>> thanks to gavin. john gab bore. father jonathan morris, marc cuban, katherine, joanne, the liberal panel. boy this show is tonight on "red eye" the ashley madison hackers ex-- exposing those having affairs. and is calling somebody an anchor baby offensive? or is it an accurate way to describe peter doocy. and do optimists lead better lives? our panel provides things you wanted to hear and need to hear. first, a news break.

welcome to "red eye." hello, everyone. i'm tom shillue. let's check in with tv's andy levey at the news deck. andy? >> not a great day.

>> why is that? >> it looks like your boy might get rid of tom brady's suspension. >> that's fantastic news. one great american standing up for another. >> people are so disgusting. >> what do you mean you people? >> barbershop quartets from new england. >> let's welcome our guest. she is so good at acting she almost has me convinced she wants to be here, joanne nosuchunsky. everyone is a crit tig, but ease -- critic, but especially this guy. last time i saw someone that was this good looking court he still had an acting career. the criminal defense attorney remi spencer. and he is my third favorite tony behind bennett and the tiger. tony rock. let's start the show. the only news bigger than trump is the sensational data dump. the ashley madison hackers released millions of addresses

registered to the cheating website and busted users are coming forward to admit their moral failings. no, actually they are of onerring explanations. a scottish minister of parliament said, quote, an out of use e-mail address seems to have been harvested by hackers. and one writer clarified, i think if i signed up to ashley madison i didn't sign up once with a potential feature. feel free to use this excuse. the rest of the internet is cracking jokes of the impending divorces of these love rats. "looks like christmas came early for divorce lawyers." the hackers released more ashley madison users despite the pleas of top celebrities. >> hundreds of thousands of people signed up. >> you do know that, right? >> you should reconsider. >> don't do it. >> does that matter to you? >> what is the point. >> it is none of my business. >> there are a lot of tom shillues out there. >> i don't get it, man. >> seriously, don't do it.

>> people's lives could be ruined. >> they stole my credit card. >> i didn't get paid for that. i did it it as a public service. >> the internet is treating it as a big joke and like it is entertainment, but people's lives are on the line, breaking up marriages. it is terrible. >> i love this more than i can possibly say. >> you do? >> i love this. i love the idea that people thought somehow that there was a fail safe method of going hunting for available women when you were married, and that somehow karma would not fall on you like a ton of bricks. >> it's true. you are tempted to think that, but tony, the thing is there are other people in this equation. assuming we are talking about a cheating husband, right? there are wives and there are children. >> they will get exactly what they deserve because to be a good cheater everybody knows secrecy, anonymity, there is

no logging in and no pass words. you get what you deserve for thinking you can cheat on-line. >> that's what it said. they promised complete anonymity. >> if you log on, you will get caught. secrecy is the key to cheating. >> i don't understand. remi, don't you have sympathy for the people caught up in this? >> not really. what is so fun fee about this story is the numbers came out. the number of men to women, the ratio, was so big that it was virtually impossible that these men would be able to cheat. they are basically communicating with an anonymous, nonexistent profile. >> it is a level that you can hardly imagine. men are getting caught for wanting to cheat, for having paid money in the desperate hope they can find a woman and maybe rent a red roof inn with. to find a way out of their

dull, sad marriages. >> what was the cheat? maybe they just wanted somebody to talk to. >> maybe that is it. >> and what if they wanted a little on-line entertainment? some say they were fantasizing and looked at the profile and they paid the monthly fee and sometimes the extra $200 for the guarantee diswhrie. are consultants who are publishing articles about what to do if you are -- if you or a senior member of your company is caught up in this scandal. it is about being pro-active and denying. basically it is from a business consultant and it says deny it until you die. and then disassociate from the company. i think when the dump happened, there was enough wiggle room and excuses. the caveat was there was no way to confirm these e-mail addresses are accurate or active. so i think that gives just about every individual an out. >> thisy have an out. >> maybe. listen, this is lazy cheating.

i prefer lipstick on a collar orie seat in the pants pocket. that's the way to do it. when we are speaking about morality, which is more wrong? cheating or hacking and exposing -- like posting this leak? >> that's what i'm looking for. >> cheating is more wrong. >> when the sony leak happened, and all of these e-mails are being put on blast we are like, oh, porally, should -- morally, should i look at these e-mails? should i not? i get the whole karma thing. i do. some of the e-mails were not nice from the sony execs. on a pour rail tee standpoint none of us are saints. >> i can't believe it you do sympathize more. you think the hackers are okay? you said cheating is worse than releasing the names of millions of people and ruining tens of thousands of lives? >> what we are balancing is your right to privacy on the

internet . as you just .ed out it does -- as you just pointed out it doesn't exist. versus the person you committed your life to. the betrayal to your spouse is far worse than the privacy on the internet. >> that's the hacker's nature is to ruin everything. >> they are taking it all down. >> if you want to be serious, of course that's a horrendous and horrific invasion of privacy, and it is dangerous. if you are going to go this way it is like -- this is elementary proof that we need to tear up our credit cards, cut them up and never do anything on-line again. at some point one of us -- every one of us will get caught up and our credit ratings will be ruined and personal information exposed. if you work for the federal government at any point in the last 25 years, chances are the chinese have your social security number. this is like really scary stuff, and what the hackers did is incredibly immoral and dangerous. having said that, it is impossible not to enjoy this story. i'm sorry.

>> well, i don't enjoy it. >> i don't believe you. i don't believe you don't enjoy it. >> i don't weep for the website. ashley madison was a bad website. they will probably go out of business. i feel bad for these people. they are weak people. it is terrible. ashley madison is eke wering relationships. ashley madison is wrecking relationships. let's take a look. >> lucy want kisses? >> no more. >> donald trump is finally making some news. i told him he has to break out of his shell. as part of the immigration plan the front runner said he would end birthright citizenship. if you are born in america and you are an american citizen and even if your parents are here illegally. he uses the term anchor babies to describe these kids which some people find offensive, but when this was pointed out to him by a concerned

journalist he quickly apologized and backed down. >> are you aware that the term "anchor babies" is an offensive term? >> you mean it is not politically correct and yet everybody uses it? give me a different term. what else would you like to say? >> the american born child that is an undocumented immigrant. >> you want me to say that? i will use the word anchor baby. i will use the word anchor baby. >> that's rude. if he wanted a different term he should have given another two-word term. >> trump is a dw an -- trump is a gangsta. i will use the word i want to use, anchor baby. that's hilarious. >> it is script tiff. they don't mean an actual anchor. >> the picture it paints is funny. >> it is. and he doesn't like politically correct behavior. >> that's what i like. >> there are a lot of people who wouldn't go for trump, but they like his plain speaking. isn't that true? >> i like that he doesn't

mince his words. he takes shots at other comedians and he just -- >> he is funny. >> no filter. i love it. >> john, you love him too. i know that. >> i love him like my late aunt gerdie. here is what i'm saying. i'm opposed to this whole idea of ending birthright citizenship, but the notion that anchor babies which itself was created as a euphemism to describe the children of undocumented immigrants or illegal aliens that that is now offensive when it exists -- it references no color, no race, no ethnicity, no country, nothing. it merely describes a phenomenon, the idea that you have a baby in the united states in order to secure residency in the united states. it is the opposite of something that should be considered offensive. >> i agree. now, joanne, you have to be honest. you tell it like it is. you don't have to be politically correct. i want trump on this.

>> but everyone is forgetting that anchor is an acronym. it stands for america's newest citizen having obsolete rights. i just thought of that right now. >> that's pretty good. >> amazing. >> what's fascinating is i believe it was in 2006 that the "new york times" did a piece saying that "anchor babies" is a derogatory term. that it is offensive. and then in 2011 -- it was because of the elections happening and the debates and everything. it was people who were opposed to these rights and the deal with the 14th amendment. that opposition is what brought this about. >> are you thinking of the times that brought this to common usage? >> yes. >> we will talk about the 14th amendment. i will discuss the issue of the rights themselves. is anchor baby an offensive term?

>> before donald trump was using the term, i will be honest i was not familiar with the term "anchor baby." to me it feels uncomfort believe a. i am not sure if offensive is the word. why can't we call them citizens? why can't we call them citizens by birth? >> we are calling them that. we are calling them citizens, but we are also calling them anchor babies. what if their parents call it to them lovingly. oh you -- i am now a citizen. you are my little anchor baby. >> nondescript. i think the important issue and the more legal issue that is before us is what done thald trump is say -- donald trump is saying. he wants to deprive someone's brighter right -- someone's birthright to citizenship and some lawyers would agree that that's okay. what we know is that the 14th amendment of the united states constitution makes this a right and it can't be changed. >> well, i might argue with

you. let's move to the next issue. the issue of birthright citizenship stems from the 14th amendment that says if you were born in the u.s. and subject to the jurisdiction there of, you are an american citizen. trump isn't the only candidate opposed to this idea. rand paul, lindh see gram, rick santorum and ted cruz, all republicans, and here is the donald arguing with bill o'reilly about it. >> from you born here, you are an american, period. period. >> but there are many lawyers who are saying that's not the way it is in terms of this. what happens is they are in mexico and they will have a baby and they move over here for a couple of days and have the baby baby -- but bill they say it won't holdup in court. >> let's see how one anchor baby reacted to trump's comments. >> i would much rather find out whether or not anchor babies are actually citizens. >> test it out. have your guiles file a federal suit tomorrow. >> we are going to test it

out. >> they are going to test it out. >> remi, since you started this argument, he was talking about this, the 14th amendment, this will not include persons born in the united states who are foreigners, aliens and belong to families of ambassadors or ministers accredited to the government of the united states. but it will include everyone else. what do you think of that? it will include certain classes of people including foreigners it said. >> historically the 14th amendment was subject to the most debate. it almost didn't pass in the 1800's but it has been interpreted by our courts which is their obligation, marbury versus madison to say if you are born in this country you are a citizen. what people have trouble with is the person who illegally jumps the border to give birth and take advantage of that. >> are you saying that's included? >> it is included under the 14th amendment as it is today. the problem is, president obama had been selectively

enforcing our immigration law. >> we have heard all of that before. >> but that's the distinction. >> i don't know if that's the problem. >> i am glad you quoted the senator from 1866. let's make it clear that there are lawyers, and i know some of the lawyers who argue that you can make a case that there is no birthright citizenship as the 14th amendment is written. that is not case law. we have almost a hundred year history of adjudication of this. the only real way to do this is to pass a constitutional amendment overturning this part of the 14th amendment and claiming that you cannot have an anchor baby. >> how about passing a law that says if you walk across the border and give birth, that doesn't count. law, boom. >> no, that's not how it works. >> that's never been done?

my law. tom shillue's law has never been done. >> pass it. >> i am declared it is unconstitutional by judges. >> i do wonder though would republicans rather -- a lot of people come here to have birth because this country provides a wonderful life obviously for new babies. would republicans rather the babies be born here or the mothers don't have the child in their own country and terminate the pregnancy? would you rather the life happen? >> wow, that's really -- you are taking me through a maze there, joanne. >> that is crazy. that's like a meryl streep movie. i don't like that argument. >> you took it there. >> we know the 14th amendment was about black people, right? >> absolutely. >> when they talk about changing amendments, i get nervous. i know the bull's eye will end upright here at some point. >> they were trying to secure

the rights of americans, blacks, am i right? >> that's the point. if you were born in the united states as a slave, the 14th amendment meant that from that moment onward you were deemed to be a full citizen with full rights. that was the reason for the way the passage was written. having its interpretation that is more expansive has come to include everyone born in the united states. since the language of the 14th amendment is totalistic and it was an effort to specifically end the act of not counting people fully if they -- >> and i would add to that one president important point. included in the 14th amendment is our right to due process. >> we love that. >> fair process. >> i love all of the other rights, but i don't like the crossing the border and having a baby. coming up -- we have to go. good news from pessimists. pessimists? that's bad news. i'm confused. set your dvr to record "red eye" with tom shillue so you

can watch tivo with andy levey.

as an optimist i am used to being attacked by naysayers and those who want me to be miserable like them. he claimed 20 years of research proved that the power of positive thinking is a myth. she says optimists are stare eyed losers and pessimists have it going on. etigen is the author of the new book rethinking positive thinking. she says her research shows optimists spend all daydreaming of the wonderful things that will happen to them and pessimists get to work because what else are

they going to do? their life stinks. outcome, what will happen if you do get what you want? obstacles, what's in your way. and plan. what do you have to do to make this happen? that's called optimism. i think you are mixing us up with the dreamers. they are realists who keep repeating the benefits despite difficulties. the little engine that could. a classic optimist. yoing you need a whole new philosophy, professor or a whole new book. but god bless. i'm sure it is going to do great for you. >> remi, whistle while you work. that's what you say. and work is part of it. we don't just whistle, right? >> i actually for a change agree with everything you just said in your moment. >> it is critical thinking. it is risk analysis.

it is real life. that's not daydreaming. that's being optimistic. it is believing that you can and then setting out to accomplish your goals. >> i think that she is looking obviously for a best seller. she wants to rock the world with her theory. >> you know, i am a life long optimist until the premiere of the show "naked and afraid" and now i am -- that's it. now human nature, america -- >> do you watch the show sph. >> no, i only need to hear about it to know that civilization is finished. >> sorry. >> it gets me in trouble how optimistic i am. i am not going to be late. >> i don't get it it. i am still going to get it. or she is not going to be pregnant. >> that's what she is talking about. she said that is the classic act of the optimist. you have to be -- to be a

comedian you have to be an optimist. otherwise how would you get through the first two years? >> i am always positive thinking, positive thinking. i do the work as well. i don't just sit and say knock on the door and present itself. now let me start doing the steps to meet it halfway. >> it is all about the steps. joanne do you know gtd? getting things done? >> it is a system. david allen wrote the book. i am into gtd. >> okay. that's fine. i would say -- >> i think you need penicillin for that. >> it clears up in a few weeks. i am more of a realist. i recognize that all things aren't permanent. the good times don't last, but the bad times don't either. more than optimism, specificity gives you what you

want. you have to define what you are after in order to work for it. most of the things that i am most proud of in my life, i clearly imagined or said out lout that's what i want. and then the seas parted and i made it happen. >> remi, perhaps the good professor is defining things wrong. there are optimists and pessimists. and then there are doers. >> one of my law school professors is brilliant. his motto was, it is better to be lucky than to be good. and i think that that is part of it. you have to believe. you have to have faith. you have to be positive that things are going to go well. you work hard and you prepare. and then the really great things happen. i don't think pessimists have any advantage. they only have a disadvantage. i don't like them, and i don't want to be around them. >> fantastic. coming up, three minutes and 32 seconds of pink floyd "dark side of the moon." that's right. it is half time.

welcome back. time to find out what we got wrong and what we may have missed from tv's andy levey over at the "red eye" news deck. >> how are you? >> good. >> should you your coffee? >> ashley madison hack. that is indeed your name. you said you loved the idea that people thought there was

a fail safe way of hunting women while they were married and karma wouldn't fall on them like a ton of bricks. how about this? how about the fact that at least some of the people being outed may really be being outed. ie, they are gay and live in a country where being gay isn't safest thing in the world to do? or they are straight, but they live in a country where committing adultery is punished by something like, stoning? >> that's the horror. there are tens of thousands of names of people in saudi arabia, and it is not just stoning. i mean, yeah, adultery brings the death penalty. that's why despite the joking it is an evil. there is no question the hack is an evil. >> then we will agree to agree on that. >> okay. >> remi, you said the ratio from men to women made it virtually impossible if the men were going to be able to cheat. >> you got me, andy. but i just think it is kind of sad that these people were

hoping and believing that they had an opportunity that they never really had. and now they are being punished for it. >> it is actually a good point. how many people that signed up did tallly cheat? >> thanks. >> a quick lesson on how jewish guilt works. i am single. i never used an on-line dating or hookup app at all. i am walking around like, oh man i hope i am not on that list. what kind of way is that to go through life? i don't understand. you said the hacker's nature is to ruin everything. now, if i were you i would take this opportunity to apologize to the people who have the power to destroy your life. >> i have twitter and instagram and all of that. i am going down tonight. >> by the way, ashley madison does not verify e-mail addresses. the excuse that someone used -- if you say that wasn't me,

somebody used my e-mail could be true. >> it is the anthony wiener excuse. the problem is it has been used so many times in the past. >> but it might be true. >> it is hard to believe you are not guilty until proven innocent. >> the reason they do this is precisely so no one can verify if it is an actual person if they find the e-mail address. >> well that's why they suck. >> i don't care about that. >> by the way, a read it user used the ashley madison dump and census info and calculated the most unfaithful sates in the union -- states in the union. alabama is number one followed by colorado and the non-state of washington, d.c. west virginia, the least unfaithful. you all seem amazed by my stats. >> yeah. >> donald trump will keep saying anchor babies. you said you love trump like you love your aunt gerdie.

is that an expression? >> i just wanted to check that. >> i do agree with you. even a cultural marxist like me, i can't get worked up about it. then again i don't have a problem with describing people who imigrate here illegally. i guess i am weird that way. >> well you like accuracy. accurate phrasing of what happened there. >> and remi, you said the term makes you uncomfortable. i get that. here is how i feel about it. if there are people who are literally crossing the border just to hn here because they think it will give them a fast track to citizenship which by the way they are wrong about or if they think it may make it less likely they will get deported that they are having a kid for that reason which they may be right about i think anchor baby is a goodie script tiff term for those specific cases. maybe it shouldn't be a general term. >> when we can call them anchor babies we can call them

whatever we want to call them. the parent is committing a federal violation, a crime, by coming here. and if we had an administration that would prosecute according to the law and not be selective, we may not have as much of a problem as we do today. >> remi spencer says we can call them whatever we want. >> 14th amendment. it is possible trump may be right on this with regard to what the 14th amendment was intended to mean. i think remi is correct that he is wrong on wining a court case on it. and case law completely goes against his claim. >> yep. >> tony -- >> the three of us are all constitutional lawyers. >> one of us actually is. >> you were in that tram. >> yeah. >> when they start talking about changing amendments, that's when you get nervous. you said it was a funny joke, but it also is a really good

point in that once you start meddling with the constitution you could end up with all kinds of unintended consequences. >> somebody said it was the wording and it is not -- the way it was worded is what makes it hard to interpret. i think that's what we need to do. we need to clearly explain what we mean. it should be so simple like you have a baby here? baby good. so there is no way to get it through. >> as far as i can tell not a single european country has birthright citizenship. >> quite the opposite. >> i assumed this was one of the european things we adopted. it is usually mostly an american thing. >> tom, you said, quote, as an optimist i am used to being attacked by naysayers and want to make everybody as simple as

them. you don't have to ask. >> it is not just you. >> remi, you said you agree with everything tom said. just get out. >> you know i would never say that. i would normally never say that. >> i know. oddly i agree with you too, tom. i agree with you in that her definition -- the definition of optimism they are using is wrong. you are dead right about that. you're welcome. >> you're savoring it. >> you were a life long optimist until the premiere of the show "naked and afraid." do you now go through life naked and afraid? >> i am always afraid, rarely naked. i will also say it is important to point out that every person that is alive today had an ancestor who was smart enough to panic and run when a lion was coming. so if you think that optimism is a good -- was a good way for the human race to solidify

its presence on the planet earth, i think you have a wrong sense of the evolutionary nature of mankind. >> i am with you. i don't want to be anywhere near optimists. joe, you said you are more of a realist which i don't think is true because you don't seem cynical. >> that's funny. you're so funny. >> what? >> you're done? it is time to take a break. don't worry. we are coming back with the power of starn.

as allen sherman would say hello parent one ♪ hello parent two ♪ courts in tennessee decided to replace the word mother and father in all of their legal documents with the gender neutral terms parent one and parent two. that's until fox contributor wrote a column criticizing their decision after which the tennessee administrative office reversed the change. and you know what that is. #u.. ♪ that's the power of starn ♪ power of starn

>> don't mess with todd starn, right? >> right. i just want to say that you and i are the only people in america have what the hell you are referencing. allen sherman was a comedian in the early 1960s who wrote a song about camp and kids at camp. i'm explaining that because everybody on this panel was 12 years old except you and me. >> you are assuming i don't though. ♪ hello mother ♪ hello father >> thank you very much. i am a student of the game. >> it is your field. >> a young man, but being a comedian, he has to know his history. >> it wasn't even that funny, actually. >> the thing about allen sherman is he sold five million records and it is not funny. >> it is amazing. well, it happened a lot. >> apparently. >> tony, what do you think this putting aside the power of starn, was it silly to redefine and say parent one and parent two? >> we know why.

genders are changing to two mother households and two father households and other people raising other children. i have a sister who has a child and her baby daddy is a piece of crap, so i'm parent one and two and three and four and frief. >> it can say parent one, parent piece of crap. >> they are parent piece of crap and i am parent two. >> i have three kids. do you want grounds for divorce? who gets to be parent one? i am parent one and my wife said you are not parent one. i am parent one. i'm like, hey, i'm parent one. >> i would be willing to be parent two any day of the week. it seems like that's the way it is in my house. remi, what do you think of this? do they need to do this? people in their own relationships can figure things out. they use the term spouse. some couples whether they are same-sex they call themselves husband and wife. they make up their own terms. let them do it. >> i can't believe i am going to say this, but this is kind

of what donald trump is talking about with the politically correct and make everything neutral so nobody is uh febded. this is -- nobody saw fended. this is where he gets so much popularity because this is one of the instances. the change in mother and father and parent one and parent two is kind of stupid. our tax paying dollars or the tax paying dollars of the state are paying for that? who really cares what is on that form? really? cross it out and write your name. the big to do about it is kind of not that big of a deal. >> i think pretty soon they are going to be doing things like -- i mean you cross off sex, male and female. i feel like somebody will make a fuss about that, don't you? >> no doubt. i think they do it at colleges right now. i think remi is right. these efforts to reclassify things that have been classified this way since we started running away from dye

-- from dinosaurs. >> or aunt gerdie did. >> here we are in 2015 and suddenly the rules that have governed human by yold forever are being cast out of the window because of current political correctness and it is preposterous. >> joanne, you were probably too young to recognize allen sherman, but did you get the huey lewis reference i made? do you see what i mean? joanne, parent one and parent two? are you opposed? >> the words mother and father, it depends on what they mean to you. is it an identity or is it a job title? even in same sex couples isn't there with parenting styles a more motherly figure and a fatherly figure? even if you don't want to stick to gender roles, there is usually that balance when it comes to parenting children. there is someone who is the authoritarian and someone who

lets the kids get away with something. sometimes that is switched and sometimes there is only one parent who has to do both roles. fill it in yourself. >> fill it in yourself. one big happy. >> i agree with remi. who cares? is the kid being fed? does he have clothes to wear? >> fantastic. >> we will close things out with a bedtime story.

tonight i am happy to report a victory for american traditional valueses. the hilton hotel chain announced they will no longer provide adult video on demand in their hotel. hilton did acknowledge that guests will be able to access adult content on their wireless devices saying we believe in offering a high degree of choice and control during their stays with us including wi-fi on personal devices. but gone are the days you can order up such classics as throbinhood. goodwill hunting. yes, sir rase sick -- jurasic pork.

lord of the g strings. breast side story. i don't even know what that was. and free my willy. of course. there is this classic who banged roger rabbit? how much fun did you have coming up with that list? wow. it was a short one. i'm really disappointed. now i won't be able to spend an hour in a hotel room trying to see what's going on when they have it all scrambled. you are trying to -- >> you know that. that's another age thing. those days are back in the 80 when's we used to turn on the cable channel. we actually used to try to watch the dirty movies. >> you would press 3, 5 and 11 on the tv at the same tile. i don't know what the right

answer is. you are fantastic. do you think this is right or wrong? >> who cares? i mean, really. if you are going to watch porn you are watching it 24/7 anyway like they said in the article. your ipod, your ipad, whatever it is. now a days, you know, movie stars have sex tape out there. you can see it however and wherever you want. there are naked ladies walking around time square right now. whether it was good intentions or not there is too much porn in the world and better have less of it. >> too much porn? >> he perked up. >> if i am in a hotel room with my girl there is porn on demand anyway. >> and we are naked and afraid. >> you don't sound like you will be afraid. >> i might be afraid. are you sad to see the classics are gone though? the old feature films? >> i think it is really

terrible that once there was a time when, yes, when one could watch a parody of harry potter and t remember, the spin

stops here, because we're definitely looking out for you. >> new problems for the democratic presidential front runner. welcome to a "kelly file" special. i'm in for megyn kelly. tonight we take a look at the political and legal fallout from the controversy. first, finding e-mails from hillary clinton's private server were class bid at that time they were sent and received when she was secretary of state. we know this based on markings and codes you can find on the e-mails as well as there is