>> jon: molly and i will be back in an hour, "outnumbered" starts right now. >> harris: fox news alert, there is a new sheriff in town and he lives on pennsylvania avenue. on his first day on the job, white house chief of staff, general john kelly sent anthony scaramucci packing just days after scaramucci's definitively latest tirade to the new yorker. this is "outnumbered." here today, melissa francis, also from fbn, dagen mcdowell, former deputy state department and fox news contributor, marie harf, and today's #oneluckyguy #oneluckyguy, former congressman, welcome back to the hauch, allen west.

colonel, you are outnumbered. >> allen: i am. >> dagen: not only does he bring military discipline and understanding of chain of command, he also brings humor. >> allen: i've been in some sticky spots in my life. >> harris: you are married and what did you tell me? >> allen: i'm a private at home, no doubt about it. >> harris: let's get started. a new chief on staff, sworn in communications chief shown the door. general john kelly showing his muscle on day one. sarah huckabee sanders said all white house staffers will now report to general kelly, no exceptions. >> as we've made clear a few times over the course of the last couple of days, general kelly has the full authority to operate within the white house and all staff will report to hi

him. reform act does not include jared kushner, stephen bannon, and everyone else? >> that includes every one of the white house. >> harris: mark warner of virginia says while he welcomes the action taken by general kelly, the buck will ultimately have to stop at the president. >> i hope this is a sign that his new chief of staff, general kelly will try to bring a little more order to the white house and maybe try to restore a little bit of respect to the office of the president. at the end of the day, it's not going to be the chief of staff, and has to be whether this president himself will change his behavior. >> harris: he tweeted, a great day at the white house. i read your article this morning and you said something happened right after scaramucci left, it broke out in confidence. >> allen: i think it's really

important right now, your second in command, that's a person who corrals the staff and gets them to be focused, gets them to be in the same sheet of music, but even more important, is the relationship between the commander and chief and staff, he has to instill with him and empowering him that trust and confidence to be able to go out there and run that staff and that's why you so it happened with anthony scaramucci. that was the first big test to show that mr. scaramucci thought i've got a relationship with the president, but general kelly would not have taken the position if he was not going to be fully and power. the next thing is ivanka trump tweeted out i worked forward two oh working alongside general kelly, she didn't get the memo. this is not her daddy, this is the president of the united states of america and you don't go in and talk to the president of the united states of america unless the chief of staff is present. >> dagen: i had that on my

phone, i pulled it up because i was going to reference every tweet. >> harris: i wrote that down. >> allen: you've got the commander at the top and there's a line that goes down on this to the chief of staff and the light from the chief of staff goes down and then you have the lateral, you have all of your staff officers, being the person who deals with personnel, the national security, whoever handles the legislative side of operations, communications. all of those people report to the chief of staff. everyone needs to get on board and understand that that's how it works and that's this mentality. if you are not going to buy into that mentality, you're not going to be around very long. >> harris: the audience can see the look on melissa francis' face. >> melissa: what backs that up is the way they unfolded yesterday. i was thinking about this at the end of the day and if you think about the pattern of events,

from the morning general kelly was sworn in, that was the news, that was the message, that was what was going on at that moment. a lot of us were wondering, what about anthony scaramucci, will he report to him, you didn't hear about that. after that had settled, then the word about what was going on with anthony scaramucci came out and was disseminated, but he controlled the day, general kelly, he controlled the message, he controlled the way things went. and the story about what was going on didn't overshadow or step on his swearing-in, and happened in the order of the intended and i think that tells us something about the discipline and the messaging going on. >> allen: stephen bannon will not have a problem because he is a former military officer. he gets it. >> dagen: will the president himself adhere to this? >> allen: surprises are only for birthdays, that's what we say in the military.

general kelly will not want to see the tweets out there about policy, he'll come into the president and say, let me tell you, don't do this again, please because we need to be on the same sheet of music because i have to now coordinate the staff to follow what you just put out there. >> dagen: is also making sure the president doesn't listen to people outside of that flowchar flowchart. james baker said, i was there to catch all javelins intended for the old man and make sure the president follows basically the guidance of kelly. one thing i'll add because we've been sitting here talking about donald trump running for this presidency for more than two years, trying to predict the unpredictable. >> marie: we've seen a number of these moments, when mike flynn left, there is been a number of them. this is a big one.

if there's going to be one, we could see this. do you think donald trump will listen when general kelly goes in and says you have to let up on the tweeting? >> allen: he would not be in the position if that were the case. the thing is, you will make him goal cold turkey. i think you'll see a draw down and you'll also see focused tweeting, that will follow the theme or the message. >> melissa: i think he made it clear what the job was and he said you'll have to listen to me. i'm not going to do this unless a, b, c, d. >> marie: there's two questions, what, dominic >> harris: he has a rich history, however short and may be with this president. when he rolled out the travel ban, it was a hot mess.

we had all sorts of criticism for this white house and why didn't they do it better and why didn't they tell anybody? general kelly stepped up into the fold and calm to the waters and said this is how we are going to move forward. i don't know if you remember that, but when they passed that, he was part of what come to the waters. >> allen: in the military, they will tell you that unpredictability can be a tactic, but it cannot be a strategy. i think what you have seen with this presidency, they think it can be a strategy. it cannot be how you're going to operate. >> harris: i want to know how it works in the real world with the president's family members in the white house, because we can sit here and talk about who's going to go to whom and all of that and i get the chart, i understand what you're saying about all of that, but the fact of the matter is, they have a

relationship. >> marie: we haven't seen this, this isn't something we have seen since kennedy and that's different because they weren't children. these are the president's children, he has a daughter who has a role, her husband has a role, we haven't seen this before and we've already seen ways in which it operated. it's made this white house operate differently and on that chain of command like you're talking about. i just wonder if general kelly can fix all of it. >> allen: >> harris: you chose r words very carefully, so we don't know. >> dagen: it only matters in a time of crisis. they make and people can sit back and it makes great headlines right now, and it gives us a lot to gossip about over breakfast, lunch, and dinner and that midafternoon snack as well, but it doesn't matter because we are facing some sort of great global threa

threat. >> allen: if he is your daddy, then you want to talk about thanks giving dinner, that's a different conversation, but if you want to have a conversation with the president of the united states, if you want to have a conversation in the official position that you are and in the white house, you come through me. >> marie: i agree, i think of anyone can do it, general kelly can. i just haven't seen the closeness of the relationship with ivanka, how would jared has been so empowered on so many things, i'm a little dubious that can actually happen. >> dagen: why were his businesses successful if he didn't have some sort of order and chain of command? >> allen: again, the president, he is the chief executive officer of the federal government. he is a leader of the free world. he is the commander of our armed forces and he is the de facto head of the republican party. this is not the same as sitting

over there and having a real estate business. this is a big deal. you cannot look at this in the same way as from a family relationship or a family business, and that's the type of order and discipline and structure that general kelly will bring. >> harris: before we move on, many would argue with north korea firing the missile towards the united states, i was learning about the trucks that they could put warheads on, all sorts of stuff that's pretty scary with north korea and then you have the situation with russia as we go back between sanctions. >> allen: don't forget venezuela. >> harris: right come as maybe there is a crisis on the horizon, if you will. what difference does it make having john kelly in this job and particular? we already have a general among the cabinet members, but now you have a second, a person in the white house. >> allen: the important thing is that the generals military office was taught to be visionary leaders, they think

about what can happen based upon this action, the reaction and the counteraction. when you look at iran and russia and china and the launchers that north korea are using, these are chinese trucks. >> harris: a lot. colonel, it's great to have you here. thank you. if congress cannot fix health care, president trump may try to do it himself through executive action, but how much can he actually do without lawmakers? is it a good idea, what do you think? and eric trumpets the g.o.p. over lack of support for his father. why won't lawmakers get behind him and he was inserting the most? after we wrap up on tv, we pop up online, foxnews.com/are numbered, click on the overtime tab, we have a live chat. we like to read from the live chat, we also read comments that you leave us as he watches live on facebook. our handle, outnumbered fnc, tweet is any time. melissa and dagan, are you

tweeting to each other? >> dagen: we're texting, tweeting, and instagram incorporated. >> harris: stay close. are shared over the real cream in reddi-wip. ♪ reddi-wip. share the joy. this is lloyd. to prove to you that the better choice for him is aleve. he's agreed to give it up. ok, but i have 30 acres to cover by sundown. we'll be with him all day as he goes back to taking tylenol. yeah, i was ok, but after lunch my knee started hurting again so... more pills. yep... another pill stop. can i get my aleve back yet? for my pain... i want my aleve. get all day minor arthritis pain relief with an easy open cap. your insurance on time. tap one little bumper, and up go your rates. what good is having insurance if you get punished for using it? news flash: nobody's perfect.

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health care reform, members of congress are beginning to voiced doubts about their ability to get a bill passed before the august break. orrin hatch warns that members of congress are too divided to continue focusing on health care. bill cassidy saying this, watch. >> do you think there's time to do health care? >> it really depends, there needs to be another server momentum. it can be from the white house or from the senate. that's not how it works. it either needs to come from both sides of the senate and governors is saying this is where i want to be. >> melissa: rand paul says the president is considering using executive action to address health care. >> i just spoke with the president about this and i'm still very excited about trying to let people join associations across state lines and i think he can act by executive order to

do this. we talked to the secretary of labor and i'm hoping that president trump will move forward with actually doing some of this series i could've action. the president is very open to this and he says i'm keeping up the dialogue to do something. >> melissa: the reason why i think this works is because he's not trying to create laws that can then be peeled away as soon as he leaves, but he'll be using executive action to try and create something that would work. if it does work, great, maybe they'll decide to hang onto it. if it doesn't, then it still begs the question, do something better, then asked, then change legislation. >> dagen: president trump does understand that they have to move on something related to obamacare, because all of these republicans revealed themselves to be liberals underneath the conservative clothing that they wear because they basically, by not moving ahead with repeal and replace, they stand by obamacar

obamacare. all the taxes, all the mandates, all the government spending, all of the we think we make better decisions about your health and your money than you do. all of those republican senators, except for rand paul. he's doing something piecemeal. the health and human services secretary, tom price, could move in and remove away the individual mandate. that's something he does have the power to do, apparently. that would help, but when you do these other small things, it begins to unravel. >> marie: that's where i was going to go. there are things you can do by executive action, but what a lot of us would like to see is getting back to the regular order that we heard about last week. >> melissa: they can be trusted to do that. >> marie: the committee that's in charge of this, i heard is going to come out with a work

plan. tomorrow alexander said he is committed to doing this. he is going to try to actually do this and regular order in the senate and then if they can't, let's figure it out. speak to your senator mccain and others say we need the senate to do this. all of it is great and that's where we hoped we would be. they've had seven a half years to do any of that stuff and they haven't. now we are waiting years again to do it. it's certainly passed the midterm point, i would think. i want to point out because i did some research this morning with her team, president obama more than 40 times, major delays and obamacare fixes and he got very creative with his executive authority. he'll do things were broken and this law and tried to fix them. he was hoping to shore up some of the areas without having to go to congress.

>> allen: republicans criticize him for doing that and i republicans want to come around and say this is what we are going to do, all because we can't get our act together. >> melissa: thieves are a bunch of cats meowing, getting nothing done. >> allen: if you continue to reinforce this bad behavior, this is the greatest pavlovian experience that we've ever seen. they come back home, reelect me, send me back, and people do. i don't like this thing about executive action because it's a constitutional republic, not a constitutional monarchy. we don't need people sitting in the white house doing this. >> harris: even if it fixes across line marketing, there will still be issues. >> allen: you still have law and the books and as long as you have that, there's nothing you

can do. >> melissa: both sides have some at the helm and have the opportunity to fix this disaster and they've all chosen to go home instead. they have had years and years and years to make amenities, to do studies, to get together, to get off there took us and do something. >> dagen: thrall the same, they're wearing the same uniform and that's a spending taxpayer dollars and never having to stand up and answer to how those dollars produce benefits before they make in people. by the way, all those republicans who didn't do that, they stand by obamacare, i hope that your bumper sticker. >> melissa: time to reach across the aisle, how the white house's new chief of staff could be speaking and opening with democrats, whether that's a good strategy and what the white house wants to accomplish,

plus, tackling the country's tax code. the new administration is confident that congress can get bills to president trump by november. whether this will go better than the health care push and what a political risk it might be. ♪

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♪ >> harris: as chief of staff john kelly settles into the white house, he appears to being open to work with democrats. he has reached out to members such as nancy pelosi and chuck schumer in hopes of regaining political capital. the white house is looking to jumpstart president trump's agenda. meanwhile, the article notes, though calls to opposition leaders are the sort of traditional niceties any incoming chief of staff would perform, and kelly's case, the underscore, a larger effort to put the white house on firmer political footing. while some democrats appear open to working with general kelly,

others are said to be wary. including his involvement in the travel ban and the ramp up to deportation. by the way, let's get on the record. the huge amount of people that president obama deported never gets talked about. it was kept under the radar. that friendly media didn't want to tell about all the deportation. you see that on this white house, but they are carrying out the same laws. >> allen: the original countries that were part of this came out of the obama administration. if you sit back and look of these countries, these are failed states, they have islamic terrorist organization sanctuaries or their estates like around that are actively supporting islamic terrorism. this come back to why general kelly is leading, because no one has been able to do that very well. i will tell you, him reaching

out to nancy pelosi, the minority leader and to chuck schumer, keep your friends close, keep your enemies even closer. i think it's important that he tries to establish that relationship with them. >> harris: are you hopeful? >> allen: no, because the principle of government is on the democrat party. >> marie: i have to call you on that one. >> allen: don't think the progressive wing -- coast before i've never heard that term until this moment. >> allen: how do you ask when the phenomenon of bertie sanders? >> marie: he's not a democrat. >> allen: he was the guy that you almost had his or her nominee if it wasn't for debbie walsh or shorts >> marie: by partisan reach out as a good thing.

let me get in here, here is why it's right now. the publicans control the white house, the senate, and the house of representatives and they have failed to fulfill any of their major legislative policies. they're clearly not able to do it on their own, so maybe you have to start reaching out to democrats or else you're never going to get things actually done. >> dagen: that's what the democrats want. they're doing republicans a favor. let us a ride in on our thoroughbred horses that we bought with our money. they don't have to do anything and they know it. as i said at the beginning of this administration, at the beginning of this republican congress, they're going to sit back, full their arms, and go, this is what we are running on

in 2018. >> melissa: it's a great idea to call them on that bluff, to reach across the aisle. you can tell by the number of people who hate president trump and wished for him to fail that yesterday with general kelly, maybe that was a turning point for the administration. those people that can't stand him, at least have respect for general kelly. he's a person to reach out, this is probably the one opportunity, and why not try it? >> dagen: their solutions will be greater government control. that's what they want. just before a single pair is something that is used to scare people. >> marie: i am a democrat, i pay attention to lots of this by my party, there are certain

people in the party who do want it, most democrats, if you listen to them in the senate and the house, they do not want it and it's used to make people stay accomplished. >> dagen: they should stop going on tv and talking about how they wanted then. >> marie: they have show themselves incapable of governing without help from the democrats. >> dagen: next upcoming tax reform. president trump will reportedly start selling his plan to overhaul the tax code this afternoon. this is the white house says he's confident congress can get it all done in the next few months. >> the expectation is will begin the process in the house. there will be marcos any hearings in the finance committee at roughly the same time. those processes will probably play out and getting a bill to the house in october and the senate in november. that's an aggressive schedule, but that's our timetable.

>> dagen: unlike what went down with health care reform, republican senator jeff flake of arizona believes some democrats will step up to help. >> i do think there a certain number of democrats that want to see tax reform. it's certainly a heavy lift, but not as healthy heavy as health. >> dagen: senate democrats, and a letter to president trump and g.o.p. leaders say they are willing to work with republicans on tax reform, provided that it prioritizes working families over the wealthiest few and special interests. melissa has her finger in the air. we've heard steve bannon say -- we've heard president trump say the following that i've talked to -- i've have wealthy friends

who tell me they don't mind paying more in taxes. >> melissa: all of that is bluster in the sense that kevin brady did a fantastic interview with bill hemmer yesterday in which he answered that specific question and talked about the fact that you're not hearing that from steve mnuchin who is the president's representative on this, who we've all heard has a 100 people chained to their desk and treasury working on this around the clock, no matter what everybody else is working on. i would point to that market that we see and as we get ready to touch 22,000, that is 100% about this idea that steve mnuchin and his team are reassuring people that they are going to get tax reform done this year, that it's going to take effect for 2017. kevin brady reinforce that yesterday on fox news and he talked about the fact that they aren't going to touch mortgage deduction, they are going to touch charitable deduction, they're not going to follow that steve bannon top that you've heard, and what they may cut out are things like that tesla loophole that let you spend a

fortune on electric cars and taxpayers support that. >> dagen: kernel, to that point, melissa is bringing up the subsidies, the handouts that are buried throughout the tax code. jason riley once said there are ten lobbyists for every, so that means they will have to give up something. >> allen: if you are serious about continuing economic growth, you can't sit there and say we will raise taxes on people. if you want to help working, we have to do manufacturing. for the life of me, i can

understand why they haven't done something. you could have come out already and said we are going to do this one thing, 8-10% of tax on this, to get it back in the united states and the revenues that we generate, there is your infrastructure that you want to go out there. then you talk about the spendin spending. i hate it when i hear -- those are the key buzzwords and i'm looking for. i could tell you, when they're talking about november, i don't know. 20 new taxes as far as obamacar obamacare, you couldn't fix the tax situation of obamacare. >> harris: with a new enrollment. not coming up, and the price hikes that are coming down, what you're talking about is that november time, if they couldn't do it fewer than 25 taxes, how are they going to do it?

but can't they start somewhere? >> why haven't they? >> allen: if they were serious, they wouldn't be on vacation right now. >> dagen: this is nonpartisan, bipartisan love. president trump tweeting last week how sad it is that republicans don't protect the president and now his son is asking why the g.o.p. is not showing his dad more love. >> my father has the voice of this country, the people of the country love him, why wouldn't they get in line?

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♪ >> melissa: president trump's son eric wants the republican party to show his dad more

support, watch what he told sean hannity. >> i want some buddy to start fighting for him, he is the best fighter in the world, he'll do a better job fighting for himself than all of them will do fighting for him, but how much weight does he have to carry by himself? how can a party that is doing so much better than democrats, if you look at how much more money the republicans are raising, you look at the complete shambles that the dnc is in, the dnc is in debt, -- why wouldn't they embrace that? my father has the voice of this country that people of this country love him, why wouldn't they get in line? >> nomadic >> melissa: president trump himself tweeted this last week. this was a feisty discussion.

>> harris: on its face, this looks like someone who was a fan of his father coming out and saying some things to shore him up, but if you wipe this away, the relationship and who they are to one another, it doesn't help to make the president look strong. if you're questioning whether or not he can take the headwind. you've got one set of the political aisle saying don't help them out with health care, obama. he's got enough to face, i don't know that it helps whether he is your dad or not, come from a place of strength, say how things are going to be different moving forward. on the heels of anthony scaramucci, the guy who loves the man in the white house, i don't know the you necessarily need this. >> marie: support is earned.

he's basically bullied senators, president trump is not doing things to get the respect and the support of republicans in congress. >> harris: i don't agree with that. they were against him from the beginning. >> marie: for me, the jeff sessions situation has been really tough because when he went after jeff sessions directly, you heard pushback from a lot of republicans in congress who worked with jeff sessions, they like him. for a lot of them, they came out and said, what are you doing? >> dagen: the bigger question is a lot who this president when after deserved it. i was waiting for when he would call them out by name and it is fair to ask the question which has been asked over and over again, do these republicans want this president to succeed? do not forget, president trump

not only defeated hillary clinton, he the anointd one. he started by defeating republicans. he decimated the ranks republican comers, which we talked about. >> melissa: the part that resonated to me, he'd rather see the country failed to my father succeed. i agree that he should handle it on his own, but there are a lot of people in washington who want to see the country fail. >> allen: it's not so much the country fail, they're trying to protect washington, d.c., and that's what has a lot of you ladies upset. when i look at this, this is not operating from a position of strength. you have your son out there trying to portray the leader of the free world, the most powerful man in the world of some type of victim. i think you have to move away from there.

you have to have the power and the strength of your conviction convictions. when you have all those senators and the white house for a meeting, they don't leave, will order domino's pizza, whatever, but no one is leaving until we figure out this thing about health care. that's how you are in somebody's respect. if you try to get up and going away, sigrid but backed down, we are going to solve this thing right now >> harris: he basically did that with heller, he said if you don't stay, you may not have a job. >> marie: that's her republicans are wary of this president. maybe he's not doing it in the most effective way to get his legislative agenda. >> melissa: michael moore now slamming democrats, why he says the party is in so much trouble and his recipe for how democrats can take back power. will it work? real debate. ♪ originally discovered...

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running? and ivanka and jared, also will be reporting to kelly. the fight to repeal and replace obamacare may not be dead yet, does the u.s. senate have the energy to tackle it again? ahead happening now. >> harris: we'll see with the top of the hour, thanks. >> dagen: michael moore says the reason many americans still support president trump is that democrats are offering no alternative. he says rather than try to attract moderates, the parties to move further left to win back voters. >> and democrats try to sonic republicans, they move to the middle or the right, they lose. when they actually run as democrats and run on the liberal issues of the american people, they win. there's something about democrats, the only way we can win, we have to repeal the trump voters. who we have to appeal to are the 8 million obama voters that voted for trump.

>> dagen: there is your boy, there is your poster boy for the liberals. >> allen: who owns the democrat party? >> marie: he is not the poster boy for the party. he's wrong. there is a reason as a democratic strategist, it came to fox news after i left the obama administration because i thought we need to talk to voters across the spectrum. we need to circuiting our message out to people who may be voted for obama and trump, who maybe have never voted, that are independent. the democratic party will win again, if we move from the left, we are a big party and not listen to michael moore. >> harris: that's the best commercial for fox news channel. >> marie: michael moore doesn't represent our party anymore -- the democratic party is going through a bit of a growing pain, we are trying figure out how to

win back voters. those from the state of ohio believe we need voters who are moderate and liberal. >> allen: you had a congressman from ohio that challenged nancy pelosi and what happened? >> marie: he lost. >> harris: she says now, she is a master legislator, she is more worried in herself and the rest of the party. >> marie: after the georgia special, we talked here, a number said it's time -- they set it on television.

>> allen: who came up with the idea that this 30-year-old kid who didn't even live -- that's what i'm saying. someone is running the democratic party that has taken it further and further away. >> melissa: it's totally flipped in this country were anybody who works for a living has become a republican. it's a very wealthy 1% that controls the democratic party. nancy pelosi, hillary clinton, it's hollywood, it's silicon valley, it's the wealthy people and people who they enslaved to be democratic voters because they are dependent on the government for their very livelihood. when you realize that, you won't get the people who work for the them. >> dagen: nancy pelosi still has that job because she raised

half a billion dollars for democratic races. i was watching and there is nancy pelosi with chuck schumer talking about we need a $15 minimum wage and we need to go after big businesses. i don't know how far back they had to get those ideas. >> harris: if you look at the messaging and the man that we know who created that pizza, papa john's, it wasn't built on $15 an hour, it was built on the young people who wanted jobs and were hungry, not just for the pizza, but to get something bigger and better. >> marie: all of us agree that the current democratic leadership isn't working. i am encouraging my party to look at people like joe crowley

from queens who could be nancy pelosi, people like that, people like seth moulton, our party needs to look at those people. that's what i'm trying to get them to do. >> harris: try to find some people who have been into a waffle house in the last 15 years, maybe. marie just acquired her candidacy. it will be right back, more "outnumbered" when we come back. hi.

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>> are big thanks to colonel west for being here. we are outnumbered over time on . marie harp just said under some circumstances if her party doesn't get it together, she's going to write in john kasich. tune in. >> a fox news alert. will today be the day the dow hits 22,000? major record territory taking your 401(k) with them as corporate earnings overall have been better than expected. >> investors shrugging off the grid lough in our nation's capital while donald trump calcination's climb. we are covering all the news happening now. >> general kelly will go down in terms of the position of chief of staff, one of the greatest ever. >> jon: president trump hailing his selection of john kelly to bring some order to the west wing. the former homeland security secretary has a lot on hi