♪ we are at washington university in st. louis where ten hours from now donald trump, hillary clinton will face-off for their second debate. this as the media are ablaze with damaging stories about each candidate that are virtually certain to surface tonight. for trump it's a decade old videotape that shows him engaging in vulgar talk about groping women, those words causing a storm of criticism, even among some conservative commentators and fellow republicans. we will talk to the reporter who broke the story. for clinton e-mails dumped by wikileaks revealed some of what she said in those big money

beaches to wall street firms include not just embarrassing phrases but positions that seem to contradict her public pronounce mts. we begin with those hot mic moments from trump's 2005 "access hollywood" taping with billy bush and some is graphic. >> i moved on her like a [ bleep ]. i couldn't get there and she was married. all of a sudden i see her, she's now got the big phoney [ bleep ] and everything, i'm automatically attracted to beautiful -- it's like a magnet. and when you are a star they let you do it. you can do anything. >> whatever you want. >> grab them by the [ bleep ]. you can do anything. >> trump said in an initial statement that he apologized if anyone was offended but that bill clinton has said far worse to him. then came this video. >> i've never said i'm a perfect person, nor pretended to be someone that i'm not. i've said and done things i regret and the words released today on this more than a decade old video are one of them.

anyone who knows me knows these words don't reflect who i am. i said it. i was wrong. and i apologize. >> but many pthe story as highl. >> i honestly feel like there's a pretty good chance we don't know who the republican candidate is for president by the end of this weekend. >> will this kill his campaign? >> i think this could be it. >> nobody is going to defend this. you can't defend. it is wrong, it is inappropriate, it is outrageous. >> joining us now to analyze the coverage of the trump and clinton stories as well as tonight's big debate julie roginsky fox news contributor and a democratic strategist, tucker carlson co-host of "fox and friends" weekend and editor of the daily caller and heidi przybyla senior political reporter at "usa today." >> tucker, you have a nuclear explosion in the media over a decade old tape, republicans

baling right and left. the words are disturbing, they are indefensible, but i was watching cnn and msnbc, it's on hour after hour. is the news business overplaying this just a bit? >> the words are indefensible they are not inexplicable. nobody is actually shocked by this and everyone is pretending to be. >> manufactured outrage. >> entirely manufactured. this was one of the recurring guests on the howard stern show. this is donald trump. so everyone knew that trump is capable of this. everyone who knows trump knows he speaks like this in real life, not this extreme but in the ballpark. one the press has no moral standing to judge anyone who talks like this having spent 25 years in news rooms. >> you have heard plenty of locker room talk. >> i have. the other point is it's misleading to pretend trump is being abandoned by the republican leadership because they are so outramd. john mccain is not pulling his

support of trump because he's offended, it's because he thinks it hurts him politically. >> julie roginsky, tucker is saying hardly shocking, we have heard the whole howard stern interviews and so a lot of this is just whipped up from people in the media and politics who do not like donald trump. >> i agree with tucker on almost everything. the only difference between locker room talk that tucker was privy to is donald trump is not just talking about the size of somebody's breasts he is actually talking about sexual assault, he is going up to women and grabbing them by their private parts in ways that i think most people would construe as an unwanted sexual assault. so when it comes to that, that's where the lawn is drawn. listen, i agree with tucker 100%, john mccain is not baling because all of a sudden we find that donald trump is vulgar. they're baling because of politics. for a lot of women this isn't about just the locker room talk, it's actually about the fact this locker room talk constitutes something people are familiar with as assault.

>> i'm not trying to minimize this or defend it or make excuses for it i'm merely saying it came from donald trump and everyone knew he was capable of this. that's the only point i'm saying. >> interesting that you used the word private parts because the p word which we have bleeped cnn just showed the tape and showed the p word and s words and "the new york times" printed it. >> heidi przybyla, even if people are saying this is media bias, you don't like donald trump, you also have the explosive reaction to this whole tape, you know, reince priebus and kellyanne conway bowing out of the sunday shows, mike pence not making a trip saying he can't defend it, trump's wife saying this is offensive but accepts his apology. hugh hewitt and bill bennett saying he should drop out of the race. in part is the press covering the reaction to this even if it's an overreaction? >> absolutely. granted, tucker is absolutely right that a lot of these republicans who are baling have been critical of trump all along, but a lot of them haven't. like bill bennett who had been

out there essentially speaking -- talking up trump, like deb fischer in the senate. there's really only one female gop senator who hasn't called for him to step aside which is joni ernst. so i'm hard pressed as are all of the political comment caters to come up with any kind of a historical precedent for what we've seen over the past 48 hours. not only just in terms of the lewd comments that are also frankly predatory in nature, but also just in terms of what we're seeing with this civil war erupting in the republican party with republicans down the ballot now as well panicking and it is relevant and it is significant to play this up because this comes at a time when it appeared according to the polls that trump was really consolidating the gop base for all of the ranker that had taken place throughout the primary, he was consolidating. >> let me come back to you on this, tucker. a couple trump tweets, the media

and the establishment want me out of this race so badly, he said he's not dropping out, he also told the "washington post" and "wall street journal." so many self righteous hip ritz. my question is you say there is a lot of hypocrisy in the news business. is there going to be a gap between the public which may -- some of whom may not like this at all and some of whom may think that this is just, you know, trump showing off with boys will be boys, and the pundits who are saying -- who are actually talking about whether he could be replaced as a republican nominee? >> look, i don't think anybody likes what trump said, it's gross. i mean, it's disgusting. on the other hand there could be a rubber band effect where the outrage is so phoney and so overdone that some people say knock it off. i dislike you more than i'm offended by trump. i would just say this, here is the dishonesty is that the people who are opposing trump now have real reasons to oppose him, i think, they are totally legitimate but they're preexisting, the same people

abandoning him now didn't want him to be the nominee. they have preexisting reasons for opposing him and that's fine but we should just be honest about it. >> julie, let me read you excerpts from the coverage, cnn said it's over for him, he is like some central american dictator. "politico," no candidate has entered a debate so cloaked in disgrace, "new york times" this turned a borish man into an outright predator. i have the impression there is a lot of glee in this, a lot of people in the media who never liked trump, said he was never going to win the nomination would kind of like the, quote, vikts ri of seeing him pushed out of the race. >> there's two things going on and then i will make a personal observation. one is trump is a complete creation of the media. >> no, he is not. >> he is, i'm sorry -- >> he got millions of republicans votes. >> he did because the media rode this horse all the way to the nomination, they covered his press conferences, they never broke to go to ted cruz's press conferences he. >> he gave more interviews than the history of anyone in television. >> they didn't break for ted

cruz or marco rubio or jeb bush, they did it for trump because his ratings were good and they were good because he would say crazy stuff and people wanted to tune in. that's one. two i will say to you that reporters love nothing better than to build somebody up and tear them down and that's a fact. to some extent you have a point there. >> on that one i agree with you. >> the third observation i would make is as a woman we all know this guy. it may not be a big deal to male reporters, every woman out there knows this kind of guy. i don't think there's going to be a rubber band effect among women because women know this guy, we've seen him and experienced him and that's what women don't want to see in their president. >> how about billy bush who is now a co-host of the "today" show, he is seen playing along on this i'm at that. he has apologized, he is embarrassed and ashamed that he did play along. is he going to take a hit in terms of his nbc career? there are reports that nbc is not even planning to reprimand him. >> charitable interpretation, he is just kind of an overseeinger sink a fant who was rooting trump on, but the damaging part is when they get off the bus and

he knows what's been going on and the talk and donald trump has put the tick tack in and pushes him on to this woman. so i think based on the reporting that i've seen this could be a real problem just given not just what happened but also the demographic graphic of the audience that the "today" show reaches which is mostly women and also the fact that this could make a lot of his female coworkers as well uncomfortable and who knows, i guess we will find out on monday when he was supposed to be co-hosting again what actually happens. a lot of times in these cases when something like this happens the host or the personality will go into a hibernation period. i guess we will find out on monday. >> right. what's interesting is that megan kelly who just criticized donald trump and hillary clinton said on her show donald trump with all due respect to my friend at 10:00 will go on hannity and pretty much only hannity and will not venture out to the unsafe spaces these days and hannity tweeted back you should

be mad at hillary clinton, clearly you support her, they have since made up, sent out a picture but trump is staying off of any nonfox outlet. i know some people out there and i see some of this online are saying, well, what donald trump said is just talk, but bill clinton he actually had affairs including with an intern in the white house, there is an allegation of rape. >> they hate trump, they are not going to buy into that argument. is it a lejtment argument? >> i don't know. i think he is better served by talking about what he believes. i think it's worth preserving this distinction, there is a difference between talking and doing, there is, if i say i don't like you that's different from hitting you in the face. i'm not defending anything that trump said and i didn't like it. i've got three girls, i don't like that stuff. but to call it assault is to devalue assault. it wasn't assault, it was something different. it was. it's not the same as physically attacking somebody talking about it it's just not. >> brief response that he has talked about having done this, not just talk. >> okay. >> and that's a big difference. >> okay.

then he can call what he did assault, give me the specific time that he did and i will say that's assault. >> he is boasting about it you don't want me to take his word on this particular issue. >> i'm not defending the guy. don't devalue the word assault. >> if somebody says i'm going to grab you by the you know what or kiss me without my consent that to me is the definition of assault. >> we will just be shaking hands at the end of this segment. >> you can give me a hug at any time. >> let us know what you think, "mediabuzz" @foxnews.com. when we come back -- this is going to be some debate tonight -- the leaked documents against hillary clinton. these have practically been blown off the screen by the tramp saga. the reporter that got ahold of the trump and billy bush tape gives us the back story. picking up for kyle.

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undoubtedly face a new line of questioning at tonight's debate here in st. louis about her highly lucrative wall street speeches, parts of which were made public in hacked e-mails obtained by wikileaks. while running to the left against bernie sanders she had said in these speeches that she favored, quote, open trade and open borders, a stunning contradiction with her public position. she also called sanders' supporters a bucket of losers and despite her tough on big banks rhetoric clinton said this in one speech, wall street insiders are what is needed to fix wall street. clinton spokesman said the, quote, stolen documents could have been orchestrated by russian officials trying to help donald trump but would not say they were fake. the media treating this also as a bombshell? >> i don't think they are treating it at all. this goes to one of the most frustrating pieces of this whole debate or non-debate is the lack of attention to the actual

issues. what would it mean to carry through on trump's trade policy, what would it mean to have open borders? hillary clinton in the last two weeks we have found out that obamacare has basically collapsed. hillary clinton is calling for extending obamacare benefits to illegal immigrants in this country. what would that mean? >> the media interest on these subjects? >> i haven't read a single story on this. >> julie roginsky, open borders, that's a radioactive phrase and seems to district everything clinton has said on trade and immigration. >> i am not going to defend these speeches, if she was even contemplating running for president to go out there as soon as she left secretary of state to go out there and start doing these speeches was completely inn comprehensible to me. >> and suck up to wall street. >> yes, exactly right. she didn't need the money, she didn't need to suck up to wall street, she was going to get their support and did not need the money. i'm not defending that. having said that the difference here is it's sort of what you expect of politicians it's not as salacious as the trump tapes.

in her luck and it's really dumb luck in this case this tape got leaked at the same time as her wikileaks stuff got leaked, the news cycle will go up with trump up until tonight's debate and starting tomorrow the news cycle will pick up where the debate left off. this is getting lost in the news cycle she has donald a bullet on these speeches. >> heidi przybyla, on any other day, i mean, these john podesta e-mails would have been the lead story everywhere. is it simply not just that it's being overshadowed by the trump saga but they are not salacious as julie says and is that the media standard for whether we cover something intensively? >> i think they're plenty interesting enough. there is a lot in there. this has been some of the most sought after information in this cycle about hillary clinton ever since the primaries when bernie was hammering her to release these speeches but to julie's point the timing was so forth tuesday for her that i literally thought it was a joke when i saw it come across on twitter i thought this is a joke and then

i realized that it wasn't. this is essentially the campaign's own audit of some of the worst stuff that she could have said in these speeches and i think, you know a lot of it has to do with the way the networks play this because the papers did give a full write up to the extent that i saw hillary clinton surrogates accusing "the new york times" of writing a smear article, but the way the networks operate the gop is in crisis right now and they don't have their surrogates out there pushing this because everyone is playing defense on this trump story. very much it's completely due to the timing. >> right. you don't have democrats running away from hillary clinton over this story the way you do have many big name republicans at least publicly distancing themselves from donald trump. >> you could do separate stories just on hillary clinton saying only wall street insiders can fix wall street this after all the outrage at the banks in the wake of the fiscal crisis. >> or do 11 stories on how billy bush may be culpable for

american sexism. the trump "access hollywood" story left an absence for journalists to write real stories. i don't think "the new york times" ought to need prodding from partizans to cover a story. you make a completely fair point about the lack of surrogates but that shouldn't affect our business. we should be, what is this, go write a story on it but no one >> for months and months the press was hot on the $675,000 from goldman sachs to take just one example hillary clinton was paid, the failure to release her speeches, the refusal, that seems to have cooled in the general election. i'm sure some critics are saying now you're giving hillary clinton the pass because she's close to winning the white house and donald trump is in trouble. >> i don't know if it has cooled, i think it goes back to ratings. this is why i keep saying trump is helped by the ratings now he is being hurt by the ratings. he is so salacious in what he says that especially cable news

including all of us unfortunately go with him and it's left for other people to sit there wading through boring wall street speeches, it's not as sexy, it's not to most people talking about what billy bush and he talked about. >> there is also the question of wikileaks and the role of russian hackers that troubles me but we pounce on these stories. tucker carlson, heidi przybyla, we will see you later, julie roginsky thanks for joining us. ahead martha maccallum on how the latest trump and oklahoma disclosures create problems for the moderators tonight.

upgrade your phone system and learn how you could save at vonage.com/business now comes an ammunition for people who suspect that media outlets give politicians the questions in advance which would be a huge ethical breach in any interview.

the case of chicago television and radio host steve harvey and hillary clinton it was true, in cringe worthy fashion. clinton aides detailed harvey's plans questions last february along with proposed answers in a memo obtained by the washington free beacon, also pre selected photos to share with the audience. >> let's go to the yale law school. >> oh, no. >> billy boy. >> so i met my husband in law school. >> according to the memo a grandmother in the audience would see suggestions on what to do with her grandkids and hillary with talk about sinning wheels on the bus to her granddaughter and then this penetrating query deep dish or thin trust pizza. what did clinton learn from her last campaign, how would she bridge the racial divide, answer, hillary has been fighting these battles for

decades. >> race is such a hot button in america these days. how would you better bridge the racial divides as you see it? >> i want to thank you for raising it, kind of helping people to think about it because, look, there can be no doubt that we still face systemic racism -- >> it was all in the memo, what's the role of faith in your life and campaign, answer, clinton would talk about being raised a methodist. the campaign even suggested questions for hillary to ask women in the audience before her final q & a on the problems in flint, michigan. there were tv sit comes less jipted as this. a spokesman for pre harvey explained this as a regular interview. check out this question to clinton at a pennsylvania town hall meeting. >> at my school body image is a really big issue for girls my age. i see with my own eyes the damage donald trump does when he talks about women and how they look.

>> well, "the new york times" reported that brennan had said her dad a local politician helped her with the question but the paper didn't take the next step by media eye did, the father is a democratic state senator and big hillary supporter. he claims it was a spontaneous question. here is the kicker, according to a hacked e-mail a producer for msnbc host chris hayes talking about the amazing intelligence woman who probably faced more nonsense back in the day because she is a woman. now, that is amazing. coming up, how badly did cbs's elaine quijano get run over in that vice presidential debate? martha maccallum on that and more. she's on deck. ♪ everything your family touches sticks with them. make sure the germs they bring home don't stick around. use clorox disinfecting products.

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washington university in st. louis is martha maccallum, the co-host of america's newsroom who moderated some of the presidential primary debates. martha, this donald trump videotape story has exploded like a neutron bomb, some republicans calling for him to drop out, i don't see that happening. do you have a sense that some folks in the media are kind of cheering this on, kind of enjoining this twist and watching the setback for the trump campaign? >> yeah, i mean, absolutely. you know, you have to ask yourself about the coverage of this issue and how important this moment really is in terms of measuring a presidency. however, as you and i well know we live in a world where people sort of want to digest scandalous material at a level that is really unprecedented. and the desire to dig deeper into policy is not always there. but donald trump is such a unique candidate. you know, he's obviously a businessman who came through the

ranks and built a real estate empire, but he's also a reality tv show star. from the very beginning this has been digested by the media and public at a level and in a way that is just not like anything we've seen in terms of typical political editorial digestion. so it is a completely unique situation and this unfortunately for him it feeds right into the worst nightmare of the way he treats women and talks about women and women have been the problem for him electorally since day one. so the group that he should have been building traction with and building a reputation with over the past four or five months in particular and he made some ground there, he is sliding down that hill quickly and it's going to be very difficult for him to repair tonight but that's the job that's set before him, howie. >> right. white hot focus on that and relatively little focus on the wikileaks dump on hillary clinton. let me ask you this because we've got the debate coming up anderson cooper cnn one of the

moderators, martha raddatz the other. they said the "access hollywood" tape will be the focus of opening questions. does that seem right to you and will it overshadow the economy and taxes and terrorism? >> of course there's a danger of that. it's going to go to donald trump to answer that question in the way that he has designed and decided to answer that question and to then move on to the issues that got him through an incredibly roller coaster tumultuous primary where he vank wished 16 other candidates out there. he has to figure out how he will deal with this question. it is better for him if it comes off the top. hillary clinton will also have to answer to these wikileaks stories about her public versus private persona and they better press her on that as well. they are going to have to be seen as coming at these

candidates fairly. i question why the trump campaign did not put donald trump out there last night, why he didn't do a sit-down interview with a sort of neutral party to talk about his life, to talk about the way he sees things, to express, you know, his apology to women that he offended with this. he could have gotten this sorry a little bit behind him in a well crafted appearance last night and i really think that that's going to be one of the questions that continues to dog him. why didn't they do that last night? >> instead it all comes down to tonight and i predict that the viewership will be at least as high if not hire than the first debate. let's take a brief look back at the vp debate. cbs's elaine quijano a little less experienced with this as a moderator. >> you can't -- >> gentlemen, the people at home cannot understand either one of you when you speak over each other. i would please ask you to wait until it is -- that the other is

finished. >> i was in washington, d.c. on 9/11. i saw the clouds of smoke rise from the pentagon. >> i was in virginia. where the pent gone -- >> i know you were. we all lived through that day as a nation. >> yes, please. >> the fbi did an investigation. >> yes. >> and they concluded. >> senator. >> that there was no reasonable prosecutor -- >> senator kaine, governor pence, please. >> there was so much cross talk it was hard to hear. got about a minute. did elaine quijano lose control of that debate and is there any danger of that happening tonight in st. louis? >> yeah, i think she did a little bit. i think both of those guys came in ready to jump in on each other. tim kaine said even his wife said he interrupted too many times, i think it was 72 times, i don't think it reflected well on him. i do not expect that to happen tonight, i don't think anderson cooper or martha raddatz who i ran into and asked her how she felt about, she said sure i'm nervous. i don't think either one of them

would put up with the kind of thing we saw at the vp debate. >> i'm with you on that. of course everybody a little nervous before such a big event. martha maccallum, great to see. >> you we get confused all the time. thanks, howie. see you later on our show. looking forward to it. >> same here. coming up, the "washington post" reporter who broke the trump story on how he got that tape from an anonymous source. and later frank luntz on how this and the wikileaks dump on hillary clinton is changing the coverage of this campaign. you can run an errand. (music playing) ♪ push it real good... (announcer vo) or you can take a joyride. bye bye, errands, we sing out loud here. siriusxm. road happy.

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the crisis in donald trump's campaign was triggered by an exclusive from one newspaper reporter and joining us from washington is david fahrenthold, a reporter for the "washington post." david, you can't reveal the unnamed source who led you to this footage of donald trump and billy bush a decade ago of course, but is it fair to say the person wanted to damage trump's candidacy. >> i can't really say anything about the source and i don't think i really even know. so, no, i can't really address that question. >> you're saying you don't know the source's motivation? sometimes newspapers try to at least describe the motivation of somebody who brings in information but doesn't want to be named. >> in this case we haven't. we haven't said anything at all about the source. i can't say more than nothing. >> okay. can you even say whether somebody want this had out quickly because, after all, "access hollywood" had this in

the archives, could have dug this up anytime in the past year and when you called "access hollywood" for comment you had to figure you might be in a race to break this story. >> that's right. we knew that was the risk. we called nbc and billy bush's folks around noon to 1:00 on friday and knew, yeah, that was the risk. obviously this foot a.m. was theirs originally, there was a risk they would get there before us, but we had to take that risk, we wanted to make sure that the tape was authentic, there was no concern that we were being hoaxed. >> any hesitation at all in disclosing what was obviously meant to be a private conversation? >> no. no hesitate about that at all. we are talking about the guy is running for president of the united states wearing a microphone. if this had been somehow a secret bug put in his office in trump tower or something like that maybe you would have a different -- you know, wonder whether he knew he was being miked but he certainly was wearing a microphone, you can see that later in the tape. no, nothing on that at all. >> wearing a microphone, that is

a perfectly valid point. early on in the show we talked about, well, a lot of past raunchy talk involving donald trump particularly on those howard stern interviews has been out there. did you anticipate when you saw this that this would create the crisis and the explosion that it has for donald trump? did it seem to be to be sufficiently different from what we have already known about the trump persona? >> no, i don't think i would have predicted it would have caused this level of crisis but i've been wrong basically about every political prediction i have made on the way, i spent three weeks writing a long profile on bobby jindal last year so i don't think my instincts should be trusted. what's different about this tape, a, it's not public. howard stern, all the things that trump said on howard stern he says in public and there is sort of a sense that he said it in public it can't be that bad, also trump said when i talk in public i'm playing a character.

as one of your earlier guests says he's not commenting on a woman's attractiveness he's describing his own behavior, weather truthfully or not, i don't know, he's saying this is what i did, this is what i do. i think that's what makes it worse. >> now, you have broken most of the stories about finances of the trump foundation leading new york's attorney general who is a democrat and big hillary supporter to recently bring a temporarily halt at least to the foundation's fundraising. the campaign not that long ago described you as a biased report who is clearly intent on distracting attention away from the corrupt clinton foundation. what was your reaction to being attacked that way and does something like that make you try to redouble your efforts? >> well, that's life in the big city, you cover a presidential campaign, there is going to be questions about your motives and why you are focusing on one candidate versus another. in the case of trump this is a guy who is running for president, when you do that you open yourself up to scrutiny and the questions about the trump foundation it's particularly the

particular failure that led to this order from ag snyderman, this is not going that snyderman found and brought to me it was something i found that was pointed out to me by a law professor when i was working on another story. it's the easiest thing that trump could have done -- it's a paperwork error, it's not something that required a lot of sleuthing, once you knew the law it was easy to see trump should have done this and in fact did not. >> i've got just a couple seconds. you do all this digging on the trump foundation and the story you will probably always be known for involves "access hollywood." >> a bus and interview on "access hollywood," i never would have predicted that after i learned all the ins and outs of tax law. >> david fahrenthold, thank you for joining us from washington. >> thank you. and let's bring back tucker carlson and heidi przybyla. hype the way in which the tape became public, does it matter? does it affect the impact here? >> okay. at this point i think there clearly was some media

strategizing around when this was released because it wasn't until the decision was apparently made at nbc or that it became clear that it wouldn't be released until monday after the debate that someone took it upon themselves to decide that that wasn't good enough and that it should be released on friday before the debate to kind of set up this big forum. >> i couldn't get fahrenthold to shed like on that but clearly somebody didn't want to wait until monday because clearly "access hollywood" would have reported it after the weekend. tucker, "access hollywood" is part of the huge nbc corporate family. >> right. >> so this has been sitting in the archives for more than a year and yet nbc never thought could go after it to find out whether there were any outtakes that might be interesting. what does that say -- >> it's been there 11 years of course -- >> i meant since the campaign -- >> right. look, someone should ask billy bush inside the company he works for. i would like to do the network morning show anchor challenge

where we attach microphones to all of them when they don't know they are being recorded and see what we find. i would have run this in a second if someone would have sent it to me. but there are ethical questions around it. let's not pretend there aren't. it's silly to pretend there aren't. he didn't think he was going recorded. i have a mic on my iphone, if i'm recording it is it you knew i had an iphone. i'm around mikes all the time, maybe you miss judged it but someone told you you aren't on pham ra, on camera you talk differently. that's legitimately. we all have different selves, the one we project publicly and when we're speaking privately. >> we live in an age of hacked e-mails and all of these private correspondence, comments, seem to come out, seems to be part of the terrain for running for president. >> and i think that's why it's shocking that this actually didn't come out until now, especially in the course of the primary, i think we were all

waiting for his primary opponents to bring stuff like this out because we all have known that the stern tapes are there for public consumption, for instance, and now there may be more coming out. it's really poor timing for trump. >> all right. we will see tonight. heidi przybyla, tucker carlson, great to see you guys here in st. louis. next on "mediabuzz," frank luntz on how the new trump and clinton bomb shells are changing the media climate and perhaps public opinion. [ crowd noise ]

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when it comes to the fireworks we now expect at tonight's debate in st. louis, we turn to someone who has studied these things intensively, frank luntz. frank, this donald trump tape is very vulgar and very damaging

and i don't think there's any debate about that, but does the tsunami of media stories, the endless replaying and reposting of the tape, does that amplify the impact on donald trump? >> it does, but this is what everyone is talking about, that if you take a look at twitter, if you look at facebook, google, instagram, everyone is talking about this presidential campaign. this is the most talked about campaign that i have been around since 1992, and what makes this one significant is that even people who don't care about politics, who would normally turn this stuff off with just one month to go, they're all paying attention. there's a reason why that first presidential debate was record-setting. there's a reason why this morning, sunday morning, you can wake up at 7:00 a.m. and it is filled with this conversation. it's because people want to know what donald trump is going to say next. >> so it would be a mistake, therefore, to look at this purely in terms of political

analys analysis? i had my questions here to ask you, does it affect with him with women, with all voters? you're saying thises a cultural event. it is everywhere online and, therefore, the interest, you know, even -- is just huge whether you ordinarily tune in to politics heavily or not. >> you can't get away from it, and people don't want to get away from it. it's why fox news is having it's all-time record ratings and the competition is also up. you're picking it up on talk radio and newspapers and the problem is they're not asking about substance, and, howard, i really do think this is an issue that no one is asking which one is better able to handle nuclear -- a nuclear war. which one is better able to balance the budget. it's all about the persona. it's about their character traits, and that's good up to a point, but the american people need to be talking about the issues, and nobody is right now. the candidates aren't. the media isn't.

the pundits aren't. nobody is. >> do you think the reason that the media are shying away -- i mean, over the course of a campaign obviously we've talked a bit about the economy and taxes and terrorism, but the media shying away because this other stuff, the juicy stuff, the talk of sex tapes, talks of miss universe, all of that is like capnip and is much more fun to cover and delivers the better ratings? if so, what does that say about the news business? >> we've been finding this out for the last couple months. it's genuinely upsetting for those of us who care about the future of the country. this is an impossible campaign for someone like me to cover because nobody -- not only are they not talking about the issues, they don't even know what the issues are, social security, education, things

affecting us right now or over the next generation, and instead we're discussing the "p" word, and by the way, watching "saturday night live," and this is something that i also find significant, for first time ever just about every one of george carlin's words that you can't say on television you can now say, thank you, donald trump, thank you, media. that's where we've come, and it's a disgrace. >> i've got about half a minute. so rather than just pile on the journalists and the pundits and the news organizations chasing the cotton candy and ignoring the substance, what i'm hearing from you is this is a reflection of the country, that we are a mirror to a country that is increasingly amusing itself to death? >> there is a battle between william f. buckley and that tripe and the pbs crowd and the jerry springer and that crowd, and, unfortunately, howard, the jerry springer crowd won, and we're never going to be able to go back. the thing i tell every viewer,

once you step over that line of civility and indecency, once you start to use language you might use in a bar rather than in a presidential debate, you never go back. i think it's a poison. i think it's toxic, and the country is going to suffer. >> frank luntz, thanks very much for your insight. still to come, some final thoughts from st. louis on trump's handling of the big bombe shell and the debate, now just nine hours away. at clorox 2 we've turned removing stains into a science. shell and the debate, now just nine hours away. bombshell and t just nine hours away. watch stains disappear right before your eyes. remove 4 times more stains than detergent alone.

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more importantly to the people who were turned on by them. >> alec baldwin back in action on "snl." this has been the most remarkable 36 hours and the most remarkable campaign any of us have ever covered. after the incredible media battering donald trump has taken, it is stunning that all outtakes of "access hollywood" has many of his colleagues bailing. what's disturbing is the sense of glee i see among some of the reporters and pundits who cover him especially among twitter as if this justifies their hostility against trump. whatever happens to trump in this campaign, the media's reputation for fairness has definitely suffered some damage. that's it for this special edition of "media buzz" from st. louis. i'm howard kurtz. write to us at med

mediabuzz@foxnews.com. i'll be on her after the debate. you can check me out with megyn kelly. we are back in washington next su sunday. check us out then for the latest buzz. it is high noon in new york city. it's 11:00 a.m. in st. louis, and 9 hours from now it is trump versus clinton, round 2. both candidates getting ready. hillary clinton's plane took off from new york last hour, and the controversy of the last 36 hours makes this must-see tv. hello, everyone. we're live in america's newsr m newsroom. good day to you, martha. >> we're live from washington university in st. louis, the glorious site of tonight's big debate. trump's back is again the wall. he needs a knock out, hail mary, whatever you want to