>> shepard: noon on the west coast, 3:00 in d.c., we're following two developing stories. first, president trump says it may be time to let obamacare fail. after the republican healthcare overall collapsed. >> just let obamacare fail. we're not going to own it. i'm not going to own it. >> we will try a different way to bring the american people relief from obamacare. >> shepard: we'll show you what senate republicans are working on. why the efforts are in trouble and one man as a brand new plan. the other developing story, mystery solved. the eighth person in the russian meeting identified. a businessman working for a russian company. ahead, what more we know about him. and breaking this afternoon, word we could see the

president's son and former campaign chief testify in public. also, is o.j. simpson actually set to walk free? his parole hearing coming in just two days. insider's say the judge halls a good chance to let the juice loose. >> shepard: obamacare repeal and replace is dead. new this afternoon, repeal and replace later is also dead. and obamacare is the law of the land despite republican promises to kill it. what to do? the white house solution, do do not fix obamacare, let it fail. president trump is calling for exactly that, allow the collapse of the healthcare program in which tens of thousands of men and women depend for medical

coverage. the coverage lashed out at democrats and republicans after the collapse of the g.o.p. healthcare bill in the senate. and he said he wants to force a deal by letting obamacare go belly-up. >> president trump: i've been saying that for a long time, let obamacare fail. it will be a lot easier. and i think we're probably in that position where we let obamacare fail. we're not going to own it, i'm not going to own it, i tell the republicans are not going to own it. >> shepard: politically republicans do own it, voters gave them control of washington. it was central promise of the republican campaign. for eight years they told constituents and voters give us control and we will repeal and replace obamacare. fox's brit hume explains this way. he writes on twitter, what enshrines obamacare is leaving it fully in place despite control of the house, the

senate, and the white house. the g.o.p. now owns it. this bitter republican failure happened after two plb an senators announced last night they would vote against bringing the bill to the senate floor for debate. mike lee of utah and jerry moran of kansas. a blind side to the white house. announced that the president was having din wert republicans at the white house attempting to shore up this new plan. today the president admit heed was surprised by their announcement. his spokesperson moments ago said he's frustrated. two gop senators came out against the measure, susan collins of maip and rand paul of kentucky so that was four a fifth joined them today. and the senate majority leader, mitch mcconnell, could afford to lose only two votes and still pass the bill without support from any democrats. today the majority leader announced a backup plan, repeal obamacare first, then replace it a couple of years later. president trump suggested the same thing on twitter last night. but the truth is, that's not what they were actually

advocating. the senate gop healthcare bill does not repeal obamacare. it merely defunds it leaving the measures measure's regulations in place of the structure of obamacare would stay under this new idea. that new idea that, backup plan that the senate majority leader was pushing is also dead. at least three senators are now a no. what's next? there is no clear path for republicans to accomplish what was one of the biggest promises to americans. here's what fox news contributor and press secretary for george w. bush airie fliescher said today on this network. >> this is a dismal day for republicans. abandonment of the heart of the republicans' promise and not to deliver on it. this is the senate's job. the senators needed to have looked each other in the eye and say it is our responsibility to figure on it how to replace. shgs it's possible bipartisan plan to fix obamacare could emerge that could shore up the

individual marketplaces, allow tense of millions of people to have insurance. so far that hasn't happened. republicans appear at this moment hopelessly divided. moderates on one side, conservatives on the other in stark opposition and unable to do what they promised. the affordable care act, obamacare, remains law. and there is nothing in the works to change that. we have team fox coverage, chief congressional correspondent mike emmanuel live on capitol hill. first the chief white house correspondent john roberts out of the briefing and with us on the north lawn. what did the white house say moments ago, john? >> you pointed at the top of it, shep, the president is frustrated with what happened last night and is what going on today. frustrated from a couple of stand points. he's frustrated that republicans have been talking about repealing obamacare for seven years now. he gave them an opportunity to repeal and replace it with something else, something better he says. and they're not taking him up on the offer. sarah luck have huckabee sanders saying the president believes if

the republicans were after this for as long as they have he thought it would have moved faster than they have in congress. the other thing the president is us from freighted at is democrats, he has had no help from democrats. not that you expect any with the type of bill the republicans are pushing. sara huckabee sanders saying democrats got us into this mess and they want nothing to get out of the mess. the president talking about this, a short time ago as he met with veterans of the war in afghanistan, here's what he said. pvpt we're disappointed, i am very disappointed because, again, even as a civilian for seven years i've been hearing about healthcare. i've been hearing about repeal and replace. obamacare is a total disas per. we'll let obamacare fail and the democrats will come to us and say how do we fix it, how do we fix it. or how do we come up with a new plan. >> he said at the beginning of this, shep, the president said he is not going to own, this he is going to do everything he can

in conjunction with republicans in congress to shin ensure that the democrats own this. but at the same time the democrats want to wrap it around the president's neck and ride it into 2018. so this is really going to be a battle of political wills in the next 17 months. >> shepard: the vice president, mike pence, spoke on healthcare today i understand. >> yeah, and it's the vice president who really is the prime liaison, legislative director mark short does a lot of the heavy lifting in terms of the technical aspects. the vice president is the primary liaison between the white house and capitol hill. he's taking aim at republicans who voted to repeal obamacare back in 2015, whether they be in the house or the senate and saying, look, you voted to repeal it then, why are you against repealing it now. two new republicans who voted for it then, murkowski and kapitow say we're not going to vote for it in 2017. listen to the strident language the vice president used today.

>> to be clear, the senate should vote to repeal now and replace later or return to the legislation carefully crafted in the house and senate. but either way, inaction is not an option. congress needs to step up, con grels needs to do their job, and congress needs to do their job now. >> this something you see the white house putting pressure on senators over, shep, in the next couple of weeks. look, 49 of you are in the senate right now, voted for this thing two years ago. you tell us now that while we voted for it in 2015, it was a show wrote, we knew there was no chance of it becoming law now there's a chance that something might happen you're going to back away from it? shep they're going to cry hypocrisy, loud and long. >> shepard: more to come, stay with us if you would. the second developing story of the day, the identity of the eighth person at donald trump jr.'s russia meeting last

year remained a mystery until today. fox news as confirmed earlier reports that the businessman ike kaveladze was. there he works for a russian real estate firm, based in the united states. further we now that justice department special counsel robert mueller is looking into that meeting because the russian businessman's lawyer confirmed mueller has asked his cliept to submit to an interview. we will have more on ike kaveladze later. mueller is investigating russian interference in the investigation and team trump collusion with the russians in their efforts to elect donald trump. . before that trump tower meeting, e-mails reveal that don trump jr. was offered damaging information about hillary clinton by the russians. democrats say it is the cleeest evidence yet of possible collusion between the trump campaign and russia. trump administration officials have given mum tip many

explanations for the meeting and call it a proposed zoe ducks to standard opposition research. what is the latest on the russian matter, john? >> they haven't really weighed in on this, shep. it's the outside counsel that's handling all of this. i spoke with the attorney for ike kaveladze, confirmed he was the so-called eighth man, mystery person in this meeting. he is vice president at the crocus corporation. when we learned that, the dots are connected here. crocus corporation is owned by it was araf in that e-mail that rob goldstone sent to donald trump jr. saying that the prosecutor from russia and r. arasso had information they thought beneficial to the trump campaign. they brought the miss universe haj paj don't moscow, he's a friend of donald trump jr.

all of these dots are connected. as to exactly what he was doing there, the attorney for donald trump jr. said when he spoke with -- i'm sorry, kaveladze last week he was told he was there to act as bit of interpreter for natalia who doesn't speak english well, she did have a dedicated translator with her. it's an interesting web spun here. peter faust said when he spoke with pete kaveladse, he's been in the united states since 2001, went to university of new haven to get his mba and assured peter fast he has nothing to do with the russian government or russian intelligence. that's third hand information, we haven't spoke with him yet. >> shepard: john roberts, thanks. much more coming up. we'll get reaction from capitol

hill from people on the collapse of the new healthcare bill. and the fact that obamacare remains the law of the land, coming in just a moment in a live report from mike emmanuel. the white house daily press briefing has ended and there are so many items of great importance in the world right now, on which the white house is given an opportunity to weigh in. and that happens during the press briefing. but for those who don't know, the white house from time to time does not allow us to air the news conferences live. further they don't allow us to air the audio until after the news conference is complete. well, it just finished, john roberts came of the early to be with us. it just finished. we'll play that audio for you. so you know in context and perspective without edits. here's the first question. >> i will take your question. >> the president seemed blindsided by the defections on the health care bill. what do you think changed at the

white house, to know where the votes are on tax reform? >> the same thing we've been doing, continuing to have ongoing, regular consistent contact with members of congress. ideally, democrats will want to participate in the process. moving forward. on a number of issues including tax reform. and maintaining that open line of communication as the president often does meeting here with members of the house and the senate as well as having regular calls and members of his administration in touch daily with leadership and members of both houses. >> the vote coming up later this year, is there any plan to have the president reach out and make contact personally and what does that mean for the lawmakers to capitol hill? >> in terms of tactics, we'll make those decisions as we get closer to that point.

certainly, i would expect the administration to be engaged in that process throughout. blake? >> let me ask you a couple of questions about healthcare. they said a couple of times in the remarks a little while ago that at this point he'll just let obamacare fail. why is it acceptable policy to let obamacare fail? >> i think in large part, look, democrats have refused to join in fixing the healthcare problems that have plagued our healthcare system, specifically in large part due to obamacare. obamacare's failures. that sort of i think behavior is simply unacceptable. and hopefully with the collapse of the program that they put in place they will be more willing to come to the table and clean up the mess president. >> another comment about the timing going forward. the president said, quote, something will happen and it will be good. it may not be as quick as we

hoped but it is going to happen. he also started talking about 2018 and the need for more republicans to get elected. i guess in the short term, is it realistic for some sort of healthcare agreement to happen before the august recess, even, as the administration and republicans answer on capitol hill have been hoping for, or is this a longer term horizon? >> as we said many times before, we're less focused on the time tablend and making sure we get it right and get it done. continuing to focus on repealing and preplacing owe bam care with a system that actually works. those priorities and principles haven't changed. >> is it possible this is a post reset, maybe, even a 2018 event? >> ideally i think it happens as soon as possible. but, again, we've been clear about not saying by x date, but more about let's get better coverage, let's get a better plan and a better program. that's been our focus not the

timetable. job? >> three republican senators have come out against this idea of repeal. collins not surprising, she voted against it in 2015. but the others voted for repeal in 2015 and now they're saying they're against it. is this thing dead before it leaves the barn? >> the thing that's dead is obamacare. we've seen that it's completely failed. at this point congress needs to do their job and do it as quickly as they can. every day that they don't we go further in to collapsing under obamacare. i think at this point inaction is not a workable solution. so they need to come to the tale and figure out how to reform the system and fishgs it. >> what do you say to the two senators who voted for repeal in 2015 but now say they won't vote for it in 2017? >> i think we say, with the vice president what he said today, do your job. time for congress to do their job and do it now. >> speaking of members of the

house paul ryan a short time ago said it's difficult to explain to your constituents why you voeed for something two years ago and aren't voting for it now. is that the tact that the white house will take as well? >> i think that's something that the senators will have to answer to your constituents, not something that the white house has to answer on behalf of those members. >> will the trump administration take action to move obamacare toward collapse, like stopping csr payments or other things it's threatened before? >> i don't think the white house has to take actions for obamacare to collapse. you see the evidence every single day. you got dozens and dozens of counties that have no options on the exchange. premiums continue to skyrocket. i don't think the white house needs to do anything for the failure to continue. >> what about the csr payments? >> i don't have anything further than where we've been the last several months on that, nothing new to update. >> one more question about, the

afghan girls -- >> why stop now, everyone is having a good time. >> the afghan girls robotics team competing down the street, ivanka trump wept and met the girls today. how did the president find out about these individual cases that he's interceded on like this. and what ends up moving him on those individual cases? >> i can't speak to every single way that he finds out about information, obviously he has a large staff and administration that pays close attention to a wide range of issues. and this is something that was flagged and something that he toong a great deal of interest in, in making sure that the problem was solved and it was. we're excited that they're here. matthew? >> thank you. two questions if i may. first, who is primarily responsible for what appears to be the failure of this healthcare legislation?

>> i would say democrats. they're -- >> but they're in the minority. >> they're responsible for passing obamacare. they're responsible for creating the mess we're n they're responsible for being unwilling to work with republicans in any capacity to help fishgs a system that they know is completely flawed and publicly said so. i think that it's pretty clear, i think the responsibility lies on their shoulders. >> just a quick followup, bipartisan group of governors including the republican john kasich, brian sandoval and others are calling for a bipartisan healthcare reform. is the president open to that, specifically sort of starting woefer a by partisan look at this, bringing governors to the table? >> the president has met with a large number of governors, talked to them regularly, that certainly won't stop at this point in the process, not just on healthcare but on a wide variety of issues. in terms of bipartisan, i think

the president laid out clearly from the beginning of the process, he was more than willing to sit down with democrats. they've been the ones that have been completely unwilling to even come to the table to be part of the discussion. hopefully, now, now that obamacare continues to completely collapse maybe they'll decide that they want to be part of this process. >> what is the president's level of frustration with republicans since they control both houses of congress? >> he's frustrated, he spoke about this earlier today, again i any his primary frustration is that there's no progress in terms of over the last 24 hours of moving this further down the road. and giving americans the system that they deserve. i think he laid out pretty clearly there's a small number of people that he's probably frustrated with. but i think in large part most of the frustration lies with the democrats who created the mess but won't want to fix the problem. >> when he says he's not going to own it what does he mean by

that? >> i think he's not going to own the failure of obamacare. exactly what i said to matthew. the failure of obamacare i think rests solely on the shoulders of democrats. they created the programs, they pushed it through, they made this legislation happen. and they need to own the failure of it. >> during the press conference the president had at trump tower, asked about healthcare, he said that there would be repeal and replace the same week but probably the same day, could be the same hour. did this turn out to be a lot more difficult than he anticipated? >> certainly i think that after hearing members of congress talk about repealing and replacing obamacare for seven years, i think that most people thought it would probably move a little bit faster. >> what did we learn about the way congress works in the process, what did he learn about

this town, what did he learn about the legislative process? >> probably in a government always moves slower than it should. >> the president a year ago this fly dray at a republican national convention accepted that party's nomination, said nobody knows the denks better than me, why i alone can fishgs it. if the president knew the system so well does he owe his supporters an apology? >> for what? >> that he couldn't get healthcare across the finish line. >> having the stock market at an all-time high, creating jobs, putting isis on the run, getting rid of countedless things that make the business climate better? absolutely not, we should be proud of the progress that we have made in the sirs the six months and continued progress that we're going to take over the next 7 1/2 years. >> in response to matt, this is from november 8, 2013 from the president, leadership, whatever happens you're responsible.

if it doesn't happen you're responsible. why is the president trying to shove responsibility over to democrats? doesn't he own any of the blame here? >> the blame of a program that was created and forced through before he took office, no. but the process of reforming healthcare is certainly not over. and we're going to continue to focus on reforming the healthcare system and putting one in place that isn't a failure like obamacare. >> this seems like a multi question day, i have two. >> i thought they were all multi question days. i didn't know there was an option to do it different. >> we can also do it on camera. >> i'll consider that one, too. >> is the failure of the senate bill going to change the president's approach moving forward? will we see him take a more public role with rallies and speeches calling for healthcare legislation? how much should we expect to see him meeting with the senators about this? >> again, the president has laid out the priorities of what he wants to see in healthcare reform.

and now it's congress's job to legislate. and we're looking to them to work through some of that process. but we're going to continue to be incredibly engaged. specifically on providing technical assistant as well as looking at all options for best repeal and replacing obamacare. >> the second one, one thing i've been hearing a lot is this notion it might have been smarter to pursue infratruck tur first that, has more bipartisan appeal. do you think there's any regret about not going for another agenda item first? >> not necessarily. april? >> couple of things. is the president going to go to the convention next week in baltimore? >> i'm not sure. >> is he considering sfla. >> i honestly don't know, i haven't seen the schedule for next week. >> when it comes to a.c.a., you're blaming democrats but democrats are saying there were 99 amendments by republicans in the a.a.c. what do you say to that?

>> this is still, i mean, a democrat piece of legislation. it was written, it was forced through, 99 amendments to how many hundreds of pages of legislation? it's outrainous to make sha bipartisan bill. everybody knows exactly who is part of that process, and it certainly wasn't republicans. >> and the last question congressional leaders particularly democrats are very concerned about the trust factor when it comes to jared kushner and his security clearance and also still remaining on the job. what does the president have to say about his son-in-law right now in the midst of this storm, the fact that more information cons to come out after he gave his initial statement and they're concerned about the trust factor when he has a critical piece security clearance that deals with issues of trust.

is the president considering allowing him to stay or leaf? should he keep his security clearance? >> i don't know of any changes that would be made. the president has confidence in jared. i'm not aware of any changes at all. >> is it fair to say the president was blindsided last night when he found out, when senior staff found out? >> i'm not going to get into the process piece. and the tick to be and the back and forth -- tick to be. our focus is on the repeal and replace not the process piece of it, i maing sure we get it done. >> can you confirm the president did tell lawmakers that they would look like dopes if they did not vote for repeal and replace? >> i'm not sure, i will have to get back to you. >> the president to get republicans elected in 2018, he said he would be working very

hard to make that happen. does that go for two republican incumbent senators jeff blake and dean heller who were not onboard with this healthcare plan? >> due to legal restrictions i won't get into potential election questions. >> thank you, sara. two questions, please. >> john roberts is bored, he's headed out. [groaning] >> two questions. even before senator mcconnell's statement last night and speaker ryan's press conference, the concept of an outright repeal was cause du jour in the house of representatives, meeting of conservative lawmakers on thursday who ared a a mapt about it, congressman biggs introduced the bill for direction. is there any possibility the administration would at least sit down and join the cause for

direction repeal before it pursued any new kind of legislation? >> i think we're certainly open to having conversations on all fronlts and the best way to move the process forward. >> second question, one of the things, it's been concluded that the meeting that miss veselnitskaya had with donald trump jr. was about eventually lifting all of the sanctions which targeted top officials in the kremlin. now, since january, secretary tillerson has said none of the sanctions will be lifted. many of the russian expatriates and opponents of the kremlin regime have subjected if the president can put this issue behind him, by supporting further sanctions, are there any plans to do that? >> it's specific sanctions, i

can't speak to that today. once we have an announcement i'll let you know. dave? >> sarah, thanks. the president has said many times in the past six months that we needed to get the healthcare legislation done first so we can go on to massive tax reforms, healthy economy. can now proud with massive tax reform that will give the biggest bang to the economy without having done the obamacare part of it? >> we're going to continue pushing forward on tax reform and laying out that plan. i know this will surprise a lot of people but we can walk and chew gum at the same time. we're not done with the healthcare battle, we'll continue wishing forward on that and hopefully get that completed then transition fully to tax reform after that. >> sarah, you concluded this is the democrats fault. but they were able to come back to the table and negotiate to

improve -- they could work with you on repeal and replace. isn't it fair to say that you guys wouldn't work with them as well. >> not at all. we've been clear from the beginning we're willing to sit down with democrats and talk about how to reform the healthcare system. and until they recognize the fact that obamacare has completely collapsed and failed i think it will be hard for them to move forward in the process. but their unwillingness is pretty welcome documented. >> in 2012 trump talked about obama stopping his agenda, since he had full control for two years, he can never take responsibility. doesn't the president need to take some responsibility for this moment, sarah? >> look, i think we're taking responsibility in terms of pushing new legislation through. but not the failures of

legislation that happened before the president got into office. i think you also have to take into account the outrageous obstruction that we've talked about pretty frequently up here, not just on healthcare but across the board in just allowing the president's administration to be fully staffed and be able to fully carry out the duties of the office. >> this is not about the legislation of the past before the president took office. this is about the president and republicans campaigning on repealing and replacing obamacare, for seven years, and the president when he was on the campaign trail not living up to that promise. doesn't he need to take responsibility? >> like i said before, the debate in the battle over healthcare isn't over. we're continuing to push forward to repeal and replace obamacare. we're going to continue fighting for that every single day. you're speaking as if this is over and done and it certainly isn't. charlie? >> just curious whether the president would be willing to sign a repeal only legislation

if that ended up on his desk. >> you know i don't have an announcement to make on specifics, that hasn't hit his desk. but i think right now we're certainly open to considering all options to reform healthcare and make sure that americans get the best care possible. >> the president earlier today had a luncheon with service members and said he wanted to hear ideas about the war in afghanistan. can you tell us about any ideas that he heard? he clearly isn't happy how long the u.s. has been in afghanistan. will he reject the plan from mattis of keeping the u.s. there long term? >> in terms of specifics that were discussed at the meeting i'll see if i can get any of those ideas, if that's something that those individuals want to share. the president felt it was important to talk directly to some of the servicemen that have been on the ground and hear some of their feedback and their thoughts about what's taking place there. some of the progress being made. >> in regards to mattis and the

plan to keep the u.s. there long te term, is he in support of that plan in the u.s. stays longer? >> the president is still reviewing what options he wants to take and we'll keep you poeshed. -- posted. >> repealing and replacing the affordable care act was perhaps the biggest campaign promise that the president made when he was president. does the president believe the fear that failing to do so will impact the republicans' ability to hold on to the house and the senate in 2018? is this something that he's conveyed to members of congress in his conversations with them? >> again, we're going to get the job done, we're still focused on doing what we set out to do. but i would also argue that the president laid out a lot of priorities during the campaign, creating jobs, creating a better job environment, getting rid of

burdensome regulations, butting isis on the run, securing the border, protecting our country, taking steps every single day to help improve the lives of the forgotten man. he certainly delivered on a lot of those things. and we're going to continue to do that. every single day that he's in office. >> sarah, also, in terms of what the president said a little bit earlier and also what he tweeted earlier, spoke about coming together. does that indicate that the president is open to some sort of bipartisan solution to fixing what is wrong with the affordable care act? >> absolutely. the president said all along that he, his primary goal is to fund a solution. he's happy to work with democrats to get it done. francesca? >> you said the administration would want congress to finish work on healthcare and then move on to taxes. previously the white house has said that it wanted to see a

draft plan for that tax reform before the august reset. -- recess. is that still the case and do you expect to get tax reform done this year in light what we learned about the healthcare bill yesterday? >> we're still very focused on moving forward on tax reform, it's still a big priority for the administration. that has not changed. >> in terms of getting it done before the end of the year? >> we want to get the biggest tax reform as possible. tax reform plan in place. and we'll keep you posted on time line and announcements for that happening. >> one other topic, i wanted to ask about the legal fees, is the president paying for his lawyers that are defending him in the russia allegations that are outside of this white house? and is the president paying mark garalo, the spokesman and the lawyers on his team?

>> i'm not sure what the structure is for that. >> thank you, sarah. the president, as candidate and president, raised significant expectations about this legislation saying it's going to be a beautiful plan, of one was going to be covered. and did he ever really have a plan? and what does that say about his true knowledge regarding the healthcare system? >> i think the president has shown extensive knowledge, he's laid out priorities that are important to be included in the legislation. once again, this is not a game-over situation. we're continue to be push forward and work hard to make sure that the american people get the type of healthcare they ned and deserve. alexis? >> as long as the affordable care act remains law is the president committing through hhs to support the subsidies, the

executive sus nans that the existing law has? >> as has been the case since we got here we'll continue to keep you posted as decisions and changes are made. or if they're not. >> can i follow up, you just said a few minutes ago, we are taking responsibility in terms of pushing new legislation through. that sentence seems to conflict with what you said earlier. can you clarify what you mean by you're taking responsibility. what happened last night is the president's responsibility. that's what you're saying? >> i'm saying that our goal is to continue to push to repeal and replace obamacare. we're committed to doing that. that hasn't changed throughout the campaign. that was something we talked about and something we talk about every single day that we're here. focused on doing. that we're going to continue pushing forward. >> in the white house a couple of weeks ago, mitch mcconnell

said the republicans are going to sit down with senator schumer. he was suggesting that sitting down with democrats would be a sign for republicans failing to repeal obamacare. are congress and mcconnell on the same page whether or not they want to work with democrats? mcconnell seemed to indicate that was plan b. >> the president has said he's happy and willing to work with democrats on repealing and replacing obamacare. >> do you believe that's the way the process actually unfolded? >> in terms of democrats being unwilling to come to the table, yes. >> in terms of whether republican leaders have been open to democrats. >> i think democrats laid out very cleanly from the beginning of the process they were unwilling to come to the table and have that conversation. >> i want to ask you about iran, it's reported that the president

was reluctant to certify that iran is in compliance. how reluctant was he? >> i think everybody in the room knows the president has talked about this pretty extensively and his opinions and his feelings on this deal have certainly not changed. he's still very much thinks it's very really bad deal. the iranians have not been fully compliant. and we're going to continue through this process. i'll refer you back to his statement. >> follow up on the lunch today, he sat with enlisted men and heard from them what they think should happen. was the president seeking a second opinion from what he's hearing from the commanders? or just curious why he wanted to hear from them? >> i wouldn't call it a second opinion. it's important to have that type of engagement, that's something that matters to him. not just on spechic policy

issues, but just to be able to have that type of open dialogue with the guys that have the boots on the ground. he'll want to be able to continue to do that throughout his time in office. >> obamacare is dead, but millions of people still depend on it. the president has decisions to make as was noted earlier, payments from insurance companies and subsidies. he can push this over the cliff as senator schumer said a short time ago. he has the power to do that. it's not simply going to fail on its own, he has the power to do it. >> i disagree. i think we're seeing it fail day after day after day as millions of people -- >> it's already failed, you're saying it's dead. you're saying it's dead. it's not dead. there are still millions of people many of them forgotten men and women you like to talk about, who still depend on it. and he has the power to kill it dead. he has the power to push it over the cliff. are you saying he's already made

the decision on subsidies and payments to insured companies that would finally kill it? >> no, that's not what i'm saying. again, in terms of obamacare being dead, it's an unsustainable program. when something is unsustainable and can't reeb vooifd -- >> there are people who depend on it, millions of people, many of your supporters. it's not dead. >> that's why the process of repealing and replacing would need to make sure that those people are continued coverage. that's been a big focus. one of the priorities of this process. throughout, from the beginning. >> is he going to push it over the cliff? >> this is already going over the cliff and doesn't need a push by the president. >> sarah, when you spoke to the president earlier today, said that this system will continue to collapse and get to a point where democrats have to come back to the table and join and try to find a way to fix it. what specifically does the administration think would be that point?

to get a group conversation and not have them -- >> that's a question you have to ask the democrats. they're the only ones that are going to bring it to the table. >> you're the one that keeps saying there's going to arrive a place where the system is at such a level that they're not willing to compromise. >> i can't imagine that this program, as he laid out, goes deepernd deeper off the cliff. >> you don't go deeper and deeper off a cliff. [laughing] what is the point you are describing? >> obamacare is unsustainable. we have said this 100 times. it's not a program that can be revived. it is 'lengs adead program in terms -- it is essentially a dead program to provide the type of healthcare that americans deserve and need. the priorities that the president has laid out, we have to have a plan in place that provides care not just coverage that brings the cost down, lower

deductibles across the board reform. and at this point, hopefully democrats will see how bad the system is and come to the table. >> what specifically is going to happen to bring them back to the table? i mean you're saying it's unsustainable, it can't be supported. >> i would think those things alone should wake up democrats and make them want to come to the table. again, i'm not going to speak for the breaking point of democrats. i can't imagine that as we continue down this road they don't come to the table to try and help save healthcare in this country. >> shepard: the recording of the white house wrapping up an off camera briefing with reporters saying president plump is frustrated after the senate republican healthcare bill collapsed. the president himself said it's time to let obamacare fail. the senate republican backup plan also is dead on arrival. but one democrat is pushing a new idea. the two parties working together. mike emmanuel is on capitol hill, what is the latest from

the majority leader, mitch mcconnell today? >> majority leader mcconnell seems determined to have a vote on a partial repeal without a replacement plan even though he doesn't have the votes. he expressed frustration a short time ago. >> this has been a challenging experience for all of us. pretty obvious that we don't have 50 members who can agree on a replacement. a lot of people have been involved in the discussion, it's been a very passionate discussion. but than has gefb it their best shot. >> four moderate republicans came out against the idea even though it was a bill they voted on in 2015, maine's susan collins voted against it then. the three other senators say the situation has changed in their particular states. >> ohio has had big changes since 2015. one is we now have 19 counties with not a single insurer. in 2015 we had insurers in of county. we have another 27 counties with

only one insurer. >> it would force everyone back to the drawing board. >> shepard: what are democrats saying about this, mike is the. >> they're saying the idea of voting on a repeal without a certain replacement plan would cause a whole lot of chaos. here's more from senate democratic leader chuck schumer a short time ago. >> the time has finally come for a republican colleagues to take us up on our offer of working together to improve the healthcare system rather than sabotage it. >> schumer is trying to force republicans back to the negotiating table to see if they can work together on fixing obamacare, shep. >> shepard: tell us with the new proposal, mentioned the work together program, it's from joe manchin. >> he describes governors as problem solvers, he said the

dozen or so former governors should sit down and talk it out. >> we understand the challenges of the state. we understand the challenges of getting to consensus. if you have got 11 of us in this united states senate and you got mark over in the house that's 12 former governors. >> he's sulting that former governors would sit down and -- he's suggesting the former governors would handle it in a practical way. >> shepard: let's go to alex from politico. they say they're working on it. it's dead, though, right? >> it sure seems d.o.a. at this point. this whole idea of just flat-out repeal doesn't seem like it's going anywhere to the point where you have -- >> it wasn't a repeal, you have to have 60 votes to repeal. it was a defund essentially. the structure of obamacare stayed in place.

>> here is the problem, 34i67 mcconnell's problem, his own republican senators, even though really trump really friendly states aren't in support of this state. -- of this bill. that illustrates the problem. those senators from states where trump did very well in the 2016 election are not on board with this plan. that's a problem not just for healthcare but potentially other agenda items moving forward. >> shepard: tax reform is next. but potentially. but tax reform relied upon repeal and replace of owe bam care did it not? >> well, look, it relies on -- it's complicated. they are looking at a lot of other things as it relates to tax reform, infrastructure. all of these things that trump talked about on the campaign trail, things that he said he was going to accomplish, things that he promised voters he was going to get con, all of these things face hurdles toward passing the house and the senate. this is the problem facing republicans, which is as we head toward the 2018 mid-term

election, what is it they're going to run on, what are they going to say they've accomplished at this point. >> shepard: what have you heard about the timing last night, for our view areas bit of background, mitch mccome had been asking members, look, hold on until the cbo score comes out. they had only lost two votes. that had been the plea. then last night, while the president was meeting with republicans in a dinner at the white house, he got blindsided by this. what's the message here, if there was one, from these two senators? >> the message is, that republican senators are saying we're going to do what we want and there is sort of an independent streak that they are showing that they don't necessarily feel like they need to go along with the white house. and this is something that's been going on now for several weeks if not months, frustration on the legislative end about the way in which they've been able to work with the white house or the lack -- a lack of real relationship with the white house in terms of getting things done. you're sort of starting to see

those strains break out into the open. >> shepard: from a republican perspective, the facts are as follows. for a year, barack obama traveled the nation selling from the presidential bully pulpit the idea of the affordable care act. he went from state to state and city to city all over the country. and it worked. president trump has not left trump properties in his selling of this. what is the level of frustration among legislative republicans on that matter? >> huge frustration. especially if you why this. donald trump, his strength has been retail. he's an extraordinary salesman if you think about it. that's what he was before he became president. and he has shown himself to be unwilling or uninterested in selling his agenda across the country. going to states like pennsylvania, going to states like wisconsin, places like michigan where he did really well, turning democratic states red, and selling to it the

people, he has not shown an interest at all in doing those things. >> shepard: do you know why? >> it's a great question. the reality is that he seems to be more interested in playing golf or going to one of his properties during the weekend. or just staying at the white house. it's a problem when you have to sell big, complex pieces of legislation. he seems to be uninterested or unwilling to use his bully pulpit. >> shepard: very interesting, thank you very much. i mention the other developing story of the day, we've learned that donald trump jr. may testify before congress about the russia investigation. this comes after e-mails showed he met with a russian lawyer, in what he believed was an attempt to get dirt on hillary clinton. testify before congress in open session, and on camera. there are many new details and they're coming next.

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front of the sep at judishly committee at the intelligence committee. i have a line out to the trump legal team to see if it's under consideration. >> shepard: we reported earlier to o. this eighth person in the meeting, formerly the mystery guy, who we know was the eighth person in donald trump's meeting. what else do we know about him? >> okay, his name is ike kaveladze and he is a u.s.-based employee for a company called the crocus group. the crocus group is controlled by this other russian, agalarov, who initiated the meeting with donald trump jr. on the premise he meant with the crown prosecutor in russia and there may be incriminating or damaging information against hillary clinton. the "washington post" is reporting that this eighth person, ike kaveladze -- pardon me, kaveladze, was the eyes and ears for the russian oligarch in this meeting.

this is typical of the m.o. of a russian operation. >> shepard: robert mueller has told the lawyer to this eighth person in the room he wrants to interview him regarding what happened in that room. is that tantamount to an admission that that meeting is part of the russia investigation or that robert mueller is looking into that meeting? >> based on my experience, yes. >> shepard: and whatever happens with that, the mueller camp is not one that's been leaking, we don't know anything from the muller camp. this leak -- not a leak, this information came from the eighth person's lawyer. >> lawyer, that's correct. i think it's worth noting most of the information is coming from outside attorneys who are confirming they have had requests to provide information. the distinction i would make is that gathering information, casting your net wide, would be a standard practice in one of these investigations. whether it becomes a central focus is another question. we don't have the answer.

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>> nei pvpt i'm disappointed in what took place. for seven years i've been hearing repeal and replace. >> the outside groups weighed in. >> we hope that now mitch mcconnell will reach out to democrats. >> this has been a very, very challenging experience for all of us. >> if there's anything wrong it's wrong within the congress and not anything to do with the white house. >> neil: welcome everybody, i'm neil cavuto, it's back and forth and finger pointing on healthcare and what went wrong, enough to make you vomit. it is time to get ready for the pivot. we're getting word that republicans are moving fast and furious to change to