get your ass back inside. >> >> we can shoot our way out of here? >> no. oo tonight a "kelly file" >> tonight veryfor the very first time two of the young women inappropriately touched by josh dug duggar speak out about what happened. jill and jessica are two of the 19 kids belonging to jim bob and michelle dug gar. tonight they reveal themselves as victims of their brother josh's inappropriate touching. saying they want to set the record straight about what went on some 12 years ago under their parent's roof and what did not. they will speak in moments but

we begin with what has proven to be an intense few days for the entire duggar family. an exclusive interview. >> we went through wonone of the darkest times. our son josh came to us on his own and he was crying and he had just turned 14 and he said that he had actually improperly touched some of our daughters. >> we were shocked. we were devastated. >> jim bob and michelle duggar sitting down for an exclusive interview after they reveal a family secret. their oldest son josh inappropriately touched five girls when he was a teenager four of whom are their teenaged daughters. why would they launch the show knowing of their family history. >> how did you first learn? >> he was the one that came and shared on his own.

as parents we felt we are failures. here we tried to raise our kids to do what is right to know what's right. >> some people have said why didn't they wait or go to the authorities or go to the counseling the first time he came to you? >> i talked to somebody that worked at one of the juvenile youth sex offender facilities. the success rate is not very good. it was a situation where we felt our son's heart had gone astray. >> what would make you launch a reality tv show about your family given this fast? >> we had nothing to hide. we had taken care of that years before. >> the media reaction was swift and strong. >> a lot of times they do an interview to lay this issue to rest. it may have raised more questions. >> as a father of three little girls it was a brutal hour of television to watch. >> don't bring up god.

don't do it. you can't do it and talk about god for giving people when you don't have forgiveness in your own heart. >> the problem started when you start celebrating people because they punchedmped out 19 kids. >> there's another part of the story, the story we haven't heard until tonight. two of the daughters sat down with us to reveal they were among josh's victims. this revelation came at a time that had been the hp iest of their lives. jill duggar dillard a new mom just 24 years old her wedding to derek was televised in a wildly popular episode of the family tv series. then there's jessa, 22 years old a newlywed herself expecting her first child with her husband ben. their wedding also televised with huge rating success. two women were subjects of unwanted touching and who today are the subjects of a media

circus. tonight they break their silence about their secret and their heartache. >> thank you both for being here. let me start with your ages. you are 22. how old are you? >> 24. >> this happened a long time ago. how old were you? let me start with you. how old were you when josh inappropriately touched you? >> i was 12. >> how about you? >> i guess i was 9 or 10. >> you are going on the record as being two of josh's victims. >> uh-huh. >> does it feel strange to you that word? >> we didn't choose to come out and tell our story. this wouldn't have been our first choice but now this story has been brought about we feel like as we have been seeing the headlines as we have been seeing things people are saying about our family we feel like as victims we have to come out and

speak. this is something like we choose to do nobody asked us to do this. jes and i were talking oh my goodness most of the stuff out there is lies. it's not true. we want to set the record straight. >> sitting here today, when i said victims you furrowed your brow a little. do you feel like the vic tinl of a molestation? >> i think in the case of what josh did it was very wrong. i am not going to just fy anything that he did or say it was okay. not permissible. but i do want to speak up in his defense against people who are calling him a child molest error a pedophile or a rapist. that is so over board and a lie, really. i mean people get mad at me for saying that, but i can say this. i was one of the victims. i can speak out and say this and

set the record straight here. in josh's case he was a boy, a young boy in puberty and little too curious about girls and that got him into some trouble. he made some bad choices. really the extent of it was mild inappropriate touching on fully clothed victims. most of it while girls were sleeping. >> we didn't know about it until he went and confessed it with our parents. >> john of the victims were aware of what happened until joshua confessed. >> it wasn't like we were keeping a secret. we didn't know until josh explained to my parents what his thought process was what everything was. >> how did you learn about it? >> my parents took us aside individually and they said here's what has happened. and at that point you are like

you are shocked. >> your parents were the ones to tell you you were molested? >> oh yeah. >> and you, too. >> at the same time or separately? >> individually they talked to us. >> what was your reaction to that. >> i was like shocked and kind of like okay. this is strange. >> you had no knowing of it? >> i didn't know. i didn't understand okay this is what happened until my parents told me. so i think at that point it was kind of like -- >> it is like you never think this will happen to me. in our case it is very mild compared to what happens to come young women. >> i know some went through things that are way worse. >> when my parents sat down and told me this really? i am sad. i am shocked at the same time. like jessa was saying i am

shocked. okay. and i am sad because this is my older brother who i love a lot, and so it's like they are conflicting there. >> did you feel angry? >> i did. you know i was angry at first i was like how could this happen and then my parents explained to us what happened and then josh came and each of us individually i know but he asked me to forgive him. i had to make that choice to forgive him. it wasn't something somebody forced. you have to make that decision for yourself. you are 12 years old, 10, around there, and your parents sit you down individually and tell you when this happened. do you remember if it was 2002 or 2003? >> don't remember. >> you had the family meeting.

did josh go away right after that? >> he did pretty soon after. at the time i was young so it seems like everything was a whirlwind or whatever. >> were there times you were in the house with josh knowing this prior to him going away? >> not really. i think whenever it was brought to my attention it wasn't very long after that josh went away. >> you remember the dynamic of being in the house thinking there's my brother, i know this information now what am i supposed to do with this? >> we were sad whenever he was sent away. it's your brother. you are all still kids. but it was burned in our memory josh made bad decisions and he will suffer the consequences of those decisions. >> you get the chance -- you were feeling angry p. did you get the chance to express that anger to him?

>> did you fight? >> i think to us our situation is different than most girls in that he's very subtle. he knew in his mind my actions are wrong and i had bad intentions but he was very sly like the girls didn't catch on. if you catch the girl sleeping a quick feel or whatever. if you are just not really aware. in the situations it happened when the girls were awake they weren't aware it was happening. it was very subtle. so i think that for us it's like okay we realize this is serious but at the same time it wasn't like a horror story or this terrible thing. >> that's one of the headline covers. house of horrors. that's not how you view it? >> my parents i can see looking back as an adult they handleded the situation very well.

they set up safety guards in our house. they shent josh away. they had him get help. he when he came back he was a totally different person. >> how did that manifest itself? >> you could just tell. i mean he was repent enter whenever he left and he was apologizing. when he came back it was like okay i can see he has made some life changes here during this time and he's never going to go down that path. >> did you feel scared at all that he might resume? >> when this happened when my dad and mom sat down with us and shared us what happened and josh asked us to forgive him. he we had to make the choice that everyone has to make. my dad explained to us there's a difference between forgiveness and trust. that is not the same thing. you for give someone and then you have boundaries. forgiveness with boundaries. so trust comes later. josh destroyed that trust at the

beginning. so he had to rebuild that. so i think when he came back that was his point of okay -- actually, when he asked us to forgive him that was the point of rebuilding and then from there. >> what were the safeguards that were put into place to make sure? >> like -- >> i was going to say not being alone. my parents said okay we are not going to do this hide and seek thing where people go off and hide together. not baby-sitting girls. >> at night in your rooms? >> locks on the doors. everybody is in bed girls in the girls room boys in the boys room. so yeah. as a mother now, i look back and i think my parents did such an amazing job for me. even when we went through the dhs investigation they complemented my parents on wasn't an amazing job they did during that process. i think not only taking the legal action that they did and

then going the extra mile and i see as a mom, i hope that i can set up the same safeguards like my family like they did and reaching the heart of their children and not only trying to take care of josh but us girls. >> for the record did you ever have any trouble with any other family members. >> no. >> this is just about josh. >> yeah. my parents did talk to us when all of this came up they sat down with all of us kids every age and sat down and said if any one ever touches you inappropriately, come to tell mom and dad. you have a voice. >> did you think of yourself after they told you as a victim? is there a moment where the light goes off where i am a victim of molestation? >> i don't believe so. >> i think in our situation like i said we weren't aware that that was going on.

>> you talk to child molestation victims they often talk about feeling shame, things like that. did you go through any of that given the circumstances here? >> i think when we were doing the dhs investigation and they were asking you to tell your story, it is one thing to talk to mom and dad and say wow okay this happened. but strangers were like tell me your story here. >> our parents told us we all went down there they took us down there and they said we are going to share what happened here. they told us. our parents told us be completely hope and hon -- open and honest. >> you met with the investigators and told them your story. >> we told them. we were honest. here's what happened. we told them the complete story and my parents said this isn't something people are going to blab and.

you can trust tell them the story just like you do with mom and dad. it is a safe place to talk. >> unfortunately not. >> up next jill and jessa discuss what happened when they were questioned by the authorities. plus the moment that brought jill to tears. >> we were pretty serious. >> i was in tears. i couldn't believe what was going on. r you, the same way, you devour food that's not good for you. ♪ my lenses have a sunset mode. and a partly sunny mode. and an outside to inside mode. transitions® lenses automatically filter just the right amount of light. ask for transitions xtractive lenses. extra protection from light... outdoors indoors and in the car. huh, fifteen minutes could save you fifteen percent or more on car insurance. everybody knows that.

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>> in 2006 an investigation was launched into josh duggar. they were ensured their statements would remain private. >> we told them the complete story my parents said this is not something people are going to blab and. you can trust these people and tell the story just like you told mom and dad. it is a safe place to talk. >> yet? >> unfore natalie not. >> any hesitation when you decided to put your family on tv that this would come out? >> i think whenever we started the tv show the reality show was that five years or something after all of this. we had dealt with it. as a family we had moved on.

>> there was never a fear we are targets now we are on tv we are outspoken? >> all of the people in our lives the close friends and the people the officials that helped us walk along side of our family during this time and walk along the hardest days they knew about this. people walked through this with us. we didn't feel like there was a need to share private information about the people who weren't a part of the problem or the sool luges. after all of the months they said your parents have done an amazing job. your home is a safe place for children. >> some of the family critics would say you not only went on tv but you add voe indicated strong christian values now critics are saying the family

shouldn't have been out there doing that since they knew what had happened. is that fair? >> well i think that some people i have heard them saying you know you are hypocrites. well if you go back and look at everything that people have seen in our lives on television we have never claimed to be a perfect family. my parents actually stated we are not a perfect family. we are just a family with challenges just like everybody else. >> with lots of kids that has 20 times more people in our family. >> how about josh though. he has been out there with the family research council talking about family values and suggesting that certain lifestyles are not aproep jat in-- appropriate. >> it is all right to say here's my thoughts if you have failures in the past doesn't mean you can't have change. i think the real issue is people

are making it sound like it happened yesterday. >> and that it is ongoing. >> it happened 12 years ago. he was a child himself. seeing the change in his life we witnessed it. we know. >> jessa made a good point. as we were talking she said you know i think the hard part here is our viewers feel like they are in our home every tuesday night. they feel like they know our family, but when we are out and about and people are coming up to us and saying hey jesse or we are hi we are saying hi. we don't know you. we don't have that personal -- >> like you know people expecting to know every detail of our lives when this happened long ago before the show. >> we are not going to say hi nice to meet you here is

everything that has ever gone con. >> when you found out it was going to be on the cover of in touch weekly? >> i tell you we were pretty serious. >> i was in tears. i couldn't believe what was going on. whenever i heard the police report it was a big relief and i said what? they don't have a right to do this. we are victims. they can't do this to us. >> yet they did. >> and they did. >> this wasn't set up to protect

kids also who make stupid mistakes or have problems like this in their lives and the ones affected by those choices. it is greatly failed. for us it is like go to the store and there's your picture or magazine and you are like -- >> they are like whatever things they might say legally we can do this and we can do that. it's like it's obviously not -- they are not protecting us here. >> freedom of information act is not -- you can't have juvenile cases. there's hoke key pokey going on there. i don't know what it was. i know that the tabloids released it, they are used to exploiting women. they have the parent companies>> they are a major porn provider. maybe their mind set they are used to making objects out of

women maybe -- >> when we see the tears what was it? what was it about the disclosure that was so painful? >> i see it as a re victimization that is a,000 times worse? >> why? >> because this is something that was already dealt with. we have already forgiven josh. we have already moved on. >> what is the emotion that you are feeling? >> it is not the truth first of all. everything when thisas distorteded. we feel our story was not being told and we felt like it shouldn't have been told. the victims are the only ones who can speak for themselves so now that it has already been forced and told however they want to portray it then we felt like that's why jess and i wanted to come out and say that's not what happened.

we have dealt with this. we have taken care of it. >> do you feel like you are speaking on behalf of your other sisters? >> we can't speak for the other ones but i feel like as far as i can speak for the others in as far as saying that everybody is angry that this has been publicized. >> how about when it comes to for giving josh? >> everybody has forgiven him. >> that was long ago. >> the baby-sitter as well? >> yes. definitely. >> the parents say they are looking at legal action against the parties involved. >> up next the women answer that question, they discuss the counseling they received and they will tell us what is'cv=y next for the duggar family. they work fast and don't taste chalky. mmm...amazing. thank you. alka-seltzer heartburn reliefchews. enjoy the relief. for the millions of americans suffering from ringing in their ears,

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and call your doctor right away. other side effects include gas, stomach-area pain and swelling. bottom line, ask your doctor about linzess today. duggarduggar. >> live from america's news headquarters i am kelly wright. good evening. a manhunt for two convicted killers on tonight. they are offering a 100,000 dollar reward for information leading to their capture. they are looking for the man who escaped from the maximum security prison. road blocks are up and cops are using helicopters and blood hounds. the two are considered to be extremely dangerous. german chancellor miracle says she expects g 7 leaders to be on the same page about sanctions against russia because of the

ukraine crisis. they agree the sanctions will remain in effect until russia fully implements the peace agreement reached this past february. g 7 leaders holding private meetings at the summit to discuss trade mainly the trance pacific partnership pact. i am kelly wright. now back to the kelly files. >> jill and jessa duggar feel violated by the public exposure of their ordeal. do they feel like somebody should be punished. >> the parents suggest they are looking at legal action against the parties involved. >> i can say that what was done was very wrong. the terrible thing about being a victim is you are helpless in the moment over the actions of others, and then i feel like in this situation we are again

helpless as to the people handing over this report and then the tabloids taking that and printing that and sen sayingsnalizing itlize -- sensationalizing it and using it for their own profit. >> you see so many people stand out on behalf of child victims. we have seen very little of that with respect to your case and your privacy rights and the violation of those promises your record and your testimony would be sealed. do you think it has something to do with who you are? who the duggars are what your family stands for? >> i definitely feel like people that arelready don't really like our family would be the ones who really spread this around fal lusciously do so slander us they didn't have the victims in mind. >> i feel for the girls. i am like no you really don't, if you did you would respect our

wishes for things to remain private. >> i feel for the other families out there. status statistics say two-thirds of families deal with something like that. i feel for the other victims out there and other families who maybe the parents may take a pause before they do something to report or to take care of what is going on. maybe these other victims continue to live just not -- having the situations dealt with. >> some refer back to the charges the incidents they say maybe the stat tations have run. would you ever have supported a prosecution against josh? >> i think by the time that all of that was done the report was made and everything it was very

obvious to everyone, us in our family, friends, officials that josh was a completely changed person. he had not gone down that path for years. he was humble before god, before us before the officials. we all went through professional counseling but josh did, too. he had to pay for his own. >> did you have to work that out? what were you working out there? what do you do in counseling you talk about what happened. you talk about the actions that have been taken. we really wanted to make sure that everything in our heart was dealt with. >> did you solve some things in there? >> i am really grateful that my parents encouraged us to go through that to get that counseling and all of that. it was helpful for us to close that chapter and move past it.

>> for you looking back what was the most difficult part of it for you>> with the exclusion of today? >> i don't think we can exclude today. definitely it was difficult when it came up the shock of oh this happened and then talking about it with the family and counseling. every step was difficult to walk through, but i would say these past two weeks have been a thousand times worse for us. >> do you wear about the tlc show? do you want it to continue? >> we have always thought of the show as a window of opportunity to allow our family to be on television and share with other people our lives. >> what about the fact that it may disappear not just for josh

or your parents. >> we are not a tv family. we are a family that happens to be on tv. >> we do love our film crew. they are like family to us. we will see. we will see what life brings. we don't know. >> this is it right? it is not another big duggar family secret that is going to come out. you feel like if you can weather this storm with tlv. >> we have been through a lot together. our viewers can see that the journey our family has taken it has not always been easy on television. they have seen that yet we have still allowed the filming to take place and allowed people to see our struggles see things we have gone through from my little sister josie being born premature to the funerals.

this is another show we are going through right now, another hard time but it is bringing our family even closer together. >> definitely. >> we were all sitting around when this came out i was like guys the people out there may be stirring things up. look on the bright side at least we are all in harmony as a family and we all love each other like crazy. >> thank you so much for speaking with us. >> the duggar girls talked repeatedly about how they felt victimized not once but twice. >> what was it about the disclosure that was so hateful? >> i see it as a re victimization that is a thousand times worse. my lenses have a sunset mode. and a partly sunny mode.

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serious. >> i called and i was in tears. i couldn't believe what was goingu] whenever i heard the police reports had been released i said what? is like they don't have a right to do this. we are victims. they can't do this to us. >> yet they did? >> they did. >> jill duggar dillard talking emotionally about they all but identified her as a sexual abuse victim made her feel victimized all over again. howard kirtz is the host of fox

media buzz. as the silence dawned on the room and the tears flowed you could hear jill's infant son two months old crying in a room above us son crying as his mother suffered below recalling the pain of the past two weeks and her sister sitting next to her is pregnant expecting her first baby too. these are vibrant beautiful young women who are supposed to be in the crime of their lives and you tell me what if any ethical obligations in touch magazine had to think of them before they put that story in their magazine basically identifying them as sex abuse victims? >> watching them bravely have you gone struggle through that through the tears watching them say they felt victim icedized 1,000 times worse than the original unwanted touching breaks your heart. put aside the legalities why is

it okay for in touch weekly and every other media outlet on the planet to violate an iron glad rule of journalism and essentially identify these young women? >> they did. they revealed it was the sisters. it doesn't take a lot of math to figure out who was in the police report. we are supposed to follow a code where we don't do that. is it because it is a christian p outspoken family that pass judgment on certain people's lifestyles did you ibut i didn't see that exception in the ethics book. >> absolutely. i think maybe there was a sense this is a reality show. these people put themselves out there. they preach christian values they are hypocrites they are fair game. it all seemed abstract when the media were kind of lapping up this admittedly riveting story about josh duggar and the family and the show and the

molestation. when you look at those two young women who as you say one a new mother one about to be a mother it is almost like they were collateral damage nobody thought of them. >> i see the pundits on other shows talking about how who was there to protect them. where was the parents. where is their thought for the girls now? where is their condemnation for media that was only too willing to throw away thoseanonymity that promised the girls and guaranteed under the law. >> the media's conduct has been a nonissue because it is so much easier to feast on this speckle. i don't have any problem with criticism of josh duggar who did a horrible thing who i notice didn't joan the interview. the parents put the whole family at risk by putting them in the glare of a reality show while having this secret but, to

listen to gel and jessa it is almost like a heartbreaking clinic in the fact that media can inflict a lot of damage on people. these two women who are the victims in some ways they didn't think of themselves as victims they were dealing with their where are they love, all of that they have been traged through the mud here. they didn't want to sit and talk to you. they had to. it was brave of them. >> what about the other victims that are out there right now considering going forward considering calling that hot line howe and the only way they will do it is if there's a promise of confidentiality that they are protected as juveniles and they see this. >> that's the worst of it. the police say this is confidential it will never come out. counselors tell people to come forward. we want people to report sexual abuse they see this and there has got to be some gnawing doubt that maybe they shouldn't come

forward. that's the question for the media to rest el with. they need to wrestle with it. all of us need to wrestle with it. at what point is the story not worth it because of the damage inflicted on people who in this particular case didn't ask for this were victims of abuse within their own family? >> howe thank you. >> my pleasure. >> jessa and jill were braver to speak out in the midst of a family crisis. up next we will talk about the choice the duggars face and what really were their options. don't miss it. ♪ every auto insurance policy has a number. but not every insurance company understands the life behind it. ♪ those who have served our nation

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>> sittinger here today when i said victims you furrowed your brow a little. do you feel like the victim of a molestation? >> well i think in the case of what josh did, it was very wrong, i am not going to justify anything that he did or say it was okay not permissible, but i do want to speak up in his defense against people who are calling him a child molest error a pedophile or rapist some people are saying. that is so over board and a lie

really. >> jessa duggar talking about her brother josh. >> emma holds a doctor rat are sociology. she chairs the sociology and criminal justice department at st. francis child. she is the author of "protecting our kids how sex offender laws are failing us." we thank you for being here. >> thank you. >> what did you make of the girl's testimonial there? >> it highlights the complex nature of sexual abuse within families especially when the perpetrators are also children. >> how so? >> they clearly love their brother. it wasn't necessarily been a bad thing if he was put into prison and put on the sex offender list. one-third of people who sexually abuse children are children themselves. as a society we have to recognize this. we don't talk about this. many people on the sex offender list are children. >> could be as young as 9 or 140

years old. >> -- 9 or 10 years old. >> i interviewed many people who grew up on the registry who were convicted as sex offenders as children for things similar to this. the average age of people who sexually abuse children who are child sexual abusers of children they are 14. >> that's important. we looked into this. a question a lot of people have is josh duggar a child molester in the way we understand that term today? is this somebody who is likely to reoffend in the way we see adult mol desteresters do? >> child offenders have much lower recidivism rates. >> we like to think they are predator reuncontrollable. that is a very small percentage of people who are convicted of sex offenses or commit sex offended. juvenile sex off fernds like josh duggar have even lower rates. treatment is effective.

>> 2009 department of justice study said those who offend around this age 14, 15 years old, 85 to 90 percent of them never commit another sexual offense again. >> that's a credible study. >> others found lower rates. treatment works. intervention works. >> let me ask you this. the girls, you talk about how the parents faced a terrible choice. we talked about that on the air the other night. viewers said no they didn't. it is not. you turn in the son. you get him out of the house immediately to protect your other daughters because they didn't do that immediately they had other girls fall victim to what they view as a predator. >> let's step back. there's so much emotion and his terria. the pitch forks came out. they said these people did a terrible thing. can you image having one child who is sexually accused -- accused of sexually abusing your children. they love their son, they love their daughters.

they want to protect everyone. if you go to the police you will be taken out of the home and go to jail. >> you involve the cops -- >> although that didn't happen. they went to the state trooper it didn't happen initially. >> thfdz unusual. >> do you have any concern in this line of work of what message the outing of this the backlash against the family is sending to other child abuse victims sexual abuse victims? >> i think families are going to be even more hesitant to get help. >> thank you for being here. coming up final thoughts before we go. ♪ [whirring drones] ♪ no sudden movements. ♪ [screaming panic] ♪ [whirring drones] google search: bodega beach house. ♪ ♪ [drones crashing]

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we help them fight the good fight. use health is everything. (vo) around age 7, the glucose metabolism in a dog's brain begins to change. (maryjo) she's always interacted with dogs and now does suddenly not want to be around dogs. (jack) she's very much a loner. (maryjo) you are what you eat and this is definitely the case with bright mind. (jack) i've been surprised by how much has happened. she's much more affectionate than she was. (maryjo) she just has integrated herself into the family again. (vo) purina pro plan bright mind promotes alertness and mental sharpness in dogs 7 and older. purina pro plan. nutrition that performs. >> the judge thein the duggar's case says the police report should never have been disclosed. they out child sex abuse victims in this way the law needs to be changed. this case may shine the light on how we can better protect our

young victims in the homes and in the media. if you are someone in need of help pleads find the courage to come forward. call 1-800-4 a child. i am megyn kelly. thanks for watching. >> you can do this greg. you can do this. this is your show. don't screw it up like last week. this is going to be the one. this is going to be the one. you can do it. go get em greg. >> it could be my son. could be anybody. you don't mess around with that garbage garbage. you understand me? >> what garbage? >> don't make a jerk out of me. >> don't do it. >> don't do it. >> you are right. you are right. i won't. >> you understand we are on the air you