final start of the season. don't feel too badly, though. his base salaries still $8 million. >> thank you for being part of "the real story." i appreciate it. i'm gretchen carlson, now to shep. >> who are we supposed to trust? a trip kick warning from the prime minister of iraq. one that no high-level united states official confirmed. the prime minister said terrorist are set to trying subways here in the united states and in france. who do you trust? plus the fbi director now claims to know how many americans are fighting with the terrorists in iraq and syria, but does he know who they are? at any moment police in virginia expected to hold a news conference on the missing student hannah graham, come days after the arrest of the prime suspect, or the person of interest, at least. let's get to it.

>> good thursday afternoon from the fox news deck. first from fox today, we're expecting president obama to announce this afternoon that our attorney general, eric holder, is stepping down. he said he would likely leave sometime later this year. we just didn't know when. now we do. holder is the fourth longer serving attorney general in u.s. history and now folks view his -- now how folks view his legacy could have a lot to do with their political views. imagine that. at as the nation's first african-american attorney general, holder pushed policies aimed at equality for minorities. this week, secretary holder announces the federal prison population dropped fory the fit time in three decades. last month, attorney general holder launched a federal investigation into the police shooting of an unarmed black man in ferguson, missouri. he also supported marriage

equality and championed legal rights for gay couples. but attorney general holder's legacy also includes controversy inch his first year on the job he angered critics by planning to try the 9/11 suspects in federal court in new york instead of at guantanamo bay. the proof is in the pudding. trials in federal courts have moved along with convictions while they have languished at goon. in 2012, the republican-led house voted to hold eric holder in contempt of congress over his handling of the fast and furious gun-running scandal. nothing ever came of that. judge napolitano calls it something less than a footnote. last year, attorney general holder reportedly signed off on plans to newspaper on journalists, including james rosen, of fox news channel, as part of a leak investigation. at one standpoint some 40 republicans in congress signed a letter calling for the attorney general to resign. still, he defied repeated calls to step down, instead announcing it now as if making a point of

leaving on his own terms. wendell, reaction across d.c. depends on whether you're red or blue. >> pretty much split along party lines. eric holder was a lightning rod for the president'siics. the justice department is supposed to be independent but was not independent enough for some conservatives. with holder and mr. obama on the same page on gay marriage, and voter suppression, and holder'sq name a special prosecutor to look into the irs's targeting of tea party groups that applied for tax exempt status. john cornyn said today, quote, the american people, myself included, lost confidence in the attorney general's ability to lead a long time ago because of his continued willingness to put politics before the law. wade henderson said holder presided over one of the most forward thinking justice departments in memory. a lot of folks mentioned at

possible successors. depaul patrick, who says the job is not for him. and former white house council katherine, and former home lean security secretary janet napolitano, and california attorney general, harris, who would be the first african-american woman attorney general. >> the attorney general has been a champion for equal rights, equal rights for people because of their race, sexual orientation, and his critics have taken shots along the line. >> specially on the racial issue. holder says it was an issue with them. less than a month after he took office, at an african-american history month speech in february 2009 he was criticized for his talk on race relations. >> though this nation has proudly thought of itself as a ethnic melting pot, in things

racial we have always been and we, i believe, continue to be in too many ways essentially a nation of cowards. >> now, conservatives were offended by that. insisting that president obama's election as president showed the nation moved on. holder disagreed and as recently as april said that race factor in conservative attacks on him and the president. >> wendell good, to see you, thank you. let's turn to doug lace brinkley, presidential historian, professor at history at rice university. he was lightning÷ rod, and has been a lightning rod, and i guess in mean ways the president should be thankful for that. he took lot of heat for this president. >> he did. he was the closest personal friend that barack obama had in his administration. they're very tight. this is clear lay loss for the president. but you know, attorney generals

get hammered all the time. janet reno, and john ashcroft angering feminists groups. so it's a tough position at attorney general. he has been controversial, eric holder, but is quitting on his own terms and has been a survivor. >> i wonder if people flash back in the way i did when you read the list of names, attorney& janet reno. eric holder hayes been the target of so many for so long. i didn't go to ferguson, missouri, but i watched it very closely, and the reaction and the change when he got there, african-americans seem to trust him in a way maybe they couldn't find trust before, and that seems to be worthwhile for this nation. >> well, i think you nailed it. that's the big thing eric holder will be remembered for. he is leave and going into the

private sector with 195% of african-americans supporting him. he went to ferguson and said i'm not just an attorney general. i'm a black person, too and i've felt discrimination in any life and been stopped by people and asked for my i.d. because of the color of my skin. he has been somebody who has been a warrior on the issue of civil rights, going to be seen as very proud figure in african-american history. >> for most it's difficult to know how history might look at something because we're so close to it, we can't see it. the forest for the trees comes to mine. can you back up far enough to let us now how history might reflect on this man? >> a middling reputation. not the drama of bobby kennedy during the cuban missile crisis, and there have been some great mistakes on holder's watch. clearly the releasing of five taliban$e prisoners from guantanamo and only getting one american back in return was kind

of a suspect deal. there's controversial controversy about allowing the authority, president obama dealing with the immigration issue. i don't think there was personal corruption and there was the cost with him. sometimes that's the most we can hope in this very partisan climate. have somebody who is competent at his job. low mark is rosen, this idea of looking at the telephone records of journalists and all of that, what that entailed. i thought is going to be a black mark on his tenure as attorney general. >> no doubt. nye to see you. thank you. >> thank you. >> take you over a wall street now where the dow is in an absolute nosedive. looking at the big board. we're down 1.38%. 238 points. i'll walk into that shot and show you something. this is a tech matter.

apple, its new operating system for the iphone and in the iphone 6 and iphone 6 plus, the ios8.0.1? that was a problem. they pulled it back and the market is reacting. they have a new look, the dow. it's just a different font, different way of doing it, a little more swoopy. but it's got a chink in the armor today because this green never happens. we don't know why that is there. this is generated from wall street. that is a glitch. this is not, though. this is sadly the real thing. we're down 237 on the session. we understand workers are trying to fix this but it's not quick. a volatile week. today is the fourth straight day of a triple digit move by the dow. a movement that make missouri for the traders so they're doing well. then the rest of us, three of the four days have been down. tech stocks bringing it down. apple off three percent coming after reported of the glitches with the software for the

iphone. my iphone 6 plus is awesome. vfy"uz breaking news. sources on the ground in yemen just told fox news that nonessential american personnel are right now being evacuated from the united states embassy in yemen's capital. we mentioned this yesterday. we were dancing around it when -- we're told it's a very delicate situation that the embassy does remain open. sources say that u.s. marines, the normal security at the embassy, are watching the area closely to see how the rebels there are going to treat the american embassy now that they control much of the security in that city. state department officials call it, a, quote, temporary reduction, unquote, in the number of personnel. they're evacuating personnel out of an abundance of caution as they put it. next details ton the terror warning from the iraqi prime minister, a warn that united states officials say it was news to them. the prime minister says his own

intelligence has uncovered a tos and something in new york city. how do you like the timing? iraqi government, do we trust you? here's a fact. that's an open question. we'll get reaction from the fbi and dig a little deeper. that's next. how much money do you have in your pocket right now? i have $40, $21. could something that small make an impact on something as big as your retirement? i don't think so. well if you start putting that towards your retirement every week and let it grow over time, for twenty to thirty years, that retirement challenge might not seem so big after all. ♪

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well, that new prime minister in iraq, blindside the united states government when he told record reporters isis terrorist are carrying out attacks on the subways in paris and new york, or at least here in the united states. the prime minister says he has credible information about this plot. he says the information comes from iraqi intelligence officials in baghdad, he says the attack is imminent. he just met with our president and didn't mention this, apparently. and u.s. intelligence officials and political leaders of all levels of government seem stunned by these claims. the fbi and other agencies report, of course, they're looking into it. they look into every credible accusation. for now they say they have absolutely no idea what the prime minister is talking about. it's worth noting the u.s. and france are the"a only western countries currently bombing militants in iraq, but right this second everybody is talking about sirarch not about -- about syria, not iraq, and the iraqi

prime minister needs help in iraq. i'm not saying he is making this up out bit possible he is making this up. >> that's what your saying, the dod, fbi, and state department, say they have no knowledge of the subway plot the iraqi prime minister told reporters about on the sidelines of the u.n. here's the statement from nantz excuse security council: we have not confirmed such a plot and would have to review information from our iraqi partners before making further determinations. we take any threat seriously and always work to corroboratek(q information we receive from our partners. the french became the first western ally to begin flight airstrikes in iraq in the past week. the british parliament votes tomorrow about whether to join the air campaign in iraq, neither has agreed to operate in syria as of yet. >> so there's not widespread panic no reason for panic no, leaders are saying we think this is about to happen. they're saying some new prime minister in iraq is saying this and we're telling you, stand

down. it's always dangerous -- life is dangerous now. we're also learning mow about airstrikes aft oil refineries in syria.r8 that's the money hub for these terrorists. >> that's right. in fact, they were earning about $2 million a day, we heard, from this oil -- the oil refining and the sale of these black market -- black market oil. most of the aircraft par tis pace in the planes were not american. saudis dropped bombs on oil facilities. u.s. planes dropped 18 bombs. the goal was to disrupt the estimated $2 million a day that isis earns from the black market oil sale. the before and after photographs provided by the pentagon today after the air strikes show how the pentagon hoped to remove isis from these sites but leave the infrastructure intact for later use. >> without obliterating the

refineries it was about degrading their able to use these refineries, then themselves, and so we're still assessing because 12 targets we have to assess. >> kirby announced that defense secretary signed deployment orders for 500 u.s. troops from the first infantry division, the army's big red one out of conditions. 200 of the troops goal to baghdaand irbil. 300 to centcom area of operations. >> jennifer griffin at the pentagon. thank you so much. some gruesome news from iraq's second biggest city. the united nation officials report isis terrorist kidnapped and murdered an ricky human rights lawyer. a public execution. it happened by firing squad on the streets of mosul. think of that. firing squad on the open street. this is mosul. according to officials at the gulf center for human right they say the lawyer worked for them. they tell us that maskedgun men

took the woman from her home after she posted facebook messages in which she criticized the militants' destruction of religious site. if it's not their mosque0# they'ring blowing them up. she says that's a bad thing to do, to blow up a religious site, and for that they executed herment the u.n. reports terrorist tried her in a sharia court and found her guilty of going against her -- their strict version of islamic law. savagely tortured her first for five long days. then sentenced her to pock execution, and the terrorist took over mosul in june, and is it the city of mosul, their second larger. look at the houses on top of each other. if you're a terrorist, don't you get into one of these that are right next to each other, right here, a martyr's park right here in the middle. the other side of the river, same thing. house after house after house. it's brooklyn style, close together.

it's compact urban dwelling. so if you start trying to take people out here -- yes, we have precision guided wins but what they would like to see happen is they would love to see civilian casualties which they can capture on the new iphones and put on the web here of children who are broken in half, by our allied forces6x weapons. that is what they would like to see. why? because that helps them recruit. anybody who tellsout the video o beheaded americans and fresh or french is not telling you the truth. it's how they're recruiting. if you're going to fight with a terrorist organization, you want to give we biggest and badest can ex-the ones who slit the throats. that's why they put it out there and do it to inflame us because they want news there. once we get in there we have to hit these things, and when we do, they'll have civilian casualties and then they'll put them on and it's a vicious circle. that's what is going to health it's happened over and over and over again.

history is our guide. now the radical cleric who appeared on fox news channel, defending the action the islamic state. he was arresting this morning in london. he appeared on the program, hannity, and child the islamic state does not torture or kill people. that reports like the one from mosul were a pack of lies, ludicrous and stupid and ridiculous just as he is. here's part of the interview. >> i think it was your own george bush you're with us or the terrorists. we're not with america so we must be with the terrorists -- injury so -- >> now you can answer my question. do you support isis telling christians in mosul, northern iraq, that they must convert to islam, pay a tax or die? what do you think of that? >> this is simply false. didn't happen. >> it felt like something off the dailyh) show. it felt like a fake repor

police in london say they have now arrested the cleric and others on suspension of supporting and encouraging terrorism. the arrest happened this morning, part of a sears of anti-terror raids. the obama administration reports more than 60 nations signed up to help take on the islamic state. who are the 60 nations? is it enough, what they're doing? we'll speck to the former ambassador with decades of experience. [guy] i know what you're thinking- you're thinking beneful. [announcer]beneful has wholesome grains,real beef,even accents of spinach,carrots and peas. [guy] you love it so much. yes you do. but it's good for you, too. [announcer] healthful. flavorful. beneful. from purina. i'm on expert on softball. and tea parties. i'll have more awkward conversations than i'm equipped for, because i'm raising two girls

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talk to your doctor and visit humira.com. it makes me happy to i like feeling smart. internet essentials from comcast has brought low-cost internet access to over 1.4 million low-income people at home. internet essentials helped me progress in my schoolwork. it helped my grades move higher. today it's the largest broadband adoption program in america. it helped me a lot. comcast. helping to bridge the digital divide. 24 minutes past the hour. more now on the u.s. led fight against the islamic state militants. president obama told the united nations more than 40 countries have joined our coalition, but the state department says the actual number is 62. the state department reports this includes nations which have

carried out or supported airstrikes, provided military equipment, and sent financial or human -- humanitarian aid. also, countries part of the coalition or have promised support but have not said how they plan to help. 62. as we reported the u.s. and france are the only western nations bombs, and for now, france has only hit targets in iraq. we are the only nation, outside of the arab nations, that have sun so inside syria. official says the uk and belgium and the netherlands may join soon and stick it to iraq, not syria. let's bring in a former ambassador to jordan, kuwait, and australia, and a deputy secretary in both the state and defense department. now a director of middle east. ambassador skip, as i'm told to youor, nice to see you. >> is no to be with you. >> this 62 number sounds silly. it's remarkable at very least

how much these ones act like the last ones who were in charge. >> honestly think there's a right -- >> there's a slight difference but slight is the right word, mr. ambassador. >> the slight here is that actually having five of the arab states flight planes in the air and bombing, that's a remarkable demonstration of regional concern. >> how do you see this playing -- how concerned are you that we're getting into a trap, that the people who cut the most powerful nation's in the world's citizens heads up and it it on the internet are drawing us in. >> you have point about the they do want to see independent people are killed so they can run them on the news. we're going to be very careful. you cannot do what we're / doi, which is bombing, and not kill

civilians by accident. not intentional. but they'll be there we have already seen it in syria, some fighters had their families in the sites we bombed. >> what can we do now as a nation to accomplish this goal of keeping them from doing what they're doing without drawing the world into a conflict that could frankly quickly spiral out of control? >> yes, and i guess -- i have been critical of the president in the way he does conduct some foreign policy inch this case i'm thinking he is doing a fairly good job of putting it together. the answer to your question is we are building up a really true international response against isis. and we will be able to utilize that to move against them. the problem, of course, is planes don't take cities. you need people on the ground, and there are only two sources of ground troops, the syrian resistance, whatever it is, and

the iraqi military and mill litat yas. >> i was -- militias. >> i was sad to see what happened in mosul. another standoff between isis and these iraqi troops, which we stood up so we could stand down, and maybe as many as 300 of them may have died and iraqih. heart.

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ask your doctor about cialis for daily use and a free 30-tablet trial. how much money do you think you'll need when you retire? then we gave each person a ribbon to show how many years that amount might last. i was trying to, like, pull it a little further. [ woman ] got me to 70 years old. i'm going have to rethink this thing. it's hard to imagin how much we'll need for a retirement that could last 3years or mor so maybe we need to approach things dferently, if we want to be ready for a longer retirement. ♪ the head of the fbi says 12 americans are believed to be directly fighting with the terrorist in iraq and syria. 12. he says the group is part of the 100 plus americans americans why traveled or attempted to travel to syria. catherine her ridge is live in washington. what else are we learning?

>> the director breaking down the numbers and confirming a dozen americans are fighting with terrorist groups in iraq and syria. the fbi director who spoke on the record did not describe their roll but said there are two other isis operatives both with energy more than accents and identify -- north american hack sets. both men appeared in this isis video. one men carried out a mass execution. fox news understands this section of the video is being analyzed by the fbi in. >> there's been a lot of talk about the identification of the man in the video of the beheadings of james foley. but through voice analysis didn't they have that complete in the first couple of days. >> the fbi the british ambassador in washington danced around that issue successfully for that first week or so.

but this is the first time we have had a u.s. government official confirm this individual has been identified. he did not go into specifics as to who it was, but the identification is clearly of significance. >> they've always thought -- i mean, it hauls believed it's been this dj who was over there. >> that's correct. >> well, for whatever reason they're being very careful about identifying him, and i think it's significant that just earlier this week, this dj's father did a plea deal with the u.s. attorney's office york, and i would be interested to know whether he is providing cooperating information in that case now. >> that would be interesting. catherine herridge, great to see you. >> see you. >> observe ares say the oil refineries that coalition jets bombedded, helped mick the islamist state the most well-funded group on the planet. they could be worth occupy to $2 billion and the bulk of the money comes from oil.

look at the wall over there. as we reported, intelligence official says the group has been earning 1 to $3 million a day. "60 minutes" says $6 million a day. smuggling oil out of syria and iraq. three million do dollars a day. isis has been selling women and children as sex slaves, checking ransom and extorting businesses and say terror groups collect donations from wealthy arab supporters, and one other piece, look look at the wall again. see turkey? turkey is buying this oil. this bootleg oil. so turkey can play both sides against the middle all turkey wants but here's a fact. entities within"4>u turkey are involved in this bootleg oil sale, of this the world is certain. peter barnes is live in washington. what more do we know about the arab donors who are giving money to isis? >> these arab donors are large

and small and sympathetic to the sunni extremist movement and squadist movement a report from the brookings institution found wealthy donors sent money to isis, donations came from saudi arabia and qatar sometimes solicited on facebook and twitter. an li for csis reported on a charity auction in kuwait in march that included a 1982 chevy caprice classic. the money was supposed to go for humanitarian relief but anallies say that few could doubt it could end up in the pockets of squadists. >> peter barnes from the biz in d.c. feds warning strikes against the islamic state to lead to lone wolf attacks. in new york city police will

notice a larger police presence than north american. the general assembly is in full swing, the jewish holiday, rosh hashanah underway, and as we reported, iraq's prime minister came out of left field today. the fbi director enough says he was not aware in any way(rkñ ofy such plot, and still isn't. security officials are not taking any risk. when something says something like this you have to make changes. i guest they're costing millions and millions and millions of dollars. laura is on the street in front of our building. >> governor cuomo is acknowledging the statement, saying his office is treating the report that came out with the utmost precaution, in a statement released a little while ago the governor says this. over the past few weeks we have begun continue crease security at mass transit sites and other key areas in the new york city area as part of a bistate security enhancement and

partnership with governor chris christie of new jersey. it's paramount and we're doing everything necessary to protect new yorkers. cuomo adds his administration has been coordinating at a high level with local, state, and federal partners and wants to assure the people of new york they're monitoring the reports and remaining in close communication with officials in washington. and cuomo just got off one of our cubways8=px in new york, me his point riding riding the e tn from the world trade center to penn station. >> officials giving any specifics? >> of course, times square is always a big perceived target, and the nypd stepping up security there, as they always do during the u.n. general assembly. the presence there is high across the city as the nypd evaluates internet threats calling for lone wolves. former nypd officer says the country is living in a very dangerous ti2iw right now. >> we know there are people out there who do not like americans

just because of what we stand for. it makes us a target. more so in new york city because it's the capital of finance and economic and capitalism, as foreign people see us, but it's also the mecca of the united states. >> a couple of specifics. as for the u.n., officials said they'll be giving greater security to the heads of state and delegations from countries where there are continuing conflicts and there will be security at synagogues during the high holy days. >> thank you very much. a clearly cool and rainy day in america's biggest city. police say they found the suspect in the case of the missing college freshman hundreds of miles away from the university of vamp details on why investigators say he was in texas. sweet! spicy! savory!

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some breaking news oust syria, and i got to tell you right off the bat here, we're not sure of this one. if proven, it would be an explosive development that could change things in the fighting there. this is out of sir ra. according to the "associated press," activists in syria say the nation's brutal regime launched a new chemical weapons attack on rebels near damascus long after syria assured the west its chemical weapons had been destroyed there was anreem. here is what is said to be new video out of syria from "associated press." fox news can't verify. from damascus, some shaking, some already dead. the seep soap reports it has validated this video. fox news cannot independently confirm it. but we're a lined of ap and can he trust them. we do not know who the alleged victims are. we cannot know which rebel group

they were part of. the analyst says the islamic state is not known to operate in the area around damascus and that's true. we don't know if the victims are the moderate syrian rebels, the onesu(wk the united states plans to arm. the activists are claiming the assad regime launched a new chemical weapons attack. one more thing. i just got this in seconds ago. this is some context for the pentagon press secretary, rear admiral john kirby. asked about reports assad had used kim cal weapon -- chemical weapons and he said, no, at 9:10 am there had been reports that clorox bombs had been used. so we don't know. this is happening in real time. so "associated press" say it's happen. the activists say there has been

a chemical attack. the best thing to do is wait and fine out about the facts on the ground. if assad crossed the red line is it possible we would have a new equation here? >> we have no idea where hannah graham is, that's a quote from the cops just a short time ago in charlottesville, virginia. comes as the suspect in the disappearance appeared in court today. police say they arrested him yesterday afternoon at a beacher in galveston in texas. the suspect, who is 32 years, named jesse matthews, may have been trying to escape to mexico. in court he agreed for officials to extradite him to virginia. fox news and legal analyst is here. i that you would him a person of interest. talked to him at bit. he got away. the lost the tail, suddenly shows up in galveston. >> they're reporting he had been thrown out of another university because of accusations of rape charges against him. what was telling about today's

press conference, was it was really the police asking for help from the community to find this poor girl, and they asked various ways at different areas of the world, from a tight city, there are a lot of wildlife cameras, they're asking everyone, check any surveillance you have around your house, ask all property openers to walk their property and look for her and call the police accident say i live at 123 main street, there's nothing there they asked realers who are representing properties that are vacant or homes that are vacant. search the homes. they describe what she was wearing. they describe her iphone. if you see it, don't touch anything, just call us and we'll get there immediately. i it was a cry out to help -- for help from9rtp the chief investigator, and he said, i need you guys to spread the word because that's the only we'll fine her. >> they have their prime suspect. now hoping to a miracle in virginia. i final check of the dow. an awful dow and the rest of the

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this is awkward. go to comcastbusiness.com/ checkyourspeed. if we can't offer faster speeds or save you money we'll give you $150. comcast business built for business. he cops searching for the suspect accused of killing a state trooper say they've spotted him several times but haven't been able to catch him. this is pennsylvania. a they say he may actually be taunting them. police say he is leaving behind a trail of strange items, including siberian cigarettes and so i so i would -- soiled diapers. he shoot two police troopers and one died. the suspect its armed and very dangerous. this search has kept people out of their homes for days at a time. meanwhile, state police are warning about a telephone scam in that area. they say scammers are pretending to be from the police department and asking for money to help search for the effort.

of course they stealing the money. >> reporter: police say that suspect asia frein liked to play soldier and sometimes a six-beananned and he was warring the adult dine-per-because it allowed him to stay in one location for a long time. he was able to elude officers and k-9 units and tactical teams prowling the woods near the pike county line, very close to his parents' home and 15 to 18 miles from where they say he ambushed the trooperes. they think he has been using bunkers and shelters built deep in the hills. and while there have been multiple sightings he continue0s elude capture because they say him from hundreds of yards away and by the time they can go after him in a safe manner because he is heavily armed,

then he is out of the way. they will not give up until he is captured. >> we'll be right back. it that ? the son picks up the check? [thinking] i'm still working. he's retired. i hope he's saving. i hope he saved enough. who matters most to you says the most about you. at massmutual we're owned by our policyowners, and they matter most to us. whether you're just starting your 401(k) or you are ready for retirement, we'll help you get there.

on this day in 1959, the soviet leader nikita khrushchev met with then president dwight d. eisenhower in maryland as both leaders tried to thaw out the cold war. khrushchev lashed out another officials whose refused him to go to disneyland. but after the meeting both sides say the hope the talks would lead to a just and lasting peace. the optimism would not last long. less than a year late their soviets downed an american spy plane and captured the pilot and the cold war dragged on. -but two world powers tried hashing out their differences 55 years ago today. mickey was not of assistance.

when news breaks out we'll break in. breaking news changes everything on fox news channel. man. final bell is tolling. down 255 today. tech sector, apple, cavuto is coming up right now. >> so much going on, you're looking live at the white house right now where an ag is set to say bye-bye. eric holder is stepping down. many republicans welcome his departure but bill they welcome his his replacement? we're less than 30 minutes away. but ahead of that, this, on a very busy news day. hold iris not the o. one making news, is so isis and so is wall street. iraq's prime minister warning the terror group is plotting an attack on subways in the u.s. and paris. it is unnerving security folks here and didn't do much to help