later they don't. thanks for watching us again tonight. ms. megyn warming up in the bullpen. i'm bill o'reilly, remember the spin stops here. we're deferently looking out for you. breaking tonight, reports that a second american has been killed overseas after joining the fight alongside the terror army known as isis. welcome to "the kelly file." isis has an estimated 5,000 foreign fighters in its ranks altogether. and while some reports suggest there could be 140 or so americans among them, other estimates put that number at more than that. in fact, closer to 300. and even that may be too low. just yesterday we learned about this man, a u.s. citizen raised in minnesota killed on the battlefield after joining up with isis. today the state department said it could not confirm the report

of this second american being killed. over at the white house the administration suggested that the issue of americans and other westerners joining the ranks of this terror group poses a serious risk. >> there are thousands of foreign fighters from more than 50 countries or up to 50 countries who have traveled to syria to take up arms alongside isil. we are very concerned about the risk that those individuals pose to the 50 countries from which they traveled. in many cases these are individuals that have western passports. they have some freedom of movement in our modern transportation system. and we are working cooperatively with interpol and other law enforcement agencies as well as the homeland security agencies in countries throughout the west and in the region to try to monitor the movement of these individuals and to mitigate the threat that they may face. >> our chief intelligence correspondent kathrine herridge is live for us tonight in washington. >> megyn, tonight a senior law

enforcement official tells fox news they are actively investigating reports that a second american was killed over the weekend fighting for isis in the same shootout that killed 33-year-old douglas mccain based on social media reporting and other intelligence. the story broke as the state department briefing was underway today. >> i've seen those reports. we're looking into it. but we don't have any independent confirmation at this point in time. >> the reporting of a second dead american fighting alongside isis comes from the free syrian army, the same group to tell reporters about mccain by posting photos of his passport and dead body. these images were provided to fox news courtesy of the middle east media institute. mccain was friends, went to high school with another convert to radical islam who was killed fighting with extremists in somalia in 2009. earlier this year a suicide bomber from florida destroyed his american passport by setting it on fire as part of a farewell

and martyr dom video before driving a truck with 16 tons of explosives into a restaurant used by syrian government forces. the nation's top counterterrorism official recently told reporters he believed that at least 12,000 fighters from at least 50 countries are in syria and iraq. and a significant number, as many as 3,000, have passports that would allow them to travel to the united states without a visa, megyn. >> those numbers are huge. thank you. >> you're welcome. joining me now lieutenant colonel oliver north, host of war stories and author of the book "counterfeit lies." colonel, good to see you tonight. more and more we're seeing perhaps hundreds of americans going over to fight with isis as there are reports tonight the white house is asking the president is for a plan on what to do about this by the end of the week. >> hopefully the lesson learned at the white house, megyn, particularly given what cathrine just spoke of, doing nothing or

taking too long to act has terrible consequences. doing nothing to get a status of forces agreement with maliki was the beginning of the end for iraq. when all u.s. forces were withdrawn in december 2011, the sunnis and the kurds who were our allies and eyes and ears in iraq were abandoned. maliki turned east and became a shiite trap for iran. >> they exploited the vacuum. >> exactly. >> they went over, amassed forces in syria, they came back to iraq. they had a systematic plan to take out the opposition which they've executed now, they've reclaimed fallujah, they reclaimed mosul. and now we're dealing with a caliphate, with an islamic state. and the question is whether we should have seen it coming. because there's a west point report out tonight, you know the administration's all over the board about, well, are they a threat to the homeland and how bad are they? and the president said they were jayvee. west point we can trust because

they don't answer to anybody politically. they have concluded this group was growing in threat for the past four years and the administration knew it. >> isil had four years of safe havens and sophisticated training planning and building an intelligence network in iraq from syria. in 2013 he started his soldiers harvest campaign of assassinating iraqi soldiers, government officials and the secular sunnis who worked with the u.s. since 2006. what you're now seeing is he's attracting jihadis from all over the planet. and as many as 12,000 foreign jihadists are now among them 1,500 brits and maybe as many as 300 americans who are fighting there. all of whom could come back here. this administration has got to act. and they've got to act quickly. they cannot take months to plan this. the options are factually time is not our ally, the u.s. failed to support the kurds. now the iranians are doing so. >> we haven't acted in several instances that appears to have created a vacuum according to

the experts which our terrorist enemies have been and continue to exploit. but the question tonight, oli, is what can we do? because some military analysts are saying, you know what, air strikes over syria is not going to be enough. we've got all these different factions out there. some of which are aligned with us, some of which aren't. air strikes aren't going to work because there's too many to choose from. we need boots on the ground. is that going to happen? >> air strikes are not enough, but he needs to send a carrier battle strike group to the mediterranean and start talking to western leaders about a coalition. not just albania. he's got to get congress engaged. stop saying what we won't do and act. on the way hire a c.i. director focus on human intelligence. take out the isil high value targets, the command, communication nodes, logistic sites, training centers, make it harder for them to send people back from iraq and syria. we're going to blow up car bombs here in the united states. >> you got to get the isis command. >> you got it.

>> oli, good to see you. colonel north, all the best. >> thank you. as we mentioned a moment ago fox news obtained advance copy of report today from the center of combatting terrorism at west point. while some of these administrations have said isis burst on to the scene in the last few months, this new report shows a long trail of warning signs saying, "isil did not suddenly become effective in early june 2014. it had been steadily strengthening and actively shaping the future operating environment for four years. congressman mike rodgers is chairman of the house intel committee. he's with me now. mr. chairman, is it the case, was the intel community warning of the white house that this group was growing in its threat? >> oh, clearly. this has been going on for years. we watched a pooling of these jihadists in eastern syria and then establish a safe haven. and remember when they were first operating in syria the isis group as we know it today, it was an al qaeda affiliate. so the other al qaeda group

there was and is still associated with al qaeda, but they had a split. and this group took on a different name. >> but now what the administration's telling us after first last week there was a terrifying press conference held by chuck hagel, our defense secretary, and general dempsey, chairman of the joint chiefs saying it's an immediate threat to the homeland in virtually every way. and then something happened over the weekend and they came out this week saying it's a regional thing not to worry. but now we're thinking about bombing syria. so you tell the viewers what is the truth. >> the truth is that isis is a growing threat to the united states. you heard oliver north talk about some of the numbers. but don't forget about canada. they believe that there may be as many as 500 canadians fighting. and you're just a car ride away from driving across that border and doing something to the united states. and, you know, countries like morocco think they have 1,200. i think these numbers are low. part of the problem is these folks are going with western passport who is are going for

jihad. they're flying to separate countries and working their way into syria. so we don't really know all of the individuals that are there. that's what's so alarming about this. >> how are we going to take care of is this? because the report out today from our own james rosen reported top aides to president obama expect that president obama's second term will end without the united states defeating isis. it sounds like they're declaring defeat before we've even engaged in the battle. >> well, you know, we've seen this movie before unfortunately. when syria was starting to go, our arab league partners were calling the united states, they came here, they sent leaders here, they asked congress, they asked the white house, hey, we need some help here. we don't need, you know, the 141st airborne division, we need intelligence, we need logistics, we need help in command and control. we need your leadership at the table and we think we can handle this. and the white house really turned their back on those conversations. and the longer it went, the worse it got. so our fear here is that this

notion if we just don't do anything everything is going to be okay is going to continue. this is as dangerous a threat matrix as i have ever seen in my time on the intel committee, which is about ten years, megyn. it is serious. we need to address it. and it's not just here, it's other places as well. but the syria and iraq portion of this present a new and unique opportunity for some really bad people to get back into europe, to get back to the united states in a way that we hadn't seen before. >> that is a chilling assessment, mr. chairman. thank you for being here. well, this terror army is still holding several american hostages. and now the mother of one of them has shared a compelling message. >> i ask you to please release my child. i ask you to use your authority to spare his life. >> that is part of her plan for saving her son. up next, we'll look at the latest plan from washington. and before you make any decisions about right and wrong in the police shooting of

michael brown, judge alex farer wants you to see this tape. and we warn you it is disturbing. and breaking news tonight involving lois lerner and new claims about which evidence was destroyed and which was not. we've got new news on this fo

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be merciful. i ask you to please release my child. i ask you to use your authority to spare his life. >> that was the mother of steven sotloff, an american journalist currently held by the terror group isis. today she released that video pleading with the group and with president obama to spare the life of her son. the question at the white house, what is the plan? chief white house correspondent ed henry live for us tonight. ed. >> megyn, they're still looking for a plan even though there's more chaos tonight in syria. the syrian rebels who are supposed to be sort of the moderate good guys actually work with an al qaeda linked group to seize a crossing, a frontier crossing with israel on the golan heights. we're told it's a symbolic move but could draw into this brutal war. all of this happening of course as isis militants continue to

gain strength in iraq and syria. john mccain demanding the president come up with that plan you're talking about to defeat isis, not just contain them. something i pressed josh earnest about. listen. what is the strategy? for the president to say we're going to root out the cancer, that's more of a slogan than strategy, isn't it? >> well, i -- >> what does that mean? root out the cancer? how? >> well, i think as i mentioned and answer to roger's question, the president has laid out a strategy to deal with the threat posed by isil. >> he went onto say that might include diplomat moves. he might actually be pulling back rethinking all of this and seeing whether there are some diplomatic ways out here. friday he's going to take the time out from these deliberations. the white house says he's going to rhode island for democratic fund raising. >> what? >> fund raising on friday. and with house democrats. and so the optics he got beat up

on over playing golf during vacation, went back and forth on that, clearly he doesn't care about the criticism. he's going to be fund raising on friday. >> ed, thank you. joining me now to react, marc thiess thiessen. really? he's going to take a time out from all the work he's been doing in the vineyard to go do some fund raising while we consider whether we need to bomb syria and perhaps put boots on the ground? >> maybe it was a golf fundraiser that would complete the circle for him. it's just absurd. what josh earnest said at that podium is just a complete fabrication. the idea that he has a comprehensive plan to defeat isis. just a week ago president obama was saying it's not his responsibility to defeat isis. he says we're not the iraqi army, we're not the iraqi air force. they have to take care of it. now we have a comprehensive strategy to deal with it. i don't know where these people come wup this stuff. >> he also said isis claim is just claiming it's at war with

the united states and in fact this is a regional problem and it should be a coalition of the willing who deals with it. >> yeah. you know, a couple things. one, it's just a regional problem and they're not really interested in hitting us, that's what they said about al qaeda in the arabian peninsula in 2009 before they sent the underwear bomber to blow up a plane over detroit. that wasn't a stop terrorist attack, that was a failed terrorist attack. the bomb malfunctioned. as far as not being at war with them, they have said they're at war with us. the leader of al qaeda -- of isis has said to my message to the americans is we are going to be in direct confrontation. the sons of islam have prepared for this day. i don't know how he could be clearer than that. in 1990s in the clinton administration al qaeda declared war on the united states, we ignored it and the result wz 9/11. and it looks like history is repeating itself. >> do you believe, marc, that this president is prepare today go into syria? they say they're trying to get together a coalition including many in the region from jordan,

qatar, saudi arabia, turkey, so far britain and australia the only ones that have signed on. thanks for that, jordan. >> yeah. this isn't the first time i've heard the president indicate he might take military action in syria and not follow through. so i'll believe it when i see it. i think this is a president who -- i hope he does something because you cannot deal with this isis threat unless you take out their command and control in syria. >> and that was said by general martin dempsey. that's not marc thiessen. i got to go, marc, thank you. >> thanks, megyn. >> also with us tonight, a democratic strategist and former advisor to senator harry reed. can i start with that, penny? what's he doing going to a fundraiser when we're weighing on whether we're going to bomb syria. >> you know the -- always travels with the president -- >> stop that. >> i would say -- let me finish. i would just say you're right, the optics aren't good.

>> it's not the optics, it's the actual behavior. get back and start governing. americans could die. they could die in executing those strikes. if they're not effective, they could die back here on attack on the homeland or interests elsewhere. what's he doing? >> megyn, as i was trying to say, i agree with you. and i do think that the president can and should be able to -- should stay and actually have the optics. and do the hard meetings that he is doing right now. what we don't know, what you and i don't know, is those hard conversations that are being taken place that he is asking the tough questions that need to be -- >> i believe you that he's doing that. i'm just saying -- >> does he have the right strategy? >> penny, i'm not suggesting he isn't having those meetings. but i think it may be a multi-day affair. i think he should spend maybe more than just a few days on it because he's been on vacation all these weeks and should spend friday avoiding the democratic fundraiser and deciding whether it's worth the risk to american lives to send our military over syria. but let's get to the question

about isis and whether he does in fact have a comprehensive strategy. because you know there are many in this country tonight who believe, no, no more american lives in this region. syria's a hot mess. isis according to the administration this week is a regional problem and we don't want to expend anymore blood and treasure over there. >> and what the president is trying to do is make sure he can isolate and take out isis without alienating the entire muslim arab region. so he doesn't want to antagonize it so we have the entire muslim world against us. >> it's too late for that. >> no. but you can't go -- you cannot go into syria as a sovereign nation and just decide to go ahead and bomb them. you want to have a coalition of those arab states around you. otherwise they're going to bring a whole war on you that you didn't want to invite. instead of just isolating isis -- >> where's the coalition? >> i think the conversations are

being had. and hopefully our arab neighbors who have dismissed or who have called out isis and saying they themselves find it in their behavior so egregious. saudi arabia, jordan, others, we are asking them to step up. and i hope that they do. >> the problem is syria's so complex and very different factions, they don't want to be involved. thanks for being here. >> and christians hunted down by these terrorists in the middle east. and before you make up your mind about the shooting of 18-year-old michael brown in ferguson, missouri, we have an ferguson, missouri, we have an eye opening look at we are born makers. so we went the extra mile, and made a car that does the same. ferguson, missouri, we have an eye opening look at the all-new chrysler 200. america's import tm if you're suffering from constipation or irregularity, powders may take days to work.

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we have new reporting tonight on what is happening to christians in the middle east.

some of those who managed to escape this terror group are now sharing stories about being told to convert to islam or expect to die. we keep hearing that over and over. tony perkins is president of the family research council. he has been helping us track this. and the latest stories are no better than l earlier ones, tony. >> megyn, it's hard to imagine the brutal savagery -- how savage these individuals are with isis. i was in the middle east last week, i was in israel, spoke to some of those who had come out of iraq. and the stories in some cases are worse than what we had heard. and this really goes unchecked. but here's a real bad problem that we are not getting a handle on, and that is the humanitarian crisis that's unfolding there as literally tens of thousands of christians and other religious minorities have fled their communities. many of them in irbil. we've had places like irbil where the population has literally doubled. the infrastructure not able to handle it. and i was talking with relief

workers as late as today still no presence of the united states there on the ground in the relief effort. so this is a huge problem that's in the making in addition to the security issues that you've been talking about already. >> the numbers are staggering. reportedly christians are believed to have numbered in about 1.5 million when we began our invasion in iraq in 2003. and current estimates put the number between 00,000 and 400,000 and many of those forced out just in recent weeks by this terror group. are we looking at right now the end of christianity in a region of the world where they have been for a thousand years? >> from the beginning. from the beginning. two of jesus' own disciples toot gospel to this region of the world. it is the longest continuous population of christians. and, yes, that is what's the potential. three weeks ago almost to the day the iraqi parliament described this and passed a

resolution for what it is, genocide, calling on the international community to do the same and to stop it. and yet our president and his atrocities board has a hard time bringing themselves to the point to describing this for what it is. it is genocide. it is -- this is a crime against humanity. the reason is that will then require us to do something about it other than these isolated efforts, you know, when we went to the yazidis and said we were going to prevent genocide. genocide's already happening. isis has made very clear what they want to do. they want to eradicate everybody that does not march to the beat of their drum. >> it's really terrifying. when you see the archbishop of canter bury coming out saying the slaughter is "off the scale of human horror." and you have to wonder what's -- what does the future look like for them. tony, thank you. >> all right, megyn, thank you. we also have breaking news in the irs targeting

investigation tonight. and new claims about what evidence was destroyed and what was not. that's right after this break. don't miss this. plus, for nearly two weeks the city of ferguson, missouri, struggled to keep the peace. now it is getting hit by a $200 million lawsuit in connection with that behavior. the mayor of ferguson is here to respond. when folks think about what they get from alaska, they think salmon and energy. but the energy bp produces up here creates something else as well: jobs all over america. engineering and innovation jobs. advanced safety systems & technology. shipping and manufacturing. across the united states, bp supports more than a quarter million jobs. when we set up operation in one part of the country, people in other parts go to work. that's not a coincidence. it's one more part of our commitment to america.

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this is how it feels to hotwire. ♪ virtually all your important legal matters in just minutes. now it's quicker and easier for you to start your business, protect your family, and launch your dreams. at legalzoom.com we put the law on your side. from the world headquarters of fox news, it's "the kelly file" with megyn kelly. >> new development tonight in the irs targeting scandal. a lawsuit uncovering some crucial evidence from the woman at the heart of the scandal may have been destroyed after the investigation began. in february 2012 the house oversight committee started looking into these targeting claims.

months later in june 2012 lois lerner's blackberry was wiped clean. but wait, she was under investigation. why did that happen? tom, the president of judicial watch, his group's lawsuit against the irs uncovered this new information. so while she knew, we presume, she was under investigation, she wiped her blackberry clean and must have known by that time she was having major hard drive problems. >> well, exactly. and congress is sniffing around, so that issue is live. the only reason we know this information is because a federal court judge forced it out of the irs. he wanted an explanation, they gave him a joke of an explanation. and on his own he said give me more information. are there other devices she used like blackberries or ipads? they said, yeah, there was this blackberry. and they admitted just recently it was erased and people put it together with the timing of congressional investigations and the fact other e-mails disappeared. there's no explanation as to why

that blackberry was scrubbed. so, again, raises more questions about the irs's own willingness to be forthcoming. >> let's turn the page because you also made news this week by claiming that your lawyers in this case spoke with doj lawyers on friday and that doj lawyers made an admission to your lawyers that in fact there are backup tapes that would hold the so-called missing lois lerner e-mails, the ones that were lost when her hard drive melted down. and that those backup tapes have been available all along. the doj now denies that. they claim you've got your facts wrong. how do you respond? >> well, they told us there was a system for backups in case of catastrophe. and e-mails were potentially available on these tapes or backup systems. but it was too onerous for them to search them. so they don't disagree with us that there were backup tapes. they're disagreeing with us as to whether this is new information. and it is new information. we asked them to supplement the record to the court because the court wants to know about this

information. there are two court orders asking the irs directly for information about where lois lerner's e-mails are. they haven't told the court yet. we asked the irs, are you going to tell the court about this new backup system, whatever it is you call it? and they said no. >> they've come out and said this, because it's sort of an interesting denial. there was no new backup system described last week to judicial watch. we simply referred to the same e-mail retention policy we've described all along. so they are emphasizing this was not a new backup system that was revealed to you. >> they talked about a catastrophic backup system not only for the irs but it was clear they were government wide. they could access it, but they did not want to. so whether they call it new or old is inconsequential because the court wanted details on these backup systems because that's where the lois lerner

e-mails may be. they didn't tell the court, and they still refuse to tell the court. they don't want to supplement the record. so we're happy to have this discussion in federal court before judge sullivan. i don't understand why the irs didn't tell the court this. this is just one long -- one example in a long string of obstruction frankly in dishonesty by this agency and a cover-up of the irs abuse. >> tom, thank you. for more joined by julian epsteen ceo of lmg. julian, any of those strike you as problematic? wiping the blackberry when they knew they were under investigation? >> maybe only a little bit. but i think there are some important facts tom didn't discuss. in february of 2012 lois lerner got a new blackberry. which is very common. you exchange old blackberries for new blackberrieblackberries. she got a new blackberry in february 2012. several months later the irs

swiped that blackberry, which is again standard operating procedure. >> but it's different when you know you're under congressional investigation. the wiping that happens here at fox news when i need a new blackber blackberry, it would be different if i received a letter from jim jordan saying you're under investigation. >> that's very reasonable, except blackberries at the irs are synced with your computers. at the time we're talking about where she's exchanging an old blackberry for a new blackberry, her computer was working perfectly well. so the e-mails during that period of time are perfectly well preserved on her existing computer. somebody could make the case skprks here's what -- if tom were to make a criticism that i think would be valid, he didn't make this, i would help him out if he wanted to make a criticism, he could say the old blackberry turned in in february 2012, perhaps that could have had some forensics that were useful in trying to get some of the e-mails that were lost from

the computer in 2010. >> the impression i get from him this is coming out in dribs and drabs. this is a federal court judge saying, look, be forthright, you have an obligation as an officer of the court, do not make me beg for it, tell me whether you're been forthcoming cht doesn't sound like judge sullivan is impressed with the irs's disclosures. >> again, i'm not sure about his state of mind about this, but i will say that the policy of swiping old blackberries for new blackberries is a policy. it's a written policy. there's nothing unusual about that. that's common in agencies. >> why didn't they volunteer there was a blackberry when they were probing as to what devices might have the e-mail sns why did the judge have to ask for it and then be told actually it was wiped after she knew she was under investigation? >> i think it's a perfectly reasonable question, megyn. i think to the extent that lerner and the irs were not more candid about that or upfront,

they should have been. i think at the same time in their defense everybody knows everyone in the agency is carrying blackberries. everybody knows they're synced with computers. >> i like typing on it. i got my iphone for pictures of my kids and then the typing. >> i like the voice on iphone. >> i got to go -- >> no one has said any of the information on the swiped blackberry was lost. >> i got it. >> nobody's ever said anybody of the obama administration -- >> julian, good seeing you again. visit with you again soon. deadly force in the shooting death of 18-year-old michael brown as we share a disturbing video of a police officer and suspect and how quickly things can go very wrong. an interesting perspective on this from judge alex ferer next. and asked for less. there's a reason it's called an "all you can eat" buffet... and not a "have just a little" buffet.

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well, in the nearly three weeks since 18-year-old michael brown was shot and killed by police in ferguson, missouri, we have heard brown's supporters repeatedly ask how can an officer feel so threatened by an unarmed man that he had to shoot him six times? perhaps more, six bullets landed in michael brown. consider the argument in this videotape of a violent confrontation of an officer and a suspect.

we warn you, this tape is disturbing. the officer lived. >> daddy! >> just get in the car. baby, i can't go to jail. >> i can't go to jail. host of the nationally syndicated show "judge alex," a former police officer and retired circuit court judge. this bears no relation in the michael brown case. we have no idea michael brown did anything like that. but your point as a former cop is that police officers have a different mindset when they go out on the job than the rest of us and when they confront somebody who's a potential suspect. >> absolutely, megyn. police officers are taught from day one in the police academy to be wary of suspects of persons

they're dealing with in public because like in this particular case that you saw that woman pulled that gentleman over for speeding, turns out he was on parole and he didn't want to go back to jail. she had no way of knowing that and it could have led to her death. at the end of the tape after he brutally, brutally beats her, he reaches down to where her gun would be. i don't know if he was trying to pull her gun out or not, but that's certainly one possibility. when people say to me how can a police officer justify shooting an unarmed person, my response is usually unarmed people can kill police officers just like armed people can. all they have to do is get the gun away from the officer. sometimes that's even easier. >> i got that. >> the officer's not going to draw. >> and obviously the second tragedy in the video clip is the man's young daughter watching it and pleading with him is horrifying. by the way, he's in jail. but the case in michael brown in ferguson, missouri, has michael brown by all witness accounts 35 feet away from the officer. i haven't heard one witness say

that he wasn't running away from the officer. then there's a dispute about whether he turned around and started to come back at the officer. but it seems he was running away at least when the first bullets were fired. that's how it seems right now. there's an asterisk until we hear the cop's story. how can you justify shooting a suspect who's running away? >> well, first of all, let me make it clear, i'm not here to justify anything. seems like every time i take a position -- >> legally i'd like to know the law. >> one side or the other takes offense with it. legally the law used to be that police officers could shoot any fleeing suspect. and that was changed under tennessee versus garner in '85 to require that it be a suspect who was involved in a crime or that the officer reasonably believed or has probable cause to believe was involved in a crime where there was violence or threat of violence, possible serious injury. >> so if michael brown had punched the police officer in

his patrol car and the gun went off and then he ran away, would that justify the officer potentially? because that would have been a crime to assault a police officer. >> yes. and more than that there's an allegation that they fought for the gun in the car, that he was trying to take the gun away from him. again, we don't know any of that to be true. that may be totally made up. but if you look at those facts, and those facts are later on proven to exist or presented to the jury under tennessee versus garner that would satisfy a police officer shooting at a fleeing felon. missouri law actually is broader than that. but that would make missouri law unconstitutional and they have to be held to the standard of tennessee versus garner. >> even six bullets into michael brown and perhaps as many as ten or more shots fired? >> well, every detail is going to have to be looked at to find out whether force is justified. if the officer needs to use deadly force until the person goes down and it takes six rounds or ten rounds fired, that would be justifiable. but just as easily if the individual turns around and puts his hands up, that's it.

the officer's not justified from that point on firing another round. and he should be prosecuted for that. >> another question some viewers have been asking me. they want to know whether michael brown had a juvenile arrest record and whether that will be accessible. this is from the viewers who are wondering about whether that's -- because there's a lawsuit actually right now trying to get at that. do people have the right to see that? >> no. they don't have a right to see that. missouri law protects juvenile records. the only time it would come in as if for example michael brown committed a crime and needed for the presentence investigation report or relevant to that crime. in this case it really would not come in at all because it's very difficult to get a victim ice prior record assuming there were any crimes of violence. and as far as we know michael brown had no priors. assuming any prior crimes of violence, the police officer would have to know about it in order for it to be the actions that he took. >> right. otherwise just putting it in evidence to show this is a bad person, which is not okay to do.

>> and let me say one more thing. just because tennessee versus garner case or law in the united states allows a police officer to shoot a fleeing felon, doesn't mean i think it's a good idea to do that. i'm just saying that they have broad authority in taking people into custody. >> i mean, if it's true he turned around and started going back after the officer, as some claim, then that's one thing. but, you know, if he was shooting him as he's running away from the danger, the incident at the car is over and he's running away. >> right. >> and the incident should be over but for an arrest and that creates all sorts of legal questions. judge, great to see you. thank you, sir. >> thank you. for nearly two weeks law enforcement in ferguson, missouri, was locked in street battles with protesters. and now ferguson may pay a very big price for that. the mayor's next. (radio noise) (phone ringing) what's up jake? that depends man, what are you doing? just cruising around in my new ride. oh, the one i'm not suppose to touch, right? you got it.

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new developments tonight from ferguson, missouri. for nearly two weeks law enforcement there were locked in street battles with some violent protesters. and tonight we are told the city is facing a $200 million lawsuit as a result. joining me now ferguson, missouri mayor james knowles. good to see you tonight. now we are told that the black lawyers for justice, tomorrow we understand, will be filing a $200 million class action on behalf of the protesters against you, the ferguson police and some others in your town in connection with those protests. your reaction. >> well, i think the lawsuit is addressing the issue of the use of force on the protesters and some of the allegations made as far as the types of weaponry that was used, the concern about the militarization of the police

department. none of that really had anything to do with the city of ferguson because our police department does not have that equipment. we're not armed with that equipment. and so, you know, there's a lot of misconceptions from day one about who was using this equipment on the protesters and on the rioters. >> so the response is it wasn't us. >> i'm not concerned that -- right. i'm not concerned because it wasn't that. >> okay. let's move on. second point, now there are reports out today the st. louis county executive has raised the idea of a federal bailout for ferguson businesses. and has actually met with u.s. senator roy blunt of missouri to discuss the disbursement of federal aid to the ferguson businesses that suffered. now, with all due respect to your town and the businesses that suffered as a result of the looting and protesting and so on, why is that the problem of the american taxpayer? >> well, actually, right now the regional business council, the st. louis economic development partnership and other regional business leaders have pledged money and raised money to help

these businesses get back on their feet. >> okay. a million bucks. >> yeah. we have a lot of people in the st. louis region committed to helping these businesses get back on their feet. we're not sure where we're going to be at as far as the total loss, but right now people in st. louis are stepping up. and they very much appreciate that. >> but do you think the feds or the american taxpayers should step in to make up the difference? >> i'm not sure that there's going to be a difference yet. i think i'm going to withhold judgment -- >> but why should they? why should viewers in florida or out there in wyoming have to pay for what we saw happen in ferguson with the looting and the businesses that lost money? >> well, i mean, clearly -- i will say it again. this issue didn't start in ferguson. there's a lot of concerns and a lot of frustrations, i think, that have been expressed across the country. so i can understand the ask where they think maybe this is much larger issue than the city of ferguson. but i'm not asking for that yet.

>> i got it. it's not you. last question for you. so missouri state senator, a democrat from st. louis, once again she doubled down on her earlier threat of the rioting that will happen if the county prosecutor is not removed. this time she's warning the governor. is this appropriate? >> it's not anything i would expect out of an elected official. we're all in this together. the st. louis region is in this together. the state of missouri. this is tough on all of us. and so i would hope that as we suggest this, as we see the process play out, we'd be trying to work together in a positive manner and not try to create more concerns of unrest. >> mr. mayor, only 20 seconds left, but seems like things have calmed down in the city. is it true? >> yes, absolutely. much has calmed down since the press has left. so much of the city's getting back to normal. and our citizens are relieved

for that. >> point taken. thank you, sir. good to see you. >> thank you. >> we'll be right back. plus, "hannity" at the top of the hour. . >> under the islamic state >> under the islamic state people would not be doing this [ female announcer ] we help make secure financial tomorrows a reality for over 19 million people. [ susan ] my promotion allowed me to start investing for my retirement. transamerica made it easy. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. transamerica. transform tomorrow. we think they're the best-fitting pants in fashion. with technology that slims and shapes and five-pocket styling. they'll be the star of your wardrobe. chico's so slimming peyton pants. we're famous for our legs. at chico's and chicos.com.

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tune in tomorrow night or set your dvr, but you should just have a season pass for "the kelly file" by the way. we're going to have general jack keane and also former governor mike huckabee on whether the

u.s. is about to ramp up this fight against isis and whether we should. in the meantime go to facebook.com/thekellyfile. follow me on twitter. let me know what you think of tonight's show. we're always reading, esp this time of night. thanks for watching. i'm megyn kelly. see you tomorrow. welcome to "hannity." this is a fox news alert. isis militants are demanding $6.6 million for the release of another american hostage that they are holding captive. now, this hostage has been identified as a 26-year-old woman who was kidnapped one year ago while doing humanitarian relief work in syria. now, this comes after news broke last night that 33-year-old douglas mcarthur mccain was killed while fighting for isis over the weekend. we turn to conor powell standing by tonight in jerusalem. conor. >> reporter: sean, it's estimated there are more than 12,000 foreign fighters like mccain in syria and iraq right now. u.s. intelligence officials say they'r