if you have persistent diarrhea, contact your doctor right away. other serious stomach conditions may exi. avoid if you te clopidogrel. for many, relief is at hand. ask your doctor abouxium. >> people are going to do it whether you like it or >> poker on-line.it or >> it's immediate action. >> you have a king? >> gambling is popular. some say gambling is a game. >> this has negative consequences that begin to ripple through society. >> my poker game with friends would be a crime. >> you are under arrest. >> hands against the wall. >> when people are arrested for gambling when it is okay for states to sell lotteries. >> add millions to your jackpot.

>> gambling what's right, what's wrong, what's legal? oo now, john stossel. >> i would like to gamble i bet on anything. want to bet on whether hillary clinton will become president? wh whether the stock market will go up? i will take any bet if there's no casino or book key or government taking a cut. more than 100 million americans filled out march madness brackets. they sold 12 million more than the super bowl. yet according to our reading of federal and state laws betting on the brackets is illegal. it is legal in nevada and montana. small time fools among friends are with vermont and

connecticut. otherwise betting on march madness is illegal. many of you broke the law. fortunately the law is really enforced and shouldn't be. why have it? it makes people feel good. >> it encourages people, poor people to spend money. >> this is a fundamental issue. i sound like some victorian nag. >> yes, rich, you are. gambling hurts some people. a group called stop predator regambling said it increases inequality causes people to lose control. patrick bash i am says chill out. he's the author of gambling a healthy bet. what do you mean a healthy bet. i don't mean it is healthy.

>> it is good for emotional and fizz rale health. it is fun entertaining and provide physical interaction. older people who gamble have less alcoholism, less depression. there are all kinds of things. >> i am convinced. >> we have seen gambling go from private to local activity to dominating national headlines. why is that? >> government has made gambling the way it communicates to citizens on a dill lay basis. constant calls to gamble lotteries that's why you see march madness like you have today. >> what -- >> now with government constantly advertising gambling to society we have created a culture where gambling dominates our headlines. >> your group is titled stop

predator regambling. >> that's right. >> what would you do? >> our mission is to get government out of the 2k3w578bling businee -- gamblin. it is different than a poker game. it is being done as a commercial enterprise. government in gambling are cheating and exploiting citizens. we are encouraging citizens to go against the law of probability. you have citizens spending billions on this. >> let's stick to the march madness for the moment. if people are betting 1,000 to win 60,000 should that be allowed? >> if you are doing a private or locally knock yourself out in the privacy of your own home. >> these are often the entry point for youth to begin gambling. sam should enjoy following the tournament filling out the brackets for the fun of it not for the amount of money they could possibly win.

>> we should hope it would be an entry point for youth. i would say if our focus is on reducing problem gambling whatever the level of that is what we know from research the lart in life one starts to gamble for the first time the more likely you will develop a problem and that will be more sever. yet if you are involved in sports you could get in big trouble. university of washington football coach was fired for betting in an office pool. it was a big one. they got a tip he put up 5,000 one about 20,000. one described as a gathering with friends. >> if you are not betting against your own team i don't see how it is any one's business. >> the new story got big news primarily because at the time the university of washington was looking for a reason to fire them: >> it wasn't like he was betting against his team. he's a football coach. >> teaching kids managing risk

through gambling. there's a difference between management risk and being responsible verses encouraging them to lose their money. it's like sitting down with your children encouraging them to play a video game they have no chance of winning. >> no chance of winning. >> we are not talking about commercial gambling we are talking about family poker game. >> gambling teaches skills math skills, problem volume offing. >> much more interested in playing poke tore learn odds than sitting in class. >> absolutely. >> i think gambling interests make a specific emphasis to pinpoint poker. to the average person they think poker is a harmless game. it's a small portion of gambling in america today. big money and gambling is slot machin machines. if you have kids we are talking on-line shot machines that's the focus. that's what the fight is about. >> what it gets to is

fundamentally there's people in our society in positions of power who think there is an amount of money for example that you shouldn't be able to use in a certain way. i miss that memo as to what it is i should or shouldn't be able to use my money on it it crosses a magical line or it is suddenly bad for me. it is patronizing and condescending and it is not what i think this country is all about. >> i agree. i sometimes play poker with friends. one guy thought he won with a pair of queens. >> queens. wow. >> you have a king? oh! after i won the nice pot i asked my poker buddies what do you think of the laws that protect people but banning gamble? >> we are intelligent enough to know our limits. leave the government out of it.

>> don't take my right away from me. >> not all mentally and psychologically strong enough to govern ourselves. >> the liberal wants government to do something. >> the addictive element of gambling forces the government to step in. >> smoking cigarettes is addictive behavior. they don't prevent us from drinking in our home. >> half of the state banned gambling like that with friends in yao you are home. your thoughts? >> the friday night poker game leave it in the privy of your own home. >> you worry about people who have a gam nling problem? >> absolutely. the difference between the poker game you play with your friends you are not putting a lien on somebody's house.

>> we can agree those are good friends. when you do it commercially that's when it crosses a line. that's when it makes it predator re. >> if that's commercial? >> teit's a business model. the commercial model is to make 40 to 50 percent of the profits come from people with a problem with it. the commercial gambling come -- >> if all of us game problem gamblers the industry would die in six months and a day. >> that is pretty unrealistic. >> mow more unrealistic as we increase the opportunities to gamble we all go to hell in a hand cart. the history of this country and other countries who have far more gambling and have been for centuries tells us are they problem gamblers? yes. there are tiny fractions and as

they expand -- >> england legalized internet poker problem gambling didn't go up. >> exactly. >> i haven't seen a study that was by -- >> what is it? >> the addiction is when people lose control of the gambling meaning it takes control of their life it takes money they use from college tuition. >> i gamble all of the time and i like it. >> you are in control. you stick to your limit you are not borrowing money to gamble. >> the addiction is a lay person's term. there is no scientific or medical definition. what we are talking about are bad habits some of which become tragically bad but we are not talking about medical illness that removes self control from the individual. >> the commercial gambling houses see wind other guys

promote casinos politicians casino interests none of these people gamble themselves. they don't lose their own money gambling. what's morrell leetist than t-- elitist than that. >> tax on the willing far more preferable than the voluntary tax. >> let's talk about your passion the casino. the shot machine is where the big money is. it is the worst bet for the biggest soccer stages hung up on it. they are freely choosing to do that. >> the idea is it's a game that is rigged against the player. the question here is -- >> the house -- part of the issue here is shlot machines ar illegal unless government is a part of it. you have government partnering with slot machine interests casinos who are exploiting citizens through you slot machines. >> government used to ban

gambling. >> if you did it for profit it is criminalized. if you have a friday night poker game no one is jumping off parking garages like they do in casinos on a daily bases. >> i have to pick up on that. jumping off parking lots? >> addicted gamblers are abandoning their children in casino parking lots. >> in one state alone there have been dozens of instances. >> how many abandoned? >> at least 20-years in the past two years in the state of pennsylvania alone. >> left for an hour? >> left for several hours in 10 degree weather. >> if the casinos are partnership with government are allowed to yell free play. >> were the kids hurt? >> the state took the kids away. image leaving your kids for

six-hours in 20 degree weather, of course they are hurted. >> remember even in the most tragic cases of pathological gambling, it is very, very hard. sometim sometimes i am the first one to admit. substance abuse of another kind. >> let's move on to another way to gamble. >> the track? most place in one. used to raise horses but sometimes they raise dogs. >> the only way you can bet on these races used to be to come to the track and place the bet here. some come all of the way here so they bet with book makers illegally.

>> they are criminals they steal the public's money and they have betting that replace book keys that promote the public welfare. >> let him go. >> now in many states people can make convenient belts in off track petting fore store fronts. >> off track betting is representative of how much contract betting has failed. state governments like new york keep them alive. >> stop on that a moment. the book keys were making so much money taking bets that the state said this is mafia crime we have to take it over to clean it up, government is so incompetent they are doing the same thing the book keys were doing. they lose money in new york city. >> it shows how much when government gets into the gambling business it shows how much it ends up being a failed policy.

>> they had 68 offices of 1300 work force, a fleet of 87 vehicles. >> government. >> p only government can lose money as a book key. >> to keep the conversation going on facebook or twitter hash tag march madness. tell us what you think. >> buying stuff, is that gambling? i say it is a form of gambling. i can beat the specialists by taking stock at random. is it possible that i by throwing darks could pick stocks better than the so-called experts? we will see. but next internet pokerly be able to gamble from bed? probably. yea. try alka seltzer fruit chews. they work fast on heart burn and taste awesome. these are good. told ya! i'm feeling better already. alka-seltzer fruit chews. enjoy the relief!

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>> u >> want to play poker? where should we play? casinos are usually far away. we have this thing called the internet. we should be able to gamble with any one any time. for a while we could. web sites like poker cards and poker offered gambling 24-hours a day. until it is now called black friday.

on a friday three years ago the department of justice charged the sites with money laundering because they used u.s. banks to process transactions. that stops americans wefrom playing. six months later after consumer complained the states asked for clarification about the law the justice department said maybe states may offer on-line gambling to gamblers in their state. now new jersey delaware and nevada allow it. more states probably will but they started a lobbying group the coalition to stop internet gaming. >> in the history of bad ideas this has to be one of the worst. internet gambling. this isn't going to a casino it is gambling on your computer mobile phone or ipad. they target the young and elderly making it look fun and

easy before they are in over their head. you can get taken for thousands brl setting a foot in casinos. it takes gambling too far. >> give me a break. casinos are so wholesome you want to set foot in them? we invited his people on the show they said no. mary bono represents a different casino group which says sure legalize it. but make sure it is regulated properly. what do you mean? >> if you ban this you allow the blocked web sites to continue to profit and to do well and build up momentum that gets stronger and stronger and stronger. that is the bad idea people ought to be talking about is the ban on gaming. >> that certainly sounds great to me. i am suspicious of your group. i get the feeling you are trying

to funnel this gaming activity to the casino. >> people can be suspicious on all sides that's fine. let's talk about the way i see this. it is p beyond gaming. i am not a gamble error a gamer. to me it is a matter of simple entertainment value if i go to a casino. i look back at what the internet did to music and television and film. they tried to stand in the way of the internet. if you think back about the recording association of america trying to stand in the way of music on the internet they were suing kids, it didn't work. all it did was build up momentum for the sites like napster and live wire and all of the sites these kids love. ever since then the legitimate businesses have been trying to make up for lost ground. >> you are saying let it rip? >> i am saying the congress should not ban gaming.

they are currently in gaming in different levels. they are scaring them to some degree trying to make sure it, would. i am saying don't stand in the way of the internet. i came here to the studio using uber and uber knows who i am. they know where to find me. i decide it's okay they do that. people tried to stand in the way of that technology. >> theish up is congress shouldn't be banning this. shouldn't be telling the saturdays not to do it. if you allow the blocked sites you need to build momentum and kill off good american businesses. >> this is what they say about your effort. >> if they get their way gambling will be available in every home every dorm room every phone tablet and computer every where. >> every where sounds scary. >> every where the consumer

might want it. >> kids might play. >> that's the whole point of it. this is to make sure we regulate it so kids won't play. using the uber example they knew who i am where i was. kids are not going to play. if we don't do it and do it right we will have more moan momentum for lax web sites there's no rules for any consumer of any type. >> when uber driveings somewhere they see you. the 15-year-old kid can be gambling. they want his money they don't care what it is. >> this wouere would be protectn place. i believe we can do it and do it right if we allow the states to regulate it. to allow the offshore sites to do it means zero rprotection in place for kids. >> thank you congressman.

>> you can already play on-line poker. some companies seem to have found a clever way around our dumb law. that's next. four-wheel steering is why i get up in the morning. ♪ [ jim ] when my grandson grows up, it's his. but it's all mine now. [ male announcer ] that's how we run, and nothing runs like a deere.

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>> want to play black jack? i will take another card. another. another. yipee. i won. >> i could play poker. rue let game. slot machine game. all of those games are playable because this site is not in america. it may be in ireland or panama. i don't know where it is. i don't much care. these sites are growing. there are more of them all of the time. how do they take bets from americans when other sites were stopped? here to explain that is naomi rockwell. these things somehow thrive because people play a bit coin?

>> the internet gambling is enforced is the government targets the intermediaries the financial institutions that process the payments for on-line gambling sites. what is amazing about bit coin it doesn't actually use any of these financial institutions. the gambler can communicate and make payments directly to the casino. there's little government can do to i can ma the transactions. they could try to shut down of the different sites and use diplomatic pressure but there's such incredible assets. 50 percent made within gambling sites. >> they depend on bit coin pay. >> bit coin is an incredible technology but it is debilitating these sites and making it sifr for those doing the gambling. >> i don't know what this place is i don't know if they will take the money and keep it.

>> there's an internal question with any business isn't it? there are many technologies the market responded with. it mathematically proves every dice is random every shuffling is completely random so people see the transparency. >> they show all of the results are some of the prior poker sites turned out to have been fixing it for their friends. >> exactly. >> you can't do that on these sites? >> no. before this fair technology existed it was difficult to see and prove the sites weren't biased against you and weren't cheating you. this is a new technology that is making things a lot more certain for gamblers. >> the payments are usually instantaneous with bit coin? >> you could go one step further they are ir reversible. one of the things they have is charge back graed. bit coin completely eliminates

the risk of this happening. >> this principle of using bit coin from our uptight american employees is what julian assange and wick wiki licks have done. >> think put pressure on them like pay pell, annex and visa. the people were actually able to continue. i think they raised $2.5 million for bit coin. not just the freedom of speech but for allowing people to spend their money where they want to so the government can no longer dictate what where where they can and cannot spend money. >> the chairman board asked about any kind of gaming with digital currencies he said

unless it's expressly allowed it can't happen. the laws doesn't condemn plate it. >> i was a little shocked reading that. the implications of that that basically he's decided it is illegal. when he was asked where does it say bit coin is illegal? it doesn't. we don't plan to write it into the law. but it is illegal which means the government can come up with anything they want and ban anything make anything illegal and they don't have to tell the people about it. >> it is illegal unless they officially approve it. >> i wassen der the apregs we could assume things are legal unless the government bounds it. things were completely flipped which is a little bit scary for the state of society. >> coming up the biggest gambling scam of allstate lottery.

>> from the minnesota state lottery. >> one way to gamble where the odds favor you. if you throw darts at stock symbols you will probably make money. i tried it. that's next. for over a decade

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john:. >> >> i wish our stock market was like every casino i go to. they have regulations. you get a fair hand. we do not have that in our software. >> cramer is wrong about this. >> there are very specific regulations and casinos. casinos offer terrible odds. the best games are one percent every hand you play. roulette costs you 6 percent are every spin of the wheel. slat machines cost you much

more. over time market averages tend to go up. that is vastly superior to casino betting. neighbor by that's where charles pain is making money. >> i hate to use the word play and the stock market in the same sentence. i make a lot of people in the stock market for 25 years. >> making money implies wrur picks beat the averages beat what i would do if i through darts. >> the dart throwing analogy doesn't work too well. you don't have any pressure. it's like the guys oh who predict there's going to be a stock market crash of course there will be. if you keep telling the public that and they miss a 10,000 point rally in the dow do you miss it. >> most people who don't what

charles does don't do well. they pick stocks and manage mutual funds that turnout to do worse than the average i put my money in index funds because they convince me most people out perform the average managed fund if they through darts and stock tables. i have done that from time to time. this time was three years ago. >> what did i get here? select trau energy nipon emerson electric. >> my darts landed on 30 companies. how old they do compared to the stocks recommended by manage mutual fund? >> three years later my stocks were up 34 percent. which sounds great. it was no better than the new york stock exchange average. the managed mutual funds did worse. you have to pay a fee. that's why i call what you do, maybe you have been really smart and successful but it's

gambling. it is gambling in the sense that walking across the street is gam nling. many buy one stock and that's not really an investment. they pick one thing. people have a tendency to own that stock. if you go up 30 percent they won't take profit but if it is down they take a loss and wipe their hands and say that thing didn't work out. you can make it into gambling. i have seen a lot of women wearing michael kors watches. i bet every woman watches the show either wears them or knows about it. where did you get it from? did you buy the stock? no. at the same time it was obvious they were taking market shares from coach. they are up 100 percent coorpse

kors is up 1 percent. >> i think nothing is a no brainer. i am glad that worked out. you dispute the data that shows the index funds do better than the managed funds? >> the biggest problem with funds -- are you a football fan? >> yeah. >> you ever watch a foot gall became one team goes out they are throwing the ball down the field like crazy they are going into the fourth quarter 28-3. what do they do? >> they sit on it. >> we are rining down the clock. the next thing you know the other team tied up the game. >> what does this have to do with index funds? when mutual fund managers there's a difference between playing to win and playing not to lose. a lot of mutual funds will have the semi conductor stock in the

fund and the worse. you throwing the darts worked out more in your favor more than likely you weren't going to go for the best and worse in the name of balance. i am not a big mutual fund fan. i am not going to defend them. although if someone is intimidated the market that's the only way you can get in it i will recommend it. >> over an index fund? >> not over an index fund. why pay extra money for average returns. >> managed funds often charge a 1 percent fee index fund a fraction. >> typically cheaper. >> it is gambling but market averages over the years have come up. >> a scandal over pinball machines and why government crashed them. >> why we should trash politicians for selling poor people garbage like this. >> get a second win to win the

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>> jim loves trains but sometimes he thinks they are too >> he thinks trains are just too small. that changed when he won the

lottery. >> yipee for jim. his luck is the reason most americans buy lottery tickets. most of you. and you are suckers. the betting odds are terrible and the hypocrisy behind lottery is terrible. the same politicians who ban internet poker or sports bets because they are evil, dangerous, turn around and run their own gambling operation. apparently lotteries are okay because government gets some of the money. don't politicians see what hypocrites they are? ben sees the hypocrisy. he wrote about it in the federalist conservative>>ings the hypocrisy is obvious whether it's playing poker in your home or betting or no sorts or march hadness with your office pool the governmentment cracks down.

>> they rarely crack down on march hadness. >> they don't actually come in and call you an illegal book making operation if you are doing that. not yet at least. but then within the space of lotteries the government profits from all of these horrible deals where desperate and boor people -- poor people go with the lottery. >> you are playing games with odds that are incredible. 1 in 175 million. >> you win so much. >> that's the way the government sells you on it. it is a bad deal. if it was a casino where you had a 1 in 175 million chance of winning, you wouldn't typically go to that casino. you wouldn't play that game. you have a 1 out of 21 chance of getting 21, getting black jack. that's not that great of a deal. lots of people lose money in black jack but they don't think of it as a rip off.

>> it is also a tax on poor people. >> it functions as a progressive tax on the boopoor. it's a way to go into their pockets and pay the cash out. >> a lot of people don't pay the income tax. >> most lottery tickets are bought by poor people not rich people. >> that's why you see all of these communities taking a desperate path to try to make it big to make up for their current economic flight. that's one of the reasons why lotteries have been doing great even if the time of economic downturn because it is incentivizing people to play more. >> we are told if you play the lottery our children are the big winners. >> every time you play the new york lottery game a portion of the sales goes to new york states children just like that. new york lottery everybody wins. >> if they are ripping off the bo poo it goes to cool children.

>> it can mean buying light bulbs and things of that nature. if can go to anything. >> the way they be avenue they can use that money to offset certain expenditures in other areas. one of the things we have seen it is getting people to spend more money on them for cronies and special doctors. >> even if they kept their promise it is only a small part of the dollar you spend. right? >> exactly. >> half goes to the winner $0.40 goes to the italian con grglomee in one state. maybe 11 scent to tcents to the government. >> for some states they don't

make that much money off the lottery. west virginia makes more money off the lottery. for all sorts of states they don't have to do this. they can find the money by cutting other programs or needless wasteful spending in other areas. >> what galls me most is they sneer at the real jobs. they show a woman who wins and tells her boss. >> what? >> >> back to work. >> working. working. >> yeah, that kind of rich. >> so work is for losers. >> this is like obamacare freeing you from job loss. you can free your dreams because the government is going to come in and give you a bunch of money to do so. the ridiculous money is it's a good example of why the lottery

is such a bad idea. they are incentivizing you to make bad decisions giving you different works how to gain out of that success. lottery winners don't feel as happy quickly after they won. >> ohwowe>> a lot of them blow through the money. it's a policy where the government shuvent prevent you from making bad decisions but it shouldn't invent vise you from making bad decisions and profit from twryour bad decision. that's what you see with all of these lotteries. >> thank you ben. >> when we return some good news. some of today's politicians are more sensible than their

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at least for your dishes. cascade. beyond clean and shine every time. cascade. millions have raised their hand for the proven relief of the purple pill. and that relief could be in your hand. for many, nexium helps relieve heartburn symptoms from acid reflux disease. find out how you can save at purplepill.com. there is risk of bone fracture and low magnesium levels. side effects may include headache, abdominal pain, and diarrhea if you have persistent diarrhea, contact your doctor right away. other serious stomach conditions may exi. avoid if you te clopidogrel. for many, relief is at hand. ask your doctor abouxium. >> when the who wrote that song about a pinball wizard for much of america pinball itself auz illegal. they treated pin paul the way

they treat poker now. in nashville it was illegal for a teen to stand within 10 feet of the pinball machine. it was dangerous because trying to win a free game, that's gambling. new york's mayor said this robs youth of nickels and dimes. his police force ceased thousands of machines. politicians pose with pictures smashing them with sledgehammers and axes. it was a moral imperative protect america from pinball. despite all of that pinball didn't disappear. it just moved under ground this happens now with gambling. laws against betting create a black market. gambling is subject to law and responsible social convention. puts criminals in charge and makes gambling less safe. authoritarian says gambling bankrupts people and wrecks

families. that does happen sometimes. but outlawing it doesn't stop it. makes it worse by making it secret. the good news is thanks to the internet authoritarians are losing control gamblers have options outside of america. they notice all of the bets going overseas and now three states legalize enter net gam e gambling and others are considering it. they realize for the wrong reason. they talk about millions in tax revenue. that's not a game for the people. we are better off when they are in private hands. i wish they would legalize for the right reason p. here it is. some of us like to bet. if we are adults there's nothing in the constitution that gives them the right to tell us we cannot. i be able to do anything i want with other consenting adults, anything that's peaceful.

that's our show for tonight. see you next week. ♪ {off-lin {off-line} hroughout the evening i am harris faulkner. now huckabee. does the president's numbers really add up? no amount of money will bring my daughter back. >> dpshgs m. >> i believe this is criminal. the sister of one victim tells her story. plus, are wall street traders rigging the system? ♪