capitol hill. we'll keep you up-to-date on that, as well. in the meantime, most-watched, trusted, and most grateful you spent the evening with us. good night from washington. i'm shannon bream. ♪ ♪ >> tucker: good evening, and welcome to "tucker carlson tonight." as you doubtless know, the most controversial document in america remains totally mysterious. it is only four pages long. it is classified. that means while many are talking about it, and they are, virtually nobody has read it. this memo prepared by the housea intelligence committee apparently describes surveillance of americante citizens in this country by our own intelligence and law enforcement agencies. several republicans who have seen the document say it exposes massive and terrifying abuses of our civil liberties presumablyy committed for political gain. they say the memo shows how the obama administration used the

foreign a intelligence surveillance act not to protect this country from foreign threats like terror, which is its purpose, but to spy on rival campaigns, the trump campaign in particular, and to create a pretext for the current independent counsel investigation, one that has mesmerized our class and paralyzed our government, even today the president was responding to questions on it.nd watch. >> one more quick one. >> i only repeat for the purposes of making sure you understand. >> one more quick one. do you think robert mueller would be fair to you? >> we're going to find out. here is what we'll say, and everyone says. no collusion. there is no collusion. now they are saying, oh, well, did he fight back? done. fight back? oh, it's obstruction. so here's the thing, i hope so. >> how do you define collusion? >> you're going to define it for me, okay? i can tell you. there's no collusion.

i couldn't have cared less about russians having to do with myer campaign. >> tucker: that's all we talk about in washington pretty much. if it turns out that this whole investigation is a politically motivated sham, that will be newsworthy. in the words of onein sitting member of congress, "when this memo comes out, people will go to jail." is the memo that damning? honestly, we don't know. we have no idea. like pretty much everyone else washington, we haven't read a word of it. but we take the idea seriously, and why wouldn't we? h the most destabilizing thing any government can do is use law enforcement as a political weapon. that is when the police become the secret police. suddenly you are no longer living in a free country. it happens all the time in other places. our founders worried about that happening here. the rest of us ought to be worried too.th a rogue fbi is a far bigger threat to you and your family than any buffoonish tweet from the oval office.e. it could wreck everything we've built here. this is not a story we ought to ignore.

the public deserves to know,t it needs to know what is in that memo. this is our government. we have a right to know if it is representing us or lying to our faces. if there is corruption, expose that corruption. i transparency is the only antidote. you would think everyone would agree with that sentiment. it's pretty commonplace. i when you think about it, what is the counterargument against that? secrecy is good? people shouldn't know if their government is corrupt?at more darkness and deception, please. even in washington, you can't say those things out loud, though many would like to, trust me. so instead democrats on the hill and their many handmaidens in the media that have a new argument, you're not allowed to know what is in that is in that memo because russia. that is what they are making, dianne feinstein and adam schife democrats both from a state of california, are warning that if you want to read that document, that memo, which by the way, was prepared by the u.s. government for american lawmakers, you are

somehow in league with the vladimir putin regime. yesterday, those two sent a letter claiming that calls to release the memo are "an ongoing attack by the russian government through kremlin-linked social media actors directly acting to intervene and influence our democratic process." got that? anyone asking for more transparency from this government, and that would include elected members of congress and this show, among others, is participating in a foreign propaganda campaign that hurts america. in other words, they are traitors. the implication of the letter is that twitter and facebook ought to do something to help, by the way, quickly, like censor theio accounts of anyone who wants to see the memo. you would think the media might have a big problem with that. for centuries, the media has fought efforts by politicians and those in power to hide unflattering information about themselves. that was noble work. it is the reason the press is mentioned in the first amendment. they are not doing that anymore. on television today, you heard famous anchors make the opposite case.

they suggested that calls to release the memo are simply tactics by right-wing craziese and vladimir putin to undermine america because they are unpatriotic. and that is when you knew it was over, the long and worthy tradition of journalists as watchdogs holding the powerful to account. it turns out that journalists have switched teams.s. they are with the powerful now. they would like you to shut the hell up.p. matt gaetz is a congressman representing florida. he joins us tonight. congressman, thank you for coming on. c >> good to be on, tucker. >> tucker: you have read this memo. assure us that it is not being oversold. you think this memo will change the conversation about how surveillance is used against american citizens? >> two things the american citizens should evaluate when they read this memo. you've got to evaluate the memo in the context of the five months of missing text messages between peter strzok and his mistress, lisa page. you can't evaluate those separately.en they have to be evaluated together. second thing --

>> tucker: let me stop you there. how are those connected exactly? >> tucker, i can't get into the specifics precisely, i can only say that i don't think it is an accident that strzok and page, who were volleying texts back more than a high school cheerleading squad, suddenly had a five-month black hole, right at the time that one would expect a conspiracy, to undermine theer appointment of robert mueller, conspicuously the same day that the strzok and page text messages come back online. no coincidence. the second thing you've got toot evaluate is the manner in which evidence presented to the court was corroborated. the problem with lies is they've got to keep telling them. you can't just tell one lie. you have to use otherhe lies to corroborate. it is my position that the the mueller probe is

interactively infected, it is built on a bad foundation, it should end immediately so we can focus on the real challenge of reforming the fbi and the department of justice so thathii could never happen again under a republican or democratic administration. >> tucker: that is right, it is a bipartisan concern. what you are suggesting is corruption so deep and menacing that every american ought to be really upset about it. can you pledge, as a membero of congress, that you will do everything you can to expose this and let people make their own decisions about whether it is appalling or not? but don't you think it isnd important for our citizens to have faith in their government and, in order to have that faith, they need more information soon? >> well, absolutely. i haven't been in congress for a very long time, but i don't think you solve a lot of problems by having members of congress meet with each other behind closed doors and share their outrage with each other. i think we have got to haveh sunlight, transparency, so we can all have a national debate about what type of government we want to have, what type of a surveillance system we want to have, what type of information has to corroborate the stuff

that is presented to courts before people's liberty is impaired. i think that is an important discussion to have, and i think the only way we are going to get there is by releasing this memo. the good news is, devin nunes and members of the committee on the republican side want to do that. the democrats are all over the place. i have a hard time keeping track of where they are. they vote against allowing members of congress to see it, then they now apparently have their own memo which is just a ludicrous proposition. >> tucker: it would be interesting. we can't successfully get any democrat on the show to explain the argument behind not releasing it. am i mistaken in remembering that the fisa law was just reauthorized? wouldn't have it been helpful to have this before that happened? >> would have preferred that, it is important to know that the reauthorization of fisa was not a blanket reauthorization. there were additional due process protections that were included. that was the 702 section of fisa that deals with overseas collection of intelligence, and when we release the memo, we will see how that interacts or

maybe doesn't interact. can't confirm or deny those details. >> tucker: the rest of us are getting really anxious, not because of partisan reasons, but because you want to trustt that your government law enforcement agencies aren't being used for political reasons, it is simple and important. when are we going to see the memo? >> i think we will see it within the next two weeks. the important thing is, nowwt democrats are making a claim that the memo is conclusory. i think chairman nunes is right. what supporting information can be released along with the memo that validates it? that will help us to have a more robust that allows us to have a more , fact-based discussion rather than just lobbing conclusions at one another and that is why that mama hasn't been released yet. i think the chairman and the committee are rightfully going through that process so that we don't disclose sources and methods or put americans who are downrange in any jeopardy but that we absolutely expose what i believe is a deep-seated corruption that has really undermined this presidency, unfortunately.

>> tucker: i think that is wise. the intel community specializes in releasing conclusions without telling you how they got there.i it does not inspire trust. congressman, thank you very much for coming on tonight. >> thank you, tucker. >> tucker: and you thought digital was forever, that's what they tell you. turns out it's not true when it comes to the federal government in the middle of a scandal. the fbi now says it lost thousands, somehow,f of text messages between peter strzok and lisa page relevant to the conversation we're having tonight. president trump just reacted to those missing messages just r moments ago. here's part of what he said. >> i do worry when i look at all of the things that you people don't report about with what is happening if you take a look at, you know, the five months worth of missing texts. that's a lot of missing texts,, and as i said yesterday, that's primetime. so you just sort of look at that and say, what's going on? you do sort of look at certain texts where they talk about insurance policies or insurance where they say they kind of things they're saying, you've got to be concerned.

>> tucker: not the first time the government has lost communicationsns central to an investigation. you may remember lois lerner and the irs and how 24,000 of her emails were accidentally deleted somehow and of course, hillary clinton's deleted emails. tom fitton is the president of judicial watch. he joins us for perspective. tom, my impression was, and our cyber security guys are always saying, if you write it down digitally, it never goes away. why is that not true for federal documents in these investigations? >> it is only true if it is convenient to withhold information from investigators and the american people. in the case of lois lerner, they told us, we didn't keep some of her emails. it turns out, there were backup tapes, we ended up getting a lot of those. with hillary clinton, they saidu well, there's nothing to give you. turns out, she had them all, tried to delete half of them, and we now are getting emails that she deleted or otherwisem, hid.

this is just a matter of lawaw enforcement going in and recovering this material that needs to be recovered or finding it where it is hidden. if i were the attorney r general of the united states, i would be very concerned about what the fbi did here and i would send in independent law enforcement like the u.s. marshals to secure and recover this evidence. a >> tucker: i am concerned. these are not favors that they are asking. if you are a member of congress on a committee investigating something or a citizen filing under the freedom of information act, you have a legal right to these democrats. if a government bureaucrat lies to you or withholds them, what is the penalty? >> could be obstruction of justice, obstruction ofe, congress, destruction of government property -- >> tucker: are charges ever brought on these grounds? >> they are if you're not hillary clinton. >> tucker: were they in the hillary clinton case or the lois lerner case? anyone go to jail for lying about that? >> no. >> tucker: what is your best guess here? i confess i'm not an expert in digital questions, but five months from an agency

that is famous for understanding digital matters work, what do you think the truth is? >> i think maybe there was a technical glitch but little interest in resolving it and little interest in resolving it still. it is only going to be resolved with significant law-enforcement interest. i don't think the fbi can be trusted to investigate itself,nt and this is why need independent law enforcement, and congress ought to start its own inquiry as well. these text messages about the activities of law enforcement agencies who have been implicated in massive abuses of power, have ruined the clinton investigation terms of its credibility, and this isn't -- this is about the mueller investigation. peter strzok at the center of this, the key investigator in the russian conclusion investigation. who knows what evidence he has gathered as a result of this k partisanship that has now been tainted. i think there is this race going on at this point where mueller is trying to get donald trump

interviewed before this memo comes out and before more text messages come out that further undermine his already really low quality investigation. >> tucker: the president could declassify it by the end of this show. >> click his heels three times, we could get the fisa warrant rather than relying on congress. >> tucker: we ought to. thank you. chris hahn, a radio show host, former aide to chuck schumer. chris, thanks for coming on. >> any time, tucker. >> tucker: i don't know what is in this memo, no one who has seen it has described it, they said it is a big deal. as a citizen, i want to know, i think that's my right. does this make me an unwitting tool of vladimir putin, as schiff and feinstein suggested yesterday? >> no, as long as you consider the source. this was written by devin nuness for devin nunes in an attempt to distract from the mueller investigation.fo we should be very concerned

about that. >> tucker: how do you know that? before you make that charge, how do you know? h >> oh, because we have known devin nunes' motives from the very beginning when he changed cars from being followed to the white house so that he could screw up this investigation. >> tucker: hold on a second. >> devin nunes is the reason why we have a special counsel. >> tucker: i'm not here to defend devin nunes or any member of congress, i'm just here as a citizen who is concerned that there may have been influence. fill in the blanks. i don't care, democrat, republican, i don't care, that subverts our government. why wouldn't i have a legitimate claim on knowing what the hell happened? i don't understand. >> i don't disagree with you on that point, tucker, not at all. usually when the intelligenceh committee tries to get to the bottom of this thing, these kinds of things, they do it in a nonpartisan way.mm the fact that this was done in the dark by republican staffers for the congressman who has a history of covering up for the president --

>> tucker: wait a second, have you seen the memo? have you seen the memo? >> i have not. >> tucker: the difference between us, i'm not speculating to his contents because i haven't seen it. you are. why don't we settle this debate by revealing it and we can make our own assessments. this is, after all, our country, it's a democracy, it's our government. i don't understand how anyone could justify holding this back from the american people. what is the answer?? >> i am not arguing to keep that hidden. i am just saying, when we see that memo, this is a memo like no other. usually the intelligence committee operates as a nonpartisan body. that has not happened under chairman nunes' leadership. >> tucker: first of all, let's be -- i have had that schiff character on the show who is totally untethered from reality, who called me, to my face, an agent of vladimir putin, but it's congress, it is a political body. again, why are democrats against releasing this to the public?

what is the answer? it's really simple.li why shouldn't we know? >> they go back and forth. they question the veracity of the intelligence used toto creae it and they think there should be some explanation behind that. that is what i can surmise. >> tucker: i'd like more information. i see the media figures beingse like, "oh, you are attacking the intel community." no, i'm not. i'm an american citizen asking to know what happened and these people are trying to keep it from me and i think it's fair to be mad about that. wouldn't you be if you were me? >> well, yeah. the congressman on before me, he was attacking the fbi, attacking their integrity. i think that is kind of crazy. >> tucker: i don't know, he's read the memo, let's see what's in it. i am an adult, i'm 48, i could make up my own mind, right? >> from what i've heard about this memo, a lot about strzoke and page and their conversations. quite frankly, strzok was attacking hillary, bernie, everybody in politics.

>> tucker: let's find out. i hope you will tell your friends on the hill,ol stop with the foot dragging, transparency is always the answer, the public can handle it, treat us like adults, and give us the document and stop this partisan nonsense. i'm with you on that. chris hahn. >> if we're bipartisan, we're good. >> tucker: i agree with you there. chris, thanks a lot. the doj stepping up its offense against sanctuary cities, threatening almost two dozen of, them with subpoenas. we've got someone who helps run in a city in california who supports the sanctuary policy w and joins us next. plus, in today's world, in case you haven't noticed, everyone is required to lie all the time. professor jordan peterson refuses to lie ever, so, of course, the left hates him. he is here just ahead. ♪

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to give small businesses more. call 1-800-501-6000 today. ♪ >> tucker: the department of justice threatened 23 sanctuary cities, counties, and states with subpoenas if they don't turn over certain records. in response, new york mayor bill de blasio and several other city leaders boycotted the scheduled meeting with the president at the white house today. david campos, a former member of the san francisco board of supervisors, joins us today. thanks for coming on.em >> thank you very much. i am here as deputy county executive for the county o of santa clara. >> tucker: great county. because you have that official role in california, let me ask you this. your attorney general announced that employers in the state who cooperate with federal immigration authorities will be prosecuted by the state of i california which, apparently, now its own country. will you participate in this? if you find in your county

employers collaborated with the u.s. government on immigration law, will you turn them into the state of california for prosecution? >> i think i'm good enough ant lawyer to know that before i answer that, i would have to look at the specifics of that. what i can tell you is about the county of santa clara, we are proud to call ourselves a constitutional county that is trying to follow the letter and the spirit of the u.s. constitution, and that is why when it comes to immigration that we are very clear that weco are here to do the job that is outlined for us by the u.s. constitution. we actually have sued the trump administration twice and succeeded in every time where they have attempted to predicate federal funding to force counties like santa clara to be in the business of enforcing immigration law and, with all due respect, we believe there is a role for the federal government and there is a role for jurisdictions like santa clara -- >> tucker: since you are a lawyer who helps run a big county in the biggest state,

answer this. is it consistent with readings of the constitution ratified by the supreme court that a state would actively work to undermine federal law? i'll answer for you. no, actually. no. that has not happened since the civil war. so what is your take on that as a county official and a lawyer? >> well, you know, i don't think that i should be in the business of telling the state or the federal government how to do the job. likewise, i don't think they should tell us how to do our job. i have an order here that was issued in the northern district of california where the federal district court basically told president trump and his department of justice, with all due respect, sir, you cannot force counties likee santa clara to do your job. that is not their role. >> tucker: we are arguing parallel conversations. i'm not asking, do you have a duty to do your job. i'm asking you whether you are allowed, as an official of the state of california, to actively undermine federal law and prosecute californians who follow it.

really simple. and you know, because you are an attorney, i am asking you, would you do that if you were ordered by the attorney general of your state to help prosecute somebody or aid in the prosecution of a california citizen, because he followed federal law, would you participate in that? >> well, look, again, under i don't know the specifics of this program -- >> tucker: yes, you do. you are a state official. this is something you should think about, because we are moving towards a constitutional crisis really fast, as you know, as a lawyer. you believe, obviously, that having more undocumented immigrants, illegal aliens, whatever, people who aren't legally supposed to be here, in your county is a good thing. have you done an economic impact study on immigration in santa clara county? >> let me tell you, mr. carlson, and i thank you for the opportunity, it is a personal issue for me. my parents brought me here undocumented as a child. i was 14.

and what i can tell you is that, when i came here, it wasn't my choice, but i made a point of trying to be a productive member -- >> tucker: i don't want to be rude. i think you have done great. i think that's great. i'm not attacking you personally. there are a lot of immigrants like you who are impressive. but there are also 330 million americans who are already citizens, and i think it is fair to ask, what effect does this have on them. a if you study the economic effect of immigration on your county, and if you haven't, and i know you haven't, i wanted to tell me why you haven't. >> we believe thatat the immigrants that are part of our county are an asset to our county. >> tucker: but do you know that? t have you studied that? why wouldn't you study that rather than just guess? >> if you look at the contributions that immigrants make on a daily basis, businesses -- >> tucker: do you treat your medical care the same way? i'm sure this job works because it looks like it does.

>> studies have been made for jurisdictions, forcing immigration law, actually safer, and we are -- >> tucker: you haven't done any studies on it because you haven't. >> you have to stop demonizing any one group. >> tucker: i could do with a little less moralizing and a little more care to the effect of these policies on actual people based on numbers and social science, which you could do but are choosing not to. mr. campos, thank you. daca protesters aren't just blocking disneyland, now they are harassing lawmakers, wait till you see what happened yesterday. pretty over-the-top, watch. ♪ kind of looks like a monster coming to eat ya. holy smokes. that is awesome. strong. you got the basic, and you got the beefy. i just think it looks mean. incredible. no way. start your year off strong a new chevy truck. get a total value of over $9,600 on this silverado all star

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i'm just surprised it means in my kitchen. so that means no breakfast? voya. helping you to and through retirement. >> tucker: you're probably pretty familiar with the drill >> tucker: you're probably pretty familiar with the drill by now.. daca beneficiaries embody the americanca dream. they are the best america has to offer. in fact, they are better and more law-abiding than you are. in fact, if anything, you are the one who ought to be deported so a more deserving daca person can get your house. some daca beneficiaries already believe that and are taking that to heart. a group recently showed up at chuck schumer's house where he lives to harass him for not giving them full amnesty with benefits. just the latest case of illegal immigrants making themselves unpleasant in a bid for citizenship. here are a few others. [crowd chanting] >> we want to let him sleep! >> if he won't let us dream!

>> no dream... >> no deal! >> [bleep]. [crowd chanting] >> we fight the fight for the dreamers. do you want to listen or do you want to shout? hey, stop it! just stop it now. just stop it now. just stop it now. >> tucker: leonard lance, a congressman representing new jersey, signed an open letter advocating for amnesty for daca recipients.ap thanks for coming on. >> thank you for having me. justcker: presumably you saw the tape we played. why would you let any person like that into the country?

why would you do that? >> i think we need reform of daca, but we also need border security, ending chain migration, and ending the lottery system we have for visa programs. i think this has to be a package, and i think we should not have a situation where you only address daca, we have to address greater border security. >> tucker: but there have been all of these demonstrations where people who are not here legally jump up and down, make threats, calling people racist, block disneyland, show up at offices, show up in front of chuck schumer's house. why does no one love the country enough to find out who these people are and deport every last one of them, like, by 10:00 tonight? why wouldn't we do that? >> i don't think we should deport young people who came here as infants or children. i do think that in order to address the issue, we have to do it -- >> tucker: what if they are horrible? >> regarding border security as well, i think that is the onlysl legislation that will pass

congress. >> tucker: again, as i said a thousand times, i feel sorry for a lot of thehe daca recipients. i don't think they had anything to do this with this. the fact is, we are letting them stay because we are super nice, not because we are convinced they are going to help the country, but if they are actively hostile to the country and its traditions and its lawmakers, why in the world would we reward anyone like that with something as precious as citizenship?n >> some have demonstrated in my office, and i try to indicate to those who have come into my office that this has to be part of a comprehensive package. i also think that the president is accurate and he will lay out in his parameters on monday, and the president has said that he is willing to take heat on this so long, tucker, as it is part of a larger whole, including greater border security. i don't want to be in a situation 20 years from now where we have to revisit this because of lack of border security. i >> tucker: when they came to your office, did you think, wait a second, get the hell out ofor here, a, you have no right to participate in our political system because you're here

illegally, that is reserved for citizens, that privilege.pa did that occur? >> i welcome those who come into my office, but i explain to all who come into our office, on o this issue, there has to be in agreement that includes border security. certainly reforming chain migration and the visa lottery program, these are major components of part of a largerer whole. certainly i don't think we should have shut down government as the democrats did this past weekend on this issue. >> tucker: candidly, between you and me, does it worry you, just as an american, that there are people here who have literally legally no right to bo here who are so entitled and angry and hostile that they would scream at our lawmakers and demand citizenship which they don't deserve and they are not legally entitled to? does that bother you that they would have that attitude? >> i do not like anybody who believes in a sense ofha entitlement, and that is not the way i conduct my responsibilities, and i

certainly think there should be recognition that we have to secure our borders. >> tucker: okay,y, congressman, thank you. >> thank you. >> tucker: more than 1,000 private jets are assembling in davos, switzerland. what is on the agenda? global warming, of course. your electricity bills goes up to offset their private jets. quite a deal. more on that next. ♪ (vo) i was born during the winter of '77.

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>> tucker: president trump just boarded air force one, headed to davos, resort town in switzerland, for the worldnt economic forum. that happened about 60 seconds ago. one of the biggest topics is global warming, but that comes with a huge helping of irony dripping all over it. the climate cognoscenti of davos are arriving in more than 1,000 private jets but how could that be? the founding editor of climate progress joins us tonight. thanks for coming on.

>> thank you for having me. >> tucker: it is one of those stories i couldn't resist. it seems to me if you really believe that global warming is an existential threat to humanity, life on earth, you probably wouldn't be flying around on a private plane, would you? >> i'm glad we are in agreement that climate change is an existential threat to humanity. >> tucker: i'm not sure thate it is, but the people in davos are sure of it, so why are they flying in these planes? >> if you want to put things in context, all of the air travel for everybody going to davos equals about one second of total annual global emissions. >> tucker: i guess it depends on how you look at it. i'm not insisting people don't travel because of global warming. so if you fly in a private plane for ten hours, you are using 3264 liters of fuel. if you fly commercial, you're using 346 liters of fuel. l so it's 10x. how is that justifiable if you believe that global warming is

real and a present danger? >> do you believe that global d warming is real and a present danger? if you don't, what is the point of discussing? >> tucker: here is exactly the point. the people who are flying into davos make the policies that the rest of us live under, and those policies will have costs for ordinary people in the form of higher utility bills, for example, and it looks to me like the davos elite are basically using the rest of us as a carbon offset. you pay more in your electricity bill every month so i get to fly on a private plane to a swiss ski resort. you can see why that --ri >> i'm not a fan of the elite. they are the biggest polluters, the richest people. they own the most stuff. i certainly agree with you that everybody needs to do their fair share. but the most important thing is that the governments of the world take action, and at least the global elite in every single country but maybe this one is committed to reducing global emissions. >> tucker: that is not true,

having traveled around the world and seen countless tire fires in progress in downtowns around the world, you can talk -- and this is my point. you can talk all you want about global warming as a threat, but if you're letting tire fires go burn in the middle of your city and you're flying on a private plane to switzerland using two and a half years worth of gas, you are not real, it's not serious, it's fake. >> you're not serious when you're the united states and donald trump is the only world leader who has said, we are not going to join the rest of the world in reducing pollution. you understand that 200 nations in paris back on december 15th, 2015, said that climate change is something that we are going to have strong action, but only the united states -- >> tucker: it was fake and it would have allowed the two

biggest polluters, china and india, to keep polluting, and indeed, increase their mission levels for years to come. you are ratifying my suspicion, this is about punishing america. why won't you look in the camera and say, any leader flying into davos on a g5 ought to be ashamed? >> i think anybody who is flying in a private plane ought to be ashamed. yes, i don't have a problem saying that. but i will also say the president of united states should be ashamed that, unlike every other rich country in the world, we are the only ones who pulled out. >> tucker: are you madder at the u.s. or china? >> i would say right now i'm about equally mad. >> tucker: even though china is, of course, uninhabitable in its capital city because of pollution, but somehow the equal of the united states. it's real pollution, kills people. >> we put in place regulations that donald trump is trying to undo to deal with our air pollution.pl >> tucker: our air pollution and beijing's are pretty similar, would you say? >> we have regulations because

democrats and the nixon administration, progressives, george bush, put in regulations because, you know -- i >> tucker: i'meg not against that. >> it sounds like you are. i'm very much in favor of holding people accountable, what should we should do is have a price on carbon pollution and everyone would be held accountable. >> tucker: rich people would love it. joe romm, thank you. professor jordan peterson has been compared to dictators like mao and hitler because he won't let others dictate what he says. a brave man. one of the few. next. ♪

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>> tucker: ♪ >> tucker: everywhere in modern society, you are ordered to conform. if anything, it is getting more conformist from gender to immigration. pick your issue, there is increasingly only one acceptable view. you can be ostracized or fired for disagreeing. o many are, in case you haven't noticed. university of toronto professor jordan peterson stands, dramatically against this tide.t he has become famous in large part because he refuses to be shamed from the public square. last week, he left an interviewer speechless when hequ explained that people do not have the right not to be offended. watch this.pl >> why should your right to freedom of speech trump a trans person's right not to be offended? >> because in order to be able to think, you have to risk being offensive. look at the conversation we're having right now. like, you are certainly willing to risk offending me in thet pursuit of truth. why should you have the right to do that? it's been rather uncomfortable. that's fine. more power to you, as far as i'm concerned. >> i'm just trying to work that

out. i mean -- >> ha. got you. >> you have got me. >> tucker: really one of the great interviews of all time. he's got a new book, "12 rules for life." that clip is everywhere. i'm honored to have you, professor. i've watched you for a while. i've always thought you were a truth teller. one of the chapters is "tell thi truth." that is one of your rules. what are some of the things you think we are forced to lie about in this moment? >> i don't know if we are forced. i think we make a choice. it is sometimes a bitter choice, but that is often the choice. you are sometimes in a situation where you are damned you do and if damned you don't, might as well pick the poison you would rather you take. you have a moral obligation. if you're going to say something unpopular and get attacked for

it, that is a risk, but to pretend you think something different is to warp your soul, and that's a much bigger risk. >> tucker: yes, it is. i would think that even if they don't agree with you, people in the media would be thrilled by the way you comport yourself, the way you respond.d clearly you are saying what you think, and that is supposed to be our charge as journalists, to tell the truth. yet you get met with thesese hostile receptions. why do you think that is? >> i would say that is not universal. there is a big battle in the press. say with the cathy newman interview. there are people who are casting her as a victim because she has been vilified because of the interview. but there have been many people in the media who stood forth and said it is necessary to be able to say what you think. it is not yet, it is good. surprising but good. >> tucker: so if you, in the book, you have a number of these rules, and rule 5 jumped out at me as a father. here is the rule. "don't let your children do anything that makes you dislike

them." what does that mean? >> it means you should understand that you are capable of disliking your children, and that because you are larger and more powerful than them, if you let them misbehave in a way that makes you dislike them, you are going to take revenge on them in a bad way, sometimes over y decades. i have seen that as a clinical psychologist. more importantly, if your children behave in ways that make you dislike them, assuming you are reasonable, and that might be something you want to discuss with your wife, then other people are going to dislike them too, other adults. then they won't teach them things, they won't pay attention to them, and they will only smile falselyly at them, and otr children won't want to play with them and include them. that is a catastrophe for your child. it is very helpful to help your children behave in ways that make other people welcome them,, because then everywhere they go, isy are welcome, and there nothing better you can do for a child than that. >> tucker: very smart. in the minute we have left, if you could pass on one piece of life advice, and this really is a book of life advice, to our viewers, what would it be?

>> stop saying things that make you weak. >> tucker: what does that mean? >> if you pay attention to whats you say, you will know thatr: sometimes you feel like you are standing on a rock. you are in a solid place, suppose you are speaking from your heart. other times you are saying things just to look good and just to buttress your particular status at the time, and that makes you feel weak. you sell yourself out. and if you pay attention to what you say, you can tell when w you're making yourself stronger, you can tell when you'rere makig yourself weaker. unless you want to be weaker, then i would say it is best tou say those things that make you stronger. you can learn to do that. it is fairly useful. so i would recommend practicing that because it is good for you and good for everyone else too. >> tucker: there is a reason that people obsessively watch your youtube videos. professor, thank you very much for joining us. congrats on the book. >> thank you very much. >> tucker: a scandal isfo rocking the limited but vigorous world of saudi beauty pageants. probably not the way you would expect.

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>> lots of serious news in washington and want to >> tucker: a f of serious news in washington so we want to close with some news from maine animal kingdom. a man bites dog story. so weird. police in new hampshire are investigating a shooting when they found a man with an outstanding arrest warrant, in the words of one police attendant, he very strongly resisted arrest by fighting the police dog. the b dog bit back and ultimatey the man was subdued by a taser and brought in. the dog is fine. it more strange animal news, and the kingdom of saudi arabia, a conventional beauty pageant would likely result in someone being beheaded, so instead, they nthave camel beauty pageants. we are sad to tell you, there a scandal in the world of camel beauty. a dozen animals have been disqualified from a major context after judges found they have received botox

injections. it can make its head bigger and it's lips drew clear, both highly appealing to camel aficionados. good night from washington. hannity is a lie from new york. >> sean: great show, as always. huge, breaking news. we on this program cannot exclusively report that the department of justice is now started and is recovering some f the five months of missing text messages from trump painting fbi agents peter strzok and lisa page. also parking right now, president trump is telling the special counsel robert mueller that he will talk to him under oath. it sounds like the president has nothing to hide, but is it the right legal decision? we'll explore with our panel. also brand-new tonight, robert mueller and has mouthpieces and the corrupt liberal media, they are in a full-fledged panic and desperately trying to change the narrative to hide the truth amid a new, stunning wave of information about anti-trump bias,