>> welcome, everyone, that is "outnumbered." i'm sandra smith. here today, there she is is, harris faulkner, fox business network's elizabeth macdonald, radio talk show host meghan mccain is here, and #oneluckyguy, co-host of "america's newsroom," bill hemmer. outnumbered after a busy morning. so nice to join us. >> i feel outnumbered. good to be back with you. good to see you all, thank you. nothing going on. >> it's a light day. sandra: but you love every minute of it. let's get right to it. she is saying no big deal. hillary clinton down playing that stumble on sunday that jolted her campaign, saying although she was sick with pneumonia and under doctors orders to rest, she just wanted to soldier on. >> i didn't think it was going to be that big of a deal. kind of thing if it happens to

you you're a busy active person and you keep moving forward. as soon as it became clear i couldn't power through, we said was going on. sandra: grilled about her cam's secrecy about her illness and feeds fishing shun of voters about her trustworthiness. >> oh, my goodness, anderson, compare everything you know about me with my opponent. i think it is time he met the same level of disclosure that i have for years. you know, you've got a medical report on me that meets the same standard as mitt romney and barack obama. donald trump's doctor says he would be healthiest president in history. that is not even serious. i have released 40 years of tax returns. he hasn't released one. sandra: meantime syndicated columnist charles krauthamer says hillary's campaign said hillary's campaign should have been honest from the get-go. that this episodes points to a larger question of trust.

>> i think this is another case of the cover-up being worse than the crime. if it is what they say it is, this is totally benign, they should have explained it right away, and this as everybody can see, it just adds to the impression that these people are simply incapable of telling the truth, the simple truth. sandra: so let's go back, bill, to hillary clinton saying i just didn't think it was going to be this big of a deal. >> i think she wanted to power through. i think she has been probably doing that for a long time. we within our own jobs want to find strength to get through the dale. this is really grueling stuff. meghan, i was with your father eight years ago in new hampshire, just to see what you do, you really got to want it. >> people have no idea. a schedule unlike an olympian. get up in the morning, don't get home until midnight and meeting people at events all day.

>> john kerry in iowa, 2004, he had a gap he needed to close, rented a helicopter and flew all over the state. he himmed in there sunday night and his voice was hoarse and he won. that is something you need to do. with regard to hillary, she comes back at the end. week, shows strength, this will behind her. if she comes back and there is another episode, it could be big. sandra: how different, liz, would today be, if charles krauthamer suggested they should have told the truth from the beginning, if it was indeed pneumonia, that her doctor diagnosed her on friday, how different would today be if they told everybody that on friday? >> remember. she wasn't going to a lot of campaign events recently. therefore letting this narrative take hold about the email and, server in the basement of the home without answering the questions about that. did she lose some ground game to trump? possibly. so instead of transparent, say i'm sick, then voter, media say,

she is sick, give her some leeway on it. but issue, what if the smartphones weren't there? what if nobody even saw that video and knew about it? would we know she had pneumonia now if it wasn't there if. sandra: that leaves only room for more speculation as "new york post" cover today, throw it up there, it says illary this is what happens when you leave that much room for speculation, right, harris? >> what is interesting others coming on board saying how sick they have been. chuck schumer recently had pneumonia. not saying that he feels for her, not just having empathy, i was kind of in the same boat. this is how you get through it and how long it takes. it causes people to come to her side. so then i start to question, well, if you had to change the narrative from the emails and you might be seen as a sympathetic figure, why not even tell them you had pneumonia on friday?

i guess she couldn't have known this. sandra: there is the conversation about the medical records and how much has been released, how much more should be released. how thorough we should look at their medical history. meghan, how important, going back to your point about the grueling schedule, you're talking about running for president. what about actually being president? how important is it for voters to see the health of the candidate? >> i think health is incredibly important if you're not physically capable of being president this is something the american voter should know. this blows my mind trump and hillary haven't released medical records. this is something the american public need to know. pivoting, off this, bill, i think is much bigger deal. coughing fit. one time looking a little sick in the debates. sometimes she looks fatigued three hours through, the american public will be she is not physically up to this. harris: we talk about the 55 days until the election. the next big point, under hot lights for the stage 90 minutes. incredible pressure. you're with donald trump. don't know which direction.

he is not traditional type of candidate you would have debated. she hasn't experienced what the 15, 16 other guys experienced. meghan: another question about the capability to lead is people surrounding herself by. if this were my father on the campaign and his staff didn't immediately take him to the hospital. harris: someone is missing. huma abedin. meghan: doesn't matter. if only one woman can handle hillary clinton and apparently a team of people won't give her water or she won't drink water and not physically taking care of yourself and don't have a team concerned about your health first and foremost. i don't have faith in the team. >> she is running the show. sandra: before we leave this, donald trump's strategy so far is i hope she is better soon. i hope she gets well. good strategy. >> i indeed do. remarkable thing, leading democrats come out question whether hillary clinton should be on the ticket. this is phenomenal thing. don fowler ran the dnc in the 1990s, for three years.

would you be stupid, or foolish not to have somebody as backup. what marine dowd said, it is not health but the stealth. republicans talking this for years about the clintons. democrats doing it as well. harris: you touched on this as well. while hillary clinton recovers, bill clinton is going to fund-raisers. it was supposed to be a big week for the democratic nominee. she would kick the campaign off after a quiet august, relatively quiet for her there. are growing questions whether donald trump could benefit her being off the trail. stayed away from pulling into politics. he wished her well, mostly stayed on message, giving carefully-worded speeches, issuing policy papers about top issues and leaving off insults. bill, you said you think this is smart for him to do. this feed as negative narrative about hillary clinton. low energy.

is she fit physically to hold office? so long so forth. how long do you stay away from the narrative which he helped create by the way? >> few months ago, trump was talking about stamina and strength then. this is playing right into his strategy. i have for a long time circled october 1st on the calendar because that will be five full days after the first debate, september 26th, 13 days away. harris: go on. sandra: we got it. >> so you've got these major polling centers that will have tuesday, wednesday, thursday, and friday of that week after debate number one. you will know on saturday whether or not trump has legitimate shot. that is my think. harris: we haven't talk about, elizabeth, early voting that comes into play. >> yes. harris: before the calendar before debates are up. >> north carolina started last friday. harris: we don't know what they're doing, they will be affected by some of things as people to to the polls already.

liz: you're right, 55 days from now, this to be happening in the clinton campaign is pretty stunning. seems like every day something comes up. you know, the one thing that trump can make hay with, this point is being made, the clinton campaign is saying, you know, we're taking care of it. just scoot doesn't bench. just set this aside. move along, power forward but hillary clinton cited her concussion when she was speaking with the fbi as saying, listen, i had a concussion. i don't recall the briefings on classified info. >> 2012. you're point about early voting before it gets too far away from us, mitt romney beat barack obama on election day four years ago, but obama beat romney in the early vote prior to that, which is, a lot of the reason why democrats try to get early vote out there. they have a harder time getting their people to the polls on election day. sandra: starting in october, you know the president cleared his schedule to go out there and campaign for hillary clinton. so she has got that lined up.

if you have bill clinton subbing in for her recovering in chappaqua, you have to decide whether he helped or hurt her on the campaign trail. harris: we didn't see him on sunday reportedly when this was going on. meghan: interview from charlie rose, this happens often or many times referring to the fainting. horrible surrogates of this campaign is because of him. doesn't look like he is in terribly amazing health. harris: meghan, you don't think his comments recalls, i want to point out where was bill clinton on sunday when this is unfolding you don't think -- meghan: he is loose cannon. if i were on the campaign i wouldn't put him on tv. look what he said. what are you talking about. she said this happened twice before. he said it happened a few times, multiple times. is she fainting everywhere? there is no transparency with any of this. harris: complicating factor, too, sandra you don't have a doctor as a surrogate.

you have the president on the trail today. michelle obama, first lady joining in northern virginia later this week, maybe thursday. you have the surrogates might have to get into higher gear than they were planning to when they were being down. they're not doctors. they will be asked these questions. sandra: look what we're talking about. we're talking about medical records, hillary clinton's health, not talking about the email scandal. how important is that in the election? >> i think hillary clinton wants to talk about policy and no one is. jerry seib wrote a great piece in "wall street journal" how she needs to get in the lane and stay there and not play trump's game. look what happened thus far. harris: like the high road. that lane. not a lot of people on it. anyway. but some are. donald trump is fighting back hard against his opponent's claim that some of his supporters belong in a quote, basket deplorables. how he is turning hillary clinton's own words against her and were -- whether it is resonating with voters. two newspapers would risk going

to jail to publish donald trump's tax returns. more mainstream media bias. or are they just doing their jobs? we'll talk about that. can't wait to get bill's take on that. after the show on tv wraps up, you go online because we pop up there. foxnews.com/outnumbered. hit the "overtime" tab, there we are with our live chat and facebook live. also our handle there, "outnumbered," fnc. see you after the break. picking up for kyle.

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having run out of options. sandra: even brought nearly a dozen supporters on stage to prove they are no such thing. >> my wife and i represent non-deplorable people. [cheering] we are not racist at all. we don't even fit on that list that she put out. [cheering] sandra: but clinton's press secretary said she expressed regret over her phrasing there are at least some trump supporters that do fit into that category. >> i think larger point is one that we are unapologetic about and it is fairly consistent with what she has been saying out on the trail in fact she gave an entire speech how donald trump has sort of promoted and continue to highlight these white nationalist sentiments on social media, in terms of the people that he is installed at the leadership of his campaign.

he continues to court and cultivate support from, yes, deplorable elements of our society that traffic in bigotry and hate. sandra: brian fallon, hillary clinton's press secretary. bill, did her campaign just double down? there is no doubt he just said -- >> you could take it that way. i think ultimately they gave trump this -- it is right there. it's a silver platter and i would expect him over the next week at every rally to pull people out, hey, i'm not deplorable. two things come to mind, 2008, 57 -- 47% mitt romney, and this in 2008. it is not surprising when they get bit they cling to guns or religion or antipathy toward people not like them. probably in all likelihood more familiar to what barack obama said in the private fund-raiser in san francisco in 2008. more so than romney of 12. democrats hammeredded romney

four years ago. i would argue his push back was not sufficient. in 2008, republicans pushed hard on this, but they scored points but the deck was stacked against your father to win the white house. that was a hard hard dell to over come -- hard hurdle over come. if trump is smart and we've seen him in the marketing genius in the past, would roll it out every opportunity. take white people, take hispanics, take chinese, men and women, line them all up. as they said last night, we're going to need a bigger basket. meghan: early on after he made this comment, he said early on this is worst moment of political season. es has not stopped hitting her. harris: you and i were talking about the social media blow back on this, how he galvanized that segment of population on social media by millions. ad coral deplorables.

sandra: #deplorables for trump. harris: remember when hillary clinton claimed republicans were her greatest enemies. you make the argument she puts people in this category where they would be the hated ones. meghan: one thing you never want to do with politics something reach out echo chamber of politicians. hashtag with some of my friends, my brother boozing with whiskey and american flag bandanna. i'm a basket of deplorables. i should hashtag this every time i go out. this is reached masses. this is trending topic on twitter. becoming a pride of honor, anyone voting for trump. this is big gaffe on her part. that on top of the video came out of her passing out. i do not know how she recovers from this. sandra: they're not backing off of it. liz: doesn't help in the swing states where things are getting tight. thing too, mike president nominee mike pence may have stumbled when asked by wolf

bitter is david duke deplorable. he is not into name-calling him. harris: he thanked him. >> that question came up on capitol hill. >> how did he do it. >> gave a long stem winder i thought was impressive. i was listening to his answer. talking about all the names his supporters have been called. he backed into the answer about david duke. liz: white supremacists are pretty deplorable. we saw the same thing too with mike pence. >> i'm not defending. giving balance between yesterday and today. they did not want to get caught in the trap. liz: all over the media now that mike pence wouldn't call david duke deplorable. >> my suggestion it will flip. harris: what he said, we missed it, exactly how -- >> he was talking about all the negative things that have been said about their supporters, et cetera and then got to the david duke point and suggested he did not need his support. sandra: we got to leave it there. a major hearing on capitol hill over hillary clinton email

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♪ harris: a major hearing going on right now, it has been for a couple hours now, on capitol hill into hillary clinton's email scandal. the house oversight committee subpoenaing the tech expert who handled clinton's server. her i.t. guru, bryan pagliano, did not show up. he took the fifth before you know, many, times. three men showed up including two technology employees from firms where the emails were deled despite orders to preserve them for congress. they both took the fifth. >> mr. combatta, do you intend

to make opening statement? >> on advice of counsel i respectfully decline to answer and assert my fifth amendment privilege. >> mr. thornton, do you intend to make an opening statement? >> on the advice of counsel i respectfully decline to answer and assert my fifth amendment constitutional privilege. harris: pleading the fifth. the only one willing to talk, bill clinton's long time aide, justin cooper. he is the guy who took a hammer to hillary's blackberry and helped set up the computer at home but apparently did not have security clearance. watch this. >> did you have security clearance at that time? >> no, i did not have security clearance. >> after you left the white house early -- when did you you leave the white house. >> 2001. >> 2001. did you ever have a security clearance at any level after that? >> no, i did not have security clearance. >> you had full access to the whole server the entire time you were working for the clintons? >> yes, i had access to the server. >> and you have no security clearance?

>> i have no security clearance. harris: also at a contentious hearing just yesterday, chairman chaffetz who you just saw there, subpoenaed the fbi for the full case file of its investigation into clinton's emails. watch that. >> will the fbi provide to congress the full file with no redactions had. personal-eyed footballable information. >> i can not make that commitment skiting here today. i will issue a subpoena and do it right now. i have signed this subpoena. we want all the 302s and we would like the full file. you can accept service on behalf of the fbi? >> certainly. >> you are hereby served. harris: is this kind of thing american public is looking for teeth in all this? sandra: trouble i think politically it is too much. people don't know what to tune in to listen to with all the email stuff. that was an unbelievable moment in that hearing today. that clinton aide just basically said, he had access to every

single one of hillary clinton's emails with absolutely no security clearance. harris: right. sandra: i love math, harris. i can not sit here and come up with number of people that we know as of today that had access to the secretary of state's email server and all of her emails. harris: those would be somewhat experts in their field. the list even gets longer, bill, when you look at, because i don't think that the attorneys were xeroxing stuff on their own, how many people have looked at some of those emails, who were secretary is, assistants making files. we could look at a very long list of people who have no clearance. >> we have no answer. the point has been made repeatedly past several weeks. that is reason why you see trustworthy numbers go down and part of the reason race gets tighter. combatta fellow, he used bleachbit. they are from platte river networks. i think the operation is out of denver but with regard to hillary clinton they were using it out of new jersey. harris: that's right. >> he was the guy. half of them pled the fifth.

and i was surprised justin cooper was even talking. i think that is the most information we have gotten yet from someone who has directly ties directly to the establishment of the server, the operation of it and fact he was able to see all these emails contributes more and more to the whole classified system being ignored or dare i say, abused. sandra: bleachbit of course is the application that disintegrated all the emails, sent them off -- harris: private emails. like an acid wash is how it is put in some terms but to sandra's point, elizabeth, how this is being taken in by the american people. it is a lot of information. people are turned off bit volumes of it but what is highlight? >> i agree. so much minutia, you're in the weeds. harris: what is the highlights? liz: justin cooper revealed, by the way he worked at clinton foundation and worked on the clinton initiative and edited

his book. he had access to what catherine herridge of fox news is reporting, access to 2100 top secret emails. james comey said 110 hillary clinton received classified. people have right to know about security issues, not only the classified information there but fact that the private server was set up first place, why, what was the intent there? finally, hacking. clinton foundation has been hacked. state department is hacked. what happened with the server. harris: what you're saying all the original questions which the fbi and others said basically were answered. hillary clinton, are still unanswered to satisfactory level. >> liz: yeah. harris: meghan, i'm piggybacking off of what elizabeth said. he knew then the significance, knew all of this, the guy working on the server and part of the foundation support too, he would know significance of foundation and secretary of state type emails, correct? >>

meghan: 100%. clintons want to make it as complicated and possible. keep it in the weeds. you have to go to law school understand it. super symbols, letting randoms looking at our national security. was in 2001, i was still in high school apparently looks at your emails and classified information about what is going on in the world, any point anytime, god knows who else they let see everything and god knows who else knows national security secrets. this woman would be should be in jail. any other person that did this would be in jail. harris: if there were any indication of pay-to-play with the foundation and her as secretary of state a whole lot of people would see that. sandra: further in the hearing it showed blurred lines between her as secretary of state and clinton foundation and clintons living up in chappaqua, he was asked who paid you? he said the clintons and clinton foundation. just those constant blurred lines. >> one big pile. i was in high school 2001 too. awesome year. harris: did you go back?

i love you, i love you bill. yeah, move on. >> presidential candidates are expected to release more on their health sometimes this week. hillary clinton's spokesman said the documents will reveal the type of pneumonia she is suffering from and medical circumstances surrounding her becoming ill and stumbling after the nine heavy len memorial on sunday. donald trump plans to disclose new records during appearance on dr. oz of all places. former dnc chair don fowler, saying democrats need contingency plan if pneumonia forces clinton out of the race this is different time, with a lot more people who like to express themselves and perhaps wrest control. i'm sure some sanders people would want to get into play and some biden people. i think you're likely to have discussions and perhaps controversy. how likely is it that that joe biden -- >> i think it is zero.

you would have to drag hillary clinton off that stage kicking and screaming. i don't think that's going to happen. i think with regard to all the health records and taxes, et cetera, i think both candidates are gaming the system right now to figure out what will voters accept and what will they not. reince priebus was on our program earlier today and i asked about trump's taxes. i don't think trump will put out his taxes. i think that is the card he is playing. less than 60 days to go he believe his calibration is that voters don't care. we'll see if they do. harris: this may have helped him though. now in terms of having to put out his health records, he can say well, i put that out. took that off the list. liz: about taxes. mr. trump says if hillary releases private emails he will release tax returns. does that feel like they are accessible and he could release them? sandra: i have to ask the question what would be in medical records? recent physical exams? what has to be in them for a

game-changer. meghan: can't be edited by huma. bleachbited out information. one physical at one point in time. that is ridiculous. i don't trust they would give me something authentic anyway. some random doctor friend, one day she has heatstroke. next day she has pneumonia. >> dr. mark seek gel thinks your father set the standard. he calls it the mccain protocol. meghan: thank you very much. >> they flew out to phoenix, arizona. went through what? meghan: 1000 pages. much to the chagrin of some people my father is alive and kicking. sorry. >> that if you're 70 above, you should be subjected. meghan: want to be leader of free world. >> if you're 45 should you do it? meghan: yes. harris: starting age 70. she is 68. you asked what kind of thing could be in there. if there is any other indication would give a reason for what we've seen recently, not just the the pneumonia cough, people

were talking about coughing a couple months ago, even longer. if there is any indication there would be another cause what people look for. i agree with you, they will not hand unredacted documents, please willy-nilly go through, get rid of hipaa. someone did make a suggestion to me, i thought it was interesting, why not like a military-style physical. right? look at a few records, right? i mean, and have people who would normally do that sort of thing. wouldn't be in the public purview but would have a certain standard. i don't know. meghan: doesn't matter your age. i think if you want to be president you have to prove to the american public you're healthy and physically fit to do it. quite frankly neither of these candidates have done it. i look forward to see what donald trump does with "dr. oz" on thursday. growing evidence of mainstream media bias. two editors of top newspapers would reportedly risk jail time to publish donald trump's tax returns.

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visit your local dealer before october 31st. can-am, the ride says it all. harris: fox news alert. here's what we're watching for the minutes away from donald trump holding a rally in iowa. polls show a tight race. the gop nominee could have new reaction to the illness that sidelined hillary clinton temporarily, or to her claims that some of his reporters are quote, deplorable. trump is to be here live on fox news channel, schedulewise in the next 15 minutes, we'll be all over it. sandra. sandra: new questions of mainstream media bias as editors from the "new york times" and "washington post" reportedly say they'd risk going to jail to publish donald trump's tax returns. for months he has refused to release them citing irs audit.

irs says he can release them anytime. multiple media outlets reported asked at forum whether they publish his tax info if they got their hands on it? both said yes. "times" executive editor dean bakay saying trump's taxes are important because he is presidential candidate whole campaign built on success as businessman and his wealth and that his taxes could cast light on whether that's true. "the washington post" bob woodward saying, some things you have to do. dean is exactly right. this defines donald trump. what? bill hemmer? >> you know i think as a reporter if i had the information too, i would probably go with it. i think you have to ask yourself, how much do you learn from a tax return? you don't know his net worth, right? harris: uh-uh. >> you wouldn't know how much money he made. sandra: bank account, reported interest. >> how much money he gave to

charity. you want the complete picture about his claims about wealth, et cetera. i think they're going for there. but i think if i had it, yeah, i think i would consider making it public. harris: so depending on your earnings from your capital gains on some of your retirement funds you wouldn't know what is in the funds. you wouldn't know how much money is there. sandra: saying you would go to jail, hemmer? >> yes. i had hillary clinton's returns and she was refusing to put them out i would treat them the same way. sandra: or her health records? >> yes. i think okay. sandra: sandra and i share the same brain. >> the answer is yes. sandra: this is difficult question. liz macdonald, tax returns are something you know very, very well and look at every day. not his tax returns. >> working on story auditing clinton's returns, uncovering unsavory things, weird tax deductions on things they gave to charity including their undergarments which is weird.

>> that is not illegal. liz: it was totally illegal. bundle them in little rock, arkansas, use them as rags. harris: stop. liz: moving along, the question about the tax returns, talking about his personal returns and his company's tax returns because the problem now that these, that the reporters, by the way i would totally go to jail too if i could get those, if i had to, in order to get the tax returns. absolutely should get them. donald trump, jr., said, russians make up a pretty disproportionate cross-section of our assets. now that journalists out there, is there anything in trump's tax returns that could disclose dealings with russia -- harris: that is pointed question where you want to see them. that is an interesting point. not just a blanket can we see your tax returns. meghan: part of the problem too, is, you great you will go to jail to find donald trump's tax returns. would you do anything for hillary clinton if you have any information any place about her health records or whatever stuff with the clinton foundation,

stuff about people knowing our national security secrets? i don't believe there are many journalists out there to expose the hypocrisy of clintons versus trumps. i believe in media bias. especially doing well and has a chance to pull this thing off. liz: but issue every presidential candidate releases tax returns. meghan: what is fascinating american public isn't demanding it. it was demanded of my father, health records. was demanded of -- >> by people or media. meghan: i think by people as well. >> you think voters were looking for information? meghan: i think voters wanted to make sure, my father was 72 at the time. that he had health and stamina which is fine. with the romneys they have exorbitant amount of wealth, and people want to see. for whatever reason i think because donald trump has different type of swagger and presents it in a different way, the american public doesn't seem to care as much. it is weird. sandra: the fact that every journalist on the planet as they

said wants the tax returns, they think this would be a game-changer for donald trump. liz: could be a game-changer if he doesn't. >> she said no. i'm going to see emac there. she said, meghan was shaking her head yes, too. harris: get them in the jail. sandra: a bill would let 9/11 families sue saudi arabia's government sits on president obama's desk after sailing through congress and passing unanimously in the senate but the white house says the president will veto that the measure. why the administration says suing the saudis is a bad idea. and how congress could override the president's decision. i've been taking fish oil from nature's bounty to support my heart. eating better, keeping healthy. so that no matter what happens in the future, my "future self" will thank me. thank you! 45 years of experience has taught us: no matter what the future holds, you're always better off healthy. nature's bounty

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sandra: more "outnumbered" in just a moment. first let's get to jon scott with what is coming up in the second hour of "happening now." hey, jon. >> sandra in next hour we're waiting a speech from donald trump. he is expected to repeat the attacks on hillary clinton for her saying that many trump supporters belong in a quote, basket of deplorables. we'll take that live. monitoring a clinton event. tim kaine is speaking in ann arbor, michigan. we're awaiting a campaign event by president obama. he is kicking off next hour what is expected to be a string of appearances for hillary clinton.

we'll have comment live as well. not a great day for stocks. the dow down as much as 250 points today. it comes despite a new economic report from the census bureau suggesting that poverty rates are falling and incomes are finally rising. we're keeping an eye on your money and incomes are rising in part because bill hemmer is getting time 1/2 for doing your show today. >> need it. sandra: hello. harris: she will give us a primer. >> thank you, jon. right on. [laughter] harris: white house says president obama is intent on vetoing legislation which has a wide bipartisan support. it would allow families of 9/11 victims to sue the government of saudi arabia. 15 of the 19 september 11 hijackers as you know were citizens of that country. white house press secretary josh earnest explains why the president believes a veto of the measure is in order. >> this law actually opens up the united states to risk of

being hauled into court in countries around the world. it is not hard to imagine other countries using this law as an excuse to haul u.s. diplomats or u.s. servicemembers or even u.s. companies into courts all around the world. harris: while capitol hill watchers say there appears to be, appear to be, i should say enough votes for congress to override the president's expected veto, it is not clear when or if that vote will definitely happen. that's because what is called a pocket veto may allow the president to defeat the bill by just holding on to it until congress recesses for fall elections. wow. you gave it a hmmm. >> like to have pocket veto every day around here. man, what's up with that? checking my twitter feed. hemmer, i would love to see you go to jail. meghan: what?

>> that was about the previous discussion. liz: on tax returns. >> i understand josh ernest's logic here and who knows how this leads legally to other countries with diplomats and americans and others working overseas. white house may not have a say. congress has the votes to override it. president obama never face ad veto before. seven 1/2 years. which president has that record before but if congress has the votes to override it, i see where they're going. i see where the families feel they need to open this up. i can see both sides of the argument. harris: maybe the president doesn't care so much about what people think about him as he exits in the next few months but, meghan, would this put the issue in the same category and ainge other over this category because of executive power if he pockets that veto? meghan: yeah, i think so. i'm still not clear how you sue

saudi arabia as an american. they have no respect for our country and our people as it is. i just don't even understand how there would be any recourse for this. i was under impression this was more cathartic for victim families. harris: i think this is serious thing. would we ever see the american government on their behalf posture a lawsuit? meghan: not under the obama administration, i don't think so. harris: they said if your people are taken hostage you're on your own coming from the administration in recent months. liz: there are political implications. chuck schumer is for this. >> a lot of democrats. liz: that has big ramifications if the president vetoed it. sandra: threatens formally, right? timing is everything. happening now could be significant for the election. >> if that is the case we'll see how much the white house lobbies congress to make sure it doesn't happen. harris: what are your thoughts in terms of the timing though?

sandra: the timing politically, is he still looking at approval rating at all-time highs right now, president obama? meghan: her racklously. blows my mind. i have no idea how he kept his numbers. harris: who would side against this? who would side against those families, getting some sort of something after all they have been through? >> good question. harris: you said you could understand the logic of it. explain it. >> i understand where the families are coming from. they want answers. they believe members of the saudi royal government, they were given money to al qaeda to make sure they had the money they needed to live in a hotel in san diego or to live in a hotel outside of fairfax, virginia. liz: profits that were backed -- >> they had the money in order to carry out the attacks. you get it. especially coming off the heels of 15 years of september 11, you feel for them even today. i don't know how wise it would

be for our citizens working and living overseas. i see it on both sides. harris: we'll cover it as it happens. we're awaiting donald trump's rally in iowa where he could have new reaction to hillary clinton's health issues and her claim that many of his supporters, i'm calling them supportables, supporters are deplorable. we'll keep an eye on all of it and cover it. we're coming right back. at safelite, we know how busy life can be.

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harris: congrats on fantasy football. looks like you're doing well. >> one week. one week. sandra: more of this. we'll keep it right here for "outnumbered overtime" on web. facebook.com/outnumbered, and facebook live. and tomorrow we'll see you on tv "happening now" starts right now.