>> i go to the university of california irvine, >> l george mason university. >> virginia tech. >> the university of south dakota. >> the. >> tonight a special edition of "stossel" from the nation's capital. 1,500 college students from all over the world have gathered here to debate what makes for a free society. these are our future leaders. i'm glad they are learn being the most important thing -- liberty. students usually don't learn much about that in school. tonight, what you ought to know about economic freedom. free speech, personal

responsibility, drugs, privacy, america's constitution. that's our show. [ cheers and applause ] >> thank you. you students are unusual. you are unusual because you have this special interest in liberty. most people don't which -- makes me wonder how many of you ever discussed liberty on your campuses? how many of your professors discuss it? how many of hem discuss social justice? many more. i'm not surprised given the love for big government in most campuses. most of your professors probably don't even know much about basic economics. which is why we title this show stossel university.

our first professors tonight are eby mccloskey and don boudreau. you are here to tell students what they should learn about economics. you can't do it all. >> first thing they should learn intentions are not results. judge policies by their results and not by the state intentions. people in the public sector are just as self did interested and no more enlightened than the people in the private sector. >> nice or vicious as everybody else. they are doing the public good. they are different. >> that's what they say. >> some other ideas that are taught. higher taxes can encourage work. carl smith, who teaches economics at the university of north carolina, fine school, says taxes make me poorer when people are poorer, they need to work more to pay for the things they want. therefore, taxes should make me work harder. >> when you tax something, you get less of it. if you take work you get less of it. the same for investments and business. this is why in countries with high taxes, like the united

states, you see slow growth and slow job creation. >> you believe that econ professors teach this stuff. >> >> i wonder if professor smith would double his teaching load if the unc chopped his salary in half. i bet not. >> we have a credit crisis so regulate the banks. you testified before congress on dodd-frank. >> since dodd-frank was passed in response to the financial crisis to protect consumers. what we are seeing in practice consumers are having less access to credit and savings, banks fees are at record highs. over 3 million people have been shut out of the banking system. this is the law of unintended consequence. >> another appealing theme is we should buy. we are americans. we should buy american. >> american buy from farmers we get good lower prices. i want poor people to have access to the lowes price gods. when americans buy from foreigners we send money abroad and that money comes back to

america as -- demand for american exports or investment in america. it is normally not seen by the people who don't know my economics. but it is definitely real and it helps america. >> isn't it more patriotic if i buy american stuff? >> no. when you buy -- when you buy american -- that means you are not employing resources as they should be employed. there is month reason you shouldn't choose the best deals you can find. that's patriotic. >> income inequality. it is growth that people have more than others. shouldn't government try to even it out? >> government does to large extent. the top 20% of earners pay 70% of taxes. we have a huge social safety net. what's concerning to me as an economist is not income and equality but the fact that we have millions of people trapped in poverty from a broken welfare state and broken education system. >> a gallup poll found 78% of people your age support raising

the minimum wage. most of the public does. more people your age does. how many of you agree we should raise the minimum wage? you clearly are libertarian. >> if you raise the minimum wage you are raising the cost to employers of employing low-skilled workers. when you raise the cost of something, you get less of it. it is as simple as that. >> i want to hear from you students. what questions do you have for abby and don. >> my name is lauren clark. i'm studying journalism. it is my dream to take over your show one day. >> please do. >> my question to you guys is i'm also very interested in economics. why is it that in the university sector there are so many progressive people studying economics? to me it is reasonable sense. >> you know, i wish i had a good answer to that question. i don't understand why people who don't get economics don't

get it. it is like they are blind to rememberality. they are blind to the fact that gravity is operational. >> also, i also think that -- they are not eksz posed to it. the majority of high school students are not exposed to it. you can't be held guilty for something you don't know. >> my name is scott. i study economics at the university of albany. my question to you guys is that when you are talking about income inequality, how do you find the most effective way to relay to people that it is government that is responsible for creating the disparity in the first place? [ applause ] >> some people are smarter than others. some people are born with a silver spoon. >> i thidon't doubt in some mars people prosper more income-wise. what i like to point sought one of the benefits of free market is while it may increase from time to time income inequality it decreases -- inequality.

rich people today do not consume much more than poor people today. in america, the -- difference between what poor people consume and rich people consume is shrinking ever and ever -- getting a lot closer. >> you brought this catalog along to make a point about that. >> yes. typical american workers back then had to work 30 hours to buy this vacuum cleaner. today an american worker has to work six hours to buy a much better vacuum. >> my name is sebastian torres and i study history at eastern kentucky university. and i just want to see what your personal opinion of big coin was. >> i'm all in favor of anything that competes with monopoly central banks. [ applause ]

>> have you bought some? >> i have not. >> have you? >> i have. >> hi. i was wondering if you believe there is a better alternative to social spending such as food stamps and social security. >> preedeman had an idea which is negative income tax. basically everybody would have a guaranteed level of income and it wouldn't have the same distortions the current welfare system has that discourages work or marriage, for instance. this level of -- low enough that people don't grow dependent on it. >> hello. my name is michael ashley. i'm a student at that time university of delaware. what's a good outline or effective measure of creating

small government -- >> one idea that has been proposed to keep government smaller is to link practical spending as a percentage of gdp and have an actual rule. congressmen are held responsible for if they want to increase spending above the historic norms. i think that's a good starting place. >> another idea is to repeal five rules any time you pass one. >> my name is ken williams. i am a political science student at ohio university. obamacare, with how we are -- there's a distrusting insurance companies because they want to make a profit that the solution to that is to mandate buy prosecuting the insurance companies. >> where the idea comes from, i don't know. it is a dumb idea. insurance companies have

incentives to provide the right mix of coverage at competitive premiums. the obamacare mandates this sort of coverage and that sort of coverage. that interferes with private choices. private choices that would month doubt give rise to better policies than the absence of the mandates. >> thank you. we are out of time for questions for this segment. thank you. if you at home would like to keep this conversation going, here's the twitter hash tag. isflc. how you are supposed to remember that -- interest stands for international students for for liberty conference which is where we are. let people know what you think. coming up -- what do you know about america's founding documents? i will give you a quiz. [cheers and applause] okay, listen up! i'm re-workin' the menu.

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snot ♪ okay, college students. action pop quiz. in the constitution of the declaration of independence and here it is, together, how many times is the word democracy used? fewer than five times or more

than five times? who says five or more times here? who says fewer? i didn't know this, it never mentions democracy. you should read this. [ applause ] it is not very long. our constitution is shorter than the constitution for most other countries. if you want one of these you can get it from the cato.org. we give them out free. the constitution was prepared in secret behind closed doors guarded by centuries. is that rue? who thinks it is true? yeah. you weren't so smart on that. this one true.

you better read this thing. to learn even more, now we turn to someone that really knows, the author of the "conscience of the constitution." you went to a liberal college where there was contempt for this. i can see why. this is written by old white men. some of whom were slave holders. why should this be so important today? >> the constitution of the united states is a promise about how government power will be used and it is a promise that was left to us by a generation who had lived under tiyrannical government and needed the framework. we should be very grateful for had a. >> it is not relevant today. >> it is true the constitution's promise has been broken time and time again by our government. but we are very fortunate we can at least point to it and say that this is what the framework of our government was designed to do. >> all right p. the preamble says secure the

blessings of liberty. for you that's the most important. >> that's right. the constitution says in the first sentence liberty is a blessing. it does not say the same thing about democracy or government in general. the constitution was written to protect liberty against government whether it be a democratic form of government or any other kind of government. >> it also says ensure domestic tranquility. that could be speech code, decency code. it says promote the general welfare. obamacare. but that's only within the framework of the liberty which the declaration says we are all born entitled to. most important part of the constitution is its limitations. limitations on government. if you look at article i, section i, the first sentence there says all legislative powers herein granted are vested in a congress. a lot of people skip over that part. they think congress has all legislative power or all power or the power to do whatever is a good idea. that's not what the constitution

says. it says all of the powers listed in the constitution are given to congress. if it is not in the constitution congress does not have the power to do that. >> they do it all the time. >> that's true. they do. unfortunately, the -- elected officials have a huge incentive to do whatever they think is popular. >> the supreme court for the most part hasn't stopped them. >> a lot of time the supreme court has gone along with the government overreaching. most obviously in the obamacare case. for example, in obamacare what happened was the supreme court said that, well the government can't force people to buy things. actually a huge victory for individual freedom. you imagine what would have happened if it came out the other way if congress suddenly the power to force us to buy whatever politicians think we should have. but the court said then, well, but we are still going to uphold the obamacare because as chief roberts put it it is not the role of the court to protect people from the political choices. that is false. it is wrote t role of the courts tone force the constitution

with -- which is a limit on political choices. >> all right. my p my supreme court cases you are happy with? >> there are some great supreme court decisions out there. the first one -- it was -- when i fell in love with the constitution was when i was in ninth grade and i learned about the court's decision, tinker versus des moines school district which is a decision that upheld the right of high school students to wear black armbands protesting the vietnam war. their teachers told them not do this. they sued. they said we had a first amendment right do that. the supreme court ruled in their favor and said individual rights do not stop at the schoolhouse gate. when i read that decision, i made my parents drive me to the county law library so i could photo copy the decision. this was in the days before the internet. i felt in that decision -- i felt the constitution -- you were an odd kid. >> i was a nerd. can you imagine? i felt -- when reading the decision i felt the constitution reach out and touch me and protect me and say my rights

can't be taken away by people trying tell me what to do. >> a supreme court case from a few years ago, ten years guy, i think, now. in which the supreme courts says the government does not have the right to tell us who we can sleep with. there was a texas law that made it illegal for two adults of the same sex to go to bed together in the privacy of their own home and the supreme court said that that is obscene in a free country that is why i love the constitution because there moments like that when really helpless minorities and individuals who can't expect the legislative process to respect their rights, nevertheless have a shield in the form of the supreme court saying, no, this line something that congress and the states can not pass. >> questions? >> hi. i graduated in new jersey.

may question is, if the constitution is the rule of law, the rules for the government, and the government administers and enforces its own rules, how sit we prevent them from breaking their own rules? >> that's a very good question. it is one of -- the founding fathers fought about. james madison says in creating a government that's to protect people you have to create one that will protect them from the government itself. now, patrick henry said that no, that's not going to work. congress is going to do all these terrible things. when he was done, james medical son got up and he said have we then no virtue among us because if we have none we are indeed in a retch ed condition. no system of parchment of checks and balances can protect us. the constitution's promise has the meaning we give white we honor that promise. yes, the government has fallen away and ignored that promise on occasions. but it is there for us to enforce as we go forward. [ applause ]

>> my name is nathan. i study communications at indiana university. my question for you is what do you think is the best method to reverse the policies created by the surveillance state? >> i think the best method to reverse policies is to elect new officials. but the bust way to ensure constitutional liberty is secured is to enforce the constitution and that means sue, sue, sue. and i mean that sort of selfishly because my profession is i sue the government for a living. it is the greatest job in the world. it is the brightest job in the world. i do it for free. i don't charge my clients and we go to supreme court and make your argument and you insist the constitution says this. now it is up to you, judge, or you, court of appeals or you, u.s. supreme court, to follow

what's written there. >> thank you, students. thank you, tim. later in the show, given that most of your fellow students are left wingers will have a debate about the best way to argue with them. but next, this art exhibited, picture of it, the sculpture of a sleep walking man in his underwear, is upsetting students in one college. they demand it be removed. [cheers and applause] with at&t's new pricing for families

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dhp john: your students should you students should be uld careful what you say. at your college, you may get in trouble if you say the wrong thing. if you offend people. pyre, they call themselves. in college stuns say all kinds of stuff.

>> that's right. students are saying all kinds of stuff. but, unfortunately, the fact is that on campuses across the country they are taking a very big risk by saying those things. and it has xoten so bad that the students are actually going so far as to sencensor themselves. >> a 59% of higher education institutions have policies that infringe on our first amendment rights. >> a few years ago 75%. it has gotten better. unfortunately, we see these in policies all across campus. >> you list the worst colleges for free speech. state university of new york, oswego harvard university of bawl. alabama. >> we had an student writing a story for the school paper, hockey coach necessary the area saying how do you find a relation to the hockey coach to be. don't worry, not everything you

say has to be complimentary. one of the coaches forwarded it back to the administration and they actually got the student in trouble for basically calling it lets, calling that something that you are not allowed to say on their campus. he got in trouble simply for saying not everything has to be positive. >> harvard, number would. >> they decided to read the e-mails of 16 of their resident deans because they were trying to figure out who was leaking information about a cheating scandal at harvard. >> at brown university, new york police commissioner ray kelly was prevented from speaking. >> we ask you to let him speak and make the comment part of the question and answer part of the program. >> he eventually zbaf up and left the auditorium. this happened to me at brown. they pulled out my mike cord. this is a liberal arts

institution that's supposed to hear all sides. >> this happens because we trained students from k through 12 and into college to believe that certain views are so abhorrent they shouldn't be spoken. in that case, ray kelly, hit to do with the stop and frisk policies. ray kelly came down to give a speech what he knew would be hostile on brown and had agreed to take questions. but that wasn't good enough. so the organized hecklers, for 27 minutes, disrupted the speech. he only got a few words out before it went on. for 27 minutes he gave up and left. that's the very opposite of the environment we are supposed to have on college campuses. they were going to have a x&a session. if they objected to the policy they had a chance to convince ray kelly he was wrong but they squandered that by instead engaging in this kind of vigilan vigilante censorship. >> what's the deal with the sleep walk erstad u? >> streets supposed to evoke a sense of empathy about this --

the sleep walker. how he is vulnerable. that's now how the students seen it. they see it as a threatening image. it is an all girls school. it may trigger memories of sexual assault in people that see it because it is a man who isn't fully dressed. other people have objected the they think it is whiteness and maleness are a real imposition on campus. somebody called it discomforting. >> all right. i will push back and play the role of the university. we want people to learn. between want people to be comfortable. if it is an ugly climate, if i'm in your face and say -- you are a big, fat, ugly parasite lawyer, and i'm screaming at you, how can people learn? shouldn't there be a civilized public square? especially at a university? >> well, civility is an important value but not anywhere near as important as freedom. and the fact is we are training wellesley students -- least liberal arts college. we are training them to be so

afraid of a statue that they feel uncomfortabling to simply walk around their campus and go to class and learn, then something has gone terribly wrong with our level of tolerance for the different views. you are going to see -- you know, white men maybe in their underwear sometime in your life. up can't let that throw off your entire lifestyle. >> thank you. [ applause ] >> coming up, we will talk drugs and privacy. but next, are you students getting ripped off by your college? i think many of you are. that's next. [applause] good job!

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♪ welcome back to a special edition of my show from the students for liberty conference in washington, d.c. i assume when you students

graduate, you would like attorney some money and get a job. but will you? mayor your college is wasting your time and your money. camille foster says you can't count our college. you need to take responsibility. foster is co-host of the new fox business program the independence. you are an entrepreneur yourself. you started in college i started a small telecommunications consulting firm. i-spent about ten years doing that. i did not at the time drop out of school. i went about one two classes at a time. i didn't borrow a bunch of money in order to finance my education. i would go on from there to start two other small companies. one in new media firm that does film production. and another, retail and mfshing company that makes camera accessories. >> just wanted to do this. >> i wanted to do it. it is one of those things, it is increasingly true your college degree is not necessarily preparing you for the kind of world we all encounter. we have a pretty significant

unemployment problem right now and a xwrit deal of that has do with the policies we are pursuing as a country. some of it is structural. there are people graduating from college that are getting liberal arts degrees and don't have the sort of skills necessary totally compete in the job market. they are not entrepreneurial enough and it is just this sort of thing that's not really being taught at most universities. >> in trying to be an entrepreneur find it it is something that makes people understand the benefits of limited government. i don't know why you people became libertarians. i assume you didn't all start businesses. but -- a lot of people say i had no idea that this is what business people have to go through. >> interestingly, that's one of the things that makes most optimistic about the put is that people have a -- a warm peeling about entrepreneurs in general. and more and more people feel like they can be entrepreneurs. there is an increasingly free agent culture and there is something wonderful that happens when more people have to mauck

payroll and when more people find themselves dealing with government bureaucracy in the most ordinary and regular ways. whether it is running your payroll and having to deal with the various tax agencies that you have to get records and numbers from and it is doing everything exactly the same way for a number of years and then finding out something was wrong and having someone come into your office to screw around with you and for the space of 2 1/2 months. it is wasting 33% of your time in a fairly small company with ten employees to comply with various burdensome regulation. >> we need more people to start businesses to wake up. >> absolutely. >> yet, colleges are teaching people -- you list some of the fun courses. princeton has course in getting dressed. >> yes. because no one at princeton could possibly master that on their own. it couldn't happen. >> the university of california san diego, god, sex,

chocolates,ire and the spiritual path. >> sounds delicious. i mean -- >> the university of texas, invented languages. klingon and beyond. >> it is amazing. when we hi about college, what sit? it is folks paying $20,000 to $50,000 a we are for an extra four or more years of adolescence. it is fine. it is nice. it is a bad idea to subsidize it with taxpayer dollars. it is certainly a bad idea to take out loans in order to do it. [ applause ] >> thank you. coming up, what school won't teach you about personal people like -- should i be allowed to open this case and do this? sn [ male announcer ] it's simple phics...

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welcome back to "stossel." this next class is about " personal liberty. time limited to two cop particulars. . the nsa is spying on us and

drugs. illegal drugs. how many of you have never used an illegal drug? including enclose when you were not yet 21.[l some of you.th all right.m clearly a minority. the -- editor of my favorite magazine says once you are an adult alll substances should be legal. she is katherine of "reason" magazine.er all drugs? every single one? crack, meth?>> >> i think legal drugs are safer drugs. that's probably the best to start t with.at e-cigarettes which you so cooll. smoked earlier. >> i tried. >> this is a safer product than a regular cigarette. here's because somebody figured out how to make money selling u drugs that we want to consume.o the people had a make money on drugs now are people who are a

willing to operate in black markets and i rather see it all out in the light of day. >> this is really just a substitute nicotine nedelivery m system. d smell. just vapor. >> it exposes this weird d puritanical element on the war j ofu drugs. it literally -- you like that chemical in will and it makes y you feel good, we don't want ton you have it. >> i think they are also saying if we allow this, this sends the message smoking cigarettes is okay. >> ghright. well, i mean, i think -- ideally we -- find ourselves in a world where the message sent is -- si using drugs,ng choosing what yo want to put in your own body is but that we should hopefully let companies provide safer alternatives, provide more reliable alternatives to the black market drugs that are out there. >> all right. this is nots what most of the time we are talking about when we are talking about illegal l drugs. we are talking about the nastie ones like meth that really hurt people. lots of people.

well-meaning authoritarians sayg that we can reduce the amount iu we make it illegal. >> that's worked out so well so far. >> they argue there would be more of this. >> you know -- i'm sympathetic t toin this concern. cocaine in vendsing machines is it the american way? that's an alarming concept to people but if you look at the huge damage the war on drugs has done, disproportionate damage t black communities, students' he lives ruined, the costs are hugt and it is not working.c heroin is cheaper now than it 3 was 30 years ago. >> nsa spying. when the nsa spying story first broke, i upset atlanta w bravetarian business saying i was nott that upset. i figured that my enemies already had all of the information on me. my neighbor was stealing my th information. and i -- i post ad list of 100 e things that government does tha upset me more than data mining

like our $17 trillion debt. corporate bailouts, rules against schoolhoic choice. i don't say all those hundred things are as important as msa spying, potentially dangerous. it is just that i can understand the government's reason for wanting to do it. people want to kill us.ant >> you know, that's -- true up to a point.r but actually, what we are seeing as more and more information isa coming out about how incrediblye sensitive the data mining is, wn are actually seeing not a lot o evidence that it works.r i mean, this is the old -- if youa sacrifice liberty for y security you get neither.ht that's where we are right now. [ applause ]gle i love it when google takes my data.c i want goog tool have all my da data. if i could give my brain toee google i would. that's because google gives me something i want in t exchange.. it gives me ads that are for products i want to buy.

>> it is giving you personal s safety. >> it gives me services. the nsa says i'm giving you y, personal safety or i put new jail.this right? had is -- this is the back -- google can't put me in jail. the nsa can. >> who agrees with her? who agrees with me? i'm losing this. your turn, students my name is michael. i'm dyinged with bipolar disorder so i have a host of medicines i take with a host of side effects. for my concern i don't think it is anybody's business how a drua interact was my body.i so i don't think that it is -- beneficial to bring that to the light and so people understand sortd of what drugs do for whom and how they interact with what -- it is my business. not anybody else's.ee to me it seems sort of iv

counter-individualistic to sort of propose i want to legalize drugs such that the entire body public can understand them when it is frankly none of their business in the first place. that's my question to you.c how do you think that's cohesive with individualism. >> iindividualism? >> i think individualism libertarians should favor i letting knowledge be free. i think more information is gooe for individuals to make their own choices. [ applause ] >> my name is ryan, i'm a freshman at the online high school, my virtual academy. how do we deal with the liberal bias in high school because there's aa lot of it. i've dealt with it quite recently learning about franklin delano roosevelt and it praises

him likes he's a god and he's he ruins everything. [ cheers and applause ] how do we deal with that? how do we communicate liberty and real freedom and all of that into high school? >> the first part of your question and the second. if you're going to an online high school, you figured out hc to opt out of the system. congratulations. [ cheers and applause ] >> my name is elizabeth francis, i'm a senior at kansas state t university. what areh some things that maybt audiences at home could take as to how advanced personal liber? and work towards changing publio policy? >> there's a great campaign outd there that's just asks people who have smoked weed to be open about it, successful people.at so i think that's a great placeb to start. i have a job at a bank. i smoked weed.ed i have a kid, i smoke weed.f

>> coming up, most of these students attend liberal en colleges, you have to deal with students and professors who love the government. how might you educate them? a debate on that next. [applause] ♪

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if you learned anything at stossel, it should be the best type of government is limited government.

these students understand that. why don't other people get it? how can we convince them? cathy and julie barosky know how. julie has a youtube channel and cathy is editor of a blog called sex and state, which is a cool title. cathy, you say to open other people's minds, libertarians should check their privilege. what does that mean? >> libertarianism is overwhelmingly dominated by straight middle income well educated white men. -- >> the overclass. >> right. >> i want to figure out how can we make libertarianism if not appealing to other people because that demographic is decreasing, at least get people not hostile to our ideas. there are certain things you can't know on basis of who you are. in order to understand what for instance discrimination against for me -- i'll have to check my

female privilege and listen to their experiences. >> for women we should talk about things like making birth control available over the counter. >> absolutely. >> for blacks ending the drug war allowing school choice? for hispanics opposing e verify which requires employers to get permission before they hire anybody. >> this is from my own personal life. i used to be a prohibitionist because it had generally never occurred to me that police were using drug laws to gather armed s.w.a.t. teams and burst down doors and carry people off to prison and disproportionately people who don't look like me. >> this seems like a reasonable argument to me, julie and you don't buy it? >> for me the main component is individualism. we want to maximize freedom for every individual. what i've noticed when the privileges crowd, it's verydy vicive and negative and class war fare and jealously.

>> it is a leftist college expression? [ cheers and applause ] you've heard it from us? >> personally i do not like the term check your privilege because a lot of people say check your privilege, i've never seen someone say you make a good point, maybe i should check my privilege. people get defensive and rightfully so because they are making a predetermined judgment about that person. i think it's down right rude. [ cheers and applause ] >> and cathy, it is not nice to divide people into categories. we're all individuals. >> absolutely. unfortunately the reality is that racism, sexism, home phobia exhib exists, without acknowledging the inhibiters to certain

abilities we're be hampered to truly advocate for them effectively. [ cheers and applause ] >> i've got to say as i look around here, i see disproportionate white men in ties, even bow ties. they look like the overclass. i would think this is a turnoff for a lot of people. >> there's a lot of white men here. i would say it has more to do with libertarianism being a bit nerdy and i'm a nerd myself so i can say that. >> all of this is food for thought. audience, whose argument is better? let's have a vote. who sides with julie and who says we should not argue by sex, race and ethnic group? [ cheers and applause ] >> who sides with cathy and says we should? [ cheers and applause ] >> anyway, i think you both make good points. thank you, cathy and julie and thanks to all of you for

attending stossel u. thank you at home for watching. >> a fox news alert protesters taking control of the capital of ukraine while the president goes into hiding. live pictures dramatic pictures from the center of it all, independence square. it's 1:00 a.m. sunday morning local time. the crowds are as big as ever. welcome to america's news headquarters, it's a brand-new hour, i'm ed henry. >> and mr. dapper is here. here's what we know, president fleeing the capital early saturday morning to take refuge with his russian leaning supporters in the eastern part of the country. the parliament now calling for