what's your name? >> the question i have is about [inaudible] >> i have no idea. today will be a day hopefully after this i can really get in a quiet place and get my head around these services i don't know how i'm going to make it through the week. i wanted to do this where i could have the rest of the day to begin the services tomorrow, hopefully you all won't bug me and respect i'm trying to get through the last funeral from tuesday and i hope you respectfully understand while i ignore you. nothing personally. i like all of you, well, most of you, we can hopefully get past this with god's good grace. yes? >> chief [inaudible]

explosive device previous statements -- [inaudible]. >> yes. >> was there any structural damage to the garage or anywhere else? closed-circuit you were using and will you release a timeline that -- [inaudible] [inaudible] >> probably not today. probably will be several days. i'm going to try to get my guys home ready for these funerals. we're likely to slow down a little bit. they have been going, not wanting to go home to try to chase every lead. there was damage and i'm not sure, some parts, where this happened was in the building proper, not the garage. so we misspoke on that. we'll try to correct that because we got a release going to come out about the gun. we had another follow-up question about something else. we'll try to include the

location, a little bit more clarification where it happened. >> [inaudible] >> yeah, yes. >> and do you know what part of the building? >> second floor. i can't describe what part but second floor. we'll try to get the details of that to you today in a press release. >> [inaudible] people on lockdown in the building at the time that you detonated that bomb, is that correct? >> yes. there was a lot of students in the building before this suspect ran into the building and our officers got most of them out. we learned here recently that two students stayed in there overnight, afraid to move because of all the shooting. we got them out the next morning, just recently, yes. we just recently. so that is a big building. that is a big floor. so they didn't, they weren't in any danger or anything like that as a result of the explosion. i'm going to ask more news

reporters here waiting patiently, our local and only paper. if y'all don't mind i will give him a little privilege here. yes? >> [inaudible] >> yes. so, because sources leaked the names of our officers before the families were ready, it really became a moot point for us to release officially. we didn't really see the need, but if you see the need to officially release we'll do that. we think it's a moot point. everyone knows. no one has been misidentified. we were just taking the leave for the families. i promised them tonight that their loved one was killed until you tell me there is okay. i believe in keeping that promise. hang on just a second. this guy was after these two. yes, sir? >> [inaudible]

>> i asked the question of how much we were using and i said, don't bring the building down but that was the extent of my guidance. all right? i just said i trust you. you know what i want done. they emproadvised this whole idea in about 15, 20 minutes, extraordinary. somebody over here that halls under asked. i will get back to you. yes, ma'am? >> [inaudible] >> we've turned the responsibility of the security detail for the president to our

law enforcement partners, arlington pd is working with the secret service on that. they will be working with any other law enforcement partners that have area doing that i didn't want my cops having that responsibility because of the fatigue factor. i didn't want to go wrong with the president coming here because we're tired. they volunteered to do it. i appreciate arlington doing that. let me speak a little bit the square here ad headquarters the other day. -- scare here at headquarters this is lecturing and then i get off the soapbox. but when reporters say there are shots fired irresponsibly, when they did not hear any shots fired and no one else hurt shots fired, that puts our officers at risk. if you tell me shots are fired, i'm, the adrenaline pump and rush for that, it is hard to take a step without falling, let alone think about where the shots are coming from? is anybody hurt?

most irresponsible thing a reporter can do is say shots fire if you didn't hear it. if you heard it and near an officer, tell the officer. don't tweet it. so we convey the message in a way creates safety for our officers. so i'm going to get off my soapbox, but it wasn't you. i'm just saying, you know who you are. don't do that again. that makes, that makes the hair on our heads raise and just makes us unsafe in the way we conduct ourselves. just to say shots fired. don't do that. that is irresponsible. >> chief -- before, and if so, [inaudible]. >> no. hadn't been used before. i'm going to wrap up. i'm tired. i don't have anything else left for you. i'm sorry, this is the last question right here. you are persistent. >> [inaudible] >> all right. >> you were late. and then -- [laughter]

we've been looking for you like 30 minutes. >> we're here. >> go ahead, hannah. you got the last question. >> [inaudible] what do you need to do right now urgently, what else can you possibly do to -- [inaudible] >> so, we are, obviously it's a priority focused on the families for the funerals. while that's happening we're getting 911 calls every second and we're fighting against an increase in violent crime that every city in the country has been fighting against since last summer. we have plans to do some things as a result of spike in violent crime this month that we had to delay.

the number one thing i would say that we are doing is supporting each other as officers. watching each other's backs. showing that we care about each other. i think not letting anything divide us as a police family. not anything. or anyone. get us off track. on our mission. that is simplified but i think it is easy for cops to understand that the number one thing is for us to stick together. watch out for each other. protect each other. care about each other. say it, express it. and make sure we do everything we can to go home to our loved ones every shift. >> what about the community? >> you taking liberties that you don't have being late. you being late. thank you y'all so much, i

appreciate it. lauren: dallas chief police david brown doing what he has done for days now, showing his wisdom and leadership for the nation to see it is on display today saying that not an hour goes by that he doesn't hug one of his police officers because knows they need shoring up right now. he gave details about the takedown just then of shooter nights ago that killed five police officers. and. he was talking about that robot going in. and how he said, with specificity, don't take down the building. take this guy out. so it was on his order to see that detail and on him move into counselor mode and spirit all mode and politics. we'll get into that. we move into "outnumbered." i'm harris faulkner. this is "outnumbered." here with us today, sandra smith, host of "kennedy"

on fox business, kennedy herself, co-host of "after the bell" also on fbn, melissa francis, and judge alex ferrer is outnumbered. we look forward to get your expertise. >> always great to be here as usual, thank you. harris: one of the things chief brown was talking about moments ago is the burden of policing across america. watch. >> what we're trying to accomplish here is above challenging. it is, we're asking cops to do too much in this country. we want to be superman and superwoman and we're not and we're the last to say we need help. our professionals suffer from this for quite a while now. harris: and william la jeunesse is live for us in dallas now. william, we were all watching the police chief and we've been kind of suspended and in kind of a state letting him guide us through what is going on. i'm curious to see what his words are doing to heal dallas at this point?

reporter: number one, i'm not sure about that. i do know that he talked about potentially mandating counseling services for his force because he says cops are the last ones to ask for help. but, harris, what i want to do is bring you up to speed on the investigation and paved on what i heard and how it jibes with comments that the chief made yesterday that were rather extensive. number one, they do not know if micah johnson had any accomplices, and number two, they can not prove or know if the family had knowledge of his intent even though they have phone to his mother. number three, he wrote the initials, micah johnson, rb, in his blood at two locations at the garage where he was pinned down. they have not figured out with the fbi's help what that means. number three, firearms. we know firearms were found at his residence. the chief was not specifically how many or which ones. i'm told it is not an arsenal. i believe or here on the premises of the crime scene they

had a long gun and two handguns located with him or nearby. number three, he talked about enough bomb-making materials stockpiled at his home to create a devastating effect on dallas or north texas. he was asked about that today. i am told only roughly about a pound of canerite was located at his home. that is not terribly lethal. it is used at target practice. here what the chief had to say when i was asked if he had intent to use those bomb making materials in a wider application or what objective it might be. >> i don't know whether or not he planned to escape and then bombing would start or he didn't have time to complete. we just don't know how the bombing aspect of his plans were going to play out. we're looking for those answers,

and the concern is that we haven't found something that is out there. reporter: as for that robot he said that his, the innovative, as far as we know the first time use of a robot to deliver explosives to kill a suspect like was used her, they came up with that solution about 15 minutes. basically put c-4 at the end of a arm on the robot and detonated it after negotiations broke down. he had no ethical problem with that only used that was necessary, not to bring down the house. finally on the two cops, we didn't know about these before, there were actually two more cops injured in the attack. they're from the el send troh college police department. one, when johnson parked his car he tried to enter el central college. the doors were looked. he fired on the glass doors. bullet fragments struck one officer in his stomach.

he will require surgery. glass fragments injured another officer, john abbott. as personal things. chief is running on fumes. it is overwhelming. he did and his family receive death threats. harris? harris: william la jeunesse reporting live from dallas. thank you, william. sandra: meantime president obama preparing to travel to dallas tomorrow to speak at a memorial service for the victims there. the president cutting short his trip to europe as violent protests spread across this country with more than 300 people arrested nationwide. this was the scene at a "black lives matter" protest in baton rouge where many of those arrests took place. and in st. paul, minnesota, saturday night, police say people hurled molotov cocktails and bricks at fireworks at officer, injuring more than 20 of them. that was hours after president obama spoke in europe about the divisiveness in this country. here's what he said. >> i firmly believe that america

is not as divided as some have suggested. americans of all races and all backgrounds are rightly outraged by the inexcusable attacks on police, that includes protesters. includes family members who have grave concerns about police conduct. sandra: but now, listen to what the police chief in st. paul had to say about the protests in his city. >> last night, really was the me in my 28 years as a police officer that i have observed the level of violence that was directed towards our public servants. the public servants that are there to protect all of us in this room and all of us in our community and it is really a disgrace. sandra: judge, how can there be such a disconnect from what

you're hearing from people in country and those officers and what the president is saying? >> anytime i get information about the government about status of unemployment and information on the economy i do a gut check. it feel like unemployment is better, do people feel better financially off? i do it here. tensions in the racial divide have approved dramatically over the last eight years or have they declined? they have declined so massively. it is his spin. what he wants to say, maybe to get people not to be afraid to come to the u.s., like we're hearing a lot of countries are warning their citizens of the he doesn't want to admit situations gotten under worse under his watch. there is no question about it. a lot has to do with the position the government has taken. every time a white police officer shooting a black male before any evidence in whether it was justified or not the government has jumped in said this will not be tolerated. started originally with the police officer in massachusetts who arrest ad black scholar, and

obama, for whatever reason -- harris: you mean like seven years ago? >> started way back when. harris: that is how far back 2 goes. kennedy: police chief in st. paul. >> called it stupid actions by the police and had criticism. with ferguson, before there was evidence in, he came in and was strong hand against police department. doj came in and investigate. at the end of the day the doj determined that shooting was justified. didn't hear much about that from the government. he sets tone and tone gets fed on by other groups, president obama sees this is wrong and we'll jump on the bandwagon, that is the tone. there is antipolice atmosphere where there shouldn't be one. sandra: kennedy, the country is not so divided president says, just hours later violent protest s.

frank bruni blamed media coverage and sensationalized headlines that rarely report what is going on and how peacefully the protest in dallas began and how it proceeded up until the shots. kennedy: reminds me of the joke, other than that, mrs. lincoln, how was the show? is that what you're talking about? what a scary time to be a police officer and scary time for family members of police officers. i think that dallas police chief is absolutely right, especially in a age of terror. we're asking police to do too much. i think it is very legitimate and responsible to have a conversation, ongoing conversation about criminal justice reform in this country. it's a bipartisan issue. a lot of people are passionate about it, but unfortunately the emotionalism that gets tacked on to these stories, when you have violence and death on both sides is ripping the country apart and the president by ignoring it because he didn't want to admit failure is doing much more to exacerbate it. sandra: melissa, very emotional donald trump tweeted out, quote,

look what is happening to our country under the weak leadership of obama and "crooked hillary." we are a divided nation. what is your take? melissa: everybody is standing behind the dallas police chief. >> absolutely. melissa: this idea we're asking cops to do too much. schools are failing. put it on the cops. mental health issues. put it on the cops. 70% of the african-americans raised by single parents, put that on the cops. you're putting too much on the cops of the help us. when i see all this we have no idea what it is like unless you're a law enforcement officer to go out there to face violent crowds and what that is like. i pair that what newt gingrich said over the weekend, if you're not a black american in america you don't know what it is like, i think we don't know what it is like to be those two groups to be in those shoes, i'm not equating them but because police have the power. we could always benefit walking in the other shoes and trying to solve the problems rather than

inflame them. >> very true. kennedy: members of the media like "new york times" reporter should do a ride along. harris: if we aren't divided why ares things hashtagged with skin color at beginning? sandra: fair enough. to quote the dallas police chief moments ago he has gotten through the week by the grace of god. we'll talk about it more in few minutes. republican convention is fast approaching and vice-presidential speculation is heating up. one name reportedly making donald trump's short list, retired lt. general michael flynn. why some conservatives aren't too enthusiastic about that pick and who trump should be picking as his running mate. a heart attack doesn't care if you run everyday, or if you're young or old. no matter who you are a heart attack can happen without warning. if you've had a heart attack, a bayer aspirin regimen can help prevent another one. be sure to talk to your doctor before you begin an aspirin regimen. bayer aspirin.

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♪ sandra: former new york city mayor rudy giuliani is lashing out at the "black lives matter" movement accusing it of inspiring violence against the police. he calls the movement inherently racist and says its members should focus on killing of black civilians within their own communities. listen. >> "black lives matter," white lives matter, asian lives matter, hispanic lives matter, that is anti-american and it is racist. of course "black lives matter"

and they matter greatly, when you focus on 1% of less than 1% of the murder going on in america and make it a national thing and all of you in the media make it much bigger than the black kid who is getting killed in chicago every 14 hours, you create a disproportion. the police understand it and put as target on their back. every cop in america will tell you that if you ask them. sandra: but critics say instead of polarizing the issue we need unity. this morning on "fox & friends" giuliani further explained his argument. >> it is inherently racist, because number one it divides us. all lives matter. when the presidential candidate, governor of maryland made the statement that all lives matter, they intimidated him into changing it to "black lives matter." all lives matter. white lives, black lives, all lives. number two, the

"black lives matter" never protests when every 14 hours somebody is killed in chicago, probably, 70, 80% of the time a black person. where are they then? sandra: as mayor giuliani was making his first comments there, lashing out against the "black lives matter" movement you were, you were agreeing with him, in my peripheral vision. harris: no, absolutely. i will do it straight to your face. look if we called something white lives matter people from naacp and aclu out there in the streets picketing, you can't do that, you can't do that. if blacklist matter so much why aren't they in your former home chicago of city with black on black crime at a height in my lifetime. why aren't they there? why do you get a blow back when you put all lives matter? don't all lives matter? i understand they want to highlight police brutality. there is place for that and we should have a conversation of brutality against anyone, to put your race in the beginning.

i have a problem with african hyphen american, i am an american who hams to be black but it is only a hour show. sandra: clearly emotions are riding high, judge, the president has been challenged many times on this. why not focus on what is happening in chicago? >> i'm going to actually disagree with mayor giuliani. i don't have a problem with "black lives matter" as a concept. i think they're calling attention to a particular cause, okay. they don't have an obligation to call attention to every cause out there. they don't have to call attention to blacks shooting blacks. they call attention to what they believe a growing problem, white officers shooting blacks. i believe they're being misled the numbers are off the chart when they're not. you have a network out there every time a white officer shoot as black male and do 24 hour coverage and how everybody talks about the rampant thing and numbers don't bear it out. if you look at fbi statistics, i've been saying that since ferguson. you lead the public to believe, it is rampant. every day it on there.

there are 8,700,000 arrests in 2014. number of police shootings total, whites, blacks, hims panics, were 1/10000 of 1% of all the arrests. vast majority were whites as you expect. whites were killed by police more than all blacks and hispanics combined. the impression from some networks this is out of control so these people go out there to protest what they believe is a out of control situation. i don't have a problem with that but i think they have obligation, because when the group goes out there under the name "black lives matter" and start yelling pigs in a blanket and start yelling we want dead cops, the ones who run the group have obligation to stand up and say that is not our message. if they don't, they own it. sandra: where mayor giuliani further took his comments. they sing rap songs about killing police officers and talk about killing police officers and yell it out at their rallies and police officers hear it, kennedy. kennedy: that's true. it is tough when you are policing communities where there

is a lot of animus but you know to your point, and i thought this was a good explanation of it, the reason the hashtag popped up, a lot of people in a lot of communities who felt like black lives didn't matter. harris: we get that. >> that is an important part of the conversation. how did we get to that point? harris: fight police brutality. kennedy: the answer to that is not inciting violence. >> exactly. kennedy: there is room in this country for peaceful protest. we have to protect people's civil liberties. we have to take honest look at these discussions, hashtag all lives matter is not offensive. are we supposed to be color-blind? harris: people glock to it like fire, like you said something blasphemous. melissa: how have we gotten to the point in this country you immediately fear and mistrust people because of the group they belong to whether police officers.

there are group of people in country feel like they have no stake. they feel like if you have nothing, there is nothing to lose. there is much bigger problem at the root president obama could have addressed and changed and we haven't seen. it is people who feel like a they don't have a stake. harris: start with his hometown of chicago. sandra: we'll leave it there. the clock is ticking toward the republican convention and ever closer when we hear from donald trump on his running mate. who is the best choice and what are some possible landmines? ♪ the right things working together

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new jersey governor chris christie is expected to be on the short list. another name being considered retired army lt. general michael flynn. he raised eyebrows with his stance on abortion rights. >> abortion, i think for women, these are difficult issues but i think women have to be able to choose what they, you know, sort of the right of choice but i think that's a difficult legal decision that, and i think women are so important in that decision-making process. harris: now eight esmond. flynn is saying something quite different from that, telling fox news he is actually a pro-life democrat and that the issue should be decided by the courts. hmmm. all right. what do you think? kennedy: i think the last thing we need right now with the world falling apart and our country being torn apart at the seams is litmus test on abortion. harris: a lot of different reaction to that, judge.

part of the reaction like kennedy said, wait a minute, if he is in line to be president as vice-presidential pick shouldn't he be well-rounded on all issues? your thoughts. >> especially this year when so so many people are dissatisfied with our choices for president, i think vice-presidential pick will be that much more important. people are looking for something to like about each candidate. harris: does he need to be military? >> no, he doesn't need military. kennedy: political experience? >> that could kill him. everybody is trying to get away from typical politicians. look at support for bernie sanders and military, depends who you are. ross perot's running mate. kennedy: i saw mike flynn speak privately before he came out into the media right after he left military service. he is brilliant. he is determined. he had a very clear plan for how to deal with isis and how our position all around the world has gotten so far out of crow,

it was clear he was very frustrated with the way things have unfolded and how we have lost our stand and how we're losing this war and you know, he is someone who has a distinct plan for how to deal with this quagmire we are in and radical islam and why it is important to use that name. it is very strong on that issue. this, not so strong on. harris: -- make him polar opposite what we have in the white house. that would be the point that is something maybe donald trump would want to put on a ticket because it is so different, there is a strategy there, something our own president hasn't had. sandra: you have to wonder, does he know right now or still doing the research. wilbur ross, famed investor held a fund-raiser for donald trump at his house in the hamptons over weekend. spoke to wilbur ross. he was very impressed by donald trump. he was there hour 1/2. he spent a large chunk of the time going to every single guest asking them for their vp preference. he responded with a positive and negative on every person they

throughout there. >> what people like about his being so up front and speaking his mind. if he didn't like your suggestion he tells you, i don't agree because of this, you have to admire that. because most politicians would do a salsa dance. sandra: i don't know if anybody took him by surprise or names on the short list. mayor giuliani was one stood out. >> my name didn't come up? harris: well, it did. >> what is up with that? harris: they know your platform is so big. >> they know i would never leave the couch. harris: this is talked about, purported short list that keeps getting shorter. we saw senator bob corker take himself out of the running. kennedy: same with senator joni ernst. harris: what is going on behind the scenes as they make this choice? oh, by the way, paul manafort said probably wouldn't be woman or minority because they don't want it to seem like pandering, go. kennedy: top three. who is making podium right now? looks like gingrich is in the pole position or aiming for the gold medal.

i would say flynn it is in the silver and christie is headed straight for the bronze which means he will be a-f or chief of staff. if christie is the attorney general we'll have problems. sandra: can you tell kennedy watched a lot of olympics. kennedy: did you see the gymnasticses trials? it was so emotional. harris: that's our girl. we'll move on. hillary clinton is pushing back against criticism from the fbi she was, quote, extremely careless in handling classified information. her defense and how might affect the election. stay with us. (climbing sounds)

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material that was classified and indeed any of the, any of the documents that have been referred to i think were not marked or were marked inaccurately. i just believe that the material that was being communicated by professionals, many with years of handling sensitive, classified material, they did not believe that it was. i did not have a basis for second-guessing their conclusion melissa: she is still parsing it. meantime a new "washington post" abc news find 56% of the americans disapprove the fbi recommendation not to criminally charge clinton. only 35% improved. harris, you're confused as i was in this doublespeak. other people were sending it to me. why would i second-guess them. they had more -- it is exhausting.

harris: it is, it is, it was, it was kind of around and around. the study you pointed to, predominantly people thought it would affect the way they look at her trustworthiness overall. means less how they feel about the email situation than what they point to. many were democrats. most of them were independents if you drilled down into the study. melissa: sandra, what do you think about that. sandra: so, mr. comey said fbi discovered several thousand more work-related emails not turned over to the state department. almost in the same breath, in the same day she says she turned over every document in my possession when the state department requested it. i don't get it. what are we watching for, judge? is there possibility out there, she will stop, i was wrong. here's the truth. >> yeah, no. that word sticks in her throat. that will never come out. she has been caught in lie after lie after lie. some people forgive her because they have such, such low

standards for politicians when you bring it up to them, well, all politicians lie. why do we accept that? why don't we draw a line in the sand, one we're not willing to let them cross, say no. it if you're a politician, we can't trust you, we won't elect you. harris: because nobody would run. melissa: she sticks to the original talking points, mistake to use personal email. she didn't use personal email. she is still saying that. kennedy: comey didn't stand before the country i wish you would have used gmail address. if she had used gmail the servers would be much more secure. at first, she said i did not send classified information. then she said i didn't knowingly send classified information. now she said i don't believe i sent classified information. lady, you sent and received classified information. you also withheld thousands of emails. how can you possibly say, when they found thousands of your emails that you didn't turn over, how could you possibly say you turned over everything.

melissa: at same time, judge, it is over. she got away with it. it is over, right? >> may or may not be. looking whether or not she committed perjury in front ever congress. harris: did you think she did? >> it is really close. harris: what about your courtroom? >> i would have look over what her statements were and what were -- kennedy: chichi perjured herself. >> what i want to hear from comey, documents were wiped clean and could not be retrieved. why is she wiping server, because she doesn't want people to read wedding plans for chelsea? there is something else. why was the tech given immunity. what did he know, because i suspected all along she had the tech basically wiping that server non-stop. melissa: they asked comey. kennedy: i don't know if i can talk about this, this is legal document. let me get back to you. no, bro, you were -- >> the investigation is over.

harris: he did it 125 times. >> unless he is going to come forward, we're continuing to investigate her staff the investigation is over. it should be public record -- this guy gave a proffer. they don't give immunity without a proffer. his proffer is what he knew. i would like to know what he knew. melissa: facebook taking encryption of messenger service to whole new level. the nearly one billion users could have a conversations in total secrecy. should law enforcement access communication of criminals, not to mention terrorists? we'll discuss. ♪ ♪ it's a tangle of multiple symptoms. ♪ ♪ trintellix (vortioxetine) is a prescription medicine for depression. trintellix may start to untangle

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built for business. harris: fox news alert in virginia beach. you see the lecturn. we're awaiting remarks from donald trump. we understand these are the first live remarks since the tragedy in dallas. there is anticipation he would first mention that i can tell you for sure his focus will be on veterans health care issues because he is going to be talking about that. this is not far from the uss wisconsin which is in norfolk, not far from where he first announced his platform, if you will, for changing things for veterans affairs and making them better for vets. so at this venue we know that will be on the bill and we'll bring you this live as it happens but that's what we're

waiting for, virginia beach, donald trump. kennedy? kennedy: very good. facebook ramping up encryption in very big way. will allow its nearly one billion users to hold conversations from start to finish in total seacrest system that is not just you chatting with your friends. no. it also means criminals and terrorists can communicate behind a digital wall invisible from law enforcement. the new feature on facebook messenger which is separate from the main website. it is available on limited test basis. it will be fully rolled out a little later this summer. we should point out other tech companies like apple are unveiling end to end end encrypn to have a bid for privacy. customers want for-profit companies to give them privacy. this is what the market wants. what is the big deal? >> the big deal law enforcement that terrorists and criminals can hide behind that and do their plans and communicate

about attacks without law enforcement ever having a chance of intercepting to find out what their plans are. it's a political issue. something congress will have to decide whether they want to legislate to make it illegal to have a communication system like this with total encryption. the public will weigh in on this obviously a lot of people do want it. other apps already out there have it. harris: yeah. >> from a business standpoint, facebook, apple, are at disadvantage if they don't compete with other apps that have it. if the legislature steps in says we'll not allow this, this will be criminal from now on, it changes whole playing field and people will have input about what -- kennedy: can you get a warrant and take it to facebook like law enforcement has in the past. >> no, with encryption like this, facebook does not have the content. in other words on these systems where you have end to end encryption the message is only existing on phone that sent it and phone that received it. facebook or any of the other methods out there that send this message will not have it on

their server. you can't go to facebook to say i have a warrant. melissa: only a matter of time with technology, right? all the encryption is based on rsa technology, semiprime numbers end to end. quantum compute something coming along, blowing all that up so it will no longer be encrypted. my point is technology always surpasses and i never believe these things are totally secret and encrypted. there is computer and algorithm always breaks it open. kennedy: also true for law enforcement and also true for tech. i think you're right, market and technology will always work two steps ahead of law enforcement and legislation. sandra. sandra: this is the conversation with apple, right? we're talking about facebook and mark zuckerberg. but they have their customer in mind. they have their shareholders mind. and to your point, kennedy, you can't blame them. that is who they have to answer to. that is absolutely 110% legal. they say, we put people first in everything we do at messenger.

guess what facebook's goal has been all along reporting on these companies? make it a one-stop place for their users. never a reason to go anywhere else or never a reason to use any other app or technology. that continues to be their goal but i wonder what the libertarian voice in kennedy's head says about it? >> libertarian voice there is no way legislature should step in to keep people from any sort of platform or technology they desperately want. they're not just catering to terrorists. like -- harris: excuse me the voice in kennedy es head have to continue online. we have to go. i want to thank you. we had a busy news hour. appreciate you being here. right after the break we'll hit "happening now." we're on line, foxnews.com/outnumbered. click on overtime tab. watch this.

trump. >> plus, america on edge amid chilling new details. massive protest in the country as we learned that the killer of five police officers planned a much larger attack. plus, a new twist in an already bizarre white house race and concerns that voters would cross