and i think it's wrong that we have this false narrative that we put out. we have riots, we have demonstrations, we have people getting hurt, careers destroyed, families destroyed, reputations destroyed, when the facts are in front of us. in michael brown, it was in front of case, it is dead in front of us. the police chief has told us enough, that is absolutely 100%, and that's what he said. the man had a gun, he didn't have a book. the man was told to drop the gun, he did not repeatedly and the officer used deadly force. we wouldn't the facts to get in the way of a really good riot with agitators and this narrative that black lives matter. they swoop in and they think that every one of these cases is going to be bad. they have no confidence in the criminal justice system, and mr. parks knows you cannot release

video it is you have a tentative indictment for a homicide. if you want an officer indicted, you can't release evidence to the general public and pollute the jury pool before you actually indict the officer and give him his constitutional rights. so if the officer is cleared, they'll release the videos. >> do you want to respond to that? >> i don't quite agree with that. i think -- >> what do you mean, you don't agree with that? [ overlapping speakers ] >> hang on, hang on. we've got another flash bang that just went off there. as you can see on the left side of the screen, of your screen, you can see that the final disbursement attempts i guess are being made as the police have been trying throughout the night. they've tried tear gas, rubber bullets, mace, flash gangs, and the crowd seemingly just reorganizes, as steve harrigan has been telling us all night, again and again.

any way, i want to go back and ask daryl parks, you can go back to the point you were making. >> there are plenty of times we see in america where we make a decision that is in the public interest to release information to quell some of the concerns. it happens all the time. >> but it's part of an ongoing investigation. >> but there comes a point where the public interest outweighs them. there are more lives jeopardi d jeopardized. >> let me give mark fuhrman a chance to respond to that. >> so are we to say when we have a possible homicide investigation, we're supposed to release the information, the evidence in that case so people don't loot, riot, shoot people, break into stores? i think that sounds like a hostage situation, it doesn't sound like justice. it sounds absurd as a matter of fact.

so the general public says if they don't get what they want, that they're going to riot. i mean, that's just ignorant. >> well, let me respond to that, because it's not ignorant. i think there are certain situations where it demands that justice, you must release information. it makes good sense. [ overlapping speakers ] >> are you giving in to a mob mentality, we demand you release the evidence, even if it takes away any chance of having an objective jury pool in a potential criminal case, which in this case might be against an officer. we don't have the facts in the case yet. why would you be forced to do that to appease people that are saying if you don't do it, we're going to loot, we're going to rob, throw rocks and bottles at cops and create maximum amount of chaos in our city and create destruction along with it.

>> let me say this, sean, we've seen cases, one example is a case we saw in a roadway in chicago where you had footage of what happened between the officer and the person killed. in those cases where you saw the -- what exactly happened, that there was such great public concern and outrage, i think the public deserves to know fully what happened. on behalf of the person that was killed and on what have of the police. >> it might not even be definitive. that's another issue that we have here. so for example, the two different versions of the story are, as it celts to keith lamont scott, he was either carrying a book or he had a gun. if he had a gun, and they have a gun and i've seen pictures of, and they have a holster on his ankle but there's no book, i think that would lean a jury in favor of the police's version of events, not residents that say he had a book, and i think it's

going to be one way or the other. i don't think there's going to be any ambiguity here. >> if that's the case, show it. >> reporter: sean, channel 9 in charlotte breaking. sources say dash cam video shows keith scott getting out of car, coming to officers with gun in hand. >> so he did have a gun on him? >> reporter: i don't know. this is s.o.c. tv channel 9. sources tell channel 9, keith scott getting out of car coming towards officers with gun in his hand. there's no reason -- you don't release everything, but there's no reason -- i've seen, you've seen dash cam video released well before a case has been

adjudicated. i think the whole notion that you have to wait until a your trial to release evidence of such intense public interest is false. >> let me ask this question, geraldo. let's say this report turns out to be right. i guess everybody can back up and say sorry, we rushed to judgment, we can go home now. is that going to happen? >> reporter: i doubt it. you have the two views of the world, sean, and it's dangerous to ignore that reality -- >> what reality? the truth is reality. >> reporter: people believe that the police are more dangerous to them than they are protectors of them. >> this has to be discussed, because we cannot ignore this any longer. geraldo, 3,000 people have been shot in chicago. 3,660 killed in chicago since obama has been president. we only hear the false narrative of out ferguson.

that they killed him in cold blood. it was a lie. and on everything that happened there after was predicated on a lie. if that report you just gave this audience is true tonight, everything here is predicated on a lie. >> reporter: listen, you and i were absolutely in sync after ferguson, i think those two steps in and of themselves would go far towards alleviating some of this tension. but the tension definitely exists. this will blow over. but you had tulsa just a couple of days ago. they've had hundreds, i don't know how many because it's very difficult to get statistics on police involved shootings because they don't have a national data bank. i think that's one of the reforms that can happen, to know exactly what we're talking about here. let's be proactive rather than

make it about presidential politics. i understand that there are different points of view about that, but what i'm interested in, and this is why what the mayor said about me hurt my feelings, because i stand with cops at too many funerals. i'm shoulder to shoulder with cops. i understand how difficult it is to be a cop in an urban setting, and one of these dysfunctional towns like baltimore has become, i empathize with cops. but we also have to understand that there are many sensible, loving, patriotic, american people who feel the police are, you know, too many unarmed black men are dying in confrontation with cops.

not this guy, apparently if that report is correct, but i have no problem going back to the original where i started -- >> you know what that would mean, geraldo? in baltimore, what happened to the six cops in baltimore, geraldo? none were found guilty. >> reporter: i was the first one -- i knew they would be acquitted, sean. >> this is not personal about you, i'm just making a point. the same thing in ferguson. our good friend daryl parks here, he was part of the belief that "hands up, don't shoot" happened, that false narrative. this is the point i was trying to get to you. if all of these murders are happening in chicago, and the vast majority of those nearly 4,000 dead since obama has been president, where black americans, black on black crime and the president ignores it and the nation doesn't know the name of any of those people. but we know the names of every case where the president got it

wrong, there's something fundamentally wrong with top political figures rushing to judgment, not allowing due process. not allowing the presumption of innocence. not calling for calm. and the police not doing their job or prevented from doing their job, which is to stop and protect and serve innocent people in these communities and store owners that have sacrificed greatly. >> reporter: you know what happened tonight? in the wnba, the woman's professional basketball league, the entire team from indiana, the women's team from indiana, they all knelt during the national anthem. you'll hear about it tomorrow. you got the colin kaepernick, the 49ers guy, you've got other ball players doing it. just like you had lebron james, when he was with the miami heat during the trayvon marting coming out with hoodies on. this is the perception, in many

ways it is a false narrative in terms of the data and facts -- >> not in many ways, it's a false narrative. >> reporter: if you have 732 black guys killed in confrontation with cops, that's not nothing. >> i believe as a christian, every life was granted by god. one of the things that frustrates me here is we always seem to focus on cases that are brought up through a political prism because they advance a narrative and nobody seems to be getting or paying attention to how wrong the president has been. how wrong hillary clinton is. how wrong is it for them to embrace black lives matter, people that dare to say what do we want? dead cops. when do we want them? now. are you serious? the president of the united states invites them to the oval office? >> reporter: if you focus your

wrath, sean -- >> there's no wrath, it's justice. >> reporter: on the hard-core hip-hop rap community that extols the virtue of anti-police violence, to me those are the people that are promulgating or exaggerating the reality, where they glorify the violence, where they glorify the confrontations with the thin blue line. but the "pigs in a blanket" business, i'm not sure how many times it happened. >> you know what? one time is too much when you're talking about dead cops. and what do we want, dead cops? stay right there, all of you. by the way, it is a little ironic that two days ago obama gets so indignant because he wants his legacy and he doesn't want black americans to vote for donald trump because that would outrage his legacy. mr. mayor, rudy giuliani,

america's mayor, let me go back to you. i'm watching all this unfold. we've seen the rocks and the bottles, we've seen the 16 injured officers from last night, reports that some might have been injured tonight. >> you know who we haven't seen tonight? the president of the united states. we haven't seen the president of the united states get on television and say you shouldn't do this. this is going to be a justified shooting. the police chief laid out the facts today. he seemed to be an honorable and decent man. i would find it hard to believe that he's a racist. i understand the criminal justice system and i'm surprised that geraldo doesn't understand it, that you can't put information out. i did it a couple of times and got severely criticized for doing it, put out the criminal record to people who were killed in order to show that they were

people who instigated violence all throughout their lives. the reality is that people like my good friend, geraldo, are part of the problem here. there are two sin't two sides t story, there's just one story and it's called the truth. so if the president turns out to be wrong about trayvon martin or wrong about a situation in which a police officer acted improperly, he should give a speech to the country, including the african-american community, who would listen to him more than me, and say, i was wrong. and the reason that we have so many confrontations, and there respect that many actually, but between blacks and police officers, is because of the high level of crime which is seven times per capita what it is in

the white communities in these areas. now, i could have -- when i was mayor, i could have kept my police officers on park avenue. they would have been very happy. except i would have 7,000 more black people dead. so the police are there because of the heavy amount of crime in those communities, about which president obama has said nothing, done nothing, nor has he offered any leadership in a situation like this where we have civil unrest to the point where people are being killed and harmed and hurt. where is the president tonight? sleeping in his bed. why shouldn't he get on? maybe he should have called the police chief today. if i were president, i would have called the police chief today and asked him to show me the tape and i would have gone on television, and if the police chief was right, i would have said -- >> backed him up. >> stand up, stop it. let's not have a riot. there's no excuse, and even if the police officer was wrong,

there's no excuse for what's going on right now. we have a criminal justice system. it works. our leaders, our president, our attorney general for sure has to get people to believe in our system, not attack it. and that's all they do, attack it. >> you know, you're raising such incredible points here. >> where is the president tonight? this is a night we need a president. this is a night we need a leader, and we happen to have an -- i was an italian-american, so i could stand up to the mafia, talk back to them and i never stopped. where do we have our african-american president standing up to these criminals who are on the street right now, who are throwing rocks, shooting, looting their own people's stores. where is that president protecting those innocent people. >> you know, mr. mayor -- >> he's completely oblivious to

it. if i had become president in 2008 and there were 3,000 murders in my street, do you think i would have kept my mouth shut? >> no. >> you know why? because i care about the lives of all black people. not just black people shot by police. not just black people shot by other blacks, not just white people, but all people. when i was mayor of new york, i went to every shooting that happened that was serious. and when i was u.s. attorney, i went to every shooting that happened. geraldo may have been with the police a lot, but i've been at the deathbed of 24 police officers and one of my cousins died in the line of duty. so you can't tell me that this is not about a black of leadership at the very, very top. this is happening because of eight years of barack obama and his failure to speak tonight is a tremendous testament to his

total lack of leadership. >> mr. mayor, i've got to put you on hold again. >> sean, i've got to get off now. i've got to get up early and i've said enough. [ overlapping speakers ] >> i love geraldo but i think buying into this is very dangerous and it's just going to continue this. we have to tell people the truth. >> all right, mr. mayor, thank you for your time tonight and your insight andrience. it's much appreciated. joining us on the phone is the governor of the state of north carolina, pat mccorry is with us. and he's just, as of now, declared a state of emergency. governor, first of all, thoughts and prayers go out to everybody in your state. i hate to see what i'm watching. i'm very upset at so many people rushing to judgment here. can you corroborate, have you talked to the police chief, can you corroborate what he said

earlier was true, that in fact a gun was found in this particular case and it wasn't a book? >> yes, that's correct. and i know this police chief. i was mayor of charlotte for 14 years from 1995 to 2009. i knew this police chief when he was a beat cop. he's one of the best there is, and i trust him immensely. and now that i'm governor of north carolina, i'm going to do everything i can to support him and these police officers who are catching total abuse on the streets of the city i love. i just declared a state of emergency. we're going to be bringing in the national guard around also bringing in state highway troopers to supplement their needs, primarily to protect buildings and these police can arrest those people causing

damage. >> governor, i have a lot of close friends in north carolina, winston salem and elsewhere, including charlotte. how long will it take to get the national guard there and other state officials there to help out this police department that seems overwhelmed by the numbers of people that have been in the streets? >> we have some on the ground right now, but you're talking about several hours because you have to make sure when they get there -- i mean, they're not far, but you have to make sure there's coordination. you don't want them to just rush in, you want it to be planned. we're going to be working very close with the chief of police there. i've been on the phone basically all day, waiting for the directive. and i've had people getting prepared for this since 7:00 this morning frankly, coming from all over the state. >> governor, have you heard from the president of the united states yet? >> i have not, no. >> yeah. let me ask you this, what does

it mean -- would that mean a curfew in the city of charlotte, sir? >> no. right now the main thing that i'm doing is providing assets to the police department. i do think that's something that the city of charlotte officials ought to consider for the city at this point in time, but i'm going to let them make that decision. as mayor for 14 years, i had similar circumstances, although social media has changed dramatically since that time. social media makes it much more difficult on police because of the -- because of the activity that can be coordinated. and frankly, the 24-hour news cycle doesn't help either because a lot of these people are playing to the cameras. even in downtown charlotte, we have a lot of media where some of them outnumber the protesters. and we have similar problems throughout the united states.

so a lot of these people are playing to cameras, and i encourage the media to not let them play to the cameras. that just puts our police in jeopardy. that's what i care about right now is our very brave police officers. it's a very, very stressful situation, and i'm going to do everything i can to protect our city and our state, especially support our police during this time. >> governor, we certainly support that goal of yours. let me go back and talk about the charlotte police chief. you said he was very, very firmly today, he disregarded all of these -- the differing narratives that have emerged, neighborhood residents saying that the man that was killed here, keith lamont scott, was carrying a book. you've been able to confirm with the police chief that, in fact, a gun was apprehended from that individual?

>> that is my understanding if talking to city officials. but it would be safer as governor to let the city officials respond. i think it's very dangerous in these type situations to have too many spokesman. i'm a former mayor, and i never wanted the governor to be deferred to who is further away from the situation. i trust this police chief. he's got an excellent force there. i worked with him for many years, and i used to ride with the police in charlotte. it's a great city. >> it is a great city. i've been this, governor. ask you confirm one piece of information for us? can you confirm whether or not there ask a videotape that will corroborate what the police chief said? >> i will not -- i will not confirm that, because i think it's up to the police chief to give those direct answers or the

mayor. and i'll let them deal with that. my job is to help the mayor and the police chief in protecting their city and our state. that's my major concern right now. during this next 24 to 48 hours. it's very sad to see some people whose only interest is to cause trouble. that's a very small minority of people in charlotte and some of these people are come in from outside driven by social media and want the publicity for deviant reasons. >> are you confident, governor, that with the extra resources you're providing by declaring a state of emergency that this will be the last night of trouble like we've seen in the last two nights? >> that would not be a prediction that i would be able to make, because i've had these situations before as a mayor for 14 years.

i think that's a prediction that would be unwise to make, because it is not an exact science, especially with a social media environment which people can coordinate very quickly any place, anywhere, not just in charlotte but in the united states. my job is to protect the people of north carolina and support our police and hopefully we'll be arresting very shortly many more of these agitators. it's a very small number of people causing a great deal of pressure and harm to our police on the streets right now. >> governor, if there is a videotape, it's an ongoing investigation. you don't want to taint the jury pool -- >> with all due respect, i've got to get to work. i have to deploy the national guard. thank you. >> thank you for being with us.

now on the phone is former 2016 republican presidential candidate dr. ben carson. dr. carson, i had the pleasure of being with you earlier today at the town hall we did take with donald trump. hopefully we can air it tomorrow night. as you watch this unfold and it's not the first time we have seen this, what's going through your mind? >> well, there's a lot of things going through my mind. first of all, you know, was there a gun or not a gun? it seems like that should be important. we should just get off of protocol and say if we have a way of demonstrating that, we should do that and move on. there's an atmosphere in the country now where no one trusts the authorities, from the president down.

we've got to begin to combat that, and we're not going to combat that if we say yeah, we've got this but not show it to you. that's one thing. we're going to continue to have these problems if we don't begin to retrain our officers in non-lethal force techniques. right now, police are taught if you feel there's any danger, use lethal force. i think of that situation in oklahoma where that poor officer, i mean, she didn't know whether he was going to his car to get a gun or not. and she had to make a decision. but the only choice she had was lethal force. maybe we should be teaching them to use nonlethal force before he gets to the car. that might alleviate some of these situations.

but i think trust is really the issue here. i get the feeling that there probably would have been riots no matter what was shown, because you have all these professional agitators now who come in and take advantage of the situation. didn't happen on the first night, because they hadn't gotten there yet. but once they smell blood in the water, they're going to be there. so tonight, probably very bad. may get much worse than it is now. and tomorrow night, who knows what's going to happen? you know, unless the evidence is shared. so those are the things going through my mind right now. also, a combination of agitators and a populist that has lost hope frequently leads to great chaos. i think we need the kind of leadership that really checked into things that can be out

front and up front with what's going on with people. can work with people from both sides to find solutions. one of the things that impressed me the most about ferguson when i went there is the fact that the police, the mayor, the community, officials, as well as some of the rioters, had become friendly with each other, were having regular meetings. i think that's the kind of thing that can have an incredible impact. >> yeah. i was together with you today and this town hall, i started out the town hall with a lot of statistics about what the last eight years have been like in terms of economics in the country. then i broke it down demographically as we were addressing problems in the african-american community. this is a demographic that obama got 93% of the vote.

when you break it down demographically, it's not a good story. you know, i think we have policies that have disproportionately impacted the black community. if i can repeat them again, dr. carson, we've had a 58% increase in the number of african-americans on food stamps since obama is president. a 20% increase in the number of african-americans who are not in the labor force any more. the african-american home ownership rate is down. it's more than 20% lower than the national average. african-american unemployment is 8.1%, nearly double the national average of 4.9%. the wage gap between african-americans, white workers, is the worst it's been in nearly 40 years. median household income for african-americans is $20,000 less than the national average. and the african-american poverty rate is 24.1%, over 10% higher than the national average.

and then i talk -- go ahead. >> there's no question that things have gotten much worse, and they're going to continue to get even worse if we have a continuation of this kind of leadership. i'm proud of donald trump for actually going into the neighborhoods and making the effort. he's going to get criticized whether he makes the effort or not, he knows that. so he's going to make the effort. he's not just talking. i can tell you, he's a man who knows how to get things done. there are many examples of that in new york city. he's also -- i'll tell you something many people may not know about. he's very, very loyal. if he feels that he's had a lot of support from the african-american community, believe me, they're going to feel that in a very positive way. he's going to do it any way, but he's going to be extremely

enthusiastic about it. i think a lot of black people are starting to see that. you're starting to see it in the poll numbers. but a lot of private communication are indicating that's happening. black people are not stupid, and they look and they say, you know, what's been going on with democratic rule all these years? it's not helping us. we have 73% of our babies born out of wedlock. high high school dropout rates. increasing poverty. none of these are good things, plus all the violence and what's going on with our young men in the prisons and getting murdered on the street. this is not good. the republicans unfortunately over the years have not really delved into this area and haven't talked much about solutions. >> i don't want to give away the

town hall, because hopefully we can air it tomorrow night. we won't be preemted because of violence. but nobody knows the name of the 3600 people murdered since president obama has been president in chicago. nobody talks about an educational system hurting black americans where high school graduation rates are 9% lower for african-american students. you know, here question spend $11,600 a student, and in spite of all that money, well, america ranks 17th in reading, 19th in science, 26th in math. when i first met you, i was mesmerized by your story, about a mother that so loved you, she dragged you off the streets with

your friends, in my case, my dopey friends. seriously, if i didn't have the loving parents that made me do the things your mother did in your case, you wouldn't have been the brilliant brain surgeon you became. >> true. >> we're not loving these kids enough to fix their failing school systems. we have a mysterious resistance to institutionalizing reform and charter schools that we know work. go ahead. >> their opposition to charter schools is almost incomprehensible when you look at the improved graduation rates and college rates. and the achievement in general. why would they be against

achievement? obviously, they have some nefarious things going on here, and it's control issue. >> they want -- teachers want the tenure. there's no accountability. there's no standards. you know, by the way, this is a choice election. trump wants to give education back to local communities and cities and states and hillary clinton beholden to the nea, institutionalized failure. >> absolutely. what people have to realize is when we get more of our people actively climbing the ladder of success, that means there are fewer people that have to be -- that speeds up the progress. we can speed it up if we get more of our people, able bodied and well educated. it makes perfectly good sense. >> hopefully we'll be able to

air the town hall that you were gracious enough to be part of earlier today, when we were in cleveland, ohio. dr. carson, thank you so much for your time. >> okay. thanks, sean. >> joining us now, fox news senior correspondent geraldo rivera, mark fuhrman, david web, and daryl parks remains us with. geraldo, you're driving me insane tonight, because for whatever reason -- i understand your point. there's certainly legitimate -- any time a life is lost, we all ought to be concerned as human beings. the is, disproportionately by a magnitude of a thousand, we don't hear the examples of black on black crime. the president rushes to judgment in high profile race cases where the police are involved.

i would argue because he wants to advance a narrative, and he's been more often wrong than right and ignores his own city with one of the highest murder rates since he's been president of the united states and he's done nothing. that to me is so out of proportion it's unconscionable. >> in your first 30 seconds, you made my case, sean. this is not all about one side. there is some truth to the complaints of the community. i think that it is the height of intolerance and strivancy for mayor giuliani to say there's only one side to this story. >> whoa, whoa, there's either a gun or a book. there's no in between. >> i'm not talking about the specifics of this incident involving this father of seven, that his death is a tragedy

regardless of whether he had the gun or the book. there are those reports, and i just reported them from channel 9 in charlotte, that the video does show him approving the office we are a gun. but my point is this, if you completely deny that all that emotion and all of these public figures that are speaking out, all the people that are so deeply hurt by the deaths in the community, that if you just reject whole cloth, everything, you just delegitimize the sentiment at all, then i think you're guilty of turning your back on a substantial segment of the american people. >> i just gave more statistics about the last eight years and how disproportionately black

americans are being mistreated by their government and how government has failed them. >> i'm not debating that. >> here's my point. a president that ignores the magnitude and severity and the sheer numbers of death and shootings in his own city -- >> but you can't deny there are black mothers out there who are more afraid when their kid goes out at night of the cops than the crooks. >> hang on a second, we've got a bunch of people in the highway. they seem to be surrounding a car. this does not look good. the car thankfully got away. juxtapose the 3,660 deaths, since obama has been president in chicago. the 3,000 shootings this year alone, with only the cases that he seems to talk about where it's only the police involved. why do you ignore the thousands -- >> i don't ignore it.

i cover all these riots for you. i'm the guy getting tear gassed normally. >> yeah, i know. [ overlapping speakers ] >> rudy giuliani said a lot of things about me tonight. >> he likes you. >> i love him, too. he's a great mayor, although a lot of people resented his hard -- his harshness. >> he saved lives. >> i've been in this business 47 years. i was a street lawyer on avenue c -- i took rudy giuliani to show him the heroin dealers when he had no idea where they were. i took him by the hand -- >> don't take it personally. i'm very concerned what i see going on here. >> i see it. [ overlapping speakers ] >> these are the bad dudes now. >> now what you see happening,

cars being stopped by the crowd and things are being thrown. i'm worried they're going to rip somebody out and start beating the crap out of them. >> i absolutely agree with you. >> they're throwing things at the car. >> the driver in the rodney king case got ripped out of the car. where are the police now? i know they're shining a light. there's a helicopter flying over this. somebody is holding something up. are they going to throw it at the car? this is -- where are the police here? i'm glad that the governor called in the national guard. this is very dangerous what is happening here. >> i don't understand why the state police aren't there. the state police come before the national guard. it would seem that they should have been on the scene already here. >> they are. >> are they on the scene? i don't know where -- >> it looks like the police just got there, because the crowd is slightly disbursindisbursing.

reginald denny was the guy driving the truck in the case in los angeles. but if you've got one city and you've got over 75% of deaths, and they're black americans and i agree, black lives matter, all lives matter. and the president ignores that, but he only goes after high profile cases where police are involved and then he mostly ends up being wronged by the end of the day -- something again was just thrown at that car -- that tells me that his priorities are way out of whack. >> i think his biggest failure, sean, in office is that race relations have deteriorated over the last eight years, exactly the opposite to what our hopes were in 2008. it may be that he has not been

active enough. some say he should shut up on these cases. >> is somebody laying on top of that car, trying to prevent that car from driving? look, i'm -- i don't even have my glasses on. if somebody can confirm that in my ear. they've been stopping cars. things have been -- they're like swarming this car here. >> i would like to see some officers marching up there. >> i don't see any officers and they've been stopping car after car. i don't see any cops near here. if i had any ability to communicate with the cameraman, i would ask him to pan in a little bit more. hang on, joining us on the phone is charlotte police spokesman

robert trufano. are you watching what's going on, on our screen right now? >> i'm monitoring it with the command center here in charlotte. seeing not only what you're seeing but seeing other flare-ups that are being generated around town right now, and have -- >> officer, do you see these cars being stopped and people jumping on them and seem to be -- we're on the verge of a potential real problem here. i don't see any cops in the area. are you watching this? >> this is not the only situation that we have going on right now. we have officers deployed in the city, trying to quell some of the behavior. it's quite dynamic. the drivers have two choices, they're going to either run people over and kill them, or people are stopping them in the middle of the highway and throwing things at their car and surrounding the car. it reminds me that there could

be a potential tragic reginald denny situation if we're not careful here. >> we all remember that from a you years ago, sean. our officers are doing heroic work tonight -- >> i don't see any officers here. have any officers been dispatched to this highway? >> yes, they have. we're monitoring from the command center and we have our chopper in the air. again, this isn't the only situation unfortunately we're having to address tonight. what started out with the hope to be a peaceful protest, a couple of events planned earlier in the evening, started out going according to plan, but agitators unfortunately hijacked a number of these event and this is what we're seeing on our screens right now. again, our officers are doing heroic work in various parts of town. >> i think -- no, i thought

there were police officers getting there. officer, if you haven't gotten any officers there, i think you need some help real quick. that seems like a pretty volatile situation unfolding there. mark fuhrman, look at this, mark. you've got people standing on cars, obviously. it's almost like they're hijacking these cars. are you watching this, mark? seems like car after car is being stopped. things are being thrown at the cars. now you've got the driver's side door open and people standing on top of the car and i don't see any police in the area. this seems like a potential disaster. >> well, it is. and those drivers should just go ahead and drive right through it. and if somebody doesn't want to

get out of the way, that's their problem. it is a potentially dangerous and deadly situation, once that person -- >> they're all going slow because they don't want to hurt any of these people. they're standing in the street. there's like a mob of people throwing things at cars, jumping at the cars. it looks like they're hijacking this car. there's six people on top of this car now. oh, my god. >> you know, sean, when i listened to everybody talk about this, we're forgetting -- >> and the driver is trying to drive, but his driver's door is open. wow, this is not good. this is really not good. geraldo, are you watching this, too? >> i am, sean. it is -- this is where in these dark corners where you remember at 11:47 eastern time the only people out there right now are

those who want very much to be part of the action in the worst possible way. when you get a dark corner, you get someone vulnerable, who is isolated. that's where something tragic can happen. i think that a massive show of force come tomorrow morning will be very helpful. tonight is going to be a long, hot night in charlotte, north carolina. >> that's pretty scary. who else do we have here with us? i think -- let me see, we've got david web, you've been watching with us all night. are you interpreting this the way i am, you have this mob of people on a major highway stopping the cars as they go, obviously intimidating? >> the car that he's talking about with the riders on it -- sean -- >> david, i don't know if you can hear you. >> i can hear you.

that car that you're talking about that came up, it came on the highway at a 90 degree angle. i watched it come on. so chances are, that's a car, you and i saw this in ferguson, where people would pull up and do the ride alongs and slow down the traffic. so the car looks like is someone that was brought on. so what we have here are the professionals, the people out there and night, the agitators. i wish people would rewind to the conversation you had with dr. carson. i was with him there in ferguson. the engagement needs to be at the ground level. it's a failure by the president and the doj. we need real leadership on those issues. >> geraldo, where is the president tonight?

where is the guy silent on all those chicago shootings and silent on those chicago deaths, baltimore, cambridge, trayvon, where is he tonight, sleeping? >> i think there should have been a statement from the white house, he didn't show leadership? >> the president can't jump up. what you have here, you have the shots, one fellow died in a confrontation with a cop and you have the critically injured protestor shot by another protestor tonight so you have to keep it in perspective.

you don't have rodney king yet. you don't have ferguson. you don't have some of these -- >> you have cars turning around because they see. >> it is nine minutes to midnight. you can't expect the president of the united states to be on tv. >> this is the same guy who rushed to baltimore and cambridge and asked the community to wait until the evidence is in, now, you've got cars running around, racing around, probably putting other peoples' lives in jeopardy? are you kidding me? >> you reluctantly got the governor of -- >> well -- i think the governor and president should have a chat. >> that would have been obama's

responsibility. pick up the damn phone. >> to make this about presidential politics is -- is -- >> i'm sorry. it's only okay when he rushes to judgment. >> put it in the frame of the president shouldn't come out, no president can, and comment on any legal issue. what he can do is demonstrate leadership. the same president who said last week i consider it an insult if you don't vote for hillary clinton and i'm paraphrasing. has a great deal of influence in the black community. he can stand up as a show of leadership, geraldo, i'm with you. i don't want to hear from the president of the united states on everything. in this case, he can say how about we have a call for calm rather than a rush to judgment and we let due process play out? >> there are rocks being tlen at police.

mark furman, you've watched this chaos unfold. cops need it desperately. what do you think they're doing wrong here? >> i don't think they're having anything wrong. i think there are too little personnel. we tried to break it up and box them in. they're having a difficult time keeping it in one place, you have motivated rioters that want to continue this until they move to a different area and cause the police to then move accordingly. >> look. again, i think they've been put in a difficult situation. geraldo is right, mark. as much as people are here, you know, it's nearly midnight on the east coast tonight. and the people out there now, these are the -- this is die hard professional agitators.

they're going to be out there until all hours of fight. right? >> when you think about agenda of the groups that are perpetuating this, black lives matter as well as others, there is nothing the city or police department can do to appease them. this is about power, this is not about justice or a man with a gun. this is about power, they don't want to let go of it. these unwitting volunteers on the street are the soldiers being sold a bill of goods to push an agenda of people they don't even know. >> let me bring back darrell parks here, i know you and i have had disagreement. what if it turns out once again there was a rush togment like in the two cases that you

worked on, and michael brown case and trayvon martin case, what if that happens one more time and this was wrong from the beginning? is anyone going to say i'm sorry? anybody going to say maybe we need to give people the benefit of the doubt? police officers? the presumption of innocence? >> no. no. i think in this situation that we here, i think transparency is a thing we need to see. something dr. ben carson said, we need to get to a point where law enforcement officers need to be trained in some thought given to nonlethal force. the reason they are to use deadly force is a problem, as long as young black men keep being killed by the police we're going to have to get in this situation. >> this woman is getting right in their grill here and a police officer picked up what i think

is a rubber bullet gun and had to point it at her, she was getting in the police officer's grill. wow. >> this is, this is now between this and what is going on on that highway, extraordinarily volatile. this is a dangerous situation. a president could owe have called the mayor today, the police chief today. could have called the governor and said after 16 cops got hurt last night maybe we need to give these guys support. do you need anything from me? that would have been nice. >> i just wish sean that you can replay the incident you did 15 minutes ago. i think that in his intelligence measured way, dr. carson really put this thing in the kind of perspective we need to understand. there is a, i'm not talking about the people looking at the screen now, these are the punches. these are the pros. they've been in my face a

million times, they've thrown water on me. and it, put that aside. there is this lack of trust with the community. we've got to work on it. mark is right. there is nonlethal training. i want to see more universal use of tasers. >> it's easy to say. >> but the guy had a gun, geraldo. >> it's one of those things if it's true, that a guy -- >> in his car, whatever he was doing, he stayed waiting for his son at the bus stop like a good dad. >> that doesn't matter geraldo. what happens is when he gets out of the car and his actions. training is not a 1-way street. the community trains the police and vice versa. the problem is that we have a community or a group of people who are out of control.

the lesson of dr. ben carson going to ferguson is that there is engagement in both directions and there was information exchanged but the people that don't show up for solutions are on the street. they want to keep the trouble and argument alive. they don't want to work towards solving the problem. >> talking about nonlethal force, if someone pulls a gun, you don't have a lot of time to decide whether or not i can get him with a taser. >> that is the end of the escalation of force. once they demonstrate they have a weapon, a firearm, but they're failing to actually adhere and follow the commands of the officer, you cannot wait until he points it. because he will beat you to the first shot. that is also -- >> that is the use of force aggression. >> that is something we don't talk about.

use of force progression and tactics. >> it's an escalation. >> right. >> and that use of force can go from verbalizing to hands on, he went from verbalization to use of force because he had to. the suspect demanded it. >> i have are got to believe that the state of emergency that has been declared in charlotte by the governor is going to have an impact. the national guard coming in and would he expect more of this tomorrow? >> yes. we should. they're there to protect the community and building from the looters. we've got to have protection of the community. >> guys i want to thank you for staying with us for two hours.

that is all the time we have left. state of emergency has been declared by the governor. stay with the fox news channel for continuing breaking news coverage of the protests in north carolina. our thoughts and prayer are with those people. >> this is a fox news alert. governor of north carolina declaring a state of emergency following a second night of violent protests in charlotte. gunshots ringing out outside of the epicenter, police say one person was shot by another civilian. on the left-hand side of the screen you're looking at live footage at the police in riot gear now. things appear to be dying down. the protestors looting businesses in the area, it's the second night of demonstrations following tuesday's deadly police shooting of a black man.