♪ ♪ [applause] jon: and good morning to you. a fox news alert on the va scandal. amid growing calls for secretary shinseki to step down from his post, he is facing senate lawmakers right now. hello, i'm jon scott. heather: and i'm heather childers, in for jen fromna lee. shinseki is vowing to do better on patient care saying that any adverse event is one too many. this after shocking claims of neglect surface in va hospitals all across the country with charges including secret waiting lists and falsified records

linked to dozens of veterans' deaths. lawmakers now trying to get to the bottom of exactly what happened. >> i am very frustrated to be here once again talking about some deeply disturbing issues and allegations. it's extremely disappointing that the department has repeatedly failed to address wait times for health care. >> what happened in phoenix? well, the truth is we don't know, but we are going to find out. heather: well, chief congressional corps responsibility mike emanuel in live for us on capitol hill. mike, what is secretary shinseki telling lawmakers so far about this va mess? >> reporter: well, heather, good morning. questioning is just now getting underway, and shinseki is telling lawmakers that as a veteran himself, he is mad as hell at what has been uncovered about what's been going on at the va. he says the veterans administration can and must do better. he expressed some sadness for

the preventable deaths and the unnecessary delays of treatment many veterans have gotten, and he says the veterans administration under his leadership will do better with. we will see if law lawmakers are satisfied by what they hear there him. again, questioning just now getting underway, heather. heather: so very senators said so far this morning about this scandal that just seems to continue to grow? >> reporter: well, they say they are tired of all the reviews of what's gone on at the va. they say it is time for actual action to take place. they say there are deep, system-wide problems. they're talking about leadership failures, and here's a sample of some of the bipartisan outrage. >> it seems that every day that there are new allegations regarding inappropriate scheduling practices ranging from zeroing out patient wait times to scheduling patients in clinics that don't even exist and even to booking multiple patients for a single appointment. >> it is unfortunate that these

leadership failures have dramatically shaken many veterans' confidence in this system. secretary shinseki, i continue to believe that you take this seriously and want to do the right thing, but we've come to the point where we need more than good intentions. what we need now is decisive action to restore veterans' confidence in the va. >> reporter: and shinseki says he is committed to taking all actions necessary, but already lawmakers are expressing a great deal of frustration about this growing scandal. heather? heather: not just lawmakers, people all across the country. mike emanuel joining us live, thank you. jon: want to give you some background now on the va scandal and what's happened. claims of neglect first surfaced about three weeks ago when a doctor at the va hospital in phoenix came forward to discuss a so-called secret waiting list of patients. a little more than a week later a second whistleblower came forward and said hospital executives ignored warnings

about those lists. two days after that "usa today" reported that another va hospital in fort collins, colorado, was falsifying its treatment records. and by the next week, the scandal grew to include facilities in ten states. well, right now nigeria's president reacting to or rejecting, i should say, boko haram's offer to exchange nearly 30 kidnapped -- 300 kidnapped schoolgirls for imprisoned militants. but the president says he is still open to negotiations with the group as american lawmakers emphasize the urgency of finding these young women. >> every day these girls are missing, it becomes less likely they will return home safely. it took too long to respond to these girls' abduction. jon: amy kellogg is live there london with the very latest on the search. >> reporter: hi, jon. there's a lot of talk now about possibly extending the state of emergency that exists in borno

province where the girls were taken from, but it's been in place, jon, for many months and, clearly, it is simply not preventing the kinds of atrocities from going on. on the one hand, nigerian soldiers are said to be demoralized. they haven't been adequately equipped, and they haven't deny adequately reinforced. they, in fact, have fallen prey to corruption and some have been complicit with militants. just today the mastermind, the suspected mastermind in a bombing in knew nigeria's capitl april 14th, he was arrested in sudan. as you mentioned, jon, the president of nigeria has rejected -- after first indicating an openness to negotiate for release of the girls, possibly in exchange for some of their prisoners -- now, again, he is saying he won't do that. but he says he does want to keep dialogue going. however, it is increasingly clear to all that the leader of the group is unstable, to say

the least, and so the prospect of having any sort of productive dialogue is daunting. and this as nigerians keep the story alive with vigils for the hundreds of missing girls, over a hundred still, as the stories of those who manage to escape trickle out, highlighting the sheer terror of their ordeal. the governor of borno happens to be in london today for a few meetings, but he is heading back to nigeria later today. >> i feel compelled to come to you to show our appreciation to the people of great britain, to show our appreciation to the world for the empathy, concern and support they have exhibited in our hour of need. >> reporter: now, the governor of borno, jon, himself is a muslim, and he has said that muslim respects its young girls, values them and says it's a travesty that boko haram even calls itself an islamic movement. but lots of imams have spoken out against boko haram, and even they have been attacked, some of them killed. that is how unbelievably violent

the group is, jon. jon: yeah. just an awful situation. i hope they find those girls very soon. amy kellogg in london, thank you. heather: meantime, back at home fire crews in los angeles furiously working to clean up a massive oil spill. thousands of gallons of crude oil spraying into the streets there after a high pressure pipe burst. patti ann brown is live in our new york newsroom with more on that story. hi, patti ann. >> hello, heather. well, the oil was up to people's knees in some areas. this after a 20-inch oil pipe ruptured in a suburb of los angeles. a geyser spewed at least 20 feet into the air, and about 10,000 gallons of crude oil spilled onto the streets of glendale. the spill covered about half a mile, and witnesses say it looked like a lake in some spots. it happened shortly after midnight. the oil line was shut off remotely, and firefighters and hazardous materials crews were called. the l.a. times reports two

people were transferred to a hospital complaining of nausea, and several commercial businesses were affected in atwater village. cleanup is expected to take a day. a cement company provided firefighters with sand, tanker trucks then began to vacuum it up. that is done now, but workers are still trying to sop up the oil that the tankers couldn't get. the fire department, meanwhile, says there is no visible evidence that oil has entered the storm drains which empty into the los angeles river, but they do say it's possible that oil has seeped under manhole covers. more on this ahead. >> which would not be visible yet. path ty ann, thank you so much. jon: we are keeping an eye on those hearings in washington. the secretary of the veterans administration, eric shinseki, facing the senate for some tough questions about problems in his agency that have recently come to light. a lot of pressure on him to step down. we will certainly keep an eye on

those hearings and bring you the highlights. plus, new e-mails who they say ordered the targeting of tea party and conservative groups at the irs in the first place. we are live with more on that story. plus, jeb bush now reportedly considering a run for the white house. does he have the support he would need from the republican base? we'll go in depth. >> i just don't want to go through that until the right time. and it turns out that not running has generated more interest than if i said i was running. [laughter] weird. at some point pretty, you know, maybe a year from now -- [laughter] >> i'm marking it down. >> end of the year, i'll make a decision.

heather: welcome back. right now some new information on some of the stories that we're following for you. a judge hearing arguments on whether to suppress concessions made by a friend of boston bombing suspect dzhokhar

tsarnaev as a friend admitted removing evidence from the suspect's dorm room, but his lawyer says the statements came after police intimidation. well, protests today in the more than 30 cities as workers demand higher pay at chains including mcdonald's. the demonstrations building on union campaigns to create awareness and push for $15-an-hour wages. and radio legend caste city kasem has been found in washington state days after leaving a nursing home in california. his exact location still unknown as police say that he is, quote, somewhere in the pacific northwest. family members say that they are relieved but still concerned about his health. jon: well, his father was president of the united states as was his brother, and while jeb bush may be mulling a run in 2016, he might not get the republican support he needs because, as our next guest says, quote: contrary to a lot of psychological analysis,

republicans don't go for the guy whose turn it is because they are hard wired to be hierarchical and orderly. they do it because the guy who came in second last the next four years wooing the conservative base. the author of those words is jonah goldberg with the national review online and a fox news contributor. he diswhroins us now -- joins us now. that article was titled "why jeb bush's turn may not come." you think he is not going to be the next bush and perhaps the final bush in the white house? >> well, we never know about the final bush. there is a whole other generation of bushes to come. and i'm not an anti-bush guy in that sense, but there is something fundamentally weird, almost game of thrones-y about having for a quarter of a century every republican president come from one nuclear family. and i think there are a lot of people who rebel against that just for the dynasty reasons. but i think the real reason why

as the quote from my column suggests, the real reason why jeb would have real trouble is that historically the republican party tends to nominate more centrist, moderate republicans. really only reagan and goldwater were true blue conservatives. and the reason for that is that the moderate sort of establishment republicans who come in second in any given presidential year in the primaries, they tend to go around trying to win over enough of the conservative base to get a winning coalition. and we see that's what mitt romney did, that's what john mccain did, that's what george h.w. bush, that's even to a certain extent what george w. bush did. and the problem with jed is he seems -- jeb, he seems uninterested in trying to win over a base of support particularly from the tea party base. jon: it's also been some time since he was governor of florida. he was a successful governor, two terms in office there.

but is that, you know, going too far back in history for voters to be able to say, okay, well, what are your credentials or what would you do now in this, you know, twitter era? >> yeah. you know, i think he's actually perfectly qualified to be president of the united states in terms of his resumé and his capabilities. he's -- i disagree with him on some policy issues, but he is a policy wonk. he knows his stuff really, really well. he's a very smart, impressive guy. but the issue you raise is still a good one because politically you get the sense that he's a little tone deaf. he has not been mixing it up, duking it out on the hustings and thinking about politics the way a marco rubio, rand paul, paul ryan or any of those kinds of people have. you can tell when he said the ore week about how immigration, you know, illegal immigration is an act of love, now, i kind of get that, and i have sympathy with the point, but that is a crazy thing to say if you're trying to win over the base of

the republican party. so is giving hillary clinton an award. jon: yeah. you say in your article the base feels un-wooed by jeb bush. >> yeah. so far i was trying to think of a single example where he is trying to win over some large, significant segment of the conservative base, and he just hasn't been interested in doing that, and that's the only way his dad or any, basically, any other leading republican since at least ronald reagan has won the nomination. reagan won it because he had locked down the base, and then he had to spend all his time trying to reassure moderates he wasn't the crazy. everyone else has had moderates on their side and had to go around reassuring conservatives he was conservative enough. jeb doesn't seem interested in playing that game at all, so i don't see how he could possibly win iowa or new hampshire. jon: but elections are won with independents, are they not? is it possible his appeal as a sort of middle of the road republican or moderate

republican could bring enough independents onboard that he might, you know, win an election anyway? >> oh, he certainly -- jon: [inaudible] >> yeah. i'm talking about winning a nomination. winning an election is a different issue. you know, he speaks fluent spanish, his wife is mexican-american, he comes from a very diverse state, he was a very impressive governor. i think he would be a very competitive general election guy. not necessarily my first choice, but i think he would be very competitive. he first has to get through iowa, south carolina and new hampshire, and the way he's doing it right now doesn't show to me that he has a whole lot of fire in the belly to try and do that. and you can't get the nomination unless you do pretty well in at least two out of three of those. jon: of course, we are talking about a guy who hasn't announced that he is a candidate or would be interested in being a candidate, says he has to make a family decision about that first. >> that's right. jon: interesting to speculate anyway. >> it's always fun to speculate. don't cost nothing. jon: jonah goldberg, thank you. >> thank you.

heather: well, still to come here on fox news stay with us, because we are going to take you live to capitol hill. but we're also going to speak to senator john barrasso. he is here. he's going to talk about why states that wasted millions on failed obamacare exchanges should pay back uncle sam. and as i was mentioning there, that's a live shot of capitol hill where they're discussing treatment delays for veteran deaths, accusations at veterans hospitals all across the country. ten states at last count. it's getting heated. we'll take you there live next. of complete darkness. i am totally blind. i've been blind since birth. i lost my sight to eye disease.

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could mean less waiting for things like security backups and file downloads you'd take that test, right? well, what are you waiting for? you could literally be done with the test by now. now you could have done it twice. this is awkward. check your speed. see how fast your internet can be. switch now and add voice and tv for $34.90. comcast business built for business. jon: so it is a very interesting and perhaps heated moment right now on capitol hill. veterans secretary eric shinseki is there in front of a senate

committee taking some heat over the allegations that veterans have been delayed, made to wait for care in some cases, one allegation is that in phoenix perhaps as many as 40 veterans died while waiting for care from the veterans administration medical system. at any rate, we are continuing to monitor the testimony. there is va secretary shinseki. we are continuing to monitor the testimony. if there are interesting nuggets to wring you, we will bring them to you here on "happening now." heather: well, payback time for faulty state obamacare exchanges, at least according to a bill filed by republican lawmakers requiring states that experienced serious technical problems in running their obamacare exchanges to repay the federal government over a ten-year period. now, the senator who introduced the state exchange accountability act, that's what it's called, he joins us now,

senator john barrasso, chairman of the senate republican policy committee. thank you for joining us. >> thanks for having me. heather: so i was listening to some of the interviews that you done, i've read some of the comments that you've made, and you're saying taxpayers shouldn't have to pay twice for the mistakes made by this administration when it comes to obama care. talk a little bit more about that. >> well, people know what they want, they want accountability for their hard-earned, taxpayer dollars. they send money to washington, washington wastes it, and they say that's not fair. so this health care law that set up state exchanges, about half of those states have failed miserably, but they've wasted a lot of taxpayer dollars in the process. and when you have incompetence and mismanagement, i just think that the taxpayers from around the country ought to get their money back there those states that allowed those sorts of problems to occur.

people want accountability, not excuses. heather: and some of the states that you've mentioned specifically, massachusetts, nevada, maryland, oregon, you know, these states spent massive amounts of money on these exchanges that then turned around and didn't work. >> and you're talking hundreds of millions of dollars, and now those states are throwing up their hands and say, oh, we're just going to go into the federal exchange and say, hey, just forget about the fact that we wasted all of this money. and i say that's not good enough. the american taxpayers deserve accountability. yesterday at the hearings for the new secretary of health and human services she said this should be, the money should be recovered to the full extempt of the law. but -- extent of the law. but, heather, the law doesn't allow the kind of recovery that i think taxpayers deserve when it comes to accountability. and the bill that i've introduced with senator hatch calls for a return of all of that money. and i'm going to meet with the nominee to be secretary of health and human services later

today to discuss that specific point, to headache sure taxpayers -- to make sure taxpayers get their money back. heather: so specifically, how would those states then be able to return that money? would the cost of that then come back on the residents of those states? >> well, if the states have mismanaged through failure of oversight seen money wasted, taxpayer dollars wasted, the states would over a ten-year period have to pay back about a tenth of what they've collected. each of those next ten years so they don't have to pay it back immediately, but absolutely. you have to hold elected officials and those in those states that allowed this, you have to hold them accountable. heather: and it seems to make sense that if it's not working, then the taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for it. they certainly shouldn't have to pay for it twice when they're also paying more for the care itself when it comes to obamacare. >> well, you're absolutely

right. this is one of the expensive and harmful side effects of the health care law. but this is just part of the picture. you know, the president has told democrats to forcefully defend and be proud of this health care law. but we know that people are paying higher premiums, higher deductibles, higher co-pays, many can't keep their doctor even though they like their doctor, many are finding out that they've lost their insurance coverage even though it's something that worked for them. so there have been so many harmful side effects as a result of this law. this is just one piece where we want accountability, demand accountability for taxpayer dollars, and that's why senator hatch and i introduced this legislation called the state exchange accountability act. heather: and i know you mentioned it would be paid back over ten years, but what type of action are you calling for in terms of the bill itself, and are you calling for any sort of votes before the midterm elections?

>> well, i'd like to get a vote on this proposal immediately, and that's why i'm meeting with the nominee to be the secretary of health and human services today to talk about how we can go after this money, this wasted money. she has said we should go and use the full extent of the law to have it paid back. i want to make sure all of the money gets paid back. that's the only way that taxpayers really get the kind of accountability that i believe they deserve, not just empty excuses. heather: and that will be interesting to see if people take a stand one way or the other before the midterm elections on this. thank you so much for joining us, we appreciate it. >> thanks for having me. jon: well, general motors is adding even more calls to its -- cars to its recall list now. what the growing problem at gm means for you and the auto giant. plus, new revelations in the irs targeting scandal. are we coming closer to finding out who ordered the agency to focus its attention on conservative and tea party

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jon: a fox news alert now on our top story. the senate hearing focused on the scandal at the veterans administration with secretary eric shinseki getting grilled by lawmakers as outrage grows over neglect claims at veterans hospitals across country. secretary shinseki welcome as white house review and vows to

hold employees accountable for any misconduct as lawmakers call for action to restore veterans confidence. >> this needs to be a wake-up call for the department. the lack of transparency and lack of accountability is inexcusable and can not continue on of the practices of indimtation and -- intimidation and cover-ups has to change starting today. >> no one should be treated this way in a country great as ours. treating those we owe socallously and ungratefully is unconscionable and we all should be ashamed. >> any allegation, any adverse incident like this makes me as, makes me mad as hell. i could use stronger language, mr. chairman but in deference to the committee i won't but at the same time it also saddens me because i understand that out of those adverse events a veteran and a veteran's family is

dealing in the aftermath and i always try to put myself in their shoes. jon: the american legion and some congressional republicans have called for secretary shinseki's resignation. we're monitoring the hearing have much more later in the hour. you can watch the entire hearing if you like to streaming live on foxnews.com. heather: right now judicial watch releasing new bombshell irs emails revailing that the tax agency targeted tea party groups from its headquarters in washington, d.c. and that is triggering new action on capitol hill today. with more our chief washington correspondent james rosen. hi, james. >> reporter: heather, good morning. these latest revelations in the irs scandal and latest revelations in the benghazi scandal come to us courtesy of the advocacy group judicial watch which obtained emails and

other documents through the freedom of information act. this includes one written in april 2013, by lois lerner, the former irs official who headed the tax agency unit in charge of screening applications for tax-exempt status and whose failure to testify fully about her role to testify in the scandal found her being in contempt of congress last week. in the newly uncovered email lerner wrote to eternal irs investigators about the criteria for bolo program which stood for be on the lookout and apply particular scrutiny to applications filed by tea party groups. the lerner email said the criteria use any groups using tea party, patriot or nine 12 project. government spending, government debt and taxes. those groups that quote, educate the public through advocacy, legislative activities, to make america a better place to live. or those that applications where the case file included, quote, statements that are critical of how the country is being run,

unquote. the obama white house has maintained that liberal groups received improper scrutiny for their tax-exempt applications that whatever improprieties occurred with respect to these organizations were committed chiefly in the irs cincinnati office and had no direction from headquarters in washington but other documents obtained by judicial watch show correspondence with officials exempt organization as technical unit, eot, based here in the capitol stated in july 2010, i quote, eot is working tea party applications in coordination with cincy. another quote, we are developing a few applications here in d.c. and providing copies of our development letters with the agent to use in development of their cases. one reference to chip hull, lawyer in irs headquarters, working cases in eot and working with the agent in cincy. republican senator ted cruz of texas has this morning renewed his call for a special prosecutor in the irs case. you can bet this come up, might

not happen with the white house today. there is a press gaggle happening aboard air force one this week. might not be asked then but you will get reaction from the administration with the latest revelations. heather: we'll depend on you for that. james rosen joining us live. >> reporter: thank you. jon: general motors announcing five more recalls bringing its total number for the year to 18. the latest recall includes 140,000 chevy malibus with possible brake problems. the automaker will take a charge of $200 million in the second quarter to cover the cost of recall-related repairs. with more on this fox business network's lauren sim sim. >> gm taking 200 million-dollar charge to cover repair costs. this involves just about three million cars in the u.s. and you may be driving one. here they are. 2 1/2 million older cars like pontiac g6s and saturn auras.

brake lamp problems for 100,000 older corvettes. low beam head lamp issues. 140,000 new malibus for programs with the brakes. nearly 20,000 cadillac ctss for windshield wiper failures and trucks for tie rod defects. that is a lost vehicles. bringing total number of gm cars recalled worldwide this year to more than 11 million. many are due to the deadly ignition switches, right? this increased emphasis on quality control can be credited to one person, jeff boyer, the new head of safety at gm. he is trying to expedite current reviews and identify potential new problems to show that the new gm is concerned about safety around making that a number one priority, jon and heather. jon: but it is going to cost the company a bunch of money sounds like. >> 200 mil and going up. jon: lauren simonetti. , great to see you. heather: "fox news polls" that

show how americans are feeling about the economy right now. registered voters split down the middle, with 49% of registered voters saying we're still in recession while 48% are saying an economic recovery is underway. for president obama, some 46% of voters approve of the job that he is doing while 50% disapprove. that is a big jump from his lower rating in march. and then we asked voters if they're satisfied with how things are going in the country today. those numbers improving from march of this year and october of last year. now 43% of voters saying that they are satisfied, while 57% say they are not. >> more of those polls later on. russian president putin is putting the squeeze on ukraine as we get new information on how americans view the crisis in eastern europe. should president obama get more involved? also violent protests breaking out after a mining disaster leaves hundreds dead. we'll take to you where this is

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jon: 17 minutes from now "outnumbered" at the top of the hour. kimberly and harris what do you have? >> hey there. she is at the center of the benghazi talking points controversy. now susan rice is speaking out on the first time of the house new investigation into the attack. >> plus irs officials testified that rogue agents in ohio targeted conservative groups but now newly-released emails show the orders came straight from the top, dc. serving up a sexism controversy, putting logos on a specific area of women's bodies. some calling that move a big bust. >> all that plus our #oneluckyguy, "outnumbered" the at the top of the hour. jon: can you tell us who he is? >> if we did we could have a put duck you tape on you and put you

in the closet. jon: i'm up for anything. >> i heard that about you. jon: kimberly, heather, thanks. >> or harris. jon: harris i'm sorry. heather: wow. right now we have switching gears for just a moment. roughly 300 people killed in the worst mining disaster ever to hit turkey, the tragedy sparking protests over poor safety conditions at mines across the country. police are using water cannons, tear gas, all of that to try and break up these crowds. the unrest threatens to derail the presidential aspirations of the prime minister, who has referred to mining accidents as quote, ordinary things, if you can believe that. meanwhile families are burying their loved ones as more bodies are recovered from the disaster site. more than 100 people still unaccounted for after an explosion and a fire at the mine. officials say carbon monoxide poisoning caused most of those deaths. jon? >> turning to the crisis in

ukraine, russian president vladmir putin now demanding cash payment to deliver gas to ukraine. the kremlin releasing a letter saying a recent meeting to resolve the nation's rising debt failed to settle the issue. meanwhile the ukrainian military reporting some success in the bloody standoff in the east. the ukrainian army destroying two military bases of pro-russian insurgents in overnight operations. greg palkot is streaming live from donetsk, ukraine. greg? >> reporter: jon, there were more clashes today between ukrainian forces an pro-russia separatists as kiev tries to regain control of this region from the rebel militants. we traveled today to a somewhat unusual town in eastern ukraine. one that actually flies the flag of ukraine. many others fly the banner of the rebels. officials there support kiev and a united country, not without dangers though.

there are pro-russia separatist it is all around the town. this police station, for example was attacked. that is why the folks here have started their own pro-ukraine militia. they say they're ready for anything. just last night a car of one of the members militia was firebombed by pro-russia rebels. they go on patrol by foot and car and by night they're armed for trouble. we spoke to residents of the town. some back the pro-kiev stand of officials. others want a break from the government. the town plans to go ahead with presidential elections, planned for may 25th. they tell us they expect problems. jon? jon: what a mess. greg palkot in donetsk, thank you. heather: as the senate holds hearings on the va hospital scandal we want to hear from you. what question do you think secretary shinseki should be

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that corporate trial by fire when every slacker gets his due. and yet, there's someone around the office who hasn't had a performance review in a while.

someone whose poor performance is slowing down the entire organization. i'm looking at you phone company dsl. check your speed. see how fast your internet can be. switch now and add voice and tv for $34.90. comcast business built for business. jon: now this fox news alert. former new england patriot sar aaron hernandez facing two additional murder charges in massachusetts. suffolk county, attorney general laid them out mom listen. >> a short time ago a suffolk county grand jury returned indictments charging aaron hernandez with two counts of first-degree murder for the shooting death of daniel debreu and mr. furtado. they were ambushed and executed as they drove home along sharp

mon avenue in boston's south end in the early morning hours of july 16th, 2012. jon: hernandez, former tight end for the new england patriots is already awaiting trial on murder charges this after he and two accomplices allegedly shot a man to death near his home. he was cut from the patriots roster shortly after. hernandez is pleading not guilty to that charge. two new murder charges filed just today against aaron hernandez. >> if any of these allegations are true with regard to scheduling at phoenix and elsewhere we invited ig to come and look at issues that were, that surfaced, if any allegations are true, there are completely unacceptable, to me, to veterans, and i will tell you the vast majority of dedicated vha employees who come to work every day to do their best by

those veterans. if any are substantiated by the inspector general, we will act. heather: just in, and things on capitol hill getting fired up as va secretary eric shinseki testifies before senate lawmakers speaking at length for the first time about the shocking claims of neglect at va hospitals all across the country and shinseki is quote, mad as hell and he vows to hold employees accountable. today's hearing coming just as the white house ordered its own review on patient safety. joining us now, jesse jane duff. retired marine gunnery sergeant. she is with concerned veterans for america. thank you so much for joining us. >> thank you so much for having me. >> just heard what the secretary had to say there. is that a good enough answer for veterans across this country and their families? >> absolutely not. i watched the entire hearing. i was was disgusted his lack of

passion, his shame. there was none. he was different. he was aloof. i will get to the bottom of and i will take action. we got the evidence and he did not even say he would take criminal action. he sat back with scathing evidence, presented to him, he said, well i don't want to get ahead of myself or the ig before i take action. what are you waiting on? clean out your management. send the signal that this will not be tolerated. heather: well he is calling for an internal review with 250 employees, over a period of the next two weeks, but it has been about a month, i believe, three weeks since we first discovered allegations from the phoenix va hospital for more than 40 veterans died. since then it spread to total of 10 dates. are you saying action needs to be taken before another two weeks go by. >> i say too little too late. my organization alone presented scandal after scandal over the

past year. now that you're caught where is your integrity? integrity is doing what is right before people have to observe and question you. you chef been doing what was right all along. there should have been investigations a long time ago. all that they are doing is allowed a culture of corruption, to fester within the va which basically said, gaming the system is a way of doing business as usual. i find that offensive. there was no passion within this secretary on all of the deaths that were presented to him and the investigations that were presented to him and emails that were presented to him. the long, chronicled history. he had no, no response that gave me the impression that it was a affecting him personally as it should. these are veterans. heather: exactly, that is what i was going to say. why, your perception, this lack of passion his part, he is a veteran him seven, a wounded veteran with prosthetic foot. >> exactly. all the veterans dieing from

lack of care. it came out the gao discovered 1.5 million appointment records that were deleted. va own policy doesn't allow to you delete records for over 150 years. you're going to sit there, now you will send in an investigation? i give, i give senator blumenthal great credit. he presented fact affect to the secretary and the secretary dodged each one. he flat-out asked him are you going to remove your management? he said i don't want to get ahead of myself or the ig. i want to rate e wait for the results. wait for the results? we've given you the evidence. heather: i want to know from you if you had the opportunity, and we asked our viewers this just a moment ago, if you had an opportunity to ask secretary shinseki a question, yourself what would you want to know from him right now? >> how did you allow it to go this far down the road five years later? now you're starting to act like it's a significant issue? why weren't you on top of that five years ago with the first scandal that was revealed? why would you assume it was only

one location. where there is smoke, there is fire. from what i heard from the doctor testified next to him, they were very well aware of executives gaming the system over periods of time at different locations. why aren't you sending a signal early on if we catch it, we will fire you, we will remove you, we will take criminal action against you. that is what a general does, hold your people accountable. heather: this really shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone that followed concerns of veterans over many, many years. we know that they have not gotten the care they tree serve when they have given up so much for our country. thank you very much. >> thank you so much for inviting me, heather. heather: appreciate it as always. jon? jon: heather as you and jesse was speaking, we got word that eric shinseki's testimony ended in front of that senate pa panel on capitol hill. they're taking a break in the hearings. thrill will be more testimony this afternoon but, the secretary is done testifying for now. will it mollify the senators and other critics of his leadership

at the va? we do not yet know. we'll take to you capitol hill for more coverage straight ahead. avo: wherever your journey takes you

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heather: we will see you back right here in an hour. jon: "outnumbered" starts right now. >> here's where it gets fun because this is "outnumbered" and i'm kimberly gill foil. here today is harris faulkner, sandra smith, ted day, #oneluckyguy, tucker carlson. >> hey. >> are you ready for some action? >> i'm totally ready. i meditated for over two hours to center my spirit. >> i saw you doing yoga and he is is ready to go on the hot seat. veterans after chair chief eric shinseki finishing testimony on the hill under oath for the first time since the scandal now engulfing the va.