stay tuned to fox news channel and this fox station for continuing coverage of this story. i'm jon scott in new york. >> we begin with a fox news alert. i'm harris faulkner. a malaysian passenger jetliner with 295 people on board has crashed in ukraine near the russian border. we continue our coverage of this now on fox news channel. that is according to the news agency interfax, citing an aviation industry source. it says the bowing plane was flying from amsterdam to equally lump pure. this brings -- kuala lumpur. this brings up memories of a missing plane back in march. we focus on flight 17 which has crashed. there are a lot of things being said what could have brought the plane down.

we're gettin gather informationt they are saying. they believe this plane was brought down, shot down by some sort of a missile. two things know about where this plane was. obviously near the russian border. that is a hot zone during the war that is going on right now where the conflict between those two countries. it is difficult to know if that played a role at this point, but of course that is what people are looking for. 34,000 feet. if you want to think about it this way, a surface-to-air missle probably cannot take out a plan that far away. so what might have been, that is what they are looking at. we're going to go around the horn, let's start with geraldo

rivera. >> the fact it is a malaysian airliner, the same as the infamously missing passenger jet in the indian ocean is a distraction. as a war correspondent weighing all the facts as they have come in, mid-to be this is my opini opinion. i believe vladimir putin as the blood of these airline passengers on his hands. the russian leader has been supplying increasingly sophisticated weaponry to the pro-russian anti-ukraine activist in eastern ukraine, there are reports sophisticated surface to air missiles have been spotted in that region. they are little command over those rebels in eastern ukraine. i believe as i sit here today what happened is russia supplied that weapon system so those rebels could shoot down ukrainian helicopters and

ukrainian warplanes attack in them, and they saw this aircraft in the sky, these undisciplined and ukrainian rebels shot down the innocent passenger jet, i believe. >> you are to beating this to your own experience in a war zone, but you cannot change the fact they are supplying be sophisticated surface-to-air missiles is widely occurring. the other thing as what the russians will say about this incident. let's get to the white house it may be potential response from there as we have been watching. >> the bbc reported the russians are denying they had anything to do with it. it is interesting you feel so strongly about this. you think this is incompetence or it was meant take our passenger jet or incompetence?

>> if you're asking my opinion. were these leaders of ukraine separatist group. they are hard-core intelligent guys, war hardened reticles in many ways. i do not believe they consciously sought to take out a commercial airliner. i don't compare that stupid nor that malicious. i think this was sheer incompetence when you give a kid a gun and a kid kill somebody, they kid may not intend to kill somebody but they don't know enough. and oh how to target the missiles, they took down the aircraft because that was the aircraft flying over them and i think you have a combination of incompetence, horrible tragedy and a war zone.

>> again, that is your opinion. let's go over again where this plane was. why would the pilot have been so close to a hot zone? we don't know that question yet. at 34,000 feet flying from one destination to another, all you have to do is watch one news report and you know there is something going on in that part of the world. what took that pilot there? >> i think we are going to out relatively quickly exactly what happened and what went down because we have the benefit of the crash scene. they can bring in forensic experts to do an examination of the aircraft and determine effective it was struck, where it was struck, what kind of weapon was used. they can understand the trajectory of the weapon, where it came from and originated so they will be able to get some real-time information on the ground very quickly.

for russia, no way rush is going to claim they shot down a passenger plane ever. even if they had some kind of involvement in it by providing the weapon systems or anything like that, they are not going to claim this. it is too problematic for them to do so. >> there was a tweet put out early on, can we have that pop up on the screen? there we go. sandra: this is what we know. we're going off of reports of the russian nongovernment news agency, but this is what we do know. they have lost contact from amsterdam, the last was over ukrainian airspace, more details to follow. i have a twitter feed in front of me, i will be watching it constantly. our london bureau reporting amsterdam airport is still not

confirming anything on their side as well. except for the fact the plane took off from there. >> you will see us intermittently put up this video of the smoke, and there it is again. we want to be on the record with this, this is what witnesses are telling us on the ground, we're not getting, trie try decrying e from people we have inside the border area of ukraine as wl. until we can really confirm that, let's go on the fact that is possibly where the plane went down. we know other planes have gone down in this region. on monday a cargo plane was shot down in that same region. it is a war zone. i originally asked this question about the white house, we're still getting information bid let's go live outside the white house. this is kind of an interesting place where the president might step in.

how do you get in? what are your sources telling you, wendell? >> we are still waiting comment from the white house the state department indicating he they will discuss it during the briefing this afternoon. the president on his way to delaware on a report of infrastructure. as marine one was taking off from the south lawn. a day after the president stepped up sanctions on russia. he said they hadn't stopped supporting the pro-russian separatists in ukraine. they had increased their suppo support. on the transport plane shot down on monday that you mentioned, senior administration official says the plane was shot down from an altitude of 21,000 feet, which this official said indicated the separatist had

sophisticated weapons and would be able to reach that far. the malaysian passenger jet apparently traveling at 33,000 feet, so it would take sophisticated weapons to shoot it down. our understanding is they have them, but waiting comments from the white house and the state department on the latest incident. >> stick with us so we can toggle back and forth. i want to quickly go to geraldo for a second because 21,000 feet, mentioned 34,000 feet, these are not your normal surface to air sort of apparatus, tell me about the weaponry potentially. >> these weapons either are locking down with radar or with feet seeking. they have the capacity to go well beyond the range this aircraft was flying at.

that is an easy bag, plus their cumbersome, large, relatively slow, not like a warplane. they are not at all stealth technology. here in my view the most likely scenario, i feel very strongly when all of my red flags go up, it is for a reason. start with the fact you saw eyewitness suggest the surface to air missile system has gone across the border from russia into the hands of the ukraine. the, you have to shoot down the commercial aircraft earlier in the week at 21,000 feet, well beyond the capacity of a shoulder fired missile as you suggest. and then you have any lumber and passenger plane flying at 34,000 feet, i submit this russian system, which remember

that took down the spy plane at 60,000 plus feet well with the capacity of this weapon system, and the ill disciplined reckless militancy of the ukraine separatist being pushed by encouraged by vladimir putin i think when you make this toxic mix, that is in my view the most likely scenario that happened to this outrageous tragedy. >> what we know at this point is the m17 malaysian airline flight was flying at 33,000 feet. we had reports in recent days from reporters on the ground that a sophisticated book missile system, a surface-to-air missile system that can shoot at planes and missiles flying up to

72,000 feet, this malaysian plane was flying well within the range of the buk missile system. it is known by nato as sa17 produced in the soviet union and in russia. and again, ap reporters on the ground said in the last 24 hours they had seen this buk missile system that had been brought across the border from russia. pentagon officials told us no less 24 hours they had seen an increase in russian troops along the border. estimate between 10-12,000 troops were now along the ukraine border. just in mid-june president putin pulled forces back from the border, they're at a height of 40,000 troops along the border. they packed up suddenly about a month ago, now they appear to be

building up again. in the last few days we have seen sophisticated rocket systems coming across the border including the brad missile system, surface- 2-surface system. ukrainian troops say they have been under fire from that missile system, so what we're seeing is a real escalation in recent days of missile systems coming from russia as well as a buildup of troops, and as geraldo was mentioning in the last week alone, we have seen two planes shot down according to interior ministry officials in ukraine. the fighter jet that was shot down last night brought down by russian missile and on monday ukrainian cargo jet flying at 21,000 feet and it was also brought down by a surface-to-air missile.

not easy to bring down this kind of planes with shoulder fired missiles. it is very notable this has now been introduced into the separatist complex in ukraine. clearly he separatists are getting more and more russian help. >> jennifer, obviously an increase the amount of activity and violins in that area. what about any intel chatter you have heard on the ground from the people, is i there any kindf statements being put out to say they would take down any aircraft that cross into that area? >> we have not heard of any particular threats. at this point in time there is no indication that woul whatever brought down this plane wherever fired the missiles of it was a missile that it was intentional, it could have been an accident, but what is notable is clear targeting of ukrainian military

jets in recent days, and so the coincidence of a commercial aircraft coming down in exactly the same area these others were shot down is just what is leading to a lot of this discussion right now, but it is ukrainian interior ministry spokesman who mentioned the bo book, they are quite certain according to the ukrainian officials this missile ross down that airplane. we're having to piece together reports from the ground but certainly the circumstantial evidence at this point in time suggests an introduction in recent days of very sophisticated surface-to-air missiles. >> you malaysian defense minister ordered the military to get involved, we are still not confirming this airplane was shot down.

i'm looking at a report from reuters to say the armed forces are saying they are not involved in the passenger plane being brought down, the presidential press service. what else are you hearing? so putting together bits and pieces of this information, but kimberly was alluded to reports from the ground there. it seems everybody at this point, the defense minister not able to confirm any situation. we're not even confirming the plane was shot down, jennifer. >> you will remember with the previous malaysian airline disaster was very slow confirming that plane had gone missing. it is not unusual in this kind of circumstance for there to be such a slow period of time.

it is clear there has been some sort of incident, flight 17 is missing. it had 295 people on board, officials say they have evidence it was a russian buk missile that was fired at the malaysian plan. we do not have independent confirmation from the pentagon or source on that, but it will not be difficult for the pentagon which has been watching that area with satellites and other signal intelligence to see what radar picked up at that time when the malaysian plane went missing. it will be easy to reconstruct this. the income he cannot disguise a surface-to-air missile like a buk missile, so this is early after the planets gone missing but as far as the circumstantial

evidence and what witnesses and reporters on the ground have been seeing in recent days as pentagon officials have been confirming it has been a flood of weapons including the surface to air weapon systems coming across the border from russia and no coincidence the russian announces sanctions against russia because great concern russia is interfering in ukraine internal affairs and by sending these weapons across border and sending 10 to 12,000 new russian troops to occupy border positions in that area. all of these things add up to a suspicion that it may have been russian supplied weapons that brought down the plane. >> thank you so much live from the washington bureau keeping us up with the very latest.

>> reporters on the ground where able to see the buk missile system delivered as they say. that is a huge piece of information as we try to piece together what has happened. president obama reportedly has been told about this, this is just coming into our newsroom now as jennifer and others have mentioned, president obama spoke with president putin just yesterday talking about those sanctions hadn't happened yet. we have the representative chairman of the house and homeland security says he wants to emphasize there has been no formal briefing for him, however, and this is interesting, from his experience at that altitude for which the plane would have come down 33,000 feet, it was likely a military grade weapon that would have done it. he says in this sort of incident intentional or accidental, it is "an international incident when

a passenger jet is shot down. we are waiting in trying to verify this right now." we're going to take a quick break away from our coverage at this moment. we have new information coming in and we will work that with the airlines jet carrying 295 people that reportedly has now gone down in ukraine just on the other side of the russian bord border. what brought it down, something possibly fired on it, the world is watching. we are covering it. stay close. (vo) friday night has always

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the fastest speed dial. the fastest office plant. so why wouldn't i choose the fastest wifi? i would. switch to comcast business internet and get the fastest wifi included. comcast business. built for business. >> joining me now on the phone, kt mcfarland, national security analyst just back from ukraine last month. what do you make of this breaking news and malaysian airlines jetliner shot down over ukraine near the russian border? >> several things. one, earlier this week on sunday there was ukrainian cargo plane shot down. we have the ability to see heat signatures bid about a hanley on the record confirmation, though off the record confirmation as we were able to track it, we

sought was taken down from a missile and the missile came from inside russia. that was monday. now thursday in the plane is missing in the same area. with the russians have shot it down? i think it is unlikely. with the ukrainians shot it down? i think it is far more likely rebels in eastern ukraine trying to get the russians and everybody back involved. the russians are not fighting an overall war. they are fighting what they call a "phony" war. they are not doing it with russian badges on or russian uniforms, they are doing it because they don't want to own it. they want to look like it is really just the rebels. so then the question becomes why would the ukrainian rebels shoot it down. they are losing right now, they are being surrounded. maybe this is a last ditch

attempt to stir things up again and get the russians to resign. >> there is a statement from the ukraine president acknowledging the incidents that have happened in recent days, the third major tragic accident. the key is basically saying he is not ruling out at this time this plane was shot down. >> i wanted to talk a little bit about how the white house would assert themselves o in any kindf way because the president and putin spoke yesterday about the tough sanctions, where does this leave us internationally in this whole thing? >> they were more symbolic than tough, but is this a response to that? so many unanswered questions.

he is pretty happy to have this happening under the radar, just far enough but doesn't provoke a response. it sounds tough on the surface of it. the europeans had not gone along with them. >> kt mcfarland giving us her contacts and experience on this. we appreciated, thank you very much. let's go to cleveland live for us on the story in d.c. i told our viewers the representative with the homeland security committee is waiting to be briefed formally on this, what have you learned? >> exactly, harris. i was talking to sources inside of ukraine, they are quoting from the separatist movement, the "pro-rebels." they have put something up reading from it say at the time

of the malaysian airlines disappearance when this was posted, they are saying they shot down the ukrainian transport plane. they thought they may have been shooting at near the city on the border there. they are ending their post saying we warned, don't fly in our skies. what that means they fired on a plane, they are saying right now they did fire on a plane, what kind of a plane it is, we don't know. he goes to that question was actually operating this, did the missile flailed of russia or flight out of ukraine? who actually had their finger on the button that launched the missile that brought down this airplane? >> another important piece as we try to figure out what happened today. kimberly, you were just having some reaction to that. >> this is what we were talking to jennifer griffin about. what kind of cheddar until they were getting, anything that preceded this munication that

might alert individuals there might be an imminent threat or direct threats to say if you fly in our airspace, highly volatile area especially with the amount of violence, this is what you are going to look for. really quickly we are going to be able to get some confirmation on this. >> there was no no-fly zone over sleepyhead this commercial airliner was a sitting duck. there may have been these threats from these separatist radicals but it was not an official no-fly zone. >> we are now going to continue our coverage on the fox news channel. before we do that, to remind everybody to keep it on the fox news channel. boeing 777 malaysia airlines has gone down in eastern ukraine. to set the stage, march 7, 2014, just a couple of months ago, he will world was concentrating on a different malaysian airliner. the one that went missing.

now the one that has gone down with 295 people on board. how it happened, the world is looking at and the pieces are coming together, looking at all aspects of this as we continue our coverage. now, to shepard smith on the fox news desk. >> from the fox news desk, i am shepard smith on fox and a vision networks across the station and on the fox news channel around the world. this is breaking news from the fox news channel. the word today is a malaysian airlines jet has crashed in eastern ukraine, and there are indications that might have been shot down. malaysia airlines reports the flight was headed from amsterdam with 295 people on board. a boeing 777. ukrainian officials as on the facebook page their plan was flying at 32,000 feet, so at cruising altitude in essence over a conflict zone.

if you wish, over a war zone. the missile from the russian launcher hit the jet, associated press journalists reported a similar launcher near the eastern ukrainian town earlier today. ukraine president now says armed forces in ukraine did not take any action against airborne target. leisure airline says on the twitter feed it has "lost contact with malaysian airlines flight 17 from amsterdam." that is the word from malaysian airliners. we are told airline is preparing a statement now. the white house says president obama has been briefed on the situation and spoke by phone today with russian president putin before any of this happened to discuss new sanctions announced yesterday. moscow requested that phone call allegedly. they have tweeted "i'm shocked by reports a plane crashed they

cal, we are launching immediate investigation." here is what we believe in the early going has happened. with every indication seems to be is that separatist working in the east of ukraine that were pro-russians fired off some sort of missile surface-to-air missile. there are indications that group they were trying to hit another plane. we have recently learned this. and now it appears instead they hit a passenger jet, a boeing 777 with 295 people on board. and we've just gotten word from journalists on the ground there, and i quote "bodies are scattered for miles around the smoking debris seen." so what happened, who is responsible, and what degree this is escalate an already very difficult situation? let's turn to jennifer griffin

in washington. the first reports it may have been shot down seemed absolutely impossible until you get the background of what happened in recent days. >> reporter: shep ard, remember this is the third plane to go down in this region since monday. on monday, you krienian officials say it was a russian missile fired at an antonov-26, ukrainian cargo plane that went down in this same area. just hours ago a fighter jet, sukhoi 25 was shot down by surface-to-air missile. the you anian pilot of that plane ejected safely. moments later we learned the malaysian plane had crashed in the same area. it has gone down in the village of torez. that is in donetsk. that is where these russian-supported separatists have been fighting against the

ukraine government for the last four months. pentagon officials in the last few days have told us that there was an increase of russian soldiers along the border with ukraine in that area, about 10 to 12,000 russian troops had been deployed in recent days to that border region. that had raised concerns at the pentagon. as had reports that sophisticated russian surface-to-air missile systems had been flowing across from russia into this area of donetsk. reporters on the ground had seen a surface-to-air missile system known as a buchanon. buk. this is a sophisticated medium-range missile that can file up to 72,000 feet into the air. the malaysian plane that crashed and went down within the recent hours it, was flying at 33,000 feet, well within the range of this buk missile system. the russian rebel separatists in

donetsk had been bragging in recent days, showing off they had this new missile system known as the buk. in fact on their social media page just moments ago we understand they claim to have shot again at a ukrainian transport plane at the about the same time this malaysian commercial jet disappeared. so all indications right now look as though it may have been a russian missile provided to the separatist its that may have brought down the malaysian flight within recent hours. >> jennifer, we're monitoring our sister network sky news in the united kingdom and they have word from the separatists on the ground, these rebels who are in support moves could you, and against ukraine and, what once part of ukraine to become part of russia, these people who shot down as you just reported, airliners in the past, are now saying that they were attempting

to shoot down a ukrainian military aircraft, and instead a passenger jet came crashing to the ground. >> reporter: what is so worrisome right now, again pentagon officials have been watching this area very closely. and they have noted this sophisticated buk missile system was brought across the border from russia and provided to the separatist it is. the range of the buk missiles, they can fly up to 72,000 feet. what the separatists have been talking about in recent days, now according to this posting on social media, they were targeting ukrainian military cargo planes, like the one that they brought down on monday and it what seems at this point in team #r time because of circumstantial evidence they may have inadvertently targeted

malaysia flight 17. >> jennifer are, we expecting anything from the pentagon this afternoon? >> we've been speaking with pentagon officials since the first news reports of plane going down occurred. they are watching this very closely. they have signals intelligence. they have satellites trained on this area. they are not speaking as of now, they're not confirming any of the details at this point in time. we do understand that president obama has been, is being kept informed of the developments. he spoke to russian president vladmir putin in the last 24 hours after the, after he announced before 6:00 p.m. eastern that he was going to level more sanctions on russia for its involvement in ukraine, for its support of the russian separatist it is. those were, that was a big announcement last night that angered the russian president greatly because it was targeting the oil industry, the energy sector of russia and was going to have dramatic impact on

russia's economy. so again, for the white house and for the president to take that kind of move against russia over increasing concerns that russia was deploying more troops to the border of ukraine as well as supplying more sophisticated weapons to the russian separate i have it is in donetsk, it is clear that the white house and the pentagon have been very concerned about these developments and watching. again, this is the third plane to be brought down in this area by russian-supported separatists in the last four days, sheppard. >> jennifer griffin at washington newsroom on capitol hill. jennifer, thank you very much. i want to show you the flight path. this is kuala lumpur. this is amsterdam, schipol airport up in amsterdam. you're flying across clearly europe. this is where you're headed, kuala lumpur, right? pilots, captains of jets have the option to change their

flight path for any reason they want. they are the captain of the ship. the decisions are theirs. the decisions are not made by air traffic control or anyone else much the captain makes the decision. so here's what happened. on the ground there in the east of ukraine and in the west of russia, there is a war going on because people on the ukraine side of the border have been shooting aircraft from the sky at altitude, meaning at 20, 30, thousand feet, sheeting them out of the sky and they're crashing. what happened today the captain got aboard, well the map has changed. the captain got aboard his jet with a flight plan that took him over the war zone where just yesterday a jet was shot from the sky and decided, i'll fly that way. the pilot decided he would fly over this war zone where just yesterday a plane just got shot out of the sky. and today it would appear he got shot out of the sky.

john bussey with us, from "the wall street journal." since the moment i was in the gym, when this happened. and from the moment i heard it, a passenger jet just flew over what? >> yes. right. >> unimaginable that a captain of a jet would do this. not that this is his fault, not to pass blame, but what are you thinking? >> this is a dicey zone that has been getting worse very quickly. might have been the airliner or the air traffic controllers thought it was still safe but over the last four days there was a lot of indications as jennifer griffin has pointed out, a lot of indication it is wasn't safe. cargo jet getting shot down by a missile on monday. the ukrainians saying one of their fighter jets shot down yesterday by a russian plane and now this. and shep, there is a long history of commercial jets flying into or over dicey areas and getting into trouble. in african conflicts where there have been commercial jets shot

down. remember flight oo 7 in the 1980s, korean jetliner flew over russia, it was sensitive and flown off course and shot down by the russians. the united states in 1988 when iranian passenger jet flew out into the persian gulf, uss vincennes thinking a fighter plane on the attack shot down a commercial jet as well. >> we're monitoring our sister network sky news in the united kingdom. they have resources in the region. this is the smoke coming from the ground from the plane crash. ukrainian interior ministry advises 295 people are dead. that is confirmed from the ukrainian interior minister. i want to give you a little background as we continue to watch these pictures, please, what happened in that region. june the 6th, rebels say they shot down ukrainian an-30 surveillance plane. killed 3 people. use ad shoulder-fired missile to

shoot down a large ukrainian military transport jet and killed all 49 people on board. on jewel 14th, pro-russian militants in eastern ukraine claimed responsibility for shooting down a ukrainian military transport plane. july 16th, ukranian fighter jets shot down in ukranian airspace. ukraine blamed the russian military. today, july 17th, accidentally it would now appear, best reporting we have, the same separatists claimed they were trying to shoot down a ukrainian military jet and instead killed 25 people in a passenger jet flying over over e airspace. >> this tragedy, the discussion turns into two different directions. one is air traffic control around the world. how does this happen a commercial jet flies over a very, very dangerous area where planes are getting shot down out of the sky. the second area this moves into, the discussion fairly quickly, what was vladmir putin's role in this? this missile system, if it was a missile, if the plane was shot

down by the buk missile system, was given to ukraine by russia, does that somehow -- putin from responsibility for this or does it engage him directly in responsibility for this? and that international concern over the conflict in ukraine really escalates. way beyond all the incremental sanctioning that has been going on, the europeans are forced to step forward with much harsher measures. >> i want to shop pictures just coming in. i have it over here. these are pictures sent in. we've got them overtwitter, we confirmed they're real. this is a piece of the plane in the country side, east of ukraine, not far from the border. this is only one i have up at the moment. from reporters on the ground. there are pictures we can not show you because remains of those on the plane are scattered all over the place. i would assume we'll hear from the pentagon. we'll hear from the president within a short period of time. he was leaving to go to an

event. this event happened as marine one my understanding was taking off from the white house. the president is in transport. i suspect we'll hear from him soon. i wonder if and when we hear from vladmir putin. i figure he wants to get ahead of the message. >> the difference between 24 and flight 370 couldn't be more stark. there was no information on flight three sift and it dribbled in over days. this was the malaysian jet lost over the indian ocean of the there will be a wealth of information surrounding what happened here. everything from eyewitnesses on the ground to u.s. military surveillance which has been ongoing in the region and significantly stepped up since the conflict began. there will be a lot of data points to consider. >> i would be willing to venture, not speculation but educated guess, when this jet went down our cameras were on it because our surveillance on this

region has been constant when this all began. more pictures coming in. our friends at sky news in the united kingdom are getting information who may have been on the plane. what appears here to me, to be a piece of the fuselage, and more pictures that are coming in from the jet itself, again these are twitter, these are twitpics that we've gotten we confirmed are in fact from the region and our friend at sky news now is speaking who is on this jet. let's listen. >> to conserve fuel and most direct routes destinations on weather. i remember flying to the middle east not so long ago, honest we were flying very close to syrian and iraqi airspace and mildly intrigued the pilot should choose such a course. i suppose the calculation a civilian aircraft of high altitude was unlikely involved in anything occurring further down below. >> i've just gotten this in from the associated press. the ukraine pro-russian rebels

as we were mentioning a moment ago saying they did not shoot down the airliner. they instead are blaming ukrainian armed forces. you can not believe anything that is being said right now because the first information from these rebels was, hey, we were trying to shoot down a ukrainian military vehicle, military aircraft. that is what they said first. the separatists are now saying, no, we didn't shoot anything. ukrainian armed forces did this. that does not stand to reason. that is not to say that is impossible but i can tell you the intelligence is on the ground and in the air and whatever did happen we won't have to rely on anybody from malaysian airlines thankfully to know. because we'll know because our people are there and our satellites are there and our intelligence is on the ground. this matter who was on board, they're traveling from amsterdam to kuala lumpur, it wait a minute full but with 295 people on board it is close to full. back to sky news.

>> i would have thought so. if you look at any historical book on warfare, who was shot down by whom at what time, difficult to put down after number of years. after hours or days this would be difficult. a aircraft at altitude can travel long way when damaged. not clear because it came down in particular region it was hit in that region. any weapon that could have damaged it would have a very long-range and could be far away. at present there is little idea concerning what occurred. >> by the sounds of this show -- though, this seems to have been a pretty catastrophic strike if that is the case as this plane was heading towards russian airspace. people are expected to turn up within moments and, it vanished from the skies and appears to have dropped some 50-k short of the russian border. sound like a pretty catastrophic strike that had an immediate impact and this was no case of a

plane flying on for a long way? >> no, possibly not. the kind of weapons that the could reach an aircraft at altitude, the sa-11 that ukrainian government ministry suggested it might have been, s-300, similar weapon have quite large warheads designed to do a lot of damage. a civil aircraft is not designed to take such punishment could have flown in varying states of damage before finally falling apart sop distance after the impact. >> edward hunt. >> shepard smith back in new york now. we can't know yet exactly what happened to the yet. we ownly know what authorities are saying and what the flight path indicates. the early indication this plane was shot out of the sky. is that confirmed? the answer is no. the intelligence agencies no doubt know exactly what happened by now because they have tracked it. but we don't yet know. we're awaiting specifics exactly

what happened. i can tell you flightaware, the flight trafficking website that tracks all jets in the air at all times, has updated this flight path and it now indicates that the jet actually came down much closer to the russian border than previously stated. there are a number of reasons this could have happened and the most likely according to those who are watching this is that whenever it was struck or whatever happened, there was a glide path that happened after the strike that made it land many miles closer to the russian border than it would have been. this is the path from the website. so they would have lost contact at one specific location, and then it would have kept forward progress for a while. you figure it is flying close to 500 miles an hour, ground speed, and at 33,000 to 34,000 feet it could glide quite a while. it is not as if any of this is in question. it is just where the plane stopped functioning properly and where it landed are two

different locations. john bussey, from "the wall street journal," managing editor there is with us. there's a lot yet to learn. >> a lot of ifs, a lot of ifs. the presumption it is still shot down. we still don't even know that for sure. it looks like it but there are a lot of ifs. there will be a lot of information coming from this plane. there will be satellite tracking. there will be ground radar tracking. there will be a black box this time for this malaysian jet. shep, look, ukraine itself shot down, by mistake, shot down a commercial jet once in 2001 during military exercises. this happens. whether or not plane was shot down and whether by separatist it is, was it by some ukrainian force, we still don't have those firm data points yet. >> we talked about this buk or buk missile surface-to-air missile. we've explained that associated press reporters saw one of these launchers at the border in

recent days. i believe it was yesterday but i know it was within recent days. so the separate rate of it is from the, russian separatist its do have these missile launchers. that said, so does ukraine bought. associated press it has four missile system file photos including one on flatbed truck maneuvered in ukraine by ukrainian forces. that happened to be on july 4th. as this jet dose gown, it is interesting and i would assume at this moment nothing but coincidental that 18 years ago today, twa flight 800 crashed off the coast of long island, new york and killed everyone on board. we know the conspiracy theoryies live to this day surrounding that. >> one of them was a missile fired at it brought it down. in fact investigators found it was a malfunction inside of a fuel tank that ignited the fuel tank and the plane blew up. so it could very quickly

escalate into the zone of skepticism. the reason are looking at buk missile system, the presumption is nothing else could get that high. >> right. >> cruising altitude. a buk missile system can fire a missile above 70,000 feet. theoretically it would be weapon of choice for a plane flying that high, if this was ultimately shot out of the sky. as you point out, both side have the system. >> the kremlin has, i will go to jennifer griffin for more on the system in just a moment but i want to give you this. the kremlin in moscow put out a new statement claiming that, i spoke earlier of the phone call between the russian president vladmir putin and our president obama obama, call that happened earlier today today, sanctions and some cases european leaders placed on russia for its activity in the region, economic sanctions, energy sanctions, all kinds of stuff. the kremlin has a new version on that phone call. i will let you know what it is. the kremlin put out a statement

claiming in their phone call today about new sanctions, president putin told president obama that malaysian airplane crashed on ukraine can territory. the kremlin claims that putin mentioned the crash, during the phone call from obama, russians were getting new information from air traffic controllers about the air crash. it is important to caution here white house spokesman josh earnest told our white house correspondent ed henry that he is still seeking clarification on the exact timing of the obama-putin call. so the kremlin says the president learned about this while on the phone with putin. the white house says, we're not sure yet. so this the putin version of call that he told obama about a crash in general. they're pushing the white house for more information. i'm sure at this moment it doesn't really matter much in the grand scheme of things. what matters who was on this plane, who did this, how will they be punished and what does it mean to the now escalating crisis on the ukraine border? the number of crises in the world right now is astonishing

and, i listened to bob schieffer on cbs last night he felt like we're in a very, very dire moment around the world. not only what is happening now in ukraine but what is happening in israel and in palestinian territories. not to mention unrest across the middle east. secretary of state who bob schieffer put it hopping from country to country putting out fires and really isn't able to get very much accomplished along the way because the problems are so big, so widespread. when you look at the world as a whole it looks sometimes like everything is falling apart. >> this is one of those times where there's a lot going on overseas. our correspondents did risely a piece on a this, probably not since the 1970s have you had this much unrest in so many parts of the world. what happens in ukraine now? does this inflame -- let's assume for the moment this was somehow shot out of the sky. does it inflame matters? if it was done by the russian

separatist its does it focus international ire on vladmir putin for supplying them with the missiles? does that force a, a pressure on russia to back away from this conflict? and does it actually, damp down the conflict there? or does it go the other direction, does it inflame it? russia feels, there is a lot of nationalism in russia. they're very much in support of what putin is doing in ukraine and has done in crimea, does it inflame it even further? >> it is important to remember exactly how this went down. this began with vladmir putin invading another country and taking its territory by force. it was quiet. it was under the radar, it was done with social media. you never really saw pictures. i was there in crimea i days after, in the days before and after this happened. you couldn't even see it on the streets. it was happening behind gates and suddenly crimea no longer

belonged to ukraine! and now the russians are trying to do the same thing in the east of ukraine. and those who are in support of it have been ramped up by what is, you can not imagine the level of vitriol that is being broadcast on russian state television. the propaganda is of cold war-age style but new world spread. in other words, it is across all mediums. it is on social media. it is all over the internet. it is in the newspapers. it is on television and on radio and all state controlled. in the east of ukraine they no longer get ukrainian television and you krienian media. they get the kremlin. they ramp up force people are screaming in the streets about facism and how they have to be taken away from the which is. they are all riled up to they are shooting jets from the sky. we know they did it yesterday. they admit they did it. it would appear in early

reporting, first they said we tried to shoot a ukrainian military jet out of the sky. instead down came this 777. what are they using with all of this as your background? these buk or buk missile systems. let's get to jennifer griffin at the pentagon. these are from russia. moscow sent them to the separatists, right? >> reporter: it is important, shepard as you and john were speaking about before, both sides have these buk missiles as far as we know. ukrainian forces in still photos on july 4th, their forces traveling with buk missile systems. ukraine is close to russia and natural they would have bought them from there. in recent days we heard reports that russia provided to the separatists in the donetsk region the buk missiles and separatists were bragging about having these buk missiles. here is how the missile system

works. it can fire up to 72,000 feet. it is a surface-to-air missile, medium-range missile, designed to bring down planes, warplanes as well as cruise missiles. the way it works according to military sources it has two radar systems, and it has a semiautonomous homing device which means that if somebody points that missile at a target, if there is a nearby target that is larger, the missile will divert off course and take on that larger target. so you could see in a situation like this where there are multiple planes in the sky that the separatist its, if in fact they fired the buk missile they could have thought they were targeting a cargo jet, a military plane, ukrainian military plane as they did on monday when they brought down the antonov-26. that missile could have honed on to a commercial jet like the mh17 passing by. that is how this missile system works. it is very similar to our

patriot missile system which you heard deployed multiple times over the years to various war zones. this sa-17 or sa-11 buk missile system. that is how it works. it deploys with ground forces and it is used to shoot cruise missiles and planes out of the sky, shepard. >> jennifer griffin at the pentagon. we'll get back to jennifer in just a moment. i should let you know we're waiting for the latest from the white house. ed henry informs us that we, that we are expected to hear from them details of exactly what the call was to president obama and who knew what when. the malaysian defense minister says he is on the way to the ops room with the prime minister. he says the transport minister is on his way back from beijing. that is what is happening in malaysia with this malaysian airlines jet which has gone down. it was hard to imagine malaysian would survive to this day after the disappearance of the previous malaysian airlines flight, what happens to

malaysian airlines now is anyone's guess but they were in horrible financial trouble. now to find out who was on that plane, what happened to it, how it came from the sky and who is responsible. who is responsible. it is 1 o'clock and 10 o'clock a.m. on the west coast and in ukraine a malaysian airline from amsterdam to kuala lumpur was lost from radar and suddenly in a field in the east of ukraine not far from the russian border. those who support russia taking over. the rebel fighting many weeks and months, attempted to shoot down a ukranian jet. military jet as it had in recent days. today early reporting