it for all? it's your choice. good night. hello, everyone. i'm dana performe dana perina and this is "the five." first, the united states does not negotiate with terrorists. that's what the obama administration has said many times. but then why did they swap bowe bergdahl for five guantanamo detainees. listen to the attempt to answer

that question and charles krauthammer's response. >> you don't think taliban is a terrorist group? >> i don't think that the taliban -- the taliban is an armed insurgency. >> it attacks buses, it drives car bombs into markets and it's not a terrorist group. look, you can't this administration. >> press secretary joshua earnest was back at the white house today and attempted to clarify the comment. >> does the administration consider taliban a terrorist group or not? >> they carry out tactics akin to terrorism. they do pursue terrorism to advance their agenda. >> all right. so let's get this conversation started. they tried it again today. eric i have a theory. we swap theories back and forth.

i think they are not making a political rationalization. they are trying to tell everybody that the war in afghanistan is over. they don't want to call the taliban terrorists because they want to be able to say see america, we said we'd get out of these wars, even if it's premature and misguided and we're going to create the problem that they created in iraq by leaving early because isis is already showing up in afghanistan but that's what they are trying to dance around here. they don't want to call the taliban terrorists because they want to leave prematurely. >> they want to leave and make sure that something jumps up again. they want to say, we made a mistake. but you would think that they would send eric schultz -- why would they send him out so unprepared for that question? it's amazing that he was lost -- >> well, that's called a slaughter. no he was prepared i had

empathy for him. he was trying to deliver exactly what the guidance was that he got from the national -- >> so can i add to your speculation? so the white house also said that they were going to meet with some people who are loosely affiliated with the muslim brotherhood. we heard about that as well. so maybe they just don't want you to call them for what they are, cutting deals down the road putting people in places that they want to put them and they don't want to be associated with a terrorist organization. if you don't call taliban terrorists, then you can kind of deal with them. >> it could be kimberly, that they are trying to make a distinction where there might not be. the state department has a list called foreign terrorist organizations, that means that you're a state and doing terrorism and you are a state sponsor of it. the taliban are not on that specific list. however, they are on the

treasury list. >> right. >> which basically means, if you are on that list, there are asset freezes and you can't do trading with them. do you think they are trying to make a distinction? >> of course they are. it's always what is convenient semantically. i don't know what is wrong with these people. they really don't get it. this poor guy makes a fool of himself. it's just sad. and they are in charge of this country and of our foreign policy and of our national security. i don't get it. they have really proved themselves to be completely and wholeheartedly unworthy. >> do you think it matters if they say if the terrorists? >> an administration so afraid of phantoms and shadows while dismissing real threats. the alphabet is more threatening to them than the taliban. you've got to wonder where they get these guys. it's like they approach the

sales staff at abercombie & fitch. >> let's help them out. they need alternatives for the word terrorists. homicidal bummers poiseonous pals. because the fact is it's just mean to call somebody in the taliban a terrorist because they have feelings too and you hurt their feelings every time you call them a terrorist when, in fact, it might be a medical disorder, a peanut allergy, they just might be allergic to sanity and they need help. the white house should be extending an olive branch to the taliban. it's the thought that counts.

there's a travel agent for nirvana. beautiful. >> today -- what the press secretary did today, he did not deny that they participate in terrorist activities but he didn't want to say that they are terrorists. do you think that they are needing to have some clarity so they don't have generals like the other day saying you need to tell us where we are headed? >> i think the reality is -- by the way, it's manmade disasters that's what they were calling it. >> i am a manmade disaster. >> i think what they want to do is negotiate with the taliban, which is what you said earlier. remember, the taliban was in charge of afghanistan before the united states went in and roused them. so what you're dealing here is a

straight-sponsored terrorist activity and secondly in terms of reconstructing afghanistan, which is what we want to happen in order to keep the peace and keep control and influence, i think they don't want to alienate the taliban unnecessarily. one point, i think that you are on target and i think having them on the global financial list is what matters here. it doesn't matter what is fighting them. >> but it's inconsistent. it's hypocritical. semantics matter when you're fighting a war against -- like who is next to get on the softball list? isis? >> i don't think you know who the enemy is. >> isis has been showing up in afghanistan. that's the problem. will the taliban allow isis -- >> we don't want it. >> that's why we should not -- we're going to get on the next topic. there was an interview with house speaker john boehner last

night and here's what he said about the tea party and setting realistic goals. >> you said that you can get more members on your side of the aisle? >> i do. i was the tea party before there was a tea party. i understand their concerns and frustrations. but we have a constitution that we abide by. whether people like it or not, barack obama is going to be the president for the next two years. we've got to find a way to hold him accountable and try to find common ground to get things done on behalf of the common people. >> a lot of that interview did talk about obamacare and something else happened. the senate did finally pass the keystone pipeline bill. there are changes for congress. >> one of the questions that bret asked is it's because this is what we want, what we represent.

i'm not sure that he's as far conservative or as conservative as the tea party would like him to be they said you need to hound congress on taxes and keystone. like you say, there's changes afoot. but, again, so this is going to be great. >> that's what john boehner was trying to say that we can do some things but there's a president that's going to be there for two years. so he's talking about realistic goals. >> i think what he's trying to say, in a nice way, we have more in common among in our party than not. it's a necessary message to unify in order to win. the tendency in every party for people who want to say i'm more conservative than they are. no, i'm more progressive than they are. no, i'm truly libertarian.

it's a pointless contest of egos and holds no value. every time you call somebody a rhino, a democrat smiles because they like to see the internal conflict. they like that. it's more important to say, we have our disagreements but at the end of the day we come together. we come together like the wonder twins. we unite. >> activate. >> activate. >> wonder twins activate. >> i am flogged but i enjoy being flogged. >> he had a small role in "pulp fiction." >> that was really perfect. >> we have one other topic that i really want to get to. there's been a lot of speculation on whether or not hillary clinton will run in 2016. according to new reports, she's delaying formal launch of her campaign until july, three months later than originally planned. now, one, let me ask you, first

do you think that this is hillary clinton's team being worried that she doesn't have a message or that she could screw things up or do you think they are so confident that she doesn't have to do anything until july? >> both are true, maddam. right now they don't have any real challenger. the challenger that would be there looks like joe biden or elizabeth warren. neither is in the game right now and both are way down in the numbers. i think it's like 70 to 10. and so what she's doing is giving herself more time out of the limelight away from reporters, away from the scrutiny and she can launch an exploratory committee to meet the financial requirements necessary for raising money. so on every front, it's a good move for her. there's no reason for her to jump out early and she said she's going to talk to the benghazi committee if they need to. >> all right. i'm on another side of it. kimberly i think this is interesting. one of the things you'll find amongst any clinton crew is that the internal debate and

arguments that happen internally end up in the paper because they cannot help themselves. so they are talking about launching a campaign six months from now but they are already having fights in the newspapers over it. >> well, that's not a good sign, is it? >> i don't think so. >> leaks indecision. in the meantime, by the time she gets around to pulling her crew together, what's going to happen? elizabeth warren is like, cheese. >> i think it's not -- greg was talking before about the visions among the gop. and which i think is -- boehner is saying he was tea party before the tea party? his nose is getting as long as -- >> i know what he meant. if you go back to 1994 -- >> that is like raspberry iced tea. >> may i say something on hillary? i think it's a brilliant strategy. i think she's so far out ahead of everybody whether it's money or popularity or anything just put it out there she has no

reason to do some of the things that she's done take chances on -- fox news poll came out, i believe last night shows that it's not elizabeth warren who is on her heels, it's joe biden. >> i think we need to help joe biden out. >> she's in no rush. >> and also former senator jim webb apparently has some reason to run. some money, maybe some information that he'd like to impart. >> but the obvious point here is that hillary clinton is incredibly lucky because she's a democratic candidate. a democratic candidate could throw in the pillows and they are immune to criticism. so the republican has to stop really thinking about hillary clinton and start thinking about how what kind of candidate they are going to feel because you are going to fight two fronts. you're going to fight the media front who is democrat and then you have your political

adversary who is trying to ruin you. so they can fight and be charismatic and be able to refute the media. >> do we have any suggestions? >> i'm not going to say. >> you're not going to say because i'm thinking -- i've been saying that for 17 years. >> what a techicket, you know? >> at least we'd get some you know what done. >> what what? >> there we go! >> there's your platform. >> there's our >> perino and west. that's my ticket. do illegal immigrants have a right to work in america? the very woman that could replace eric holder thinks so. details on her comments, next.

yeah! >> should immigrants who come to america illegally have the right to work here?

well, they will under obama's executive action. jeff sessions pressed loretta lynch on the topic yesterday. here's what she said. >> i believe that the right and the obligation to work is one that's shared by everyone in this country regardless of how they came here and certainly if someone is here, regardless of status, i would prefer that they be participating the workplace than not participating in the workplace. >> all right. dana immigration is obviously a hot button issue that may be banned. >> i think she was a great choice by president obama to be -- >> why is that? >> i think she's not objectionable. they might choose to vote against her and i can understand why. that answer, whether people have a right to work even if they came here illegally i think the follow-up question i would have asked is will you continue to uphold the law that says it is illegal for employers to hire

somebody who is here illegally? because then her point actually she would have shown a real contradiction in her point because that law still is on the books. you cannot as an employer hire an illegal immigrant. you are not allowed to do that. i think that overall on immigration, the fight about the executive order is one that will go beyond this nomination. i think she will get confirmed, even if there are several republicans who don't vote for him. >> i think you're right about the outcome and she has some very good things in pursing people that are child abusers and child sex offenders. eric, you're going to be sad to see eric holder go especially when you have the nice selfie of you in your office but what do you think about loretta lynch? >> so a lot of people think it will be a continuation of eric holder. i'm not sure. i think she'll be a lot more -- i think the right will like her better than eric holder. my only problem with what she said right there is it doesn't matter how you come here you

have a right to work. now, the word right to work is questionable. you may have the opportunity to work, we may have a policy that allows you to work but you certainly, by any definition don't have a right to break. you're breaking the law. so that's -- >> very good point. >> if the attorney general has a problem interpreting that law, that's trouble. >> well obviously i have a different understanding of what she said because i think she said, everybody should have an obligation, a right to work, like i want people working. i want people to go and look for a job. and the second thing she said was she would prefer that everybody be participating in terms of going to work. so i don't want anybody laying around. >> the right part -- the right to work means that there's a -- whatever, a civil right legal right, whatever. i don't see that. >> no. i don't think she was saying there's a legal right. i think she was trying to say there's an obligation. go to work. and we want people working.

>> she's testifying on what her views are, how she's interpreting the law. right? >> she's testifying about preferences. she is going to be the chief law enforcement officer. by the way, if there's somebody that you want to hold responsible, how about these employers? you can't get them a job if you're an illegal immigrant, if the employer won't hire you. >> she believes in capital punishment so she would enforce death penalty laws. she thinks marijuana is more dangerous than alcohol. she has some pretty strong prosecutorial-minded viewpoints. greg? >> i'm with her on the death penalty but not on the marijuana thing. >> we know that. >> can we step out of this theater for a minute? this is what republicans do to democrats and what democrats do to republicans. it's proven ping-pong. like, for example, i like sheriff clark, i love him, but i'm not sure -- i don't know why

he's there but i'm glad that he's there. but there's a tip for people who have a problem with her. win the presidency. then you can make the nominations. and then -- and i agree with eric. she can't be worse than holder. you have to try really hard. >> you really have to do something. >> but people question her because they always question the judgment of president obama. if he had nominated a freshly reanimated ronald reagan we rejected strictly out of suspicion. >> the truth has been -- >> that's true. legitimately president obama has the judgment of a bitter grad student. >> gearing up for michael mukasey in 2007 democrats were very aggressive. >> i want to play this since you brought up sheriff clark, we have a montage --

>> the united states has held itself up for open accountable government. today those freedoms are under assault. >> we're watching a fundamental change in our constitutional system. it's changing in the very way that the framers warned us to avoid. the justice system has played a troubling role in those changes. >> i viewed the united states department of justice as an ally in the pursuit of justice. what i have witnessed under the leadership of attorney general eric holder has been almost hostility towards local law enforcement. >> to me, this looks like a political blitz. we're going to use this as a stage to launch a political attack on the obama administration. it has nothing to do with loretta lynch. >> my point is it's political ping-pong. >> this is what goes on in washington. that's why those people are dysfunctional. they are wasting my time. >> you think turley is a serious

witness? >> not in this situation. he's testifying about his lawsuit in which he's representing john boehner. >> he's talking about executive orders and whether they are legal and whether she's going to agree with them. >> and whether it would be an overstep in terms of the office. so i think it is relevant. >> good question, whether she thinks it is legal. are they legally binding when they come out of -- >> she would ask the question for example, about the immigration order and she thought it was a reasonable resolution. if we wanted that information, we got it. >> oh, you know what come on. let them show up. was president obama wrong when he called the united states a tight-knit family? what americans are actually saying about our country. that's next.

welcome back.

according to a new fox news poll, the country is as divided as ever. 37 73% see america as a dysfunction family. i took to the polls. watch. >> we're a strong tight-knit family who has made it through some very, very hard times. >> so is america tight-knit? >> i think it's highly dysfunctional. >> i think it's some of both. >> nobody is agreeing on anything. >> when it comes down to it we should all stick together. >> i think the working places are tighter knit. >> we do the grind every day. >> i think we're a tight-knit group. >> absolutely. we love america. >> are you trying to get me in trouble? >> no, i agree with you.

>> you mentioned it sounds positive. people are optimistic. almost everyone was leak you know what, when push comes to shove, americans are tight-knit. >> be honest, how can you not love america. where else would you rather be? think about it. even in the middle of a storm. >> but why would 73% of america say it's dysfunctional? >> if you watch tv what we do is we have large -- even in my lovely family, we have large arguments. it doesn't mean we're not a family. but if you ask me on any given day, can you choke that guy? yeah, i can choke him. he gets under my skin. >> what's wrong with you? we're talking about your family. >> i tell you this, you go

overseas, i think america stays together compared to eafroverseas. >> the people on the street are tight-knit. the politicians, quite divided. >> but every family is dysfunctional. that's how we operate. anyone who says their family is tight-knit is hiding something. every family is dysfunctional. everybody has something going on. >> my family is tight-knit but it's this big. >> what do you make of all this? >> joe biden's face is tightly knit. did you see that picture of him? this is another perversion of language. we are -- what we're saying is tightly knit means patriotic but we're not saying that. this whole survey is flawed. america is not a family, nor should it ever be a family. it's a sanctuary from madness and it's protected by the world's greatest military. if it were a family, i

hope it would not be the huxtables. it's a reflection of the fact that we have a democracy. we can swear and hate and blasphemy, you can make fun of my religion, i can make fun of your sports team, you can do whatever you want because that's what makes us -- the dysfunction is what make this is country great. the survey was stupid. >> before we go, the law enforcement and firefighters we talked to were so pro-american, it was unbelievable and they are awesome. >> but they put it on the line every day. they are really living it. >> when you say dysfunctional that doesn't mean you're not pro-american. i'm pro family even though i think i have a dysfunctional family. >> your child is crazy that hairy little thing. >> wait a minute. that's a dog. coming up msnbc news chris

kyle will not believe what this reporter said about this american hero. that's when we come back.

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so earlier this week i mocked agent spinster marilyn manson mocking christians that they might have asked for. and look he says that the murdered paris editors shouldn't have offended the terrorists. of "charlie hebdo," he says i can't say they didn't ask for it. it's kind of a dumb idea to do something like that. the renegade who made fun of christians thinks you shouldn't confront radical islams. spoken like a true rebel.

so what was the mopey mascots response? he tweets, "i'm so sad that the racist wasn't afraid what would happen when he opened his mouth. god bless you." have at it kids whatever you do, make sure it's biblical. when he realizes he has no argument, he tweets racist. worse when he can't find his own battles, he asks his fans to do it for him. now, that's devastating. almost as bad as being called short or fat by ah-ha and a 6-year-old girls asks i won't be able to shop at spencer's gifts again for wrist bands and i'm

sad that manson is mad. here's the real point. he asked that his followers make their attack on me biblical. so demanding your rabid followers to exact retribution for an insult of blasphemy doesn't that sound oddly familiar? can't say i didn't ask for it. dana? >> i know you're a big fan. marilyn is playing in front of dozens in new york. if you want to go with me -- they are available. >> it would be great if you had a showdown with marilyn manson. >> oh, yes. >> how did you know was there an onslaught of tweets? did you feel like you were under siege? >> no. he tweeted twice in the morning and they were really stupid and i guess his fans sleep in until 2:00 in the afternoon because they live at home and they -- his fans must be in their 30s by

now. the cake is so thick on their face they can barely see. when they end up sleeping in the dumpster of applebee's. i've gotten off topic. >> was there a question? >> no. is it pathetic that he introduced the race card? >> when we were having this discussion earlier in the week, i think you should put on that marilyn manson makeup and what did you say you should be accused of -- i like the whole transvestite thing so i think it would be a treat. >> i hope nobody takes that out of context. >> there's obama one way to take that. i'm so sorry. take it to the bank. >> guys, what's with the god people? you know they are actually very

nice. when you are over a certain age, it's got to stop. >> so i go to zumie's my son likes van shoes. he's got this xanax necklace. this can't end well. true story we get home, open the box, two right shoes. i'm not kidding. >> you always have to check the boxes, like the drive-throughs. >> he was wearing a xanax collar. >> i think that was it. >> true story. >> you know, it's a necklace. >> last time you were taking

about that. >> what they do is they galvanize that they are followers, kind of a cowardly move. >> it didn't make any sense. i'm worried about his mental health state. it's nonsensical. you've actually given him the most you have in a long time. >> i hope we can kiss and make up. >> do you want me to do this next thing or not? take a look. >> people have described as his racist tendencies and going on some of these killing sprees in iraq on assignment. >> killing sprees? when chris kyle was going on killing sprees? >> when he was involved on

assignments. >> right. >> in terms of what he was doing. >> right. >> a lot of the description that has come out from his book and some of the terminology that he has used. >> right. >> people have described it as racist. >> he said people have described. don't you love that? not him but people. >> so the headline was, this nbc reporter said chris kyle was racist. what's the difference? it's not that far -- it's not like he was reporting something that was going on. he took chris kyle and put racist and killing spree in the same sentence and glossed it over. so the natural reaction is this guy is saying that chris kyle was a racist and -- >> the people say, i'm not saying it but people have said -- some have said. >> all right. we've got to go. coming up passion for school choice. they will keep the pressure on the democrats when we get back.

demanding that president obama and my other fellow democrat take action to change our education system to start

doing what is best for the kids stop playing footsies with the union. today, i'm not backing down. neither are americans all across the country fighting for the same thing. here, take a listen. >> this is not a threat to public schools. this is a tool. this is the way that will help public schools. >> we're parents and we're educators and want the best for our kids. no one wants to see our kids fail. we all want them to succeed at the end of the day. >> we want to give more comfort to the kids and make sure that everybody feels like in south carolina they can get the best education that best suits them. >> who knows what is best for a child than their own mom and dad? certainly one size does not fit all. >> you know, this was the key point for me. if you give power to parents i think parents love their kids and i think no matter their social class or educational background, they are going to make a better choice than the bureaucrat and certainly the

historical record would indicate most often the parent does pretty good. let the parent take more control. dana? >> i was going to ask you, where is hollywood on this? you yesterday described it as a civil rights issue of your generation. and it seems that hollywood has so much sway in someone emerging to be the champion of this issue? >> i'm blocking on the name of one movie that was made where, you know, it was teachers who were standing up and fighting. it's, of course, the unions then took on the movie and made that the movie as a democrat. i don't understand why democrats wouldn't say we should have been ahead of this issue forever. >> instead of climate change, it would be nice. if you're beyonce or j-z why not make that your cause? >> this is the new prohibition. when you had politicians railing against evil booze, but then

they'd return to well stocked speak easies and get wasted. it's the same with school choice. they come out against school choice but enroll their kids in private schools. there should be a law that if against school choice, your children must go to a public school. they've got to have that law. >> by the way, i think that movie's called don't back down or won't back down. >> the sad thing is the children are losing at the expense of unions' profits, and it's very disturbing to me. your party should be championing this cause. >> that's what i think. i think it should be out front and agree with you. and the thing is, it gets heavily politicized because they say, well, other groups get to the republicans and these union -- but what about forget it, the kids -- education. >> what about the children? >> it's -- nothing will change because there's literally hundreds of millions of dollars going to 95% democrat campaigns. so you going to be a democrat or say i'm going to walk away from $3 million or $4 million in the campaign because i care about

the children? no, not going to do it. >> i think at some point you've got to be -- >> and that is. you kind of distance yourself from the liberal left in that regard. something i wanted to show about the teachers union is the biggest problem with our schools. people fell off their chair. they couldn't believe -- but you're right. the problem is when there's hundreds of millions of dollars going to people who want to vote in favor of -- i think it's all -- >> a distraction. >> it's like, i said. what do you care about with regard to your kid. do you care about his education or the money. you could say i want to educate my kid first and foremost. >> don't forget. money's what makes campaigns now. >> one more thing coming right at you. stay with us. test test

it's time for one more thing. >> i'll go first. there's a senate armed services committee meeting today. former secretaries of state, henry kissinger, george schultz were there to testify. watch what happens after. >> i have never seen anything as disgraceful and outrageous and despicable as the last demonstration that just took place about -- you're going to have to shut up or i'll have you arrested. get out of here low life scum. >> yeah! bringing it. >> good job. >> make that your ring tone. >> marilyn manson calls you can play that. >> you're next. >> okay, fox 10 arizona's morning weather man had a

technical glitch. >> now, i'm not authorized to evacuate evacuate, and it's a total loss. you might as well get out. >> i love it. >> really. we're on fire. >> funny. and global warming. >> it's burning. >> juan williams. >> well, listen, if you were at the new england patriots' hotel last night around 4:45 a.m. with greg, guess what, a fire alarm went off woke everybody up. oh, my gosh, and this is the second time in three nights tuesday night it was at 1:30 a.m., they had a fire alarm and woke everybody up. >> it was on purpose. >> what do we think?

well, they asked rob gronkowski, the patriots' tight end, he said, i slept through it. apparently nothing wakes him up. but identify got to wonder if those seattle seahawk fans aren't up to some tricks. >> watch your mouth. >> cheating is the name of the game. >> and there was greg in the hallway in his shorty robe. >> everybody's cheating. it's my point. it is national puzzle day. and i know you're excited about that. i love doing puzzles. i think we have pictures and puzzles. that was elana's handy work right there. that one was a good one. i encourage everyone to try a puzzle with your family. it is a really good way to spend a weekend.

you'll be a tight knit family. greg, you're last. >> it's time for "i hate these fish." as you know, i hate seafood. check out what happened to this poor cat. >> oh, my gosh. you're thinking, hey this is a pretty good meal i think i'll have this for dinner. and so he's stubborn, it looks delicious. don't wave me away, this show isn't over. this is what happens because fish look disgusting. >> okay. >> and that is a great lead in for

>> it is friday january 30th. a fox news alert. back to the terror battlefield. one of the fighters swapped for sergeant bowe bergdahl trying to reconnect now with the taliban. this as the obama administration still refuses to call the taliban terrorists. >> the captain of the plane locked out of the cockpit. >> our pilot just got locked out. >> the dramatic moments on board the plane. >> a super bowl super star in the game of his life might not take the field sunday. why richard sherman might be watching the game from the