>> what you doing an hour from now? jon: i'll be right back here. how about you? [laughter] >> i'll be back here as well. jon: "outnumbered" starts now. ♪ ♪ harris: this is "outnumbered," i'm harris faulkner. here today, sandra smith, julie roginsky, plus our #oneluckyguy, fox news contributor, pete hegseth is outnumbered. >> great to be here. and my vikings are 5-0, i just want to let the nation though that. >> go cubs. [laughter] sandra: it's the only team i care about right now. different sport. harris: donald trump is not holding back, going after the

media, the clintons and his accusers. he's denying accusations he made unwanted sexual advances on women. his campaign says he will not let up and will keep pushing back at rallies over the next two days. >> these people are horrible people. they're horrible, horrible liars. and interestingly, it happens to appear 26 days before our very important election, isn't that amazing? this invented account has already been debunked by eyewitnesses who were there. they were there! harris: and mr. trump had more to say. he blasted the media for being in the tank for hillary clinton. >> the most powerful weapon deployed by the clintons is the corporate media, the press. the corporate media in our country is no longer involved in journalism. they're a political special

interest no different than any lobbyist or other financial entity, and their agenda is to elect crooked hillary clinton at any cost, at any price no matter how many lives they destroy. harris: and today both "the new york times" and people magazine are dismissing mr. trump's threats of legal action. they say they stand by their accounts, and we have this reaction from his opponent, hillary clinton. >> the whole world has heard trump brag about how he mistreats women and the disturbing stories just keep coming. but it's more than just the way he degrades women as horrible as that is. he has attacked immigrants, african-americans, latinos, people with disabilities, p.o.w.s, muslims.

there's hardly any part of america that he has not targeted. harris: so, pete, i would imagine this is a tough spot for either candidate to be, but particularly for donald trump. what do the american people want to see? defend himself or fight for them? or can he do both? >> i think he has to do both. he has to adamantly fight back because it really is him against the entire mainstream media whose entire agenda is to elect hillary clinton. the balance of all of those stories add up to that. so he has to fight back, he has to deny it. but at the same time, in this election cycle every issue cuts in his direction. so the quicker he can get back to the issues -- the economy, jobs, isis, rebuilding our military, the second amendment, the supreme court, all the things that resonate with his voters -- the better. he's got to explain as viciously -- harris: how is he doing that? >> i don't know, he's holding these rallies, he's impugning the media which does get his people fired up. whether or not that moves

independents or women remains to be seen. harris: all right. julie, i mentioned it was tough for both of them, because an e-mail dump by the thousands almost every day now with hillary clinton and the highlights from that collusion, corruption, a bunch of c words that don't sound good for her. i mean, clinton -- [laughter] what do you do? julie: well, i don't know that there's any -- i haven't seen anything in these e-mail dumps that shows corruption. i see a campaign operation whose campaign methods are being laid to bare and, frankly, any good campaigns has employed the same kinds of methods. i will say about trump -- and this is an observation as somebody who's worked in politics, not necessarily partisan -- if you're with going after the media, you have lost because the media prints ink by the barrel, and you're riling up your base, but your base is already riled up. that's about 35-40%. where's the other 10% coming from plus one? he needs more than just that,

and he's not going to get it by focusing on the media. they're not on the ballot, hillary clinton is. he needs to focus on her and the issues where he differentiates himself -- >> what was the media supposed to do, not report on this? people are are accusing a presidential candidate of sexual assault. they have to report on that -- >> there's a lot of things they had to report on that they decided not to report on. >> so when these women are reporting him doing exactly what he was caught on tape saying he would do? we've got to look a little be bit at donald trump here and not just the media. there are plenty of reasons that women don't come out until -- >> the media does it until themselves though. time and time again, they choose which stories they're going to -- cath -- harris: maybe someone who didn't come out right away, right? one of the bill clinton accusers, kathleen willey. she was on hannity last night. >> everybody in the mainstream

press is calling all of bill clinton's crimes infidelities. rape, sexual assault and sexual harassment are not infidelities, they are crimes, and they are misdemeanors. his wife is covering for him. no champion of women attacks the victim of sexual assault and rapes. harris: so i mentioned this is tough for both sides. so, you know, how much of this -- again, i'll ask the question for hillary clinton for her husband -- has to be about her on defense and not pro-the american public, or does she have to do a mix? sandra: newt gingrich sat where you are right now yesterday, pete, and he said if he's going to win right now, he has to start looking and thinking big, big picture. if he keeps responding to every one of these individual attacks, he will not win. i mean, also in the corner of the mainstream media, a statement from the committee to protect journalists' chairman

saying donald trump has directly addressed the threats he has made to the media. is he going to win this one? people want him to move on. i don't know who he's listening to at this point -- ash. harris: as you respond, please take into account that accuser was per bill clinton. >> sure. to your point, there's so many accusations, so many fingers being pointed, people have lost track, right? it's already baked in whether you think donald trump is wrong or not. you're right, he has to pivot be, has to go big because the big issues are what draw people to him. they don't want to vote for hillary clinton, and if he could just give them a reason not to when they go into that ballot box regardless of the polls right now, he still has the upper hand of the undercurrent of the american people. harris: you know, julie, 25, 26 days feels like, oh, my gosh, that's not a lot of time. we are having news cycles that are reduced to four hours --

>> i can't keep track. harris: you could have, like, six big stories in a five-hour period. julie: this dumpster fire is never going to be extinguished. it's got to end. [laughter] harris: my point is there's time to do what pete is talking about. what is her strategy? >> to do what she's doing, because she's winning. lay low and watch him implode -- harris: even though the numbers are not widening. look at north carolina -- >> ohio, trump's up one. harris: yeah. how do you say winning? because i know you don't look at national numbers. julie: well, right now -- >> she does when they're good. julie: no, always consistently i've always -- as a matter of fact, if you look statistically, national numbers and battleground state numbers tend to converge the closer you get to an election. she's already got the 270 she needs. she doesn't have -- all she has to do is not blow it. harris harris there's a lot of time left. julie: right. what he these to do -- and, again, obviously, he's not going to take my advice -- exactly what pete said.

get off this issue, get off the meltdown in public and start focusing on the issues that people in ohio care about. nobody in cleveland, ohio, really cares about kathleen willey, with all due respect. how is donald trump going to brung their jobs back -- bring their jobs back. he's talking about him, donald trump, being victimized. nobody cares. he needs to -- sandra: he's going to say i do. he feels the need to -- [inaudible conversations] katherine: not moving on from this, that can't happen if he doesn't move on from this. if he keeps talking about it, what's the media going to talk about? exactly what he's talking about. a focus on policy very, very necessary. sandra: i think it was a half an hour into that speech yesterday where he even mentioned obamacare, for example, and that's where some of his supporters or are coming in with rate schism even saying, come -- criticism saying, come on. >> the governor of minnesota admits it's unaffordable. it's indictable, and they're

making people's lives worse. julie: but he's not talking about it, that's the problem. harris: all right. well, as we have been telling you, in just five short days a fox news anchor will be moderating a general election presidential debate. our friend, our colleague, award-winning journalist chris wallace, widely regarded as the best questioner in the business, will be moderating the all-important final debate between donald trump and hillary clinton. it will be held this wednesday, october 19th, 9 p.m. eastern in las vegas, the best place to watch the first fox-moderated debate, of course, on fox news channel. pop your corn, you know where to be. meanwhile, as donald trump tries to fend off controversy, hillary clinton appears to be laying low and trying not to make any mistakes, exactly what julie roginsky just said. like appearing on ellen for the second time since monday. not julie, but hillary. in fact, she has no public events scheduled until the debate. is it a good idea? we'll talk about it. and under oath for the first

time, hillary clinton says she cannot recall at least 20 times the questions about her e-mail practices. why voters may have a hard time with her answers. ♪ ♪ sports. i've never been #1 in anything until i put these babies on. now we're on a winning streak and i'm never taking them off. do i know where i'm going? absolutely. we're going to the playoff. allstate guarantees your rates won't go up just because of an accident. starting the day you sign up. so get accident forgiveness from allstate. and be better protected from mayhem, like me. here you go.picking up for kyle. you wouldn't put up with part of a pizza. um. something wrong? so when it comes to pain relievers, why put up with just part of a day? you want the whole thing? yes, yes! live whole. not part. aleve.

woman: how do we protect them from $4 billion in new cuts to california schools? man: vote yes on proposition 55. woman: prop 55 doesn't raise taxes on anyone. man: not on working californians, not small businesses.

no one. woman: instead, prop 55 simply maintains the current tax rate on the wealthiest californians. man: so those who can most afford it continue paying their fair share... woman: ...to prevent new education cuts... man: ...and keep improving california's schools. woman: vote yes on prop 55 to help our children thrive. ♪ ♪ sandra: hillary clinton facing

new questions about her e-mails, this after the democratic nominee says she, quote, does not recall ordering any work-related e-mails to be deleted or permanently scrubbed from her server. that's according to sworn testimony she gave to questions submitted by judicial watch. in fact, hillary used some variation of i do not recall at least 20 times in her submitted answers. but newt gingrich not buying clinton's apparent lapse in memory. the former house speaker on the o'reilly factor. >> a woman who says 39 times to the fbi i can't remember and then seems to remember everything in a debate? i mean, she's just totally dishonest. sandra: the former speaker has a point, doesn't he? >> he sure does. selective memory is inherently sketchy. [laughter] it just is. in this case, actually under oath and has no answer, she decides to not know just like she decided to extricate herself from which e-mails were deleted, what was pushed out. she's never -- she's somehow

never in the loop but always in the loop. and she's, in this case, it reveals yet again that she's totally untrustworthy across the board. katherine: what's interesting about this is let's say, let's play a game and say she really doesn't recall. so she just doesn't remember what she did with information that's crucial to our national security? >> benghazi -- katherine: how is that any better at all? how is her defense a defense? even if she's telling the truth, that's still pretty bad, hillary. harris: this points to the problem that we talked about yesterday with fbi director james comey, and i understand it is somewhat standard for there not to be a written or recorded record with the fbi initially because they were part of the investigation, so she was not under oath. however, if someone tells you repeatedly that they don't remember something and we can only think that happened because that's what james comey said happened even when he sat down with her, wouldn't you want to start to talk some notes? [laughter]

i mean, god forbid she should forget the conversation she just had with you. [laughter] julie: i suspect her lawyer was the one taking notes -- harris: has not been reported that way. julie: listen, i've never defended this e-mail thing from the beginning, she's lawyering this like any good lawyer would which is i don't recall. because as one of you said, i don't have a good answer. and it is what it is. i mean, there's nothing else to say about it other than she knows anything she says is not going to comport with what she said to the fbi or anything she wants in the public domain because judicial watch is not her friend -- harris: or they won't match up because she misremembers. julie: right. so the smart thing for a lawyer -- and she's a lawyer herself -- >> she's effectively pleading the fifth. sandra: julie, let me use an example here. secretary clinton said she did not recall receiving a february 2011 memo warning her of increased attempts to hack into private e-mail accounts

belonging to senior state department officials. do you think that's a significant moment that she would remember? do you believe her personally? julie: do i personally believe her? no. of course i don't. [laughter] clearly, as i said, she's doing this because she's got very good lawyers. she herself is a lawyer, and she was, she is advise aring herself not to remember because there's no good answer. i mean, look, do i think ultimately that she set this up as a matter of convenience? no. i think she set this up because she's obsessed with privacy, and there's a secrecy component -- >> control. julie: -- and control, and that's why this e-mail account was set up. it was a dumb thing to do. [inaudible conversations] katherine: she's lying. her convenience is more important than safety, these are all very, very concerning things. oh, well, that's easy to understand, period. >> and then you butt it up against the fact that anyone who did anything like what they did, including tim kaine's son as a lieutenant, did this he would be in jail, he would be court-martialed. harris: because there was classified information in there. >> of course. katherine: and having more power

as a president is only going to make her feel like she has a greater license to do this and also more. julie: i'm pretty sure she's not going to, hopefully, do this again -- [laughter] i hope she's learned her lesson. >> what in her track record -- katherine: she's done it again and again and again. sandra: heads than four weeks to go until election day, and hillary clinton is leaning heavily on the first family to get out the vote. how the obamas are campaigning for her and whether it's going to actually help. plus, hillary clinton gives her first tv interview since the last debate, ellen degeneres, and she got right to slamming her rival. clinton's strategy for the final stretch and whether it's a good one. >> he was really trying to dominate and hen literally stalk -- and then literally stalk me around the stage. and i would just feel this presence behind me -- [laughter] and, you know, i thought, whoa, this is really weird. >> yeah. [laughter] ♪ ♪

upgrade your phone system and learn how you could save at vonage.com/business

♪ ♪ harris: welcome back to "outnumbered." hillary clinton appears to be laying low and trying not to make any mistakes. she has no big rallies or campaign events planned until after next wednesday's faceoff with trump, the last debate in las vegas. but she is appearing on friendly talk shows like the ellen degeneres show. >> whoo. [laughter] >> does everyone to that to you

now? >> yeah. i didn't even know i was doing it -- >> you must have known at the time that came out of you. >> i didn't. i knew that i could whoo, i knew that, but i didn't know i did the little shimmy to come around with it. afterwards i saw it, and now people are always saying do the shimmy, you know? harris: it's my new fall dance move. i mean, yeah, this is not out of the ordinary, right, julie? are you shimmying too? >> i was, yeah. harris: contagious. we knew she would go -- julie: what is that thing you're doing? [laughter] sandra: friendly places for hillary clinton. julie: yeah. i look, she's going to elen degeneres, i wonder why? this is very strategic as to where candidates are placed. harris: is that what this is? or is she hanging out with her friends? i thought we had learned that she has the women's vote -- julie: no, no, she needs to shore it up, you don't take anything for granted, especially in light of what's happening

with trump. and in terms of her laying low, look, she's prepping -- and i know this for a fact because i know her people -- prepping hard for this last debate. she's not laying low, she's jammed up in whatever conference room getting ready for this debate. by the way, something i strenuously advise donald trump to do as well because you can't win this -- katherine: he was prepared for the last debate. julie: he had a little meltdown in the beginning, and then he got better. sandra: he did that town hall before, he said it wasn't prep for the debate. okay, as far as appearances on ellen degeneres, this is her fourth appearance since announcing her candidacy, her second one since may. ellen degeneres, after hillary's last appearance, was asked by an entertainment outlet if they've asked donald trump, and she said, i don't know if we've formally asked him, but he's not banned from the show. so that's kind of interesting to me. but trump, before he was running for office, had been a guest on her show five times.

his last appearance in 2007 for those wanting to know. harris: so, you mean, if we just want to appear on ellen's show, we just need to call? julie: candidate faulkner -- [laughter] harris: oh, no. i'm not even to running for the pta. i think the point is, as sandra has just pointed out, there's a fault line between when you can come on the show, apparently, if you're donald trump. you're not banned -- julie: what else are you going to say if she was -- by the way, he should take her up on it. i'm dead serious. he should call her up and say i understand i can come on your show. he needs to do this kind of stuff. he needs to get women to the look at him as something other than a predator, which is what they're looking at him as right now. katherine: he does well on stuff like that, i mean, when he's on the late night shows, he is likable, he is funny. i agree with you, i think that would definitely be a good thing for him to do. but hillary, you know, she's ahead right now so, of course, she's doing these fun little

things. >> harris, i would vote for you for pta. harris: thank you. >> no, she's retreating to the cozy confines of hollywood where they will be nice to her. i'll use a sports analogy. when you're in the fourth quarter and you're up by 5 and you go into a four corners basketball offense to run out the clock are, that's often times when you're most vulnerable. you don't do what got you where you are -- harris: you're only two scores away from losing. >> exactly. and the other team's pressing, you're likely to turn the ball over, and i think that could happen if trump gets his message on track and there's no more -- harris: but that's the difference between these two candidates too. he never probably feels like he can't run full court. he doesn't really care about a 5-point differential. sandra: we actively look at social media during the show, and i got a message -- harris: oh, give it to us. sandra: it was criticism of his candidate saying, unfortunately, donald trump is out spending

time defending hardship's awe attacks while -- hillary clinton's attacks while she is prepping for the next debate. you hear that criticism coming from his own supporters, prep for this debate. julie: that's my point. it goes to the earlier segment, he's reinforcing, kat is so right, he keeps bringing it up. go on ellen, go on whatever other type show -- i don't watch, this is the only daytime tv i watch, but whatever other shows we have that appeal to women, do it. harris: you wanted to say go on "outnumbered." julie: hopefully when i'm here one day. but he also needs to insure that he talks to these women. the only thing they don't see is some guy railing at the media and reinforcing the message that maybe he did, maybe he didn't, maybe it was just talk. that's not the impression they want to leave. he should go on ellen, he should take ivanka with him. ivanka's protecting the brand. she's missing in -- sandra: i have been reporting --

julie: yeah, she's totally protecting the brand. go and be a human being, that's what he needs to show people right now. katherine: meanwhile -- [laughter] four weeks until election day, hillary clinton is leaning heavily on the obamas to help get out the black vote and the youth vote. president obama speaking this morning in ohio telling voters the choice between the two candidates has never been more stark. >> it shouldn't be a complicated choice because it's a choice between somebody who is as qualified as anybody who has ever run for this office -- [cheers and applause] and somebody who has proven himself unfit to lead or represent this country that we love. katherine: and just yesterday michelle obama gave an emotional speech in new hampshire calling on women to rise are up against donald trump. -- rise up against donald trump. >> too many are treating this as just another day's headline.

as if our outrage is overblown or unwarranted. as if this is normal, just politics as usual. but, new hampshire, yeah, be clear. this is not normal. as usual. [cheers and applause] and it doesn't matter what party you belong to, democrat, republican, independent. no woman deserves to be treated this way, none of us deserves this kind of abuse. [cheers and applause] katherine: all right. well, that specific speech aside, just the general strategy, pete, of her leaning on the obamas so much is an interesting one given how much this election not just on the republican but also the democrat side with bernie sanders, was against the status quo. >> true, but i think it's a smart and powerful move. they're powerful campaigners. he feels even more comfortable in that mode. she's clearly sr. good, and hillary clinton has had problems with her base. while not every progressive loves barack obama, they like a

lot of the things that he's done, and if he can tell them hillary clinton will solidify that legacy and they can multiply, you've got bill -- bill doesn't do well for her these days. [laughter] they make up for bill, they can spread across the country, man, that's tough to beat. katherine: people like obama more and more these days, i've got to say. >> it's mind-blowing, but yes. harris: his job performance numbers right now, if we want to pop those up on the screen -- sandra: 52%. harris: yeah. hers is not about job performance, but on the campaign trail it is because that's what her job is. she's a campaigner right now. look at that, i think that's reflective of how she did yesterday on the stump. i didn't listen to the politics part of the speech as closely as i did, i'm watching it kind of journalistically and saying this works, it's very well produced, it is a job out on the campaign trail that the obamas do well. katherine: and you said in the year room, michelle is the

best -- julie: i can't remember as good of a campaign speech in a long time. it was amazing because it was visceral. harris: yeah -- julie: her voice was breaking. that's what i'm saying. people understood, she spoke as a woman, she spoke as a mother, she spoke to other women, men who like women, i mean, men who appreciate women are not just a commodity to be talked about in the way that certain people talk about them. i also will say the reason it's smart for her to have the obamas campaigning for her is all she needs to do is replicate the obama coalition, and she will have won from a purely mathematical perspective. the only people that came out to vote for her that came out to vote for him, she'd be president. so so in that sense, it makes a lot of sense for her. and michelle obama is beloved for that reason. harris: kat, you mentioned ivanka. she's also, i mean, we saw this

from the rnc convention, she captivates -- sandra: not recently. she's not out there. harris: where has she been? sandra: that's a question a lot of people are canning. people are talking about the trump brand is in trouble, and she's got businesses of her own, but a big question does loom, why is she not out speaking on behalf of her father saying this isn't the man that we know? katherine: t a lot tougher for her right now given everything that's going on with her dad. it's a really awkward position, and it might be tough for her to have heard some of these things and and process them. campaigns, she does need to get out there. harris: she's the one who rivals those numbers in terms of likability and favorability. katherine: yes. julie: can i tell you why? harris: but it's a different role for the campaign manager and -- >> a family member. she has crossover appeal too. julie: jared kushner, her husband -- the person who was apparently responsible for the idea of putting those women that accused bill clinton of rape and

assault and harassment at the front row of the debate, and i think that's something she probably doesn't want to answer for, that her husband played the key role in decisions about whether to promote them and exploit them the way that some people -- harris: i think it's impossible for us to pontificate why, but yeah. katherine: well, a new fox news poll shows hillary clinton leading donald trump by seven points nationally, but other polls show the race much closer in two key swing states. we'll discuss what it means for this fast-changing race. ♪ ♪ you can run an errand. (music playing) ♪ push it real good... (announcer vo) or you can take a joyride. bye bye, errands, we sing out loud here. siriusxm. road happy.

i spent many years as a nuclear missile launch officer. if the president gave the order we had to launch the missiles, that would be it. i prayed that call would never come. [ radio chatter ] self control may be all that keeps these missiles from firing. [ sirens blearing ] i would bomb the [ beep] out of them. i want to be unpredictable. i love war. the thought of donald trump with nuclear weapons scares me to death. it should scare everyone. i'm hillary clinton and i approve this message. across new york state, from long island to buffalo, from rochester to the hudson valley, from albany to utica, creative business incentives, infrastructure investment, university partnerships, and the lowest taxes in decades are creating a stronger economy and the right environment in new york state for business to thrive. let us help grow your company's tomorrow- today at business.ny.gov

♪ ♪ harris: breaking news by julie roginsky. sandra: all all rightment some w insight, a brand new fox news poll shows hillary clinton up even points nationally -- seven points nationally, 45-38% in a four-way contest, but other polls show a tight race in two key swing states. in ohio trump has a one-point

lead over clinton in a four-way race, that according to an nbc/wall street journal poll. but meantime in north carolina, the poll shows clinton with a four-point lead among likely voters. political analysts say trump's best path to winning is sweeping north carolina and ohio as well as picking up florida and pennsylvania. julie, to get back to you, you started off the show talking about these key battleground states. what are you seeing right now as far as trends? julie: well, again, as you pointed out, it's going to be very hard more trump to win unless he sweeps all four. he needs to get to 270 in some way. he's losing virginia, i think that's no longer on the table as a swing state. it was purplish, now it's kind of a light blue. for him to win pennsylvania would be pretty unprecedented. i don't think a republican has won pennsylvania since, if i'm not mistaken, the first george bush. so that's a tough task. florida is in play as it always is but, again, demographics shifting in florida, that

becomes a tougher challenge. he could win north carolina and ohio and still with the map the way it stands today lose election. for him, he really does need to win some combination of those four states. sandra: why is it so close there if hillary clinton is such the obvious choice? julie: because i think we're a really divided country. i don't think you're going to see a reagan sweep of 49 states again in our lifetime. i hope i'm wrong, but the way the country is today, people are really in their corners, and they're -- you're not going to see that for a very long time. you know, i hope some event happens that brings us all together. a good e present -- event, not d event, but as of today, you're not going to see that. harris: well, whomever gets into office doesn't have mandate, and especially when you make it a four-way tie, they really don't. it's around 40% for the two of them. whomever gets that mantle really has to listen to all those people -- katherine: it's going to be really tough after this

election, way, way tougher than it's ever been before because people are -- there's not -- have you seen a single issue in this election where both sides weren't just, oh, i have an opinion, but very angry about it? harris: i hate you. katherine: people are are losing, studies are showing people are losing friendships over the election -- harris: don't talk about it on your job. katherine: it's going to be harder than ever. >> and it's not even left/right. if donald trump were to not win within the republican party, the circular firing squad will be in full effect. i thought your analysis was very fair. ultimately, pennsylvania's critical for donald trump. he's still behind eight points today, doesn't mean he couldn't make it up, but florida, north carolina and ohio are more or less toss-ups. i think virginia may be concern identify heard people say that it's off. it doesn't have to be. trump has got to focus on pennsylvania and places like that in the rust belt and inner or eyes people and say your jobs come back under a trump administration, and here's why. hillary clinton, no, hillary

clinton tells you in front of you that she supports you and behind the scenes she says if you're a catholic, an evangelical or a coal miner, you're out. julie: he should be, but instead he's going after news organizations and talking about how he hasn't really assaulted women the way they're saying -- >> he's under siege. what would you do if you were under siege? >> as a person or -- julie: what i would do is r if i were advising him, change the subject. you've got to change the subject. sandra: as far as the enthusiasm gap we've been reporting on, the advantage that trump had over hillary clinton does seem to be evaporating a bit. 70 percent of his backers strongly supported him last week, that's now at 63%. for clinton it's 66%, and that's gone up from 57%. what does that tell you, kat? katherine: look, i think that what trump is dealing with now is, it's a huge problem. it's going to be really hard to come back from. i really, really hate saying that regardless of what polls say. what we're not seeing is it changing and him shifting.

so it's not like, oh, it's still possible. we need to start talking about how, and once we see that shift, then we can talk about it rather than just talking about it and, you know, fantasy type of terms. oh, maybe, maybe, maybe. hillary, least likable candidate ever, but the circumstances right now are making it really tough for her to be beat. i mean, really, hillary clinton? oh, it bums me out too, trust me. very sad. [laughter] sandra: all right. well, a high stakes meeting at the white house is just hours from now as the window to save syria is closing. now u.s. officials report aredly considering airstrikes against syrian bases, but that's raising the risk of a direct confrontation with russia. we discuss that next. ♪ ♪ [ crowd noise ]

whoa. [ gears stopping ] when your pain reliever stops working, your whole day stops. try this.

but just one aleve has the strength to stop pain for 12 hours. tylenol and advil can quit after 6. so live your whole day, not part... with 12 hour aleve. prop 64 makes marijuana legal in california for adults 21 and over. and here's what else it does: bans marijuana use in public. permits sales only at licensed marijuana businesses, not at grocery or convenience stores. and prop 64 generates a billion in new tax revenue for california to fund after-school programs and job training and placement initiatives. learn more at yeson64.org vote yes on 64.

harris: we'll have more "outnumbered" in just moment. let's go to jon scott with what's coming up on the second hour of "happening now." jon: we're awaiting the donald trump rally in greensboro, north carolina. he's again expected to tear into hillary clinton and defend himself after a string of women have come forward claiming trump made unwanted sexual advances. president obama was in cleveland last hour at a rally for hillary clinton. he ripped into mr. trump, says he's been getting headlines for

fighting with his own party and threatening to sue the press for stories he doesn't like. bill clinton also campaigning for hillary last hour, he was in delaware, ohio. president clinton saying he knows what makes america great means, it means lifting you up at cost of someone else. both bill clinton and president obama had to deal with hecklers in the crowds. a lot of politics to cover, it's all ahead, "happening now." harris: we'll see you then. thank you. jon: thanks, harris. >> all right. next, president obama and his advisers meeting later today on what to do now as violence spirals out of control in syria. syrian and russian aircraft continuing to pummel the city of aleppo and other starts, and now some officials are calling on the u.s. to act more forcefully there or risk losing influence among moderate rebels battling the assad regime and isis. according to reuters, the white house is considering military options including airstrikes on syrian bases, but that raises the danger of a direct confrontation with russia. another option reportedly being

discussed provided vetted rebels in syria with more sophisticated weapons. now, when i think about this subject, so many bad options. a quote from general patton comes to mind: a good plan violently executed now is better than a perfectly planned, a perfect plan executed later. meaning if we had acted when we needed to act in syria when the opportunity was there with real rebels, even if it wasn't a perfect plan, you'd probably have a lot more options. regardless, i wouldn't want to be sitting in that situation room -- harris: part of the reason is we've telegraphed all the things we are not willing to do to fight them. so in the time gap of an imperfect plan back then versus one now in that gap be of time has been everything that we will and will not do, giving the enemy an advantage. i would say this, i want to get your perspective on something else that's happening simultaneous to this which has russia and iran, i'm sure, sitting back saying, we got this, to some degree. we've got a hot war with our troops in yemen, and those are

iran-backed militia as i understand, right? >> yeah. harris: you've got the situation that we need to take back mosul, probably this month in iraq. that's just next door to syria. and you've got shia on the ground supposedly to help us do that, but they haven't promised they won't fear at us too. >> yep. harris: and then you've got the situation in syria -- katherine: i really think it's good to not rush to jump into these conflicts. the whole war in iraq thing kind of a bad idea. i don't think that's a mantra we should be spoken just as the token libertarian sitting here -- [inaudible conversations] julie: i have two observations to make about this, and i struggle with it internally as to how to approach this. on the one hand, we have said many times never again when it comes to the holocaust. what you're seeing right now happening in syria and iraq is a holocaust. be. harris: yeah. julie: there are people who are being -- it's genocide. there's no other way to describe it. so we have talked about this never again mantra for now 70, going on 80 years, and nevertheless, we're standing by

watching it happen. one side of me feels that way. the other side of me, and this is why it's such a complicated issue and doesn't learned itself to -- lend itself to easy answers, i'm not sure who the, quote- unquote, good guys would be. even if we had gone in when the red line was put down -- >> that's all very fair. and that quote isn't meant to say you rush in. it means what vladimir putin did is he went in violently immediately, and i'm going to affect this outcome. i'm going to do what i need to do it. we've stood on the sidelines and refused to be part of a real or proxy -- julie: who are we fighting for? that's the question. sandra: president obama's going to be meeting with his foreign policy advisers on the options. what would you say in his last few months in office? what would you like to see? >> he can't salvage his legacy on this. he can't and won't. i don't think i'd like to see action necessarily from president obama, because i don't trust he would to what we need

to do decisively to affect the outcome we want. it is a humanitarian crisis, but how it ends well with a tepid obama, it's not clear. julie: real quickly, putin has a clear mission, to prop up assad. i don't know what our mission would have been, and nobody's ever given me that -- harris: a crossed red line -- >> who controls afterwards? that's why everyone's staying out of this at this point and just trying to defeat isis which assad, apparently, is trying to do as well. harris: so he says. >> big musicians releasing 30 songs in 30 days to keep donald trump out of the white house. is this another case of a little bit of celebrity bias? ♪ ♪

see me. see me. don't stare at me. see me. see me. see me to know that psoriasis is just something that i have. i'm not contagious. see me to know that... ...i won't stop until i find what works. discover cosentyx, a different kind of medicine for moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. proven to help the majority of people find clear or almost clear skin. 8 out of 10 people saw 75% skin clearance at 3 months. while the majority saw 90% clearance. do not use if you are allergic to cosentyx. before starting, you should be tested for tuberculosis. an increased risk of infections and lowered ability to fight them may occur... ...tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms... ...such as fever, sweats, chills, muscle aches or cough.

or if you have received a vaccine or plan to. if you have inflammatory bowel disease, tell your doctor if symptoms develop or worsen. serious allergic reactions may occur. see me. see me. see me. on my way. find clear skin... and a clearer path forward. for a different kind of medicine, ask your dermatologist about cosentyx.

♪ ♪ [laughter] harris: wow. sandra: we were warned. harris: it's not just hollywood speaking out against donald trump, apparently. musicians are also putting their talents to use to make sure the republican nominee does not win the house. a group of artists taking part in 30 days, 30 songs for a trump-free america. the tunes released so far include can't you tell, million dollar loan, with love from russia -- that you just heard -- and same old lie. sandra: whatever. [laughter] >> it's laughable.

i mean, even julie's got to be laughing at this. there's nothing about a song from a celebrity that's going to influence someone to vote or not vote. this is -- sandra: no, but i would be fine if the effort was to get people to go out and vote, and they just simply labeled it musicians for a prosperous america or a healthy america. go vote. but they're not doing that. they're telling people who to vote for. julie: well, that's their prerogatives in ways that everybody has an opinion. i want to know where are the proceeds from all these sales going, buzz that hasn't -- because it hasn't been answered. >> hillaryclinton.com. harris: no. julie: seriously, you're putting out these songs to enrich yourself? that's their prerogative, but i'm just curious about how this works. i would love for this money to go towards a get out the vote effort -- harris: certainly, it helps hillary clinton. julie: actually, i'm curious as

to whether this is an in-kind contribution. sandra: why not use the effort and the message to tout their candidate, hillary clinton, than to just put down the other? why isn't there a positive -- katherine: because to rhyme stuff about donald trump. [laughter] i'm sure someone would be doing this about attack thing against hillary clinton, but what rhymes with server, benghazi, clinton foundation? [laughter] it's a rhyming issue. i cracked the case. >> we all know hollywood is about being cool, and there's nothing cooler right now than bashing trump. so they can glow in their self-righteousness by singing a song about it. harris: all right. the debate on wednesday with our friend, chris wallace, that's wednesday, october 19th, at 9 p.m. eastern. don't miss a moment of it. it is making history not just for chris, but all of us here at fox because this will be the first time we will have seen a fox news moderator handle a presidential general election debate. we are excited for him and for all of us here, and now you know where you should watch it. and it was great to have you on a friday.

>> thanks more having me. always good to be here. harris: go vikings. >> bye week this week, but go vikings. harris: and the cubs. i know you like them, right? yes. tv, monday be, noon eastern, we'll see you then. "happening now" happening right now, have a good weekend. shows a tightening race of indiana. that is home state of mike pence. >> donald trump is up four points there. we are covering all of the news now. a brand new wiki leaks e-mail causing more problemses for the clinton campaign. >> honestly, she should be locked up. >> why donald trump's threat to lock her up is drawing fire. >> and m