you're all heavenly to me. john: maternity care, alcohol care, and more? i will have to raise my rates or lose money unless i can get taxpayers to bail me out. we don't want people to know that we are talking about so we will call it risk corridors. uncle sam will raise down with lots of your money and give it to companies that the politicians want to please. have some tax money.

so isn't obamacare great? it's not just obamacare that controls us but control freaks all over government. >> it takes a long time to put the legislation together to control the people. >> it's not due process. >> the nanny state is alive and well. john: that is going to be our show tonight. sonoma company. ♪ john: the control freaks in washington really want to run your life very and we start with obamacare, the administration and the eagerness to pass a law that would let government rule over health insurance wanted to make sure that insurance companies aren't upset. how could they do that? because obamacare insurance forces them to cover more stuff.

so obamacare says don't worry, we will bail you out. but bailouts to big companies, especially insurance companies, are unpopular. instead, the administration used an obscure insurance company term, risk court orders. that is why i embarrassed myself by doing silly stunts and dressing as uncle. and is it really this bad? am i exaggerating? let ask the health care specialists betsy mcculloch. is it this bad? >> it is, it is corrupt. you are fooling the public using the public's own money. price your plants lowered and what you actually need to cover your costs and we will come

through at the end of the year with this money to offset most of these lockers. and then worse than that. john: she hears her obamacare wherever she goes. >> this is why it is so telling. this bailout expires after the 26 election. john: they didn't want to make it permanent because perman fill out perman failing would expire. >> it is supposed to look a little he's out of office. but as you pointed out, so many extra things. john: drug coverage, obesity treatment, talk there be, wellness visits. >> it's like passing a law is

that the only car you are allowed to buy is a fully loaded cadillac. john: obama sweetened it after the log was pat cemented he did was to enhance these recorders and court orders even more than the law allows. and then the presidents until they come up we will make it quietly with the money of the public. we are entering the perfect storm for repeal and this should be the first thing rebuild. john: the bill says the permissible profit margin is 3% and now it's 5%. >> that is a big increase in plus insurance companies can incur expenses other than your health care, which is salaries

and profit margins that they didn't have before. so it really gives sweetness for them. and the president is not allowed to change law by himself. john: it was bad enough with what was in there, he illegally races that end there's just about no reporting on this because it is boring, bailouts you can get your ring around. >> we were very deceptive, they took an insurance company termed risk court or and pretended it was the same thing. but it's not. john: thank you, betty. obamacare happen because democrats and some republicans, let's not forget mitt romney, said consumers can't be trusted to arrange their own health care. some people don't buy health insurance am or if they do come in the plans that they choose are not good enough. some people wait until they get sick and they rush to high-cost emergency rooms. and whatever we think and whatever the critics say, it is true that more people have health insurance. >> the final stores speaks for

itself, there are 7.5 million people across the country that have the security of health insurance and most of them for the very first time. >> that's your than they had predicted and now they are saying 9.5 million will have signed up by this winter but they originally thought it was these 13 million. still, 7 million new people have health insurance and doctor kathleen london is thrilled about that. but she said to she and the president missed the point. >> the number of people who signed up on the exchange is in the number of people with new new insurance. there were 5 million people lost insurance because their plans are illegal. so if you add the people that got insurance or medicaid, and the people who lost their insurance for various means, it's part of this. >> why are you so happy? >> it's hard to get covered when you have no other means. when you look at people who have been married to their job, having employer-based insurance key people there.

so one of my colleagues last week -- i'm a practicing physician. one of my colleagues saw little girl who came in and she had a fever that was unknown and a high white blood cell count. then after tests, the child had [inaudible] what they didn't know is that dad quit his job a month ago and doesn't have insurance now. so not out of the question being is my child going to be okay, the question is how my going to pay for cancer treatment. john: not everyone can pay for health care. >> free market advocates have advocated this system. where instead of getting this, you on the tax rate yourself you can shop with everyone and you can take it wherever you want. the problem with obamacare is that actually the story you just

described as the exception. the common exception is that the law discourages people from staying in the workforce because in order to maintain benefits their income has to be so low that they can't actually seek real work. >> i was in 2007 in massachusetts and had my own practice when romney but the heritage foundation, similar to the think tank he work out, when the individual mandate was part of this. john: that's right, it came from a republican think tank. >> so why is it now bad? >> the average price is 49% higher today than it was last year because obamacare mandates and regulates how insurance plans can be design. >> that is a buyer beware kind of insurance. and if you want to be fiscally conservative, you go to single payer. are we ready to follow that as a country? john: the government does pays

for this and they tell us whatever we want. >> it's not. and they are saying the things that are absolutely necessary, preventative care, urgent care, then we would have insurance for the rest of it. it is what every other industrialized nation does very well. john: they freeload off of us. >> that's not true. it's another real-world story, a woman being wheeled in, having a heart attack come out and we take them right into the catheter lab and she yells stop, let me see if my insurance covers this. her husband had died four years before it has a 16-year-old and doesn't want to leave her child with giant medical bills. john: if you're having a heart attack, they're going to treat you. >> the number one cause of bankruptcy is medical bills.

>> that's not true. you want to have catastrophic insurance to protect people. let me talk for a second coming you've had a lot of time to talk. so you don't need insurance to pay for that routine catastrophic care. it's like paying for gasoline, oil changes, fuel. so if you look at the countries in the world where they have a system where they don't ensure for those routine expenses, health care a lot more there than a dozen america. if you go to a cash bar come you get the bud lite where the house wine, but if it's an open bar come you get a single malt scotch. >> if you come in before your diabetes is under control, it's a whole lot easier to take care of. john: there's no evidence that preventative care is saving americans money. >> we now have a much lower rate. right there that is it.

>> it's like getting all this false treatment for stuff that never would've become a problem because the doctors say this might happen and they overtreated. >> we could have a rational insurance system that protects people against catastrophic financial loss, but allows them to pay for routine health expenditures and driving across town. that's all we do and that's not what obamacare does. john: obamacare for bids at. >> that's exactly right. they know spend more money out. john: i see why you like it because you have patients are getting paid and are coming in and getting everything. but how can america afford this? >> it was the first step and it was the best plan we could get through the congress. john: thank you both for joining us. to join the argument, follow me on twitter at fbn john stossel, used to hash tag #no they can't. i said it in that great book.

and for the most part washington cannot. like our facebook page, post on our wall, we want to know what you think. coming up, can washington use the full animal to torture property owners? at first, some of the businesses that freak out the control freaks coming up next. ♪ (holiday music is playing) hey! i guess we're going to need a new santa ♪(the music builds to a climax.) more people are coming to audi than ever before. see why now is the best time. audi will cover your first month's payment on select models at the season of audi sales event. visit audioffers.com today.

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john: apis shooting range in maryland, everyone is shooting special ammunition, including the last shooter that you saw who owns the company and she is here with us today, brian is with this group that runs the u.s. consumer coalition. so what is operation shall point? what is that? >> at the program that the department of justice is pursuing. they are trying to help you to stop doing business with people they don't like.

people like this are being affected and losing the ability to provide services and products. >> company say seen on tv. they didn't want to reveal this. the firearms makers, payday loan sellers, surveillance equipment, lots of companies. >> they didn't want this program to be released as you mentioned to the public at all. but most of these industries are industries that they have tried to legislate out of existence over the last 20 or 30 years and i haven't been able to do that. the obama administration under the direction of eric holder at the department of justice has decided that we are going to come up with a creative way to go after these industries. we are going to find the one unifying factor that brings together all of these industries. and everyone needs a bang. everyone needs a payment processor so we're going to the banks and we are going to intimidate them into stopping

these relationships with all of these companies. john: how did you find out that you had been choked by operation chokepoint? >> we were told that we were rejected due to our industry. >> you suddenly come you couldn't use your paypal account enact. >> upright, we couldn't use the credit card processor that links to your website. john: you then try to open a bank account enact. >> i was told that a branch manager you can have your bank account you cannot have this to your industry. john: that means credit card processing? >> exactly and i don't have it right now. >> thousands of companies are right now receiving letters from their bank thing that they can no longer have bank accounts and that they cannot use the card processing services. that's the one that we know about. john: teagan says thank you for closing a personal account that

i've had since i was 18. >> the department of justice started with industries like payday lending and pornography. they have now moved into guns and ammunition sales and tobacco sales. the letter they received from the bank doesn't say operation chokepoint but after 25 years of doing business with one of these banks, they receive a letter saying that we can no longer bank here. and you need to move your money some place else. stay on their collectivist that support the media and things like this. here's "the new york times" editorial. >> fortunately, some people were upset enough for some of the justice department people to hear to it. >> have you determined front? has there been due process? has there been a hearing or an adjudication? >> the lawyers recognize that

legitimate businesses were in fact being harmed. that decided that the ends justified the means. >> it's great to see members of congress doing their duty and pushing back against the control freaks. so were the abusive lawyers from the doj cringing with guilt? here is the bureaucrats opening statement. >> our policy is to investigate this an transpacific conduct based on evidence that consumers are being prodded. john: on and on he went. we asked the department of justice to explain what they are doing is okay but they did not respond. so did they respond to your complaint? >> ironically the only response we have gotten from the doj is when we start talking about the public. >> some people would say that it's not a threat. you make ammunition that is in good and you really should be policed.

>> i have two licenses from the state of maryland. so it's highly regulated already. john: they always want more. >> that's right. john: coming up, the control freaks plan to ban tobacco sales. >> i find smoking to be one of the most disgusting habits that anybody could possibly do. >> and i love to bet on sports. it's my money, isn't it my choice? know, is what the control freaks say.

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>> governor chris christie signed up eldo partially legalizes sports betting in the garden state. john: it's about time, millions of us bet on sports. finally politicians will make it legal. that they only want to legalize betting and casino's and other

state-controlled facilities and even that was too much for the control freaks that they threaten for lawsuits. >> if someone wants to stop it, they have to take action to top it. >> and they did. the prose is sued them. and the judge did stop at least for now. people that i interviewed agreed that government should prevent us from gambling. >> should betting on sports be allowed? >> never. >> it encourages people to spend money they don't have. john: it does sometimes. the nonfree americans allowed to do what we want with our own money? know says this man of the conservative think tank american policy roundtable. >> is legal in this country in some sports right now. john: if you build your friend with you have a friendly poker

game, it's legal in some parts of the country but not all. >> in some, but what chris christie and others have tried to do is illegal and they tried to get around it by forcing courts to action. john: it could be illegal but only because foolish control freaks have made it illegal. >> from your mobile device, from anywhere. if we put this anywhere and we have our mobile devices and were able to do that, it's going to open up a can of worms. and even a few hundred is a lot of money and you may sivas college sports go away after an hour.

>> we have a loss, but it doesn't stop athletes from occasionally fixing this. we have the freshman heisman trophy winner, remarkable athletes,. >> allegedly, but there is also stuff being talked about. john: some are in jail. in england it is legal but it doesn't happen. >> it's happened there with scandals and the fact that people could gamble. golfers are able to wager on themselves and so it's a big difference. but to think of tim, that happened in a legal environment if we open this up and it becomes legal in the street corners, the thought that it's not going to expand and have

been more than taxpayers will be left holding the bill to subsidize. john: i don't know about tennis teams in britain. but we researched it. the bbc said that in 1964 a players were jailed for fixing a soccer game. the previous incident we could find from 1915. >> when we study gambling and the expansion of gambling, around the country or world, it is on the decline everywhere. john: gambling is on the decline >> absolutely. the problem is they are sucking the money out of the economic engine of certain states and they are wasting this money. the more money that people gamble, the less they can spend on cars and washers and dryers in homes. >> why is this my choice? >> gambling is a legal activity and you can't gamble right now. >> i can't bet on the nfl this year. and i'm not allowed.

>> gambling is evil in the state of nevada. you can do it tomorrow and that keeps the people that are able to afford this gambling on the nfl. john: thank you, rob. coming up next. >> they want to police what you do for pleasure. how you eat and why you like this little animal a lot more this little animal a lot more than they like mhere's our new trainer! ensure active heart health. heart: i'm going to focus on the heart. i minimize my sodium and fat... gotta keep it lean and mean. pear: uh-oh. heart: i maximize good stuff like my potassium... and phytosterols, which may help lower cholesterol. major: i'm feeling energized already. avo: new delicious ensure active heart health supports your heart and body, so you stay active and strong. ensure. take life in.

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>> the nanny state is alive and well. john: it sure is. the control freaks want more. they want to protect us from ourselves by limiting what we eat and what we do for pleasure and how we give to charity. they think it is their duty. and i admit that i was guilty of this kind of thinking.

as a young consumer reporter i did research as to what doctors said was backrest and i wanted to help stamp it out very at after all, people have lives and they don't have time to check everything out and find out what is harmful. it is important to stay protected. the concept of individual freedom was not on my radar screen. i apologize, i was ignorance and arrogant. but at least i had no real power and i couldn't force consumers to avoid unhealthy things. only government can do that. and sadly government still is filled with people just as ignorance and arrogant as i was but they do get to use the force. matthew mitchell covers regulations and he talks about the damage control and wising up

>> it turns out it was a famous study. a famous man looked at the data and the town that after the introduction and accidents increase and now the probability of getting injured in fall. but the two effects cancel out. and that is because cyclists are not protected by seatbelts. and if you mandate that all cars have to have all kinds of expensive features, like backup cameras, there are the

discouragement of people from buying new cars. john: let's talk about secondhand smoke. they started by saying that this could ban smoking but now smoking in bars is illegal. >> those are areas that introduced bans on smoking. and this is related to alcohol. the theory is that people are driving longer distances in order to find bars that have outside seating or outside of the jurisdiction. john: were you surprised that smokers and resist? i mean, i don't smoke and i don't mind it.

>> it's quickly curious how people are willing to give up their freedoms. john: someone to ban the sales altogether. >> they want to make it illegal to sell tobacco to anyone including adult. john: last week the town held a hearing about that. 500 people showed up. i like what this guy says. >> i find smoking to be one of the most disgusting habits that anyone could possibly do and i find this proposal to be more disgusting thing that anyone could ever do in any town in the united states of america. john: maybe people are wising up now. thing and not. well, we often think about the federal government and federal overreach. but a lot of the most intrusive regulations happen happened at the local level just like this. john: the regulators make a good

argument that smoking hurts people and seatbelts save lives. >> beginning in march, sugary beverages cannot be sold in portions bigger than 16 ounces. john: that was the tax. and it is least onerous of the van. >> they can also accomplish it from a tax. and it it's something were big ten accomplish this. john: members of the media often act like control freaks and cheerleaders. and nbc is still wanting this.

and even the most ridiculous people get upset. >> is feeding the homeless a crime? a new law in one florida town says that it is. >> to pastors and a 9-year-old volunteer are facing jail time after they were arrested for feeding the homeless. john: fort lauderdale passable on public food choices are your so what is your take? >> welcome he had been feeding someone in a park for over 35 years, he's been hf. he's not trying to outlaw this but he's trying to make it but economics says if you give food away, and homeless people arare going to find it in their next meal harder to come by.

john: but in this one, i think it's my weakest taste. and of course, that is the one that al sharpton embraces because there is something called the public square and the town gets the police, the public square. >> i think you can make a stronger case for regulation in the public square than you can in a private bar or a privately owned piece of property. in this case, you know, it may be possible for them to find another place for them to feed the homeless. john: thank you, matthew mitchell. coming up next, control freaks want more. we have another story next. they say if you don't visit these yards, you don't own your these yards, you don't own your property

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john: isn't that a cute little animals? prairie dogs. environmentalist now the government say it is in danger to see you must not harm one. or hard mitt or pursue it or shoot or wound kill catch or

harass its. harass it? to amend harassed manatees by doing this. >> deal with that. [laughter] spee mickey jumped in the water and posted a video. they were sent to jail. you don't mess with the control freaks of fish and wildlife but this man did he messed with them by fighting them in court he was upset because it was his only and he cannot develop because of prairie dogs. last year he came on the show to complain about the government. this month he is back because you one? congratulations. the core role the constitution does not give the offense the right to drive the prairie dogs off his land. we have the pacific legal foundation the charity. tell us about this but the

first time a federal court has instituted a decision on the endangered species act. the power to regulate commerce does not extend to regulate species only located one small part of utah. john: that sounds like a technical clause but he is not that rare. there are 40,000? >> of the top prairie dog the and black tails? >> the only difference between the top prairie dog the and the millions of others is the color of its tail. john: and it only groom's itself while the black tails grew each other. >> i did not know that. john: and environmentalists say makes it a unique species a you cannot develop during and. >> we are not developed - - being judged by the courts our judiciary belli is

written, administrative laws by bureaucrats. a bureaucrat can tell me what i can or cannot do with my property then they hold a big hammer over my head to make sure. the fine to harm or harass even want is often thousand dollars and five years in federal prison. john: for one of them? you have 85 on your property. there is a process to remove them. >> it was a waiting list and it took three years then i had removed 10 of the 85 then i went down to the bottom of the list again. so in reality it was impossible to ever read them -- get rid of them. john: so why you need to get rid of them? but our fox loss angeles

reporter did a good job to say how makes it dangerous for kids to play and they do nasty things to a neighborhood. >> here in iron county utah the critters are taking over to a local church for the pastor says it is too dangerous for the kids to play. >> right now the animals have dominion over us. >> as mayor, her town's cemetery is falling apart. >> we had a problem over 20 years now they are tipping the stones. >> people are sick and tired of putting up with them because they have more rights and better paid lawyers. john: you work for free? animals are helpless property owners are rich. >> that is not true. there is a lot of very

wealthy environmental groups paying attention and lobbying for species to be added to the list by the hundreds. john: friends of animals groups say we will appeal to the tenth circuit to make short work of this embarrassing judicial work. the government partners with them. >> coming in on this side of the government to defend the lawsuit and tinkly there were not enough the court ruled the commerce clause limits still apply and he should use his property. john: don't you want to protect god's creatures? >> we have plenty and we want to protect them the day the ruling came down they said will you kill them without on your property? i said no. we're not interested to kill them just in our constitutional rights of private property which we don't have currently.

john: thank-you. bruce. jonathan. coming up, what it means for freedom when congressmen say things like this. >> it takes a long time to put the legislation together, to control the people.

john: i opened the show with a clip of the congressmen saying is.

>> it takes a long time to put the legislation together to control the people. john: politicians work hard to control the people. that was not ordinary congress banned but john dingell who has been in office 59 years. yes. here he is with president truman. his father was a congressman and two and first elected 1933. he died in office and was replaced by his son. , jr. will finally retire this year next year his district will be represented by a woman. debbie. the same name? yes. his wife. debbie worked for gm the family made millions while the congressman pushed for the five bailouts for gm. besides from protecting the home town automaker he is a control freak as much as

anyone the endangered species act? his website says he wrote it i wonder what debbie will control? she is 30 years younker so maybe she will stay in office 59 years also. that will give her plenty of time to demand lots of things. did they ever inveigh and anything? occasionally. >> from this day the 18th amendment is doomed to. >> they did legalized alcohol after words though a few states have legalized we'd but it generally the control freaks only increase control. take cigarettes. at first just warning labels been banned on tv ads that restaurants to have no-smoking sections then airplanes, schools, workplac es, and their restaurants, bars also. and sometimes apartments and outdoor spaces. frankly i like it i don't

like the small but it can smokers have some bars? no one has to come in here can a smoker look forward to an evening like this with a cigarette in his hand and have this moment? no. in half of america is illegal and state-by-state they just take it. by the way this secondhand smoke scare is called the smokers still taking a. most everyone quietly gives up his freedom that is why i was encouraged by the town meeting when they wanted to ban all tobacco sales hundred showed up and complained. >> i find smoking to be one of the most disgusting habits anyone could possibly do. on top of that, i find this proposal to be more of a disgusting things that anybody could ever give any

town in the united states of america. john: maybe that pushed back will stop that town but the control freak soleus want more. >> there are 50 cities with their own plastic bag behan's. >> large capacity ammunition magazines. >> boycott the sale of alcohol. >> banned from coming to the united states. >> every precaution. >> it is always more. i talk about economic freedoms and the world knows that is what creates prosperity. is a big deal but the free part? is is just as important. individual choices matter. i object to restrictions on choice not because i like choice, it is a moral objection with government limiting our control over our lives, we become less. something changes an hour character.

we become smaller. people on the left and right bepromote good thing this and discourage bad ones. of the right you think it should promote marriage or religious charities? or pots and violence servitude games or pornography? it is government's job to promote what is good and suppress the bad. that allows the control freaks to stick their noses into everything we do. politicians can dream of control and it is a changing role. no more destructive cabling every prairie dog is preserved, dash interest loan spanish. health care is paid for by strangers in washington. politicians can dream about that but they cannot do it. no. they can't. they shouldn't try. as frederick hayek said the task of of this -- economics

is touche to demonstrate how little they know about what they imagine they can design. they can't. that is our show. that is our show. hello. i'm eric shutdown. welcome to brand-new hour of america's news headquarters. >> i'm arthel neville. chuck hagel making a surprise visit to afghanistan announcing the change in the troop's drawdown. why the pentagon is keeping an extra 1,000 troops there. a major development in the sony picture cyber attack. this as the f.b.i. is looking into those chilling new e-mails that threaten employees and their families. and u.s. naval engineer in trouble with the feds allegedly trying to sell secret documents detailing how to sink