a scolding that they would rather avoid. i did it. i got it n i was almost out of time. good to have you with us. food for thought t we'll see you back here at 7:00. tucker carlson up next! [ music playing ] . >> tucker: good evening and welcome to tucker carlson tonight. the emmy awards aired last night in prime time. if you didn't watch you weren't alone. by the way we don't judge. even by the usual standards of show business last night's show was identity politics over art and the entertainment even before it began. an actress told reporters she was planning to judge the nominees solely on the basis of their skin color and she will wasn't the only one. >> who are you rooting for tonight? >> i'm rooting for everybody black. >> i want to thank trump for making black people number one on the most oppressed list.

he's the reason i'm probably up here. >> tucker: those comments didn't seem to raise an eyebrow. of course they didn't, it's 2017 so we're used to open race hostility from the left. so used to it that many of you don't even notice t the entire show was close to that. here is a selection. >> unlike the presidency, emmy's go to the winner of the popular vote. >> i suppose i should say at long last mr. president here is your emmy. >> imagine if your president was not beloved by nazis. >> in 2017 we still refuse to be -- >> so celebrities are liberal, they don't like trump. that's not what is striking here. last night's show wasn't about trump it was an expression of the contempt america' ruling class has for the rest of the

country, for the sip codes they don't live in. the middle class elected donald trump last november, last night hollywood denounced them for doing it. you could have heard the same contempt at any google board meeting or facebook meeting. watching now is no longer a debate between conservatives and liberals. it's an unbridge able divide between those who have reaped the massive benefits and the rest of the country, which is not. the winners imagine that they deserve it. they're simply better and more deserving than everybody else. the people beneath them deserve what they get, too, they're disgusting. they voted for donald trump. dismissing trump voters as evil allows those actors and tech mobiles in board rooms to sustain the current very warped system and still believe they're

not just good people but the very best people. last night's show also exposed something else. many of america's famous artists are hacks. their shows are did you mean. their art is crap. they're not impressive. the weekly sank at this money fest won best variety series. in what world? utterly distorted world. a place where everybody has to pretend that he writes well. a country where the hand maiden's tale is ignored because the message is so important at a critical time like this. that show won five awards last night, of course it did. politics corrupts art. turning free thinkers into robots and beauty into propaganda, we should not be surprised. wendy is a professor at john's hopkins. thank you for coming on. >> thank you for having me.

>> tucker: i'm not wining that hollywood is liberal, knew. that i'm bothered by the distorting effect that politics has on art. and i fear that no one on stage last night was even allowed to offer a contrary opinion. not just about trump but about america itself. like there's an orthodox i that produces really crappy art that bothers me. >> as americans it's okay for us to be critical of our press dent. >> tucker: i agree. amen. >> president trump is not beyond reproach. as entertain percent and comedians they use real life to entertain. we see that take center stage when we see alec baldwin winning an emmy for his portrayal of donald trump. we see indicate mckin son winning a portrayal of hillary clinton and kellyanne conway. when the cell will he where i at

this commander-in-chief you cannot be mad when he is the center stage and brunt of all jokes. >> tucker: i'm not mad, i understand it's funny, some of of it is funny. it bothers me that there's political affirmative action at work. hand maids tail? are you serious? wins five awards. not because "the story" is convincing or elevating or interesting or anything other than wooden and did you mean because it is but it's like an alagory that's important. that dee values art. do you see? >> no, art is what we make it [ laughter ] >> it's true. beauty has the ability to be interpreted differently based on who views it. >> tucker: that's true. there's a subjective element but there's an idea of excellence. you shouldn't be awarded today now they the same words and have the gall to call yourself an

artist or free thinker. >> what the problem, what they said on the emmy's or when they're acting or portraying their is that right. >> i think the whole thing is distorted. i'm not against mocking this or any other president. but you have to subscribe to a certain world view. that's the opposite of free thinking. they're like bureaucrats. >> there are people in hollywood who have different thinking, whether you look at caitlyn jenner, there are people who have different thinking. not everyone in hollywood is liberal. the beautiful of our country is diversity, who we are and how we think. at the end of the day no one ideology should lead us whether in hollywood or not. >> tucker: i agree with that. i believe in diversity in the true sense, judge people by what they do, not by where they were born or how they look. with that in mind the actress who said she was rooting for

anyone who was black, i thought i don't think she should be in jail for it, but i would say that's disgusting. you should treat people as individuals. nobody said anything about it. why? >> nothing the show which is diverse. i cannot speak for her, because i'm not in her head. but seeing the die service of her show she's saying she wants to see individuals win and have an it diverse background when it comes to 'em it's. yesterday we saw the first african american win for writing an african american play. >> tucker: i'm not against the show or against her. it seems the opposite of diverse. she's saying i want people of one specific color to win. that is the opposite of diversity. it also suggests that a person's color is the most important thing about that person. i just don't believe that and i hope nobody else does because it's wrong. >> our country wasn't founded on

that. it matters, us coming together. not being in her head, but just seeing her art form time and time again she is a diverse thinker and she was basically trying to say it will be great if we escape from the norm and we have individuals who represent all walks of life walking across that stage. >> tucker: she only mentioned one group. i think it's an it device sieve hand i. >> the first muslim won an award. >> tucker: i think looking at the world like that gets you to civil war. i think you should look at people first as individuals. what does this person do? what does he believe? >> who is her merit. >> tucker: as soon as you see people as indistinguishable that's when people start hating each other. >> we can't be the victim. >> tucker: you don't see it as device sieve? >> looking at her artwork and art product i have seen

diversity and inclusion. i believe she was trying to say we want to see people walk across that stage. >> tucker: she the meant the exact opposite of what she said? >> you should bring her on the show. >> tucker: i don't want to hassle this person about whom i know nothing. she seems a metaphor, that i'm rooting for my group or team or tribe and i just think that we should think of each other as americans. finally the 'em it's, the numbers are going down. e msnbc it makes me wonder, they don't care that americans don't want to watch their political lectures but they keep giving the same lectures, why do you think that is? >> if you look at the totality of the situation, the numbers did go down. however the numbers went down in 2016 and it was a 5% drop from the numbers in 2015, we're seeing not just that show but

award shows across the board, i would appeal to the people that run the shows and say listen the award viewer ship is going down. what happened during the obama administration the awards were going down. this year's has the same viewer ship as last years. >> tucker: maybe america just doesn't have an appetite for watching rich people give themselves awards. >> if you are deserving of an award you should get one, whether you're rich or not, tucker. >> tucker: okay. hand maids tale, it's a parody. >> i heard it's great. >> tucker: joy villa is a singer, song writer who wore a donald trump themed gown to the grammy awards and she joins us tonight. >> hi tucker. >> tucker: what would have happened if you wore that outfit

last night in the. >> they would have lambasted me. they lambasted me after the graham it's. wendy who was just on, she's too afraid it say izza is bordering on racism, saying she's only going to support people who are black. that's when diversity goes way too far. it's the opposite of diverse sit. it's i'm going to support my people because that's what i should do right now. hollywood has such a bloated ego about themselves. they think anything they say will be taken straightforward and really we're laughing at them. i think they're mad. >> tucker: that's my question. what do i know? it's not my world at all. it's more yours. >> yeah. >> tucker: do you think when they come off a show like last night they think that was really important work we did? we really helped america understand where we are? >> absolutely. tucker they are patting themselves on the back. they're drinking whiskey shots saying you were great, no you were great, no you were great, we were all great.

>> tucker: is that really true? [ laughter ] >> yes. absolutely. >> tucker: your worse nightmare. what a bunch of losers. >> if you think any different than you are lambasted and put in the corner and you are no longer allowed to play ball. that's why this diversity line is a lie. the diversity of color, diversity of texture of flavor of all these different cull sewers but not diversity of thought as we saw in the 'em it's, if you hate trump you get a prize, if you love trump you get an award. >> tucker: how can you be creative if you are told what the conclusion has to be? >> it totally should tucker, that's the thing, there is no more creativity. we saw remake after remake, see equals, books being made into movies because there's no free thought. no free thinking and no artistry. honestly hollywood is rehashing the same old thing and patting

themselves on it. it was a sgufting display of below the he didness that we saw last night. >> tucker: i want to the make sure rich people get enough awards. the testimony mows stick audience is shrinking but they're sustained by the international audience? i guess it bothers me that this is the world' window into america, that this is the stuff that people see? international they're going to stop buying the bs. i think all their numbers are going down. they're tanking. people are not buying this any more. it's the same old story being sold. honestly i think for rental lengths are going to be rising ahead of us. they're starting to think outside the box. they have less free speech than us, we're supposed to be the country of the first amendment. in hollywood they no longer care about that. >> tucker: you are the bravest, wearing a trump outfit for an

award show, that's like ordering a rib eye at a convenientlying attorney banquet. >> thank you, tucker. >> tucker: hurricanes marie and irma weren't enough. hurricane maria is headed straight for the caribbean tonight. >> you've asked some questions. you've asked some questions. thank you. thank you. >> tucker: illegal i am mygation activists, if there is such a thing, picked a fight with democratic leader nancy pelosi. what were they angry about? we'll show you next. it's like nothing you've seen.

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>> tucker: this is a fox news alert. 2017 devastating hurricane season continues. hurricane maria barrelling toward puerto rico at this hour. it's expected to approach puerto rico by wednesday morning. it could add to the devastation already caused by hurricane irma. we'll track it and bring you the latest. so many deadly storms in the past. many have sought to make a political point or draw a connection between them. many are saying the storms are proof of global warming. never mind their lectures that weather is not climate when it's cold or stormy. john stossel is being denounced as a denier. he joins us to explain. john you're seeing this everywhere. we have hurricanes,

unprecedented hurricane season because of climate change. is that true? >> no. even the government says we don't have information to prove that. it's premature to conclude they've had a detectable effect. yet the media is filled with that. they say climate proves climate change is real. they say man made climate change is real. we don't know how much man did. but they just say it. >> tucker: but doesn't that. i have the mean wait a second f. you ask critical questions, and ask for data in order to come to conclusions that makes you i think ale denier, right? >> well i think because i work at fox, everything makes me a denier. but, and i am a denier of part of it. climate change is four things, is the climate changing? yes. does man play a part? i would say probably, maybe a small part.

is it going to be a crisis? it might be. it's possible. but the most important one, four, is anything we do now going to make any significant difference? and there, no. i am a denier. because we're just wasting money and hurting poor people doing the stuff we did under president obama and before him. >> tucker: but i mean the argument is that to acts is a moral imperative and it's immoral not to the act. do you buy that? >> it's immoral to act if it isn't going it make much difference, if it makes it harder for poor people to live. if it raises the price of energy that really hurts people. it might be a moral imperative to act on ma layer i can't or disin tear ri, real problems we have now but we don't know about climate change. but buying all the priuses, if everybody followed the paris agreement, even proponents admit

it would make the slightest difference. >> tucker: why does the debate about science have so many moral over tones? >> it's the new religion of the left. man poll lawsuits. man's carbon greedy industries. this has to hurt people. we have to fight this. this is their religion. >> tucker: can you think of any other species in science where asking questions is considered wrong? >> no. asking questions is good. there are no did you mean questions. >> tucker: right. isn't skepticism the essence of the scientific method? >> yes, it's beyond that now. everybody agrees. but they don't agree it's a crisis or that we could do anything about it. as a consumer reporter i have covered so many of these squares. >> tucker: right. >> pesticides are causing the cancer epidemic. y2k is going to make all the planes crash. they don't happen. >> tucker: can you think,

medicine is another branch of science. what would happen if you applied the same rules to medical research. anyone that asks questions is immoral and ought to be punished, what kind of medicines do you think we would develop? >> progress would stop. remember the researchers have an intent sieves to say this is a crisis f. we do this, it will make it better because then they get money. if they say we don't know or it might not make a difference, they don't get money. >> tucker: or this is incredibly complicated and we see part of the picture because that's the way life is. bottom line you're saying there is no consensus that climate change is responsible for more powerful hurricanes? >> that's what the -- i'm not the scientist who can make that decision but noa says it. >> tucker: interesting. john stossel, thank you for that. >> thanks tucker. >> tucker: good luck with the aftermath, blow back.

nancy pelosi is pushing amnesty for hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants. why is she under attack from the very same group? we'll have more for you next. >> you had your time. if you've been struggling with belly pain and constipation, and you're overwhelmed by everything you've tried-- all those laxatives, daily probiotics,

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just turn on cars.coms on tprice dropswant? and get real-time notifications that could help save you money. use cars.com and save. . >> tucker: now this video comes with a trigger warning. in it you will see a white woman

telling a group of people of color to be quiet so she can white explain to them. please cover your children's ears. >> for a long time we've been fighting the fight for the dreamers. [ crowd noise ] >> do you want to hear an answer or do you just want to shout? [ crowd noise ] >> yes. yes. yes. yes. yes i am. yes i am. you do not. you don't know what you're talking about. . >> tucker: the revolution always consumes itself. why were those people so mad at

pelosi? they're furious that she's negotiating with the president. they want total am me sis for 11 million immigrants. i van is the founder. thanks for coming on. >> i am a daca beneficiary and born a crime when i was immigrating here at nine months old. >> i guess what i find so strike bg that video and other things i've found in the last few weeks is the lack of gratitude and the hostility from people who are getting a pretty good deal from the united states apparently, people who are here illegally breaking u.s. law, getting benefits and yet seem hostile toward the united states. i never hear a single person say thank you. why not? i wonder. >> i believe that undocumented

immigrants, daca resip the yenlts are reacting to what's continuing to be done over years. they're talking about us but not talking to us. they're not including us in the conversation. this is something going to be addressed. both parties will be held accountable. people have something to refer to, records to indicate how promising these agreements can be. that's voting records. we're going to be holding people on both sides of the party who have voted against us. that's all we have. >> tucker: wait. wait. wait. hold on a moment. slow down. you're issuing a threat and i want to understand what that threat is. you're not an of u.s. citizen you're saying you and others are going to hold u.s. citizens accountable for not being nice for non u.s. citizens. >> undocumented citizens that live in these communities, we take great part in our community and ask to be represented. we are paying taxes, we are

contributing to the community and we ask for representation. >> tucker: by the way, i've always been very pro immigrant and am in still ways still and you're making me very anti-immigration by what you're saying because of its tone and because of the threat you just issues to people who don't see it your way. you're not a u.s. citizen. u.s. government exists to serve the needs and protect the needs of u.s. citizens, not to protect the needs of non-u.s. citizens. i think all countries are that way. do you see the distinction. >> do you understand taxation without representation? something that this country was founded on? i believe we're paying taxes and deserve to be represented. i'm not issuing any threat other than we are going to go ahead and no longer allow people that jeopardize our community behind our back. we want to have relief that includes our pair presents, brothers, uncles who don't fit the typical dreamer narrative

per se. >> tucker: why do you have a right to demand anything? let me be really clear for the fifth time. i'm sympathetic to at lat lot of the daca people but i'm more sympathetic to u.s. citizens because i am one. i don't understand on what grounds you make these demands. if i show up in another country and say i demand a political voice, benefits and respect. they would say buzz off pal, leave. you have no position to demand those things. do you see what i mean? >> i understand. the context of the video you're referring to. those are daca beneficiaries. 800,000 which are in limbo. there isn't anything happening in the next six months. theory acting to. that these two or three people very much well involved in our communities, teaching our children, police officers, fire men, paramedics, even in the recent hurricane they were

putting their lives on the line. >> tucker: that's just totally nonsense. some of them are great people. some of them are criminals and drug dealers, they're people. not all of them are future medal of honor recipients. let's stop with the propaganda. i'm asking what citizenship means and the rights of people from other countries to demand things from a country that's not theirs. it's an entitled posture for you to take it. i the demand this. on what grounds? >> they contribute to this country. they are not new. and that applies to every population. i know plenty of good citizens and bad citizens. >> tucker: i agree with you. but there are citizens and non-sit sense. that's the distinction that the left is seeking to erase. we're all the same. and my point is, no, the point

of a government is to look out for the citizens, that's why a citizen is different from a non-citizen. you're subject to the laws of and also benefitting from the protections of a government. so like everyone in the world who wants to come to the united states can show up, go on benefits, reap the benefits of our society. why would we allow that? >> nobody is actually doing that. there is no line right now for anyone in this country to get behind. there are applications that people can apply for. we're talking about millions of people who are already here. 800,000 daca beneficiaries who are in limbo. there is no line to get behind. the immigration systemless currently processing applications from 1999 something we have no control over. >> tucker: but that's not really up to you to like or dislike because you don't have grounds for that. look i would concede some of the daca kids are a little different

because they came here as small children as you did. for the 11 to 15 million people who snuck into the country, using forged documents to work undercutting the wages of american citizens, how do they get to tell me the i want this, i demand that? what? why would i normal citizen take that seriously? >> i'm one of the examples of millions who have been here for decades, contributing. >> tucker: these are major distinctions that you're ignoring. you think that all your relatives. >> there's push and pull factors for this i am my indication. we are the largest economy. also the push back. >> tucker: that's, you know what that's just garbage. you learned that in some school you went to. we have almost 100 million citizens not working. >> let's put it in perspective. there are 320 million u.s. population. are you going to tell me 3.5%

are responsible for the other close to 95%? >> tucker: you know that's another ludicrous argument. i don't think that. >> that's what people like you are making. >> tucker: i don't know who people like me are. learn how to like follow a rational train of thought. i'm not saying that, i've never said. that i think americans are responsible for most of their own problems. importing millions of low workers into this country every year doesn't work, and you don't care. google has shown its willingness to crack down on peach. why are they opposing a bill aimed at going after human trafficking? plus every week brings us new examples of luna sir from antifa? some people say the movement doesn't exactly exist.

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. >> tucker: right now the u.s. senate is considering a bill that will intended to combat a bill against human trafficking, the tech giant google, mary campaigns against human trafficking, she says google has played a key roll. mary, thanks for coming on. >> tucker, nice to be here. >> i'll acknowledge nobody is for human trafficking and i'm not sure i fully understand the ramifications of this bill. i want to get to google's roll and big tech's role in all of this. >> we asked ourselves the very same question. when we dove into this topic we were looking at back page which has been determined to be the go-to site for commercial sites

of all kinds chewing children. several children who were victimize ed, sold and bought, we were serially raped at the ages of 13, 14 and 15 sued back page to determine if they were culpable in any way. we started reading the court briefings and we noticed there were voluminous briefings filed by the electronic foundation. i scratched my head and said who could be filing in support of back page. a quick google search you'll find google is the primary funder of both organizations. it stands to reason that google would be concerned about opening up any kind of liability for online content. right? it is the wild west on line. >> tucker: right. >> and the back pages of the world have been shielded by an outdated internet law. right? section 230 of the

communications decency act which was passed 20 years ago. it really the meant that facebook and twitter couldn't be sued for stuff people might say. it made sense, right? >> tucker: right. >> there were no tools to monitor content. fast forward 20 years and there were crimes that are simply unimaginable that have moved online. yet you've got this law that is completely outdated, hasn't been tweaked, and it's simply not appropriate to continue business as usual with the wild west on line. we have discovered that kind of stunningly for a company whose motto is don't be evil, that google has pushed so hard to keep the wild west in place, that it has allied itself with back page t goes beyond more co complici complicity. in addition to contributing to back page's legal defense we

know that google lawyers have met with back page lawyers to talk about tactics and best practices. and it's really shocking on really the lack of ethics around this issue for a company that is really so revered. >> tucker: it's so interesting that so many tech companies are complies sit in shutting down speech in other countries, right? they're complies sit with the chinese government for example, facebook and shutting down political dissent in this country and drawing a line in the sand on this? >> well you see them last week start to remove alt-right speech. if they're inciting violence that's a good laudable thing. when it comes to section trafficking you can google buy a child for section and within moments a child can be delivered to your home. and that is the fundamental problem. and google is right now, it is

imperative for them to be on the right side of the issue. now google does fund antitrafficing organizations. again laudable. however when you looks at the timing it of when they began fund pg antitrafficing organizations it coincides with activists looking to tweak this law that has shielded back page. why is it still legal in 2017 to host advertisements selling children? it is child abuse. it is serial rape and it's protected. and that just simply can't go on. >> tucker: really quickly, i'm pretty hard line on speech, i think everybody should be. these are actions. there's a huge difference. >> that's a great distinction. >> tucker: here is my question. could you host an ad selling illegal weapons? machine guns? you couldn't, right? >> you would think you the

couldn't. you the couldn't -- the american public would never stand for a murder for hire site. >> tucker: exactly. >> children for sale, it's kind of sort of consensual prostitution. people have no idea how this crime has changed and it's really remarkable. before you let me go, the other thing is that this law that there's a hearing tomorrow on the hill it has nothing to do with speech. jane doe one, two and three sued back page in boston. the court found even in back page had participated n. was a co. condition su conspirator of the crime of section trafficking it go had no choice but to dismiss this lawsuit. the first circuit called on the children and said go to congress. for google to now suggest that this is an assault on free speech that the internet is going to break, what google is concerned about -- >> tucker: to lecture us on free

speech? it's a little much. mary that was super interesting. thanks for coming on. >> thank you for having me. i really appreciate it. >> tucker: we had an an at this at that professor on this show last week, antifa, some people claima claimant it doesn't exist, it's fake news. more on that coming up next. s. only from allstate. switching to allstate is worth it. tcan help protect you from the unpredictable. and the distracted. its cameras, radar and sensors can help prevent just about any surprise. well, almost. lease the gle350 for $609 a month at your local mercedes-benz dealer.

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future dead cops. that tweet was so over the top it brought new york please and bill did i blows yes together. we never root for anybody's firing but it is worth asking the obvious question who hired a nut case like this guy in the first case? why was he teaching kids and this is relevant to you, how many people just like him are still out there teaching your kids right now? answer, a lot of them. despite professor isaac son and routine violence in portland and berkeley, it's a fever dream invented by us has been suggested. >> his obsession with antifa, i don't understand. he has an unhealthy obsession with antifa and maybe it's because fox news, i watch fox news for years lately they are obsessed with antifa and with stories about race, and

pitting -- is the president being manipulated by fox news on these stories? >> old done lemon. he's not alone, whoopi goldberg says antifa isn't over blown, it's an out right fabrication. >> antifa is one of the things the right came up with as a catch phrase so you can say there's violence on the other side. but i don't remember violent demonstrations before the jam who is in now got in. oftentimes i've found that sometimes the side that is stretching the loudest has sort of original straight this so they can complain about it. >> tucker: who watches that show? >> now to sort out what is real and fake, we're joined by town ha hall.com senior column any of the kurt. is it possible? i've heard people suggest this

that antifa are all town ha hall.com readers beneath the mask. >> i like to mask up and go beat people in the head with a bike lock. really. it's all an illusion, tucker. you're pulling the strings on the president, you're convincing him there's not crowds of antias you bur ban rich kids acting out fantasies on our streets, no, it's all an illusion. i've had run-ins with done lemon in the past. after listening to what he said you always have to wonder, has he been drinking again in after hearing him say that i have kind of hope he has. that's the only possible explanation for that spring of words that were so stupid my head is still spinning, i don't know if i can drive home. >> tucker: i can't help myself, i still like done lemon, i don't think he's responsible for what he said.

there's a condition sieve radio host who took a ton of heat for suggesting that one tragedy was made up, that there were actors involved in it. i hear mainstream media figures making the same argument, this is left wing conspiracy that they're actually right wingers? i think it's insane. >> it's right up there with feature the can't melt steel as the kind of idiotic insight that makes me want to completely the redo our education system from k to graduate school. how did you mean do they think we are? i know how did you mean the people who follow them are, and they're right. how did you mean do they have think us normal people are? do they think we think this is happening. >> tucker:. >> tucker: what's going to happen when you turn it over to lunatics. thanks kurt. >> thanks for having me. >> we'll be right back.

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>> tucker: unexpected fox news alert. arbitron campaign manager paul manafort was wiretapped by the barack obama administration both before and after the 2016 election. it needed approval from top justice department officials of the obama administration. according to cnn, suggesting he was wiretapped by the obama people in trump tower may have been true all along and may have been occurring for much of the 2016 election. if that's true, huge and shocking story. inapplicable subversion of democracy. we will be on that tomorrow. that's about it for us tonight. tune in every night at 8:00 for the show that is the sworn enemy of lying, pomposity, smugness and groupthink. get ready for our new lineup. "the five" heads back to 5:00.

"hannity" moves to 9:00 right after us and the primetime debut of our friend, laura ingraham is joining the lineup next month. it should be a good show. don't miss it. have a good night. here's "the five." >> dana: hello, everyone. i am dana perino. along with kimberly gulf hall, juan williams, greg gutfeld, and jesse watters. it's 9:00 in new york city and this is "the five." some breaking developments tonight, there is a report that the fbi wiretapped former truck campaign manager paul manafort. both before and after the election. for more on this stunning story, let's bring in ed henry in washington. >> the leaks keep on coming. not just about the possibility of an indictment coming from paul manafort but also new informatioin