the results of the indexes have been so great. it's incredible. >> i want to thank you all. the cost of freedom continues now with david. on the place for business. fox. violent clashes in france. socialist protest ers slashing out to loosen bureaucratic red tape that's crippled businesses there and led to high unemployment. this as socialist bernie sanders continues winning votes and demanding more bureaucratic red tape right here. just a preview of coming attractions. hi, everybody, welcome. let's go on focus with steve forbes who's in l.a. today. thanks for coming.

rich, what do you think? >> the backbone of bernie sanders' support are these young people and unfortunately, they have no idea how bad it can get under socialism. no memory of the communist soviet union, but what this reminds me of is great britain in the late 1970s. the winter of despair in 1979. garbage piling up everywhere ch unions shutting down everything. not until margaret thatcher came through and cut through deck katds of growth did things get better. >> only us old folks realize that. that's the problem. john, what rich is saying the that it could happen here. >> i appreciate that young comment, but it's not going to happen in the united states. we're not french. we're not european. we decent from the people who wanted to escape european stateism, so, the idea that we

would embrace sanders, furthermore, the idea he could get his ideas past the house and senate, i don't think that's realistic. we're safe mere. >> but if money is any indication, bernie is very popular. in march alone, bernie got $44 million in contributions. that's a lot more than what hillary clinton got. she just got 29.5 million. >> i think what's happening is you're already seeinging the revolution. the protesters aren't in the street, but they're voting in the primaries and people who have been left out of getting preferential treatment by expanding government and growing entitlements, that person they're looking at is donald trump, so we're seeing this protest, but not on the street. we're seeing it at the ballot box. >> jessica, the point is that even if bernie is not going to win, i'm sure i've heard yu make that case and you're probably right, but still, he's getting all this money. he's pulling hillary to the left, so a lot of her policies are pretty much socialist or at least in that direction than his

are. >> they're clintonian. >> you're saying she's like bill clinton? >> i think it's an unnatural position for her. on some issues like gay marriage, that's where she is naturally, but on trade agreements, even probably parts of her health care plan, alleviation plan, this is a direct result of being pushed to the left by bernie and elizabeth warn, but again, as you've mentioned at the top, he's not going to be president and these ideas, i think they are really only hitting the young people here. older democrats are voting in droves for her. she had 2.5 million more votes. >> you just killed our demos. >> steve forbes, stick with bernie for a second here. because some of what he is talking about is pure socialism. it is just socialist and that concerns a lot of people.

there's one professor wrote a pete in the dallas morning news a couple of days ago saying sanders' policies are incompatible with the american tradition of self-responsibility, self-determination and limited government under rule of law. is bernie sanders incompatible with american values? >> it is incompatible. we've seen in recent years, david, even though republil of real laws being made by regulatory agencies who are out of control. epa waging war on coal, oil and gas. telling companies that can't change their address of their headquarters, absolutely unlawless. so, if bernie ever did get in, which thankfully, he won't, you're going to see more of this from the top. even if hillary gets in, it will be more of the same. socialism with a frown, but still be far to the left of what we have today. >> to the extent we are still the strongest nation in the

world, both with our economic policies, military, et cetera, it's because we're a free market economic system. isn't that income pat bable with being a socialist? >> yes, it is and by the way, sanders' policies have been income pat bable, news flash, with the democratic platform from is the 60 through 2004. the democrats are in an identity crisis and that's the issue. we have an adolescent, juvenile outlook on policies from sanders, who's been in office since 1990 and has gotten his big government ways every time. big government does not lead to economic growth. the democratic party was xwens big government. they were for tax cuts, for 5% growth at one point. they said limit government, help out small businesses. >> jessica, is socialism incompatible with american values? >> i think it is and certainly, european -- i do think this is and that sanders, he is putting

out there this world view that it's impossible to have, let's look at denmark, france, look at the united kingdom, but we're a 300 million plus population country and we're diverse and that's when going back to what you were say, he's winning largely white states. not doing well in diverse states. the closest he's gotten is having a 30 point lead with african-american voters, so, the vision he's putting out for america is incompatible with what you are in terms of values, but also, who we physically are. >> we had property value, which define our free market system. are incorporated in our constitution. in our constitution. if we change concept of what is property and our property values, we have to change the constitution, don't we? >> yes, well, the constitution will get changed. even if it's not an actual people scribbling over the words already written. because remember, sanders is elected p president, who do you think the next supreme court pick is going to be? and how is that going to tilt

the supreme court? and now, they're going to back off all this stuff steve talks about, executive order overreach. the supreme court will back him, but mike, i have to say, even if it's hillary, i mean, obviously, she's not going to be as far to the left as sanders, but if hillary is president, she's picking those supreme court justice, won't she do a lot to change the law regarding private property? >> i think so. i don't think there's really much question about that. but i think the protests, particular ly the revolution going on is coming from in alternative. the people feel frustrated because republicans haven't taken a stand for prosecutor rights, for smaller government either. and i think that's why you're seeing this big push for donald trump because all the forgotten people that haven't gotten the preferential treatment in this great search for economic justice and all that has made this country worse and killed economic growth.

that's what people are frustrated about. >> steve forbes, go ahead. >> the whole thing is amazing that the whole culture of america could be attacked the way it is. through regulation and executive decrees and the republican party deserves to have its knuckles wrapped for not articulating these basic principles. if you want to see how to do it, go i was there yesterday. the reagan library. october 27th, 1964 speech in favor of barry goldwater, the republican nominee. eve p though the numbers have changed, the principles have not. listen to that speech. that should be the basis of the republican party. reagan had it right a half a century ago. >> to be sanguine about clinton, the policies would pull us further to the left than president obama has. i think she is more like president obama or to his left. >> yeah, what she's saying now in terms of her policies, i

agree. i think that's the fault of bernie sanders. hope federal government she gets sbo office, she won't behave like that. make no mistake what sanders is about. to leave no bureaucrat behind act. he wants bigger government so they can put their them on the scale as crony capitalists and create lunatic, complex laws that will basically, they retain the power. bernie sanders and his cronies retain the power on who gets favors on who they like. >> we've seen it happen everywhere in the world. that's it for now. while millions of americans are preparing to send more money to uncle sam by tax day, millions of others are skaling out of billions and you're paying for it. is it time to get rid of this irs program before it bleeds us dry?

when they thought they should westart saving for retirement.le then we asked some older people when they actually did start saving. this gap between when we should start saving and when we actually do is one of the reasons why too many of us aren't prepared for retirement. just start as early as you can. it's going to pay off in the future. if we all start saving a little more today, we'll all be better prepared tomorrow. prudential. bring your challenges. hello, everybody. disturbing new details emerging in the sexual abuse case against

former house speaker dennis hastert, prosecutors are now accusing him of abusing four young boys when he was a high school wrestlinging coach. he has not been charged in these incidents because of statutes of limitation. he pleaded guilty in december to paying hush money to one of those victims. space x landing ng the history books now. the falcon 9 rocket making a successful return to earth, touching down on a drone ship in the middle of the atlantic ocean. suffered from various mishaps. the unmanned rocket was coming back after launching a cargo castle to the international space station. now back to more forbes on fox. have a great day, everybody. getting down to the wire to get your taxes in, but look what we're finding out the irs is giving out billions to people

who pay little or no income at all and john says there's a fix for this. first of all, this is a huge, $66 billion program. essentially gives poor working people a bonus. a taxpayer funding bonus. go ahead. >> it's terribly offensive and we've got to get rid of the earned income tax credit to rid us of this bad idea. face it, the world's poorest would give anything to liver and work in the united states. the idea that we need to subsidize the work of people lucky enough to have been born in the united states is an offense to the nation. >> jessica, should we abolish this program? it's huge. and it's not terribly expensive. >> we have a lot of poor people. there's a fraud component, which is an issue. about people filing that haven't earned anything, but you can't get rid of the earned income tax credit without raising the minimum wage and we are talking about people who are working. these aren't free loader, people just living off welfare. they're out working and there is an incentive within this program

to keep working, so i don't really understand the argument to abolish it. >> here's the argument that fraud portion of the $66 billion is huge. it's 24% of the program $66 billion program. we can put up the chart again. 1$15.6 billion of it is imprope payments. people who are either lying or mistakes have been made. it's a huge problem with this program. >> so, what you're saying is nearly a fifth is fraudulent. this is what happens when you have chardonnay politicians who think they're going to right thing by the poor when they get a hold of a program. this is called the earned income tax credit. the problem is, the aitc is given out to people if they don't report income, hello. this is saying to the thooef, here's the taxpayer's wallet, steal it. take it. there's a cottage industry out there, david, where you have

these tax preparers filing for children, the elderly, people who haven't worked and they're stealing from taxpayers. that's money right out the door. >> steve, we are getting reports from accountants and other people, kind of nail iing down some of these reports, that it is a scam. that people are being drawn in and shown how to fraud the system. how to gain the system to get a piece of that $15 billion fraudulent pie. >> well, two things on it. first of all, this is an argument for the flat tax under my flat tax proposal. this would be phased out over five years, but it was put in to get people out of another abomination of the government, a so-called welfare trap. you went out and started to work, you end up being worse off than before. the fact it was administrated is no surprise for government, but there's a way and a pretty effective way with the 96 welfare reform act of getting people back in the workforce. but let's simp p fi the code and

get a flat tax and all these credits can go out the window and the fraud with it. >> well, we should mention by the way, this program was originally designed by a great economist. he came up with a idea. called a negative income tax back then. originally to get people off of welfare, but later in his life, he said this is, this was a disaster. i never should have implemented it. i should have seen the way it was going to blow out of proportion. >> i think the it's because as steve points out, this was an attempt to move from a welfare system to one in which people were working and rewarded for that. unfortunately, it has gone awry. i think the larger story here is les about the eitc and more about the ability to fraud the irs and work the system. we don't want to turn our backs on those in need, but what's happening is that the irs' response is we just need more money in order to stop this fraud. i can think of lots of ways to roll back the irs and we would have plenty of money to weed this out. >> the point is here, this is a

political season. a highly charged political season and politicses being asked how are we going to save money. here's a perfect example. 15.6 billion is fraudulent. at least get rid of that. >> the more things they put in to achieve so-called economic justice, you notice the gap between the rich and the poor just keeps growing, getting bigger and bigger and bigger. if washington would get out of the way and let the economy move freely, you'd get a lot less poor people in this country. if you just let birds fly as they should. all right, thank you very much. the cashing in gang getting ready to roll at the bottom of the hour. eric? >> hey, david. president obama has a huge problem with trump's new plan to pay for the wall on the southern border, but would it work better than what we're doing now? plus, foul mouths and frap chinos. what is happening to civility in american? see you at 11:30. >> thank you very much.

we'll be watching. first, as -- in more money by selling more oil after sanctions are lifted. us navy intercepted another iranian ship full of weapons likely going to rebels in yemen. is this more proof we have to scrap that nuke deal and fast? next. everhas a number.olicy but not every insurance company understands the life behind it. for those who've served and the families that have supported them, we offer our best service in return. usaa. we know what it means to serve. get an insurance quote and see why 92% of our members plan to stay for life.

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are we helping tehran fund more terror? iran was caught sending weapons the same week it was bragging about selling 2 million barrels

of oil a day now that sanctions aring being lifted. steve says this is proof the nuclear deal was and is a raw deal. steve? >> well, this just shows that no deal would have been better than a bad deal. this gives iran more money for terrorism. the whole idea they'd use it for infrastructure in kindergarten is propostrouse. they want to dominate the middle east, the oil and have terror around the world. it's out there. and why barack obama goes along with this is one of the most business episodes in diplomatic history. >> i think it's bizarre. jessica, i'm wondering if you think it's bizarre. >> not as bizarre as you do. >> this is the third armed shipment the u.s. intercepted. a huge armed shipment. >> some of it. it's a fraction of the money they're getting from the oil. we need to know they were going to rebels in yemen before we say that's what's going on here. >> they weren't going to good guys. they weren't going to cowboys in white hats. >> i totally agree and i think

what's happened here is the administration has prioritized and they said that stopping iran from getting a nuclear weapon is the number one priority for the region and for the world. and there's a will the of stuff that unfortunately we're just going to have to take from iran. that said, ipg that the economic snap back sanctions are going to have to be used and used freely. when they are certainly breaking the deal, but you know, when they took our sailors and things like that, i think we need to seem stronger on the front to say hold up, we're going to -- >> another thing they're spending money on are these misl test, which are in violation of u.n. sanctions that have been hit on them and so, they're just doing all this stuff in your face. >> nuclear icbms. that's what we're talking about with iran. they still continue to call the united states wrongfully and unjustly the great satan. this is demonic behafr vior on part of them. i wish we could get out of the middle east. i wish we could see, enough of it, we have our own oil. when iran continues mayhem in

the rest of the world and threatens us, it's an issue. >> john, shouldn't we scrap the treaty or deal? >> not to make us safer, but because we shouldn't be legitimizing an economy that has the size of philadelphia. the idea that left and right view iran is a serious threat, i've never understood. >> well, another thing they're spending on is developing oxygen, which is this highly explosive material that can be used as nuclear triggers. >> that scares me more than it scares john and what's really upsetting is they seem to be thumbing their nose at us while we're allowing them to obtain more resources and have greater ability to fund extremists. as far as i can tell, we just help bolster iran. we made them more financially secure and more militarily prepared. i'm terrified by this. >> even if there's a snap back of our sanctions t europeans aren't going to snap back, are

they. >> right and philadelphia terrori terrorizes any good baseball or basketball fan. they're not pursuing nuclear weapons and now, iran, the greatest exporter of terror in the world now suddenly has a budget of 20 million per year to cause mischief? >> thank you very much. coming up, the average worker expecting a 3% bump, but our informers at the stock will give you a much birg bump in pay.

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moves in the opposite direction of stock prices! is this a good stock if you think we're in a bubble? >> i like the name, but i do like this one. >> thank you very much. that's it for forbes on fox. have a wonderful weekend. keep it right here. the number one business blog continues with cashing in. president obama mocking donald trump for saying if mexico doesn't pay for the wall, the immigrants in the u.s. transfer back to their home land. >> the notion that we're going to crack every western union you know, bit of money that's being sent to mexico you know, good luck with that. people expect the president of the united states and the elected officials in this country, to treat these problems seriously. they don't expect half baked notions coming out of the white house. we can't afford that. >> so, the president says we can't afford trump's plan, but we're doing nothing about