>> a lot of people are talking about air piracy. there are a few things we've learned today. according to the report in "the new york times," one of our competitors in news. we all got drops at roughly 5:00 p.m. eastern. the "new york times" is reporting this plane left kuala lumpur in this direction, dropped off the radar. at this point it's believed it climbed to a higher elevation. the times is reporting it climbs to 45,000 feet. that was about the time that they lost contact with it. after it climbed to 45,000 feet, it began descending to about 22,000 feet. none of this was planned. none was this was part of the preprogramming of the flight.

none of it would happen under normal circumstances. in addition, sources are telling fox news that a number of scenarios have come forward to believe this thing went in weird ways. i say that because of this. took off in this direction. this is the spot where it lost contact, where the transponders quit going. 12 minutes later, the acars system, it's a communication system, stopped performing. but along the way, as it took what it is this route, nothing you would ever program in, there was still a system on board which is speaking with a satellite company called n mars, it's located in great britain. it had a piece of equipment on board this jet. that piece of equipment, much like your phone, say you go through a mountain tunnel and you lose contact with verizon or at&t, or whatever your thing is, and on the other side, it starts circling, looking for a signal,

then you get your four dots. you didn't send a text or make a phone call, but a connection was made. that's what happened on this jet. this ping, if you will, happened for four to five hours, meaning this plane flew for four to five hours, along this route, with no communication of any kind, with no mayday call, with no communication from anybody in the back of the plane. nobody got on the computers and sent out any sort of message. there was nothing. yet it flew for four to five hours. what does that tell them? it tells them either somebody of the manipulating this plane or there was a catastrophic event. and it was flying along a preprogrammed route. the problem with that, nobody preprograms this route. these are stations in the water where mention is made of lap launch. so you say, this is a point of contact, and this is a point of

contact. they believe it flew this route. but then, at some point, as it was out in this huge area, it's leaving malaysia, goes this direction, and then if flew back over the land. american officials are confident now, they tell us, that happened. what's unsure, whether it went up into the bay of bengal, or down into the china sea. the united states has -- in the indian ocean, i meant to say. there's a search under way there and it's widely believed they may find it there. after it flew four to five hours, what happened then? no way to go. but three possibilities t ran out of fuel and crashed into the sea. another, it landed, and somebody shut all of the controls off. where would it have landed? there are a lot of possibilities, none of them make a lot of sense, but the options are there. >> it flew four to five hours.

the transponder was off. they do that within they land. >> also what's telling to me, if you remember back with the other crash, that was a decompression issue. they saw people inside the plane had died. if happened, it wouldn't be off course. number two, you wouldn't have the askending and descending altitudes of 35, 45, and 22,000 feet. so that tells me somebody was flying that airplane in that four to five-hour period, which goes to your original point, human intervention or air piracy. >> in addition to that, it's possible they could have -- the fly path, all right, let's go west. that's not what it did. they now believe it made this turn. we were getting bits of information from the malaysian military, some from other authorities. then the united states got in there and took all this

information and put them together into something that coordinates with each other in real time. this is what they've come up with. we don't send resources out into this sea without a belief that that's where they're going to find something. further, three major national and international news organizations don't get very similar information dropped on them within 30 to 45 minutes time and all go to air or print with it at the same time. none of it contradicted itself. seems like they have a much better idea what happened. the question remaining, if somebody was controlling this plane, why were they doing it, who was it, and where are they? >> that's the big mystery. let me ask you about this that we heard earlier today. the boeing is an incredible plane. the 777 one of the safest of any plane in the sky. the level of redundancy they put in that plane and the second thing that fascinates me, the engines communicate throughout entire flights, sending signals

as to their performance at any given moment in that flight. and we got reports earlier today that in fact, those signals were sent out by the mechanical aspect of the plane. do we know if we have the exact gps location when they sent those signals? >> we don't. malaysia airlines didn't subscribe to the maintenance protoco protocols, or sign up for the service for the additional monitoring. further the information the engines sent, there's a piece of equipment on there from the satellite company. it sends out, hey, i'm flying, but it doesn't send out anything else. it doesn't say here's where i am and here's where i'm going. we don't have any of that information. so what they've done, they've taken these ground points, military and civilian radar, they've compiled those with the information that it's still flying and what they're getting there. further, they have military and civilian radar which indicates it came back over malaysia. the radar doesn't show flight

370 is flying here, but when you drop off here and you get these pings of something flying there, that's why they have come up with all of this. if united states officials are coming forward with this information saying this is the route, here's where we're searching and we're looking into whether somebody was piloting the thing at the time and not communicating with us. at least for the first time it's not contradictory and it paints -- it brings together a puzzle that on some level makes sense. >> it's beginning to come together, i agree. 250 people on board. i'm angry at the malaysian government and the airlines. this information could have been shared with the international community a lot earlier. >> every contact i have says the malaysian institution of government is not set up like ours. and if they have a communication zone, a group of people, bringing all the best experts. that didn't happen. you got the military saying some things. somebody comes back and says, you shouldn't have said that. then they deny it. all of that was

counterproductive. all of that said, it's no longer believed this plane crashed when it lost contact. that there was a catastrophic event, the plane depressurized, you're asleep and then you're dead. we know it wasn't on auto pilot. so the things that don't come together here are the things that are most unnerving. coming up we have more on that plane, it's vanished off the radar screen, plus my interview with a reporter who spoke extensively and exclusively with the family of american philip woods, the one american on board the missing jet liner. he's here to explain what they think happened to their loves ones. stay with us. we'll be joined by pilots and crash experts next. save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance.d

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all right, this is a fox news alert, with all the reports that the plane was deliberately diverted we must ask, well, who are the pilots? now the video you see on the right side of the screen right now, it is one of the pilots, youtube pages and it shows him standing in front of his own home flight simulator. joining me with reaction, faa crash investigator, david sushi is with us, also a pilot, boeing, and former navy fighter pilot leah gabriel is with us. good to see you all. i'll start with you, you flew the triple 7. >> yes. >> all right, so the latest really is in fact this was deliberate sabotage of this airplane. and that it was diverted. the transponder was turned off so they wouldn't find it. that is something that the pilot would have the ability to do, right? >> that is correct. and right now i think really what we have is still a lot of speculation. so that is really what we're going on. but based upon the apparent

evidence of what we have it looks like somebody deliberately turned the aircraft off the intended flight path. >> way off the flight path. leah, let me go to you. i'm very impressed, fighter pilot, and all the work the military has done. there is a series of reports, "the wall street journal," reuters, says it went off course and flew for another four or five hours. there are safety mechanisms within the triple 7 where mechanical data is being sent back all the time through satellite imagery? >> well, it is a data link. >> yes, and who would receive that? >> typically, it depends on the airline. it would either be the engine manufacturer or the airline themselves. and usually they use that for maintenance, for the health of the engine. >> and they want to know as they send it back at this point in had the flight how the engine, for example, is performing. >> that is correct. >> so what do you glean from

these reports today? >> well, sean, i am digging on the reports that the pilot may have deliberately taken the plane off course. now, that is a reuters course, what it says basically is that the plane looked like it was flying on an aviation corridor. i'm putting up a map, the aviation map, we have this. this is an aviation chart, you can see all the lines and then the dots. those are way points. they help to define the different navigation routes. >> this would almost be like a highway in the sky? in other words, planes fly particular paths and then they follow the same paths and replay information back that the planes are following, by the way, a lot of turbulence at this area. >> it is a sky, planes can fly where they want. this is the path that according to the reuters report the plane

apparently flew. so you can see where it took off from malaysia. up there on the northeast, that is the last point of communication. and then head west from there. you can see that is where the reuters report says the military radar indicated that it may have picked up the 777 near a way point over there. them you see a way point just above that that says it is headi heading in that direction. the military may have picked that up. and then pointed again to the northwest. >> can you explain what the way points are, i know having spoken with a lot of pilots over my lifetime that usually they say good-bye to one traffic control center, one air space, if you will. and then hello to another one in other words, they're being monitored during the entire flight, although there are gaps. >> it is just a gps position, a position in the sky. but the point of showing this chart if you could put that back up there again, i want to show you. none of these are on a specific path.

so only two of them are on the same specific path that would head in the direction. this report that a pilot or someone may have intentionally taken the plane on a path, this kind of shows some other evidence because none of these are on a specific path. and at the end of the day if i'm a pilot i don't have to fly any of these routes, sean, all i have to do is put in a gps coordinate of where i want to go and i can turn in that direction. if i'm not playing by the rules that is what i'm going to do. >> it is mysterious that the pilot had control of the transponder, but this is way off cour course, which is a problem here. if we have the two incidents and put them together, and the way points, way off course. the transponder is off. then i think that goes more towards the theory that somehow a deliberate sabotage by some of the pilots or somebody on the plane. >> i think we have to be very careful sean, this is a lot of information coming from other sourcings. for example, the radar, that

could have been something completely different that they saw. the last known point of communication, that is -- that could be data on its own. and the other path could not have anything to do with the airplane. >> but we do know that triple 7s don't disappear on their own. and pilots would never turn off a transponder. and we do know that this ended up way off course. and we believe the mechanical data, on top of the military information that you're pointing out does suggest a four to five hour extended flight. >> i think it is more than suggest. to me, we're talking about the pings. so it is not just a primary radar hit. what the ping is, it coming off the acar system, there are two parts, you have the information, the data that is september back. how it is transmitted is the radios, if the sat com is not available. it makes that connection and sends it forward.

you get the batch of information. and if the acar is absent the data, then the sat com will still try to connect. >> are you talking about the sat com as it relates to mechanical performance at any information? >> no, i'm talking about the data -- it does transmit. >> the mechanical data, which i think is brilliant, they're monitoring the mechanical performance at any given moment. >> so when the aircraft lands, they can get the parts ready, have all that kind of information. >> but i also want to make the point we don't know that the plane flew off the intended course. that for sure now. there is a lot of information out there, one thing that could have happened is the plane could have crashed. >> we have to also go to the time line, the plane takes off, the last communication is 40-some odd minutes. they go through the 90 minute period where the plane is

flying. it is 90 minutes later they realize the plane is missing because it never showed up in chinese air space. it is well off course, pretty well determined, right? >> and no pilot would go off course without enunciating that it went off course. that captain was not just 18,000 hours but a training can't and certified by their government to give instruction and testing. if they had an emergency, which never was enunciated, if they had a problem they would have said something. remember, the key factors, you're going to aviate, navigate and communicate. those are the tenets that you fly by. >> is it possible that the pilot was involved? >> you know why it happened, going back to the validating of the data a as to whether or not it went off or not, the thing

that concerns me about discount ing that, if it were just radar, i would agree. there is no way to know what it is. to say our u.s. government came out and said their satellites are picking up the attempt to connect, that is not just anything. >> it is not saying specifically where it was. >> is gps included in that? >> well, if the data is included yes, but it is not. the satellite can figure out where that came from because there is triangulation on the three satellites. we're talking about the malaysian radar, which is primary. but we're talking about from what the u.s. government is saying we have the pings on the radar systems. the confusion is that malaysia said no, we talked to rolls royce, we don't have any data, which makes sense if the acar is turned off. >> and we'll wait to see where

the plane has been. there are other things that happened sean, pilot incapacitation -- >> wouldn't it be more likely, the pilots, once they go wheels up, they're boom, the wheels are up, they're there in case something wrong happens? right? >> in a lot of cases. >> you want it on auto pilot because it is a much more precise way of flying and certainly you will save a lot of fuel and time with that. so you put it on automatic pilot. yes, the fact that it went off track, the transponders were off, if nothing else that has to be a suspicion. who was in the cockpit until you get the voice recorder and the flight data recorder, you can't really know. >> we didn't get the flight data from the air france accident for two years. >> and if you remember in that case it was a malfunction in the case that caused the crash and the pilot error incorrect iing .

>> hey, guys, very informative, we'll have more on the plane and the interview with the reporter who spoke exclusive with the family of philip woods. he was the family member on board. we'll explain what they think happened to their loved one in this when it's donut friday at the office i use my citi thankyou card to get two times the points at the coffee shop. which will help me get to miami...and they'll be stuck at the cube farm. the citi thankyou preferred card. now earn two times the points on dining out with no annual fee. go to citi.com/thankyoucards. to truck guys, the truck is everything. and when you put them in charge

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. this is a fox news letter, the missing malaysian plane is called one of the greatest aviation mysteries in history, joining us now, former ntsb board member, mary, good to see you. it has been a long time. thank you so much for coming back. i know how deliberative you are and how seriously you take issues like this. when you hear all this information, it may have flown for four hours more. the possibility that the pings were going back through at least sat com, that we may have pinpointed the locations. what does it tell you? >> well, actually it tells me two diametrically opposed things. and i think you know i spent time litigating the 9/11 event and the passengers. the first thing, how erratic the flying was, the 9/11 hijackers

didn't mess around, they didn't go here, anywhere. hijackers know where they have to go and they have gps. it is easy to understand, easier than the plane, and they get there. the erratic flying does not point to me the hijacking. >> what does it point to? >> a mechanical problem, either hypoxia, a loss of steering capability like japan airlines. or a situation like stewart, where the pilots are no longer flying if you're just all over the place. but the second part of the news that came out today that rang so true it was frightening. and that is that the plane was up and down all over the place. on flight 93, the hijackers deliberately did that. they did that to throw the passengers off. remember they were trying to break into the cockpit.

we did video recreations of the flight. in that case they would take the nose up, try to throw them to the back, and try to throw them off balance and rock it back and force. that is the only thing that struck me like terrorism. everything else is basically six or seven pings. and pings don't tell me terrorists. pings say something is wrong if that is all you have. but there is like i said -- >> what about the transponder being turned off? that is something the pilot can do manually? >> no, we don't know if the transponder was turned off. we know we got no more signals from the transponder. the only way we know if it was turned off, some interruptions from communications, is from some sort of communications from the cockpit. >> well, mary, you know the safety of the 777 it is a great airplane, and you know the level of redundancy on the airplanes,

triple of course quadruple, if it went off the pilot would have been able to turn it back on via some battery pack system. >> if they're able. >> explain the payne system. he was in a lear jet if memory serves me right, we had fighter jets go up and actually they could see that everybody was already dead in the plane and they let it run out of fuel before the plane went down, right? >> right, they let it go because they could calculate exactly where it was going to come down. there was never a plan to shoot it down. you're right. >> right, but now on a boeing triple 7, was this the type of plane that could have a similar issue. wouldn't there be at least sometime for the pilots to get an oxygen mask on? >> well, at 35,000 feet which is where they had the last communication they don't have

long. they have between 15 and 30 seconds. you have to train for that. you have to get it out and get it on quickly. otherwise, hypoxia will set in and you very quickly even lose your ability to make decisions. so it is very fast and they train for it. they're supposed to train for it but you have to do it right away. >> john, what is your reaction of what mary is saying, what are your thoughts? >> well, i'm a trained investigator, i go by facts, we have a lot of theories, mary has some, and i have some of my own but we reallile have to wait until we see what they discover. >> i agree with you, but based on the information, this is one of if not the greatest aviation security information mystery of all time. boeing triple 7s don't fall out of the sky. and with all the safety systems built into the airplane you would think we would have been able to pick up its location,

no, sir? >> i agree, with the acares turned off, you have the communications piece of the acar system still working and essentially on the hour like they said. every hour it is putting its happen hand up saying hey, here i am, putting a radio signal out saying here i am. and the satellite is picking it up but there is nothing behind it because they have already turned off the memory. it is almost like a cell phone in your hand, you have the knowledge in your head, the cell phone makes the connection but you don't talk. >> does that include the mechanical communication via satellite sent out that in fact this is how for example the engines are working at any given moment during a flight? >> yes, now remember, that is a service. you have to pay for it. there is conflicting reports right now that malaysia has not paid for that. they didn't want it. it is on the airplane.

it may even actually be working. but if they're not going to pay for the service the service provider is not going to collect it and store it. >> all right, mary, final thoughts. >> it is not clear by all the stories. what the real tragedy here in the beginning is that we've lost the first three and a half days of this investigation because the malaysian government didn't share the data with the international community. >> i agree with that. >> i mean, look at what has happened in the last day and a half because the international community has been involved with it. we've got more leads than we had before. more information that we have had in the previous five days. i mean, it is just -- just a tragedy for the families more than anyone else that this delayed as long as it did. >> well said. >> mary, last word. >> well, and the other tragedy is that we still have these you know, these terrifying searches, the races to get the black box when we don't upgrade the data collection and either require the provision of this service

where the data is downloaded in flight or upgrade the black boxes in flight where they download the data in flight to the hard base at the airline on the ground and then we wouldn't have the frantic searches. >> extremely well said, we have had decades to do this. mary, thank you very much. good to see you. coming up i'll talk to the reporter who spoke with the family member of the sole american on board. and this and much more on this these amazing daily specials. saturday only, this new bass pro folding processing table is under $70. and save $60 on shimano curado g series baitcast reels.

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extensively with the family of philip wood, one of the passengers on board that jet. thank you for joining us, appreciate it. >> you're welcome. >> well, i have to imagine, i mean, i assume they're probably holding out some hope that maybe this plane landed someplace safely. but i'm sure they're very ner s nervous, what do they tell you? >> well, you're exactly right, one of the terrible things, they're hearing different reports, early on there were reports about wreckage, people were fearing the worst. and now, they are i'm sure allowing themselves to believe that maybe, just maybe, miraculously the folks are all still alive and the loved ones, they would reunited with them. >> i would have holding out hope myself. are they angry toward the malaysian airlines and the government for withholding some

very specific, important data now before they revealed it for five days? >> the people we've spoken with, they were not angry, they were more confused. confused about the fact that there were all of these differing reports out there about what happened. and seeming differences of opinion even among people in the malaysian government about what had happened. so i think they were confused. they were looking for every bit of news that they could get and just wondering what the truth really was. >> yeah, is there anything else that you can add that they might have told you that stood out to you? >> well, i mean, obviously they're sitting there trying to remember the last moments they had with the loved ones. in the case of phil wood, who is the lone adult american on board this flight. as it happened he had been in texas just a week ago. so many of his relatives. his parents, his brother, his two sons who are in their 20s had both seen him recently. so i think they were going over

in their minds the last moments that they got to spend with him. and in a sense they felt fortunate they got to see him. he was in asia after all. he was just living there. >> all right, thank you for joining us. joining me now to lay out all the possibility scenarios that led to the missing plane. seth, welcome to the program. >> thank you for having me, sean. >> very confusing, conflicting information. changing every day. flew an extra four hours, diverted. transponder, what do you make of all of this from a technical perspective, a professional perspective? >> yeah, you're right, setting a little precedent for something this mysterious. almost amazing to think a few years ago we were saying air france flight 440 was a mystery. there we knew, it was flying in bad weather, sending distress signals. nothing like that to go on. here we say did the plane go down or not? it seemed like it did not.

like it continued flying. could something like that be an accident? well, we had that payne stewart crash, the golfer who tragically died after the plane lost cabin pressure. you had these people flying on a lear jet for four hours before the plane crashed in a field. so yes, it is possible for the plane to fly that long uncontrolled. here a little bit different because we do have these signs that perhaps somebody turned off the transponder, the acar, the system going off as well. could there be a root mechanical cause that caused both of those things as well as whatever else happened? yes, but certainly a lot of evidence that perhaps something else happened. then what was that. >> well, ironic ally, another event that comes to mind happened literally six days after the payne stewart crash, that was egypt air 990, the flight out of jfk where one of the pilots seemingly locked the

other pilot out of the cockpit and crashed the plane. that is one possibility. the other is sort of a routine piracy, hijacking. and we heard the reports that perhaps the cockpit entry procedures at malaysian airlines and particularly one of these pilots were not up to international standards. >> what do you make of the sharp changes in altitude? what do you make of that? >> it certainly would indicate that the payne stewart event, kept climbing, here you have what seems to be somebody controlling the aircraft. if anything you would have to say more evidence of that than not. but again, we are all to be perfectly clear educated guessing at this point. because it is so inconsistent with almost anything else. so we're really grasping for precedent. when i give you instances, they say well could it be this? >> i understand, but if it is on

automatic pilot it will fly straight to its destination. the transponder usually -- this is not a plane known for its mechanical failure. the track record is impeccable. and then it gets off course then the changes in altitude. that is not going to happen on a flight that is on automatic pilot. is it? >> right, but we're trianulating. we don't really know what happened. we have the -- >> again if it is on automatic pilot. the motion on the airplane, or -- >> sean, the problems we don't yet know that. all we're dealing with is a plane that was not trying to communicate, again that is the important thing. not -- the transponder is not on. it is not saying here i am. i'm malaysian airlines flight 370, i'm at this altitude, and what not.

we're dealing with trying to pick up the military radar, the other indications on what might have happened. we don't know. >> "the new york times" is reporting the changes in altitude, not me, i don't know. we're all trying to put this together. coming up next, terror expert, richard miniter will talk about whether or not the plane was hijacked. we'll check in also with catherine herridge on the u.s. i will light up every room i walk into. [ female announcer ] olay presents the new regenerist luminous collection. renews surface cells to even skin tone. in just two weeks, see pearlescent, luminous skin. new regenerist luminous. from olay. and his new boss told him two things --

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this is a fox news alert, now day seven in the search for the missing malaysian airplane, and questions about whether or not the plane could have been hijacked are now beginning to surface. here with the analysis, the terrorist analyst richard

miniter, we talked with our own shep smith, more information on the plane that was not only descending, that it went off course and flew four to five su looks more and more like air piracy. >> it could well n the strongest evidence is the wild gyrations of the flight. looks like the flight path for the last minutes of united flight 93 which crashed in pennsylvania on 9-11. they kept rocking the plane back and forth. in the last minutes of this flight that disappeared there may well have been a fight for control it could be that also, idea this is an auto pilot would have remained level.

but gyrations, if accurate. >> it would have stayed on path. >> that is what pilots are trained to do. you save fuel and time saying on this computerized course. there are a lot of gyrations is the strongest case for terrorism. some experts saying we've received no threats, no claims of credit. it's unusual to occur without claims of credit. in this case nobody is taking credit for it. that might be this is a test case if you look at the flight out of manila in 1994, ramsey yusef put a bomb on that flight, cutting in half a japanese engineer and putting a hole on the side of the plane. they landed the plane but never took credit for it. that was just a test run. so perhaps malaysian hijacking

if it was a high zaking was a test run to see just what u.s. and other authorities could find. and what have we done? we've played into their hands, educated them about all electronic equipment on aircraft, what can be turned on, what can't be turned off, and so on. >> this is stuff that is pretty much common information that you'd be able to find out on your own anyway. boeing 777 is a 20-year-old plane the idea that information is sent back from the mechanical side of this to different locations just makes sense, right? i don't think that is new information. >> it depends on how well they've studied it. >> nothing tells you than seeing an active operation like this. they've just got an incredible education into the strength and weaknesses

>> planes don't go 35,000 feet to 22,000 feet like that and off course. it does not happen. >> also, from a part of the world where there is a fair amount of terrorism. >> very latest on the missing malaysian plane catherine herrige has the devel announcer: where can an investor be a name and not a number?

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based on an assessment there is a high probability the aircraft went down, today, investigators using a new technology to help locate flight 370. two communication systems went dark at roughly the same time. 370 satellite communication link was still active, and searching for a transmission point. >> we're looking closely with our team from the us to us get whatever information or satellite to the us us and we're working that to determine the whereabouts of the aircraft. we cannot review the information now because it's under investigation. >> the transponder and maintenances system can be turned off by the pilot the satellite communication link cannot. once an hour it does a kind of handshake, a reset like a cell phone. this helps a satellite find the

right tilt or angle. it did not communicate data but continues 4 to 5 hours. the satellite tilt gives investigators a broad scope or angle to consider, but does not provide data on altitude, speed, or location. today, the white house saying the president is getting regular updates. >> he's fully aware of and has been briefed on and knows where things stand. and he, too, is very concerned about the suffering of the families have to endure in a situation like this. and very concerned about the whereabouts of the plane. >> the satellite link went dark and there are only three likely scenarios the jet crashed and power disrupted, 370 went into the ocean and landed and power shut down by the crew. >> our thoughts and prayers are with the families and with those

with list missing loved ones >> thanks for being with us, rd" right now. this is a fox news alert. stunning new information about missing malaysia airlines flight 370. the "new york times" breaking big news just moments ago. first, the plane loses contact, then suddenly starts climbing high above the approved altitude for a 777. at one point the jumbo jet hitting at least 45,000 feet. then, suddenly, the plane starts dedescending. it drops fast and unevenly to just 23,000 feet. 23,000 feet is well below a 777 normal cruising altitude. then as it approaches a busy bustli