals emanate. security is being tightened in moscow and so chee. >> i think there is a heightened visk a -- risk of attacks aboard airports, train stations, metro across southern russia and moscow. >> putin hopes a major part of his legacy will be a big successful olympics. but he rose for coming down hard on insurgents in chesha. that is still causing him trouble. >> amy kellogg in london tonight. thank you. a egyptian court has sentenced 139 supports of austed president mohamed morsi to two-year prison terms. the mass trial was among scores of court cases and prosecutions following his removal in july.

defendants are being given an option to pay a fine and have sentences suspending pending appeal. still ahead, the place where the minimum wage goes up on wednesday to $15 an hour. first, the clock ticks down on a young girl whose routine surgery went terribly wrong. [ male announcer ] introducing new fast acting advil. with an ultra-thin coating and fast absorbing advil ion core™ technology, it stops pain before it gets worse. nothing works faster. new fast acting advil. look for it in the white box. isn't it time you discovered the sleep number bed? becausonly the sleep number bed offers dual air technology that lets two peopled the perfect

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northern tier. the lights are back on for all but a few customers in michigan. they had been without power for more than a week after a major ice storm over the weekend. many expressed frustration with the situation, as you can quite imagine. authorities blame five deaths on the storm which affected 666,000

customers. time is running out for the family of a california girl declared brain dead after tonsil surgery. william largenes has an update from los angeles on what is literally a matter of life and death. >> barring any other legal action at 5:00 today the hospital will be allowed to unhook the respirator from jaw hi mcmath's body. >> we're feeling pressure but optimistic in our faith that god will make another way for us. >> as their deadline approached, the family continued to pray for their daughter. though doctors insist her journey is over. >> the girl is unfortunately deceased. no amount of prayer, no amount of hope, no amount of any type of medical procedure will bring her back. >> she underwent tonsil surgery december 9th but went into cardiac arrest and declared dead

shortly there after. the family challenges unsuccessfully in court. >> i don't think it is a responsible decision, but that is my opinion. but it is up to the baby's mother and her family to make the final decision on that. >> the family raised more than $20,000 hoping another hospital would take her. none agreed, knowing no insurance company would pay to keep the dead alive. >> the judge looked the family in the eye and said i know this is very difficult for you to take and i sympathize with you, but your daughter is deceased. that is the legal as well as i believe the spiritual conclusion of this very sad case. >> now a barricade has been set up outside of the front door of the hospital as we speak, john. the family is scheduled to hold a news conference 20 minutes ago and have not shown up yet. they could file an emergency writ with the appeals court going forward. no word on that yet. the hospital has refused to stay

if it will take the step of removing life support against the parents' wishes though they have the legal authority to do so. >> i assume, william, they will -- they will inform the family before they do that? >> well, yes. everyone believes they would. that the family would probably be around their daughter. the time would come when the hospital wants to indeed pull her off life support and ask them to leave the room so they could do that. the question is whether or not they will do that because today they said they will fight until the very last moment. >> what a tragic story. william, thanks. stocks were mixed in trading today. the dow gained 26 points, the s&p 500 dropped a third and the nasdaq lost 2. for the first time in years people are feeling positive about how things went for their family in the past 12 months. our year end fox news poll shows 51% surveyed show this was a

good year. those numbers are significantly changed from last year. the grapevine is taking the night off. when we come back, the census numbers and what they tell us about you. smoking with chantix. when my son was born, i remember, you know, picking him up and holding him against me. it wasn't just about me anymore. i had to quit. [ male announcer ] along with support, chantix (varenicline) is proven o help people quit smoking. it reduces the urge to smoke. chantix didn't have nicotine in it, and that was important to me. [ male aouncer ] some people had changes in behavior, thinking or mood, hostility, agitation, depressed mood and suicidal tughts or action while taking or after stopping chantix. if you notice any of these, stop chantix and call your doctor right away. tell your doctor about any history of mental health problems, which uld get worse while taking chantix. don't take chantix if you've had a seris allergic or skineaction to it. if you develop these, stop antix and see your doctor right away, as some coue life threatening. tell your docto if you have a history of heart or blood vessel problems, r if you develop new or worse symptoms. get medical help right away if you have mptoms of a heart attack or stroke.

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♪ you are being bombarded by numbers and statistics right now as we count down toward the end of the year. tonight chief political correspondent carl cameron with

the latest on how many of you there are and where you are going. >> the u.s. population grew by 2 million people and the census bureau believes it will reach 217 million people. the worldwide population jumped more than 77 million this year and come wednesday we'll hit 7.1 billon. here in the u.s. there is a new arrival every eight seconds and departure every 12. the four most popular states are california, texas, new york and florida. but the sunshine state in the next year or so will knock the empire state out of third. texas added the most, 387,000. california reaches 38 million. new york population growth has slowed to 1%. new york city is growing, but statewide unemployment is at 7.4%, higher than the national average. upstate populations by buffalo,

rochester and syracuse are shrinking, despite those like cuomo to reverse the trend. >> loss of jobs and rapid job growth in the south, the fact there is lower corporate taxes there, no state income tax in florida so it is an attractive place to live for a lot of people. >> florida's population is growing at a rate of 2.7%. the economy is improving, unemployment at 6.4%, more than a half a point lower than the national average and rick scott is aggressively recruiting business to employ the swelling work force. there is an estimate that every year 50,000 new yorkers move south to florida and a big part is weather. only 25,000 from florida move north to new york. the migration of northern snowbirds and job-securities to the south has been under way for decades, following the 2010 census, new york lost two seats and florida gains two and the data released today suggest that

that trend will continue in the next couple. john. >> you sure can't beat the weather. carl cameron, thanks so much. 13 states will increase the minimum wage on the first of january. topping out that list is washington state at $9.32 an hour. but for some, that is just a drop in the bucket. dan springer has that story. >> reporter: as the new year comes in for a landing, all economists eyes are focused on sea-tac, washington, an town with 37,000 people south of seattle. they are watching for an increase to minimum wage. hospitality and transportation will see their wage jump to $15 an hour. while employees welcome the raise, many business owns are preached to -- prepared to let some of them go. >> we are looking at making serious cuts and reducing employee hours, reducing

benefits, eliminating some positions. >> reporter: and an airport parking company will cut staff and have customers self-pay. one member hotel will close the restaurant, eliminating 200 jobs. >> the pie is only so big. so if you give that into labor, something has to go and i haven't decided what that -- i love my employees so i don't know what to do. >> car rental companies arer wa. the owner of dollar may be forced to rearrange schedules and out force some functions. and the american car association estimates 5% of the low cost wages will be replaced by more experienced workers. one woman won her election to the seattle city council. >> there may be a few jobs lost here and there, but if we don't

fight for this, then the race to the bottom will continue. >> some jobs won't be created at all. kim owns three hotels in sea-tac and the land where he wanted to build a fourth but not now. >> this is bad for business and we are right in the area so we are putting everything on hold and see what happens and see if the financing comes through. >> reporter: late last week a king county judge ruled the $15 wage did not apply to airport workers only those in the surrounding city. unions will appeal. and in the other washington, where president obama wants to raise the ral minimum wage to $9 an hour. in sea-tac, washington, dan springer, fox news. a hearty congratulations to one of the industry's legendary work horses. vick ratner of nbc news radio retires tomorrow. he has covered virtually everything in his 40 years at the network. he has reported from 54 countries and every u.s. state except south dakota.

fox news senior political analyst and former abc man brit hume calls him a fair-minded reporter and as nice a man as i have ever known. congratulations, vick, on making it to retirement. was al qaeda involved in the benghazi terror attack? the fox all-stars after a quick break. [ fishing rod casting line, marching band playing ] [ male announcer ] the rhythm of life. [ whistle blowing ] where do you hear that beat? campbell's healthy request soup lets you hear it in your heart. [ basketball bouncing ] heart healthy. [ m'm... ] great taste. [ tapping ] sounds good. campbell's healthy request. m'm! m'm! good.®

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i don't know if it was an exhaustive investigation, we have gone through some 4,000 different classified cables leading up to the event, talked to people on the ground during the event, dob the post-mortem on the event through the committee investigation. >> so what did they get wrong? >> that al qaeda was not involved in this. >> the intelligence indicates that al qaeda was involved but there were also plenty of people and militias unaffiliated with al qaeda that were involved. >> members of the intelligence committee in the house reacting

to the new york times article over the weekend. an extensive analysis of the benghazi attack of 9/11 of which the new york times concluded there was no al qaeda connection among the militants that took part in the attack. let's bring in the panel. stephen hayes, kirsten powers and charles krathammer. stephen, let's start with you. you took this on in the new york standard said kirkpatrick did extensive reporting on the ground but missed on the big points. >> i think his reporting was in many respects terrific but the details that he provided about the inside of the mother's house of one of the chief suspects of the benghazi attacks, fantastic on the ground minute by minute reporting. where he made the mistake is drawing sweeping conclusions that weren't justified by his reporting or the body of evidence collected about the attacks since. and his main mistake was declaring in a kata gorical way

that there was no al qaeda involvement and no involvement of international terrorist groups. we know for a fact that the jammal network, which is an international organization based largely in cairo and egypt, run by a guy with close ties toal sarry was involved in this tack. we know that other terrorists from around the region were involved and participants in this attack. communicate -- communication went out discussing this attack. so it is clear there were not only ties but strong ties. nobody is suggesting that and sarry said you go do this attack and do it in this way. nobody is suggesting that. but at the same time, among those examples that i've provided, there was another one -- an attacker who later collected information and we were told in the weekly standard delivered that information back

to senior al qaeda leadership in pakistan. so there were clearly al qaeda ties. it is a stretch to -- inaccurate to make a sweeping and kata gore cal claim that al qaeda had nothing to do with this. >> and you make the focus that pointing all of this on al qaeda is focusing on the wrong thing. >> it is a strong man argument if you remember what the outcry was about after susan rice went on the shows, nobody knew who did it but it was a good belief that it was a terrorist attack and they took time until they did come out and say that. so it wasn't that it was al qaeda per se, even though i think there is evidence to show there were al qaeda affiliated groups, maybe they are affiliated but maybe not core al qaeda. but the description that the administration was giving wasn't accurate. these people were out and upset about a video and haphazardly attacked in benghazi, which

kirkpatrick's reporting, he does say it was a terrorist attack. well that was something that the administration was very slow on coming around to. >> charles, stephen reported that the reporter from the new york times contradicts from the report a year prior when is said that al qaeda grabbed the network and al qaeda ties were involved with this according to officials. >> that is what is wrong with his reporting. if he said i wasn't able to find any ties to al qaeda and these networks, you would have disputed that but at least that would have been a circumscribed statement. he shined the flashlight on part of the crime of the scene and he wasn't able to locate the links. but he went beyond that and said there are no such ties. if you say that, then you can't rely on your reporting, you have to refute all of the evidence from mike rogers, the cables he saw that kirkpatrick hasn't seen, all of the evidence collected from eyewitnesses, all

of the sources that the general and others that fox have that aren't age to come out -- aren't able to come out into the open but clearly there is a huge number that contradict every element of this story. unless he can come out and show us why all of that is untrue, his statement hangs out there as a guess and one that doesn't look right. he should have stuck to his own reporting, in which case we wouldn't have the fire storm over this. where clearly he overstepped and clearly what he is saying is not so. >> and that is a key point, just to follow up on that. he was on the meet the press yesterday and david gregory is -- asked you say there was no al qaeda involvement. and his comment was if you ask anybody in the u.s. intelligence business they would tell you the same thing. that is not true. i have literally spoken to numbers of people in the u.s. intelligence who said there were al qaeda ties. >> you talk about the difference between al qaeda core and other al qaeda ties, and let's listen to what spokesperson rhea hart

said on that today. >> no indication at this point that core al qaeda planned what happened in benghazi. we do know as we said from the beginning that extremists were involved. these folks don't carry i.d. cards, they don't come out and wear a t-shirt that says i belong to al qaeda. >> let me come out with this core al qaeda and other groups. i don't think americans believe this is core al qaeda or another group, with so much al qaeda grupz out there in the peninsula and all of the other groups, has al qaeda changed to the point where it is no longer a centrally directed organization, it is more ideology that many different groups follow but those groups are still al qaeda. >> what she said is not correct. they didn't in the very beginning say it was jeemists, it was -- extremists, it was a bunch of people out for a walk and were upset about a video.

i think it is a strong man argument, it doesn't matter whether it is core al qaeda or someone affiliated with al qaeda. if you are affiliated with the head of al qaeda, then that makes you al qaeda in some way. but at the end of the day, it is not -- i don't think that is the fundamental issue, the issue was this was a terrorist attack, not a protest. >> one final point, if i could, charles, and rue rosenfeld defended the story in a blog saying this was about politics. republicans hope to tarnish democrat candidates making it seem that obama doesn't take this seriously and throw mud at hillary clinton who plans to run in 2016. >> i think he gave it away by being defensive. he is making it obvious the reason the times invested the effort and time in this and put it on the front page is precisely a way to protect the democrats, to deflect the issue, to protect hillary, who was

exposed on this issue with almost no issue in her tenure in the administration. it is obviously a political move. but just one point on that state department spokesperson. saying it is not al qaeda because it is core al qaeda is absurd. it is like saying that if the greek resistance in the second world war launched an attack on a nazi outpost, it wasn't part of the allied effort if they had gotten a direct order from churchill. obviously these are elements in the struggle, they are all united in the sense, in their ideology and often in their links and that is all you have to know. >> let's leave it there, because coming up next, the rising minimum wage and what it might cost minimum wage workers. stay with us. welcome back. how is everything? there's nothing like being your own boss! and my customers are really liking your flat rate shipping. fedex one rate. really makes my life easier. maybe a promotion is in order.

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we are going to be looking at making some very serious cuts. we're going to be looking at reducing employee hours, reducing benefits. eliminating some positions. >> there may be a few jobs lost here and there, but the fact is if we don't fight for this, then the race to the bottom will continue. >> from a report that we brought you earlier tonight, the one area near seattle is raising its minimum wage as of january 1st up to $15 an hour. we're back with our panel. the president has got a little more modest target than that he wants it to come up to $9 an hour. this is going to become a big political issue in 2014. nine states that already have it at $9. is $9 an hour unreasonable? >> i don't think it's unreasonable. advocates for this change say if we had just kept pace with inflation since 1980 it

would be at $10. roughly $10. so, i think that we should at least have the minimum wage tracking inflation at a bare minimum and this actually has a lot of support between republicans and democrats. it's not something that is just a democratic issue. it has pretty broad based support. and i think the democrats feel this is going to be a real winner for them politically and substantively. it's something they believe in. >> how much of an issue, steve, do you think democrats can make about this in months to come and. >> they will certainly try. i think if they were able to rupp on obamacare they would. it's clear they are not going to be running on obamacare in 2014. it will be like the and contraception debate was in 2012. something that allows them to talk about something and to get voters who are particularly interested in things like the minimum wage out to the polls during an election, during a cycle when typically the president's party doesn't do well, and low income voters don't turn out as strongly.

that's what's motivating. this that's why unions are pushing for ballot initiatives. they want to drive turnout. they want to push. this on the policy side though, it's fascinating because on the one hand you hear people say theoretically make the argument that everyone would be better paid and you have people like the seattle council woman sort of shrug off 00 idea that people are going to be losing jobs. i give her credit for her candor, actually. she is acknowledging what will happen and this is one of those times where you can take this from the theoretical to the practical, talk to business owners, like the person interviewed in the piece. like the person who runs the airport parking who says we will move to self-pay. and it's clear that jobs will be lost. >> big difference between $9 an hour and $15 an hour, charles. >> which i think is really -- that's a way to really injure a lot of people, it's amazing what the council woman said. a few jobs will be lost here and there that means real people. you expect that from a capitalist on wall street and not somebody who is interested in workers.

look, it's an axiom of economics. if you raise the price of everything, you are going to lower demand. there are going to be jobs lost. do i think that raising the minimum wage gradually and indexing is the way to do it. if you index it, it stops being political issue. >> is $9 a starting point? >> i think what we really ought -- what conservatives ought to do. if you can't feed a family on, this and as a result of our lousy recovery. a lot of people are depending on this wage, then i think for people who are the bread winners in a family, it ought to be raised. but i think what you want for entry level jobs is really going to hurt teenagers. it's really going to hurt minorities because they are going to lose the jobs which would help them to get started. i would have a two tiered system. and i think that probably would be a way, a reasonable answer that republicans and conservatives could offer. it's not heartless but it keeps in mind how it would hurt jnchts why would you

want that if it's going to cost the very people it intends to help? >> i do think if somebody is the only wage earner in the family i think it would be humane to raise it to a level they can cover their expenses. >> there was a gallup wells fargo poll where they asked small business owners where they would fire people or stop hiring people and 64 percent said it wouldn't have any impact on their hiring decisions. so i'm not sure that this small amount of raising the minimum wage would actually have an effect. >> but a third said that it would. that's a significant. >> a minority. >> each if they were in the minority, it still effects them. >> panel, thanks so much. that's it for the panel. stay tuned to see a group of children demanding answers from president obama.

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finally tonight, another installment in our end of the year staff picks which scandal after scandal plague in the administration, 2013 wasn't exactly an easy year for president obama even a visit to the classroom in baltimore seemed more like a grill session from the white house press corps. >> hello, everybody. >> here is our special guest. >> hi! >> hi mr. president. >> how are you doing? >> hi, mr. president. >> we got benghazi, what did you know and when did you know it? >> ms. mcdonald says you -- is that true? >> isn't it unconstitutional record of a.p. reporters? >> is days numbers? >> irs planted target conservatives? >> maybe the white house press corps could learn a thing or two. that is "special report" for

this evening. i'm john roberts. good night from washington. dana perino goes "on the record" right now. the new year is coming whether you like it or not. hello i'm dana perino in for greta van susteren. it's that time of year where everyone pledges to be better in the next coming year. president obama says tells the associated press his resolution was to be nice to them. kanye west top talking trash and glenn beck better man in 2014. greta clean up her office because of afraid of getting a surprise visit from the health department. kimberly guilfoyle and bob beckel for, you know, this is an amazing like peanut butter and chocolate coming together for new year's eve. it's like a perfect combination.