>> thank you to senator fred thompson. we'll see you back here on monday. we have a fox news alert on two international crisis unfolding right now. the president said the eyes of the world are on eastern ukraine and the truth of a global tragedy will come out. ukraine and russia are blaming each other for the attack that left 298 people dead. breaking news, israel expanding the ground offensive in gaza and aimed at taking hamas targets. welcome to a busy hour of happening now. i am jenna lee. >> and i amex rick shaun in for

jon scott. the u.s. response for the shocking shoot down and pointed demand for russian president putin and the concern over the continuing rocket barrage of hamas at israel. >> we have wendall goaler live in the white house and johnetty is in gaza. and steve, in the capitol of kiev, steve? >> reporter: jenna, the mood here in kiev is one of fury. they are calling it an act of terrorism and the sight of that plane crash 25 miles of the border from russia smoulderring and spread out over several miles. personal belongings and bodies and passports are littered everywhere. it is complicated to analyze

what is happening. it is still an active war sight. russian rockets were fired in the air today. this will complicate the task for determining who is at fault. we have three different parties, the russian government and ukranian government and rebels. they are all pointing fingers at each other. the president obama is not giving russian direct responsibility for the takedown but samantha powers went further saying over all russia does bear responsibility for the situation. because of the technical complexity. sa 11, it is unlikely the separatist could have operated without assistance from knowledgeable personnel and we can't rule out russian personnel from operating the systems. >> reporter: so not ruling out the russians but implying they

played a role and advising the rebels on how to fire. where is the next step. you have president putin calling for a ceasefire. that is tough to do in an inflamed emotional state. we could see more fighting especially in the city of donetsk. back to you. other questions are surfacing now that are straightforward. are we safe in the skies today? here is the current map of flights over europe. you can see planes avoiding much of ukraine particularly in the eastern part of the country. this is a former pilot and engineer and joins us now with hopefully perspective. it is a scary story when you see so many innocent people killed in a senseless way. are we safe today to fly? >> we are not safe from lunatics

that get their hands on technical equipment that perform as this missile site performed. in this particular case. outside forces that affect a innocent flight and murder 295 people no, the world is not a safe place. but on every accident you do an investigation and come up with a primary cause and contributory cause. and you have pointed out primary and contributory cause i look at russia and president putin. >> before we have all of the answers, what is the immediate impact for airlines and pilots? >> basically the pilot takes their job as it comes. we don't expect us to live forever but we are not suicidal. the attitude from the pilots, we expect losses of friends along

the line, but not like this. this is atrocitiy that occurred and no pilot accepts and passengers, you have what you are putting out on the screen, and numerous other organizations, you are showing horrible film which is news and should be shown, no criticism of. that but the basic passenger looks at that and justifiably is frightened, because they don't know who are the controlling authorities, government or whatever that can cause them to be murdered on a simple flight going to visit their relatives. >> do you anticipate any sort of changes in the security for pilots or airlines? and how far in the future does that go? is the immediate impact that pilots avoid one area in europe, but does that end in a couple of weeks or spark a change in the industry? >> first of all, this should

have been a no-fly zone. the euro control put a restriction of 32,000 feet and below. this aircraft was at 33,000. and i would look at malaysian and governments and a number of shoot downs and you had missile activity from the ground and air-to-air activity from the air between fighters, there is your warning and euro control should have stepped in and closed down the entire area. we don't care if you have to circumnavigate and make a fuel stop. we are operating on the safety of passengers. the pilots themselves what you can do in the aircraft. only one airline has missile defense. they have means of defecting and diverting a missile and they have less than 40 airplanes. how are you going to arm 4,000

airplanes. >> and that is technology and whether or not it is need going forward. i can't forget about the families, all of them so impacted by what happened and so needlessly as you point out. and there is a lot of questions if you are on this plane, what you knew and when and how that helps us to piece together what happened here. the question of the black box system a big question today. how necessary is it for us to get the hands on the black boxes and what will they tell us about what happened to the plane? >> nothing. the black box, in a normal accident investigation black boxes are important. this was a shoot down. the missile hit and severed the electrical controls to the cockpit recorder and flight data recorder that is all gone. what you have most important is the crime scene and that crime scene and the investigators,

criminally wise, you must secure the crime scene. all i see is people wandering around the crime scene and god knows what they are picking up and apocalyptpocketing. it will show the termination of a innocent flight and it went black. >> you have 40 years in this industry. what went through your mind and reflections personally about this incident? >> horror. absolute horror. when you put yourself and your family on board my aircraft and any pilot's aircraft, i am only there for one thing, the announcement when you came on board and i described the flight path, i end it up now you can sit back and relax and enjoy your flight and i will have you to your destination swiftly and safely.

this is a violation of everything that what every airline pilot ascribes to protecting all of you and your families in the air. this is a horror. >> it is nice to have you talking to the program. >> thank you, jenna. nice seeing you. right now we are in a pentagon briefing. let's listen. >> the target gone awry or a act of terrorism. >> we don't know yet. we'll have to let the investigators figure out. we don't know the motive. >> what is your theory and working theory? >> i don't think we have a working theory. it just happen yesterday. there is teams of investigators trying to get to the site and pour through this. we have to let them do their job. >> people in this department said there are 10 to 12,000

regular russian troops in the border which is a build up from a couple of weeks ago. is that your estimate and has the forces changed since the attack yesterday and can you tell us what they are doing and posture is in terms of army incursions? >> i don't know of any mange change to that presence. it is roughly 10 to 12,000 fluktates from week to week. it is over time steady increase in the combined arms and tactical battalions on the russian side to the southeast of the ukraine. and they are close to the border. in many cases closer than those forces who are more aligned on the east. if you remember. we have tens of thousands that were, that were along the eastern border of ukraine and

not as close as these units appear to be. they are escalating the tension. it is difficult to know what the intent is. the russian ministry of defense, they are there, and growing in size and continue to do nothing more than escalate the tension. >> the force providing the weapons to the separatist or is that process different. >> i don't see they are involved to the provision of support to the separatist but they are amassing on the southern part of the border. >> two questions, that amassing of fores is that air and artillery and like the fa 11 that was used in the malaysian. and have you see that equipment on the russian border. >> i don't have an inventory as what they got with them. they are combined arms units and

not just infantry troops but they have artillery capability and combined arms and they are very ready. this is a very capable force. though smaller in number as what was lined up by the border before. >> you have an estimate of 12,000 russian troops on the border and in the russian side and obviously the u.s. is tracking the work of russian special operation forces and intelligence services in the ukraine. is there an estimate of the size of that advisory presence in the eastern ukraine by russian forces. is it a handful or a thousand guide? >> i don't have a number for you on that. and that is less important than the fact that they continue to do. it and we continue to see this

support and resourcing, and that advice begin to the separatist groups. and that is russian. that is coming from the russians. we believe that there are russian support for the separatist inside of ukraine, yes. >> admiral. when the general was here a few weeks ago, he said specifically that the separatist were receiving training on vehicle born anti- aircraft system. how much g? has that intensified and was he referring to the sa 11 type system? >> i don't know what system he was referring to. but we agree with the assessment that the separatist received training in the vehicle born

system. no question. but i don't have an estimate of how many and who's doing it. i don't really. >> would that raise alarms and mean small arms and that is pretty serious. >> it is pretty serious. and we take that seriously. and we are monitoring the situation as closely as we can. understand that no body in the pentagon is shy about taking about the continued threat posed by the separatist elements in the ukraine or by those combined arms forces that continue to amass on the border. >> is the pentagon increases the surveillance of the area along the border that is faster. >> i would just say we are monitoring events as close as we can.

and it is a commercial airline company. and that is known there. it is warning the civilian aircraft to fly and take care of ukraine and fly at higher altitudes and not an expert on that process. but there was an international notice. >> was that the training of the vehicle born. >> you would really have to talk to the sa a. and the obviously, if they are going to issue a warning like that, it is based on concerns that you have about surface to air missile activity and capabilities. >> when you said you don't know what the intent was of who ever

fired the missile, was there indication of ukranian military planes in the sky at that time. and is there any concern that putin can stop this if he can and perhaps this situation is out of control and perhaps russia doesn't have the control of the separatist? >> i don't know on your first question. this is ukranian air space. and i don't have that ability. we don't have that here. and the second question. the president is clear about what the responsibility and obligation of president putin and moscow is right now. deescalate the tension and cease the support for the separatist activities and i said in the outset continues and some cases

intensifying. >> even since yesterday's yesterday. >> just yesterday. i don't know of any difference or signs that it is stopping. >> there have been previous to the tragedy, there are 2 or 3 at least ukranian transport planes shot down. your intelligence and knowledge indicate the systems shot down was powerful and more sophisticated system and requiring more training or was it similar to the similar that was used to shoot down the transport planes? >> again, we are investigating this right now. it is unclear exactly what brought down the other aircraft you are talking about. we know they were shot down. but those, those are still being

looked into and i don't have great visibility on what brought them done, but i would like to bring you back to the larger point here. these aircraft are being shot down. and while it is unclear as to who is pulling the trigger, it is pretty clear it is doing nothing to deescalate the tension in ukraine and bring together a peaceful resolution. and now independent people simply flying from one city to another have been killed and brought into this. this is the big picture here. it matters a lot less, you know, exactly what system and a lot more that it happen and needs to stop. >> do you believe that who ever fired, could have mistaken it for a military transport? >> i will not get in the motivations or intent or the

reasoning that went into this. that's for the investigators to figure out and we simply don't have that level of detail at this point. >> are there measures lick this and the fact that it was a accident does that show a dangerous lack of training? >> i don't know. i am not an expert on the system and i wouldn't get up here and try to dissect it for you. they willpower through this and figure it out. >> who are the investigators? >> it is an international investigation. >> does it include the dod. >> there is no transfer for a dod representative on. this and i will not speak to further agencies, but there will be other enitties from the federal government and individuals to participate. and i don't have the make up of the team. there will be international

investigators. >> i have no representation of that now. >> the president saw no role for the u.s. military in responding to this. but whatever what happened to the list of request for the equipment that the ukranians sent. >> we continue to review request for ukranian request for military assistance and the focus of that is on the nonlethal side right now. and 33 million that the president authorized of material has been getting to ukranian armed forces and border services. and the support continues to flow. and we continue to take a look at their needs and addressing in turn. >> as i remember it was mre's.

is there any, you have a more complete list? >> yeah. there's been more items and masks and additional items will move through the procurement and night vision goggles. and thermal imagers and expose and additional radios. they have been given alarm systems and barbed wire and escavators and generators and communication's gear and all of

this is part of a package of 33 million that the president has approved. >> they haven't gotten there yet and it was a long time since they requested that. >> it is working through the procurement process. i don't have the tick tok and it will get there soon. >> is there a concern it would be a proxy war between the u.s. and russians if the u.s. were to provide lethal aid. >> i will not get in the hypotheticals, but the territory of ukraine is violated by the neighbor russia and that needs to stop. >> to your knowledge, who has the black box? >> i don't know. it is not a concern that evident may be tamered w. >> i said in the outset, we all-star sides to have safe

access to the site to get the black box and find out all of the circumstances of the downing. >> have the ukrainian asked for lethal assistance? >> i think i said before they have requested a lot of material and the focus remains on the nonlethal side. >> they have asked for weapons? >> i will not detail everything on their request. we continue to evaluate the request. and it was lethal and nonlethal focus of our assistance to date has been on the nonlethal side. >> when general breedlow talked about the training. are you seeing the training and support for separatist taking place on the russian side of the border, indeed, is that where you so it happening and then

they are coming in to the ukraine? >> i don't have a specific zip code for you for where it is going on. we continue to see support for the separatist and that includes a major of training and i don't have the details on who is doing it and what systems. we believe that the support, and not just training and advice. it is resources and continues. and i would like to take you to a larger point. that support has to cease. >> i know you will not be able to say how you know this it, you are then seeing in some fashion russian military equipment including surface to air system crossing the border in to ukraine, that's what the intelligence shoes you. >> i will not speak about intelligence matters. i will say we continue to see the support for the separatist

to include the himmings that the general talked about. and continue to see it escaulatory and dangerous and needs to stop. i will not talk about all of the measures in which we believe we have the information. >> you believe it crossed the border? >> we have seen equipment going across the border. >> but you were not aware of any mobile vehicle sam systems? >> that's correct. >> the treasury sanctions including a russian -- absent from the list is the support and export. was that at the request of this? >> i am not aware. >> admiral john kirby saying unclear who was pulling the finger, but the finger is

pointed in the separatist or russians and they had a know how to operate the buk missile system. or if it was the russian operators and military that kirby said are driven by moscow. >> and nonloathal aid. and it will take months. night vision and goggles that they are pleading to get to fight the pro russian separatist. >> and in the meantime, many mourning the loss of friends and family today. in ukraine a tribute to the victims set up in the dutch embassy. the dutch suffering the largest loss of life. and they join us with the latest. >> hi, jenna, the tragedy is piles upon tragedy and the infants who died and the aids researchers traveling across the

world to a conference and then the dutch who have nothing to do with the conflict and suffered the largest number of casulties in the crash. 189 people. and we saw members of the dutch royal family signing a condolence book for the victims and they are gathering in the amsterdam airport where the airline came from. for loved ones of tragedies it is important to travel to the crash site and they are trying to make accommodationed for that. and in this case, that journey is complicated. >> the location where the aircraft went down is 500 kilometers from kiev. and we are working on the logistics and the best mode of transport. and it is trying to do that. >> there was a touching

outpouring of sympathy in kiev. the prime minister of ukraine declaring that the terrorist have declared war against the war. malaysian airline in the press conference took questions about why it chose to fly over eastern ukraine and insists that they followed all procedures and it was declared safe to take the route and other flights had gone that way. and we know that issue will continue to be examined and talked about. jenna. >> amy, thank you. >> senator are john mccain said the world is in greater turmoil than any point in his lifetime. the world was in worse shape and hasn't been since the 1970s and he wrote that before the shoot down. he joins us next to fill us in on what is next.

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>> a shoot down of the passenger jet over eastern ukraine and expanding ground operation by israel in the gaza strip and the headlines causing us to reflect on the wall street journal headlines and seemed more impressing. a convergence of security crisis playing out around the globe and the territory of iraq and ukraine and south china sea and posing challenge to president obama's foreign policy and u.s. global powers seem te newous. and it is unfolding and hasn't been seen since the 1970s when the soviet union invaded afghanistan. and southeast asia reeling in the wake of the u.s. exit from vietnam. there is a lot there. the article got so much attention ed henry asked the

press secretary to respond. >> there is a number of situations in which the administration intervened in a meaningful way and furthered american interest and improved the you know, the tranquilitty of the global community. >> and it is focusing on now with the journalist who wrote the piece. joe so jay, what an interesting woke to write the piece. for those of our viewers who missed it, how did you get to the conclusion and you reported with a different source that the world seems to be in a crazy place, why are we at this point? >> you know, i travelled a lot with secretary kerry and specifically over the last few months and it is chaotic period, one week with russia and then iraq and iran and middle east

peace process and ukraine. we were trying to figure out why so much chaos in the same moment and feel like the u.s. is tested so much and it really so manies to be a convergence of president obama campaigned on getting out of iraq and afghanistan and pulling back the u.s. military foot prints. and he was elected and reelected on. that but china, russia and iran and al-qaeda, and islamic state in iraq and hesbollah, very much are testing the united states and international order that was established in the end of the cold war. if you are looking for a general theme, that is what ties it together and why we see so much instability in one point in time. >> some are suggesting and even in the editorial pages of the wall street journal in which you

write, are raising the questions of the downing of the passenger plane is a game changer in all of this and it would produce a policy and reengagement in the united states whether in eastern europe or in general. we are very much dealing with the news and do you so evident of that and do you think it is a game changer? >> i think it will be a game changer in the sense of how europe sees putin and they are reluctant to put in place the sectorial sanctions that the obama administration is talking about for a while. and i can see in the next week or month that there is a unified approach to punishing putin economically. and i think it would be questionable if it is pervasive of the type of sanctions that the u.s. posted on with iran and

done damage to that economy. i don't so the massive shift and arming the ukrainian military and taking up that much more robust military posture in eastern europe. i think they will continue to do what they are talking about. fortify the u.s. allies and make it clear to russia that you can't go to the baltics and those typing of steps. i don't see a radical shift in the obama doctrine and focuses on the diplomatic and working multilaterally. and military action. and i think even if you look at iraq after the islamic state took it to western a rack more than a month ago, there was a talk about military strikes. >> let me stop you there. that is an interesting point. we haven't seen this instability since the 1970s and the military and the role of our military in

the world is one of the fundmental reasons and regardless of who we are talking. there is a feeling of a lack of engagement and tell us about that. >> i think that obama was elected and followed through on what he was elected for. pull back on afghanistan and not engage in the series of wars that dominanted in the last deck cade. what is tricky for him. how do you manage that in a way that doesn't tempt our adversaris whether in china or north korea to test that. and i think there is more than enough evident that it is being tested. putin testing the line in the ukraine and crimea. and whether al-qaeda affiliates redrawing the maps of the middle east.

and you could see china get aggressive and we interviewed officials from japan and south korea and countries allied with the u.s. and they are concerned if china made a grab in the contested islands in the south china sea, how much would the u.s. get their back in this area. >> it is interesting that you mentioned that. that is our next segment. talking about how the east will react to what happened in eastern europe. and thank you for thearticle. we appreciate it very much. >> and as jerry was saying, the world and malaysian in particular, the second airline disaster that the count rope faced this year and the brazen shot down and coming down on the heels in march. that story is not found. and malaysian is mourning what happened. and the country is demanding an investigation and here is the

country's transport minister. all of these in ukraine indicated that malaysian flight 17 was shot down. it will be international law and against human dignity. the nation condemns any such action in the strongest possibly terms and calls for those responsible to be swiftly brought to justice. that is a shocking shoot down. and how does this tragedy change the international relations with russia. moscow and/beijing have been joined in the hips and does that change that or strength ten?

>> they have seen putin getting away with something, murder of 300 people. you almost have stalin and ma o reincarnated and china and russia are joined together in the hip. we have not faced a united china and russia since the known 50s and this is serious for the united states. and we don't understand what is happening on a geo political world scale. >> the president calls on putin for imposing an immediate ceasefire. to you think that will happen? >> of course not. he called them separatist. they are not separated from putin. just on wednesday, the united states treasury put additional sanctions on russian arms manufacturers and thursday we get the response from moscow. this is something that asians will see significance and they

will look to us to see how we are going to respond? and we haven't responded forcefully and they take a lesson that/beijing and moscow is working together and they better worry about the u.s. >> what do you think they will get? >> on an elemental level they are making sure the united states makes sure china doesn't do more belerjerrant. they are trying to push out and grab territor and control the international waters and the u.s. response is moderate. and people in asia want to see a determined response on our part, because it is their security and their territory and their waters. >> you talk about grabbing territory, that's what putun has done and what about asia. south china sea is one example and what else? >> when you look at the south

china sea, we have a mutual defense treat of manila and we didn't honor it. and the chinese are trying to take away islands from japan. the united states response is tepid and the japanese are concerned about that and ramping up their military. they don't trust us and that is an important dynamic. if our allies and friends don't trust us, we'll see all sorts of behavior in asia that is beyond anyone's control and we know where that leads to. >> and sadly, that could be the war we start to face. thank you for your insight. >> and a missile takes down a passenger jet. and military invasion of gas a. how does the white house handle the hot spots?

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>> hi, everyone. i am gretchen carlesson. exclusive intru with the recent director of the national safety board. how would she conduct the malaysian investigation. why are the messages so different? we'll debate that. and the day is here. my acting debow in the new movie pers outed all at the top of the hour. >> and how is the white house

dealing with two major foreign policy charges. the shoot down of the malaysian jet liner and hamas continuing to launch rockets at israel and prompting israel to expand the operation in gaza. we have more from michael and michael, first start with russia. president obama demanded vladimar putin impose a ceasefire. is that enough? do you think that putin will back down or ramp up? >> i think it would be the main goal to pursue a ceasefire and further arms deliveries from russia and to ukraine and the separatist must stop. and the president is right to demand those things. but the real leverage he has and demonstrate as hillary clinton said where are the western europeans and if we bring them along in threatening sanctions, then i think combined with the

moral outrage that has a chance to sway putin. i don't think putin will be swayed by rhetoric or a sense of guilt. we'll have to have economic muscle. the nato member passengers were shot down out of the sky in cold blood. is that enough to get the nato countries european allies on board for stronger sanctions as you call for? >> icant predict. but this is what you have to try to use. it is a horrible tragedy and i am not the first person who said tragedy provide opportunities. the people's attention is focused and the stakes are out to see. and we can't risk this again. and this is the kind of moment you hope to focus people's minds on what needs to be done. not so much for punishing putin. but the sake of stopping it

before it goes further. the sanctions that kick in unless and until he verifiably stops arming the separatest. >> and talk about focusing people's minds third time that israel went in to gaza because of the hamas rockets. what do you predict will happen there. they are not talking about a major ground offensive but a limited one. >> i can't get excited about the day they stop like some people are. the problem is whatever happens in the limited incursion. the two parties have to get back to the peace process. this is what happens when they fail. and it will happen even worse if they try to resume the negotiations. there is no determination except

a israeli and palestinian state that are loving in their own separate states. and without that kipped of an out okay, i conflict indefinitely into the future. >> sadly, as you say, it appears that peace is failing in various parts of our world. mike owe hanlon of the brookings institute. how this is impacting your bottom line on wall street, next. [ female announcer ] we help make secure financial tomorrows a reality for over 19 million people. [ alex ] transamerica helped provide a lifetime of retirement income. so i can focus on what matters most. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. transamerica. is is mike. his long race day starts with back pain...nt when tomorrow becomes real. ...and a choice. take 4 advil in a day which is 2 aleve... ...for all day relief. "start your engines"

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it is a horrific twist of fate. a woman from australia losing family members in two airline tragedies just this year. kay lien pictured here with her nephew. he lost both of his parents.

his brother and sister-in-law in malaysian airlines flight 370, which disappeared in march and still hasn't been found. today, he's mourning the loss of yet another family member. her stepdaughter was killed yesterday on board flight 17 when it was shot down. australia's prime minister expressing anger over the tragic loss of the country men's lives. >> this is not an accident. it's a crime. i stress not an accident, it's a crime. and criminals should not be allowed to get away with what they've done. so there has to be a full impartial international investigation and russia should certainly not be allowed to stand in the way of that just because the aircraft has come down over territory controlled by russian-backed rebels. >> among the passengers, 27 were

citizens of australia. the market is recovering one day after events overseas rattled stocks. here's a look at where stocks are trading right now. we're live from the new york stock exchange with more information for us. nicole, any lasting impact from the headlines over the last 24 hours or so? >> the answer is yes. the impact here is that wildcard. that sense of uncertainty and the keen eye on geopolitical -- yes we had the plane crash at 11:00 a.m. that's when we saw the selloff occur, jenna, that's where we had the biggest selloff here that we haven't seen in over two months. today was interesting. the resiliency of this market. the dow is higher by 97 points, your 401(k)'s and iras are holding on nicely. we're less than a hundred points from our record all-time high. to your point, jenna, there remains that certainty. what occurs exactly.

if there are going to be morehemore headlin headlines. on top of that, we heard about israel moving into gaza. it's something we'll watch. we'll have up arrows right now. >> we'll take the up arrows where we can. thank you very much. how safe should we feel in the skies flying overseas and sometimes you look down and have no idea what you're flying over? the may lasch i can't shootdown raises new focus on airline roots. chairman of the national transportation safety board will be here to explain. it was one small step for man but what a giant leap into history we made with the moon landing and now we mark a major milestone. >> [guy] i know what you're thinking- you're thinking beneful. [announcer]beneful has wholesome grains,real beef,even accents of

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this weekend marks an historic event for our country. 45 years ago this sunday, apollo 11 was able to put the first man on the moon. that destiny was reached on july 20, 1969 as neil armstrong took

that famous first step on to the surface of the moon followed by buzz aldrin. michael collins commanded the module. he gave up a disguise this weekend. >> what an achievement. thank you for joining us. >> the real story with gretchen starts now. alert because we're staying on top of the unfolding situation in ukraine and the international fallout over the shooting down of airlines flight 17. happy friday to you. i'm grep en carlson. welcome to the real story. >> the wreckage and the bodies now. 298 people dead, at least three infants. the president and united nations ambassadors, both saying that the plane went down by a surface-to-air missile fired i -- fired by pro russian separatists. >> it's unlikely that the separatists could effectively operate without assistance from knowledgeable