administration. dr. ben carson just wrote on facebook an announcement on my role. >> we will be back in just an hour. jon: outnumbered starts right now. >> fox news alert, president-elect trump announcing more staffing picks and he may have additional announcements later today as internal battle appears to be growing over who secretary of state should be. this is outnumbered. i'm kennedy, great to have you here today. also joining us on the couch cohost of after the bell, melissa francis, fox news eboni well -- williams and #oneluckyguy, it's david web himself and he is outnumbered. >> and smiling. there you go.

[laughter] >> well played. [laughter] kennedy: here we go. president-elect trump is spending thanks giving in florida as he continues to round out white house team. today announced south carolina governor nikki haley em -- embassador un. carson says he will consider it. meantime, when it comes to secretary of state, it looks like there may be internal tug of war. trump leaning towards romney. >> i would be concerned one, i

think, the vast majority of trump supporters will initially be unhappy and be reminded of all the things that romney said over the year and, two, because romney does represent a very different viewpoint. automatically. i'm not sure who secretary of state he would be. romney wanted to be in president-elect trump's job. kennedy: very interesting. david webb, who does this speak more about, mitt romney and his ability to be our chief diplomat or donald trump and his ability to overcompass risks? >> so this is debate that will occupy tables throughout thanksgiving. romney has certain skills that would be applicable to secretary of state. i remind everyone that the secretary of state represents the president's vision and this is what we need. we need a secretary of state

that will carry out the job he's given. this is the apprentice for politics. he's bringing everybody in. you have giuliani who is a loyalist, giuliani, someone who stood by him from the very beginning but the different skill sets. who knows? kennedy: yeah. >> it's bigger than the president. kennedy: how different are these two people? what does a giuliani state department look like versus a romney state department and what is president-elect trump choosing? melissa: rudy giuliani is tough, direct, hard and harsh in a way that to me is not terribly diplomatic but does get things done. when you look at mitt romney he represents the opposite. other than the way he treated donald trump during campaign he is usually pretty diplomatic. he's a turn-around guy. i like that. the foreign relations around the

world needs a complete turnaround. i like what trump is doing. this is what people expected after the republican national convention. we didn't see it then. we do see it now. it's also smart because he gets the talents from the people who opposed. kennedy: you not only have mitt romney in consideration but nikki haley, an outspoken op on the -- opponent, she backed marco rubio. >> get a smart of intelligent people that can do the job and make the country better in all aspects of the government. that's what he should be doing. you look at even in the senate, republicans are probably going to end up with 52 in the senate. that's very thin margins. he's going to need the entirety of the party on board with the vision for the country. it is smart to bring people in

that represent different factions of the republican party so that he can move some of those things forward and if you look at the people he has picked so far, he has picked incredibly , wonderful choices so far with people with a lot of experience, jeff sessions, former attorney general of alabama, general flynn, along with general cristal, organization and terrorist hunting organization in the country. you look at someone like nikki haley, a governor, very smart, well liked. kennedy: youngest governor in the country. >> same thing as mike pompeo as well. westpoint. he was a member of the house committee. a lot of experience in the field. he's making great decisions and people should rest easy. >> speaking of experience, someone who does not have a lot of experience is dr. ben carson.

i have tremendous respect for dr. ben carson and he's fantastic. however, this is a statement from his own business manager, armstrong williams. dr. carson feels he has no government experience. he's never run a federal agency, the last thing he would want to do is take a position that could cripple the presidency. can he-- kennedy: he was talking about hhs. >> sure. kennedy: why does that make more sense for dr. carson? >> i think it makes less sense. he's talking about home ownership and just things that seem very much out of his scope to me. >> i disagree. melissa: what he understands is the fund fundamentally approach to inner cities and you have to raise people up. he was outspoken about handouts

-- >> i want to go back to this. there's something to be said for staying in your lane. >> i disagree in staying in your lane. kennedy: establishment position, do what you've always done. >> you have a skill set -- >> why would you want to continually put bureaucrats to run agency. >> who said burr contracts. >> let me take lisa's list. >> except with rick perry moment. [laughter] >> when you look at what donald trump is bringing in versus barack obama, you have people with significant skills. dr. carson is also ran organizations. >> i'm saying saying what his own people said. let me finish this point.

i think he would be a great hud guy, his father did a pretty nice job doing the position for president nixon. i'm not suggesting put a bureaucrat in there. go establishment on this, i'm saying put someone best suited. i don't believe -- >> someone who understands the needs of housing development. kennedy: i would love to see donald trump put cabinet secretaries in place who would abolish their own departments. i think that would be -- [laughter] >> exactly. you know he wants it. i don't know. >> by the way, i would have put carson -- >> some sort of role. >> that would be better. >> i'm not mad at that, david. >> her taken is taken out of consideration, that's a very important position about common core alone. we will see many, many aspects of this administration still

taking shape. president-elect trump appears to be walking campaign promises. in a closed-door meeting he's pledging keeping open mind on climate change and whether it has affected humantivity. i'm looking at it very closely. it depends on how much it's going to cost our companies. the president elect also appear today change his mind about the use of torture to extract information from terrorism suspects. te conversation he had with i was defense secretary general james mattis about waterboarding. i never found it to be useful. i always found give me a pack of cigarettes and couple of beers i do better than that with torture and i was impressed by that answer and i was surprised because he's known as being the toughest guy. the president elect backing away from vow to investigate hillary clinton over private server and the clinton foundation, members

of the house judiciary committee reacting, listen. >> congress has an obligation to do oversight. i think when you think about equal treatment under the law it's incumbent upon the law to get to the facts and the truth here so the american people know that, in fact, there is a standard that is in place called equal treatment under the law. >> we are way premature on the actual ongoing work of the fbi and others. this president i'm positive is going to let the attorney general and the fbi director do their job. kennedy: all right, how do you think donald trump is going to influence these further congressional investigations? melissa: this is so interesting. sounding moderate tone, sounding very sane when those who opposed from the beginning wanted him to act like lunatic. he's talking in a manner that sounds more rational but at the same time he's putting in people, if you look at sessions, you look at bannon who are more

hard-liners, there's something for everyone here. i don't know. it's a very smart way to play the different things. kennedy: what about concerns that he's going back on these core fundamental campaign promises that he made. you know, he told hillary clinton that if he were in charge of the law, he should be in jail. people chanting lock her up not only at rnc but at rallies, some of the most passionate supporters, not to mention the shifts on climate change and even the border fence. >> i would say he's not even in office yet. everyone was talking about he's going to change the stance of immigration and all this talk, evidently he ended up not. let's give the guy a chance. he's president elect. in regard to climate change, i couldn't care less what he says about it. the problem is that president obama has prioritized this left-wing ideology on the

climate and climate change to detriment of american jobs and energy exploration. kennedy: sacrificing gdp but that's also what the paris climate treaty does. he's going to go ultimately the leftist international community on this, how is it going to hurt businesses. >> i don't think he's going along with it. he's just putting it on the table. we want an independent doj. they are investigating the clinton foundation. they are looking into other issues. the president can't order the attorney general to do something. he can work with congress to go after congressional hearings. what he said makes sense, americans want to doj that's impartial that goes out and does the job of carrying out law enforcement. they are playing politics a bit with this. frankly congress, i think, could have done more in the past few years. they need to accomplish more on hillary clinton.

kennedy: they are the ones who still very much want this to be played out and want justice to be served. jim jordan, one of the toughest questioners of hillary clinton when she sat for the most recent benghazi hearings. >> i agree, i agree with what totally david webb said here. we expect the doj to be apolitical, one of the biggest casualties, i think there were many around hillary clinton's candidacy and all of those investigations that took place we saw doj becoming politicized and made mesad and broke my heart as an attorney in this country. i would encouraging president-elect trump to step back from that, let your doj do its business and let doj put business in, he has put jeff sessions in. furthermore, melissa, president-elect trump is playing this smart. certainly a wide check and people voted for him because of him primarily, i believe, and i

do think that they will be more forgiving on some of policies as long as it's not too extreme. he has playing room. >> everyone is saying he's not going to listen to anyone. that's a good point. i'm going to consider that. it's exactly what we would want our commander in chief to do, vowpped himself with the best people to listen to them and cut bureaucracy and red tape that's been stiffing job creation and preventing america and give the guy a chance. >> you talk about regulation and that maybe add to go what is being called the trump-bump. u.s. stocks soar to go record high since election day. will it continue and do we really have the president elect to thank? plus a liberal art college is taking down the american flag, officials say the move is to promote a meaningful dialogue but is this really the way to go

or just a slap in the face to all americans, we will discuss more from the couch in a moment hello, i'm an idaho potato farmer and i finally found our big idaho potato truck. it's been touring the country telling folks about our heart healthy idaho potatoes, america's favorite potatoes, and donating to local charities along the way. but now it's finally back home where it belongs. aw man. hey, wait up. where you goin'? here we go again.

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embassador melissa: dow still trading above 19, up 32 on the day so far. yesterday it closed above 19,000 for the first time in history. the s&p 500, russell 2000 all closed record highs for the second day in a row. take a look at the number since the election. some are calling it the trump bump. analysts say stocks are being bolstered in parts that mr. trump's election will lead to higher growth but we meet some, kennedy, we haven't seen a lot of inflation, this is the unleashing of those -- of the man al spirits in the market. people are optimistic that we are going to grow, that he's going to unleash business. kennedy: that's right. free the market. unshackle it. analysts are saying that this is a market driven by need guiz,

potential prosperity, tax cuts for businesses, get rid of some of the regulations at least. it's a good place to start and that sort of optimism is going to go allot further than the fed allowing the keep the market propped up with low interest rates. melissa: investors got it wrong. goldman sachs and everyone else had hired her to do speeches. in reality donald trump is better for the economy overall. is that what the market is showing us in your opinion? >> exactly, you think that is. that's exactly what i was wanting to say. donald trump is talking about rolling back. i keep talking about energy because there's so much opportunity for the country and even just talking on day won. rolling back some obstruction. you look at fracking, adding

hundreds of billions of dollars an creating 1.4 jobs. it has saved americans since 2012 alone $32 billion. president obama wants to pursue federal regulation against fracking in the country despite the fact that it's been in the state's hands. he's roped off so much federal lands. he has stood in the way of so much growth, so much positivity for this country and jobs. melissa: yeah. as opposed to -- anybody in government who is out there spending my money doesn't care about efficiency and donald trump is someone who has run a profit-loss statement, run a construction project for a profit and isn't wasteful. >> when you look at government, what's the incentive versus companies?

you have the dow, multinationals and the nasdaq, tech stocks, they are looking at it from different perspectives. the global companies are looking at all regulations overseas. america are looking the market for them and they are going to come back and invest more money here. you look at the possibility for growth. that happens at the nasdaq, a lot of the smaller companies, tech stocks that are coming out. maybe there's a possibility i can actually grow and expand. for different reasons they are all looking at this. it's a matter of perception in the market. they see it, they say it's going to be good for me, that animal spirit and i'm going to go out and do something. melissa: ebony k one of the main trierties is bringing oversea dollars back to the u.s. so they can invest in u.s. factories and staying attacks because of the tax treatment but once the money comes back, that opens up a whole new world for jobs, investment factories, exciting times. >> absolutely. that's the expectation we are

seeing reflected in the market. absolutely is a good. that's for me the most exciting part. we have allowed government to become poor stewards. if it takes a donald trump to come in here and say if you do not manage funds properly, you're out of here. it's accountability and makes me happy. melissa: and they are fired. there you go. president-elect trump playing down concerns about conflict of interests saying he can run businesses while being president and that the law is on his side but democrats see this as a big opportunity to go after him. plus, a showdown moving in capitol hill as president obama is plan to go sure up the iran nuclear deal before leaving office. hmm (sfx: park rides, music and crowd sounds)

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kennedy: welcome back to the couch, president-elect trump shrugging off concerns. admitting he would like to do something about his business entanglements. he told "the new york times", quote n theory, i could run my business perfectly and then run the country perfectly. the law is totally on my side. the president can have a conflict of interest. democrats now seizing on the issue and urging action. and senator elizabeth warren, there she is and congressman sending letter to accountability office calling for a review saying, quote, we are concerned about reports of disarray within

chaotic transition and address concerns including conflicts of interest related to business holdings of donald trump and his family potentially violations of protocol and security precautions with foreign leaders and transparency related to the use of taxpayer funds in the transition. david, i mean, that is a whole laundry list of stuff. >> i'm surprised he didn't call for the firing squad for donald trump in that statement. there are bans on donations from foreign governments, money transfers, ask the clintons about that. there are conflicts of interest issues and, of course, he's going to be careful that there isn't a legal prohibition. they are just working within the existing structure. by the way, the government accountability office of which i've actually run a department that i've been audited by them

there has to be issue for review. there's not much else they can do. this is political gamesmanship, by the way, trump has a team and turn business over to his kids, hand it off, they are more than capable. >> lisa, on one happened, voters wanted something different, they didn't want a politician and perhaps a politician didn't have real estate empire because they've been so busy concentrating power and politics, so on the one hand, we see what conflicts of interests can do with the clinton foundation, so how do you make sure that he doesn't further enrich his companies by abusing the power of for presidency? >> you're right, they did want an outsider. they're sort of ironic too that the people criticizing him are the people who couldn't care about the hillary clinton foundation. a bit of irony there.

from a political lens which a lens i view the world, there's a danger for him. right now he has a republican majority and he may not in 2018. if democrats end uptaking the senate, for instance, or even the house for that matter, there's going cob congressional hearings, increased scrutiny for him which he could get in trouble looking ahead to 2020. he needs to have a solid way in he divests himself from the business and point to of taking proper precaution just to protect himself politically. melissa: we talked about this. we talked about the way you protect yourself and trust. i have real estate. i can't just simply sell it off. >> it would be ideal if he could divest and sell interests to the family.

even then the family would be in charge. how do you avoid appearance of a conflict. anything he does is going to look like he's doing favors for, you know, his family members that still own the business, if he does any business in scotland it impacts the currency. immediately everyone is going to scheme that -- scream that the golf course benefited from it. he really opens himself up down the line but i actually don't see -- one of my ideas was to put someone in charge, independent sort of auditor that with stand there and be transparent all of the time but that's hard to pick the person. kennedy: hold on one second. i don't know where it goes, i don't know how much money i have. i always wanted to be in that position. [laughter] >> so here is the thing.

legally trump is right. there's no legal issue for him, but there is the appearance of impropriety. also president-elect trump, candidate trump spoke to this. he spoke about a blind trust. the issue a blind trust is an an independent financial adviser. not as blind. >> here is my point -- here is the thing, they are going to attack him no matter what he does. how about doing the right thing of the world? just ignore them. they are going to attack you. >> what's the right thing? >> do his job as president, let the companies do the work. frankly there has to be pushback on the dishonest democrats who are going to attack if he said something they are going to attack, if he runs a company a certain way, he's going to attack. screw it. just do what you have to do to

do your job. melissa: how speaker paul ryan and two others sending a letter after a wall street journal report that the president is considering measures to strengthen the deal, the letter leads in part, quote, president-elect trump deserves opportunity to assess united states policy towards iran without administration imposing or implementing additional measure that is could impact the incoming administration's ability to develop its policy. but here is what house press secretary josh ernst had to say about this? >> make sure the deal doesn't fall apart and we know that our allies, the president had the opportunity to talk about this with some of the leaders of countries who also were a part of the international agreement to prevent iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon and they share that sentiments.

the next administration will have to decide what they want to do moving forward. but the risks of pulling out in that agreement or violation of that agreement are grave. melissa: iran has violated it twice at least by having heavy water on hand. are you kidding? qen ken all you -- kennedy: all you have to do is look at the evidence. they make this so complicated and we see the same thing with the aca. they are overcomplicating the deal and trying to solidify it. so it's impossible because this is one of the corner stones of the legacy, the iran deal and aca. he's doing whatever he can to throw spackle on the cracks and hope that the house doesn't fall down. melissa: they try to make the point that it's working.

they violated the heavy part of the agreement and on the other side they won't let in u.s. inspectors to prove the president's point. they are further from getting a bomb, we don't have any evidence . >> he will do anything he can between now and inauguration to complicate for the next president. there's a program on the border, operation fail lanes, funded through 24017, electronic surveillance against drug traffickers primarily and others, they canceled it two weeks ago. why? it's a funded program. obama will do everything he can to keep things in place. they make complex legislative actions, deals, et cetera, because it is harder to peel them out of government. it is harder to repeal them. this is about simplifying what needs to be simplified and what

can be simplified in government. melissa: beyond legacy the desire for the deal has to do desire for the deal has to do . that is what president obama plans to do to get more companies in before leaves office so it is harder to extract them later. >> look, i thought this was a bad deal to begin with. here is the reason i say that there was no way for us to understand what we were getting out of it. it was very clear what iran got from this deal. i'm still trying to figure out what america got from this deal. in this case i actually don't fault the president, david, doing what he can to preserve his impact on the world but on this it was never good to begin with. fall back. >> serves -- i would fault him for that. >> obviously he didn't see it that way. if he did he wouldn't implement it. >> they are not alone in her rejection of this deal. the majority of americans rejected the deal from day one. they realized it was bad one. not to endings increased

aggression from iranians. i think it is funny, president obama recently went on his last foreign tour because he had to eat crow because he also took unprecedented action using trips to criticize donald trump as a candidate abroad. he had to eat crow because this is rejection of his policies. not to mention, what did he do in the first 100 days? he went on apology tour. apologizing to three separate continents. that is the very reason why hillary clinton did not win the election. american people want to see strength and not bad deals like iranian deals. he wants to save face and save the legacy that was rejected. melissa: absolutely. high-priced college refusing to fly american flags on campus. the school president says it is to provoke meaningful dialogue. that's the reason. but is this the right way to spur discussion? >> by shutting it down. ♪ see me.

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marie callender's. it's time to savor. ♪ >> officials at hampshire college in massachusetts decided to stop flying american flags on campus t all began after school officials pushed to lower the flag to half-staff after the presidential election. what school leaders say was about escalating hate-based violence and not about the result but someone took the flag and they burned it. now the president, the college president says they are removing flags to promote what they call meaningful and respectful dialogue on campus. but also that students can still fly individual flags if they so choose. the hampshire president, jonathan lash, admitting the decision has been especially painful to our hampshire colleagues who are veterans or families of veterans. saying it will enable us to instead focus our efforts on addresses racist, misogynistic,

islam phone big, anti-semitic and a anti-lgbt rhetoric and behaviors. what does it say about the college that they would remove the american flag. >> it is sad to me. i'm all about first amendment rights. i'm all about respectful disagreement, dialogue, discussion and discourse. that is really, really the thing i'm most grateful from my college experience that helps prepare me for a career in litigation but this is sad for these children and these student because under what theory do you deprive them of a symbol of their country in order to spark desire to debate? those two can not be correlated, lisa. that is a dangerous, dangerous correlation and really is sad and i hate that that has become, this questioning of patriotism.

call it what it is. this kind of extraction of patism and pride and country is equivalent with progressiveness and really sad to me. >> david, we've seen a lot of this, shutting down of the debate especially in college campuses if you don't agree with more leftist view point of the world. does that concern you, about the future of country? >> it does. it trains another generation of people unwilling to look at debate, discussion or adversarial position. i want to go to this list of anti-and the american flag. racist, miss son gist nick, islamophobic, anti-semitic, the american flag stood for fixing these problems here and around the world. we turned the course on slavery, on women's rights, on gay rights. look at this nation and look what this flag represents. this flag has done what is right. ke colin kaepernick and others

brought the flag into this controversial position, your attitude is this. you're right, those are the ideals of the american flag. when they feel america is not living up to their best ideals from perspective of some there is need to challenge her to be better. i'm only saying that you don't extract that -- >> such a luxury to have this conversation, these students. >> where would they have it? melissa: tucker carlson was debates one of these kids, made the point median income in this country is $55,000. more than half the families in country live on less than what it costs to go to this college for one year. and they're sitting back, they have the luxury of having this conversation and not dealing with any real world problems. i wonder if they're really being prepared. >> kennedy you're a mom. this school costs $62,000. speaking of incomes, speaking of costs, what message does it send to parent and their kids there? kennedy: it is ridiculous. interesting a lot of these students, the freshmen who started probably thought they

would go to college for free under president hillary clinton. [laughter]. and that is not going to happen. melissa: you're right. you're right. kennedy: talk about average median income in this country. i wonder what average median income for hampshire college student and how practical those degrees r but again, there are some federal grants and plans that bolster the student loan cartel and you know, why is the federal government funding all of this, when these schools end up being so anti-free speech and anti-american and you know, we saw the university of delaware, when they wanted to cancel an america party, because it had an american theme. >> yes. kennedy: a lot of these places they lost their minds. they don't bolster them. why are people going to college in the first place? >> i'm sorry. i'm so passionate about this issue. i have to close one thing here. you bring up colin kaepernick. the american flag has stood to fix problems around the world. let me ask colin company per nick a question. what are you going to stand for?

if you're going to sit down when the flag is stood, for all these things and solving problems around the world what makes colin kaepernick stand up? i wish some reporter would ask him that question. >> hopefully they will. we'll end on that note. arguments at thanksgiving dinner are as traditional as turkey and pumpkin pie. a lot of americans feel extra stress fearing family members will roast them on political discussions. you can't get burned if you're uninvited because of your politics. yes, apparently that is happening. we'll discuss that next. ♪ it takes hard work, dedication and hours of practice for a drum line to perfect its routine. rocket mortgage by quicken loans is just as precise... but it only requires a few minutes of your time. now, you can securely share your financial information with the push of a button, giving you an accurate and custom

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♪ >> is your thanksgiving invitation lost in the mail? some people are saying their political views are getting them uninvited from family gatherings this year. on top of that, more than half of americans admit they are stressed out about the possibility of political discussion at the dinner table according to a new national

survey. many are sounding off on twitter saying things like, my family uninvited one of my aunts to thanksgiving because she voted for trump. and, dreading thanksgiving to be honest, my whole family voted for trump and they're just going to ridicule me because he won. melissa: that is not nice. >> that is sad. i've been very vocal on my family rift. my aunt is super hillary. with her. my mom on the trump train, has been year-and-a-half. it is delicate. david, do you think that this is the kind of thing people need to get over, or are you looking forward to inviting that person? you like this kind of thing? i think you, ready to roll. >> your mom is invited over to my table anytime. >> she can't come? >> i'm just kidding. politics and religion are the things you always kind of kept away from the dipper table. melissa: right. >> but politics and civics engagement and people learning to happen.

this is natural, folks. not a matter of getting over it. you have to get past it. now let's have debate. talk about issues. let's engage each other. fine with that and play football and sleep on turkey. >> melissa, what do you think about this? people got in their feelings in the election cycle. this is not debate about policy and conservatism and liberalism, this is something more, right? melissa: i think it is really tough. one of the things where families are really divided and fighting with each other a lot. people don't want to go to thanksgiving because they will be ridiculed, that is a little bit sad. i think we need to take a break and put it on ice on thanksgiving and maybe not bring it up. say it ahead of time, i said to people especially because they know i work to fox, they want to talk about it, listen we'll not talk about politics at all at this dinner. let's not bring it up. i think we need to take a break. >> football sundays in my house are football. no politics. melissa: take a break.

>> how about that, lisa? do we take a break as melissa is suggesting or use it opportunity and at least we can disagree with people we don't know but get it right with our families. >> i haven't experienced with your family. we don't all agree but not like, no one will not get invited because they disagree with someone, right? you should be able to be surrounded by people that disagree with your political ideology. you don't believe what you believe in if you can't take the conversation with someone that has different opinions than you. >> i'm all about strategies. i think the first thing you can do is, when you show up at thanksgiving dinner, bring three friends. jim beam, jack daniels and -- [laughter] and then you won't remember it. if you get into uncomfortable discussion -- melissa: that will maybe it worse.

no, no. kennedy: works every time. you go up to the person. instead of engaging in the political vitriol, you give them a long uncomfortable hug and you don't let go. melissa: hold it tight and bring it in. >> speaking bringing it in, stay tuned, more "outnumbered" in just a moment. now with one touch using the mycigna app you can find a doctor in your plan's network to save money. need to be thorough.

kennedy: as you are brianing your bider and shopping up the holy trinity and carrots and onions thank you very much,

james webb. eboni, lisa, melissa. melissa: i am going to stuff myself. i'm eating everything. kennedy: weight in turkey. back on tv friday at noon eastern. good news for you. "happening now" starts right now. choosing closest advisors. >> two big offers are are on the table and we are covering all of the news "happening now". >> we don't know exactly what president-elect trump is planning as he goes forward. we owe it to give him the strength he needs. >> president-elect trump taps the first woman for the administration assy we learn more about the vision and business plan in the white house. >> it could be a record week for